I am making a set of fingers for my 24" DiAcro fingerbrake, out of
1.25" hotrolled steel plates, and decided to square the roughly
bandsawed blocks, on the shaper. Being hot rolled..there is a thick
scale skin and its rough on endmills and fly cutters. Plus the blocks
may have been flame cut from a larger plate at the mill..the edges
seem to have a faint flame cut edge..so there is a HAZ that needs to
be gotten through. Ive got face mills..but the big Gorton has no power
feed..and I hate face milling by hand on stuff thats gonna need a
heavy cut

Id tried a slab mill on my Clausing 8540..but for some reason..the
table is rocking and I cant see exactly where..sigh..another Roundtuit
to address....

With the vise..the 8" shaper is NOT capable of squaring a 6" block, so
I pulled the support rail out from under the table and lowered the
table down, using a thinner support rail to give me the smidge of room
I needed.

I set the stroke, travel etc..and let it run a couple cycles to check
out everything. All a-ok

So I set the feed per stroke on the dovetailed gizmo on the end of the
crank and let her run.

It was making a nice cut..and suddenly the link that goes between the
feed dog mechanism on the feed worm and the dovetailed gizmo bent
slightly and the rachet mechanism dropped below 2 Oclock..the link not
being long enough.Before I could shut it off..it busted out one side
of the dovetailed gizmo on the end of the crank. PLINK!!!

The part apparently is cast iron. So I have two options...drill and
tap, or drill and dowel pin and then braze, or make a new dovetailed
gizmo from scratch. I do have the proper sized dovetail cutter (and if
I were any good..Id use the shaper itself to cut the
dovetail....shrug)

What should I do? Try to pin and weld the old part, or make a new one?
Buying one from Logan..is financially out of the question for me at
this time.

Should I hunt around for a proper piece of cast iron, or should I use
nitrated silly putty for the new part? Im fresh out of unobtainium
and the last time I did lanthanated titanium..the lathe caught fire.

Second time in a year where I wished I had a bigger shaper..damnit

There is a pretty nice Gemco 16" I might be able to get...hydraulic I
think..but then..Id have to move the Rolls Royce out of the shop to
make room.

Sigh..what to do..what to do.....

G

Gunner, who is negotiating for a Albine miller



"A prudent man foresees the difficulties ahead and prepares for them;
the simpleton goes blindly on and suffers the consequences."
- Proverbs 22:3

"Gunner" wrote in message
...
Buying one from Logan..is financially out of the question for me at
this time.

Not sure who would have the cash to buy from the dealer, I know when I
called sheldon to get a price on a fibre gear (yes fibre not even steel)
they wanted $285 for one gear.

I vote for just making a new part out of whatever steel you have on hand.
Should be way stronger than cast. If the cast part broke because of pressure
of running, the patch will be weaker and it will just break again.

May be easier to just get another shaper. Its the one machine they give away
if you want a large one.

Karl

On Sun, 26 Mar 2006 13:26:13 GMT, "Karl Townsend"
remove .NOT wrote:

I vote for just making a new part out of whatever steel you have on hand.
Should be way stronger than cast. If the cast part broke because of pressure
of running, the patch will be weaker and it will just break again.

May be easier to just get another shaper. Its the one machine they give away
if you want a large one.

Karl

Hey!! I like the way you think!!

Hummm ..there has become a space issue though....

Gunner



"A prudent man foresees the difficulties ahead and prepares for them;
the simpleton goes blindly on and suffers the consequences."
- Proverbs 22:3

On Sun, 26 Mar 2006 07:24:03 GMT, Gunner
wrote:

I am making a set of fingers for my 24" DiAcro fingerbrake, out of
1.25" hotrolled steel plates, and decided to square the roughly
bandsawed blocks, on the shaper. Being hot rolled..there is a thick
scale skin and its rough on endmills and fly cutters. Plus the blocks
may have been flame cut from a larger plate at the mill..the edges
seem to have a faint flame cut edge..so there is a HAZ that needs to
be gotten through. Ive got face mills..but the big Gorton has no power
feed..and I hate face milling by hand on stuff thats gonna need a
heavy cut

Id tried a slab mill on my Clausing 8540..but for some reason..the
table is rocking and I cant see exactly where..sigh..another Roundtuit
to address....

