Greetings,

Thinking about lathes and wondered what feedback I could get by asking the
question "what do you think is one of the best lathes"? I'm especially
interested in the reasons. I've owned a SB 10k for a number of years and
found it to be a good lathe.... great size, robust and well built, quite
accurate, and was supported with a good range of accessories (if I could
afford them!). Recently I got an incredible deal on a Summit lathe so now I
have something to compare, and the weak points of the SB start to show.
Specifically the headstock doesn't incorporate any type of roller bearings,
but instead only bushings. Mine have definitely worn over the years, likely
part due to use of a "force-in" knurling tool. The Summit incorporates a
clutch system that allows me to start/stop the lathe exactly where I want
(if I'm on top of it that day), and I find this "jogging" feature very handy
under certain circumstances. It also allows me to run the lathe in reverse
without the chuck unscrewing due to the camlock spindle style (now I can
bore/thread on the backside, where I can see better).

Recently I've been thinking about the refacing of a faceplate when
rebuilding an old Willson 16" swing lathe. Surface cutting speeds vary
hugely between the inside and outside of the surface, to the point where
there is no correct RPM setting that will work at both ends, and it showed
in the finish. One book I read suggested stopping part way through and
changing spindle speeds, but I'm sure that would leave a mark also. Ding!
What a person needs is a variable speed arrangement and a spindle tach. ...
maybe I could modify the SB. Yes, a VFD on a 3phase motor would work, but
they do tend to make a noise that might drive me crazy. Ok, how about some
variable pulley system like the kind used on the medium sized drill presses?
Maybe. Oh, and a clutch. How about modifying a clutch off the end of an
industrial sewing machine motor? Possibly. I think I'm driving myself
crazy.

A 10" SB with roller bearings on the spindle, variable speed, camlock and
clutch, would be a great machine. Is there anything out there like this or
am I dreaming?

Al MacDonald

I have a 14" SB with variable speed using pulleys and a d-4 cam lock
spindle. These machines are nice and come up on ebay once in a while and
don't seem to get much bidding. Not light (about 1600 pounds) but they are
easy to move because the cabinet is full support under it so you can roll it
on pipes the whole length. They are well built with hardend ways, possitive
oil flow to the HS bearings nice machines. I sold a 10K with a 3 and 4 jaw
and some other stuff for what I paid for the 14" with 3 and 4 jaw, follow
rest, steady rest, taper attachment, thread dial, 2 face plates and some
other stuff. If you can move it its a nice machine.


"Al MacDonald" wrote in message
news:m0lvf.30109$km.22889@edtnps89...
Greetings,

Thinking about lathes and wondered what feedback I could get by asking the
question "what do you think is one of the best lathes"? I'm especially
interested in the reasons. I've owned a SB 10k for a number of years and
found it to be a good lathe.... great size, robust and well built, quite
accurate, and was supported with a good range of accessories (if I could
afford them!). Recently I got an incredible deal on a Summit lathe so now
I have something to compare, and the weak points of the SB start to show.
Specifically the headstock doesn't incorporate any type of roller
bearings, but instead only bushings. Mine have definitely worn over the
years, likely part due to use of a "force-in" knurling tool. The Summit
incorporates a clutch system that allows me to start/stop the lathe
exactly where I want (if I'm on top of it that day), and I find this
"jogging" feature very handy under certain circumstances. It also allows
me to run the lathe in reverse without the chuck unscrewing due to the
camlock spindle style (now I can bore/thread on the backside, where I can
see better).

Recently I've been thinking about the refacing of a faceplate when
rebuilding an old Willson 16" swing lathe. Surface cutting speeds vary
hugely between the inside and outside of the surface, to the point where
there is no correct RPM setting that will work at both ends, and it showed
in the finish. One book I read suggested stopping part way through and
changing spindle speeds, but I'm sure that would leave a mark also. Ding!
What a person needs is a variable speed arrangement and a spindle tach.
... maybe I could modify the SB. Yes, a VFD on a 3phase motor would work,
but they do tend to make a noise that might drive me crazy. Ok, how about
some variable pulley system like the kind used on the medium sized drill
presses? Maybe. Oh, and a clutch. How about modifying a clutch off the
end of an industrial sewing machine motor? Possibly. I think I'm driving
myself crazy.

A 10" SB with roller bearings on the spindle, variable speed, camlock and
clutch, would be a great machine. Is there anything out there like this
or am I dreaming?

Al MacDonald

According to Al MacDonald :

Kind of skimpy on supporting details for the claim in the
"Subject: " header. :-)

Enjoy,
DoN.

