For 100 years, Census Day has been April 1.
https://www.census.gov/history/www/t...verview_1.html

For the 2010 census, a new section was added to the Overview page, Key
2010 Census Dates. The other years don't have this, but at least I
know that for 2010

"April 1, 2010 - Census Day. Households are asked to supply data in
their census questionnaire that is accurate as of April 1.

April 30, 2010 - Enumerators begin door-to-door operations to collect
census data from households to follow up with households that either
didn't mail back their form or didn't receive one.

July 30, 2010 - The toll-free telephone assistance line is closed,
ending 2010 census data collection. More than 130,000 interviews were
completed via the toll-free line."

So that's 3 complete months, during which time there were doorknockers .
Does anyone know how long it was this year. It prob

As to the completion date, I read under Herman Hollerith that the 1880
census counting was completed in 1887. So there is no need to be done
by January 2021.

Census day in every year back to 1930 was April 1
In 1920 it was Jan 1, of all things.
In 1910 it was April 15
In 1900 it iwas June 1

The url above goes back to 1790 but I don't have time to read everything
now.

On Sunday, October 18, 2020 at 2:57:15 AM UTC-4, micky wrote:
For 100 years, Census Day has been April 1.
https://www.census.gov/history/www/t...verview_1.html

For the 2010 census, a new section was added to the Overview page, Key
2010 Census Dates. The other years don't have this, but at least I
know that for 2010

"April 1, 2010 - Census Day. Households are asked to supply data in
their census questionnaire that is accurate as of April 1.

April 30, 2010 - Enumerators begin door-to-door operations to collect
census data from households to follow up with households that either
didn't mail back their form or didn't receive one.

July 30, 2010 - The toll-free telephone assistance line is closed,
ending 2010 census data collection. More than 130,000 interviews were
completed via the toll-free line."

So that's 3 complete months, during which time there were doorknockers .
Does anyone know how long it was this year. It prob


Not clear from that enumerators were out there for the three full months.
This year from what I can tell it was two months, maybe a little less,
starting in early August, ending early Oct. It probably varied a bit by
region of the country. But the real issue here is what percentage was
completed this year versus previous years and if it's substantially
different, does it make any difference in the result. They will never get
to 100%, there will always be a few percent left. That is then filled in
using estimates and models based on the 97% or whatever they have. So
if one year they get to 98%, while another year they get to 96%, not clear
that it really matters. At some point, people that refuse to cooperate
or where contact can't be made, where somone can't be found to provide the
data, another month of pounding on the door isn't going to change the result.







As to the completion date, I read under Herman Hollerith that the 1880
census counting was completed in 1887. So there is no need to be done
by January 2021.

Census day in every year back to 1930 was April 1
In 1920 it was Jan 1, of all things.
In 1910 it was April 15
In 1900 it iwas June 1

The url above goes back to 1790 but I don't have time to read everything
now.

In alt.home.repair, on Sun, 18 Oct 2020 07:23:18 -0700 (PDT), trader_4
wrote:

On Sunday, October 18, 2020 at 2:57:15 AM UTC-4, micky wrote:
For 100 years, Census Day has been April 1.
https://www.census.gov/history/www/t...verview_1.html

For the 2010 census, a new section was added to the Overview page, Key
2010 Census Dates. The other years don't have this, but at least I
know that for 2010

"April 1, 2010 - Census Day. Households are asked to supply data in
their census questionnaire that is accurate as of April 1.

April 30, 2010 - Enumerators begin door-to-door operations to collect
census data from households to follow up with households that either
didn't mail back their form or didn't receive one.

July 30, 2010 - The toll-free telephone assistance line is closed,
ending 2010 census data collection. More than 130,000 interviews were
completed via the toll-free line."

So that's 3 complete months, during which time there were doorknockers .
Does anyone know how long it was this year. It prob


Not clear from that enumerators were out there for the three full months.

True, not clear from that but it might have been the full 3 months. I
remember that they would start hiring and training 4 or 6 months in
advance. This year, my friend... I have to ask her again. She also
applied to be a contact tracer for Covid. She took online training for
one or both of them and then didn't hear back for a long time, but
anyhow, the question is, when it says in 2010 "Enumerators begin
door-to-door operations to collect census data" were they really out
there going to people's doors on the last day of April.

I hate to say it but I was depressed and hadn't returned my census form
and somoene called me, someone I knew. If I could remember who it was,
I could and would call him for more details, but I can't remember. Other
than that, I don't know how to find more about this.

This year from what I can tell it was two months, maybe a little less,
starting in early August, ending early Oct. It probably varied a bit by
region of the country. But the real issue here is what percentage was
completed this year versus previous years and if it's substantially
different, does it make any difference in the result. They will never get
to 100%, there will always be a few percent left. That is then filled in
using estimates and models based on the 97% or whatever they have. So
if one year they get to 98%, while another year they get to 96%, not clear
that it really matters.

I agree with all of this, and I don't expect the census to be 100%.

They are saying that they've been to 99% of all the residences in
Maryland, but they did that partly by loosening standards on what is
visiting a home. Used to be, on I forget, the second or third trip, the
doorknocker could talk to neighbors and if they said how many were
living there (even if they were occasinally wrong) it counted as a
visit. They weakened that to allow it on the first visit. (My friend
went to some places 3 times before finding a resident who was home and
answsed the door, but she's very diligent. She also liked the job, at
least sometimes, from the interesting places she got to go. One was a
house built in the 1800's for the visit by some German king or
something.)

Even though she lives there, she saw a lot of streets she hadn't seen.
OTOH, if I did it, I think t hey would assign me around here and I've
been down almost every street already.

But I digress:

What I don't want isn't for it to be 100% but for it not to favor
Republican areas at the direction of a Republican. I cetainly didn't
suspect H.W.Bush of doing that, as we all know, stumpie has shown plenty
of signs of trying to corrupt the Census. (For others, originnally in
June or so it was the census bureau, his own appointee I suspect, who
wanted it extended that month. Then something made them change their
mind. Maybe someone from a state that was going lose a Repuiblican
district pointed out to them how they could increase Republican
representation by shortening the


At some point, people that refuse to cooperate
or where contact can't be made, where somone can't be found to provide the
data, another month of pounding on the door isn't going to change the result.

No one pounds on one door for a month.

Whether it will change depends on how thoroughly they've done it
already. Have they really been back 2 more times? That WAS the
standard.

I think they probably doorknocked for 3 full months in 2010, but we
still don't know how long it was in 2020.


As to the completion date, I read under Herman Hollerith

On the Census site above. Hollerith invented the Hollerith card, the
precursor of what was it called, an IBM card? a rectangle with a corner
missing and little rectangualr punch holes. He got the idea from paper
crds that controlled looms as ealy as 1801, that enabled them to make
complicated patterns in cloth. He started at the Census Bureau, but
later started the company that after he left became IBM.

https://www.census.gov/history/www/c...hollerith.html
Herman Hollerith (1860-1929): Hollerith worked briefly for the Census
Office in the run-up to the 1880 census. This experience, along with
some advice from mentor John Shaw Billings, convinced him that the
Census Office desperately needed a better way to tabulate census data
than hand counting. Hollerith was able to invent a device that did just
that: an electric tabulating machine.....

https://www.census.gov/history/www/i...tabulator.html
1888 Competition
Following the 1880 census, the Census Bureau was collecting more data
than it could tabulate. As a result, the agency held a competition in
1888 to find a more efficient method to process and tabulate data.
Contestants were asked to process 1880 census data from four areas in St
Louis, MO. Whoever captured and processed the data fastest would win a
contract for the 1890 census.....

that the 1880
census counting was completed in 1887. So there is no need to be done
by January 2021.

Census day in every year back to 1930 was April 1
In 1920 it was Jan 1, of all things.
In 1910 it was April 15
In 1900 it iwas June 1

The url above goes back to 1790 but I don't have time to read everything
now.

On Sunday, October 18, 2020 at 6:43:46 PM UTC-4, micky wrote:
In alt.home.repair, on Sun, 18 Oct 2020 07:23:18 -0700 (PDT), trader_4
wrote:

On Sunday, October 18, 2020 at 2:57:15 AM UTC-4, micky wrote:
For 100 years, Census Day has been April 1.
https://www.census.gov/history/www/t...verview_1.html

For the 2010 census, a new section was added to the Overview page, Key
2010 Census Dates. The other years don't have this, but at least I
know that for 2010

"April 1, 2010 - Census Day. Households are asked to supply data in
their census questionnaire that is accurate as of April 1.

April 30, 2010 - Enumerators begin door-to-door operations to collect
census data from households to follow up with households that either
didn't mail back their form or didn't receive one.

July 30, 2010 - The toll-free telephone assistance line is closed,
ending 2010 census data collection. More than 130,000 interviews were
completed via the toll-free line."

So that's 3 complete months, during which time there were doorknockers .
Does anyone know how long it was this year. It prob


Not clear from that enumerators were out there for the three full months.

True, not clear from that but it might have been the full 3 months.


I
remember that they would start hiring and training 4 or 6 months in
advance. This year, my friend... I have to ask her again. She also
applied to be a contact tracer for Covid. She took online training for
one or both of them and then didn't hear back for a long time, but
anyhow, the question is, when it says in 2010 "Enumerators begin
door-to-door operations to collect census data" were they really out
there going to people's doors on the last day of April.

No, because of Covid it started around early August. But why do they have
to have started in April?




I hate to say it but I was depressed and hadn't returned my census form
and somoene called me, someone I knew. If I could remember who it was,
I could and would call him for more details, but I can't remember. Other
than that, I don't know how to find more about this.
This year from what I can tell it was two months, maybe a little less,
starting in early August, ending early Oct. It probably varied a bit by
region of the country. But the real issue here is what percentage was
completed this year versus previous years and if it's substantially
different, does it make any difference in the result. They will never get
to 100%, there will always be a few percent left. That is then filled in
using estimates and models based on the 97% or whatever they have. So
if one year they get to 98%, while another year they get to 96%, not clear
that it really matters.

I agree with all of this, and I don't expect the census to be 100%.

They are saying that they've been to 99% of all the residences in
Maryland,

I suspect what that said is that 99% is complete, meaning they have census
data for 99%.



but they did that partly by loosening standards on what is
visiting a home. Used to be, on I forget, the second or third trip, the
doorknocker could talk to neighbors and if they said how many were
living there (even if they were occasinally wrong) it counted as a
visit. They weakened that to allow it on the first visit. (My friend
went to some places 3 times before finding a resident who was home and
answsed the door, but she's very diligent. She also liked the job, at
least sometimes, from the interesting places she got to go. One was a
house built in the 1800's for the visit by some German king or
something.)

All that is wrong, AFAIK there is no change in how the census data is recorded.
It's always been that after some number of attempts at an address if they
can't be contacted, then they use proxies, ie a neighbor or landlord.
That's mostly because some people just refuse all attempts, which is why
they just didn't do it online or via mail.


Even though she lives there, she saw a lot of streets she hadn't seen.
OTOH, if I did it, I think t hey would assign me around here and I've
been down almost every street already.

But I digress:

What I don't want isn't for it to be 100% but for it not to favor
Republican areas at the direction of a Republican. I cetainly didn't
suspect H.W.Bush of doing that, as we all know, stumpie has shown plenty
of signs of trying to corrupt the Census. (For others, originnally in
June or so it was the census bureau, his own appointee I suspect, who
wanted it extended that month. Then something made them change their
mind. Maybe someone from a state that was going lose a Repuiblican
district pointed out to them how they could increase Republican
representation by shortening the

There were two issues there. One was ending it early and I agree, that looked
like Trump figuring that illegal aliens and the like would be more resistant
to being counted, so ending it early would count less of them. But the census
has been completed now to a high enough extent that this no longer is a
significant issue.

The other is Trump wants to exclude illegals from the count. I think he's right
on that, it's not what the framers would have intended. On the other hand the
Constitution says all people, and I don't think Trump is likely to prevail in the courts. That is one of of those conservative things, ruling on what the
Constitution says, the letter of the law. If there were some contemporary
discussion at the time showing otherwise, I would be persuaded. But there
isn't, because at the time the US was not being flooded with illegals.






At some point, people that refuse to cooperate
or where contact can't be made, where somone can't be found to provide the
data, another month of pounding on the door isn't going to change the result.

No one pounds on one door for a month.

Whether it will change depends on how thoroughly they've done it
already. Have they really been back 2 more times? That WAS the
standard.

I think they probably doorknocked for 3 full months in 2010, but we
still don't know how long it was in 2020.


As to the completion date, I read under Herman Hollerith

On the Census site above. Hollerith invented the Hollerith card, the
precursor of what was it called, an IBM card? a rectangle with a corner
missing and little rectangualr punch holes. He got the idea from paper
crds that controlled looms as ealy as 1801, that enabled them to make
complicated patterns in cloth. He started at the Census Bureau, but
later started the company that after he left became IBM.

https://www.census.gov/history/www/c...hollerith.html
Herman Hollerith (1860-1929): Hollerith worked briefly for the Census
Office in the run-up to the 1880 census. This experience, along with
some advice from mentor John Shaw Billings, convinced him that the
Census Office desperately needed a better way to tabulate census data
than hand counting. Hollerith was able to invent a device that did just
that: an electric tabulating machine.....

https://www.census.gov/history/www/i...tabulator.html
1888 Competition
Following the 1880 census, the Census Bureau was collecting more data
than it could tabulate. As a result, the agency held a competition in
1888 to find a more efficient method to process and tabulate data.
Contestants were asked to process 1880 census data from four areas in St
Louis, MO. Whoever captured and processed the data fastest would win a
contract for the 1890 census.....

that the 1880
census counting was completed in 1887. So there is no need to be done
by January 2021.

