Electrical is a big weak point for me... I think I can do what I want
with this, but maybe somebody can take a look and see...

http://www.ejearchive.com/temp/motor.jpg

I can just hook the red and black up to a grounded power cord on that
and be done, right? The green does go to the chassis for ground. I
don't need to have a power switch or anything. This is to power my
parts tumbler project.

While I'm at it... I need to push a 5/8" rubber hose onto a 5/8" shaft
for about 3 feet and have the rubber not spin once it's on there...
But after about 6", it gets pretty hard to push onto the shaft.
Anybody got any tricks? I was thinking maybe put soapy water on there
and then when the water dries out it might be tight enough.

Thanks for any help,

Dave

On Wed, 26 Sep 2007 17:47:15 -0700, wrote:

Electrical is a big weak point for me... I think I can do what I want
with this, but maybe somebody can take a look and see...

http://www.ejearchive.com/temp/motor.jpg

I can just hook the red and black up to a grounded power cord on that
and be done, right? The green does go to the chassis for ground. I
don't need to have a power switch or anything. This is to power my
parts tumbler project.

Wild assed guess, but I suspect that you need the capacitor specified
on the label, connected between the red and black wire.

While I'm at it... I need to push a 5/8" rubber hose onto a 5/8" shaft
for about 3 feet and have the rubber not spin once it's on there...
But after about 6", it gets pretty hard to push onto the shaft.
Anybody got any tricks? I was thinking maybe put soapy water on there
and then when the water dries out it might be tight enough.

Connect the open end of the hose to a source of compressed air which,
when you insert the shaft into the hose, will cause the hose to
enlarge slightly allowing you to slide it in with moderate effort.
When you turn off the air, the hose resumes its original size.
Gerry :-)}
London, Canada

According to :
Electrical is a big weak point for me... I think I can do what I want
with this, but maybe somebody can take a look and see...

http://www.ejearchive.com/temp/motor.jpg

I can just hook the red and black up to a grounded power cord on that
and be done, right?

The capacitor is apparently external to the motor, and needs to
go between the black and red wires. I don't know whether you can
re-wire it to rotate the other direction -- there aren't enough wires.

And the capacitor must be a motor-starting capacitor (pick it up
from a motor shop to get the right kind of cap).

The green does go to the chassis for ground.

The green from the power cord goes to the green/yellow from the
motor. That is internally connected to the motor's chassis.

I
don't need to have a power switch or anything. This is to power my
parts tumbler project.

Better to have a switch in the cord than to switch it by
plugging and unplugging it. The latter would result in a lot of arc
damage to the plug and the wall socket over time.

While I'm at it... I need to push a 5/8" rubber hose onto a 5/8" shaft
for about 3 feet and have the rubber not spin once it's on there...
But after about 6", it gets pretty hard to push onto the shaft.
Anybody got any tricks? I was thinking maybe put soapy water on there
and then when the water dries out it might be tight enough.

Try K-Y jelly. I use it for pushing rubber handles onto feed
levers and such (among other uses. :-)

It will dry out soon enough.

Enjoy,
DoN.

--
Email: | Voice (all times): (703) 938-4564
(too) near Washington D.C. | http://www.d-and-d.com/dnichols/DoN.html
--- Black Holes are where God is dividing by zero ---

wrote:
Electrical is a big weak point for me... I think I can do what I want
with this, but maybe somebody can take a look and see...

http://www.ejearchive.com/temp/motor.jpg

I can just hook the red and black up to a grounded power cord on that
and be done, right? The green does go to the chassis for ground. I
don't need to have a power switch or anything. This is to power my
parts tumbler project.

While I'm at it... I need to push a 5/8" rubber hose onto a 5/8" shaft
for about 3 feet and have the rubber not spin once it's on there...
But after about 6", it gets pretty hard to push onto the shaft.
Anybody got any tricks? I was thinking maybe put soapy water on there
and then when the water dries out it might be tight enough.

Thanks for any help,

Dave

It looks to me that your Active and Neutral on you power lead connect to
red and white on the motor. The cap ( symbol -I(- )is connected between
black and red. Green is Earth.
You'll need a cap as close to 150 uF as you can get. Any voltage over
and including 150V will be ok.
I also think you should use a power switch and make sure you switch the
Active and not the Neutral side. If you switch Neutral and it is plugged
in, the motor will always be 'live'. It won't be running, but it will
have power going to it all the time!
Above all...be careful!

