Too bad this line probably can't be set back up. This would make a
mean boat engine.

http://www.liveleak.com/view?i=0b2_1310169635

What ever became of that guy that was making a 1/4 scale Merlin that
was posted about on RCM some years back?
Dave

--Saw one a couple yrs back at the Vallejo model engineering show;
complete with scale prop. Will look for photos..

--
"Steamboat Ed" Haas : Steel, Stainless, Titanium:
Hacking the Trailing Edge! : Guaranteed Uncertified Welding!
www.nmpproducts.com
---Decks a-wash in a sea of words---

On Sat, 09 Jul 2011 01:00:47 -0400, lid wrote:

Too bad this line probably can't be set back up. This would make a
mean boat engine.

http://www.liveleak.com/view?i=0b2_1310169635

What ever became of that guy that was making a 1/4 scale Merlin that
was posted about on RCM some years back?
Dave


The RCMP used to have 50' coastal patrol boats with twin Merlins,
those puppies wouls MOVE. They had even faster speedboats that fit
into the back of the patrol boats, they'd kick'em loose at full speed.
Must have been a Fun Ride .

H.

On Sat, 09 Jul 2011 20:06:38 -0300, Howard Eisenhauer
wrote:

On Sat, 09 Jul 2011 01:00:47 -0400, lid wrote:

Too bad this line probably can't be set back up. This would make a
mean boat engine.

http://www.liveleak.com/view?i=0b2_1310169635

What ever became of that guy that was making a 1/4 scale Merlin that
was posted about on RCM some years back?
Dave


The RCMP used to have 50' coastal patrol boats with twin Merlins,
those puppies wouls MOVE. They had even faster speedboats that fit
into the back of the patrol boats, they'd kick'em loose at full speed.
Must have been a Fun Ride .

I'll bet. Here on our Rogue River, the jet boats have triple Chevy
454s. They're definitely a hoot, especially when they get up to speed,
whip the wheel, and we spin around fast enough to get hit by the
rooster tail it threw up. It's best on 90F+ days.

These are big, 50-person cattle boats, but they _m o v e_!
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=jC-zIqeJx28 The older, smaller ones.
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=AIxCGgYvTT4

--
One word frees us of all the weight and pain of life: That word is love.
-- Sophocles

On Sat, 09 Jul 2011 20:06:38 -0300, Howard Eisenhauer
wrote:


The RCMP used to have 50' coastal patrol boats with twin Merlins,
those puppies wouls MOVE. They had even faster speedboats that fit
into the back of the patrol boats, they'd kick'em loose at full speed.
Must have been a Fun Ride .

H.

TWIN Merlins!!!??? Now we're talking about my dream boat.
Dave

On 7/9/2011 3:06 PM, Howard Eisenhauer wrote:

The RCMP used to have 50' coastal patrol boats with twin Merlins,
those puppies wouls MOVE. They had even faster speedboats that fit
into the back of the patrol boats, they'd kick'em loose at full speed.
Must have been a Fun Ride .

Don't know about the boats you reference, but I remember reading that
the PT boats the US Navy was running in the Pacific, had a rather
punishing ride in choppy or rough water when running at speed.


Jon

Jon Anderson wrote:
On 7/9/2011 3:06 PM, Howard Eisenhauer wrote:

The RCMP used to have 50' coastal patrol boats with twin Merlins,
those puppies wouls MOVE. They had even faster speedboats that fit
into the back of the patrol boats, they'd kick'em loose at full speed.
Must have been a Fun Ride .

Don't know about the boats you reference, but I remember reading that
the PT boats the US Navy was running in the Pacific, had a rather
punishing ride in choppy or rough water when running at speed.


Jon

Yeah, but that was THREE engines...

--

Richard Lamb
http://www.home.earthlink.net/~cavelamb
http://www.home.earthlink.net/~sv_temptress

On Jul 10, 4:04*am, wrote:
On Sat, 09 Jul 2011 20:06:38 -0300, Howard Eisenhauer

wrote:
The RCMP used to have 50' coastal patrol boats with twin Merlins,
those puppies wouls MOVE. *They had even faster speedboats that fit
into the back of the patrol boats, they'd kick'em loose at full speed.
Must have been a Fun Ride .

H.