Census day in every year back to 1930 was April 1
In 1920 it was Jan 1, of all things.
In 1910 it was April 15
In 1900 it iwas June 1

The url above goes back to 1790 but I don't have time to read everything
now.

On 10/18/2020 3:43 PM, micky wrote:
In alt.home.repair, on Sun, 18 Oct 2020 07:23:18 -0700 (PDT), trader_4
wrote:

On Sunday, October 18, 2020 at 2:57:15 AM UTC-4, micky wrote:
For 100 years, Census Day has been April 1.
https://www.census.gov/history/www/t...verview_1.html

For the 2010 census, a new section was added to the Overview page, Key
2010 Census Dates. The other years don't have this, but at least I
know that for 2010

"April 1, 2010 - Census Day. Households are asked to supply data in
their census questionnaire that is accurate as of April 1.

April 30, 2010 - Enumerators begin door-to-door operations to collect
census data from households to follow up with households that either
didn't mail back their form or didn't receive one.

July 30, 2010 - The toll-free telephone assistance line is closed,
ending 2010 census data collection. More than 130,000 interviews were
completed via the toll-free line."

So that's 3 complete months, during which time there were doorknockers .
Does anyone know how long it was this year. It prob


Not clear from that enumerators were out there for the three full months.

True, not clear from that but it might have been the full 3 months. I
remember that they would start hiring and training 4 or 6 months in
advance. This year, my friend... I have to ask her again. She also
applied to be a contact tracer for Covid. She took online training for
one or both of them and then didn't hear back for a long time, but
anyhow, the question is, when it says in 2010 "Enumerators begin
door-to-door operations to collect census data" were they really out
there going to people's doors on the last day of April.

I hate to say it but I was depressed and hadn't returned my census form
and somoene called me, someone I knew. If I could remember who it was,
I could and would call him for more details, but I can't remember. Other
than that, I don't know how to find more about this.

This year from what I can tell it was two months, maybe a little less,
starting in early August, ending early Oct. It probably varied a bit by
region of the country. But the real issue here is what percentage was
completed this year versus previous years and if it's substantially
different, does it make any difference in the result. They will never get
to 100%, there will always be a few percent left. That is then filled in
using estimates and models based on the 97% or whatever they have. So
if one year they get to 98%, while another year they get to 96%, not clear
that it really matters.

I agree with all of this, and I don't expect the census to be 100%.

They are saying that they've been to 99% of all the residences in
Maryland, but they did that partly by loosening standards on what is
visiting a home. Used to be, on I forget, the second or third trip, the
doorknocker could talk to neighbors and if they said how many were
living there (even if they were occasinally wrong) it counted as a
visit. They weakened that to allow it on the first visit. (My friend
went to some places 3 times before finding a resident who was home and
answsed the door, but she's very diligent. She also liked the job, at
least sometimes, from the interesting places she got to go. One was a
house built in the 1800's for the visit by some German king or
something.)

Even though she lives there, she saw a lot of streets she hadn't seen.
OTOH, if I did it, I think t hey would assign me around here and I've
been down almost every street already.

But I digress:

What I don't want isn't for it to be 100% but for it not to favor
Republican areas at the direction of a Republican. I cetainly didn't
suspect H.W.Bush of doing that, as we all know, stumpie has shown plenty
of signs of trying to corrupt the Census. (For others, originnally in
June or so it was the census bureau, his own appointee I suspect, who
wanted it extended that month. Then something made them change their
mind. Maybe someone from a state that was going lose a Repuiblican
district pointed out to them how they could increase Republican
representation by shortening the


At some point, people that refuse to cooperate
or where contact can't be made, where somone can't be found to provide the
data, another month of pounding on the door isn't going to change the result.

No one pounds on one door for a month.

Whether it will change depends on how thoroughly they've done it
already. Have they really been back 2 more times? That WAS the
standard.

I think they probably doorknocked for 3 full months in 2010, but we
still don't know how long it was in 2020.


As to the completion date, I read under Herman Hollerith

On the Census site above. Hollerith invented the Hollerith card, the
precursor of what was it called, an IBM card? a rectangle with a corner
missing and little rectangualr punch holes. He got the idea from paper
crds that controlled looms as ealy as 1801, that enabled them to make
complicated patterns in cloth. He started at the Census Bureau, but
later started the company that after he left became IBM.

https://www.census.gov/history/www/c...hollerith.html
Herman Hollerith (1860-1929): Hollerith worked briefly for the Census
Office in the run-up to the 1880 census. This experience, along with
some advice from mentor John Shaw Billings, convinced him that the
Census Office desperately needed a better way to tabulate census data
than hand counting. Hollerith was able to invent a device that did just
that: an electric tabulating machine.....

https://www.census.gov/history/www/i...tabulator.html
1888 Competition
Following the 1880 census, the Census Bureau was collecting more data
than it could tabulate. As a result, the agency held a competition in
1888 to find a more efficient method to process and tabulate data.
Contestants were asked to process 1880 census data from four areas in St
Louis, MO. Whoever captured and processed the data fastest would win a
contract for the 1890 census.....

that the 1880
census counting was completed in 1887. So there is no need to be done
by January 2021.

Census day in every year back to 1930 was April 1
In 1920 it was Jan 1, of all things.
In 1910 it was April 15
In 1900 it iwas June 1

The url above goes back to 1790 but I don't have time to read everything
now.



"roughly 4 out of 10 households nationwide have yet to be included in
the constitutionally mandated count that is used to redistribute
congressional seats, Electoral College votes and federal funding among
the states."


"Republicans in Congress are signaling that the Census Bureau cannot
take the extra time it has said it needs to count every person living in
the U.S. amid the coronavirus pandemic €” even if that risks leaving some
residents out of the 2020 census.

Rushing to deliver new state-population counts to the president by Dec.
31, and more detailed data to the states by March 31, 2021, as required
by current federal law, could risk severe inaccuracies in the
once-a-decade count, especially among people of color, immigrants, rural
residents and other historically undercounted groups.

With 95 days until the Census Bureau plans to stop tallying the
country's residents at the end of October, roughly 4 out of 10
households nationwide have yet to be included in the constitutionally
mandated count that is used to redistribute congressional seats,
Electoral College votes and federal funding among the states.

Democrats in both the Senate and the House of Representatives have
introduced legislation, including the House Democrats' latest
coronavirus relief bill, that would grant four-month extensions to the
legal deadlines in response to requests in April by the Census Bureau
and the Commerce Department, which oversees the bureau."

On Sunday, October 18, 2020 at 6:59:15 PM UTC-4, Bob F wrote:
On 10/18/2020 3:43 PM, micky wrote:
In alt.home.repair, on Sun, 18 Oct 2020 07:23:18 -0700 (PDT), trader_4
wrote:

On Sunday, October 18, 2020 at 2:57:15 AM UTC-4, micky wrote:
For 100 years, Census Day has been April 1.
https://www.census.gov/history/www/t...verview_1.html

For the 2010 census, a new section was added to the Overview page, Key
2010 Census Dates. The other years don't have this, but at least I
know that for 2010

"April 1, 2010 - Census Day. Households are asked to supply data in
their census questionnaire that is accurate as of April 1.

April 30, 2010 - Enumerators begin door-to-door operations to collect
census data from households to follow up with households that either
didn't mail back their form or didn't receive one.

July 30, 2010 - The toll-free telephone assistance line is closed,
ending 2010 census data collection. More than 130,000 interviews were
completed via the toll-free line."

So that's 3 complete months, during which time there were doorknockers .
Does anyone know how long it was this year. It prob


Not clear from that enumerators were out there for the three full months.

True, not clear from that but it might have been the full 3 months. I
remember that they would start hiring and training 4 or 6 months in
advance. This year, my friend... I have to ask her again. She also
applied to be a contact tracer for Covid. She took online training for
one or both of them and then didn't hear back for a long time, but
anyhow, the question is, when it says in 2010 "Enumerators begin
door-to-door operations to collect census data" were they really out
there going to people's doors on the last day of April.

I hate to say it but I was depressed and hadn't returned my census form
and somoene called me, someone I knew. If I could remember who it was,
I could and would call him for more details, but I can't remember. Other
than that, I don't know how to find more about this.

This year from what I can tell it was two months, maybe a little less,
starting in early August, ending early Oct. It probably varied a bit by
region of the country. But the real issue here is what percentage was
completed this year versus previous years and if it's substantially
different, does it make any difference in the result. They will never get
to 100%, there will always be a few percent left. That is then filled in
using estimates and models based on the 97% or whatever they have. So
if one year they get to 98%, while another year they get to 96%, not clear
that it really matters.

I agree with all of this, and I don't expect the census to be 100%.

They are saying that they've been to 99% of all the residences in
Maryland, but they did that partly by loosening standards on what is
visiting a home. Used to be, on I forget, the second or third trip, the
doorknocker could talk to neighbors and if they said how many were
living there (even if they were occasinally wrong) it counted as a
visit. They weakened that to allow it on the first visit. (My friend
went to some places 3 times before finding a resident who was home and
answsed the door, but she's very diligent. She also liked the job, at
least sometimes, from the interesting places she got to go. One was a
house built in the 1800's for the visit by some German king or
something.)

Even though she lives there, she saw a lot of streets she hadn't seen.
OTOH, if I did it, I think t hey would assign me around here and I've
been down almost every street already.

But I digress:

What I don't want isn't for it to be 100% but for it not to favor
Republican areas at the direction of a Republican. I cetainly didn't
suspect H.W.Bush of doing that, as we all know, stumpie has shown plenty
of signs of trying to corrupt the Census. (For others, originnally in
June or so it was the census bureau, his own appointee I suspect, who
wanted it extended that month. Then something made them change their
mind. Maybe someone from a state that was going lose a Repuiblican
district pointed out to them how they could increase Republican
representation by shortening the


At some point, people that refuse to cooperate
or where contact can't be made, where somone can't be found to provide the
data, another month of pounding on the door isn't going to change the result.

No one pounds on one door for a month.

Whether it will change depends on how thoroughly they've done it
already. Have they really been back 2 more times? That WAS the
standard.

I think they probably doorknocked for 3 full months in 2010, but we
still don't know how long it was in 2020.


As to the completion date, I read under Herman Hollerith

On the Census site above. Hollerith invented the Hollerith card, the
precursor of what was it called, an IBM card? a rectangle with a corner
missing and little rectangualr punch holes. He got the idea from paper
crds that controlled looms as ealy as 1801, that enabled them to make
complicated patterns in cloth. He started at the Census Bureau, but
later started the company that after he left became IBM.

https://www.census.gov/history/www/c...hollerith.html
Herman Hollerith (1860-1929): Hollerith worked briefly for the Census
Office in the run-up to the 1880 census. This experience, along with
some advice from mentor John Shaw Billings, convinced him that the
Census Office desperately needed a better way to tabulate census data
than hand counting. Hollerith was able to invent a device that did just
that: an electric tabulating machine.....

https://www.census.gov/history/www/i...tabulator.html
1888 Competition
Following the 1880 census, the Census Bureau was collecting more data
than it could tabulate. As a result, the agency held a competition in
1888 to find a more efficient method to process and tabulate data.
Contestants were asked to process 1880 census data from four areas in St
Louis, MO. Whoever captured and processed the data fastest would win a
contract for the 1890 census.....

that the 1880
census counting was completed in 1887. So there is no need to be done
by January 2021.

Census day in every year back to 1930 was April 1
In 1920 it was Jan 1, of all things.
In 1910 it was April 15
In 1900 it iwas June 1

The url above goes back to 1790 but I don't have time to read everything
now.



"roughly 4 out of 10 households nationwide have yet to be included in
the constitutionally mandated count that is used to redistribute
congressional seats, Electoral College votes and federal funding among
the states."

What is the time stamp on that lie? It;s not Oct 15 when the census
field count ended, liar. Nice job further discrediting the lying libs
and giving Trump a boost! The four out of ten has to be back in the
very beginning, before census field work was beginning or right as it
started. Why do you stupid libs lie just like Trump?







=

On 10/18/2020 3:59 PM, Bob F wrote:
On 10/18/2020 3:43 PM, micky wrote:
In alt.home.repair, on Sun, 18 Oct 2020 07:23:18 -0700 (PDT), trader_4
wrote:

On Sunday, October 18, 2020 at 2:57:15 AM UTC-4, micky wrote:
For 100 years, Census Day has been April 1.
https://www.census.gov/history/www/t...verview_1.html


For the 2010 census, a new section was added to the Overview page, Key
2010 Census Dates.Â*Â* The other years don't have this, but at least I
know that for 2010

"April 1, 2010 - Census Day. Households are asked to supply data in
their census questionnaire that is accurate as of April 1.

April 30, 2010 - Enumerators begin door-to-door operations to collect
census data from households to follow up with households that either
didn't mail back their form or didn't receive one.