OK, I had a feeling I would need a capacitor... I'll figure it out.

Good tips on the hose shaft, thanks.

I also just noticed that the motor doesn't have a notch or keyway on
the shaft. I think it might have been used with a coupler to direct
drive. Can I just notch the shaft for a pulley? This is why I hate
buying used stuff... You always have to adapt and it costs as much as
something new in the end.

Dave

Hair spray is a good lubricant for sliding on the tubing. When it dries it
becomes like an adhesive.

Another suggestion would be to cut the rubber tubing into about 6" lengths,
which you push on one at a time, butting them end-to-end. If this is the
drive system for a tumbler, it shouldn't matter that there are seams. Short
lengths can be pushed easily, but don't try pulling--that makes the diameter
smaller and the tubing grips like a Chinese finger trap.

Frayed knot there, Dave. This motor is a PSC type (permanent split
capacitor), and it may be a good idea to try to find the specifications for
this motor (by the numbers on the labels), before expecting very much from
it. A GE dealer may be able to get you a spec sheet if you can't find it
online.
One reason for getting the manufacturer's specifications is because the
motor may have a limited duty cycle.. many PSC motors do, although the CL-A
INS CONT. may mean Class A INSulation, CONT (duty) with AIR moving OVER the
motor.

The other reason is because the 158 MFD seems unusually large for a small
motor.

The capacitor should be a Run capacitor (not a start cap), and 150
microfarad (uF) is a fairly large value for a Run cap. Motor capacitors are
AC-types only (generally not available at places like that Shack store), and
are aluminum canisters with large terminals on them.
The 158.0 MFD looks odd to me, because run caps for motors this size are
usually less than 50 microfarad.

***Important part***
If you're unsure of any of the connections, you'll need to get some help
from someone that is experienced and qualified to work with motor wiring.

The diagram descriptor "LINE" means the 2 AC power cord leads.
When one AC power lead is connected to the red, and one to the white, the
motor will run in the direction indicated by the arrow ROT.

If the AC power lead is changed from the red to the black (leaving the other
AC power lead connected to the white, as it was), then the motor will run in
the opposite direction.

Any AC line source needs a switch to disconnect the power, and including a
fuse is always a sensible decision.

The capacitor is permanently wired between the black and red motor leads.
One AC power lead will connect to the Red motor lead as the diagram shows.

The White motor lead is the other AC power lead.

The Brown motor lead needs to be insulated and kept separate (no
connection).

The standard wiring connections would be a 3-wire AC power cord (with
ground/green lead).
The Green lead is solidly connected to the motor housing for the earth
safety ground connection.
It's always an excellent idea to attach the green/ground lead first (for
almost any kind of electrical work).
If you sometimes don't attach it first, you'll probably find out why it's
the best approach, eventually. Operating electric motors without a
safety/earth ground lead securely connected to the motor case will
potentially create a shock hazard, which under certain circumstances can be
lethal.

The White AC power cord lead would be attached to the White motor lead, and
the connection is well-insulated.

The capacitor is installed between the Red and Black motor leads.

If you want the motor to run in the direction of the label arrow, the Black
AC power cord lead will attach to a suitable switch, then the fuse, and then
the Red motor lead (at the same point where it attaches to one capacitor
terminal).
Then this junction is well-insulated.

The capacitor connection to the Black motor lead is also well-insulated.

Any other bare metal parts of any of the connections are also
well-insulated.

When the motor is mounted where it is wanted, you'll need to locate a place
to securely mount the capacitor and the well-insulated fuse (or fuse
holder).

If at some time in the future, if you want to reverse the rotation of the
motor, this can be accomplished by:
(a) removing the connection where the Black AC power cord (switched-fused)
lead attaches to the Red motor lead and the one capacitor terminal, and

(b) connect that Black AC power cord lead to the Black motor lead (where it
connects to the other terminal of the capacitor).

Then the bare junctions are well-insulated before ever plugging in the AC
power cord.

WB
..........
metalworking projects
www.kwagmire.com/metal_proj.html


wrote in message
oups.com...
Electrical is a big weak point for me... I think I can do what I want
with this, but maybe somebody can take a look and see...

http://www.ejearchive.com/temp/motor.jpg

I can just hook the red and black up to a grounded power cord on that
and be done, right? The green does go to the chassis for ground. I
don't need to have a power switch or anything. This is to power my
parts tumbler project.