--
Email: | Voice (all times): (703) 938-4564
(too) near Washington D.C. | http://www.d-and-d.com/dnichols/DoN.html
--- Black Holes are where God is dividing by zero ---

Al MacDonald wrote:
Greetings,

Thinking about lathes and wondered what feedback I could get by asking the
question "what do you think is one of the best lathes"? I'm especially
interested in the reasons. I've owned a SB 10k for a number of years and
found it to be a good lathe.... great size, robust and well built, quite
accurate, and was supported with a good range of accessories (if I could
afford them!). Recently I got an incredible deal on a Summit lathe so now I
have something to compare, and the weak points of the SB start to show.
Well, I got my own deal, on a totally top of the line Sheldon R15.
It has a 2.25" spindle through hole, and D1-6 spindle mount.
I don't have a clutch, but I did rig a jog button, as my VFD has
that function. It is real nice when the gears or direct-drive dog
doesn't want to engage. I did have to rebuild the bed ways, but overall
it was worth it. Every time something needs turning, now, I get a BIG
grin on my face!

Recently I've been thinking about the refacing of a faceplate when
rebuilding an old Willson 16" swing lathe. Surface cutting speeds vary
hugely between the inside and outside of the surface, to the point where
there is no correct RPM setting that will work at both ends, and it showed
in the finish. One book I read suggested stopping part way through and
changing spindle speeds, but I'm sure that would leave a mark also. Ding!
What a person needs is a variable speed arrangement and a spindle tach. ...
maybe I could modify the SB. Yes, a VFD on a 3phase motor would work, but
they do tend to make a noise that might drive me crazy. Ok, how about some
variable pulley system like the kind used on the medium sized drill presses?
Maybe. Oh, and a clutch. How about modifying a clutch off the end of an
industrial sewing machine motor? Possibly. I think I'm driving myself
crazy.
I don't know what "noise" you are talking about. Maybe old VFDs from
the early 1980's made singing noises (we still have a bunch of them in
the mechanical rooms at work) but most of the new ones (by that I mean
since 1985 or so) don't make audible noise, either from the VFD or the
motor they power. The 11 KW unit on my Sheldon has fans in it that
run for a minute after you stop the spindle. You can't hear the fans
when the spindle motor is on. The 1 Hp VFD on my mill has no fans, and
it makes a TINY singing noise that I can hear when the spindle is in the
DC injection braking part of the cycle. But, that is so tiny a sound,
it is no problem, and can only be heard as the spindle comes to a
complete stop. So, I think the audible noise problem is only on VERY
old units. Otherwise, I REALLY like the VFDs, and wouldn't have
anything else. I really don't need a clutch with the VFD. I can run
forward or reverse, jog and vary the speed while it is running.


A 10" SB with roller bearings on the spindle, variable speed, camlock and
clutch, would be a great machine. Is there anything out there like this or
am I dreaming?
Umm, well, I think my Sheldon R15-6 fills all these requirements. They
are a bit rare, but REALLY well made. 3500 Lbs, though, so it certainly
is NOT in the same class as the SB 10. Unlike old 15" lathes, the
standard model goes to 1250 RPM, the "high speed" model uses a 2-speed
motor to get to 2500 RPM. (Hmm, I can't imagine taking my 8.25"
Phase-II chuck to 2500 RPM!) I can do 2500 RPM with the VFD even though
I DON'T have the high-speed option on mine.

Jon

"Al MacDonald" wrote in message
news:m0lvf.30109$km.22889@edtnps89...
snip------

A 10" SB with roller bearings on the spindle, variable speed, camlock and
clutch, would be a great machine. Is there anything out there like this
or
am I dreaming?

Al MacDonald

If memory serves, it's called a Monarch EE. It has far more than you
imagine.

Harold

I have not had the problem you mention with VFDs. If you get old ones
maybe. Just be sure the VFD has a chopping frequency over 15kHz. I got
one with 5kHz and that did sing, but 15kHz made a barely audible noise.
The noise will also depend on the motor. Also the motor makes the most
noise while your testing hooked up on bench with no load. Once
mechanically connected to the machine, noise is far less.

If you still don't like VFDs, you can also get variable spindle speed
with a DC motor and controller.

On Thu, 5 Jan 2006 22:57:24 -0800, "Harold and Susan Vordos"
wrote:


"Al MacDonald" wrote in message
news:m0lvf.30109$km.22889@edtnps89...
snip------

A 10" SB with roller bearings on the spindle, variable speed, camlock and
clutch, would be a great machine. Is there anything out there like this
or
am I dreaming?

Al MacDonald

If memory serves, it's called a Monarch EE. It has far more than you
imagine.

Harold

Lets not forget the superlative Rivett tool room lathe either

Gunner

The aim of untold millions is to be free to do exactly as they choose
and for someone else to pay when things go wrong.

In the past few decades, a peculiar and distinctive psychology
has emerged in England. Gone are the civility, sturdy independence,
and admirable stoicism that carried the English through the war years
.. It has been replaced by a constant whine of excuses, complaints,
and special pleading. The collapse of the British character has been
as swift and complete as the collapse of British power.

Theodore Dalrymple,

....
A 10" SB with roller bearings on the spindle, variable speed, camlock and
clutch, would be a great machine. Is there anything out there like this
or
am I dreaming?

Al MacDonald

If memory serves, it's called a Monarch EE. It has far more than you
imagine.