With the vise..the 8" shaper is NOT capable of squaring a 6" block, so
I pulled the support rail out from under the table and lowered the
table down, using a thinner support rail to give me the smidge of room
I needed.

I set the stroke, travel etc..and let it run a couple cycles to check
out everything. All a-ok

So I set the feed per stroke on the dovetailed gizmo on the end of the
crank and let her run.

It was making a nice cut..and suddenly the link that goes between the
feed dog mechanism on the feed worm and the dovetailed gizmo bent
slightly and the rachet mechanism dropped below 2 Oclock..the link not
being long enough.Before I could shut it off..it busted out one side
of the dovetailed gizmo on the end of the crank. PLINK!!!

The part apparently is cast iron. So I have two options...drill and
tap, or drill and dowel pin and then braze, or make a new dovetailed
gizmo from scratch. I do have the proper sized dovetail cutter (and if
I were any good..Id use the shaper itself to cut the
dovetail....shrug)

What should I do? Try to pin and weld the old part, or make a new one?
Buying one from Logan..is financially out of the question for me at
this time.

Should I hunt around for a proper piece of cast iron, or should I use
nitrated silly putty for the new part? Im fresh out of unobtainium
and the last time I did lanthanated titanium..the lathe caught fire.

Second time in a year where I wished I had a bigger shaper..damnit

There is a pretty nice Gemco 16" I might be able to get...hydraulic I
think..but then..Id have to move the Rolls Royce out of the shop to
make room.

Sigh..what to do..what to do.....

G

Gunner, who is negotiating for a Albine miller



"A prudent man foresees the difficulties ahead and prepares for them;
the simpleton goes blindly on and suffers the consequences."
- Proverbs 22:3

Want to borrow mine? Doesn't look too hard to make except the tapered
pin hole and the inside radius. I'm not using mine anyhow and won't
sell it without fixing the ratchet end that is my problem.

Looks like you would need an extended arm to prevent that from
happening again with the table all the way down. I take it that you
sold that cool bigger shaper.

Maybe you could make me the pin, and holder for the ratchet housing
that my cluts friend lost for me. They are small parts that I don't
have a sample to copy. Don't let other people clean your shop for you
and not check the pile for parts that you don't know are missing.

I'd buy new hardened ones, but I don't think Scott has them. Would my
dove tail gizmo fit your machine without modifying?

On Sun, 26 Mar 2006 09:26:36 -0800, Sunworshipper
wrote:


Maybe you could make me the pin, and holder for the ratchet housing
that my cluts friend lost for me. They are small parts that I don't
have a sample to copy. Don't let other people clean your shop for you
and not check the pile for parts that you don't know are missing.

Thanks for the offer. Ill see about making you the parts for yours
when I finish making the stuff for mine.

I had a few pounds of hydroflorinated plasma putty and the hardner..so
Im machining the new assembly at the moment. Well..I finished the
gizmo last night..but the dovetail cutter I had was .05 wider than the
original..so now I need to make a new gizgut to go into the dovetail.
Fortunately..I do have a 45 degree cutter for the horizontal
miller..so it will only take a short time to whip one out.

But thanks

Gunner



"A prudent man foresees the difficulties ahead and prepares for them;
the simpleton goes blindly on and suffers the consequences."
- Proverbs 22:3

On Sun, 26 Mar 2006 07:24:03 GMT, Gunner wrote:

What should I do? Try to pin and weld the old part, or make a new one?

If the metallurgy isn't such that it needs to be cast, why not make it
out of something a few hundred years newer, technologically?

Buying one from Logan..is financially out of the question for me at
this time.

If anyone but you posted this, I'd refer them to you.

Sigh..what to do..what to do.....

Dust off & nuke 'em from orbit. It's the only way to be sure.

On Sun, 26 Mar 2006 07:24:03 GMT, Gunner wrote:

snip tale of woe

What should I do? Try to pin and weld the old part, or make a new one?
Buying one from Logan..is financially out of the question for me at
this time.


