I need to equip my R2E4 with an add-on high-speed spindle for drilling
and milling PCB prototypes.

The little 1.5KW water-cooled spindles from China look attractive. With
one of those, a matching 400Hz inverter, and a little cobbling, it looks
like I can get into service for under $500.

Does anyone have any experience with those, any brand recommendations,
life-expectancy, etc??

Thanks,
Lloyd

On Apr 9, 8:49*am, "Lloyd E. Sponenburgh"
lloydspinsidemindspring.com wrote:
I need to equip my R2E4 with an add-on high-speed spindle for drilling
and milling PCB prototypes.

The little 1.5KW water-cooled spindles from China look attractive. *With
one of those, a matching 400Hz inverter, and a little cobbling, it looks
like I can get into service for under $500.

Does anyone have any experience with those, any brand recommendations,
life-expectancy, etc??

Thanks,
Lloyd

G'luck with it.

Probably want to think about adding the cost of a small water chiller
unit also.

--

PaulS

PCS fired this volley in news:ff3d1f2c-86f9-45e1-
:

Probably want to think about adding the cost of a small water chiller
unit also.

I think a 30-gallon shallow metal coolant tank will provide enough cooling!
These motors barely get warm under light loads, according to what I've read
in some user-reviews.

Lloyd

http://www.cnczone.com/ - lots of info

Randy

1.5kw? as in 2 hp? Seems excessive for drilling .020 inch diameter
holes in pcb's. Milling .001 inch copper sheet isn't a major job either.
Maybe 1/4 hp would be adequate, surely 1/2 hp?
If you run across a spindle in that range (30000, 40000, 50000 rpm),
let it be known. I looking for such a beast for milling stencils in 3 mil
& 5 mil brass.

Hul


Lloyd E. Sponenburgh lloydspinsidemindspring.com wrote:
I need to equip my R2E4 with an add-on high-speed spindle for drilling
and milling PCB prototypes.

The little 1.5KW water-cooled spindles from China look attractive. With
one of those, a matching 400Hz inverter, and a little cobbling, it looks
like I can get into service for under $500.

Does anyone have any experience with those, any brand recommendations,
life-expectancy, etc??

Thanks,
Lloyd

fired this volley in :

1.5kw? as in 2 hp? Seems excessive for drilling .020 inch diameter
holes in pcb's. Milling .001 inch copper sheet isn't a major job
either.
Maybe 1/4 hp would be adequate, surely 1/2 hp?


It would be, but with 2HP, I can also do high-speed milling of tougher
materials, and the difference in cost between a 0.5KW spindle and a 1.5KW
version is about $30.

I have not seen one in the 30Krpm range... most metal bearings get weak
in the knees at those speeds, and most inverter drives top out at 400Hz,
which is the rated input for these at 24Krpm.

Lloyd

On 2013-04-09, Lloyd E. Sponenburgh lloydspinsidemindspring.com wrote:
fired this volley in :

1.5kw? as in 2 hp? Seems excessive for drilling .020 inch diameter
holes in pcb's. Milling .001 inch copper sheet isn't a major job
either.
Maybe 1/4 hp would be adequate, surely 1/2 hp?


It would be, but with 2HP, I can also do high-speed milling of tougher
materials, and the difference in cost between a 0.5KW spindle and a 1.5KW
version is about $30.

I have not seen one in the 30Krpm range... most metal bearings get weak
in the knees at those speeds, and most inverter drives top out at 400Hz,
which is the rated input for these at 24Krpm.

What I heard about those spindles is that they are junk. But they may
be cheap enough to just try out.

i

In article , wrote:

1.5kw? as in 2 hp? Seems excessive for drilling .020 inch diameter
holes in pcb's. Milling .001 inch copper sheet isn't a major job either.
Maybe 1/4 hp would be adequate, surely 1/2 hp?
If you run across a spindle in that range (30000, 40000, 50000 rpm),
let it be known. I looking for such a beast for milling stencils in 3 mil
& 5 mil brass.

Assuming you can stand the noise (one place a "real" spindle beats the
heck out of them) laminate trimmers are a typical 30,000 rpm
small-horsepower unit. Routers if you need a bit more beef. I come at
this myself from the "I have a CNC router and I begin to see why I might
want a 'spindle' to cut the noise down" viewpoint. The deafening roar of
an aircooled universal motor gets old, fast. The sparks off the brushes
would presumably mean Lloyd couldn't use one, though I suppose he might
have machine areas that are not in the "go boom" zone, but if he's
looking at watercooled spindles I'm thinking he wants it quiet,
comparatively, anyway.

Runout may not be the greatest, but the same is probably true of
low-budget chinese spindles. On the laminate trimmers/routers, avoid the
cheap chinese ones or you'll really regret it, IMHO.

Or, if you have large horsepower shop air and don't mind using it, use a
die grinder. Kinda spendy for much long-term use in operational
cost...but you can get 50,000+ rpm out of one without a sweat.

Hmm. Combine the concept of watercooling and turbine air, maybe there's
some market for a water-turbine spindle - power it by dropping the
well-pump of your choice (or the power you need) in a drum of water and
recirculate...LLoyd could use that in the "go-boom" area, and you'd get
those nice non-contact watercooled bearings. Probably imractical due to
no such small water-turbine units being in large-scale production, but
it's a nice thought.

--
Cats, coffee, chocolate...vices to live by
Please don't feed the trolls. Killfile and ignore them so they will go away.

Ignoramus26995 fired this volley in
:


What I heard about those spindles is that they are junk. But they may
be cheap enough to just try out.

