The BBC guy said that Biden was "laid back to the pont of somnambulent",

What a boob. A boob on the Beeb. David Willister (sp?) in Los
Angeles.

I watched the whole thing and Biden was never anything other than
normal.

On 10/15/20 11:11 PM, micky wrote:
The BBC guy said that Biden was "laid back to the pont of somnambulent",

What a boob. A boob on the Beeb. David Willister (sp?) in Los
Angeles.

I watched the whole thing and Biden was never anything other than
normal.

I saw a clip this morning of Biden saying he might mandate a
vaccine nationally. Do you remember that? That, by itself, is enough
reason to vote against him.
Yes, Trump is a jerk.

On Friday, October 16, 2020 at 7:31:59 AM UTC-4, Dean Hoffman wrote:
On 10/15/20 11:11 PM, micky wrote:
The BBC guy said that Biden was "laid back to the pont of somnambulent",

What a boob. A boob on the Beeb. David Willister (sp?) in Los
Angeles.

I watched the whole thing and Biden was never anything other than
normal.

I saw a clip this morning of Biden saying he might mandate a
vaccine nationally. Do you remember that? That, by itself, is enough
reason to vote against him.
Yes, Trump is a jerk.

How are your polio treatments working out?
Have you recovered from smallpox? Tuberculosis?

Cindy Hamilton

On 10/16/2020 10:08 AM, wrote:
On Friday, October 16, 2020 at 7:31:59 AM UTC-4, Dean Hoffman wrote:
On 10/15/20 11:11 PM, micky wrote:
The BBC guy said that Biden was "laid back to the pont of somnambulent",

What a boob. A boob on the Beeb. David Willister (sp?) in Los
Angeles.

I watched the whole thing and Biden was never anything other than
normal.

I saw a clip this morning of Biden saying he might mandate a
vaccine nationally. Do you remember that? That, by itself, is enough
reason to vote against him.
Yes, Trump is a jerk.

How are your polio treatments working out?
Have you recovered from smallpox? Tuberculosis?

Cindy Hamilton


It will be more like your annual flu shot. Will suppress the spread of
the virus but not eliminate it.

Biden like most liberals think they can mandate science. Just does not
work that way.

On 16/10/2020 15:08, wrote:
On Friday, October 16, 2020 at 7:31:59 AM UTC-4, Dean Hoffman wrote:
On 10/15/20 11:11 PM, micky wrote:
The BBC guy said that Biden was "laid back to the pont of somnambulent",

What a boob. A boob on the Beeb. David Willister (sp?) in Los
Angeles.

I watched the whole thing and Biden was never anything other than
normal.

I saw a clip this morning of Biden saying he might mandate a
vaccine nationally. Do you remember that? That, by itself, is enough
reason to vote against him.
Yes, Trump is a jerk.

How are your polio treatments working out?
Have you recovered from smallpox? Tuberculosis?

Cindy Hamilton

Sadly there's no vaccine for wilful ignorance yet.

On 10/16/2020 7:19 AM, Frank wrote:
On 10/16/2020 10:08 AM, wrote:
On Friday, October 16, 2020 at 7:31:59 AM UTC-4, Dean Hoffman wrote:
On 10/15/20 11:11 PM, micky wrote:
The BBC guy said that Biden was "laid back to the pont of
somnambulent",

What a boob. A boob on the Beeb. David Willister (sp?) in Los
Angeles.

I watched the whole thing and Biden was never anything other than
normal.

I saw a clip this morning of Biden saying he might mandate a
vaccine nationally. Do you remember that? That, by itself, is enough
reason to vote against him.
Yes, Trump is a jerk.

How are your polio treatments working out?
Have you recovered from smallpox?Â* Tuberculosis?

Cindy Hamilton


It will be more like your annual flu shot.Â* Will suppress the spread of
the virus but not eliminate it.

Biden like most liberals think they can mandate science.Â* Just does not
work that way.

They can govern based on science. Republicans are incapable of that
these days.

On 10/16/2020 10:19 AM, Frank wrote:
On 10/16/2020 10:08 AM, wrote:
On Friday, October 16, 2020 at 7:31:59 AM UTC-4, Dean Hoffman wrote:
On 10/15/20 11:11 PM, micky wrote:
The BBC guy said that Biden was "laid back to the pont of
somnambulent",

What a boob. A boob on the Beeb. David Willister (sp?) in Los
Angeles.

