I'm rewiring my tractor. See thread below. While I'm here, I'm taking an
extra couple hours and putting wire number labels on each end of each wire.
Plus writing down the apparent function while rewiring to include fuses.
(the tractor had one fuse stock)

Anyway, the wire labels are semi exposed. Most of them will be gone in 5 or
more years when I got trouble again. Anybody heard of a clear coat that
would seal these and hold them on? Other ideas?

Karl

"Karl Townsend" wrote in message
anews.com...
I'm rewiring my tractor. See thread below. While I'm here, I'm taking an
extra couple hours and putting wire number labels on each end of each
wire. Plus writing down the apparent function while rewiring to include
fuses. (the tractor had one fuse stock)

Anyway, the wire labels are semi exposed. Most of them will be gone in 5
or more years when I got trouble again. Anybody heard of a clear coat that
would seal these and hold them on? Other ideas?

I had an ink roller once that would put numbers on small wires. You had to
roll it twice for double digits but it still came in handy.
I'll look around for it.


JC

Karl Townsend wrote:
I'm rewiring my tractor. See thread below. While I'm here, I'm taking an
extra couple hours and putting wire number labels on each end of each wire.
Plus writing down the apparent function while rewiring to include fuses.
(the tractor had one fuse stock)

Anyway, the wire labels are semi exposed. Most of them will be gone in 5 or
more years when I got trouble again. Anybody heard of a clear coat that
would seal these and hold them on? Other ideas?

Karl

Clear heatshrink tubing. Not perfectly clear, but the numbers show through
and it keeps the labels from getting peeled off.

Tove

On Mar 24, 11:52*am, "Karl Townsend"
wrote:
I'm rewiring my tractor. See thread below. While I'm here, I'm taking an
extra couple hours and putting wire number labels on each end of each wire.
Plus writing down the apparent function while rewiring to include fuses.
(the tractor had one fuse stock)

Anyway, the wire labels are semi exposed. Most of them will be gone in 5 or
more years when I got trouble again. Anybody heard of a clear coat that
would seal these and hold them on? Other ideas?

Karl

What sort of labels? We used to use some cloth-based ones that stuck
pretty well, any electrical supply will have them, but they do cost a
bunch. I tried the Brother P-Touch on car wiring, the stuff
delaminated after about a year in the engine compartment. The
adhesive was still good, though.

I've also used little plastic tags that attach with tie-wraps, you
mark on them with a Sharpie. They work fine until you have to run a
bunch of wires into a tight spot.

The best idea I've seen is the thermal marker, melts the numbers/
letters into the wire jacket. Then there's the VW way, use various
insulation colors and stripe combinations with a matching wire diagram
which is also marked with the actual wire size. Unless everything is
totally black and grungy, you can usually puzzle out what goes to
where with that system. Terminals on the various switches have
numbers that match the diagrams, too.

Stan

fired this volley in news:3d2470bd-0b49-41ab-acc1-
:

Then there's the VW way, use various
insulation colors and stripe combinations with a matching wire
diagram
which is also marked with the actual wire size. Unless everything
is
totally black and grungy, you can usually puzzle out what goes to
where with that system.

I thought that was pretty much the "every car manufacturer way".

In any case, that's not practical for the guy re-wiring his own
harness. One cannot easily obtain a broad selection of color-coded
wires in a given gauge. You'll be lucky to get five colors through
consumer outlets.

Tags or wire markers are the way to go. Brady markers with clear
heat-shrink over them are probably the most durable and easy-to-come-
by solution for the shade-tree guy. You can get Brady labels at any
decent electrical supply house, and most home centers. They aren't
cheap, but keep the extras in a temperate environment, and they'll
last for years.

Make your heat shrink cover longer than you think. Oil can migrate in
between it and the wire, and suck up by capillary attraction until it
munges the label.

Personally, all my engines are wet/dirty somewhere... so I label
everything (at both ends of every run).

LLoyd

"Karl Townsend" wrote in
rec.crafts.metalworking:

I'm rewiring my tractor. See thread below. While I'm here, I'm taking
an extra couple hours and putting wire number labels on each end of
each wire. Plus writing down the apparent function while rewiring to
include fuses. (the tractor had one fuse stock)

Anyway, the wire labels are semi exposed. Most of them will be gone in
5 or more years when I got trouble again. Anybody heard of a clear
coat that would seal these and hold them on? Other ideas?

