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Metalworking (rec.crafts.metalworking) Discuss various aspects of working with metal, such as machining, welding, metal joining, screwing, casting, hardening/tempering, blacksmithing/forging, spinning and hammer work, sheet metal work. |
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#1
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Pictures of a double hook that I welded together
http://igor.chudov.com/projects/Weld...ble-Grab-Hook/
I welded this double hook from two Harbor Freight grab hooks and a 1/4" steel plate. The purpose of it is to let me use arbitrary lengths of chain, single and two ends, when lifting stuff, as well as grab to access lifting eyes with just a piece of chain (see last picture). Welding was done with 1/8" E7018 electrodes. |
#2
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Pictures of a double hook that I welded together
In article ,
Ignoramus9191 wrote: http://igor.chudov.com/projects/Weld...ble-Grab-Hook/ I welded this double hook from two Harbor Freight grab hooks and a 1/4" steel plate. The purpose of it is to let me use arbitrary lengths of chain, single and two ends, when lifting stuff, as well as grab to access lifting eyes with just a piece of chain (see last picture). Welding was done with 1/8" E7018 electrodes. While you will no doubt get lots of advice on welding and redoing the heat treatment of the hooks (if HF hooks are in fact heat treated), don't forget to proof test this to four times the intended max load. Joe Gwinn |
#3
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Pictures of a double hook that I welded together
On 2010-05-01, Joseph Gwinn wrote:
In article , Ignoramus9191 wrote: http://igor.chudov.com/projects/Weld...ble-Grab-Hook/ I welded this double hook from two Harbor Freight grab hooks and a 1/4" steel plate. The purpose of it is to let me use arbitrary lengths of chain, single and two ends, when lifting stuff, as well as grab to access lifting eyes with just a piece of chain (see last picture). Welding was done with 1/8" E7018 electrodes. While you will no doubt get lots of advice on welding and redoing the heat treatment of the hooks (if HF hooks are in fact heat treated), don't forget to proof test this to four times the intended max load. I just proof tested it in a 12 ton arbor press. See my another post. This was actually a good idea Joe. i |
#4
Posted to rec.crafts.metalworking
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Pictures of a double hook that I welded together
Ignoramus9191 wrote:
http://igor.chudov.com/projects/Weld...ble-Grab-Hook/ I welded this double hook from two Harbor Freight grab hooks and a 1/4" steel plate. The purpose of it is to let me use arbitrary lengths of chain, single and two ends, when lifting stuff, as well as grab to access lifting eyes with just a piece of chain (see last picture). Welding was done with 1/8" E7018 electrodes. Boy did you catch hell. I assume you know to never get under a lift. Nuff said. Wes |
#5
Posted to rec.crafts.metalworking
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Pictures of a double hook that I welded together
"Wes" wrote in message ... Ignoramus9191 wrote: http://igor.chudov.com/projects/Weld...ble-Grab-Hook/ I welded this double hook from two Harbor Freight grab hooks and a 1/4" steel plate. The purpose of it is to let me use arbitrary lengths of chain, single and two ends, when lifting stuff, as well as grab to access lifting eyes with just a piece of chain (see last picture). Welding was done with 1/8" E7018 electrodes. Boy did you catch hell. I assume you know to never get under a lift. Nuff said. Wes And here is a reminder why not http://www.break.com/index/cable-fai...et-engine.html |
#6
Posted to rec.crafts.metalworking
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Pictures of a double hook that I welded together
"Wes" wrote in message ... Ignoramus9191 wrote: http://igor.chudov.com/projects/Weld...ble-Grab-Hook/ I welded this double hook from two Harbor Freight grab hooks and a 1/4" steel plate. The purpose of it is to let me use arbitrary lengths of chain, single and two ends, when lifting stuff, as well as grab to access lifting eyes with just a piece of chain (see last picture). Welding was done with 1/8" E7018 electrodes. Boy did you catch hell. I assume you know to never get under a lift. Nuff said. Wes I have seen many failed lifting hooks and accessories, and can think of at least half a dozen due to welding. The loads I have seen dropped due to bad welding range from about one tonne to 110 tonnes. It looks like the welded hooks were G30 hook they may be more weldeable than G80 lifting gear. If you want to weld hooks to a plate, weldable hooks are readily available for the purpose, why not simply use the right item. I can think of several people who never worked again as a result of poor lifting practices. If you are hand slinging you are too close for comfort if the chain or hook fails. |