Harold

A big 10-4 on the 10EE. One feature not mentioned is accuracy of machine. If
you're used to a southbend you'll think you died and went to heaven if you
use a 10EE. That extra 3000 lb. of cast iron is there for a reason.

The only thing better than a 10EE is a 10EE with a DRO and VFD spindle. Very
nice additions.

Karl

"Karl Townsend" remove .NOT wrote in
message ews.com...

...
A 10" SB with roller bearings on the spindle, variable speed, camlock
and
clutch, would be a great machine. Is there anything out there like
this
or
am I dreaming?

Al MacDonald

If memory serves, it's called a Monarch EE. It has far more than you
imagine.

Harold

A big 10-4 on the 10EE. One feature not mentioned is accuracy of machine.
If
you're used to a southbend you'll think you died and went to heaven if you
use a 10EE. That extra 3000 lb. of cast iron is there for a reason.

The only thing better than a 10EE is a 10EE with a DRO and VFD spindle.
Very
nice additions.

Karl

Given an EE in top condition, I don't think you'd gain much, if anything,
with a VFD. The original drive system, in top condition, performed as well
as any VFD could, with no loss of torque at low speeds. Depending on how
the EE was ordered, you had the option of a 4,000 RPM spindle. For the
uninitiated, that's one of the best features ever offered on an engine
lathe, particularly for those that do small work.

I spent considerable time (over a year) on what was then a new EE, tube type
(circa 1956). It was, without a doubt, the finest engine lathe I've ever
operated. That particular machine had a 3,000 RPM spindle, at which speed
considerable work was performed. I could only dream of the higher speed,
which I'd have gladly used were it available.

Not having ever operated the Rivett, I can't speak from experience, but I
fear I'd have to agree with Gunner. They didn't appear to enjoy the same
level of success as the Monarch, but were likely very competitive in
operation and quality. It was exceedingly difficult to compete with the
Monarch line in general, so I doesn't surprise me that the Rivett didn't
enjoy the same degree of success.

Harold

Al MacDonald wrote:
Recently I've been thinking about the refacing of a faceplate when
rebuilding an old Willson 16" swing lathe. Surface cutting speeds vary
hugely between the inside and outside of the surface, to the point where
there is no correct RPM setting that will work at both ends, and it showed
in the finish. One book I read suggested stopping part way through and
changing spindle speeds, but I'm sure that would leave a mark also. Ding!

A toolpost grinder will give you a uniform surface with a
non-directional swirl. This is what is used on a flywheel attachment
for a brake lathe.

I hadda look that one up... wow, it looks like you could
turn a tank (military type) on that thing.

Gunner wrote:

Lets not forget the superlative Rivett tool room lathe either

And now I see 10EE selling for $1500. There are MANY great machines made
that will do better work than most of us will ever need.
"Harold and Susan Vordos" wrote in message
...

"Karl Townsend" remove .NOT wrote in
message ews.com...

...
A 10" SB with roller bearings on the spindle, variable speed, camlock
and
clutch, would be a great machine. Is there anything out there like
this
or
am I dreaming?

Al MacDonald

If memory serves, it's called a Monarch EE. It has far more than you
imagine.

Harold

A big 10-4 on the 10EE. One feature not mentioned is accuracy of machine.
If
you're used to a southbend you'll think you died and went to heaven if
you
use a 10EE. That extra 3000 lb. of cast iron is there for a reason.

The only thing better than a 10EE is a 10EE with a DRO and VFD spindle.
Very
nice additions.

Karl

Given an EE in top condition, I don't think you'd gain much, if anything,
with a VFD. The original drive system, in top condition, performed as
well
as any VFD could, with no loss of torque at low speeds. Depending on how
the EE was ordered, you had the option of a 4,000 RPM spindle. For
the
uninitiated, that's one of the best features ever offered on an engine
lathe, particularly for those that do small work.

I spent considerable time (over a year) on what was then a new EE, tube
type
(circa 1956). It was, without a doubt, the finest engine lathe I've ever
operated. That particular machine had a 3,000 RPM spindle, at which
speed
considerable work was performed. I could only dream of the higher
speed,
which I'd have gladly used were it available.

Not having ever operated the Rivett, I can't speak from experience, but I
fear I'd have to agree with Gunner. They didn't appear to enjoy the same
level of success as the Monarch, but were likely very competitive in
operation and quality. It was exceedingly difficult to compete with the
Monarch line in general, so I doesn't surprise me that the Rivett didn't
enjoy the same degree of success.

Harold

"wayne mak" wrote in message
...
And now I see 10EE selling for $1500. There are MANY great machines made
that will do better work than most of us will ever need.

Had the government not invested in so many of them, I don't think the market
would be flooded with them as it is. Back in the late 50's an EE cost
right at $10,000, which was roughly the same price as a modest home.
Later years, they got up to $90,000. Worth every penny, assuming you had a
need for that level of quality. Understand that they are not to be
classified with other machines, aside from maybe the Rivett, about which
Gunner spoke. Unless you've operated one, you can't begin to understand
the differences, nor how the differences affect the operator. I honestly
feel that running an EE was the turning point in my learning curve, which
had suffered considerably for several months.