TWIN Merlins!!!??? Now we're talking about my dream boat.
Dave

When I was in the Royal Air Force 1959-64, I was on Gan in the
Maldives. There were two AVRO Shackletons Mk 1 on permanent Search &
Rescue duty. I was there to fix the airborne radar. Also we had a
couple of Target Towing Launches (TTLs), they had two marinised
Griffon engines. These Griffons were used in the Shackleton and were
quite a bit bigger than the Merlin. The Shackletons had contra
rotating props to absorb the extra horsepower. I had the enviable job
of looking after the Sarah Beacons that alll the aircrew carried and
and the receivers that were in the TTLs and the Shacks. We used to
abandon a little Sarah beacon in a dingy, shoot off 50 miles or so, in
any direction and then come back and find it. Sometimes the Indian
Ocean was like a millpond and boy - did these boats go! We never lost
one Sarah beacon. They were started by explosive cartridges and when
these two huge engines were put to work, the fairly light TTL would
really fly! They were made of wood - so as to be non magnetic, and
about 50 ft. and I dearly, dearly wanted one. There were quite a few
based around and Lossiemouth in Scotland springs to mind. Being wood
they did not last long, especially in the tropics, but what craft
these were. 4000 gallons of aviation fuel would be a bit hard to
handle nowadays, but it wasn't a problem then.

Regards George.

On 07/10/2011 03:09 PM, Ed Huntress wrote:
You might want to look up some things about the rum runners that were built
during Prohibition. A famous one was built around 15 miles from where I now
live. Her name was "Fleur de Lis." 52' long (IIRC), she was clocked at 55
mph with a full load of illicit booze aboard. She had three Liberty aircraft
engines, the predecessor of the Allison that powered the early P-51s. The
Coast Guard chase boat that was built to go after her had two Liberties.
That's why Fleur de Lis had three -- an advantage of the flexibility of free
enterprise over government bureaucracy.


There was a book called Rumrunner (ISBN 0-920501-94-X) that is full of
stories from a guy that was a rumrunner up around Puget sound and a
little south. It was written by the guy's niece (Marion Parker), based
on verbal stories. If nothing else it is an entertaining read.

There were a number of stories about outrageously powered boats.

BobH

On Sat, 09 Jul 2011 23:04:42 -0400, lid wrote:

On Sat, 09 Jul 2011 20:06:38 -0300, Howard Eisenhauer
wrote:


The RCMP used to have 50' coastal patrol boats with twin Merlins,
those puppies wouls MOVE. They had even faster speedboats that fit
into the back of the patrol boats, they'd kick'em loose at full speed.
Must have been a Fun Ride .

H.

TWIN Merlins!!!??? Now we're talking about my dream boat.
Dave

Have you seen the coast gaurd's little go fast boat. four four stroke
outboards on a light boat under thirty feet.

They decided to stop us once. I KNOW they were doing over seventy on
the water coming up behind us doing 24 knots. Looked like we were
standing still. The captain held a M16 while the mate boarded us. We
got a citation for a non conforming life ring. And a story to tell the
grandkids.

Karl

wrote in message
...
On Sat, 09 Jul 2011 20:06:38 -0300, Howard Eisenhauer
wrote:


The RCMP used to have 50' coastal patrol boats with twin Merlins,
those puppies wouls MOVE. They had even faster speedboats that fit
into the back of the patrol boats, they'd kick'em loose at full speed.
Must have been a Fun Ride .

H.

TWIN Merlins!!!??? Now we're talking about my dream boat.
Dave

You might want to look up some things about the rum runners that were built
during Prohibition. A famous one was built around 15 miles from where I now
live. Her name was "Fleur de Lis." 52' long (IIRC), she was clocked at 55
mph with a full load of illicit booze aboard. She had three Liberty aircraft
engines, the predecessor of the Allison that powered the early P-51s. The
Coast Guard chase boat that was built to go after her had two Liberties.
That's why Fleur de Lis had three -- an advantage of the flexibility of free
enterprise over government bureaucracy.