#7
Posted to rec.crafts.metalworking
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Pictures of a double hook that I welded together
"anorton" wrote:
Boy did you catch hell. I assume you know to never get under a lift. Nuff said. Wes And here is a reminder why not http://www.break.com/index/cable-fai...et-engine.html We have a service company inspect our hoists every year. So far no incidents. Still, I eyeball the situation before I perform a lift. Stuff happens. I *always* operate on the concept that it is likely to fail. If the load needs stabilizing, I use a tag line so I can stay away from the thing in case it falls. I'm very squishy. As far as Iggy, I'm fairly confident he understands physical properties well enough to know if his setup is safe for what he is doing. If nothing else we have reinforced that you don't get into the squish zone no matter how substantial your lifting setup appears to be. Wes Wes -- "Additionally as a security officer, I carry a gun to protect government officials but my life isn't worth protecting at home in their eyes." Dick Anthony Heller |
#8
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Pictures of a double hook that I welded together
On 2010-05-01, Wes wrote:
"anorton" wrote: Boy did you catch hell. I assume you know to never get under a lift. Nuff said. Wes And here is a reminder why not http://www.break.com/index/cable-fai...et-engine.html We have a service company inspect our hoists every year. So far no incidents. Still, I eyeball the situation before I perform a lift. Stuff happens. I *always* operate on the concept that it is likely to fail. If the load needs stabilizing, I use a tag line so I can stay away from the thing in case it falls. I'm very squishy. As far as Iggy, I'm fairly confident he understands physical properties well enough to know if his setup is safe for what he is doing. If nothing else we have reinforced that you don't get into the squish zone no matter how substantial your lifting setup appears to be. It is safe because what I am doing is far below the ultimate strength of this assembly. Thanks Wes. i |
#9
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Pictures of a double hook that I welded together
On 2010-05-01, ddeu wrote:
I have seen many failed lifting hooks and accessories, and can think of at least half a dozen due to welding. The loads I have seen dropped due to bad welding range from about one tonne to 110 tonnes. It looks like the welded hooks were G30 hook they may be more weldeable than G80 lifting gear. They were G30 hooks. i |
#10
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Pictures of a double hook that I welded together
In article ,
Ignoramus26879 wrote: On 2010-05-01, Joseph Gwinn wrote: In article , Ignoramus9191 wrote: http://igor.chudov.com/projects/Weld...ble-Grab-Hook/ I welded this double hook from two Harbor Freight grab hooks and a 1/4" steel plate. The purpose of it is to let me use arbitrary lengths of chain, single and two ends, when lifting stuff, as well as grab to access lifting eyes with just a piece of chain (see last picture). Welding was done with 1/8" E7018 electrodes. While you will no doubt get lots of advice on welding and redoing the heat treatment of the hooks (if HF hooks are in fact heat treated), don't forget to proof test this to four times the intended max load. I just proof tested it in a 12 ton arbor press. See my another post. This was actually a good idea Joe. I don't quite visualize how you used the arbor press, but another poster questioned if the 0.250" plate was thick enough, and the hook loop looked a bit thin to my eye. I actually have no idea if the plate and loop are strong enough, but the most reliable test is to lift something using this fixture. Do this twice, with a fully asymmetrical load - full test load on the left hook, then full test load on the right hook. You said that the max intended is 1000#, so the proof test load is 4000#. This test is cruel. The point is to break it in test, if it's going to break at all. Joe Gwinn |
#11
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Pictures of a double hook that I welded together
Wes wrote:
wrote: Boy did you catch hell. I assume you know to never get under a lift. Nuff said. Wes And here is a reminder why not http://www.break.com/index/cable-fai...et-engine.html We have a service company inspect our hoists every year. So far no incidents. Still, I eyeball the situation before I perform a lift. Stuff happens. I *always* operate on the concept that it is likely to fail. If the load needs stabilizing, I use a tag line so I can stay away from the thing in case it falls. I'm very squishy. As far as Iggy, I'm fairly confident he understands physical properties well enough to know if his setup is safe for what he is doing. If nothing else we have reinforced that you don't get into the squish zone no matter how substantial your lifting setup appears to be. Wes Wes -- "Additionally as a security officer, I carry a gun to protect government officials but my life isn't worth protecting at home in their eyes." Dick Anthony Heller This site pretty well defines overhead lifting and the use of the proper equipment to do the job. http://www.jrclancy.com/Downloads/TrimChains-ESG.pdf John |