Karl



Krylon "Crystal Clear".

For a heavier coating, Krylon "Clear Glaze". [Triple thickness]

On Tue, 24 Mar 2009 14:18:29 -0400, Tove Momerathsson wrote:

Karl Townsend wrote:
I'm rewiring my tractor. See thread below. While I'm here, I'm taking
an extra couple hours and putting wire number labels on each end of
each wire. Plus writing down the apparent function while rewiring to
include fuses. (the tractor had one fuse stock)

Anyway, the wire labels are semi exposed. Most of them will be gone in
5 or more years when I got trouble again. Anybody heard of a clear coat
that would seal these and hold them on? Other ideas?

Karl

Clear heatshrink tubing. Not perfectly clear, but the numbers show
through and it keeps the labels from getting peeled off.

Tove

Hey! I was going to suggest that!

It works well. Just be sure to use indelible ink underneath.

--
http://www.wescottdesign.com

On Mar 24, 4:17*pm, Tim Wescott wrote:
On Tue, 24 Mar 2009 14:18:29 -0400, Tove Momerathsson wrote:
Karl Townsend wrote:
I'm rewiring my tractor. See thread below. While I'm here, I'm taking
an extra couple hours and putting wire number labels on each end of
each wire. Plus writing down the apparent function while rewiring to
include fuses. (the tractor had one fuse stock)

Anyway, the wire labels are semi exposed. Most of them will be gone in
5 or more years when I got trouble again. Anybody heard of a clear coat
that would seal these and hold them on? Other ideas?

Karl

Clear heatshrink tubing. *Not perfectly clear, but the numbers show
through and it keeps the labels from getting peeled off.

Tove

Hey! *I was going to suggest that!

It works well. *Just be sure to use indelible ink underneath.

--http://www.wescottdesign.com

Even better- write on clear (or white) heat shrink, shrink on, cover
with clear heat shrink.


Dave

On 2009-03-24, Lloyd E. Sponenburgh lloydspinsidemindspring.com wrote:

Tags or wire markers are the way to go.

Agreed.

Brady markers with clear heat-shrink over them are probably the
most durable and easy-to-come- by solution for the shade-tree
guy. You can get Brady labels at any decent electrical supply
house, and most home centers. They aren't cheap, but keep the
extras in a temperate environment, and they'll last for years.


Also see McMaster-Carr page 1934.

--
Due to extreme spam originating from Google Groups, and their inattention
to spammers, I and many others block all articles originating
from Google Groups. If you want your postings to be seen by
more readers you will need to find a different means of
posting on Usenet.
http://improve-usenet.org/

Unless you are doing a vintage restoration with "points off" for non
"vintage era" components, I'd suggest just using different color wires
and extensive use of split wire loom (sold in various diameters in
auto parts stores), You could also use color coded crimp terminals
or short sections of colored heatshrink tubing. Use lots of wire ties
(Ty-Wraps), or if a restoration, you can use black waxed cloth
lacing. I also make use of screw terminal blocks (often called
barrier strips). Make a good wiring diagram with the connectors on
the terminal blocks numbered.

I solder all crimp terminals after crimping and then cover the crimped
part with short sections of heatshrink tubing - but then I am wiring
motor cycles and race cars where heat, moisture and vibration are
major enemies and failures are not considered a good thing. Joel in
Florida
===================

On Mar 24, 1:52*pm, "Karl Townsend"
wrote:
I'm rewiring my tractor. See thread below. While I'm here, I'm taking an
extra couple hours and putting wire number labels on each end of each wire.
Plus writing down the apparent function while rewiring to include fuses.
(the tractor had one fuse stock)

Anyway, the wire labels are semi exposed. Most of them will be gone in 5 or
more years when I got trouble again. Anybody heard of a clear coat that
would seal these and hold them on? Other ideas?

Karl

Karl Townsend wrote:

I'm rewiring my tractor. See thread below. While I'm here, I'm taking an
extra couple hours and putting wire number labels on each end of each wire.
Plus writing down the apparent function while rewiring to include fuses.
(the tractor had one fuse stock)

Anyway, the wire labels are semi exposed. Most of them will be gone in 5 or
more years when I got trouble again. Anybody heard of a clear coat that
would seal these and hold them on? Other ideas?