July 30, 2010 - The toll-free telephone assistance line is closed,
ending 2010 census data collection. More than 130,000 interviews were
completed via the toll-free line."

So that's 3 complete months, during which time there were
doorknockers .
Does anyone know how long it was this year.Â*Â* It prob


Not clear from that enumerators were out there for the three full
months.

True, not clear from that but it might have been the full 3 months.Â* I
remember that they would start hiring and training 4 or 6 months in
advance.Â* This year, my friend... I have to ask her again.Â* She also
applied to be a contact tracer for Covid.Â* She took online training for
one or both of them and then didn't hear back for a long time, but
anyhow, the question is, when it says in 2010 "Enumerators begin
door-to-door operations to collect census data" were they really out
there going to people's doors on the last day of April.

I hate to say it but I was depressed and hadn't returned my census form
and somoene called me, someone I knew.Â* If I could remember who it was,
I could and would call him for more details, but I can't remember. Other
than that, I don't know how to find more about this.

This year from what I can tell it was two months, maybe a little less,
starting in early August, ending early Oct.Â* It probably varied a bit by
region of the country.Â* But the real issue here is what percentage was
completed this year versus previous years and if it's substantially
different, does it make any difference in the result.Â* They will
never get
to 100%, there will always be a few percent left.Â* That is then
filled in
using estimates and models based on the 97% or whatever they have.Â* So
if one year they get to 98%, while another year they get to 96%, not
clear
that it really matters.

I agree with all of this, and I don't expect the census to be 100%.

They are saying that they've been to 99% of all the residences in
Maryland, but they did that partly by loosening standards on what is
visiting a home.Â* Used to be, on I forget, the second or third trip, the
doorknocker could talk to neighbors and if they said how many were
living there (even if they were occasinally wrong) itÂ* counted as a
visit.Â* They weakened that to allow it on the first visit.Â* (My friend
went to some places 3 times before finding a resident who was home and
answsed the door, but she's very diligent.Â* She also liked the job, at
least sometimes, from the interesting places she got to go. One was a
house built in the 1800's for the visit by some German king or
something.)

Even though she lives there, she saw a lot of streets she hadn't seen.
OTOH, if I did it, I think t hey would assign me around here and I've
been down almost every street already.

But I digress:

WhatÂ* I don't want isn't for it to be 100% but for it not to favor
Republican areas at the direction of a Republican.Â* I cetainly didn't
suspect H.W.Bush of doing that, as we all know, stumpie has shown plenty
of signs of trying to corrupt the Census.Â* (For others, originnally in
June or so it was the census bureau, his own appointee I suspect, who
wanted it extended that month. Then something made them change their
mind.Â* Maybe someone from a state that was going lose a Repuiblican
district pointed out to them how they could increase Republican
representation by shortening the


At some point, people that refuse to cooperate
or where contact can't be made, where somone can't be found to
provide the
data, another month of pounding on the door isn't going to change the
result.

No one pounds on one door for a month.

Whether it will change depends on how thoroughly they've done it
already.Â* Have they really been back 2 more times? That WAS the
standard.

I think they probably doorknocked for 3 full months in 2010, but we
still don't know how long it was in 2020.

As to the completion date, I read under Herman Hollerith

On the Census site above.Â* Hollerith invented the Hollerith card, the
precursor of what was it called, an IBM card? a rectangle with a corner
missing and little rectangualr punch holes.Â*Â* He got the idea from paper
crds that controlled looms as ealy as 1801, that enabled them to make
complicated patterns in cloth.Â*Â* He started at the Census Bureau, but
later started the company that after he left became IBM.

https://www.census.gov/history/www/c...hollerith.html

Herman Hollerith (1860-1929): Hollerith worked briefly for the Census
Office in the run-up to the 1880 census. This experience, along with
some advice from mentor John Shaw Billings, convinced him that the
Census Office desperately needed a better way to tabulate census data
than hand counting. Hollerith was able to invent a device that did just
that: an electric tabulating machine.....

https://www.census.gov/history/www/i...tabulator.html

1888 Competition
Following the 1880 census, the Census Bureau was collecting more data
than it could tabulate. As a result, the agency held a competition in
1888 to find a more efficient method to process and tabulate data.
Contestants were asked to process 1880 census data from four areas in St
Louis, MO. Whoever captured and processed the data fastest would win a
contract for the 1890 census.....

that the 1880
census counting was completed in 1887.Â* So there is no need to be done
by January 2021.

Census day in every year back to 1930 was April 1
In 1920 it was Jan 1, of all things.
In 1910 it was April 15
In 1900 it iwas June 1

The url above goes back to 1790 but I don't have time to read
everything
now.



"roughly 4 out of 10 households nationwide have yet to be included in
the constitutionally mandated count that is used to redistribute
congressional seats, Electoral College votes and federal funding among
the states."


"Republicans in Congress are signaling that the Census Bureau cannot
take the extra time it has said it needs to count every person living in
the U.S. amid the coronavirus pandemic €” even if that risks leaving some
residents out of the 2020 census.

Rushing to deliver new state-population counts to the president by Dec.
31, and more detailed data to the states by March 31, 2021, as required
by current federal law, could risk severe inaccuracies in the
once-a-decade count, especially among people of color, immigrants, rural
residents and other historically undercounted groups.

With 95 days until the Census Bureau plans to stop tallying the
country's residents at the end of October, roughly 4 out of 10
households nationwide have yet to be included in the constitutionally
mandated count that is used to redistribute congressional seats,
Electoral College votes and federal funding among the states.

Democrats in both the Senate and the House of Representatives have
introduced legislation, including the House Democrats' latest
coronavirus relief bill, that would grant four-month extensions to the
legal deadlines in response to requests in April by the Census Bureau
and the Commerce Department, which oversees the bureau."


That was an older reference.

Below is a much more thorough discussion of what the Repubs are doing to
obstruct the accurate census.

https://www.rollingstone.com/politic...o-fail-202575/

On 10/18/2020 3:58 PM, trader_4 wrote:
On Sunday, October 18, 2020 at 6:43:46 PM UTC-4, micky wrote:
In alt.home.repair, on Sun, 18 Oct 2020 07:23:18 -0700 (PDT), trader_4
wrote:

On Sunday, October 18, 2020 at 2:57:15 AM UTC-4, micky wrote:
For 100 years, Census Day has been April 1.
https://www.census.gov/history/www/t...verview_1.html

For the 2010 census, a new section was added to the Overview page, Key
2010 Census Dates. The other years don't have this, but at least I
know that for 2010

"April 1, 2010 - Census Day. Households are asked to supply data in
their census questionnaire that is accurate as of April 1.

April 30, 2010 - Enumerators begin door-to-door operations to collect
census data from households to follow up with households that either
didn't mail back their form or didn't receive one.

July 30, 2010 - The toll-free telephone assistance line is closed,
ending 2010 census data collection. More than 130,000 interviews were
completed via the toll-free line."

So that's 3 complete months, during which time there were doorknockers .
Does anyone know how long it was this year. It prob


Not clear from that enumerators were out there for the three full months.

True, not clear from that but it might have been the full 3 months.


I
remember that they would start hiring and training 4 or 6 months in
advance. This year, my friend... I have to ask her again. She also
applied to be a contact tracer for Covid. She took online training for
one or both of them and then didn't hear back for a long time, but
anyhow, the question is, when it says in 2010 "Enumerators begin
door-to-door operations to collect census data" were they really out
there going to people's doors on the last day of April.

No, because of Covid it started around early August. But why do they have
to have started in April?




I hate to say it but I was depressed and hadn't returned my census form
and somoene called me, someone I knew. If I could remember who it was,
I could and would call him for more details, but I can't remember. Other
than that, I don't know how to find more about this.
This year from what I can tell it was two months, maybe a little less,
starting in early August, ending early Oct. It probably varied a bit by
region of the country. But the real issue here is what percentage was
completed this year versus previous years and if it's substantially
different, does it make any difference in the result. They will never get
to 100%, there will always be a few percent left. That is then filled in
using estimates and models based on the 97% or whatever they have. So
if one year they get to 98%, while another year they get to 96%, not clear
that it really matters.

I agree with all of this, and I don't expect the census to be 100%.

They are saying that they've been to 99% of all the residences in
Maryland,

I suspect what that said is that 99% is complete, meaning they have census
data for 99%.



but they did that partly by loosening standards on what is
visiting a home. Used to be, on I forget, the second or third trip, the
doorknocker could talk to neighbors and if they said how many were
living there (even if they were occasinally wrong) it counted as a
visit. They weakened that to allow it on the first visit. (My friend
went to some places 3 times before finding a resident who was home and
answsed the door, but she's very diligent. She also liked the job, at
least sometimes, from the interesting places she got to go. One was a
house built in the 1800's for the visit by some German king or
something.)

All that is wrong, AFAIK there is no change in how the census data is recorded.
It's always been that after some number of attempts at an address if they
can't be contacted, then they use proxies, ie a neighbor or landlord.
That's mostly because some people just refuse all attempts, which is why
they just didn't do it online or via mail.


Even though she lives there, she saw a lot of streets she hadn't seen.
OTOH, if I did it, I think t hey would assign me around here and I've
been down almost every street already.

But I digress:

What I don't want isn't for it to be 100% but for it not to favor
Republican areas at the direction of a Republican. I cetainly didn't
suspect H.W.Bush of doing that, as we all know, stumpie has shown plenty
of signs of trying to corrupt the Census. (For others, originnally in
June or so it was the census bureau, his own appointee I suspect, who
wanted it extended that month. Then something made them change their
mind. Maybe someone from a state that was going lose a Repuiblican
district pointed out to them how they could increase Republican
representation by shortening the

There were two issues there. One was ending it early and I agree, that looked
like Trump figuring that illegal aliens and the like would be more resistant
to being counted, so ending it early would count less of them. But the census
has been completed now to a high enough extent that this no longer is a
significant issue.

The other is Trump wants to exclude illegals from the count. I think he's right
on that, it's not what the framers would have intended. On the other hand the
Constitution says all people, and I don't think Trump is likely to prevail in the courts. That is one of of those conservative things, ruling on what the
Constitution says, the letter of the law. If there were some contemporary
discussion at the time showing otherwise, I would be persuaded. But there
isn't, because at the time the US was not being flooded with illegals.






At some point, people that refuse to cooperate
or where contact can't be made, where somone can't be found to provide the
data, another month of pounding on the door isn't going to change the result.

No one pounds on one door for a month.

Whether it will change depends on how thoroughly they've done it
already. Have they really been back 2 more times? That WAS the
standard.

I think they probably doorknocked for 3 full months in 2010, but we
still don't know how long it was in 2020.


As to the completion date, I read under Herman Hollerith

On the Census site above. Hollerith invented the Hollerith card, the
precursor of what was it called, an IBM card? a rectangle with a corner
missing and little rectangualr punch holes. He got the idea from paper
crds that controlled looms as ealy as 1801, that enabled them to make
complicated patterns in cloth. He started at the Census Bureau, but
later started the company that after he left became IBM.

https://www.census.gov/history/www/c...hollerith.html
Herman Hollerith (1860-1929): Hollerith worked briefly for the Census
Office in the run-up to the 1880 census. This experience, along with
some advice from mentor John Shaw Billings, convinced him that the
Census Office desperately needed a better way to tabulate census data
than hand counting. Hollerith was able to invent a device that did just
that: an electric tabulating machine.....

https://www.census.gov/history/www/i...tabulator.html
1888 Competition
Following the 1880 census, the Census Bureau was collecting more data
than it could tabulate. As a result, the agency held a competition in
1888 to find a more efficient method to process and tabulate data.
Contestants were asked to process 1880 census data from four areas in St
Louis, MO. Whoever captured and processed the data fastest would win a
contract for the 1890 census.....

that the 1880
census counting was completed in 1887. So there is no need to be done
by January 2021.

Census day in every year back to 1930 was April 1
In 1920 it was Jan 1, of all things.
In 1910 it was April 15
In 1900 it iwas June 1

The url above goes back to 1790 but I don't have time to read everything
now.


The problem was the large cuts in funding for the census, which resulted
in the the departure of the director of the census, who has not been
replaced by trump. Not enough money, and no director - the recipe for
inaccuracy.

https://www.rollingstone.com/politic...o-fail-202575/

On Sunday, October 18, 2020 at 7:19:52 PM UTC-4, Bob F wrote:
On 10/18/2020 3:58 PM, trader_4 wrote:
On Sunday, October 18, 2020 at 6:43:46 PM UTC-4, micky wrote:
In alt.home.repair, on Sun, 18 Oct 2020 07:23:18 -0700 (PDT), trader_4
wrote:

On Sunday, October 18, 2020 at 2:57:15 AM UTC-4, micky wrote:
For 100 years, Census Day has been April 1.
https://www.census.gov/history/www/t...verview_1.html

For the 2010 census, a new section was added to the Overview page, Key
2010 Census Dates. The other years don't have this, but at least I
know that for 2010

"April 1, 2010 - Census Day. Households are asked to supply data in
their census questionnaire that is accurate as of April 1.

April 30, 2010 - Enumerators begin door-to-door operations to collect
census data from households to follow up with households that either
didn't mail back their form or didn't receive one.

July 30, 2010 - The toll-free telephone assistance line is closed,
ending 2010 census data collection. More than 130,000 interviews were
completed via the toll-free line."