I watched the whole thing and Biden was never anything other than
normal.

I saw a clip this morning of Biden saying he might mandate a
vaccine nationally. Do you remember that? That, by itself, is enough
reason to vote against him.
Yes, Trump is a jerk.

How are your polio treatments working out?
Have you recovered from smallpox?* Tuberculosis?

Cindy Hamilton


It will be more like your annual flu shot.* Will suppress the spread of
the virus but not eliminate it.

Biden like most liberals think they can mandate science.* Just does not
work that way.

Too bad no one has found a way to mandate intelligence and rational,
fact-based thinking.

On 10/16/20 9:08 AM, wrote:
On Friday, October 16, 2020 at 7:31:59 AM UTC-4, Dean Hoffman wrote:
On 10/15/20 11:11 PM, micky wrote:
The BBC guy said that Biden was "laid back to the pont of somnambulent",

What a boob. A boob on the Beeb. David Willister (sp?) in Los
Angeles.

I watched the whole thing and Biden was never anything other than
normal.

I saw a clip this morning of Biden saying he might mandate a
vaccine nationally. Do you remember that? That, by itself, is enough
reason to vote against him.
Yes, Trump is a jerk.

How are your polio treatments working out?
Have you recovered from smallpox? Tuberculosis?

Cindy Hamilton

Whether the vaccines work or not is beside the point. It's about
Big Brother's
limit to power.

On Friday, October 16, 2020 at 11:37:12 AM UTC-4, Dean Hoffman wrote:
On 10/16/20 9:08 AM, wrote:
On Friday, October 16, 2020 at 7:31:59 AM UTC-4, Dean Hoffman wrote:
On 10/15/20 11:11 PM, micky wrote:
The BBC guy said that Biden was "laid back to the pont of somnambulent",

What a boob. A boob on the Beeb. David Willister (sp?) in Los
Angeles.

I watched the whole thing and Biden was never anything other than
normal.

I saw a clip this morning of Biden saying he might mandate a
vaccine nationally. Do you remember that? That, by itself, is enough
reason to vote against him.
Yes, Trump is a jerk.

How are your polio treatments working out?
Have you recovered from smallpox? Tuberculosis?

Cindy Hamilton

Whether the vaccines work or not is beside the point. It's about
Big Brother's
limit to power.

How do you feel about the MMR vaccine and it's requirements related to school admission?

On 10/16/20 10:54 AM, DerbyDad03 wrote:
On Friday, October 16, 2020 at 11:37:12 AM UTC-4, Dean Hoffman wrote:
On 10/16/20 9:08 AM, wrote:
On Friday, October 16, 2020 at 7:31:59 AM UTC-4, Dean Hoffman wrote:
On 10/15/20 11:11 PM, micky wrote:
The BBC guy said that Biden was "laid back to the pont of somnambulent",

What a boob. A boob on the Beeb. David Willister (sp?) in Los
Angeles.

I watched the whole thing and Biden was never anything other than
normal.

I saw a clip this morning of Biden saying he might mandate a
vaccine nationally. Do you remember that? That, by itself, is enough
reason to vote against him.
Yes, Trump is a jerk.

How are your polio treatments working out?
Have you recovered from smallpox? Tuberculosis?

Cindy Hamilton

Whether the vaccines work or not is beside the point. It's about
Big Brother's
limit to power.

How do you feel about the MMR vaccine and it's requirements related to school admission?

Parent's choice. It shouldn't be a requirement.

"Frank" "frank wrote in message
...
On 10/16/2020 10:08 AM, wrote:
On Friday, October 16, 2020 at 7:31:59 AM UTC-4, Dean Hoffman wrote:
On 10/15/20 11:11 PM, micky wrote:
The BBC guy said that Biden was "laid back to the pont of
somnambulent",

What a boob. A boob on the Beeb. David Willister (sp?) in Los
Angeles.

I watched the whole thing and Biden was never anything other than
normal.

I saw a clip this morning of Biden saying he might mandate a
vaccine nationally. Do you remember that? That, by itself, is enough
reason to vote against him.
Yes, Trump is a jerk.

How are your polio treatments working out?
Have you recovered from smallpox? Tuberculosis?

Cindy Hamilton


It will be more like your annual flu shot. Will suppress the spread of
the virus but not eliminate it.

