I finished a prototype mold for somebody yesterday. Just a little 2 cavity
to test the concept. The I nested it out and blew it up to a full work
envelope 22 cavity mold and started it cutting about 10:00 last night. When
I ran a simulation on it it said it would take 23 1/2 hours. WHAT? Its
just a simple little stacked 3d cylinder shape. Didn't take me ten minutes
to do the CAD, and maybe half an hour to do the CAM. I let my "gee that
will be easy" thought over ride the fact that it still takes a lot of time
to cut a 3D cavity. Oops. For some reason I was thinking 5 or 6 hours
tops. I couldn't figure out why it will take that long. Then I scrolled to
the end of the file and checked the line counter.

1,391,851

Ok, so there are an average of 2 comment lines per MOP, and 2 lines of setup
words per MOP. Each nest creates its own group of MOPS, so that is a total
of 111 MOPs. Worst case there are 222 non-functional comment lines and
about the same number of machine setup lines of code. 1,391,851 - 450 misc
non movement lines of code.... is an insignificant difference. Most folks
would round up and say 1.4 MILLION lines of code. LOL.

I'm just praying it doesn't crash. I have no clue how I would recover this
job if I lost reference. Should finish some time this evening. I gotta
remember to break these up into smaller job files in the future.

I have confidence in you. It will be fine.

Christopher A. Young
Learn more about Jesus
www.lds.org
..

"Bob La Londe" wrote in message
...
I finished a prototype mold for somebody yesterday. Just a little 2 cavity
to test the concept. The I nested it out and blew it up to a full work
envelope 22 cavity mold and started it cutting about 10:00 last night. When
I ran a simulation on it it said it would take 23 1/2 hours. WHAT? Its
just a simple little stacked 3d cylinder shape. Didn't take me ten minutes
to do the CAD, and maybe half an hour to do the CAM. I let my "gee that
will be easy" thought over ride the fact that it still takes a lot of time
to cut a 3D cavity. Oops. For some reason I was thinking 5 or 6 hours
tops. I couldn't figure out why it will take that long. Then I scrolled to
the end of the file and checked the line counter.

1,391,851

Ok, so there are an average of 2 comment lines per MOP, and 2 lines of setup
words per MOP. Each nest creates its own group of MOPS, so that is a total
of 111 MOPs. Worst case there are 222 non-functional comment lines and
about the same number of machine setup lines of code. 1,391,851 - 450 misc
non movement lines of code.... is an insignificant difference. Most folks
would round up and say 1.4 MILLION lines of code. LOL.

I'm just praying it doesn't crash. I have no clue how I would recover this
job if I lost reference. Should finish some time this evening. I gotta
remember to break these up into smaller job files in the future.

I am not an expert on CNC, or anything, but I remember that I also
made a mold cavity for my kids toy.

I started out with this job taking 1 hr 50 minutes.

After some optimizations, it became a 10 minute job.

i

On 2012-05-24, Bob La Londe wrote:
I finished a prototype mold for somebody yesterday. Just a little 2 cavity
to test the concept. The I nested it out and blew it up to a full work
envelope 22 cavity mold and started it cutting about 10:00 last night. When
I ran a simulation on it it said it would take 23 1/2 hours. WHAT? Its
just a simple little stacked 3d cylinder shape. Didn't take me ten minutes
to do the CAD, and maybe half an hour to do the CAM. I let my "gee that
will be easy" thought over ride the fact that it still takes a lot of time
to cut a 3D cavity. Oops. For some reason I was thinking 5 or 6 hours
tops. I couldn't figure out why it will take that long. Then I scrolled to
the end of the file and checked the line counter.

1,391,851

Ok, so there are an average of 2 comment lines per MOP, and 2 lines of setup
words per MOP. Each nest creates its own group of MOPS, so that is a total
of 111 MOPs. Worst case there are 222 non-functional comment lines and
about the same number of machine setup lines of code. 1,391,851 - 450 misc
non movement lines of code.... is an insignificant difference. Most folks
would round up and say 1.4 MILLION lines of code. LOL.

I'm just praying it doesn't crash. I have no clue how I would recover this
job if I lost reference. Should finish some time this evening. I gotta
remember to break these up into smaller job files in the future.

"Ignoramus6562" wrote in message
...
I am not an expert on CNC, or anything, but I remember that I also
made a mold cavity for my kids toy.

I started out with this job taking 1 hr 50 minutes.

After some optimizations, it became a 10 minute job.

I can't remember the last time I did a CNC job that only took ten minutes.
LOL.