Harold

Harold and Susan Vordos wrote:

"wayne mak" wrote in message
...
And now I see 10EE selling for $1500. There are MANY great machines made
that will do better work than most of us will ever need.

Had the government not invested in so many of them, I don't think the market
would be flooded with them as it is. Back in the late 50's an EE cost
right at $10,000, which was roughly the same price as a modest home.
Later years, they got up to $90,000. Worth every penny, assuming you had a
need for that level of quality. Understand that they are not to be
classified with other machines, aside from maybe the Rivett, about which
Gunner spoke. Unless you've operated one, you can't begin to understand
the differences, nor how the differences affect the operator. I honestly
feel that running an EE was the turning point in my learning curve, which
had suffered considerably for several months.

Harold

But hardly the best lathe ever, Harold, for their size, perhaps.
This from a Monarch owner! But a 10EE was a creation of the
early 40s and apart from changes to the electronic drive did
not alter much mechanically over the years of production, something
shared by South Bend to their detriment.

I would say a late tool room lathe by VDF-Boehringer would have
been the pinnacle of lathe design & manufacture..

Tom

Okay Al,
I have to play. The 10EE and Rivetts are class acts, but you have to go a
long way to beat a LeBlond or my Lodge & Shipley 18 x 54 Power Turn tool
room lathe. Pumped and filtered lube oil, precision ground gears, precision
ground replaceable ways, horsepower meter, glass piped light gear change and
speed indicators, surface speed calculator drum, every screw thread
imaginable, including gear hob pitches built in., controls on both sides of
the lathe including lead screw reverse at speed without loss of index,
micrometer indicators on every feed control, 2 speed tailstock ram with
built in ball bearing center, D-6 Camlock Spindle with 24 speeds from 21 to
1740 rpm and a 15 HP motor. Super quiet, super powerful, super stiff, super
smooth controls and dead accurate across the whole length of the bed. It
does weigh in around 6 tons though. That's a class act.
Steve

"Al MacDonald" wrote in message
news:m0lvf.30109$km.22889@edtnps89...
Greetings,

Thinking about lathes and wondered what feedback I could get by asking the
question "what do you think is one of the best lathes"? I'm especially
interested in the reasons. I've owned a SB 10k for a number of years and
found it to be a good lathe.... great size, robust and well built, quite
accurate, and was supported with a good range of accessories (if I could
afford them!). Recently I got an incredible deal on a Summit lathe so now
I have something to compare, and the weak points of the SB start to show.
Specifically the headstock doesn't incorporate any type of roller
bearings, but instead only bushings. Mine have definitely worn over the
years, likely part due to use of a "force-in" knurling tool. The Summit
incorporates a clutch system that allows me to start/stop the lathe
exactly where I want (if I'm on top of it that day), and I find this
"jogging" feature very handy under certain circumstances. It also allows
me to run the lathe in reverse without the chuck unscrewing due to the
camlock spindle style (now I can bore/thread on the backside, where I can
see better).

Recently I've been thinking about the refacing of a faceplate when
rebuilding an old Willson 16" swing lathe. Surface cutting speeds vary
hugely between the inside and outside of the surface, to the point where
there is no correct RPM setting that will work at both ends, and it showed
in the finish. One book I read suggested stopping part way through and
changing spindle speeds, but I'm sure that would leave a mark also. Ding!
What a person needs is a variable speed arrangement and a spindle tach.
... maybe I could modify the SB. Yes, a VFD on a 3phase motor would work,
but they do tend to make a noise that might drive me crazy. Ok, how about
some variable pulley system like the kind used on the medium sized drill
presses? Maybe. Oh, and a clutch. How about modifying a clutch off the
end of an industrial sewing machine motor? Possibly. I think I'm driving
myself crazy.

A 10" SB with roller bearings on the spindle, variable speed, camlock and
clutch, would be a great machine. Is there anything out there like this
or am I dreaming?

Al MacDonald

I bought and sold a Takisawi lathe that I would have loved to keep. Not a
monarch but a top quality machine that had modern features. For anything I
would do I think there are many better lathes than a monarch. Just my
view."Tom" wrote in message
...
Harold and Susan Vordos wrote:

"wayne mak" wrote in message
...
And now I see 10EE selling for $1500. There are MANY great machines
made
that will do better work than most of us will ever need.

Had the government not invested in so many of them, I don't think the
market
would be flooded with them as it is. Back in the late 50's an EE cost
right at $10,000, which was roughly the same price as a modest home.
Later years, they got up to $90,000. Worth every penny, assuming you had
a
need for that level of quality. Understand that they are not to be
classified with other machines, aside from maybe the Rivett, about which
Gunner spoke. Unless you've operated one, you can't begin to
understand
the differences, nor how the differences affect the operator. I
honestly
feel that running an EE was the turning point in my learning curve, which
had suffered considerably for several months.

Harold

But hardly the best lathe ever, Harold, for their size, perhaps.
This from a Monarch owner! But a 10EE was a creation of the
early 40s and apart from changes to the electronic drive did
not alter much mechanically over the years of production, something
shared by South Bend to their detriment.