Karl

Laser printed paper labels under clear heat shrink tubing seem to hold
up well. P-Touch labels under the same heat shrink tubing would also
work.

On 2009-03-24, Karl Townsend wrote:
I'm rewiring my tractor. See thread below. While I'm here, I'm taking an
extra couple hours and putting wire number labels on each end of each wire.
Plus writing down the apparent function while rewiring to include fuses.
(the tractor had one fuse stock)

A good idea.

Anyway, the wire labels are semi exposed. Most of them will be gone in 5 or
more years when I got trouble again. Anybody heard of a clear coat that
would seal these and hold them on? Other ideas?

Clear heat-shrink tubing over the labels. Run it at least a
half inch beyond each end of the label.

Of course -- if you had the right tools :-) you could do it the
way that a previous employer did when building flight simulators for the
military. (I have no doubt that other manufacturers used the same
practice when building the actual aircraft for the military. :-)

Each wire in the cable is run through a machine which measures
off the desired length (longer than needed so there is slack at both
ends when the cable is laced up). Aside from color codes, each wire in
heat stamped with a number every few inches, so if you dig the wire out
in the middle of the harness bundle, you can identify it and look up
where each end connects. (They also used computers to sort and print
out wire lists to identify everything.)

To do this, you need the heat stamp machine, sets of hot stamp
numbers, two or three different colors of hot stamp ribbon so you can
select a contrasting color for each wire. Black numbers on white wire
and gray wire. White numbers on black wire and on red wire. Experiment
to find the best contrast on other wire colors.

Good Luck,
DoN.

--
Email: | Voice (all times): (703) 938-4564
(too) near Washington D.C. | http://www.d-and-d.com/dnichols/DoN.html
--- Black Holes are where God is dividing by zero ---

On 2009-03-25, wrote:
Unless you are doing a vintage restoration with "points off" for non
"vintage era" components, I'd suggest just using different color wires
and extensive use of split wire loom (sold in various diameters in
auto parts stores), You could also use color coded crimp terminals

No! The colors on pre-insulated crimp terminals are to tell you
the proper range of wire sizes for which that crimp terminal is correct,
and which crimper to use with the terminals. (Yes, each size terminal
must be crimped with the proper crimper for proper performance.)

The colors for sizes which are likely to be found in a tractor
or automobile a

Red 22-18 Ga
Blue 16-14 Ga
Yellow 12-10 Ga
Red 8 Ga
Blue 6 Ga
Yellow 4 Ga
Red 2 Ga

The sequence continues beyond both ends of what I have written there,
but I doubt that you will be using anything smaller than 22 Ga in a
vehicle, nor will you be using anything larger than 2 Ga (if anywhere
near that large).

or short sections of colored heatshrink tubing. Use lots of wire ties
(Ty-Wraps), or if a restoration, you can use black waxed cloth
lacing. I also make use of screw terminal blocks (often called
barrier strips). Make a good wiring diagram with the connectors on
the terminal blocks numbered.

Yes.

I solder all crimp terminals after crimping and then cover the crimped
part with short sections of heatshrink tubing - but then I am wiring
motor cycles and race cars where heat, moisture and vibration are
major enemies and failures are not considered a good thing. Joel in

Again -- *no*. A proper crimped terminal (e.g. the AMP P.I.D.G.
series) with the right size terminal crimped onto the right size wire is
more reliable in the face of vibration than any which has been soldered
after the crimping. The "P.I.D.G." stands for "Pre Insulated Diamond
Grip", and the crimper, as well as crimping firmly an oxygen-tight
connection to the wire, will also form a strain relief over the wire's
insulation (the "Diamond Grip" part).

Flow solder into it and it will wick up to the insulation,
leaving a rigid length of wire which stops just where the insulation
starts, so the vibration flexes it all at that one point, and failure is
more likely there than at any other point.

Even solder terminal connectors should be soldered with
anti-wicking tweezers to prevent this for any system where vibration is
a problem.

The heat can cause the crimped terminal insulation to deform,
but there is a copper lining to the terminal's insulation which still
keeps its shape and grips the insulation of the wire.