I did bump the rapid speed on my smaller machine though, and on certain
types of jobs with single direction milling (for reasons of accuracy) it
shaved as much as 30% off the job time. Not sure how I could have optimized
this one. Its running in CV mode at what ME Consultant Pro says is close to
the maximum feed rate for the pass. CV mode is pretty fast with this as
most of the longer cuts are G3s in X & Z, with only very short G1 stepovers
in X & Y. Its cutting in mixed milling as well. Accuracy is not as
important, but a small stepover is required for a smooth finish.

The next thing I am going to do is make some bearing supports for my smaller
machine so I can move some of the detail intensive small stuff off to it.
It rapids quite a bit faster than this machine, but the designer of the
machine was really cheap supporting the leads just by the motors. ICK!
There is some end play developing in the motors, hence the need to add
bearings and bearing supports on the leads.

Then I need to start the retro on the newest machine. I picked up a router
that claimed stupidly fast rapids, but the reality is they are a bit
optimistic about the dinky steppers they used. It will go that fast if you
constantly douse the ballscrews and linear bearings with light spindle oil,
but ten passes and it will stall. With a heavier way oil it just stalls.
LOL. Its going to get a Gecko Drive and some 270 or 380 oz motors. Have to
mod the Z as they set it up for a Nema 17 ICK!

Anybody want some 140 oz motors and a Chinese controller? LOL. (It does
have integrated speed control for a brush motor, but it wouldn't handle more
than 200-300 watts.)

"Stormin Mormon" wrote in message
...

I have confidence in you. It will be fine.

Sigh. I pulled it off the machine half an hour ago. Had a hiccup and lost
position at the first 3D MOP. All the rest of the pockets looked perfect,
but none of them line up with the sprues. 23 hours wasted beautifully
cutting the cavities in the wrong place. Sigh. Looks like a machine
problem, but I can't find it. Backlash is starting to build again since I
swapped the screws, but it seems to move as smooth as can be. Maybe over a
million lines of code was just too much for the computer.



Christopher A. Young
Learn more about Jesus
www.lds.org
.

"Bob La Londe" wrote in message
...
I finished a prototype mold for somebody yesterday. Just a little 2
cavity
to test the concept. The I nested it out and blew it up to a full work
envelope 22 cavity mold and started it cutting about 10:00 last night.
When
I ran a simulation on it it said it would take 23 1/2 hours. WHAT? Its
just a simple little stacked 3d cylinder shape. Didn't take me ten
minutes
to do the CAD, and maybe half an hour to do the CAM. I let my "gee that
will be easy" thought over ride the fact that it still takes a lot of time
to cut a 3D cavity. Oops. For some reason I was thinking 5 or 6 hours
tops. I couldn't figure out why it will take that long. Then I scrolled
to
the end of the file and checked the line counter.

1,391,851

Ok, so there are an average of 2 comment lines per MOP, and 2 lines of
setup
words per MOP. Each nest creates its own group of MOPS, so that is a
total
of 111 MOPs. Worst case there are 222 non-functional comment lines and
about the same number of machine setup lines of code. 1,391,851 - 450
misc
non movement lines of code.... is an insignificant difference. Most
folks
would round up and say 1.4 MILLION lines of code. LOL.

I'm just praying it doesn't crash. I have no clue how I would recover
this
job if I lost reference. Should finish some time this evening. I gotta
remember to break these up into smaller job files in the future.

That sure is disappointing. Well, Edison didn't get the light bulb easily,
either.

Christopher A. Young
Learn more about Jesus
www.lds.org
..

"Bob La Londe" wrote in message
...
"Stormin Mormon" wrote in message
...

I have confidence in you. It will be fine.

Sigh. I pulled it off the machine half an hour ago. Had a hiccup and lost
position at the first 3D MOP. All the rest of the pockets looked perfect,
but none of them line up with the sprues. 23 hours wasted beautifully
cutting the cavities in the wrong place. Sigh. Looks like a machine
problem, but I can't find it. Backlash is starting to build again since I
swapped the screws, but it seems to move as smooth as can be. Maybe over a
million lines of code was just too much for the computer.

On Wed, 23 May 2012 22:40:08 -0700, Bob La Londe wrote:

Sigh. I pulled it off the machine half an hour ago. Had a hiccup and
lost position at the first 3D MOP.

Can you copy the G-code into a troubleshooting file and edit out
everything before the first 3D MOP? (Whatever that is?)

--Winston

Winston fired this volley in
:

Can you copy the G-code into a troubleshooting file and edit out
everything before the first 3D MOP? (Whatever that is?)