I would say a late tool room lathe by VDF-Boehringer would have
been the pinnacle of lathe design & manufacture..

Tom

According to DoN. Nichols :
According to Al MacDonald :

Kind of skimpy on supporting details for the claim in the
"Subject: " header. :-)

And -- looking at other followups, it would appear that some
news server along the way stripped out the body text in what I saw.

All I saw was the headers, and no body.

I now see that there *was* a significant article to answer,
based on what others have quoted.

Enjoy,
DoN.

--
Email: | Voice (all times): (703) 938-4564
(too) near Washington D.C. | http://www.d-and-d.com/dnichols/DoN.html
--- Black Holes are where God is dividing by zero ---

Tom wrote:

Harold and Susan Vordos wrote:


"wayne mak" wrote in message
...


And now I see 10EE selling for $1500. There are MANY great machines made
that will do better work than most of us will ever need.


Had the government not invested in so many of them, I don't think the market
would be flooded with them as it is. Back in the late 50's an EE cost
right at $10,000, which was roughly the same price as a modest home.
Later years, they got up to $90,000. Worth every penny, assuming you had a
need for that level of quality. Understand that they are not to be
classified with other machines, aside from maybe the Rivett, about which
Gunner spoke. Unless you've operated one, you can't begin to understand
the differences, nor how the differences affect the operator. I honestly
feel that running an EE was the turning point in my learning curve, which
had suffered considerably for several months.

Harold



But hardly the best lathe ever, Harold, for their size, perhaps.
This from a Monarch owner! But a 10EE was a creation of the
early 40s and apart from changes to the electronic drive did
not alter much mechanically over the years of production, something
shared by South Bend to their detriment.

I would say a late tool room lathe by VDF-Boehringer would have
been the pinnacle of lathe design & manufacture..


Could you compare that to a late-model Sheldon R15? The ones made later
than 1972 or so were REALLY advanced, both in the headstock and carriage
areas. They had all sorts of features to improve precision, remove
vibration
and keep tolerances of one part from affecting another section of the
machine.
I've crowed about all this previously, so don't want to bore people. I know
something about Mori-Seiki machines, but I'm not familiar with the VDF.
Anyway, I've been astounded a few times with my Sheldon at how rigid and
vibration-free it is, even under heavy loads.

Jon

Al MacDonald wrote:
Greetings,

Thinking about lathes and wondered what feedback I could get by asking the
question "what do you think is one of the best lathes"? I'm especially
SNIP



Not having ever been a professional machinist, I don't have much in the
way of a defencable opinion on this, except that at some point I decided
that the BEST lathe ever is which ever one I happen to own at the time.
Seems to save me a great deal of energy that would otherwise be spent
lusting after things I could never own...

-AL A.

I love my SB 14" with variable speed, d-4 lock spindle, taper, sure isn't
the classic SB look but its been one VERY nice machine for me. Its no
Monarch but its 14" swing 40" BTC and solid for what I do. The cabinet is
full bottom so moving its easy to.
"Jon Elson" wrote in message
...


Tom wrote:

Harold and Susan Vordos wrote:

"wayne mak" wrote in message
...

And now I see 10EE selling for $1500. There are MANY great machines made
that will do better work than most of us will ever need.

Had the government not invested in so many of them, I don't think the
market
would be flooded with them as it is. Back in the late 50's an EE cost
right at $10,000, which was roughly the same price as a modest home.
Later years, they got up to $90,000. Worth every penny, assuming you had
a
need for that level of quality. Understand that they are not to be
classified with other machines, aside from maybe the Rivett, about which
Gunner spoke. Unless you've operated one, you can't begin to
understand
the differences, nor how the differences affect the operator. I
honestly
feel that running an EE was the turning point in my learning curve, which
had suffered considerably for several months.

Harold


But hardly the best lathe ever, Harold, for their size, perhaps.
This from a Monarch owner! But a 10EE was a creation of the
early 40s and apart from changes to the electronic drive did
not alter much mechanically over the years of production, something
shared by South Bend to their detriment.

I would say a late tool room lathe by VDF-Boehringer would have
been the pinnacle of lathe design & manufacture..

Could you compare that to a late-model Sheldon R15? The ones made later
than 1972 or so were REALLY advanced, both in the headstock and carriage
areas. They had all sorts of features to improve precision, remove
vibration
and keep tolerances of one part from affecting another section of the
machine.
I've crowed about all this previously, so don't want to bore people. I
know
something about Mori-Seiki machines, but I'm not familiar with the VDF.
Anyway, I've been astounded a few times with my Sheldon at how rigid and
vibration-free it is, even under heavy loads.

Jon

"Tom" wrote in message
...
snip----

But hardly the best lathe ever, Harold, for their size, perhaps.

Yes, of course. I should have mentioned that. One must consider how a
machine is applied. I also ran a 17" Axelson, which I consider to have no
equal-------for that kind of machine (Maybe a Mori-Seiki?).