So that's 3 complete months, during which time there were doorknockers .
Does anyone know how long it was this year. It prob


Not clear from that enumerators were out there for the three full months.

True, not clear from that but it might have been the full 3 months.


I
remember that they would start hiring and training 4 or 6 months in
advance. This year, my friend... I have to ask her again. She also
applied to be a contact tracer for Covid. She took online training for
one or both of them and then didn't hear back for a long time, but
anyhow, the question is, when it says in 2010 "Enumerators begin
door-to-door operations to collect census data" were they really out
there going to people's doors on the last day of April.

No, because of Covid it started around early August. But why do they have
to have started in April?




I hate to say it but I was depressed and hadn't returned my census form
and somoene called me, someone I knew. If I could remember who it was,
I could and would call him for more details, but I can't remember. Other
than that, I don't know how to find more about this.
This year from what I can tell it was two months, maybe a little less,
starting in early August, ending early Oct. It probably varied a bit by
region of the country. But the real issue here is what percentage was
completed this year versus previous years and if it's substantially
different, does it make any difference in the result. They will never get
to 100%, there will always be a few percent left. That is then filled in
using estimates and models based on the 97% or whatever they have. So
if one year they get to 98%, while another year they get to 96%, not clear
that it really matters.

I agree with all of this, and I don't expect the census to be 100%.

They are saying that they've been to 99% of all the residences in
Maryland,

I suspect what that said is that 99% is complete, meaning they have census
data for 99%.



but they did that partly by loosening standards on what is
visiting a home. Used to be, on I forget, the second or third trip, the
doorknocker could talk to neighbors and if they said how many were
living there (even if they were occasinally wrong) it counted as a
visit. They weakened that to allow it on the first visit. (My friend
went to some places 3 times before finding a resident who was home and
answsed the door, but she's very diligent. She also liked the job, at
least sometimes, from the interesting places she got to go. One was a
house built in the 1800's for the visit by some German king or
something.)

All that is wrong, AFAIK there is no change in how the census data is recorded.
It's always been that after some number of attempts at an address if they
can't be contacted, then they use proxies, ie a neighbor or landlord.
That's mostly because some people just refuse all attempts, which is why
they just didn't do it online or via mail.


Even though she lives there, she saw a lot of streets she hadn't seen.
OTOH, if I did it, I think t hey would assign me around here and I've
been down almost every street already.

But I digress:

What I don't want isn't for it to be 100% but for it not to favor
Republican areas at the direction of a Republican. I cetainly didn't
suspect H.W.Bush of doing that, as we all know, stumpie has shown plenty
of signs of trying to corrupt the Census. (For others, originnally in
June or so it was the census bureau, his own appointee I suspect, who
wanted it extended that month. Then something made them change their
mind. Maybe someone from a state that was going lose a Repuiblican
district pointed out to them how they could increase Republican
representation by shortening the

There were two issues there. One was ending it early and I agree, that looked
like Trump figuring that illegal aliens and the like would be more resistant
to being counted, so ending it early would count less of them. But the census
has been completed now to a high enough extent that this no longer is a
significant issue.

The other is Trump wants to exclude illegals from the count. I think he's right
on that, it's not what the framers would have intended. On the other hand the
Constitution says all people, and I don't think Trump is likely to prevail in the courts. That is one of of those conservative things, ruling on what the
Constitution says, the letter of the law. If there were some contemporary
discussion at the time showing otherwise, I would be persuaded. But there
isn't, because at the time the US was not being flooded with illegals.






At some point, people that refuse to cooperate
or where contact can't be made, where somone can't be found to provide the
data, another month of pounding on the door isn't going to change the result.

No one pounds on one door for a month.

Whether it will change depends on how thoroughly they've done it
already. Have they really been back 2 more times? That WAS the
standard.

I think they probably doorknocked for 3 full months in 2010, but we
still don't know how long it was in 2020.


As to the completion date, I read under Herman Hollerith

On the Census site above. Hollerith invented the Hollerith card, the
precursor of what was it called, an IBM card? a rectangle with a corner
missing and little rectangualr punch holes. He got the idea from paper
crds that controlled looms as ealy as 1801, that enabled them to make
complicated patterns in cloth. He started at the Census Bureau, but
later started the company that after he left became IBM.

https://www.census.gov/history/www/c...hollerith.html
Herman Hollerith (1860-1929): Hollerith worked briefly for the Census
Office in the run-up to the 1880 census. This experience, along with
some advice from mentor John Shaw Billings, convinced him that the
Census Office desperately needed a better way to tabulate census data
than hand counting. Hollerith was able to invent a device that did just
that: an electric tabulating machine.....

https://www.census.gov/history/www/i...tabulator.html
1888 Competition
Following the 1880 census, the Census Bureau was collecting more data
than it could tabulate. As a result, the agency held a competition in
1888 to find a more efficient method to process and tabulate data.
Contestants were asked to process 1880 census data from four areas in St
Louis, MO. Whoever captured and processed the data fastest would win a
contract for the 1890 census.....

that the 1880
census counting was completed in 1887. So there is no need to be done
by January 2021.

Census day in every year back to 1930 was April 1
In 1920 it was Jan 1, of all things.
In 1910 it was April 15
In 1900 it iwas June 1

The url above goes back to 1790 but I don't have time to read everything
now.


The problem was the large cuts in funding for the census, which resulted
in the the departure of the director of the census, who has not been
replaced by trump. Not enough money, and no director - the recipe for
inaccuracy.

https://www.rollingstone.com/politic...o-fail-202575/

Again, lib lunacy. None of that equates to inaccuracy. The census was
COMPLETED to what, 97%? You liars want to make it sound like it;s 30%.
Keep helping Trump get re-elected.

On Sunday, October 18, 2020 at 7:15:36 PM UTC-4, Bob F wrote:
On 10/18/2020 3:59 PM, Bob F wrote:
On 10/18/2020 3:43 PM, micky wrote:
In alt.home.repair, on Sun, 18 Oct 2020 07:23:18 -0700 (PDT), trader_4
wrote:

On Sunday, October 18, 2020 at 2:57:15 AM UTC-4, micky wrote:
For 100 years, Census Day has been April 1.
https://www.census.gov/history/www/t...verview_1.html


For the 2010 census, a new section was added to the Overview page, Key
2010 Census Dates.Â*Â* The other years don't have this, but at least I
know that for 2010

"April 1, 2010 - Census Day. Households are asked to supply data in
their census questionnaire that is accurate as of April 1.

April 30, 2010 - Enumerators begin door-to-door operations to collect
census data from households to follow up with households that either
didn't mail back their form or didn't receive one.

July 30, 2010 - The toll-free telephone assistance line is closed,
ending 2010 census data collection. More than 130,000 interviews were
completed via the toll-free line."

So that's 3 complete months, during which time there were
doorknockers .
Does anyone know how long it was this year.Â*Â* It prob


Not clear from that enumerators were out there for the three full
months.

True, not clear from that but it might have been the full 3 months.Â* I
remember that they would start hiring and training 4 or 6 months in
advance.Â* This year, my friend... I have to ask her again.Â* She also
applied to be a contact tracer for Covid.Â* She took online training for
one or both of them and then didn't hear back for a long time, but
anyhow, the question is, when it says in 2010 "Enumerators begin
door-to-door operations to collect census data" were they really out
there going to people's doors on the last day of April.

I hate to say it but I was depressed and hadn't returned my census form
and somoene called me, someone I knew.Â* If I could remember who it was,
I could and would call him for more details, but I can't remember. Other
than that, I don't know how to find more about this.

This year from what I can tell it was two months, maybe a little less,
starting in early August, ending early Oct.Â* It probably varied a bit by
region of the country.Â* But the real issue here is what percentage was
completed this year versus previous years and if it's substantially
different, does it make any difference in the result.Â* They will
never get
to 100%, there will always be a few percent left.Â* That is then
filled in
using estimates and models based on the 97% or whatever they have.Â* So
if one year they get to 98%, while another year they get to 96%, not
clear
that it really matters.

I agree with all of this, and I don't expect the census to be 100%.

They are saying that they've been to 99% of all the residences in
Maryland, but they did that partly by loosening standards on what is
visiting a home.Â* Used to be, on I forget, the second or third trip, the
doorknocker could talk to neighbors and if they said how many were
living there (even if they were occasinally wrong) itÂ* counted as a
visit.Â* They weakened that to allow it on the first visit.Â* (My friend
went to some places 3 times before finding a resident who was home and
answsed the door, but she's very diligent.Â* She also liked the job, at
least sometimes, from the interesting places she got to go. One was a
house built in the 1800's for the visit by some German king or
something.)

Even though she lives there, she saw a lot of streets she hadn't seen.
OTOH, if I did it, I think t hey would assign me around here and I've
been down almost every street already.

But I digress:

WhatÂ* I don't want isn't for it to be 100% but for it not to favor
Republican areas at the direction of a Republican.Â* I cetainly didn't
suspect H.W.Bush of doing that, as we all know, stumpie has shown plenty
of signs of trying to corrupt the Census.Â* (For others, originnally in
June or so it was the census bureau, his own appointee I suspect, who
wanted it extended that month. Then something made them change their
mind.Â* Maybe someone from a state that was going lose a Repuiblican
district pointed out to them how they could increase Republican
representation by shortening the


At some point, people that refuse to cooperate
or where contact can't be made, where somone can't be found to
provide the
data, another month of pounding on the door isn't going to change the
result.

No one pounds on one door for a month.

Whether it will change depends on how thoroughly they've done it
already.Â* Have they really been back 2 more times? That WAS the
standard.

I think they probably doorknocked for 3 full months in 2010, but we
still don't know how long it was in 2020.

As to the completion date, I read under Herman Hollerith

On the Census site above.Â* Hollerith invented the Hollerith card, the
precursor of what was it called, an IBM card? a rectangle with a corner
missing and little rectangualr punch holes.Â*Â* He got the idea from paper
crds that controlled looms as ealy as 1801, that enabled them to make
complicated patterns in cloth.Â*Â* He started at the Census Bureau, but
later started the company that after he left became IBM.

https://www.census.gov/history/www/c...hollerith.html

Herman Hollerith (1860-1929): Hollerith worked briefly for the Census
Office in the run-up to the 1880 census. This experience, along with
some advice from mentor John Shaw Billings, convinced him that the
Census Office desperately needed a better way to tabulate census data
than hand counting. Hollerith was able to invent a device that did just
that: an electric tabulating machine.....

https://www.census.gov/history/www/i...tabulator.html

1888 Competition
Following the 1880 census, the Census Bureau was collecting more data
than it could tabulate. As a result, the agency held a competition in
1888 to find a more efficient method to process and tabulate data.
Contestants were asked to process 1880 census data from four areas in St
Louis, MO. Whoever captured and processed the data fastest would win a
contract for the 1890 census.....

that the 1880
census counting was completed in 1887.Â* So there is no need to be done
by January 2021.

Census day in every year back to 1930 was April 1
In 1920 it was Jan 1, of all things.
In 1910 it was April 15
In 1900 it iwas June 1

The url above goes back to 1790 but I don't have time to read
everything
now.



"roughly 4 out of 10 households nationwide have yet to be included in
the constitutionally mandated count that is used to redistribute
congressional seats, Electoral College votes and federal funding among
the states."


"Republicans in Congress are signaling that the Census Bureau cannot
take the extra time it has said it needs to count every person living in
the U.S. amid the coronavirus pandemic €” even if that risks leaving some
residents out of the 2020 census.

Rushing to deliver new state-population counts to the president by Dec.
31, and more detailed data to the states by March 31, 2021, as required
by current federal law, could risk severe inaccuracies in the
once-a-decade count, especially among people of color, immigrants, rural
residents and other historically undercounted groups.

With 95 days until the Census Bureau plans to stop tallying the
country's residents at the end of October, roughly 4 out of 10
households nationwide have yet to be included in the constitutionally
mandated count that is used to redistribute congressional seats,
Electoral College votes and federal funding among the states.

Democrats in both the Senate and the House of Representatives have
introduced legislation, including the House Democrats' latest
coronavirus relief bill, that would grant four-month extensions to the
legal deadlines in response to requests in April by the Census Bureau
and the Commerce Department, which oversees the bureau."


That was an older reference.


I see, but you posted it here now as if it was current, then you complain
about Trump lying, go figure. Nice job, lying Bob!

On 10/18/2020 4:34 PM, trader_4 wrote:
On Sunday, October 18, 2020 at 7:15:36 PM UTC-4, Bob F wrote:
On 10/18/2020 3:59 PM, Bob F wrote:
On 10/18/2020 3:43 PM, micky wrote:
In alt.home.repair, on Sun, 18 Oct 2020 07:23:18 -0700 (PDT), trader_4
wrote:

On Sunday, October 18, 2020 at 2:57:15 AM UTC-4, micky wrote:
For 100 years, Census Day has been April 1.
https://www.census.gov/history/www/t...verview_1.html


For the 2010 census, a new section was added to the Overview page, Key
2010 Census Dates.Â*Â* The other years don't have this, but at least I
know that for 2010

"April 1, 2010 - Census Day. Households are asked to supply data in
their census questionnaire that is accurate as of April 1.

April 30, 2010 - Enumerators begin door-to-door operations to collect
census data from households to follow up with households that either
didn't mail back their form or didn't receive one.