#12
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Pictures of a double hook that I welded together
On 2010-05-01, Joseph Gwinn wrote:
In article , Ignoramus26879 wrote: On 2010-05-01, Joseph Gwinn wrote: In article , Ignoramus9191 wrote: http://igor.chudov.com/projects/Weld...ble-Grab-Hook/ I welded this double hook from two Harbor Freight grab hooks and a 1/4" steel plate. The purpose of it is to let me use arbitrary lengths of chain, single and two ends, when lifting stuff, as well as grab to access lifting eyes with just a piece of chain (see last picture). Welding was done with 1/8" E7018 electrodes. While you will no doubt get lots of advice on welding and redoing the heat treatment of the hooks (if HF hooks are in fact heat treated), don't forget to proof test this to four times the intended max load. I just proof tested it in a 12 ton arbor press. See my another post. This was actually a good idea Joe. I don't quite visualize how you used the arbor press, but another poster questioned if the 0.250" plate was thick enough, and the hook loop looked a bit thin to my eye. I actually have no idea if the plate and loop are strong enough, but the most reliable test is to lift something using this fixture. Do this twice, with a fully asymmetrical load - full test load on the left hook, then full test load on the right hook. You said that the max intended is 1000#, so the proof test load is 4000#. This test is cruel. The point is to break it in test, if it's going to break at all. Joe Gwinn I can try my my engine hoist (shop crane), it goes up to 2 tons. i |
#13
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Pictures of a double hook that I welded together
In article ,
Ignoramus26879 wrote: On 2010-05-01, Joseph Gwinn wrote: In article , Ignoramus26879 wrote: On 2010-05-01, Joseph Gwinn wrote: In article , Ignoramus9191 wrote: http://igor.chudov.com/projects/Weld...ble-Grab-Hook/ I welded this double hook from two Harbor Freight grab hooks and a 1/4" steel plate. The purpose of it is to let me use arbitrary lengths of chain, single and two ends, when lifting stuff, as well as grab to access lifting eyes with just a piece of chain (see last picture). Welding was done with 1/8" E7018 electrodes. While you will no doubt get lots of advice on welding and redoing the heat treatment of the hooks (if HF hooks are in fact heat treated), don't forget to proof test this to four times the intended max load. I just proof tested it in a 12 ton arbor press. See my another post. This was actually a good idea Joe. I don't quite visualize how you used the arbor press, but another poster questioned if the 0.250" plate was thick enough, and the hook loop looked a bit thin to my eye. I actually have no idea if the plate and loop are strong enough, but the most reliable test is to lift something using this fixture. Do this twice, with a fully asymmetrical load - full test load on the left hook, then full test load on the right hook. You said that the max intended is 1000#, so the proof test load is 4000#. This test is cruel. The point is to break it in test, if it's going to break at all. Joe Gwinn I can try my my engine hoist (shop crane), it goes up to 2 tons. How will you verify that the load is in fact 4000#? This 4000# proof test should be adequate, and will shut off all (well most) of the commentary about the inadvisability of welding such hooks. Now, I agree with much of the spirit of the technical commentary, but if you will not sell these fixtures, a real proof test (described above) should be adequate. And you know the name of the likely victim if it is not. Joe Gwinn |
#14
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Pictures of a double hook that I welded together
On Sat, 01 May 2010 10:06:38 -0500, the infamous Ignoramus26879
scrawled the following: On 2010-05-01, Joseph Gwinn wrote: In article , Ignoramus9191 wrote: http://igor.chudov.com/projects/Weld...ble-Grab-Hook/ I welded this double hook from two Harbor Freight grab hooks and a 1/4" steel plate. The purpose of it is to let me use arbitrary lengths of chain, single and two ends, when lifting stuff, as well as grab to access lifting eyes with just a piece of chain (see last picture). Welding was done with 1/8" E7018 electrodes. While you will no doubt get lots of advice on welding and redoing the heat treatment of the hooks (if HF hooks are in fact heat treated), don't forget to proof test this to four times the intended max load. I just proof tested it in a 12 ton arbor press. See my another post. This was actually a good idea Joe. You _pulled_ on it in a _press_? Bar through the eye over the jack backstop, chain under the ram fastened through the two hooks, I'm guessing? I'd think the eye would be by far the weakest link. Weld some 1/4" rod around the top, eh? I'm sure you already know enough to not get -under- anything lifted with it. -- Courage is the power to let go of the familiar. -- Raymond Lindquist |