Biden like most liberals think they can mandate science. Just does not
work that way.

Mandating treatment does in fact work. Thats how many
jurisdictions fixed the tuberculosis problem.

"Dean Hoffman" wrote in message
...
On 10/16/20 9:08 AM, wrote:
On Friday, October 16, 2020 at 7:31:59 AM UTC-4, Dean Hoffman wrote:
On 10/15/20 11:11 PM, micky wrote:
The BBC guy said that Biden was "laid back to the pont of
somnambulent",

What a boob. A boob on the Beeb. David Willister (sp?) in Los
Angeles.

I watched the whole thing and Biden was never anything other than
normal.

I saw a clip this morning of Biden saying he might mandate a
vaccine nationally. Do you remember that? That, by itself, is enough
reason to vote against him.
Yes, Trump is a jerk.

How are your polio treatments working out?
Have you recovered from smallpox? Tuberculosis?

Whether the vaccines work or not is beside the point. It's about Big
Brother's limit to power.

Plenty of jurisdictions fixed the tuberculosis problem that way.

Melbourne Australia mandated severe restrictions on where
you can go and what you can do to crush the virus and that
has seen a very dramatic improvement from almost a
thousand new infections a day to just one yesterday.

You dont approve ? Your problem.

"Dean Hoffman" wrote in message
...
On 10/16/20 10:54 AM, DerbyDad03 wrote:
On Friday, October 16, 2020 at 11:37:12 AM UTC-4, Dean Hoffman wrote:
On 10/16/20 9:08 AM, wrote:
On Friday, October 16, 2020 at 7:31:59 AM UTC-4, Dean Hoffman wrote:
On 10/15/20 11:11 PM, micky wrote:
The BBC guy said that Biden was "laid back to the pont of
somnambulent",

What a boob. A boob on the Beeb. David Willister (sp?) in Los
Angeles.

I watched the whole thing and Biden was never anything other than
normal.

I saw a clip this morning of Biden saying he might mandate a
vaccine nationally. Do you remember that? That, by itself, is enough
reason to vote against him.
Yes, Trump is a jerk.

How are your polio treatments working out?
Have you recovered from smallpox? Tuberculosis?

Cindy Hamilton

Whether the vaccines work or not is beside the point. It's about
Big Brother's
limit to power.

How do you feel about the MMR vaccine and it's requirements related to
school admission?

Parent's choice. It shouldn't be a requirement.

Problem is that too many are too stupid to make the sensible choice.

And dont try running the old line that if you let the govt
mandate something, it will inevitably lead to tyranny.
Australia mandated compulsory screening for tuberculosis
in the 50s and that fixed the TB problem and saw no tyranny.

On 10/16/2020 12:19 PM, %% wrote:


"Frank" "frank wrote in message
...
On 10/16/2020 10:08 AM, wrote:
On Friday, October 16, 2020 at 7:31:59 AM UTC-4, Dean Hoffman wrote:
On 10/15/20 11:11 PM, micky wrote:
The BBC guy said that Biden was "laid back to the pont of
somnambulent",

What a boob. A boob on the Beeb. David Willister (sp?) in Los
Angeles.

I watched the whole thing and Biden was never anything other than
normal.

I saw a clip this morning of Biden saying he might mandate a
vaccine nationally. Do you remember that? That, by itself, is enough
reason to vote against him.
Yes, Trump is a jerk.

How are your polio treatments working out?
Have you recovered from smallpox?Â* Tuberculosis?

Cindy Hamilton


It will be more like your annual flu shot.Â* Will suppress the spread
of the virus but not eliminate it.

Biden like most liberals think they can mandate science.Â* Just does
not work that way.

Mandating treatment does in fact work. Thats how many
jurisdictions fixed the tuberculosis problem.

Yes, if there is a solution.

I like to point out that only about 6% of our congress has degrees in
science or engineering.

On Fri, 16 Oct 2020 07:08:52 -0700 (PDT), "
wrote:

On Friday, October 16, 2020 at 7:31:59 AM UTC-4, Dean Hoffman wrote:
On 10/15/20 11:11 PM, micky wrote:
The BBC guy said that Biden was "laid back to the pont of somnambulent",

What a boob. A boob on the Beeb. David Willister (sp?) in Los
Angeles.

