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Metalworking (rec.crafts.metalworking) Discuss various aspects of working with metal, such as machining, welding, metal joining, screwing, casting, hardening/tempering, blacksmithing/forging, spinning and hammer work, sheet metal work. |
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#1
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Message from an ebay buyer
``There is no such voltage as 460 Single Phase. 460 volts is Three Phase''
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#2
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Does that make sense? if you have three phase machines and you don't have a three phase supply you can get converters. |
#3
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Message from an ebay buyer
Ignoramus29252" wrote in message
... ``There is no such voltage as 460 Single Phase. 460 volts is Three Phase'' You did block this person ? Best Regards Tom. -- http://fija.org/ |
#4
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Message from an ebay buyer
On 2012-09-05, azotic wrote:
Ignoramus29252" wrote in message ... ``There is no such voltage as 460 Single Phase. 460 volts is Three Phase'' You did block this person ? Best Regards Tom. I did not, why? Maybe it is a good idea to do so. i |
#5
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Message from an ebay buyer
"Ignoramus29252" wrote in message ... On 2012-09-05, azotic wrote: Ignoramus29252" wrote in message ... ``There is no such voltage as 460 Single Phase. 460 volts is Three Phase'' You did block this person ? Best Regards Tom. I did not, why? Maybe it is a good idea to do so. i Proper planning prevents potential problems. I would not want a person that thinks they know what they are talking about bidding on any of my auctions. Best Regards Tom. |
#6
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Message from an ebay buyer
"Ignoramus29252" wrote in message
... ``There is no such voltage as 460 Single Phase. 460 volts is Three Phase'' I guess it depends on your point of view. I'm not sure if you can get the power company to connect you with 460 single phase. You can get 460 single phase from 460 3 phase, if you have L1, L2, & L3, any 2 of the legs are single phase. If you have something that runs 460 single phase, you could get a transformer to go from 230 to 460. So there certainly is 460 single phase, but I'm not sure if the power company provides 460 single phase. My Miller 330A/BP welder runs off of 230 or 460 single phase. The plant where I work has equipment that uses 460 single phase. RogerN |
#7
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Message from an ebay buyer
On Tue, 4 Sep 2012 21:51:22 -0500, "RogerN" wrote:
"Ignoramus29252" wrote in message ... ``There is no such voltage as 460 Single Phase. 460 volts is Three Phase'' I guess it depends on your point of view. I'm not sure if you can get the power company to connect you with 460 single phase. You can get 460 single phase from 460 3 phase, if you have L1, L2, & L3, any 2 of the legs are single phase. If you have something that runs 460 single phase, you could get a transformer to go from 230 to 460. So there certainly is 460 single phase, but I'm not sure if the power company provides 460 single phase. My Miller 330A/BP welder runs off of 230 or 460 single phase. The plant where I work has equipment that uses 460 single phase. RogerN Ayup. My Miller SyncroWave 300 is the same. 230/460 single phase Gunner "The U.S. military has had considerably more success in turning Iraq around than liberals have had in turning the ghettos around with their 40-year 'War on Poverty.' So far, fewer troops have been killed by hostile fire since the end of major combat in Iraq than civilians were murdered in Washington, DC, last year (239 deaths in Iraq compared to 262 murders in DC.) Ann Coulter |
#8
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Message from an ebay buyer
On 9/5/2012 12:50 AM, Gunner wrote:
On Tue, 4 Sep 2012 21:51:22 -0500, "RogerN" wrote: "Ignoramus29252" wrote in message ... ``There is no such voltage as 460 Single Phase. 460 volts is Three Phase'' I guess it depends on your point of view. I'm not sure if you can get the power company to connect you with 460 single phase. You can get 460 single phase from 460 3 phase, if you have L1, L2, & L3, any 2 of the legs are single phase. If you have something that runs 460 single phase, you could get a transformer to go from 230 to 460. So there certainly is 460 single phase, but I'm not sure if the power company provides 460 single phase. My Miller 330A/BP welder runs off of 230 or 460 single phase. The plant where I work has equipment that uses 460 single phase. RogerN Ayup. [bull****] People who say "ayup" are backward cousin-****ing hillbillies. People who write it are all that, plus willfully stupid. |