BTW -- the proper crimpers leave a mark to allow inspection to
verify that the terminals were crimped with the proper size dies. For
the smaller size they are alternating single or double dots in the
middle of the crimp. For the larger sizes (8 Ga and larger) the size
itself is formed in the insulation making it even easier.

IIRC -- the pattern is:

Red (22-18 Ga) 0ne dot
Blue (16-14 Ga) Two dots
Yellow (12-10 Ga) One dot

and so on.

The proper crimpers also assure a complete cycle of the crimp
tool via a ratchet for the sizes up to Yellow (12-10 Ga). Beyond that,
the crimpers are hydraulicly powered -- at least up to the 4-0 (again
blue) which is as far as my personal collection of crimpers goes. The
bottom end is a rare small yellow which is 28-24 Ga IIRC.

Good Luck,
DoN.

--
Email: | Voice (all times): (703) 938-4564
(too) near Washington D.C. | http://www.d-and-d.com/dnichols/DoN.html
--- Black Holes are where God is dividing by zero ---

On 25 Mar 2009 04:28:08 GMT, "DoN. Nichols"
wrote:

On 2009-03-24, Karl Townsend wrote:
I'm rewiring my tractor. See thread below. While I'm here, I'm taking an
extra couple hours and putting wire number labels on each end of each wire.
Plus writing down the apparent function while rewiring to include fuses.
(the tractor had one fuse stock)

A good idea.

Anyway, the wire labels are semi exposed. Most of them will be gone in 5 or
more years when I got trouble again. Anybody heard of a clear coat that
would seal these and hold them on? Other ideas?

Clear heat-shrink tubing over the labels. Run it at least a
half inch beyond each end of the label.

Of course -- if you had the right tools :-) you could do it the
way that a previous employer did when building flight simulators for the
military. (I have no doubt that other manufacturers used the same
practice when building the actual aircraft for the military. :-)

Each wire in the cable is run through a machine which measures
off the desired length (longer than needed so there is slack at both
ends when the cable is laced up). Aside from color codes, each wire in
heat stamped with a number every few inches, so if you dig the wire out
in the middle of the harness bundle, you can identify it and look up
where each end connects. (They also used computers to sort and print
out wire lists to identify everything.)

To do this, you need the heat stamp machine, sets of hot stamp
numbers, two or three different colors of hot stamp ribbon so you can
select a contrasting color for each wire. Black numbers on white wire
and gray wire. White numbers on black wire and on red wire. Experiment
to find the best contrast on other wire colors.

Good Luck,
DoN.

Before I retired, I had a Brady TLS2200 and used the direct print heat
shrink sleeves. They are available in various materials. I'd make
..csv files from wire lists, and send to the printer. The sleeves are
damned expensive, though.

Pete Keillor

"Karl Townsend" wrote:

Anyway, the wire labels are semi exposed. Most of them will be gone in 5 or
more years when I got trouble again. Anybody heard of a clear coat that
would seal these and hold them on? Other ideas?


I've used these
http://solutions.3m.com/wps/portal/3...M Z5PPX0P53gl

along with a layer of clear heat shrink tubing in the past.

Wes

Listen to DoN when it comes to crimpers. He knows everything about
them and then some. Based on his advice, I bought a bunch of great and
useful crimpers and even resold some ebay -- ebay. DoN is the God of
crimper advice.

Definitely do not solder a proper crimp in a vibration
environment. This is known to cause fatigue failure of wire.

i


On 2009-03-25, DoN. Nichols wrote:
On 2009-03-25, wrote:
Unless you are doing a vintage restoration with "points off" for non
"vintage era" components, I'd suggest just using different color wires
and extensive use of split wire loom (sold in various diameters in
auto parts stores), You could also use color coded crimp terminals

No! The colors on pre-insulated crimp terminals are to tell you
the proper range of wire sizes for which that crimp terminal is correct,
and which crimper to use with the terminals. (Yes, each size terminal
must be crimped with the proper crimper for proper performance.)