I watched the whole thing and Biden was never anything other than
normal.

I saw a clip this morning of Biden saying he might mandate a
vaccine nationally. Do you remember that? That, by itself, is enough
reason to vote against him.
Yes, Trump is a jerk.

How are your polio treatments working out?
Have you recovered from smallpox? Tuberculosis?

Cindy Hamilton

How has that "cold" shot been working?

Depending on who you believe, a vaccine may not be effective on this
virus. It all gets back to that immunity question.

wrote in message
...
On Fri, 16 Oct 2020 07:08:52 -0700 (PDT), "
wrote:

On Friday, October 16, 2020 at 7:31:59 AM UTC-4, Dean Hoffman wrote:
On 10/15/20 11:11 PM, micky wrote:
The BBC guy said that Biden was "laid back to the pont of
somnambulent",

What a boob. A boob on the Beeb. David Willister (sp?) in Los
Angeles.

I watched the whole thing and Biden was never anything other than
normal.

I saw a clip this morning of Biden saying he might mandate a
vaccine nationally. Do you remember that? That, by itself, is enough
reason to vote against him.
Yes, Trump is a jerk.

How are your polio treatments working out?
Have you recovered from smallpox? Tuberculosis?

How has that "cold" shot been working?

Irrelevant, those mutate much faster.

Depending on who you believe, a vaccine may not be effective
on this virus. It all gets back to that immunity question.

But the evidence is that only a microscopic handful
of individuals may have got this virus twice so it is
much more likely that it will work fine.

On Friday, October 16, 2020 at 1:07:39 PM UTC-4, wrote:
On Fri, 16 Oct 2020 07:08:52 -0700 (PDT), "
wrote:

On Friday, October 16, 2020 at 7:31:59 AM UTC-4, Dean Hoffman wrote:
On 10/15/20 11:11 PM, micky wrote:
The BBC guy said that Biden was "laid back to the pont of somnambulent",

What a boob. A boob on the Beeb. David Willister (sp?) in Los
Angeles.

I watched the whole thing and Biden was never anything other than
normal.

I saw a clip this morning of Biden saying he might mandate a
vaccine nationally. Do you remember that? That, by itself, is enough
reason to vote against him.
Yes, Trump is a jerk.

How are your polio treatments working out?
Have you recovered from smallpox? Tuberculosis?

Cindy Hamilton
How has that "cold" shot been working?

My point was that the government has lined us all up before and stuck
needles in our arms. Or made it a requirement for children to go to school.
It's only the last couple of decades that people thought the common good
doesn't matter.

Depending on who you believe, a vaccine may not be effective on this
virus. It all gets back to that immunity question.

Yep. It remains to be seen. I won't be the first in line for a vaccine.
Then again, I don't mind wearing a mask, although when the weather
turns cold it'll make my glasses fog up.

Cindy Hamilton

Dean Hoffman wrote:

I saw a clip this morning of Biden saying he might mandate a vaccine
nationally. Do you remember that? That, by itself, is enough reason to
vote against him.

"We don't need lockdowns and masks, we just need herd immunity."

"Herd immunity can be created by a vaccine, at much lower risk of
serious complications or death, if most of the population gets
vaccinated."

"Waaah! You're a Nazi!"

wrote:

Depending on who you believe, a vaccine may not be effective on this
virus. It all gets back to that immunity question.

If vaccines don't prove out, the best approach may be masks: reduce the
viral load received by those who do get infected, so that they can
develop immunity while going through a milder form of the illness.

" wrote:

On Friday, October 16, 2020 at 1:07:39 PM UTC-4, wrote:
On Fri, 16 Oct 2020 07:08:52 -0700 (PDT), "
wrote:

On Friday, October 16, 2020 at 7:31:59 AM UTC-4, Dean Hoffman wrote:
On 10/15/20 11:11 PM, micky wrote:

snip

Yep. It remains to be seen. I won't be the first in line for a vaccine.
Then again, I don't mind wearing a mask, although when the weather
turns cold it'll make my glasses fog up.

Cindy Hamilton

A little practical advise: Wash your glasses with soapy (not
detergent) water and let them air dry. It results in an invisible film
that prevents the fogging.



--
This email has been checked for viruses by AVG.
https://www.avg.com

On 10/16/2020 5:57 PM, Neill Massello wrote:
wrote:

Depending on who you believe, a vaccine may not be effective on this
virus. It all gets back to that immunity question.