#9
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Message from an ebay buyer
On Sep 5, 9:09*am, Ann Romanoski Wright
wrote: On 9/5/2012 12:50 AM, Gunner wrote: On Tue, 4 Sep 2012 21:51:22 -0500, "RogerN" wrote: "Ignoramus29252" *wrote in message ... ``There is no such voltage as 460 Single Phase. 460 volts is Three Phase'' I guess it depends on your point of view. *I'm not sure if you can get the power company to connect you with 460 single phase. *You can get 460 single phase from 460 3 phase, if you have L1, L2, & L3, any 2 of the legs are single phase. *If you have something that runs 460 single phase, you could get a transformer to go from 230 to 460. *So there certainly is 460 single phase, but I'm not sure if the power company provides 460 single phase.. My Miller 330A/BP welder runs off of 230 or 460 single phase. *The plant where I work has equipment that uses 460 single phase. RogerN Ayup. [bull****] People who say "ayup" are backward cousin-****ing hillbillies. *People who write it are all that, plus willfully stupid. Please avoid reading works of Mark Twain. In your case, severe apoplexy could result. |
#10
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Message from an ebay buyer
On 2012-09-05, RogerN wrote:
"Ignoramus29252" wrote in message ... ``There is no such voltage as 460 Single Phase. 460 volts is Three Phase'' I guess it depends on your point of view. I'm not sure if you can get the power company to connect you with 460 single phase. You can get 460 single phase from 460 3 phase, if you have L1, L2, & L3, any 2 of the legs are single phase. If you have something that runs 460 single phase, you could get a transformer to go from 230 to 460. So there certainly is 460 single phase, but I'm not sure if the power company provides 460 single phase. My Miller 330A/BP welder runs off of 230 or 460 single phase. The plant where I work has equipment that uses 460 single phase. No one would want a 460v single phase power service, but there is plenty of 460v single phase machines. i |
#11
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Message from an ebay buyer
On Tue, 04 Sep 2012 21:01:07 -0500, Ignoramus29252
wrote: ``There is no such voltage as 460 Single Phase. 460 volts is Three Phase'' Sure there is. Such equipment is rather rare...very are in the US...but it is indeed out there Gunner "The U.S. military has had considerably more success in turning Iraq around than liberals have had in turning the ghettos around with their 40-year 'War on Poverty.' So far, fewer troops have been killed by hostile fire since the end of major combat in Iraq than civilians were murdered in Washington, DC, last year (239 deaths in Iraq compared to 262 murders in DC.) Ann Coulter |
#12
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Message from an ebay buyer
On Tue, 04 Sep 2012 21:01:07 -0500, Ignoramus29252
wrote: ``There is no such voltage as 460 Single Phase. 460 volts is Three Phase'' Iggy-that statement is absolutely true. I know because I checked it out. At 459 volts power only comes out of one wire. At 460 volts power comes out of three wires. And then at 461 volts power only comes out of one wire again. I looked at the wires and I could see the power coming out of the wires. And you don't even need to look at all three wires because single phase voltage is orange and three phase voltage voltage is blue. Interestingly though is the fact that single phase current is green and three phase current is yellow. I wonder why the current isn't the same color as the voltage. Anyway, if you look at the wires at the right angle you can see both colors at once. I forgot to say that the colors only apply to AC voltage and current. DC voltage and current are invisible. But that's OK because DC is so noisy. Airick |
#13
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#14
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#16
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Message from an ebay buyer
Ignoramus5921 fired this volley in