This from a Monarch owner! But a 10EE was a creation of the
early 40s and apart from changes to the electronic drive did
not alter much mechanically over the years of production, something
shared by South Bend to their detriment.

Frankly, having run one of the EE's when it was new (late 50's), I can't
imagine any changes that could have been made to improve them. Mind you,
I'm speaking from the perspective of one running a toolroom lathe. It goes
without saying that it had no magical features that one might find on a CNC.
I don't recall anything that was problematic-----aside from the fairly
premature failure of the tubes. Mechanically it was never a problem, and
I did a lot of close tolerance work with it. I'm still impressed with the
degree of rigidity, especially when you consider that it had only a D1-3
spindle. I'm open to your opinion(s).

Regards South Bend, I was never impressed with them. I had the misfortune
to be assigned, for a brief period, to one of their geared head machines, a
Turnado. Nothing short of trash.

I would say a late tool room lathe by VDF-Boehringer would have
been the pinnacle of lathe design & manufacture..

Tom

Sadly, my limited exposure has prevented me from ever hearing of it, let
alone running one. More details, please?

Harold

"Al A." wrote in message
. ..
Al MacDonald wrote:
Greetings,

Thinking about lathes and wondered what feedback I could get by asking
the question "what do you think is one of the best lathes"? I'm
especially
SNIP



Not having ever been a professional machinist, I don't have much in the
way of a defencable opinion on this, except that at some point I decided
that the BEST lathe ever is which ever one I happen to own at the time.
Seems to save me a great deal of energy that would otherwise be spent
lusting after things I could never own...

-AL A.



Absolutely. When I need to make something, my 1956 vintage Clausing is the
best lathe ever. The old secret to happiness. I'm content with what I
have. But I wouldn't say no to a Rivett, which from my paltry experience
is a hell of a lathe.

Garrett Fulton

Maybe, but the 10EE LOOKS better! IMHO, too bad about some of the
electronics they used, they worked well, but a pita to maintain old
ones.

On Fri, 06 Jan 2006 11:00:30 -0600, Mike Berger
wrote:

I hadda look that one up... wow, it looks like you could
turn a tank (military type) on that thing.

Gunner wrote:

Lets not forget the superlative Rivett tool room lathe either


Or buld a fine chronometer.

Gunner

The aim of untold millions is to be free to do exactly as they choose
and for someone else to pay when things go wrong.

In the past few decades, a peculiar and distinctive psychology
has emerged in England. Gone are the civility, sturdy independence,
and admirable stoicism that carried the English through the war years
.. It has been replaced by a constant whine of excuses, complaints,
and special pleading. The collapse of the British character has been
as swift and complete as the collapse of British power.

Theodore Dalrymple,

On Fri, 6 Jan 2006 23:00:26 +0100, "Steve Lusardi"
wrote:

Okay Al,
I have to play. The 10EE and Rivetts are class acts, but you have to go a
long way to beat a LeBlond or my Lodge & Shipley 18 x 54 Power Turn tool
room lathe. Pumped and filtered lube oil, precision ground gears, precision
ground replaceable ways, horsepower meter, glass piped light gear change and
speed indicators, surface speed calculator drum, every screw thread
imaginable, including gear hob pitches built in., controls on both sides of
the lathe including lead screw reverse at speed without loss of index,
micrometer indicators on every feed control, 2 speed tailstock ram with
built in ball bearing center, D-6 Camlock Spindle with 24 speeds from 21 to
1740 rpm and a 15 HP motor. Super quiet, super powerful, super stiff, super
smooth controls and dead accurate across the whole length of the bed. It
does weigh in around 6 tons though. That's a class act.
Steve

Yes, is is one hell of a machine. Oddly enough..I ran across one
yesterday. The fellow that is rebuilding the heads for my truck has
one. Minty minty minty. And it sits right in front of the biggest
picture window in the machine shop..right where the customers come up
the sidewalk to enter the building.

Good advertising I think

Gunner


"Al MacDonald" wrote in message
news:m0lvf.30109$km.22889@edtnps89...
Greetings,

Thinking about lathes and wondered what feedback I could get by asking the
question "what do you think is one of the best lathes"? I'm especially
interested in the reasons. I've owned a SB 10k for a number of years and
found it to be a good lathe.... great size, robust and well built, quite
accurate, and was supported with a good range of accessories (if I could
afford them!). Recently I got an incredible deal on a Summit lathe so now
I have something to compare, and the weak points of the SB start to show.
Specifically the headstock doesn't incorporate any type of roller
bearings, but instead only bushings. Mine have definitely worn over the
years, likely part due to use of a "force-in" knurling tool. The Summit
incorporates a clutch system that allows me to start/stop the lathe
exactly where I want (if I'm on top of it that day), and I find this
"jogging" feature very handy under certain circumstances. It also allows
me to run the lathe in reverse without the chuck unscrewing due to the
camlock spindle style (now I can bore/thread on the backside, where I can
see better).