I assume that you've worked your way 'round the problem by now anyway, but ...
The first order of the day is to make the arm an inch or two longer so that
the problem doesn't happen again. The second part could well be pinning and
krazy gluing the broken bits together because they should only see a couple of
pounds of force normally. Thereafter I would be looking for a bit of
continuously cast iron bar to make an exact replacement from Just because _I_
like machining cast iron :-)


Mark Rand (part way through a weld repair of the feed gears for my 10" Royal
shaper for the last two years :- http://www.test-net.com/DSCN4816.JPG)

RTFM

On Tue, 28 Mar 2006 00:28:29 +0100, Mark Rand
wrote:

On Sun, 26 Mar 2006 07:24:03 GMT, Gunner wrote:

snip tale of woe

What should I do? Try to pin and weld the old part, or make a new one?
Buying one from Logan..is financially out of the question for me at
this time.


I assume that you've worked your way 'round the problem by now anyway, but ...
The first order of the day is to make the arm an inch or two longer so that
the problem doesn't happen again. The second part could well be pinning and
krazy gluing the broken bits together because they should only see a couple of
pounds of force normally. Thereafter I would be looking for a bit of
continuously cast iron bar to make an exact replacement from Just because _I_
like machining cast iron :-)


Mark Rand (part way through a weld repair of the feed gears for my 10" Royal
shaper for the last two years :- http://www.test-net.com/DSCN4816.JPG)

RTFM

I had a quart of hydroflorinated silly putty I kept tripping over..so
formed a big ball of it, let it cure and then hacked it into shape
with an axe. Works pretty good. And I made an extension for the arm
if I ever need to drop the table all the way down again.Tounge
Depressors..that makes a great extension......

http://www.metalworking.com/dropbox/shaperFix.jpg

Gunner



"A prudent man foresees the difficulties ahead and prepares for them;
the simpleton goes blindly on and suffers the consequences."
- Proverbs 22:3

On Tue, 28 Mar 2006 00:28:29 +0100, Mark Rand
wrote:

On Sun, 26 Mar 2006 07:24:03 GMT, Gunner wrote:

snip tale of woe

What should I do? Try to pin and weld the old part, or make a new one?
Buying one from Logan..is financially out of the question for me at
this time.


I assume that you've worked your way 'round the problem by now anyway, but ...
The first order of the day is to make the arm an inch or two longer so that
the problem doesn't happen again. The second part could well be pinning and
krazy gluing the broken bits together because they should only see a couple of
pounds of force normally. Thereafter I would be looking for a bit of
continuously cast iron bar to make an exact replacement from Just because _I_
like machining cast iron :-)


Mark Rand (part way through a weld repair of the feed gears for my 10" Royal
shaper for the last two years :- http://www.test-net.com/DSCN4816.JPG)

RTFM

I had a quart of hydroflorinated silly putty I kept tripping over..so
formed a big ball of it, let it cure and then hacked it into shape
with an axe. Works pretty good. And I made an extension for the arm
if I ever need to drop the table all the way down again.Tounge
Depressors..that makes a great extension......

http://www.metalworking.com/dropbox/shaperFix.jpg

Gunner



"A prudent man foresees the difficulties ahead and prepares for them;
the simpleton goes blindly on and suffers the consequences."
- Proverbs 22:3
It didn't make it gunner - did you forget the mandatory text file???
Ken.

Ken Sterling (Ken Sterling) wrote:
On Tue, 28 Mar 2006 00:28:29 +0100, Mark Rand
wrote:

On Sun, 26 Mar 2006 07:24:03 GMT, Gunner
wrote:

snip tale of woe

What should I do? Try to pin and weld the old part, or make a new
one? Buying one from Logan..is financially out of the question for
me at
this time.


I assume that you've worked your way 'round the problem by now
anyway, but ... The first order of the day is to make the arm an
inch or two longer so that the problem doesn't happen again. The
second part could well be pinning and krazy gluing the broken bits
together because they should only see a couple of pounds of force
normally. Thereafter I would be looking for a bit of continuously
cast iron bar to make an exact replacement from Just because _I_
like machining cast iron :-)


Mark Rand (part way through a weld repair of the feed gears for my
10" Royal shaper for the last two years :-
http://www.test-net.com/DSCN4816.JPG)

RTFM

I had a quart of hydroflorinated silly putty I kept tripping
over..so
formed a big ball of it, let it cure and then hacked it into shape
with an axe. Works pretty good. And I made an extension for the arm
if I ever need to drop the table all the way down again.Tounge
Depressors..that makes a great extension......

http://www.metalworking.com/dropbox/shaperFix.jpg

Gunner



"A prudent man foresees the difficulties ahead and prepares for them;
the simpleton goes blindly on and suffers the consequences."
- Proverbs 22:3
It didn't make it gunner - did you forget the mandatory text file???
Ken.