The colors for sizes which are likely to be found in a tractor
or automobile a

Red 22-18 Ga
Blue 16-14 Ga
Yellow 12-10 Ga
Red 8 Ga
Blue 6 Ga
Yellow 4 Ga
Red 2 Ga

The sequence continues beyond both ends of what I have written there,
but I doubt that you will be using anything smaller than 22 Ga in a
vehicle, nor will you be using anything larger than 2 Ga (if anywhere
near that large).

or short sections of colored heatshrink tubing. Use lots of wire ties
(Ty-Wraps), or if a restoration, you can use black waxed cloth
lacing. I also make use of screw terminal blocks (often called
barrier strips). Make a good wiring diagram with the connectors on
the terminal blocks numbered.

Yes.

I solder all crimp terminals after crimping and then cover the crimped
part with short sections of heatshrink tubing - but then I am wiring
motor cycles and race cars where heat, moisture and vibration are
major enemies and failures are not considered a good thing. Joel in

Again -- *no*. A proper crimped terminal (e.g. the AMP P.I.D.G.
series) with the right size terminal crimped onto the right size wire is
more reliable in the face of vibration than any which has been soldered
after the crimping. The "P.I.D.G." stands for "Pre Insulated Diamond
Grip", and the crimper, as well as crimping firmly an oxygen-tight
connection to the wire, will also form a strain relief over the wire's
insulation (the "Diamond Grip" part).

Flow solder into it and it will wick up to the insulation,
leaving a rigid length of wire which stops just where the insulation
starts, so the vibration flexes it all at that one point, and failure is
more likely there than at any other point.

Even solder terminal connectors should be soldered with
anti-wicking tweezers to prevent this for any system where vibration is
a problem.

The heat can cause the crimped terminal insulation to deform,
but there is a copper lining to the terminal's insulation which still
keeps its shape and grips the insulation of the wire.

BTW -- the proper crimpers leave a mark to allow inspection to
verify that the terminals were crimped with the proper size dies. For
the smaller size they are alternating single or double dots in the
middle of the crimp. For the larger sizes (8 Ga and larger) the size
itself is formed in the insulation making it even easier.

IIRC -- the pattern is:

Red (22-18 Ga) 0ne dot
Blue (16-14 Ga) Two dots
Yellow (12-10 Ga) One dot

and so on.

The proper crimpers also assure a complete cycle of the crimp
tool via a ratchet for the sizes up to Yellow (12-10 Ga). Beyond that,
the crimpers are hydraulicly powered -- at least up to the 4-0 (again
blue) which is as far as my personal collection of crimpers goes. The
bottom end is a rare small yellow which is 28-24 Ga IIRC.

Good Luck,
DoN.


--
Due to extreme spam originating from Google Groups, and their inattention
to spammers, I and many others block all articles originating
from Google Groups. If you want your postings to be seen by
more readers you will need to find a different means of
posting on Usenet.
http://improve-usenet.org/

On Tue, 24 Mar 2009 12:52:57 -0500, the infamous "Karl Townsend"
scrawled the following:

I'm rewiring my tractor. See thread below. While I'm here, I'm taking an
extra couple hours and putting wire number labels on each end of each wire.
Plus writing down the apparent function while rewiring to include fuses.
(the tractor had one fuse stock)

Anyway, the wire labels are semi exposed. Most of them will be gone in 5 or
more years when I got trouble again. Anybody heard of a clear coat that
would seal these and hold them on?

Nope. There isn't one. The best you can do are the preprinted number
label strips made for that purpose, Karl.


Other ideas?

1) Use color-coded wire.

2) Draw up a wiring diagram/schematic.

3) Keep a list of what each wire's endpoints are. They're often easier
than tracing a wiring diagram. (I see that you're already doing this.
Good call.)

--
Don't take life so seriously. You'll never get out of it alive.
--Elbert Hubbard

"DoN. Nichols" wrote in message
...
On 2009-03-24, Karl Townsend wrote:
I'm rewiring my tractor. See thread below. While I'm here, I'm taking an
extra couple hours and putting wire number labels on each end of each
wire.
Plus writing down the apparent function while rewiring to include fuses.
(the tractor had one fuse stock)

A good idea.

Anyway, the wire labels are semi exposed. Most of them will be gone in 5
or
more years when I got trouble again. Anybody heard of a clear coat that
would seal these and hold them on? Other ideas?

Clear heat-shrink tubing over the labels. Run it at least a
half inch beyond each end of the label.