Recently I've been thinking about the refacing of a faceplate when
rebuilding an old Willson 16" swing lathe. Surface cutting speeds vary
hugely between the inside and outside of the surface, to the point where
there is no correct RPM setting that will work at both ends, and it showed
in the finish. One book I read suggested stopping part way through and
changing spindle speeds, but I'm sure that would leave a mark also. Ding!
What a person needs is a variable speed arrangement and a spindle tach.
... maybe I could modify the SB. Yes, a VFD on a 3phase motor would work,
but they do tend to make a noise that might drive me crazy. Ok, how about
some variable pulley system like the kind used on the medium sized drill
presses? Maybe. Oh, and a clutch. How about modifying a clutch off the
end of an industrial sewing machine motor? Possibly. I think I'm driving
myself crazy.

A 10" SB with roller bearings on the spindle, variable speed, camlock and
clutch, would be a great machine. Is there anything out there like this
or am I dreaming?

Al MacDonald




The aim of untold millions is to be free to do exactly as they choose
and for someone else to pay when things go wrong.

In the past few decades, a peculiar and distinctive psychology
has emerged in England. Gone are the civility, sturdy independence,
and admirable stoicism that carried the English through the war years
.. It has been replaced by a constant whine of excuses, complaints,
and special pleading. The collapse of the British character has been
as swift and complete as the collapse of British power.

Theodore Dalrymple,

On Fri, 06 Jan 2006 18:41:21 -0500, "Al A."
wrote:

Al MacDonald wrote:
Greetings,

Thinking about lathes and wondered what feedback I could get by asking the
question "what do you think is one of the best lathes"? I'm especially
SNIP



Not having ever been a professional machinist, I don't have much in the
way of a defencable opinion on this, except that at some point I decided
that the BEST lathe ever is which ever one I happen to own at the time.
Seems to save me a great deal of energy that would otherwise be spent
lusting after things I could never own...

-AL A.


While Im NOT a machiist by any stretch of the imagination..Ive cursed
a few that Ive owned. Once you own or run the good stuff..the bad
stuff is REALLY bad.

Gunner

The aim of untold millions is to be free to do exactly as they choose
and for someone else to pay when things go wrong.

In the past few decades, a peculiar and distinctive psychology
has emerged in England. Gone are the civility, sturdy independence,
and admirable stoicism that carried the English through the war years
.. It has been replaced by a constant whine of excuses, complaints,
and special pleading. The collapse of the British character has been
as swift and complete as the collapse of British power.

Theodore Dalrymple,

"Gunner" wrote in message
...
snip------


While Im NOT a machiist by any stretch of the imagination..Ive cursed
a few that Ive owned. Once you own or run the good stuff..the bad
stuff is REALLY bad.

Gunner

It's difficult to convey that message to someone that hasn't been there.
Does a man that has never experienced the convenience of electricity miss
it? Probably not------but try taking it away from someone like
me-------especially my three phase service.

Harold

snip
If you still don't like VFDs, you can also get variable spindle speed
with a DC motor and controller.


Thanks for your reply to my post and info on the VFDs. It seems the VFD is
rather expensive and the 3phase motor is cheap, whereas the DC motor is
expensive and the controller is not that bad. Aside from the cost issue do
you see any advantages of one system over the other?

" Thinking about lathes and wondered what feedback I could get by asking
the
question "what do you think is one of the best lathes"?

A note of thanks to all who responded to my query on 'the best lathes'.
It's great to know what machines are out there that will do the job well,
regardless if I can find one (or afford it). Who knows, I may trip over one
on the way to work tomorrow.

Al MacDonald

had a logan 10": the best for me for learning and for a resonable
home/hobby lathe.

now I have a clausing VS13 which is much larger but oh-my- is it a nice
bit of lathe.

for eveyone who is pumping the 10EE and the Rivett stuff, how about
Hardinge HVLH? in my limited experience it's an amazing lathe. carriage
and ways built like a brick, incredibly smooth and quiet, and you've got
to love the quick in-out lever for when you're single-pointing threads.

That's my next step if i win the lottery!

--J

--
remove xxnospamxx to reach me.

Karl Townsend wrote:

The only thing better than a 10EE is a 10EE with a DRO and VFD spindle. Very
nice additions.

The DC drive that comes with the 10EE is actually better than most (it
not all) VFDs. 3 or 5HP, 100:1 ratio, constant torque to the motor's
base speed and constant HP thereafter. 40-4000 RPM on the knob, 6:1
backgear down on the motor so the gear noise doesn't make it to the
spindle. Very hard to beat, and if it's one of the "Works in a Drawer"
tube drive you have the added bonus of things looking like Doctor
Frankenstein's laboratory while running (something about foot high
thyratrons glowing brightly...)

The Hardinge HVLH is a very nice lathe as well, but more lightly built
than the 10EE. Still, the 10EE has a very nice feel - I was able to
turn .0005" off the diameter of a shaft a friend brought over to make it
fit a bushing - it had to be turned because it was lobed and anything
else would have knocked down the low parts and not simply made it round.