#15
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Pictures of a double hook that I welded together
On 2010-05-02, Larry Jaques wrote:
On Sat, 01 May 2010 10:06:38 -0500, the infamous Ignoramus26879 scrawled the following: On 2010-05-01, Joseph Gwinn wrote: In article , Ignoramus9191 wrote: http://igor.chudov.com/projects/Weld...ble-Grab-Hook/ I welded this double hook from two Harbor Freight grab hooks and a 1/4" steel plate. The purpose of it is to let me use arbitrary lengths of chain, single and two ends, when lifting stuff, as well as grab to access lifting eyes with just a piece of chain (see last picture). Welding was done with 1/8" E7018 electrodes. While you will no doubt get lots of advice on welding and redoing the heat treatment of the hooks (if HF hooks are in fact heat treated), don't forget to proof test this to four times the intended max load. I just proof tested it in a 12 ton arbor press. See my another post. This was actually a good idea Joe. You _pulled_ on it in a _press_? Bar through the eye over the jack backstop, chain under the ram fastened through the two hooks, I'm guessing? I'd think the eye would be by far the weakest link. Weld some 1/4" rod around the top, eh? I'm sure you already know enough to not get -under- anything lifted with it. Something will always be the weakest link. This eye has a 1/4 of a square inch in the smallest cross section. At 50000 PSI, it works out to 10,000 lbs. I am not losing my sleep over it. i i |
#16
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Pictures of a double hook that I welded together
On Sat, 1 May 2010 14:04:57 -0700, the infamous "anorton"
scrawled the following: "Wes" wrote in message ... Ignoramus9191 wrote: http://igor.chudov.com/projects/Weld...ble-Grab-Hook/ I welded this double hook from two Harbor Freight grab hooks and a 1/4" steel plate. The purpose of it is to let me use arbitrary lengths of chain, single and two ends, when lifting stuff, as well as grab to access lifting eyes with just a piece of chain (see last picture). Welding was done with 1/8" E7018 electrodes. Boy did you catch hell. I assume you know to never get under a lift. Nuff said. Wes And here is a reminder why not http://www.break.com/index/cable-fai...et-engine.html That one worker is sure lucky he bailed when he did. I wonder if he heard the twang of a cable wire starting to detune... -- Courage is the power to let go of the familiar. -- Raymond Lindquist |
#17
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Pictures of a double hook that I welded together
In article ,
Larry Jaques wrote: I'd think the eye would be by far the weakest link. Weld some 1/4" rod around the top, eh? I'm sure you already know enough to not get -under- anything lifted with it. Unofficial motto of Crane Component Company: We stand behind our work, but not under it -- and neither should you. |
#18
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Pictures of a double hook that I welded together
Nice work. Looks handy.
JR Dweller in the cellar On Fri, 30 Apr 2010 20:57:16 -0500, Ignoramus9191 wrote: http://igor.chudov.com/projects/Weld...ble-Grab-Hook/ I welded this double hook from two Harbor Freight grab hooks and a 1/4" steel plate. The purpose of it is to let me use arbitrary lengths of chain, single and two ends, when lifting stuff, as well as grab to access lifting eyes with just a piece of chain (see last picture). Welding was done with 1/8" E7018 electrodes. |
#19
Posted to rec.crafts.metalworking
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Pictures of a double hook that I welded together
In article ,
Ignoramus26879 wrote: On 2010-05-02, Larry Jaques wrote: On Sat, 01 May 2010 10:06:38 -0500, the infamous Ignoramus26879 scrawled the following: On 2010-05-01, Joseph Gwinn wrote: In article , Ignoramus9191 wrote: http://igor.chudov.com/projects/Weld...ble-Grab-Hook/ I welded this double hook from two Harbor Freight grab hooks and a 1/4" steel plate. The purpose of it is to let me use arbitrary lengths of chain, single and two ends, when lifting stuff, as well as grab to access lifting eyes with just a piece of chain (see last picture). Welding was done with 1/8" E7018 electrodes. While you will no doubt get lots of advice on welding and redoing the heat treatment of the hooks (if HF hooks are in fact heat treated), don't forget to proof test this to four times