It's just text. Any editor will work.

Lloyd

Stormin Mormon wrote:

That sure is disappointing. Well, Edison didn't get the light bulb easily,
either.


True, but he WAS working in the dark...


--
You can't have a sense of humor, if you have no sense.

"Lloyd E. Sponenburgh" lloydspinsidemindspring.com wrote in message
. 3.70...
Winston fired this volley in
:

Can you copy the G-code into a troubleshooting file and edit out
everything before the first 3D MOP? (Whatever that is?)

It's just text. Any editor will work.

Lloyd

I was frustrated and I have a deadline (self imposed) to get the part out so
I reCAMed with more aggressive roughing, (but the same finishing) and it
came out perfectly in one shot in 10 hours. I don't like to push those
little machines that hard though. When I do every part on the machine
suffers. Spindle bearings, lead screw bearings, lead nuts, gibbs, etc.

I went through it and it just looks like the machine bound and lost position
at the extreme of travel on that first 3D MOP. I repositioned (in case
there is a tight spot on the lead screw near the extreme) and cut the part.
No problems even with faster more aggressive cutting.

I have a couple auxiliary operations to do that I skipped in the
reCAM/recut, that I need to finish the part, and it will probably come off
the machine this afternoon after work.

Only half the day, the rest was outdoors.

Christopher A. Young
Learn more about Jesus
www.lds.org
..

"Michael A. Terrell" wrote in message
m...

Stormin Mormon wrote:

That sure is disappointing. Well, Edison didn't get the light bulb easily,
either.


True, but he WAS working in the dark...


--
You can't have a sense of humor, if you have no sense.

On Thu, 24 May 2012 09:50:43 -0500, "Lloyd E. Sponenburgh"
lloydspinsidemindspring.com wrote:

Winston fired this volley in
:

Can you copy the G-code into a troubleshooting file and edit out
everything before the first 3D MOP? (Whatever that is?)

It's just text. Any editor will work.

Anything but WordImperfect. g Back in the early '90s, I got lots
of consulting work getting computers back up and running after the
brilliant experts had modified their config.sys and autoexec.bat files
with WP and saved them in WP format. The hardest task of the day back
then was _not_giggling_ as I 'repaired' the computer.

--
When a quiet man is moved to passion, it seems the very earth will shake.
-- Stephanie Barron
(Something for the Powers That Be to remember, eh?)

"Michael A. Terrell" on Thu, 24 May 2012
13:41:56 -0400 typed in rec.crafts.metalworking the following:

Stormin Mormon wrote:

That sure is disappointing. Well, Edison didn't get the light bulb easily,
either.


True, but he WAS working in the dark...

By lamp light.
--
pyotr
Go not to the Net for answers, for it will tell you Yes and no. And
you are a bloody fool, only an ignorant cretin would even ask the
question, forty two, 47, the second door, and how many blonde lawyers
does it take to change a lightbulb.

On 5/24/2012 7:42 PM, Larry Jaques wrote:
On Thu, 24 May 2012 09:50:43 -0500, "Lloyd E. Sponenburgh"
lloydspinsidemindspring.com wrote:

fired this volley in
:

Can you copy the G-code into a troubleshooting file and edit out
everything before the first 3D MOP? (Whatever that is?)

It's just text. Any editor will work.

Anything but WordImperfect.g Back in the early '90s, I got lots
of consulting work getting computers back up and running after the
brilliant experts had modified their config.sys and autoexec.bat files
with WP and saved them in WP format. The hardest task of the day back
then was _not_giggling_ as I 'repaired' the computer.

About the same time, I had to "repair" a computer because an employee
had opened command.com in Word Perfect, then saved before exiting the
document.

David

"David R. Birch" on Fri, 25 May 2012 05:41:27 -0500
typed in rec.crafts.metalworking the following:
On 5/24/2012 7:42 PM, Larry Jaques wrote:
On Thu, 24 May 2012 09:50:43 -0500, "Lloyd E. Sponenburgh"
lloydspinsidemindspring.com wrote:

fired this volley in
:

Can you copy the G-code into a troubleshooting file and edit out
everything before the first 3D MOP? (Whatever that is?)

It's just text. Any editor will work.

Anything but WordImperfect.g Back in the early '90s, I got lots
of consulting work getting computers back up and running after the
brilliant experts had modified their config.sys and autoexec.bat files
with WP and saved them in WP format. The hardest task of the day back
then was _not_giggling_ as I 'repaired' the computer.

About the same time, I had to "repair" a computer because an employee
had opened command.com in Word Perfect, then saved before exiting the
document.