news I thought 460v was twice cheaper to use than 230v, because of twice less current. Ig, it makes the equipment smaller and lighter (if it's solely for 460V), but watts are watts. Your power meter doesn't measure current (per se), it totals watt-hours of energy. If current and voltage are in phase with one- another, a given current at a particular voltage can be used to calculate watts. Lightly loaded motors and other inductive loads tend to muddy that by shifting the phases of voltage and current. LLoyd |
#17
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Message from an ebay buyer
On 2012-09-05, Lloyd E. Sponenburgh lloydspinsidemindspring.com wrote:
Ignoramus5921 fired this volley in news I thought 460v was twice cheaper to use than 230v, because of twice less current. Ig, it makes the equipment smaller and lighter (if it's solely for 460V), but watts are watts. Your power meter doesn't measure current (per se), it totals watt-hours of energy. If current and voltage are in phase with one- another, a given current at a particular voltage can be used to calculate watts. Lightly loaded motors and other inductive loads tend to muddy that by shifting the phases of voltage and current. LLoyd I was joking... |
#18
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Message from an ebay buyer
On 9/5/2012 8:42 AM, Ignoramus5921 wrote:
On 2012-09-05, wrote: On Tue, 04 Sep 2012 21:01:07 -0500, Ignoramus29252 wrote: ``There is no such voltage as 460 Single Phase. 460 volts is Three Phase'' Iggy-that statement is absolutely true. I know because I checked it out. At 459 volts power only comes out of one wire. At 460 volts power comes out of three wires. ... I thought 460v was twice cheaper to use than 230v, because of twice less current. no, No, NO!!! It's 4X as cheap 'cuz power is i-squared-r... gdr -- |
#19
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Message from an ebay buyer
On 2012-09-05, dpb wrote:
On 9/5/2012 8:42 AM, Ignoramus5921 wrote: On 2012-09-05, wrote: On Tue, 04 Sep 2012 21:01:07 -0500, Ignoramus29252 wrote: ``There is no such voltage as 460 Single Phase. 460 volts is Three Phase'' Iggy-that statement is absolutely true. I know because I checked it out. At 459 volts power only comes out of one wire. At 460 volts power comes out of three wires. ... I thought 460v was twice cheaper to use than 230v, because of twice less current. no, No, NO!!! It's 4X as cheap 'cuz power is i-squared-r... gdr and three ohase is cheaper still because the current is less by 1/sqrt(3) |
#20
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Message from an ebay buyer
On Wednesday, September 5, 2012 9:42:49 AM UTC-4, Ignoramus5921 wrote:
On 2012-09-05, wrote: On Tue, 04 Sep 2012 21:01:07 -0500, Ignoramus29252 wrote: ``There is no such voltage as 460 Single Phase. 460 volts is Three Phase'' Iggy-that statement is absolutely true. I know because I checked it out. At 459 volts power only comes out of one wire. At 460 volts power comes out of three wires. And then at 461 volts power only comes out of one wire again. I looked at the wires and I could see the power coming out of the wires. And you don't even need to look at all three wires because single phase voltage is orange and three phase voltage voltage is blue. Interestingly though is the fact that single phase current is green and three phase current is yellow. I wonder why the current isn't the same color as the voltage. Anyway, if you look at the wires at the right angle you can see both colors at once. I forgot to say that the colors only apply to AC voltage and current. DC voltage and current are invisible. But that's OK because DC is so noisy. Airick The reason the voltage and current are different colors is so you can determine power factor by how they mix. I though everyone knew that. I thought 460v was twice cheaper to use than 230v, because of twice less current. i Well, yeah but the truth is that the I2R losses *will* be cut by a factor of four. My 'lectric company recently went to huge expense in replacing all of the tranformers and many of the poles in my neighborhood so they could raise the primary voltage from 8KV to 13KV. It will, in the not-very-long run, pay for itself in reduced heating of the primary wires. By the way, this was a pretty impressive show. The had a HUGE transformer on a flatbed in a nearby parking lot, switchable from 8KV to 13KV. All of the new transformers were also switchable. After they had this all installed and running at 8KV (with no interruption of service, by the way), they called in what must have been damned near every truck they had in the state. There were ten on my block alone. At the appointed hour, the power was shut off and they switched all the transformers. It all took about ten minutes before the lights came back on. Excellent planning on PSE&G's part. |