July 30, 2010 - The toll-free telephone assistance line is closed,
ending 2010 census data collection. More than 130,000 interviews were
completed via the toll-free line."

So that's 3 complete months, during which time there were
doorknockers .
Does anyone know how long it was this year.Â*Â* It prob


Not clear from that enumerators were out there for the three full
months.

True, not clear from that but it might have been the full 3 months.Â* I
remember that they would start hiring and training 4 or 6 months in
advance.Â* This year, my friend... I have to ask her again.Â* She also
applied to be a contact tracer for Covid.Â* She took online training for
one or both of them and then didn't hear back for a long time, but
anyhow, the question is, when it says in 2010 "Enumerators begin
door-to-door operations to collect census data" were they really out
there going to people's doors on the last day of April.

I hate to say it but I was depressed and hadn't returned my census form
and somoene called me, someone I knew.Â* If I could remember who it was,
I could and would call him for more details, but I can't remember. Other
than that, I don't know how to find more about this.

This year from what I can tell it was two months, maybe a little less,
starting in early August, ending early Oct.Â* It probably varied a bit by
region of the country.Â* But the real issue here is what percentage was
completed this year versus previous years and if it's substantially
different, does it make any difference in the result.Â* They will
never get
to 100%, there will always be a few percent left.Â* That is then
filled in
using estimates and models based on the 97% or whatever they have.Â* So
if one year they get to 98%, while another year they get to 96%, not
clear
that it really matters.

I agree with all of this, and I don't expect the census to be 100%.

They are saying that they've been to 99% of all the residences in
Maryland, but they did that partly by loosening standards on what is
visiting a home.Â* Used to be, on I forget, the second or third trip, the
doorknocker could talk to neighbors and if they said how many were
living there (even if they were occasinally wrong) itÂ* counted as a
visit.Â* They weakened that to allow it on the first visit.Â* (My friend
went to some places 3 times before finding a resident who was home and
answsed the door, but she's very diligent.Â* She also liked the job, at
least sometimes, from the interesting places she got to go. One was a
house built in the 1800's for the visit by some German king or
something.)

Even though she lives there, she saw a lot of streets she hadn't seen.
OTOH, if I did it, I think t hey would assign me around here and I've
been down almost every street already.

But I digress:

WhatÂ* I don't want isn't for it to be 100% but for it not to favor
Republican areas at the direction of a Republican.Â* I cetainly didn't
suspect H.W.Bush of doing that, as we all know, stumpie has shown plenty
of signs of trying to corrupt the Census.Â* (For others, originnally in
June or so it was the census bureau, his own appointee I suspect, who
wanted it extended that month. Then something made them change their
mind.Â* Maybe someone from a state that was going lose a Repuiblican
district pointed out to them how they could increase Republican
representation by shortening the


At some point, people that refuse to cooperate
or where contact can't be made, where somone can't be found to
provide the
data, another month of pounding on the door isn't going to change the
result.

No one pounds on one door for a month.

Whether it will change depends on how thoroughly they've done it
already.Â* Have they really been back 2 more times? That WAS the
standard.

I think they probably doorknocked for 3 full months in 2010, but we
still don't know how long it was in 2020.

As to the completion date, I read under Herman Hollerith

On the Census site above.Â* Hollerith invented the Hollerith card, the
precursor of what was it called, an IBM card? a rectangle with a corner
missing and little rectangualr punch holes.Â*Â* He got the idea from paper
crds that controlled looms as ealy as 1801, that enabled them to make
complicated patterns in cloth.Â*Â* He started at the Census Bureau, but
later started the company that after he left became IBM.

https://www.census.gov/history/www/c...hollerith.html

Herman Hollerith (1860-1929): Hollerith worked briefly for the Census
Office in the run-up to the 1880 census. This experience, along with
some advice from mentor John Shaw Billings, convinced him that the
Census Office desperately needed a better way to tabulate census data
than hand counting. Hollerith was able to invent a device that did just
that: an electric tabulating machine.....

https://www.census.gov/history/www/i...tabulator.html

1888 Competition
Following the 1880 census, the Census Bureau was collecting more data
than it could tabulate. As a result, the agency held a competition in
1888 to find a more efficient method to process and tabulate data.
Contestants were asked to process 1880 census data from four areas in St
Louis, MO. Whoever captured and processed the data fastest would win a
contract for the 1890 census.....

that the 1880
census counting was completed in 1887.Â* So there is no need to be done
by January 2021.

Census day in every year back to 1930 was April 1
In 1920 it was Jan 1, of all things.
In 1910 it was April 15
In 1900 it iwas June 1

The url above goes back to 1790 but I don't have time to read
everything
now.



"roughly 4 out of 10 households nationwide have yet to be included in
the constitutionally mandated count that is used to redistribute
congressional seats, Electoral College votes and federal funding among
the states."


"Republicans in Congress are signaling that the Census Bureau cannot
take the extra time it has said it needs to count every person living in
the U.S. amid the coronavirus pandemic €” even if that risks leaving some
residents out of the 2020 census.

Rushing to deliver new state-population counts to the president by Dec.
31, and more detailed data to the states by March 31, 2021, as required
by current federal law, could risk severe inaccuracies in the
once-a-decade count, especially among people of color, immigrants, rural
residents and other historically undercounted groups.

With 95 days until the Census Bureau plans to stop tallying the
country's residents at the end of October, roughly 4 out of 10
households nationwide have yet to be included in the constitutionally
mandated count that is used to redistribute congressional seats,
Electoral College votes and federal funding among the states.

Democrats in both the Senate and the House of Representatives have
introduced legislation, including the House Democrats' latest
coronavirus relief bill, that would grant four-month extensions to the
legal deadlines in response to requests in April by the Census Bureau
and the Commerce Department, which oversees the bureau."


That was an older reference.


I see, but you posted it here now as if it was current, then you complain
about Trump lying, go figure. Nice job, lying Bob!

I corrected it as soon as I realized it was older. No lie involved.

On 10/18/2020 7:20 PM, Bob F wrote:
On 10/18/2020 3:58 PM, trader_4 wrote:
On Sunday, October 18, 2020 at 6:43:46 PM UTC-4, micky wrote:
In alt.home.repair, on Sun, 18 Oct 2020 07:23:18 -0700 (PDT), trader_4
wrote:

On Sunday, October 18, 2020 at 2:57:15 AM UTC-4, micky wrote:
For 100 years, Census Day has been April 1.
https://www.census.gov/history/www/t...verview_1.html

For the 2010 census, a new section was added to the Overview page, Key
2010 Census Dates.Â*Â* The other years don't have this, but at least I
know that for 2010

"April 1, 2010 - Census Day. Households are asked to supply data in
their census questionnaire that is accurate as of April 1.

April 30, 2010 - Enumerators begin door-to-door operations to collect
census data from households to follow up with households that either
didn't mail back their form or didn't receive one.

July 30, 2010 - The toll-free telephone assistance line is closed,
ending 2010 census data collection. More than 130,000 interviews were
completed via the toll-free line."

So that's 3 complete months, during which time there were doorknockers .
Does anyone know how long it was this year.Â*Â* It prob


Not clear from that enumerators were out there for the three full months.

True, not clear from that but it might have been the full 3 months.


Â*Â* I
remember that they would start hiring and training 4 or 6 months in
advance.Â* This year, my friend... I have to ask her again. She also
applied to be a contact tracer for Covid.Â* She took online training for
one or both of them and then didn't hear back for a long time, but
anyhow, the question is, when it says in 2010 "Enumerators begin
door-to-door operations to collect census data" were they really out
there going to people's doors on the last day of April.

No, because of Covid it started around early August.Â* But why do they have
to have started in April?



I hate to say it but I was depressed and hadn't returned my census form
and somoene called me, someone I knew.Â* If I could remember who it was,
I could and would call him for more details, but I can't remember. Other
than that, I don't know how to find more about this.
This year from what I can tell it was two months, maybe a little less,
starting in early August, ending early Oct.Â* It probably varied a bit by
region of the country.Â* But the real issue here is what percentage was
completed this year versus previous years and if it's substantially
different, does it make any difference in the result.Â* They will never get
to 100%, there will always be a few percent left.Â* That is then filled in
using estimates and models based on the 97% or whatever they have.Â* So
if one year they get to 98%, while another year they get to 96%, not clear
that it really matters.

I agree with all of this, and I don't expect the census to be 100%.

They are saying that they've been to 99% of all the residences in
Maryland,

I suspect what that said is that 99% is complete, meaning they have census
data for 99%.



but they did that partly by loosening standards on what is
visiting a home.Â* Used to be, on I forget, the second or third trip, the
doorknocker could talk to neighbors and if they said how many were
living there (even if they were occasinally wrong) itÂ* counted as a
visit.Â* They weakened that to allow it on the first visit. (My friend
went to some places 3 times before finding a resident who was home and
answsed the door, but she's very diligent.Â* She also liked the job, at
least sometimes, from the interesting places she got to go. One was a
house built in the 1800's for the visit by some German king or
something.)

All that is wrong, AFAIK there is no change in how the census data is recorded.
It's always been that after some number of attempts at an address if they
can't be contacted, then they use proxies, ie a neighbor or landlord.
That's mostly because some people just refuse all attempts, which is why
they just didn't do it online or via mail.


Even though she lives there, she saw a lot of streets she hadn't seen.
OTOH, if I did it, I think t hey would assign me around here and I've
been down almost every street already.

But I digress:

WhatÂ* I don't want isn't for it to be 100% but for it not to favor
Republican areas at the direction of a Republican.Â* I cetainly didn't
suspect H.W.Bush of doing that, as we all know, stumpie has shown plenty
of signs of trying to corrupt the Census.Â* (For others, originnally in
June or so it was the census bureau, his own appointee I suspect, who
wanted it extended that month. Then something made them change their
mind.Â* Maybe someone from a state that was going lose a Repuiblican
district pointed out to them how they could increase Republican
representation by shortening the

There were two issues there.Â* One was ending it early and I agree, that looked
like Trump figuring that illegal aliens and the like would be more resistant
to being counted, so ending it early would count less of them. But the census
has been completed now to a high enough extent that this no longer is a
significant issue.

The other is Trump wants to exclude illegals from the count.Â* I think he's right
on that, it's not what the framers would have intended.Â* On the other hand the
Constitution says all people, and I don't think Trump is likely to prevail in the courts.Â* That is one of of those conservative things, ruling on what the
Constitution says, the letter of the law.Â* If there were some contemporary
discussion at the time showing otherwise, I would be persuaded. But there
isn't, because at the time the US was not being flooded with illegals.






At some point, people that refuse to cooperate
or where contact can't be made, where somone can't be found to provide the
data, another month of pounding on the door isn't going to change the result.

No one pounds on one door for a month.

Whether it will change depends on how thoroughly they've done it
already.Â* Have they really been back 2 more times? That WAS the
standard.

I think they probably doorknocked for 3 full months in 2010, but we
still don't know how long it was in 2020.

As to the completion date, I read under Herman Hollerith

On the Census site above.Â* Hollerith invented the Hollerith card, the
precursor of what was it called, an IBM card? a rectangle with a corner
missing and little rectangualr punch holes.Â*Â* He got the idea from paper
crds that controlled looms as ealy as 1801, that enabled them to make
complicated patterns in cloth.Â*Â* He started at the Census Bureau, but
later started the company that after he left became IBM.

https://www.census.gov/history/www/c...hollerith.html
Herman Hollerith (1860-1929): Hollerith worked briefly for the Census
Office in the run-up to the 1880 census. This experience, along with
some advice from mentor John Shaw Billings, convinced him that the
Census Office desperately needed a better way to tabulate census data
than hand counting. Hollerith was able to invent a device that did just
that: an electric tabulating machine.....

https://www.census.gov/history/www/i...tabulator.html
1888 Competition
Following the 1880 census, the Census Bureau was collecting more data
than it could tabulate. As a result, the agency held a competition in
1888 to find a more efficient method to process and tabulate data.
Contestants were asked to process 1880 census data from four areas in St
Louis, MO. Whoever captured and processed the data fastest would win a
contract for the 1890 census.....

that the 1880
census counting was completed in 1887.Â* So there is no need to be done
by January 2021.

Census day in every year back to 1930 was April 1
In 1920 it was Jan 1, of all things.
In 1910 it was April 15
In 1900 it iwas June 1

The url above goes back to 1790 but I don't have time to read everything
now.


The problem was the large cuts in funding for the census, which resulted in the the departure of the director of the census, who has not been replaced by trump. Not enough money, and no director - the recipe for inaccuracy.

https://www.rollingstone.com/politic...o-fail-202575/


The problem is that you can't get a democrat to fill out a census form.Â* Maybe they are too busy filling out fraudulent election ballots.Â* LOL

--
Demolitioncrats are destroying America!

In alt.home.repair, on Sun, 18 Oct 2020 15:58:17 -0700 (PDT), trader_4
wrote:


I
remember that they would start hiring and training 4 or 6 months in
advance. This year, my friend... I have to ask her again. She also
applied to be a contact tracer for Covid. She took online training for
one or both of them and then didn't hear back for a long time, but
anyhow, the question is, when it says in 2010 "Enumerators begin
door-to-door operations to collect census data" were they really out
there going to people's doors on the last day of April.

I'm talking about 2010 here. You suggested "above" they weren't ready to
go on the first day.