the intended max load. I just proof tested it in a 12 ton arbor press. See my another post. This was actually a good idea Joe. You _pulled_ on it in a _press_? Bar through the eye over the jack backstop, chain under the ram fastened through the two hooks, I'm guessing? I'd think the eye would be by far the weakest link. Weld some 1/4" rod around the top, eh? I'm sure you already know enough to not get -under- anything lifted with it. Something will always be the weakest link. This eye has a 1/4 of a square inch in the smallest cross section. At 50000 PSI, it works out to 10,000 lbs. I am not losing my sleep over it. If the eye loop is 1/4" by 1/4" square, that's (0.25)(0.25)= 0.0625 square inches, or 1/16 of a square inch. At 50,000 psi, that would be 50000/16= 3,125 pounds, which is a bit too close for comfort, for lots of reasons. Not least of which the steel in hot rolled plate may not always be that good. And the eye loop geometry may not be perfect. And so on. Joe Gwinn |
#20
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Pictures of a double hook that I welded together
On 2010-05-02, Joseph Gwinn wrote:
In article , Ignoramus26879 wrote: On 2010-05-02, Larry Jaques wrote: On Sat, 01 May 2010 10:06:38 -0500, the infamous Ignoramus26879 scrawled the following: On 2010-05-01, Joseph Gwinn wrote: In article , Ignoramus9191 wrote: http://igor.chudov.com/projects/Weld...ble-Grab-Hook/ I welded this double hook from two Harbor Freight grab hooks and a 1/4" steel plate. The purpose of it is to let me use arbitrary lengths of chain, single and two ends, when lifting stuff, as well as grab to access lifting eyes with just a piece of chain (see last picture). Welding was done with 1/8" E7018 electrodes. While you will no doubt get lots of advice on welding and redoing the heat treatment of the hooks (if HF hooks are in fact heat treated), don't forget to proof test this to four times the intended max load. I just proof tested it in a 12 ton arbor press. See my another post. This was actually a good idea Joe. You _pulled_ on it in a _press_? Bar through the eye over the jack backstop, chain under the ram fastened through the two hooks, I'm guessing? I'd think the eye would be by far the weakest link. Weld some 1/4" rod around the top, eh? I'm sure you already know enough to not get -under- anything lifted with it. Something will always be the weakest link. This eye has a 1/4 of a square inch in the smallest cross section. At 50000 PSI, it works out to 10,000 lbs. I am not losing my sleep over it. If the eye loop is 1/4" by 1/4" square, that's (0.25)(0.25)= 0.0625 square inches, or 1/16 of a square inch. No, it is exactly as I said, 1/4 of a square inch. 0.25 square inch. Two 1/2x1/4 areas in the smallest cross section. At 50,000 psi, that would be 50000/16= 3,125 pounds, which is a bit too close for comfort, for lots of reasons. Not least of which the steel in hot rolled plate may not always be that good. And the eye loop geometry may not be perfect. And so on. i |
#21
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Pictures of a double hook that I welded together
In article ,
Ignoramus2896 wrote: On 2010-05-02, Joseph Gwinn wrote: In article , Ignoramus26879 wrote: On 2010-05-02, Larry Jaques wrote: On Sat, 01 May 2010 10:06:38 -0500, the infamous Ignoramus26879 scrawled the following: On 2010-05-01, Joseph Gwinn wrote: In article , Ignoramus9191 wrote: http://igor.chudov.com/projects/Weld...ble-Grab-Hook/ I welded this double hook from two Harbor Freight grab hooks and a 1/4" steel plate. The purpose of it is to let me use arbitrary lengths of chain, single and two ends, when lifting stuff, as well as grab to access lifting eyes with just a piece of chain (see last picture). Welding was done with 1/8" E7018 electrodes. While you will no doubt get lots of advice on welding and redoing the heat treatment of the hooks (if HF hooks are in fact heat treated), don't forget to proof test this to four times the intended max load. I just proof tested it in a 12 ton arbor press. See my another post. This was actually a good idea Joe. You _pulled_ on it in a _press_? Bar through the eye over the jack backstop, chain under the ram fastened through the two hooks, I'm guessing? I'd think the eye would be by far the weakest link. Weld some 1/4" rod around the top, eh? I'm sure you already know enough to not get -under- anything lifted with it. Something will always be the weakest link. This eye has a 1/4 of a square inch in the smallest cross section. At 50000 PSI, it works out to 10,000 lbs. I am not losing my sleep over it. If the eye loop is 1/4" by 1/4" square, that's (0.25)(0.25)= 0.0625 square inches, or 1/16 of a square inch. No, it is exactly as I said, 1/4 of a square inch. 0.25 square inch. Two 1/2x1/4 areas in the smallest cross section. Ahh. That's better. Joe Gwinn |
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