While I'm at it... I need to push a 5/8" rubber hose onto a 5/8" shaft
for about 3 feet and have the rubber not spin once it's on there...
But after about 6", it gets pretty hard to push onto the shaft.
Anybody got any tricks? I was thinking maybe put soapy water on there
and then when the water dries out it might be tight enough.

Thanks for any help,

Dave



--
Posted via a free Usenet account from http://www.teranews.com

Thanks for all the help... Sounds like maybe this one is going to go
back. I think it was originally a fan motor, and it may in fact need
that fan to move air over it.

Let me ask this... What would be a good motor to run what is basically
a rock tumbler that's going to have a vessel to hold about 15-18
pounds of stuff? I noticed a professional one was using a motor that
was 1725 RPM and only 1/30 HP I think. I don't want to blow $200 on a
motor because this just isn't worth it. The device will probably run
about max 3 hours at a time. I was also thinking about getting a cheap
drill press and using the motor out of that... Those already come with
all the wiring and capacitor, but I was worried about the duty cycle.

And I was thinking that you were just gonna try out a small tumbler to try
out the process.
One thing that's in the 15-18 pound load range is a washing machine,
although there are a lot of other things going on in a washing machine,
where a 1/30 HP motor definitely wouldn't be adequate.

I generally have some fractional HP motors around for various projects, and
I'd consider a 1/4 HP motor to be fairly reasonable size and a reliable
power source.
I'm no engineer and the TLAR will usually suffice for me (that looks about
right).

I find used fractional HP motors at flea markets and garage sales for about
$5, and I'll feel kinda fortunate to find a Dayton or other similar-quality
motor, rather than some motor that was saved from a worn out appliance, as
those often have strange mountings, fully ventilated cases where lots of
debris can get in, and they sometimes need a capacitor too.

A smaller motor is probably adequate, particularly if a belt is used to slow
down the tumbler. I haven't built a tumbler, so I don't know what speed
you're looking for.
My guess would be about 60 RPM, and slow speeds like that indicate a
gearmotor or gearhead motor with a speed reduction gearbox attached.
Gearmotors generally have lots of power for their size, and the output shaft
speed is a fraction of the motor's speed, depending upon the gear ratio.. 20
to 1, 60 to 1 etc.

I don't know where you've looked, but one good source that numerous RCM
participants rely on is Surplus Center
http://www.surpluscenter.com/

If you're wanting to get started right away, an electric drill with variable
speed might get you started, to determine the approximate speed will work
well for what you want to accomplish.
The cheap drill press would probably provide numerous advantages. You'll be
able to change speeds (somewhat limited) and lots of extra parts, some that
might be valuable in completing the tumbler project. The drill press might
also provide a more versatile power source, if you want to try different
sized drums.
I've seen the small units for about $50 locally, and considered buying one
just to have it for improvising a project quickly.
The motor's may be of somewhat questionable quality, but would probably be
OK as long as they have good ventilation.

For any previously unproven power application, it would probably be wise to
operate a system undergoing testing nly while you're present, and not leave
an unproven setup operate unattended.

WB
..........
metalworking projects
www.kwagmire.com/metal_proj.html


wrote in message
oups.com...
Thanks for all the help... Sounds like maybe this one is going to go
back. I think it was originally a fan motor, and it may in fact need
that fan to move air over it.

Let me ask this... What would be a good motor to run what is basically
a rock tumbler that's going to have a vessel to hold about 15-18
pounds of stuff? I noticed a professional one was using a motor that
was 1725 RPM and only 1/30 HP I think. I don't want to blow $200 on a
motor because this just isn't worth it. The device will probably run
about max 3 hours at a time. I was also thinking about getting a cheap
drill press and using the motor out of that... Those already come with
all the wiring and capacitor, but I was worried about the duty cycle.



--
Posted via a free Usenet account from http://www.teranews.com

Thanks Bill, I didn't know about that site. I think HF still has the
small press on sale for $40. I think I'll try that... It's got all the
wiring and everything already and I could probably find a use for the
left over parts. I might be able to squeeze a fan between the small
pulley and the motor to help cool.