No, because of Covid it started around early August. But why do they have
to have started in April?

Question of fact about 2010.



I hate to say it but I was depressed and hadn't returned my census form
and somoene called me, someone I knew. If I could remember who it was,
I could and would call him for more details, but I can't remember. Other
than that, I don't know how to find more about this.
This year from what I can tell it was two months, maybe a little less,
starting in early August, ending early Oct. It probably varied a bit by
region of the country. But the real issue here is what percentage was
completed this year versus previous years and if it's substantially
different, does it make any difference in the result. They will never get
to 100%, there will always be a few percent left. That is then filled in
using estimates and models based on the 97% or whatever they have. So
if one year they get to 98%, while another year they get to 96%, not clear
that it really matters.

I agree with all of this, and I don't expect the census to be 100%.

They are saying that they've been to 99% of all the residences in
Maryland,

I suspect what that said is that 99% is complete, meaning they have census
data for 99%.

In Maryland I believe they said what I said.


but they did that partly by loosening standards on what is
visiting a home. Used to be, on I forget, the second or third trip, the
doorknocker could talk to neighbors and if they said how many were
living there (even if they were occasinally wrong) it counted as a
visit. They weakened that to allow it on the first visit. (My friend
went to some places 3 times before finding a resident who was home and
answsed the door, but she's very diligent. She also liked the job, at
least sometimes, from the interesting places she got to go. One was a
house built in the 1800's for the visit by some German king or
something.)

All that is wrong, AFAIK there is no change in how the census data is recorded.
It's always been that after some number of attempts at an address if they
can't be contacted, then they use proxies, ie a neighbor or landlord.

No, it's not wrong. The number of required visits has been lowered.

That's mostly because some people just refuse all attempts, which is why
they just didn't do it online or via mail.

No. They often have sucess on later visits when they don't on the first
or on the 2nd.


Even though she lives there, she saw a lot of streets she hadn't seen.
OTOH, if I did it, I think t hey would assign me around here and I've
been down almost every street already.

But I digress:

What I don't want isn't for it to be 100% but for it not to favor
Republican areas at the direction of a Republican. I cetainly didn't
suspect H.W.Bush of doing that, as we all know, stumpie has shown plenty
of signs of trying to corrupt the Census. (For others, originnally in
June or so it was the census bureau, his own appointee I suspect, who
wanted it extended that month. Then something made them change their
mind. Maybe someone from a state that was going lose a Repuiblican
district pointed out to them how they could increase Republican
representation by shortening the

There were two issues there. One was ending it early and I agree, that looked
like Trump figuring that illegal aliens and the like would be more resistant
to being counted, so ending it early would count less of them. But the census
has been completed now to a high enough extent that this no longer is a
significant issue.

It's been completed to a high enough extent when they spend as much time
doorknocking as they did in the past, unless one can show a convincing
reason why less doorknocking is not needed. And I must have mentined
in this thread or the other how even in 10, maybe 20 or moe of the days
the census bureau says they were working, they were winding down
instead, more than once. Before Sept 30 and the entire 15 days of
Octobter. and those days count only partially,


The other is Trump wants to exclude illegals from the count. I think he's right
on that, it's not what the framers would have intended. On the other hand the

Not only that, none of the census questions say who is an alien and who
is not, who is illegal and who is not. They have an emergency hearing
before the USSC to get permission to exclude illegals but they have no
bovious way to know who they are, and if, IF, there is an indirect way
it will take a long time and will be inaccrate. I hope the SC justices
ridicule the admin lawyer or his client, but they probably won't


Constitution says all people, and I don't think Trump is likely to prevail in the courts. That is one of of those conservative things, ruling on what the
Constitution says, the letter of the law. If there were some contemporary
discussion at the time showing otherwise, I would be persuaded. But there

AIUI at the time, no one was in the country illegally. There were no
rules against entering, no Ellis Island, no Castle Clinton (well there
was, but it was a defense implacemnet, not immigration). Some of the
news stories say that we haven't excluded illegals for 220 years, and
I'm pretty sure they're sincere when they say that, but none existed for
about a century. Maybe the Chinese Exclusion Act of 1882 created the
first ones, assuming some excluded Chinese managed to get in anyhow.
Was there anything earlier?

No, 1875, "Building on the 1875 Page Act, which banned Chinese women
from immigrating to the United States," assuming some Chinese women got
in anyhow, and some probably did.

But someone else writes "The Chinese Exclusion Act of 1882 was the first
significant law restricting immigration into the United States." so
manybe the rule against women didn't apply much. After all, it's
usually men who travel looking for work.

isn't, because at the time the US was not being flooded with illegals.


Mickey



At some point, people that refuse to cooperate
or where contact can't be made, where somone can't be found to provide the
data, another month of pounding on the door isn't going to change the result.

No one pounds on one door for a month.

Whether it will change depends on how thoroughly they've done it
already. Have they really been back 2 more times? That WAS the
standard.

I think they probably doorknocked for 3 full months in 2010, but we
still don't know how long it was in 2020.


As to the completion date, I read under Herman Hollerith

On the Census site above. Hollerith invented the Hollerith card, the
precursor of what was it called, an IBM card? a rectangle with a corner
missing and little rectangualr punch holes. He got the idea from paper
crds that controlled looms as ealy as 1801, that enabled them to make
complicated patterns in cloth. He started at the Census Bureau, but
later started the company that after he left became IBM.

https://www.census.gov/history/www/c...hollerith.html
Herman Hollerith (1860-1929): Hollerith worked briefly for the Census
Office in the run-up to the 1880 census. This experience, along with
some advice from mentor John Shaw Billings, convinced him that the
Census Office desperately needed a better way to tabulate census data
than hand counting. Hollerith was able to invent a device that did just
that: an electric tabulating machine.....

https://www.census.gov/history/www/i...tabulator.html
1888 Competition
Following the 1880 census, the Census Bureau was collecting more data
than it could tabulate. As a result, the agency held a competition in
1888 to find a more efficient method to process and tabulate data.
Contestants were asked to process 1880 census data from four areas in St
Louis, MO. Whoever captured and processed the data fastest would win a
contract for the 1890 census.....

that the 1880
census counting was completed in 1887. So there is no need to be done
by January 2021.

Census day in every year back to 1930 was April 1
In 1920 it was Jan 1, of all things.
In 1910 it was April 15
In 1900 it iwas June 1

The url above goes back to 1790 but I don't have time to read everything
now.

In alt.home.repair, on Sun, 18 Oct 2020 16:32:55 -0700 (PDT), trader_4
wrote:



The problem was the large cuts in funding for the census, which resulted
in the the departure of the director of the census, who has not been
replaced by trump. Not enough money, and no director - the recipe for
inaccuracy.

https://www.rollingstone.com/politic...o-fail-202575/

Again, lib lunacy. None of that equates to inaccuracy. The census was
COMPLETED to what, 97%? You liars want to make it sound like it;s 30%.
Keep helping Trump get re-elected.


Even if Bob and I and all the liberals are wrong about the census, it
doesn't help stumpie get re-elected. Do you think his voters or the
undecided worry about the census?

In alt.home.repair, on Mon, 19 Oct 2020 04:20:12 -0400, micky
wrote:

In alt.home.repair, on Sun, 18 Oct 2020 15:58:17 -0700 (PDT), trader_4
wrote:

I said:

I agree with all of this, and I don't expect the census to be 100%.

They are saying that they've been to 99% of all the residences in
Maryland,

I suspect what that said is that 99% is complete, meaning they have census
data for 99%.

In Maryland I believe they said what I said.

It's not necessary to give support for what I said, because I'm sure
every one believes me, but I came across it in my reading.

While sometimes some people from the Census talked about 99% complete,
at other times, including the case I described in Md, in other cases
they talked about boing to 99% of the residences. As he

https://www.washingtonpost.com/natio...c91_story.html

By Mike Schneider?|?AP
September 21, 2020 at 10:40 a.m. EDT

'So far, more than 95% of households had been counted. The Census Bureau
has a goal of reaching 99% of households.

The bureau doesn’t have a plan if it doesn’t reach that 99% goal, the
Inspector General report said, and the sped-up data processing plan
after field operations end “poses a myriad of risks to accuracy and
completeness.”'


One of the two hearings on this matter was in Maryland, the other in San
Jose, Cal.

In alt.home.repair, on Sun, 18 Oct 2020 16:41:27 -0700, Bob F
wrote:


"roughly 4 out of 10 households nationwide have yet to be included in
the constitutionally mandated count that is used to redistribute
congressional seats, Electoral College votes and federal funding among
the states."


"Republicans in Congress are signaling that the Census Bureau cannot
take the extra time it has said it needs to count every person living in
the U.S. amid the coronavirus pandemic €” even if that risks leaving some
residents out of the 2020 census.

Rushing to deliver new state-population counts to the president by Dec.
31, and more detailed data to the states by March 31, 2021, as required
by current federal law, could risk severe inaccuracies in the
once-a-decade count, especially among people of color, immigrants, rural
residents and other historically undercounted groups.

With 95 days until the Census Bureau plans to stop tallying the
country's residents at the end of October, roughly 4 out of 10
households nationwide have yet to be included in the constitutionally
mandated count that is used to redistribute congressional seats,
Electoral College votes and federal funding among the states.

Democrats in both the Senate and the House of Representatives have
introduced legislation, including the House Democrats' latest
coronavirus relief bill, that would grant four-month extensions to the
legal deadlines in response to requests in April by the Census Bureau
and the Commerce Department, which oversees the bureau."


That was an older reference.


I see, but you posted it here now as if it was current, then you complain
about Trump lying, go figure. Nice job, lying Bob!

I corrected it as soon as I realized it was older. No lie involved.

Not only that, his excerpt contains "With 95 days until the Census
Bureau plans to stop tallying the country's residents at the end of
October". Anyone who knows the calendar should be able to figure out
when it was written (about June 26). Anyone who doesn't know the
calendar should be able to figure out it was written 95 days before the
census was scheduled to end. No lying involved.

In alt.home.repair, on Sun, 18 Oct 2020 16:41:27 -0700, Bob F
wrote:


"roughly 4 out of 10 households nationwide have yet to be included in
the constitutionally mandated count that is used to redistribute
congressional seats, Electoral College votes and federal funding among
the states."


"Republicans in Congress are signaling that the Census Bureau cannot
take the extra time it has said it needs to count every person living in
the U.S. amid the coronavirus pandemic €” even if that risks leaving some
residents out of the 2020 census.

Rushing to deliver new state-population counts to the president by Dec.
31, and more detailed data to the states by March 31, 2021, as required
by current federal law, could risk severe inaccuracies in the
once-a-decade count, especially among people of color, immigrants, rural
residents and other historically undercounted groups.

With 95 days until the Census Bureau plans to stop tallying the
country's residents at the end of October, roughly 4 out of 10
households nationwide have yet to be included in the constitutionally
mandated count that is used to redistribute congressional seats,
Electoral College votes and federal funding among the states.

Democrats in both the Senate and the House of Representatives have
introduced legislation, including the House Democrats' latest
coronavirus relief bill, that would grant four-month extensions to the
legal deadlines in response to requests in April by the Census Bureau
and the Commerce Department, which oversees the bureau."


That was an older reference.


I see, but you posted it here now as if it was current, then you complain
about Trump lying, go figure. Nice job, lying Bob!

I corrected it as soon as I realized it was older. No lie involved.

Not only that, his excerpt contains "With 95 days until the Census
Bureau plans to stop tallying the country's residents at the end of
October". Anyone who knows the calendar should be able to figure out
when it was written (about JULY JULY JULY 26).

Anyone who doesn't know the calendar should be able to figure out it was
written 95 days before the census was scheduled to end. No lying
involved.

On Monday, October 19, 2020 at 4:23:28 AM UTC-4, micky wrote:
In alt.home.repair, on Sun, 18 Oct 2020 16:32:55 -0700 (PDT), trader_4
wrote:



The problem was the large cuts in funding for the census, which resulted
in the the departure of the director of the census, who has not been
replaced by trump. Not enough money, and no director - the recipe for
inaccuracy.

https://www.rollingstone.com/politic...o-fail-202575/

Again, lib lunacy. None of that equates to inaccuracy. The census was
COMPLETED to what, 97%? You liars want to make it sound like it;s 30%.
Keep helping Trump get re-elected.


Even if Bob and I and all the liberals are wrong about the census, it
doesn't help stumpie get re-elected. Do you think his voters or the
undecided worry about the census?

I don't see anyone except you few worried about the census. Months ago,
when it seemed like it might not be able to be completed by the date that
team Trump accelerated by a month, there was some concern. But even then
the Democrats in Congress didn't really try to do much about it. And now
from what I've seen it looks like it has been completed to about the same
conclusion as previous censuses.

On Monday, October 19, 2020 at 4:21:26 AM UTC-4, micky wrote:
In alt.home.repair, on Sun, 18 Oct 2020 15:58:17 -0700 (PDT), trader_4
wrote:


I
remember that they would start hiring and training 4 or 6 months in
advance. This year, my friend... I have to ask her again. She also
applied to be a contact tracer for Covid. She took online training for
one or both of them and then didn't hear back for a long time, but
anyhow, the question is, when it says in 2010 "Enumerators begin
door-to-door operations to collect census data" were they really out
there going to people's doors on the last day of April.