We had some fantastic rum runners built around here, on the shores of the
Raritan Bay. My uncle made pin money tuning and maintaining the engines on
Fleur de Lis -- when he wasn't teaching shop in a local high school. d8-)

--
Ed Huntress

"BobH" wrote in message
...
On 07/10/2011 03:09 PM, Ed Huntress wrote:
You might want to look up some things about the rum runners that were
built
during Prohibition. A famous one was built around 15 miles from where I
now
live. Her name was "Fleur de Lis." 52' long (IIRC), she was clocked at 55
mph with a full load of illicit booze aboard. She had three Liberty
aircraft
engines, the predecessor of the Allison that powered the early P-51s. The
Coast Guard chase boat that was built to go after her had two Liberties.
That's why Fleur de Lis had three -- an advantage of the flexibility of
free
enterprise over government bureaucracy.


There was a book called Rumrunner (ISBN 0-920501-94-X) that is full of
stories from a guy that was a rumrunner up around Puget sound and a little
south. It was written by the guy's niece (Marion Parker), based on verbal
stories. If nothing else it is an entertaining read.

There were a number of stories about outrageously powered boats.

BobH

I'll bet I'd enjoy that. I'll have to keep it in mind.

Fleur de Lis is described in a book that was published by Rutgers Univ.
Press a few decades ago, _The Sea Bright Skiff and Other Shore Boats_, which
contains a photo of her. But I preferred my uncle's accounts of how she
evaded the Coast Guard and snuck up the creeks in Staten Island and New
Jersey, after running in the 12 miles from booze pick-ups, which they got
from Canadian ships that would just park offshore.

It was a long time before small ocean-going boats would go over 50 mph
again. I recall seeing one of the first, Bertram's original prototype, the
Blue Moppie, running in the Miami-Nassau powerboat race in the early '60s.

--
Ed Huntress

On Sat, 09 Jul 2011 23:04:42 -0400, lid wrote:

On Sat, 09 Jul 2011 20:06:38 -0300, Howard Eisenhauer
wrote:


The RCMP used to have 50' coastal patrol boats with twin Merlins,
those puppies wouls MOVE. They had even faster speedboats that fit
into the back of the patrol boats, they'd kick'em loose at full speed.
Must have been a Fun Ride .

H.

TWIN Merlins!!!??? Now we're talking about my dream boat.
Dave
Miss Supertest III only had one when Bob Hayward won the Harmsworth
Trophy three times in a row.
Gerry :-)}
London, Canada

In article ,
says...

Jon Anderson wrote:
On 7/9/2011 3:06 PM, Howard Eisenhauer wrote:

The RCMP used to have 50' coastal patrol boats with twin Merlins,
those puppies wouls MOVE. They had even faster speedboats that fit
into the back of the patrol boats, they'd kick'em loose at full speed.
Must have been a Fun Ride .

Don't know about the boats you reference, but I remember reading that
the PT boats the US Navy was running in the Pacific, had a rather
punishing ride in choppy or rough water when running at speed.


Jon

Yeah, but that was THREE engines...

Not Merlins, alas. Perhaps with Merlins they'd actually have been able
to pull off those 70-knot dashes that the press thought they could do.

"J. Clarke" wrote in message
in.local...
In article ,
says...

Jon Anderson wrote:
On 7/9/2011 3:06 PM, Howard Eisenhauer wrote:

The RCMP used to have 50' coastal patrol boats with twin Merlins,
those puppies wouls MOVE. They had even faster speedboats that fit
into the back of the patrol boats, they'd kick'em loose at full speed.
Must have been a Fun Ride .

Don't know about the boats you reference, but I remember reading that
the PT boats the US Navy was running in the Pacific, had a rather
punishing ride in choppy or rough water when running at speed.


Jon

Yeah, but that was THREE engines...

Not Merlins, alas. Perhaps with Merlins they'd actually have been able
to pull off those 70-knot dashes that the press thought they could do.

There were several US PT boat designs, but most, if not all, had a hull
shape like that of sports boat planing hulls of the time, which is still the
prevalent hull shape today: a "shallow V" planing hull which had an almost
flat run aft, for speed (and fuel efficiency, in sports boats), combined
with a fine entry. If you read hull drawings, you can see it here, down the
page:

http://www.pt-boat.com/ (click on "Redrawn Original Hull Construction
Plans")

Those things pound in rough water and their speed in limited when the water
gets rough. But they're very fast. They were used in ocean racers until
around 1962, when Bertram introduced the deep-V with longitudinal lifting
strakes. The deep Vs suck up power and fuel but you can plow them through
waves at very high speeds without pounding the fastenings out of the hull.