I sorta thought that, but after posting the same in the CamBam forum, I
had replies from three other guys who've been running them about 10 hours
a month with not a problem for over three years. Not even bearings...
and two of those guys have the air-cooled units.

FWIW, I'd consider them 'advanced amateurs', and trust their opinions.

Lloyd

"Lloyd E. Sponenburgh" lloydspinsidemindspring.com wrote in message
. 3.70...
Ignoramus26995 fired this volley in
:


What I heard about those spindles is that they are junk. But they may
be cheap enough to just try out.

I sorta thought that, but after posting the same in the CamBam forum, I
had replies from three other guys who've been running them about 10 hours
a month with not a problem for over three years. Not even bearings...
and two of those guys have the air-cooled units.

FWIW, I'd consider them 'advanced amateurs', and trust their opinions.

Lloyd

http://www.nskamericacorp.com/prod_m...ol_planet.aspx

On Apr 9, 8:23*pm, "PrecisionmachinisT"
wrote:
"Lloyd E. Sponenburgh" lloydspinsidemindspring.com wrote in messagenews:XnsA19DD9D5BC941lloydspmindspringcom@2 16.168.3.70...

Ignoramus26995 fired this volley in
m:

What I heard about those spindles is that they are junk. But they may
be cheap enough to just try out.

I sorta thought that, but after posting the same in the CamBam forum, I
had replies from three other guys who've been running them about 10 hours
a month with not a problem for over three years. *Not even bearings....
and two of those guys have the air-cooled units.

FWIW, I'd consider them 'advanced amateurs', and trust their opinions.

Lloyd

http://www.nskamericacorp.com/prod_m...ol_planet.aspx

This is unit I've used.

"jon_banquer" wrote in message
...
On Apr 9, 8:23 pm, "PrecisionmachinisT"
wrote:

http://www.nskamericacorp.com/prod_m...ol_planet.aspx

This is unit I've used.

Ducky has one--uses it to inlay mother of pearl and the like..swears by it..

Personally, I rather to use redhead, setco or parker-majestic.

On Apr 9, 9:25*pm, "PrecisionmachinisT"
wrote:
"jon_banquer" wrote in message

...
On Apr 9, 8:23 pm, "PrecisionmachinisT"

wrote:

http://www.nskamericacorp.com/prod_m...ol_planet.aspx
This is unit I've used.

Ducky has one--uses it to inlay mother of pearl and the like..swears by it..

Personally, I rather to use redhead, setco or parker-majestic.

It's a reliable unit but doesn't have much in the way of balls. It's
all I know as I've never used anything else.

"PrecisionmachinisT" fired this
volley in news:YvidnQBOdOeJRvnMnZ2dnUVZ_rmdnZ2d@scnresearch. com:

http://www.nskamericacorp.com/prod_m...ol_planet.aspx

Thanks. That would be MUCH more compact in place on my spindle nose. If
I only used it for PCB drilling, I think it would be ideal.

But I wonder how one would speed regulate such a spindle for actual
milling... any clues? Do they have throttling regulators for those?

LLoyd

PrecisionmachinisT wrote:

"Lloyd E. Sponenburgh" lloydspinsidemindspring.com wrote in message
. 3.70...
Ignoramus26995 fired this volley in
:


What I heard about those spindles is that they are junk. But they may
be cheap enough to just try out.

I sorta thought that, but after posting the same in the CamBam forum, I
had replies from three other guys who've been running them about 10 hours
a month with not a problem for over three years. Not even bearings...
and two of those guys have the air-cooled units.

FWIW, I'd consider them 'advanced amateurs', and trust their opinions.

Lloyd

http://www.nskamericacorp.com/prod_m...ol_planet.aspx

Vey cool, but "relatively low cost" scares me. Any idea what these sell
for and where?

"Pete C." fired this volley in news:51656994$0
:

Vey cool, but "relatively low cost" scares me. Any idea what these sell
for and where?

Pete, the more I look at those, the less I think they'd be well suited to
milling where one must control chip loads. Although they spin to
enormous RPMS, they are not speed regulated under loads.

I think they'd do fine for fragile, brittle materials where chip loads
are secondary to just cutting through the stuff (like PM said... mother
of pearl, or fiberglass PCB material), but wouldn't work well at all
cutting aluminum.

They're made specifically for grinding, where speed is important, but
tight regulation of speed not as much.

LLoyd

Pete C. wrote:


http://www.nskamericacorp.com/prod_m...ol_planet.aspx

Vey cool, but "relatively low cost" scares me. Any idea what these sell
for and where?
The 300 l/min should scare you, too! That's a LOT of air! (about
10 cuft / min., or maybe 10 Hp on a single-stage compressor.)

Jon

On Wed, 10 Apr 2013 05:49:14 -0500, "Lloyd E. Sponenburgh"
lloydspinsidemindspring.com wrote:

"PrecisionmachinisT" fired this
volley in news:YvidnQBOdOeJRvnMnZ2dnUVZ_rmdnZ2d@scnresearch. com:

http://www.nskamericacorp.com/prod_m...ol_planet.aspx

Thanks. That would be MUCH more compact in place on my spindle nose. If
I only used it for PCB drilling, I think it would be ideal.

But I wonder how one would speed regulate such a spindle for actual
milling... any clues? Do they have throttling regulators for those?

LLoyd

Simple regulator should do the job. Lots of my clients use NSK air
spindles for C axis work on CNC lathes and we simply throttle down the
air pressure if need be.

There are some electric spindles out there..about 1" in diameter that
use a speed controller..but they add about $3k to the basic price

And NSK isnt..isnt cheap.

Gunner