I'm talking about 2010 here. You suggested "above" they weren't ready to
go on the first day.

They would have started around that time this year, but it was put off
because of Covid.






No, because of Covid it started around early August. But why do they have
to have started in April?

Question of fact about 2010.



I hate to say it but I was depressed and hadn't returned my census form
and somoene called me, someone I knew. If I could remember who it was,
I could and would call him for more details, but I can't remember. Other
than that, I don't know how to find more about this.
This year from what I can tell it was two months, maybe a little less,
starting in early August, ending early Oct. It probably varied a bit by
region of the country. But the real issue here is what percentage was
completed this year versus previous years and if it's substantially
different, does it make any difference in the result. They will never get
to 100%, there will always be a few percent left. That is then filled in
using estimates and models based on the 97% or whatever they have. So
if one year they get to 98%, while another year they get to 96%, not clear
that it really matters.

I agree with all of this, and I don't expect the census to be 100%.

They are saying that they've been to 99% of all the residences in
Maryland,

I suspect what that said is that 99% is complete, meaning they have census
data for 99%.

In Maryland I believe they said what I said.


but they did that partly by loosening standards on what is
visiting a home. Used to be, on I forget, the second or third trip, the
doorknocker could talk to neighbors and if they said how many were
living there (even if they were occasinally wrong) it counted as a
visit. They weakened that to allow it on the first visit. (My friend
went to some places 3 times before finding a resident who was home and
answsed the door, but she's very diligent. She also liked the job, at
least sometimes, from the interesting places she got to go. One was a
house built in the 1800's for the visit by some German king or
something.)

All that is wrong, AFAIK there is no change in how the census data is recorded.
It's always been that after some number of attempts at an address if they
can't be contacted, then they use proxies, ie a neighbor or landlord.

No, it's not wrong. The number of required visits has been lowered.

You have a cite for that?





That's mostly because some people just refuse all attempts, which is why
they just didn't do it online or via mail.

No. They often have sucess on later visits when they don't on the first
or on the 2nd.


Even though she lives there, she saw a lot of streets she hadn't seen.
OTOH, if I did it, I think t hey would assign me around here and I've
been down almost every street already.

But I digress:

What I don't want isn't for it to be 100% but for it not to favor
Republican areas at the direction of a Republican. I cetainly didn't
suspect H.W.Bush of doing that, as we all know, stumpie has shown plenty
of signs of trying to corrupt the Census. (For others, originnally in
June or so it was the census bureau, his own appointee I suspect, who
wanted it extended that month. Then something made them change their
mind. Maybe someone from a state that was going lose a Repuiblican
district pointed out to them how they could increase Republican
representation by shortening the

There were two issues there. One was ending it early and I agree, that looked
like Trump figuring that illegal aliens and the like would be more resistant
to being counted, so ending it early would count less of them. But the census
has been completed now to a high enough extent that this no longer is a
significant issue.

It's been completed to a high enough extent when they spend as much time
doorknocking as they did in the past,

It's ridiculous to base completion success on the number of door knocking
attempts as opposed to the completion numbers. Ahd it;s not just door
knocking, the census has sent mailer after mailer to the the addresses
that have not responded.




unless one can show a convincing
reason why less doorknocking is not needed. And I must have mentined
in this thread or the other how even in 10, maybe 20 or moe of the days
the census bureau says they were working, they were winding down
instead, more than once. Before Sept 30 and the entire 15 days of
Octobter. and those days count only partially,

It's all irrelevant. What is relevant is what percent COMPLETION they
achieved this year versus previous years and from what I've seen, it
looks about the same. Also factor in that Covid made this year much harder,
so a number even close to prior years is a tremendous success. And you
don't need 100%, like in all years, they then use statistical modeling to
fill in what's missing because people will not comply.






The other is Trump wants to exclude illegals from the count. I think he's right
on that, it's not what the framers would have intended. On the other hand the

Not only that, none of the census questions say who is an alien and who
is not, who is illegal and who is not.

You're right, Trump lost that battle, but it should. Why is it important
we know if a son is adopted or biological, if you feel your ancestory is from
Spain or Brazil, but not if someone is here on a visa, illegally or a citizen?



They have an emergency hearing
before the USSC to get permission to exclude illegals but they have no
bovious way to know who they are, and if, IF, there is an indirect way
it will take a long time and will be inaccrate. I hope the SC justices
ridicule the admin lawyer or his client, but they probably won't

Well, that's a good point. I know that's going on but haven't paid any
attention to it. But you're right, it sure looks like a moot point now
to me, IDK why the courts are even still hearing it.





Constitution says all people, and I don't think Trump is likely to prevail in the courts. That is one of of those conservative things, ruling on what the
Constitution says, the letter of the law. If there were some contemporary
discussion at the time showing otherwise, I would be persuaded. But there

AIUI at the time, no one was in the country illegally. There were no
rules against entering, no Ellis Island, no Castle Clinton (well there
was, but it was a defense implacemnet, not immigration). Some of the
news stories say that we haven't excluded illegals for 220 years, and
I'm pretty sure they're sincere when they say that, but none existed for
about a century. Maybe the Chinese Exclusion Act of 1882 created the
first ones, assuming some excluded Chinese managed to get in anyhow.
Was there anything earlier?

AFAIK we haven't excluded illegals or anyone from the count because the
Constitution says to count people, with no regard to status.

On Monday, October 19, 2020 at 3:04:37 PM UTC-4, micky wrote:
In alt.home.repair, on Sun, 18 Oct 2020 16:41:27 -0700, Bob F
wrote:


"roughly 4 out of 10 households nationwide have yet to be included in
the constitutionally mandated count that is used to redistribute
congressional seats, Electoral College votes and federal funding among
the states."


"Republicans in Congress are signaling that the Census Bureau cannot
take the extra time it has said it needs to count every person living in
the U.S. amid the coronavirus pandemic €” even if that risks leaving some
residents out of the 2020 census.

Rushing to deliver new state-population counts to the president by Dec.
31, and more detailed data to the states by March 31, 2021, as required
by current federal law, could risk severe inaccuracies in the
once-a-decade count, especially among people of color, immigrants, rural
residents and other historically undercounted groups.

With 95 days until the Census Bureau plans to stop tallying the
country's residents at the end of October, roughly 4 out of 10
households nationwide have yet to be included in the constitutionally
mandated count that is used to redistribute congressional seats,
Electoral College votes and federal funding among the states.

Democrats in both the Senate and the House of Representatives have
introduced legislation, including the House Democrats' latest
coronavirus relief bill, that would grant four-month extensions to the
legal deadlines in response to requests in April by the Census Bureau
and the Commerce Department, which oversees the bureau."


That was an older reference.


I see, but you posted it here now as if it was current, then you complain
about Trump lying, go figure. Nice job, lying Bob!

I corrected it as soon as I realized it was older. No lie involved.

Not only that, his excerpt contains "With 95 days until the Census
Bureau plans to stop tallying the country's residents at the end of
October". Anyone who knows the calendar should be able to figure out
when it was written (about June 26). Anyone who doesn't know the
calendar should be able to figure out it was written 95 days before the
census was scheduled to end. No lying involved.

Then WTF is some old ****, the completion rate, dating way back to June when
the census field work had not even STARTED, doing here in a discussion of
how the census just ended, with regard to what percent was complete?
If Trump threw out some crap like that, why you'd be all over it for the BS
it is.

In alt.home.repair, on Mon, 19 Oct 2020 18:09:41 -0700 (PDT), trader_4
wrote:

On Monday, October 19, 2020 at 3:04:37 PM UTC-4, micky wrote:
In alt.home.repair, on Sun, 18 Oct 2020 16:41:27 -0700, Bob F
wrote:


"roughly 4 out of 10 households nationwide have yet to be included in
the constitutionally mandated count that is used to redistribute
congressional seats, Electoral College votes and federal funding among
the states."


"Republicans in Congress are signaling that the Census Bureau cannot
take the extra time it has said it needs to count every person living in
the U.S. amid the coronavirus pandemic — even if that risks leaving some
residents out of the 2020 census.

Rushing to deliver new state-population counts to the president by Dec.
31, and more detailed data to the states by March 31, 2021, as required
by current federal law, could risk severe inaccuracies in the
once-a-decade count, especially among people of color, immigrants, rural
residents and other historically undercounted groups.

With 95 days until the Census Bureau plans to stop tallying the
country's residents at the end of October, roughly 4 out of 10
households nationwide have yet to be included in the constitutionally
mandated count that is used to redistribute congressional seats,
Electoral College votes and federal funding among the states.

Democrats in both the Senate and the House of Representatives have
introduced legislation, including the House Democrats' latest
coronavirus relief bill, that would grant four-month extensions to the
legal deadlines in response to requests in April by the Census Bureau
and the Commerce Department, which oversees the bureau."


That was an older reference.


I see, but you posted it here now as if it was current, then you complain
about Trump lying, go figure. Nice job, lying Bob!

I corrected it as soon as I realized it was older. No lie involved.

Not only that, his excerpt contains "With 95 days until the Census
Bureau plans to stop tallying the country's residents at the end of
October". Anyone who knows the calendar should be able to figure out
when it was written (about June 26). Anyone who doesn't know the
calendar should be able to figure out it was written 95 days before the
census was scheduled to end. No lying involved.

Then WTF is some old ****, the completion rate, dating way back to June when
the census field work had not even STARTED, doing here in a discussion of
how the census just ended, with regard to what percent was complete?
If Trump threw out some crap like that, why you'd be all over it for the BS
it is.

Bob F is not the president and he doesn't have a white house staff and a
press office and a department of commerce to make sure what Bob F says
is correct. He is a volunteer working on his own time with a staff of
one, and if he makes a mistake it's no big deal. When the so-called
president makes a mistake it's usually a lie.

In alt.home.repair, on Mon, 19 Oct 2020 16:55:41 -0700 (PDT), trader_4
wrote:

On Monday, October 19, 2020 at 4:23:28 AM UTC-4, micky wrote:
In alt.home.repair, on Sun, 18 Oct 2020 16:32:55 -0700 (PDT), trader_4
wrote:



The problem was the large cuts in funding for the census, which resulted
in the the departure of the director of the census, who has not been
replaced by trump. Not enough money, and no director - the recipe for
inaccuracy.

https://www.rollingstone.com/politic...o-fail-202575/

Again, lib lunacy. None of that equates to inaccuracy. The census was
COMPLETED to what, 97%? You liars want to make it sound like it;s 30%.
Keep helping Trump get re-elected.


Even if Bob and I and all the liberals are wrong about the census, it
doesn't help stumpie get re-elected. Do you think his voters or the
undecided worry about the census?

I don't see anyone except you few worried about the census. Months ago,

Loads of people are worried. You've been reasonable for a week or two
and tonight so far I see you called two people stupid and you gave this
silly reply and another one to Bob F. maybe you should see an
endicronologist.

when it seemed like it might not be able to be completed by the date that
team Trump accelerated by a month, there was some concern. But even then
the Democrats in Congress didn't really try to do much about it. And now

Didn't they? I don't know. There are hundreds of bills passed by the
House that are beilng ignored at the Senate. This might be one of them.
There are too many to know all of them. Or they didn't for some other
reason.

from what I've seen it looks like it has been completed to about the same
conclusion as previous censuses.

You don't have enough information. If you do, you haven't shared it,
and I'm sure you don't, partly because you have refused to believe what
I've told you from what a doorknocker has told me. One who gets emails
from the Bureau, data loaded to the phone they gave her, adn phone
conversations with her supervisor.

In alt.home.repair, on Mon, 19 Oct 2020 18:05:25 -0700 (PDT), trader_4
wrote:

On Monday, October 19, 2020 at 4:21:26 AM UTC-4, micky wrote:
In alt.home.repair, on Sun, 18 Oct 2020 15:58:17 -0700 (PDT), trader_4
wrote:


I
remember that they would start hiring and training 4 or 6 months in
advance. This year, my friend... I have to ask her again. She also
applied to be a contact tracer for Covid. She took online training for
one or both of them and then didn't hear back for a long time, but
anyhow, the question is, when it says in 2010 "Enumerators begin
door-to-door operations to collect census data" were they really out
there going to people's doors on the last day of April.

I'm talking about 2010 here. You suggested "above" they weren't ready to
go on the first day.

They would have started around that time this year, but it was put off
because of Covid.

I know that.




No, because of Covid it started around early August. But why do they have
to have started in April?

Question of fact about 2010.



I hate to say it but I was depressed and hadn't returned my census form
and somoene called me, someone I knew. If I could remember who it was,
I could and would call him for more details, but I can't remember. Other
than that, I don't know how to find more about this.
This year from what I can tell it was two months, maybe a little less,
starting in early August, ending early Oct. It probably varied a bit by
region of the country. But the real issue here is what percentage was
completed this year versus previous years and if it's substantially
different, does it make any difference in the result. They will never get
to 100%, there will always be a few percent left. That is then filled in
using estimates and models based on the 97% or whatever they have. So
if one year they get to 98%, while another year they get to 96%, not clear
that it really matters.

I agree with all of this, and I don't expect the census to be 100%.

They are saying that they've been to 99% of all the residences in
Maryland,

I suspect what that said is that 99% is complete, meaning they have census
data for 99%.