The engines were Packard 4M-2500s. These were not re-badged Liberties that
Packard made before the war, nor were they the Merlins that Packard made
under license later in the war. They were a Packard design that produced up
to 1,500 hp in the PT boat version. This was as much power as most Merlins
made, except for the special versions made for the de Havilland Hornet and a
few others. The Merlin's big advantage was at high altitude, because of its
very effective two-stage supercharger. The low-altitude Merlins used a
single stage.

So I don't think the PT boats lacked much in the power department.

--
Ed Huntress

In article ,
says...

"J. Clarke" wrote in message
in.local...
In article ,
says...

Jon Anderson wrote:
On 7/9/2011 3:06 PM, Howard Eisenhauer wrote:

The RCMP used to have 50' coastal patrol boats with twin Merlins,
those puppies wouls MOVE. They had even faster speedboats that fit
into the back of the patrol boats, they'd kick'em loose at full speed.
Must have been a Fun Ride .

Don't know about the boats you reference, but I remember reading that
the PT boats the US Navy was running in the Pacific, had a rather
punishing ride in choppy or rough water when running at speed.


Jon

Yeah, but that was THREE engines...

Not Merlins, alas. Perhaps with Merlins they'd actually have been able
to pull off those 70-knot dashes that the press thought they could do.

There were several US PT boat designs, but most, if not all, had a hull
shape like that of sports boat planing hulls of the time, which is still the
prevalent hull shape today: a "shallow V" planing hull which had an almost
flat run aft, for speed (and fuel efficiency, in sports boats), combined
with a fine entry. If you read hull drawings, you can see it here, down the
page:

http://www.pt-boat.com/ (click on "Redrawn Original Hull Construction
Plans")

Those things pound in rough water and their speed in limited when the water
gets rough. But they're very fast. They were used in ocean racers until
around 1962, when Bertram introduced the deep-V with longitudinal lifting
strakes. The deep Vs suck up power and fuel but you can plow them through
waves at very high speeds without pounding the fastenings out of the hull.

The hull was actually the Huckins Quadraconic, which reduced pounding
compared to other similar designs--Huckins licensed the design to the
War Department. Incidentally I met Pembroke Huckins once--I was just a
little kid and don't remember anything about the meeting except that he
was a lot taller than I was and seemed nice. Used to drive past the
Huckins yard regularly.

The engines were Packard 4M-2500s. These were not re-badged Liberties that
Packard made before the war, nor were they the Merlins that Packard made
under license later in the war. They were a Packard design that produced up
to 1,500 hp in the PT boat version. This was as much power as most Merlins
made, except for the special versions made for the de Havilland Hornet and a
few others. The Merlin's big advantage was at high altitude, because of its
very effective two-stage supercharger. The low-altitude Merlins used a
single stage.

So I don't think the PT boats lacked much in the power department.

Still, one can dream. Of course if I could scrape up 3 Merlins and a
million bucks or so I'm sure that Huckins would be happy to build me
such a vessel.

"J. Clarke" wrote in message
in.local...
In article ,
says...

"J. Clarke" wrote in message
in.local...
In article ,
says...

Jon Anderson wrote:
On 7/9/2011 3:06 PM, Howard Eisenhauer wrote:

The RCMP used to have 50' coastal patrol boats with twin Merlins,
those puppies wouls MOVE. They had even faster speedboats that fit
into the back of the patrol boats, they'd kick'em loose at full
speed.
Must have been a Fun Ride .

Don't know about the boats you reference, but I remember reading
that
the PT boats the US Navy was running in the Pacific, had a rather
punishing ride in choppy or rough water when running at speed.


Jon

Yeah, but that was THREE engines...

Not Merlins, alas. Perhaps with Merlins they'd actually have been able
to pull off those 70-knot dashes that the press thought they could do.

There were several US PT boat designs, but most, if not all, had a hull
shape like that of sports boat planing hulls of the time, which is still
the
prevalent hull shape today: a "shallow V" planing hull which had an
almost
flat run aft, for speed (and fuel efficiency, in sports boats), combined
with a fine entry. If you read hull drawings, you can see it here, down
the
page:

http://www.pt-boat.com/ (click on "Redrawn Original Hull Construction
Plans")

Those things pound in rough water and their speed in limited when the
water
gets rough. But they're very fast. They were used in ocean racers until
around 1962, when Bertram introduced the deep-V with longitudinal lifting
strakes. The deep Vs suck up power and fuel but you can plow them through
waves at very high speeds without pounding the fastenings out of the
hull.