If vaccines don't prove out, the best approach may be masks: reduce the
viral load received by those who do get infected, so that they can
develop immunity while going through a milder form of the illness.


I had wondered about that and you appear correct:

https://www.medpagetoday.com/infecti.../covid19/88692

As a chemist who worked with toxicologists I knew that toxicity was dose
related. I know that viruses will replicate and wonder what dose might
be needed to assure replication.

No doubt that it is good to wear a mask.

On 10/16/2020 3:57 PM, Frank wrote:
On 10/16/2020 5:57 PM, Neill Massello wrote:
wrote:

Depending on who you believe, a vaccine may not be effective on this
virus. It all gets back to that immunity question.

If vaccines don't prove out, the best approach may be masks: reduce the
viral load received by those who do get infected, so that they can
develop immunity while going through a milder form of the illness.


I had wondered about that and you appear correct:

https://www.medpagetoday.com/infecti.../covid19/88692

As a chemist who worked with toxicologists I knew that toxicity was dose
related.Â* I know that viruses will replicate and wonder what dose might
be needed to assure replication.

No doubt that it is good to wear a mask.



That is a very good article.

"Cruise ship passengers who embarked from the coast of Argentina in
mid-March were unaware that they were living in a COVID-19 hotspot for
more than a week after the ship departed.

The reason why these passengers were oblivious? Because a majority of
the cruise ship's cases were asymptomatic.

Researchers are now pointing to this cruise ship outbreak, in which all
passengers were provided surgical masks, as evidence that universal
masking may result in a higher proportion of asymptomatic COVID-19
cases. Other outbreaks of mostly asymptomatic cases where widespread
masking was implemented, in places like jails and meatpacking plants,
provide epidemiological data that masks could reduce viral inoculum --
and as a result, decrease the severity of illness."

"
share to facebook
share to twitter
share to linkedin
email article
A photo composition of a person wearing a mask, a cruise ship, and
coronaviruses

Cruise ship passengers who embarked from the coast of Argentina in
mid-March were unaware that they were living in a COVID-19 hotspot for
more than a week after the ship departed.

The reason why these passengers were oblivious? Because a majority of
the cruise ship's cases were asymptomatic.

Researchers are now pointing to this cruise ship outbreak, in which all
passengers were provided surgical masks, as evidence that universal
masking may result in a higher proportion of asymptomatic COVID-19
cases. Other outbreaks of mostly asymptomatic cases where widespread
masking was implemented, in places like jails and meatpacking plants,
provide epidemiological data that masks could reduce viral inoculum --
and as a result, decrease the severity of illness.

Writing in the New England Journal of Medicine, Monica Gandhi, MD, and
George Rutherford, MD, of the University of California in San Francisco,
hypothesized that widespread population masking may act as a sort of
"variolation," exposing individuals to a smaller amount of viral
particles and producing an immune response.

Gandhi told MedPage Today that the viral inoculum, or the initial dose
of virus that a patient takes in, is one likely determinant of ultimate
illness severity. That's separate from patients' subsequent viral load,
the level of replicating virus as measured by copies per mL.

The "variolation" hypothesis holds that, at some level, the inoculum
overwhelms the immune system, leading to serious illness. With less than
that (and the threshold may vary from one person to the next), the
individual successfully fights off the infection, with mild or no
clinical illness.

"Diseases in which your immune system has a big role to play in how sick
you get -- and your immune system contributes to pathogenesis -- do not
seem to be able to handle a large viral inoculum," Gandhi said in an
interview.

Severe COVID-19 may be caused by a reaction known as the cytokine storm,
an immune response in which the body attacks its own cells and tissues
as opposed to the virus itself. Although this theory has yet to be
proven (and other theories, such as the bradykinin storm, have been
suggested), a large initial dose of SARS-CoV-2 may be the trigger.

Trials that give humans different doses of viral RNA are not ethical, of
course. But animal studies provide preliminary evidence that viral
inoculum could impact disease severity, Gandhi noted. In a study of
Syrian hamsters, for example, those infected with a higher dose of
SARS-CoV-2 had worse outcomes compared to those infected with smaller
amounts of virus.

Masked hamsters were also shown to be less likely to get COVID-19
illness than those without masks, a separate study found. And if they
did acquire the illness, it was more mild.