In Maryland I believe they said what I said.


but they did that partly by loosening standards on what is
visiting a home. Used to be, on I forget, the second or third trip, the
doorknocker could talk to neighbors and if they said how many were
living there (even if they were occasinally wrong) it counted as a
visit. They weakened that to allow it on the first visit. (My friend
went to some places 3 times before finding a resident who was home and
answsed the door, but she's very diligent. She also liked the job, at
least sometimes, from the interesting places she got to go. One was a
house built in the 1800's for the visit by some German king or
something.)

All that is wrong, AFAIK there is no change in how the census data is recorded.
It's always been that after some number of attempts at an address if they
can't be contacted, then they use proxies, ie a neighbor or landlord.

No, it's not wrong. The number of required visits has been lowered.

You have a cite for that?

No. But it's what I read from a reliable source. If I have the money
in my budget, I'll have my staff prepare a report on this.




That's mostly because some people just refuse all attempts, which is why
they just didn't do it online or via mail.

No. They often have sucess on later visits when they don't on the first
or on the 2nd.


Even though she lives there, she saw a lot of streets she hadn't seen.
OTOH, if I did it, I think t hey would assign me around here and I've
been down almost every street already.

But I digress:

What I don't want isn't for it to be 100% but for it not to favor
Republican areas at the direction of a Republican. I cetainly didn't
suspect H.W.Bush of doing that, as we all know, stumpie has shown plenty
of signs of trying to corrupt the Census. (For others, originnally in
June or so it was the census bureau, his own appointee I suspect, who
wanted it extended that month. Then something made them change their
mind. Maybe someone from a state that was going lose a Repuiblican
district pointed out to them how they could increase Republican
representation by shortening the

There were two issues there. One was ending it early and I agree, that looked
like Trump figuring that illegal aliens and the like would be more resistant
to being counted, so ending it early would count less of them. But the census
has been completed now to a high enough extent that this no longer is a
significant issue.

It's been completed to a high enough extent when they spend as much time
doorknocking as they did in the past,

It's ridiculous to base completion success on the number of door knocking
attempts as opposed to the completion numbers.

In just about every other department or bureau under trump when they
change the rules you correctly presume they are doing something crooked
for trump's partison or pecuniary advantage. Now all of a sudden you
trust the Census wouldn't do that!

Ahd it;s not just door
knocking, the census has sent mailer after mailer to the the addresses
that have not responded.

Do you have a source for that? And how does that differ from prior
censuses.





unless one can show a convincing
reason why less doorknocking is not needed. And I must have mentined
in this thread or the other how even in 10, maybe 20 or moe of the days
the census bureau says they were working, they were winding down
instead, more than once. Before Sept 30 and the entire 15 days of
Octobter. and those days count only partially,

It's all irrelevant. What is relevant is what percent COMPLETION they
achieved this year versus previous years and from what I've seen, it

They have redefined what completion is. How many times do I have to say
that. I'm not reading any further. You've been reasonable for a week or
two and now you're back to your querulous, quarrelsome self.

Micky

looks about the same. Also factor in that Covid made this year much harder,
so a number even close to prior years is a tremendous success. And you
don't need 100%, like in all years, they then use statistical modeling to
fill in what's missing because people will not comply.






The other is Trump wants to exclude illegals from the count. I think he's right
on that, it's not what the framers would have intended. On the other hand the

Not only that, none of the census questions say who is an alien and who
is not, who is illegal and who is not.

You're right, Trump lost that battle, but it should. Why is it important
we know if a son is adopted or biological, if you feel your ancestory is from
Spain or Brazil, but not if someone is here on a visa, illegally or a citizen?



They have an emergency hearing
before the USSC to get permission to exclude illegals but they have no
bovious way to know who they are, and if, IF, there is an indirect way
it will take a long time and will be inaccrate. I hope the SC justices
ridicule the admin lawyer or his client, but they probably won't

Well, that's a good point. I know that's going on but haven't paid any
attention to it. But you're right, it sure looks like a moot point now
to me, IDK why the courts are even still hearing it.





Constitution says all people, and I don't think Trump is likely to prevail in the courts. That is one of of those conservative things, ruling on what the
Constitution says, the letter of the law. If there were some contemporary
discussion at the time showing otherwise, I would be persuaded. But there

AIUI at the time, no one was in the country illegally. There were no
rules against entering, no Ellis Island, no Castle Clinton (well there
was, but it was a defense implacemnet, not immigration). Some of the
news stories say that we haven't excluded illegals for 220 years, and
I'm pretty sure they're sincere when they say that, but none existed for
about a century. Maybe the Chinese Exclusion Act of 1882 created the
first ones, assuming some excluded Chinese managed to get in anyhow.
Was there anything earlier?

AFAIK we haven't excluded illegals or anyone from the count because the
Constitution says to count people, with no regard to status.

On Tuesday, October 20, 2020 at 12:52:41 AM UTC-4, micky wrote:
In alt.home.repair, on Mon, 19 Oct 2020 16:55:41 -0700 (PDT), trader_4
wrote:

On Monday, October 19, 2020 at 4:23:28 AM UTC-4, micky wrote:
In alt.home.repair, on Sun, 18 Oct 2020 16:32:55 -0700 (PDT), trader_4
wrote:



The problem was the large cuts in funding for the census, which resulted
in the the departure of the director of the census, who has not been
replaced by trump. Not enough money, and no director - the recipe for
inaccuracy.

https://www.rollingstone.com/politic...o-fail-202575/

Again, lib lunacy. None of that equates to inaccuracy. The census was
COMPLETED to what, 97%? You liars want to make it sound like it;s 30%.
Keep helping Trump get re-elected.


Even if Bob and I and all the liberals are wrong about the census, it
doesn't help stumpie get re-elected. Do you think his voters or the
undecided worry about the census?

I don't see anyone except you few worried about the census. Months ago,

Loads of people are worried. You've been reasonable for a week or two
and tonight so far I see you called two people stupid and you gave this
silly reply and another one to Bob F. maybe you should see an
endicronologist.

Maybe you should figure out the facts instead of just starting to whine? WTF is
wrong with this census? Show us the substantial difference in the percentage
complete of this versus previous censuses.





when it seemed like it might not be able to be completed by the date that
team Trump accelerated by a month, there was some concern. But even then
the Democrats in Congress didn't really try to do much about it. And now


Didn't they? I don't know. There are hundreds of bills passed by the
House that are beilng ignored at the Senate. This might be one of them.
There are too many to know all of them. Or they didn't for some other
reason.

They could have put it into any bill of substance that had to be passed,
eg federal funding.




from what I've seen it looks like it has been completed to about the same
conclusion as previous censuses.

You don't have enough information. If you do, you haven't shared it,

You're the one here bitching, that the census wasn't completed adequately,
not me. I'd have expected you'd have the data before you started, now
you want me to go find it for you?




and I'm sure you don't, partly because you have refused to believe what
I've told you from what a doorknocker has told me. One who gets emails
from the Bureau, data loaded to the phone they gave her, adn phone
conversations with her supervisor.


Anecdotal evidence from one enumerator, which is the correct term, isn't
particularly compelling. And was that enumerator doing the job last census
too? IS she sure she remembers what was done back then? Is she a diehard
Democrat like you?

On Tuesday, October 20, 2020 at 1:04:08 AM UTC-4, micky wrote:
In alt.home.repair, on Mon, 19 Oct 2020 18:05:25 -0700 (PDT), trader_4
wrote:

On Monday, October 19, 2020 at 4:21:26 AM UTC-4, micky wrote:
In alt.home.repair, on Sun, 18 Oct 2020 15:58:17 -0700 (PDT), trader_4
wrote:


I
remember that they would start hiring and training 4 or 6 months in
advance. This year, my friend... I have to ask her again. She also
applied to be a contact tracer for Covid. She took online training for
one or both of them and then didn't hear back for a long time, but
anyhow, the question is, when it says in 2010 "Enumerators begin
door-to-door operations to collect census data" were they really out
there going to people's doors on the last day of April.

I'm talking about 2010 here. You suggested "above" they weren't ready to
go on the first day.

They would have started around that time this year, but it was put off
because of Covid.

I know that.




No, because of Covid it started around early August. But why do they have
to have started in April?

Question of fact about 2010.



I hate to say it but I was depressed and hadn't returned my census form
and somoene called me, someone I knew. If I could remember who it was,
I could and would call him for more details, but I can't remember. Other
than that, I don't know how to find more about this.
This year from what I can tell it was two months, maybe a little less,
starting in early August, ending early Oct. It probably varied a bit by
region of the country. But the real issue here is what percentage was
completed this year versus previous years and if it's substantially
different, does it make any difference in the result. They will never get
to 100%, there will always be a few percent left. That is then filled in
using estimates and models based on the 97% or whatever they have. So
if one year they get to 98%, while another year they get to 96%, not clear
that it really matters.

I agree with all of this, and I don't expect the census to be 100%.

They are saying that they've been to 99% of all the residences in
Maryland,

I suspect what that said is that 99% is complete, meaning they have census
data for 99%.

In Maryland I believe they said what I said.


but they did that partly by loosening standards on what is
visiting a home. Used to be, on I forget, the second or third trip, the
doorknocker could talk to neighbors and if they said how many were
living there (even if they were occasinally wrong) it counted as a
visit. They weakened that to allow it on the first visit. (My friend
went to some places 3 times before finding a resident who was home and
answsed the door, but she's very diligent. She also liked the job, at
least sometimes, from the interesting places she got to go. One was a
house built in the 1800's for the visit by some German king or
something.)

All that is wrong, AFAIK there is no change in how the census data is recorded.
It's always been that after some number of attempts at an address if they
can't be contacted, then they use proxies, ie a neighbor or landlord.

No, it's not wrong. The number of required visits has been lowered.

You have a cite for that?

No. But it's what I read from a reliable source.


So show us this reliable source and let us read what the actually claimed.



If I have the money
in my budget, I'll have my staff prepare a report on this.




That's mostly because some people just refuse all attempts, which is why
they just didn't do it online or via mail.

No. They often have sucess on later visits when they don't on the first
or on the 2nd.


Even though she lives there, she saw a lot of streets she hadn't seen.
OTOH, if I did it, I think t hey would assign me around here and I've
been down almost every street already.

But I digress:

What I don't want isn't for it to be 100% but for it not to favor
Republican areas at the direction of a Republican. I cetainly didn't
suspect H.W.Bush of doing that, as we all know, stumpie has shown plenty
of signs of trying to corrupt the Census. (For others, originnally in
June or so it was the census bureau, his own appointee I suspect, who
wanted it extended that month. Then something made them change their
mind. Maybe someone from a state that was going lose a Repuiblican
district pointed out to them how they could increase Republican
representation by shortening the

There were two issues there. One was ending it early and I agree, that looked
like Trump figuring that illegal aliens and the like would be more resistant
to being counted, so ending it early would count less of them. But the census
has been completed now to a high enough extent that this no longer is a
significant issue.

It's been completed to a high enough extent when they spend as much time
doorknocking as they did in the past,

It's ridiculous to base completion success on the number of door knocking
attempts as opposed to the completion numbers.

In just about every other department or bureau under trump when they
change the rules you correctly presume they are doing something crooked
for trump's partison or pecuniary advantage. Now all of a sudden you
trust the Census wouldn't do that!

I said that when the census was shortened by a month, there was reason for
concern and it looked like the reason was political. But the freaking census
was done and completed to just about the same extent as in previous years.
Instead of starting with that fact, you want to ignore it and pretend otherwise.

https://www.census.gov/newsroom/blog...020_cens..html

Our first look at the data collection operation indicates an extremely successful execution. We published our total response rates on a daily basis, and they show that we accounted for 99.9% of all addresses in the nation.

All states, the District of Columbia and the Commonwealth of Puerto Rico, achieved total response rates over 99.0%. All but one state was at or above 99.9%. The state of Louisiana and our field staff who worked hard to complete Nonresponse Followup operations deserve our congratulations and thanks for getting the total response rate over 99.0% complete even with the devastating effects of hurricanes Laura and Delta."


And about this, you're complaining? Good grief.





Ahd it;s not just door
knocking, the census has sent mailer after mailer to the the addresses
that have not responded.

Do you have a source for that? And how does that differ from prior
censuses.


..


unless one can show a convincing
reason why less doorknocking is not needed. And I must have mentined
in this thread or the other how even in 10, maybe 20 or moe of the days
the census bureau says they were working, they were winding down
instead, more than once. Before Sept 30 and the entire 15 days of
Octobter. and those days count only partially,

It's all irrelevant. What is relevant is what percent COMPLETION they
achieved this year versus previous years and from what I've seen, it

They have redefined what completion is. How many times do I have to say
that.

How many times do I have to ask for your cite for that? Your source is
one neighbor who claims that they went to using proxies sooner this census.
Some source. One enumerator in a country with 500K. Was this enumerator
doing the same work, in the same area, ten years ago? Is her memory any
better than yours, is she a partisan Democrat?





I'm not reading any further.

There's a big part of your problem and why you get lost down rat holes
and then get mad.



You've been reasonable for a week or
two and now you're back to your querulous, quarrelsome self.

Yeah, imagine that, me pointing out that you're bitching, without facts, about
a census that was completed to 99+%, trying desperately to blame Trump for
something, anything. It sounded much better when Bob was claiming it was
only 40% done. ROFL.