I'm basically building a long version of this to tumble long parts:
http://www.thumlerstumbler.com/images/rotary_b.jpg

That one handles 15 pounds and in a close-up I saw that the motor
looked to be 1725 at 1/30 HP. Which seemed kind of small to me, but it
must work. My vessel will probably hold about 15-18 pounds. I
calculated the the ratio for mine to be a 1 1/2" drive pulley with 7"
driven pulley, for about a 70 rpm on the vessel. Assuming the motor is
1725.

And thanks for the other people's suggestions on the shaft thing.

Dave

On Wed, 26 Sep 2007 22:15:53 -0700, wrote:

OK, I had a feeling I would need a capacitor... I'll figure it out.

Good tips on the hose shaft, thanks.

I also just noticed that the motor doesn't have a notch or keyway on
the shaft. I think it might have been used with a coupler to direct
drive. Can I just notch the shaft for a pulley? This is why I hate
buying used stuff... You always have to adapt and it costs as much as
something new in the end.

Dave
I prefer to drill a dimple for a set screw, then install two short set
screws one behind the other - same effect as a jam nut.
Gerry :-)}
London, Canada

According to :

[ ... ]

I also just noticed that the motor doesn't have a notch or keyway on
the shaft.

If you're sliding rubber tubing onto it -- why would you *need*
the keyway? You are better off without, I would think.

I think it might have been used with a coupler to direct
drive. Can I just notch the shaft for a pulley?

Sure -- you'll want a conventional milling cutter (looks like a
thick saw blade about 4" in diameter), and the arbor to drive it in your
mill. Get one the same thickness as the desired width of the keyway,
and cut the depth half of the width of the keyway for most keys. You
*can* use a tiny two-flute end mill, but those are easy to break if you
feed too fast. For the 4" mill, crank down to as slow as your mill will
run -- unless you have a horizontal mill which will run even slower for
six, eight, or ten inch diameter cutters. :-)

This is why I hate
buying used stuff... You always have to adapt and it costs as much as
something new in the end.

That's why (or at least, we) you have a shop full of tools -- so
you/we *can* adapt the free stuff. :-)

Enjoy,
DoN.
--
Email: | Voice (all times): (703) 938-4564
(too) near Washington D.C. | http://www.d-and-d.com/dnichols/DoN.html
--- Black Holes are where God is dividing by zero ---

I had a quick look at the picture of the commecial model, and I see how they
utilize such a small motor.
The first speed reduction is the small motor pulley (1/2"?) to the black
pulley (4"?), and the black pulley that is part of the powered roller
(1/2?), then the roller drives the drum (about 10"?).

These 2 levels of speed reduction will effectively increase the power of the
motor while greatly reducing the speed of the drum.
I didn't look up the capacity of the commercial unit's drum.

The commercial machine design also permits the use of a smaller motor. If
your machine design is using an equivalent system of speed reduction, the GE
PSC motor that you have may be adequate for rotating a larger drum at
approximately the same speed as the commercial unit (depending upon, if the
GE motor is rated for continuous duty).

So now I think I understand the question about sliding a long section of
tubing onto shafts.. for the drum rollers. Pulling the tubing will cause it
to grip more, but pushing the tubing may work if liquid soap is used
(without water), otherwise, you may have to shop around for different tubing
with a slightly larger ID.
If nothing can be found, cutting the tubing in a long spiral will go on the
shafts much more easily (although it may require glue/adhesive).

WB
..........
metalworking projects
www.kwagmire.com/metal_proj.html

wrote in message
oups.com...
Thanks Bill, I didn't know about that site. I think HF still has the
small press on sale for $40. I think I'll try that... It's got all the
wiring and everything already and I could probably find a use for the
left over parts. I might be able to squeeze a fan between the small
pulley and the motor to help cool.

I'm basically building a long version of this to tumble long parts:
http://www.thumlerstumbler.com/images/rotary_b.jpg

That one handles 15 pounds and in a close-up I saw that the motor
looked to be 1725 at 1/30 HP. Which seemed kind of small to me, but it
must work. My vessel will probably hold about 15-18 pounds. I
calculated the the ratio for mine to be a 1 1/2" drive pulley with 7"
driven pulley, for about a 70 rpm on the vessel. Assuming the motor is
1725.

And thanks for the other people's suggestions on the shaft thing.

Dave



--
Posted via a free Usenet account from http://www.teranews.com