#21
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Message from an ebay buyer
On 9/5/2012 3:06 PM, rangerssuck wrote:
On Wednesday, September 5, 2012 9:42:49 AM UTC-4, Ignoramus5921 wrote: On 2012-09-05, wrote: On Tue, 04 Sep 2012 21:01:07 -0500, Ignoramus29252 wrote: ``There is no such voltage as 460 Single Phase. 460 volts is Three Phase'' Iggy-that statement is absolutely true. I know because I checked it out. At 459 volts power only comes out of one wire. At 460 volts power comes out of three wires. And then at 461 volts power only comes out of one wire again. I looked at the wires and I could see the power coming out of the wires. And you don't even need to look at all three wires because single phase voltage is orange and three phase voltage voltage is blue. Interestingly though is the fact that single phase current is green and three phase current is yellow. I wonder why the current isn't the same color as the voltage. Anyway, if you look at the wires at the right angle you can see both colors at once. I forgot to say that the colors only apply to AC voltage and current. DC voltage and current are invisible. But that's OK because DC is so noisy. Airick The reason the voltage and current are different colors is so you can determine power factor by how they mix. I though everyone knew that. I thought 460v was twice cheaper to use than 230v, because of twice less current. i Well, yeah but the truth is that the I2R losses *will* be cut by a factor of four. My 'lectric company recently went to huge expense in replacing all of the tranformers and many of the poles in my neighborhood so they could raise the primary voltage from 8KV to 13KV. It will, in the not-very-long run, pay for itself in reduced heating of the primary wires. By the way, this was a pretty impressive show. The had a HUGE transformer on a flatbed in a nearby parking lot, switchable from 8KV to 13KV. All of the new transformers were also switchable. After they had this all installed and running at 8KV (with no interruption of service, by the way), they called in what must have been damned near every truck they had in the state. There were ten on my block alone. At the appointed hour, the power was shut off and they switched all the transformers. It all took about ten minutes before the lights came back on. Excellent planning on PSE&G's part. A private utility, of course. Private enterprise gets things done. |
#22
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Message from an ebay buyer
On Wednesday, September 5, 2012 11:51:58 PM UTC-4, George Plimpton wrote:
On 9/5/2012 3:06 PM, rangerssuck wrote: On Wednesday, September 5, 2012 9:42:49 AM UTC-4, Ignoramus5921 wrote: On 2012-09-05, wrote: On Tue, 04 Sep 2012 21:01:07 -0500, Ignoramus29252 wrote: ``There is no such voltage as 460 Single Phase. 460 volts is Three Phase'' Iggy-that statement is absolutely true. I know because I checked it out. At 459 volts power only comes out of one wire. At 460 volts power comes out of three wires. And then at 461 volts power only comes out of one wire again. I looked at the wires and I could see the power coming out of the wires. And you don't even need to look at all three wires because single phase voltage is orange and three phase voltage voltage is blue. Interestingly though is the fact that single phase current is green and three phase current is yellow. I wonder why the current isn't the same color as the voltage. Anyway, if you look at the wires at the right angle you can see both colors at once. I forgot to say that the colors only apply to AC voltage and current. DC voltage and current are invisible. But that's OK because DC is so noisy. Airick The reason the voltage and current are different colors is so you can determine power factor by how they mix. I though everyone knew that. I thought 460v was twice cheaper to use than 230v, because of twice less current. i Well, yeah but the truth is that the I2R losses *will* be cut by a factor of four. My 'lectric company recently went to huge expense in replacing all of the tranformers and many of the poles in my neighborhood so they could raise the primary voltage from 8KV to 13KV. It will, in the not-very-long run, pay for itself in reduced heating of the primary wires. By the way, this was a pretty impressive show. The had a HUGE transformer on a flatbed in a nearby parking lot, switchable from 8KV to 13KV. All of the new transformers were also switchable. After they had this all installed and running at 8KV (with no interruption of service, by