Of course -- if you had the right tools :-) you could do it the
way that a previous employer did when building flight simulators for the
military. (I have no doubt that other manufacturers used the same
practice when building the actual aircraft for the military. :-)

Each wire in the cable is run through a machine which measures
off the desired length (longer than needed so there is slack at both
ends when the cable is laced up). Aside from color codes, each wire in
heat stamped with a number every few inches, so if you dig the wire out
in the middle of the harness bundle, you can identify it and look up
where each end connects. (They also used computers to sort and print
out wire lists to identify everything.)

To do this, you need the heat stamp machine, sets of hot stamp
numbers, two or three different colors of hot stamp ribbon so you can
select a contrasting color for each wire. Black numbers on white wire
and gray wire. White numbers on black wire and on red wire. Experiment
to find the best contrast on other wire colors.

Good Luck,
DoN.

--
Email: | Voice (all times): (703) 938-4564
(too) near Washington D.C. | http://www.d-and-d.com/dnichols/DoN.html
--- Black Holes are where God is dividing by zero ---

We don't use heat stamping on aircraft wires any more; the insulation is so
thin on most wires nowadays that the marking will degrade its ability to
insulate. Most everyone has bought laser markers, or has gone to sleeves
for small jobs. There's an SAE paper out about the problem, but my web
connection is on the fritz and I can't find the number. Some nice Kingsley
machines can be bought for cheap now, if you look around.

Best regards,
Dale

tie knots.

Hul

Karl Townsend wrote:
I'm rewiring my tractor. See thread below. While I'm here, I'm taking an
extra couple hours and putting wire number labels on each end of each wire.
Plus writing down the apparent function while rewiring to include fuses.
(the tractor had one fuse stock)

Anyway, the wire labels are semi exposed. Most of them will be gone in 5 or
more years when I got trouble again. Anybody heard of a clear coat that
would seal these and hold them on? Other ideas?

Karl

On Tue, 24 Mar 2009 12:52:57 -0500, "Karl Townsend"
wrote:

I'm rewiring my tractor. See thread below. While I'm here, I'm taking an
extra couple hours and putting wire number labels on each end of each wire.
Plus writing down the apparent function while rewiring to include fuses.
(the tractor had one fuse stock)

Anyway, the wire labels are semi exposed. Most of them will be gone in 5 or
more years when I got trouble again. Anybody heard of a clear coat that
would seal these and hold them on? Other ideas?

Karl



Are you using proper numbered+coloured ferrules over the wires for the
labeling? If so, they won't need protection. If not, get some :-) Forget
anything that involves writing or printing on labels, it isn't worth the
effort.

Mark Rand
RTFM

In article ,
Tim Wescott wrote:

On Tue, 24 Mar 2009 14:18:29 -0400, Tove Momerathsson wrote:

Karl Townsend wrote:
I'm rewiring my tractor. See thread below. While I'm here, I'm taking
an extra couple hours and putting wire number labels on each end of
each wire. Plus writing down the apparent function while rewiring to
include fuses. (the tractor had one fuse stock)

Anyway, the wire labels are semi exposed. Most of them will be gone in
5 or more years when I got trouble again. Anybody heard of a clear coat
that would seal these and hold them on? Other ideas?

Karl

Clear heatshrink tubing. Not perfectly clear, but the numbers show
through and it keeps the labels from getting peeled off.

Tove

Hey! I was going to suggest that!

It works well. Just be sure to use indelible ink underneath.

Indelible as in UV-proof, or sunlight will fade the ink. Only
pigment-based inks will survive a few years of sunlight. Dye based inks
might manage to last a year.

Pigments are very finely ground minerals, while dyes are organic
chemicals. Paint uses pigments, while many inks use only dyes.

India ink works, as does pencil. The pigment is carbon black. Some
kinds of india ink are designed for plastic surfaces.

http://www.artstuff.net/kohinoor_drawing_ink.htm

Sakura Color in Japan may make markers with suitable inks. I haven't
tried them yet, but the writeups on some of their products sound
promising. These are widely distributed in art stores in the US.

http://www.sakuraofamerica.com/Proje...ue-opaque-mark
er-fine-point

Sharpies (Sanford) fade quickly, even though these are very good markers.

Joe Gwinn