I got it OK.

Ken (the other one)

What is hydroflorinated silly putty? I've never
heard of it.

Tom

On Wed, 29 Mar 2006 18:29:13 +1100, "Tom Miller"
wrote:

What is hydroflorinated silly putty? I've never
heard of it.

Tom

Its used for hypergolic seals on fesko tanks.

Gunner



"A prudent man foresees the difficulties ahead and prepares for them;
the simpleton goes blindly on and suffers the consequences."
- Proverbs 22:3

Gunner wrote:

Thinking of getting an Albuine miller.

Gunner, you mean a Swiss Abene miller? I had an old one years ago with
40 taper spindle. Fancy Van Norman style rotating head machine with
ample hp for most average jobs.
Interesting thing about mine was that when the head was set at vertical
it wouldn't the arm wouldn't slide far enough forward enough to center
over or beyond the centerline of the knee. This impinged a bit on area
which could be surfaced if you follow my drift.
Otherwise a wonderful machine and the simplicity of the geneva gear
dial for changing table/knee feeds is a marvel.
Very unique design and one everyone who appreciates the unusual in
machine tool design should ponder.
Gemco shapers are hydraulic?
all the best!
Honest Al Babin
Bristol, Conn. USA

On 27 Mar 2006 19:23:42 -0800, "Honest A Babin"
wrote:


Gunner wrote:

Thinking of getting an Albuine miller.

Gunner, you mean a Swiss Abene miller? I had an old one years ago with
40 taper spindle. Fancy Van Norman style rotating head machine with
ample hp for most average jobs.
Interesting thing about mine was that when the head was set at vertical
it wouldn't the arm wouldn't slide far enough forward enough to center
over or beyond the centerline of the knee. This impinged a bit on area
which could be surfaced if you follow my drift.
Otherwise a wonderful machine and the simplicity of the geneva gear
dial for changing table/knee feeds is a marvel.
Very unique design and one everyone who appreciates the unusual in
machine tool design should ponder.
Gemco shapers are hydraulic?
all the best!
Honest Al Babin
Bristol, Conn. USA

Ayup..but I believe the Albene is Swedish..I could be wrong. I think
Wayne Cook also has one.

I have a customer that has a shop you can eat from the floor..and I
already asked about the minty minty minty Hardinge UM..and he says he
is taking it home for himself..the ******* G

They are spending some serious money loading up on CNC turning and
milling centers.upgrading and streamlining..and with luck..the Albene
will be "downsized"

Gunner



"A prudent man foresees the difficulties ahead and prepares for them;
the simpleton goes blindly on and suffers the consequences."
- Proverbs 22:3

On Tue, 28 Mar 2006 07:56:48 GMT, Gunner
wrote:



Ayup..but I believe the Albene is Swedish..I could be wrong. I think
Wayne Cook also has one.

Yep. BTW the header has it right. It's Abene and it is from Sweden.

I have a customer that has a shop you can eat from the floor..and I
already asked about the minty minty minty Hardinge UM..and he says he
is taking it home for himself..the ******* G

They are spending some serious money loading up on CNC turning and
milling centers.upgrading and streamlining..and with luck..the Albene
will be "downsized"


I think you'll like it if you get it.

What are you guys expecting, accurate information from Al Babin?
Of course the machine is Swedish!
Honest Al

On Tue, 28 Mar 2006 09:00:42 -0600, Wayne Cook
wrote:

On Tue, 28 Mar 2006 07:56:48 GMT, Gunner
wrote:



Ayup..but I believe the Albene is Swedish..I could be wrong. I think
Wayne Cook also has one.

Yep. BTW the header has it right. It's Abene and it is from Sweden.

I have a customer that has a shop you can eat from the floor..and I
already asked about the minty minty minty Hardinge UM..and he says he
is taking it home for himself..the ******* G

They are spending some serious money loading up on CNC turning and
milling centers.upgrading and streamlining..and with luck..the Albene
will be "downsized"


I think you'll like it if you get it.


Anything to watch out for?

The little Clausing 8540 I have is a nice horizontal miller..but..its
not stout enough for a lot of the work I do..making blue chips is
easy..but they are pretty small blue chips. Shrug..