the way), they called in what must have been damned near every truck they had in the state.. There were ten on my block alone. At the appointed hour, the power was shut off and they switched all the transformers. It all took about ten minutes before the lights came back on. Excellent planning on PSE&G's part. A private utility, of course. Private enterprise gets things done. Somehow, you've taken this story and turned it into anti-government bull****. Would it make any difference to you if I told you that, for the twenty or so years preceding this project, my line voltage hovered around 109V, with frequent dips below 100V? It was the threat of a class-action suit from a neighboring block association, combined with charts from my APC line monitor that finally got them to move. So yeah, private enterprise got things done, but not without the threat from the public of a suit in a government court. My point about the excellent planning was that they made this switchover with only a ten or so minute interruption in service. |
#23
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Message from an ebay buyer
On Wed, 05 Sep 2012 08:42:48 -0500, Ignoramus5921
wrote: On 2012-09-05, wrote: On Tue, 04 Sep 2012 21:01:07 -0500, Ignoramus29252 wrote: ``There is no such voltage as 460 Single Phase. 460 volts is Three Phase'' Iggy-that statement is absolutely true. I know because I checked it out. At 459 volts power only comes out of one wire. At 460 volts power comes out of three wires. And then at 461 volts power only comes out of one wire again. I looked at the wires and I could see the power coming out of the wires. And you don't even need to look at all three wires because single phase voltage is orange and three phase voltage voltage is blue. Interestingly though is the fact that single phase current is green and three phase current is yellow. I wonder why the current isn't the same color as the voltage. Anyway, if you look at the wires at the right angle you can see both colors at once. I forgot to say that the colors only apply to AC voltage and current. DC voltage and current are invisible. But that's OK because DC is so noisy. Airick I thought 460v was twice cheaper to use than 230v, because of twice less current. i It should be 4 times cheaper because resistive losses increase and decrease with the square of the voltage. We're getting ripped off. Eric |
#24
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#25
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Message from an ebay buyer
On Tue, 04 Sep 2012 21:01:07 -0500, Ignoramus29252
wrote: ``There is no such voltage as 460 Single Phase. 460 volts is Three Phase'' In my neck of the woods there is no such thing as 460 volts. PPL Electric states the power they deliver is 120, 208, 240 or 480 volts all +/- 5% I think this was covered before, 460 like 110, 115 and 117 are all carry-over's from years gone by. Like Roger said I don't think you can get the power company to supply you with 460 (480) single phase, it would be part of a 3 phase service. Or does someone know this to be false? You can get single phase equipment in 277 and 460/480 volt. So it does depend on your point of view. Remove 333 to reply. Randy |
#26
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Message from an ebay buyer
Randy333 wrote: On Tue, 04 Sep 2012 21:01:07 -0500, Ignoramus29252 wrote: ``There is no such voltage as 460 Single Phase. 460 volts is Three Phase'' In my neck of the woods there is no such thing as 460 volts. PPL Electric states the power they deliver is 120, 208, 240 or 480 volts all +/- 5% I think this was covered before, 460 like 110, 115 and 117 are all carry-over's from years gone by. Like Roger said I don't think you can get the power company to supply you with 460 (480) single phase, it would be part of a 3 phase service. Or does someone know this to be false? You can get single phase equipment in 277 and 460/480 volt. So it does depend on your point of view. Remove 333 to reply. Randy Not a matter of perspective, we're talking electrical requirements of a device, not an electric service from a utility. While 460V (480V) electric service from a utility may normally be provided in a three phase service, numerous devices require 460V (480V) single phase power. A person who does not understand that should not be bidding on 460V (480V) devices. |
#27
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Message from an ebay buyer
Ignoramus29252 wrote:
``There is no such voltage as 460 Single Phase. 460 volts is Three Phase'' While single-phase 460 V feeds are a bit rare, many welders definitely are wired for 460 and only use one phase. I can imagine big industrial ovens might also run off single-phase, as well as spot welders. Jon |
#28
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Message from an ebay buyer
On Wed, 05 Sep 2012 15:25:34 -0500, Jon Elson
wrote: Ignoramus29252 wrote: ``There is no such voltage as 460 Single Phase. 460 volts is Three Phase'' While single-phase 460 V feeds are a bit rare, many welders definitely are wired for 460 and only use one phase. I can imagine big industrial ovens might also run off single-phase, as well as spot welders. Jon Big ovens I used or had that needed more than 208V were usually three phase. Easy enough to do because they usually had multiples of three elements. It needed appropriate care if replacing an element, but our electrical folks were used to three phase and its hazards. |
#29
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Message from an ebay buyer
On Wed, 05 Sep 2012 16:20:40 -0500, Pete Keillor
wrote: On Wed, 05 Sep 2012 15:25:34 -0500, Jon Elson wrote: Ignoramus29252 wrote: ``There is no such voltage as 460 Single Phase. 460 volts is Three Phase'' While single-phase 460 V feeds are a bit rare, many welders definitely are wired for 460 and only use one phase. I can imagine big industrial ovens might also run off single-phase, as well as spot welders. Jon Big ovens I used or had that needed more than 208V were usually three phase. Easy enough to do because they usually had multiples of three elements. It needed appropriate care if replacing an element, but our electrical folks were used to three phase and its hazards. That's my experience. Even smaller plastics machines usually have 3-phase sets of heaters (most of the power consumption is the heaters and the motor). The controls stuff could run off a single phase, though I've seen a 3phase transformer to supply 24V for the controls on a Battenfeld. |
#30
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Message from an ebay buyer
Ignoramus29252 wrote:
``There is no such voltage as 460 Single Phase. 460 volts is Three Phase'' Iffin you use all three conductors. -- "Additionally as a security officer, I carry a gun to protect government officials but my life isn't worth protecting at home in their eyes." Dick Anthony Heller |
#31
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On Sat, 08 Sep 2012 19:01:50 -0400, Wes
wrote: Ignoramus29252 wrote: ``There is no such voltage as 460 Single Phase. 460 volts is Three Phase'' Iffin you use all three conductors. They only sell it to you from the Utility as 460V (now nominal 480V) 3-Phase 3-wire, or 277/480V 3-phase 4-wire - and if you can get it in as 277/480V 3-Ph 4-wire Wye it's worth the extra expense. (They sell lots of different 277V Shop Lights that will run straight from the service Hot to Neutral, 480V is only available in a few High-Bay styles. For 120V lights and outlets you need a transformer, or a separate lighting service.) But iffin' you only use two of the hot lines instead of all three lines, you've got 480 Volts Single Phase there, just like you want. But don't try to cheat and use a 480V Single Phase receptacle - they don't exist - or if someone does make them (probably in a Pin and Sleeve Device) they'll be REAL expensive because they won't sell many. Just use a plain old 480V 3Ph twist lock receptacle and only use 3-conductor cord. Hot, Hot, and Ground. If you have several of these devices, balance the loads - First one is connected to the A & B phases, second is on B & C, third on C & A. Repeat as needed to keep the Power Utility from getting annoyed at you for unbalancing their system. Oh, and make sure the portable cord you use is rated for 600V, a decent percentage of the cheap stuff at the hardware store is only rated at 300V. In a few years when the cord insulation starts breaking down from age, that can cause you some serious excitement. -- Bruce -- |
#32
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"Bruce L. Bergman wrote