The hull was actually the Huckins Quadraconic, which reduced pounding
compared to other similar designs--Huckins licensed the design to the
War Department. Incidentally I met Pembroke Huckins once--I was just a
little kid and don't remember anything about the meeting except that he
was a lot taller than I was and seemed nice. Used to drive past the
Huckins yard regularly.

Aha. Huckins were pretty rare among PT boats -- just 18 out of roughly 600
PT boats built by the end of the war. Most were ELCOs (Electric Boat Co.).

http://www.ptboats.org/20-01-05-ptboat-001.html

Those developed-cone plywood shapes, based on the Quadraconic, remained
popular through the '60s, and their concave entry did reduce the slamming
into waves.

--
Ed Huntress


The engines were Packard 4M-2500s. These were not re-badged Liberties
that
Packard made before the war, nor were they the Merlins that Packard made
under license later in the war. They were a Packard design that produced
up
to 1,500 hp in the PT boat version. This was as much power as most
Merlins
made, except for the special versions made for the de Havilland Hornet
and a
few others. The Merlin's big advantage was at high altitude, because of
its
very effective two-stage supercharger. The low-altitude Merlins used a
single stage.

So I don't think the PT boats lacked much in the power department.

Still, one can dream. Of course if I could scrape up 3 Merlins and a
million bucks or so I'm sure that Huckins would be happy to build me
such a vessel.

In article ,
says...

"J. Clarke" wrote in message
in.local...
In article ,
says...

"J. Clarke" wrote in message
in.local...
In article ,
says...

Jon Anderson wrote:
On 7/9/2011 3:06 PM, Howard Eisenhauer wrote:

The RCMP used to have 50' coastal patrol boats with twin Merlins,
those puppies wouls MOVE. They had even faster speedboats that fit
into the back of the patrol boats, they'd kick'em loose at full
speed.
Must have been a Fun Ride .

Don't know about the boats you reference, but I remember reading
that
the PT boats the US Navy was running in the Pacific, had a rather
punishing ride in choppy or rough water when running at speed.


Jon

Yeah, but that was THREE engines...

Not Merlins, alas. Perhaps with Merlins they'd actually have been able
to pull off those 70-knot dashes that the press thought they could do.

There were several US PT boat designs, but most, if not all, had a hull
shape like that of sports boat planing hulls of the time, which is still
the
prevalent hull shape today: a "shallow V" planing hull which had an
almost
flat run aft, for speed (and fuel efficiency, in sports boats), combined
with a fine entry. If you read hull drawings, you can see it here, down
the
page:

http://www.pt-boat.com/ (click on "Redrawn Original Hull Construction
Plans")

Those things pound in rough water and their speed in limited when the
water
gets rough. But they're very fast. They were used in ocean racers until
around 1962, when Bertram introduced the deep-V with longitudinal lifting
strakes. The deep Vs suck up power and fuel but you can plow them through
waves at very high speeds without pounding the fastenings out of the
hull.

The hull was actually the Huckins Quadraconic, which reduced pounding
compared to other similar designs--Huckins licensed the design to the
War Department. Incidentally I met Pembroke Huckins once--I was just a
little kid and don't remember anything about the meeting except that he
was a lot taller than I was and seemed nice. Used to drive past the
Huckins yard regularly.

Aha. Huckins were pretty rare among PT boats -- just 18 out of roughly 600
PT boats built by the end of the war. Most were ELCOs (Electric Boat Co.).

http://www.ptboats.org/20-01-05-ptboat-001.html

Those developed-cone plywood shapes, based on the Quadraconic, remained
popular through the '60s, and their concave entry did reduce the slamming
into waves.

Supposedly the War Department told Elco to use the quadraconic after the
sea trials on their prototype. There was some other Huckins technology
that was licensed to the other manufactureres as well.

If you look at the drawing on pt-boat.com you'll see that the entry is
indeed concave (note though that I'm not clear on his source for that
drawing--did he have access to an original Elco from which he could take
dimensions?).