Took me a while to figure that one out. LOL.

Like the guy who called tech support because they'd lost a
document in the word processor, and was told "Do nothing" - then
closed the program, and turned off the machine. They were extremely
irate to learn the next day that while there had been a slight chance
of recover if he'd followed instructions, the document was now
completely beyond all hopes of recovery.

"That watch you sold me doesn't work."
"Did you wind it up?"
"Of course I wound it."
"I told you not to interfere with it!"


tschus
pyotr
--
pyotr
Go not to the Net for answers, for it will tell you Yes and no. And
you are a bloody fool, only an ignorant cretin would even ask the
question, forty two, 47, the second door, and how many blonde lawyers
does it take to change a lightbulb.

pyotr filipivich fired this volley in
:

"That watch you sold me doesn't work."
"Did you wind it up?"
"Of course I wound it."
"I told you not to interfere with it!"

I _have_ a Russian consumer-grade pocket watch. That's the best advice
I've ever heard for one of them! G

LLoyd

On 2012-05-24, Ignoramus6562 wrote:

On 2012-05-24, Bob La Londe wrote:
I finished a prototype mold for somebody yesterday. Just a little 2 cavity
to test the concept. The I nested it out and blew it up to a full work
envelope 22 cavity mold and started it cutting about 10:00 last night. When
I ran a simulation on it it said it would take 23 1/2 hours. WHAT? Its

I am not an expert on CNC, or anything, but I remember that I also
made a mold cavity for my kids toy.

I started out with this job taking 1 hr 50 minutes.

After some optimizations, it became a 10 minute job.

Hmm ... are the cavities cylindrical? Is the program actually
making a gazillion tiny straight line cuts, instead of making use of the
ability to cut curves? The start and stop times of all those tiny cuts
add up compared to something making a circular cut. But if it is not
circular, then you are stuck with all those tiny cuts.

Even so -- you are also limited by the total cut length, and the
maximum feed which the cutter can handle. If you're after fine detail,
you are using a small cutter, and it is limited in the number of inches
per minute which it can handle, even if the mill itself can move a lot
faster. Breaking a thousand cutters for one project does not make much
sense. :-)

Good Luck,
DoN.

--
Remove oil spill source from e-mail
Email: | Voice (all times): (703) 938-4564
(too) near Washington D.C. | http://www.d-and-d.com/dnichols/DoN.html
--- Black Holes are where God is dividing by zero ---

"Lloyd E. Sponenburgh" lloydspinsidemindspring.com on Fri, 25 May
2012 15:16:45 -0500 typed in rec.crafts.metalworking the following:
pyotr filipivich fired this volley:

"That watch you sold me doesn't work."
"Did you wind it up?"
"Of course I wound it."
"I told you not to interfere with it!"

I _have_ a Russian consumer-grade pocket watch. That's the best advice
I've ever heard for one of them! G

I snagged that from a British "comedy" recording.
--
pyotr
Go not to the Net for answers, for it will tell you Yes and no. And
you are a bloody fool, only an ignorant cretin would even ask the
question, forty two, 47, the second door, and how many blonde lawyers
does it take to change a lightbulb.

"DoN. Nichols" wrote in message
...
On 2012-05-24, Ignoramus6562 wrote:

On 2012-05-24, Bob La Londe wrote:
I finished a prototype mold for somebody yesterday. Just a little 2
cavity
to test the concept. The I nested it out and blew it up to a full work
envelope 22 cavity mold and started it cutting about 10:00 last night.
When
I ran a simulation on it it said it would take 23 1/2 hours. WHAT? Its

I am not an expert on CNC, or anything, but I remember that I also
made a mold cavity for my kids toy.

I started out with this job taking 1 hr 50 minutes.

After some optimizations, it became a 10 minute job.

Hmm ... are the cavities cylindrical? Is the program actually
making a gazillion tiny straight line cuts, instead of making use of the
ability to cut curves? The start and stop times of all those tiny cuts
add up compared to something making a circular cut. But if it is not
circular, then you are stuck with all those tiny cuts.

Even so -- you are also limited by the total cut length, and the
maximum feed which the cutter can handle. If you're after fine detail,
you are using a small cutter, and it is limited in the number of inches
per minute which it can handle, even if the mill itself can move a lot
faster. Breaking a thousand cutters for one project does not make much
sense. :-)

After the miscut I got frustrated and put some aggressive roughing in, and
cut the time in half... and as expected my cheap spindle bearings are now
ready for an upgrade to better bearings after that.