On Sat, 08 Sep 2012 19:01:50 -0400, Wes wrote: Ignoramus29252 wrote: ``There is no such voltage as 460 Single Phase. 460 volts is Three Phase'' Iffin you use all three conductors. They only sell it to you from the Utility as 460V (now nominal 480V) 3-Phase 3-wire, or 277/480V 3-phase 4-wire - and if you can get it in as 277/480V 3-Ph 4-wire Wye it's worth the extra expense. (They sell lots of different 277V Shop Lights that will run straight from the service Hot to Neutral, 480V is only available in a few High-Bay styles. For 120V lights and outlets you need a transformer, or a separate lighting service.) But iffin' you only use two of the hot lines instead of all three lines, you've got 480 Volts Single Phase there, just like you want. But don't try to cheat and use a 480V Single Phase receptacle - they don't exist - or if someone does make them (probably in a Pin and Sleeve Device) they'll be REAL expensive because they won't sell many. Just use a plain old 480V 3Ph twist lock receptacle and only use 3-conductor cord. Hot, Hot, and Ground. If you have several of these devices, balance the loads - First one is connected to the A & B phases, second is on B & C, third on C & A. Repeat as needed to keep the Power Utility from getting annoyed at you for unbalancing their system. Oh, and make sure the portable cord you use is rated for 600V, a decent percentage of the cheap stuff at the hardware store is only rated at 300V. In a few years when the cord insulation starts breaking down from age, that can cause you some serious excitement. per wikipedia: http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/NEMA_connector#NEMA_L8 NEMA L8 connectors are used with circuits with a maximum specified voltage of 480 V AC. Supply connections are intended for two-pole, three-wire hot-hot-ground circuits with a nominal supply voltage of 460 V. I could not find them on McMaster or Grangers, but did find http://www.automationdirect.com/adc/Shopping/Catalog/Power_Products_(Electrical)/Wiring_Devices/Electrical_Plugs,_Connectors,_-a-_Receptacles/Locking_Plugs,_Connectors,_-a-_Receptacles/70820FR;jsessionid=5e304e92319b048c22ca2a5356412a3 c2f44?utm_source=google&utm_medium=product-search&gclid=CIutmoePrLICFUhN4AodAVkALQ at 12.50 I would not call it terribly expensive. Balancing is indeed important. Using the correct outlets saves breaker space and I think is the best way to assure balancing. -- Stephen B. |
#33
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Message from an ebay buyer
On 2012-09-10, Stephen B. SPAMmyspam@cloud9 wrote:
"Bruce L. Bergman wrote On Sat, 08 Sep 2012 19:01:50 -0400, Wes wrote: Ignoramus29252 wrote: ``There is no such voltage as 460 Single Phase. 460 volts is Three Phase'' Iffin you use all three conductors. They only sell it to you from the Utility as 460V (now nominal 480V) 3-Phase 3-wire, or 277/480V 3-phase 4-wire - and if you can get it in as 277/480V 3-Ph 4-wire Wye it's worth the extra expense. (They sell lots of different 277V Shop Lights that will run straight from the service Hot to Neutral, 480V is only available in a few High-Bay styles. For 120V lights and outlets you need a transformer, or a separate lighting service.) But iffin' you only use two of the hot lines instead of all three lines, you've got 480 Volts Single Phase there, just like you want. But don't try to cheat and use a 480V Single Phase receptacle - they don't exist - or if someone does make them (probably in a Pin and Sleeve Device) they'll be REAL expensive because they won't sell many. Just use a plain old 480V 3Ph twist lock receptacle and only use 3-conductor cord. Hot, Hot, and Ground. If you have several of these devices, balance the loads - First one is connected to the A & B phases, second is on B & C, third on C & A. Repeat as needed to keep the Power Utility from getting annoyed at you for unbalancing their system. Oh, and make sure the portable cord you use is rated for 600V, a decent percentage of the cheap stuff at the hardware store is only rated at 300V. In a few years when the cord insulation starts breaking down from age, that can cause you some serious excitement. per wikipedia: http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/NEMA_connector#NEMA_L8 NEMA L8 connectors are used with circuits with a maximum specified voltage of 480 V AC. Supply connections are intended for two-pole, three-wire hot-hot-ground circuits with a nominal supply voltage of 460 V. I could not find them on McMaster or Grangers, but did find http://www.automationdirect.com/adc/Shopping/Catalog/Power_Products_(Electrical)/Wiring_Devices/Electrical_Plugs,_Connectors,_-a-_Receptacles/Locking_Plugs,_Connectors,_-a-_Receptacles/70820FR;jsessionid=5e304e92319b048c22ca2a5356412a3 c2f44?utm_source=google&utm_medium=product-search&gclid=CIutmoePrLICFUhN4AodAVkALQ at 12.50 I would not call it terribly expensive. Balancing is indeed important. Using the correct outlets saves breaker space and I think is the best way to assure balancing. I have seen a lot of 460v, two pole plugs. i |
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