Ive got a K&T #2 and a ..hummm Vernon (biggest one Ive seen) available
from one of my clients for $500 each...likely able to trade for one of
them...but the Abene is such an odd looking and exquisitly wierd
beasty that its tickled my fancy for a long time. and I think the
Abene has a slightly smaller foot print than the #2 and frankly...Im
running out of shop space.

Something I thought Id never do. Hell....10 yrs ago..my idea of
machinining something was chucking it in a drill motor, holding it
between my knees and hitting it with a file while it was turning.

Odd how things turn out huh? Odd how much a motivated scrounger can
aquire once he gets a new jones/hobby....

Gunner



"A prudent man foresees the difficulties ahead and prepares for them;
the simpleton goes blindly on and suffers the consequences."
- Proverbs 22:3

On Tue, 28 Mar 2006 17:33:37 GMT, Gunner
wrote:

On Tue, 28 Mar 2006 09:00:42 -0600, Wayne Cook
wrote:

On Tue, 28 Mar 2006 07:56:48 GMT, Gunner
wrote:



Ayup..but I believe the Albene is Swedish..I could be wrong. I think
Wayne Cook also has one.

Yep. BTW the header has it right. It's Abene and it is from Sweden.

I have a customer that has a shop you can eat from the floor..and I
already asked about the minty minty minty Hardinge UM..and he says he
is taking it home for himself..the ******* G

They are spending some serious money loading up on CNC turning and
milling centers.upgrading and streamlining..and with luck..the Albene
will be "downsized"


I think you'll like it if you get it.


Anything to watch out for?

Not really. It would be a good idea to make sure of the overarm and
arbor since they're a little strange. But you know how to work around
that.

The little Clausing 8540 I have is a nice horizontal miller..but..its
not stout enough for a lot of the work I do..making blue chips is
easy..but they are pretty small blue chips. Shrug..

I think you've seen the chips I've thrown with my Abene. It really
liked the 1 1/4" insert mill for hogging. It did not like the 1 1/2" 4
flute insert mill though (chatter).

Ive got a K&T #2 and a ..hummm Vernon (biggest one Ive seen) available
from one of my clients for $500 each...likely able to trade for one of
them...but the Abene is such an odd looking and exquisitly wierd
beasty that its tickled my fancy for a long time. and I think the
Abene has a slightly smaller foot print than the #2 and frankly...Im
running out of shop space.

Well I've not run a K&T #2 but I have run a #3 Cinci and it was just
to big and unwieldy for most of my work. I've not missed access to it
very many times since leaving my former employer. The Abene is just a
nice size. It's big enough to get some real work done but small enough
you don't have to kill yourself doing it. The versatility is just
icing on the cake.

Something I thought Id never do. Hell....10 yrs ago..my idea of
machinining something was chucking it in a drill motor, holding it
between my knees and hitting it with a file while it was turning.

Oh my kingdom for a warehouse. :-)

Odd how things turn out huh? Odd how much a motivated scrounger can
aquire once he gets a new jones/hobby....

Yep. It does seem to breed once you get more than one. :-)

On Sun, 26 Mar 2006 07:24:03 GMT, Gunner
wrote:


So I set the feed per stroke on the dovetailed gizmo on the end of the
crank and let her run.

It was making a nice cut..and suddenly the link that goes between the
feed dog mechanism on the feed worm and the dovetailed gizmo bent
slightly and the rachet mechanism dropped below 2 Oclock..the link not
being long enough.Before I could shut it off..it busted out one side
of the dovetailed gizmo on the end of the crank. PLINK!!!

The part apparently is cast iron. So I have two options...drill and
tap, or drill and dowel pin and then braze, or make a new dovetailed

Gunner
having now seen the photo I can suggest a good repair strategy.
keep the broken off part as a souvenir to palm around as you tell the
tale. :-)
on the main piece machine the broken face away so that you have a D
shaped end.
looking at it in profile would be something like this (forgive the
ascii art)

[------------/
[ /
[ /___________________
[ ]
[ ]
[ ] ------cut or
plane off face here that would originally have been the other dovetail
cheek.

make another dovetail cheek and position it in place with a double row
of socket head cap screws.
seems a fairly easy repair to me which would give you an adjustable
dovetail.(not that you'd need one there)

Stealth Pilot