I hesitate to mention this, but there are before and after shots he
http://www.kepler-eng.com I rebuilt this 10EE over a couple of years,
finishing early last year by having the bed regound and refitting the
saddle and cross slide.

On Sat, 07 Jan 2006 15:08:10 -0700, Russ Kepler
wrote:


I hesitate to mention this, but there are before and after shots he
http://www.kepler-eng.com I rebuilt this 10EE over a couple of years,
finishing early last year by having the bed regound and refitting the
saddle and cross slide.

Very nice work!

-Carl

On Sat, 07 Jan 2006 11:36:18 -0800, joel
wrote:

had a logan 10": the best for me for learning and for a resonable
home/hobby lathe.

now I have a clausing VS13 which is much larger but oh-my- is it a nice
bit of lathe.

for eveyone who is pumping the 10EE and the Rivett stuff, how about
Hardinge HVLH? in my limited experience it's an amazing lathe. carriage
and ways built like a brick, incredibly smooth and quiet, and you've got
to love the quick in-out lever for when you're single-pointing threads.

That's my next step if i win the lottery!

--J

I rather like mine

BSEG

Gunner

The aim of untold millions is to be free to do exactly as they choose
and for someone else to pay when things go wrong.

In the past few decades, a peculiar and distinctive psychology
has emerged in England. Gone are the civility, sturdy independence,
and admirable stoicism that carried the English through the war years
.. It has been replaced by a constant whine of excuses, complaints,
and special pleading. The collapse of the British character has been
as swift and complete as the collapse of British power.

Theodore Dalrymple,

Gunner wrote:


Yes, is is one hell of a machine. Oddly enough..I ran across one
yesterday. The fellow that is rebuilding the heads for my truck has
one. Minty minty minty. And it sits right in front of the biggest
picture window in the machine shop..right where the customers come up
the sidewalk to enter the building.

Good advertising I think

Gunner



There is a 20 x 54 Lodge & Shipley on eBay right now -
Item number: 7578594593

It looks ... magnificent.

--
Fred R
________________
Drop TROU to email.

"Russ Kepler" wrote in message
...
Karl Townsend wrote:

The only thing better than a 10EE is a 10EE with a DRO and VFD spindle.
Very nice additions.

The DC drive that comes with the 10EE is actually better than most (it not
all) VFDs. 3 or 5HP, 100:1 ratio, constant torque to the motor's base
speed and constant HP thereafter. 40-4000 RPM on the knob, 6:1 backgear
down on the motor so the gear noise doesn't make it to the spindle. Very
hard to beat, and if it's one of the "Works in a Drawer" tube drive you
have the added bonus of things looking like Doctor Frankenstein's
laboratory while running (something about foot high thyratrons glowing
brightly...)

The Hardinge HVLH is a very nice lathe as well, but more lightly built
than the 10EE. Still, the 10EE has a very nice feel - I was able to turn
.0005" off the diameter of a shaft a friend brought over to make it fit a
bushing - it had to be turned because it was lobed and anything else would
have knocked down the low parts and not simply made it round.

I hesitate to mention this, but there are before and after shots he
http://www.kepler-eng.com I rebuilt this 10EE over a couple of years,
finishing early last year by having the bed regound and refitting the
saddle and cross slide.

You, sir, are a craftsman. What a beautiful restoration.

In article , gfulton says...

I hesitate to mention this, but there are before and after shots he
http://www.kepler-eng.com I rebuilt this 10EE over a couple of years,
finishing early last year by having the bed regound and refitting the
saddle and cross slide.

You, sir, are a craftsman. What a beautiful restoration.

Indeed. Fantastic work.

OK I give up though, Russ - what is the bar that rests on the
hooks on the front of the machine for?

Jim


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please reply to:
JRR(zero) at pkmfgvm4 (dot) vnet (dot) ibm (dot) com
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"jim rozen" wrote in message
...
In article , gfulton says...

I hesitate to mention this, but there are before and after shots he
http://www.kepler-eng.com I rebuilt this 10EE over a couple of years,
finishing early last year by having the bed regound and refitting the
saddle and cross slide.

You, sir, are a craftsman. What a beautiful restoration.

Indeed. Fantastic work.

OK I give up though, Russ - what is the bar that rests on the
hooks on the front of the machine for?

Jim

Knockout bar for the spindle.

Harold

"gfulton" wrote in message
...


I hesitate to mention this, but there are before and after shots he
http://www.kepler-eng.com I rebuilt this 10EE over a couple of years,
finishing early last year by having the bed regound and refitting the
saddle and cross slide.

You, sir, are a craftsman. What a beautiful restoration.

Agreed.

Absolutely outstanding work.

--
Regards,
Noddy.

In article , Harold and Susan Vordos says...

OK I give up though, Russ - what is the bar that rests on the
hooks on the front of the machine for?

Knockout bar for the spindle.

Ouch, if I had replaced those spindle bearings I
don't think I'd be shocking them like that. Then
again if it came stock with the machine, it really
has to be present on a concours restoration like that!

Jim


--
==================================================
please reply to:
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==================================================