"We know that a higher inoculum of an infectious agent generally makes
people sicker," said Peter Katona, MD, an infectious disease specialist
and professor at the University of California in Los Angeles."

In alt.home.repair, on Fri, 16 Oct 2020 06:31:51 -0500, Dean Hoffman
wrote:

On 10/15/20 11:11 PM, micky wrote:
The BBC guy said that Biden was "laid back to the pont of somnambulent",

What a boob. A boob on the Beeb. David Willister (sp?) in Los
Angeles.

I watched the whole thing and Biden was never anything other than
normal.

I saw a clip this morning of Biden saying he might mandate a
vaccine nationally. Do you remember that?

Yeah, but it has nothing to do with somnambulence.

That, by itself, is enough
reason to vote against him.
Yes, Trump is a jerk.

In alt.home.repair, on Fri, 16 Oct 2020 11:03:50 -0500, Dean Hoffman
wrote:

On 10/16/20 10:54 AM, DerbyDad03 wrote:
On Friday, October 16, 2020 at 11:37:12 AM UTC-4, Dean Hoffman wrote:
On 10/16/20 9:08 AM, wrote:
On Friday, October 16, 2020 at 7:31:59 AM UTC-4, Dean Hoffman wrote:
On 10/15/20 11:11 PM, micky wrote:
The BBC guy said that Biden was "laid back to the pont of somnambulent",

What a boob. A boob on the Beeb. David Willister (sp?) in Los
Angeles.

I watched the whole thing and Biden was never anything other than
normal.

I saw a clip this morning of Biden saying he might mandate a
vaccine nationally. Do you remember that? That, by itself, is enough
reason to vote against him.
Yes, Trump is a jerk.

How are your polio treatments working out?
Have you recovered from smallpox? Tuberculosis?

Cindy Hamilton

Whether the vaccines work or not is beside the point. It's about
Big Brother's
limit to power.

How do you feel about the MMR vaccine and it's requirements related to school admission?

Parent's choice. It shouldn't be a requirement.

There are children and adults, with weakened immune systems from other
diseases, or from some medical treatments, and they can't be immunized.
Your child gets one of those diseaes that MMR stops and gives it to one
of those childen, who get t he disease and because their immune system
is already week, they die. You're okay with that?

In alt.home.repair, on Fri, 16 Oct 2020 16:28:02 -0700, Bob F
wrote:

On 10/16/2020 3:57 PM, Frank wrote:
On 10/16/2020 5:57 PM, Neill Massello wrote:
wrote:

Depending on who you believe, a vaccine may not be effective on this
virus. It all gets back to that immunity question.

If vaccines don't prove out, the best approach may be masks: reduce the
viral load received by those who do get infected, so that they can
develop immunity while going through a milder form of the illness.


I had wondered about that and you appear correct:

https://www.medpagetoday.com/infecti.../covid19/88692

As a chemist who worked with toxicologists I knew that toxicity was dose
related.* I know that viruses will replicate and wonder what dose might
be needed to assure replication.

I think you need a boy virus and a girl virus, and they should be past
the onset of puberty.

No doubt that it is good to wear a mask.

The name Covid actually comes from Courtney Virus and David Virus, a
famous couple in the microbe world, distant cousins. That's why it 's so
lethal because of mating with someone from the same family.

On Fri, 16 Oct 2020 10:37:04 -0500, Dean Hoffman
wrote:

On 10/16/20 9:08 AM, wrote:
On Friday, October 16, 2020 at 7:31:59 AM UTC-4, Dean Hoffman wrote:
On 10/15/20 11:11 PM, micky wrote:
The BBC guy said that Biden was "laid back to the pont of somnambulent",

What a boob. A boob on the Beeb. David Willister (sp?) in Los
Angeles.

I watched the whole thing and Biden was never anything other than
normal.

I saw a clip this morning of Biden saying he might mandate a
vaccine nationally. Do you remember that? That, by itself, is enough
reason to vote against him.
Yes, Trump is a jerk.

How are your polio treatments working out?
Have you recovered from smallpox? Tuberculosis?

Cindy Hamilton

Whether the vaccines work or not is beside the point. It's about
Big Brother's
limit to power.
You forget Karma has no limit to it's power. Nor does nature.
Sadly there is also no limit to the ignorance of man.

On Fri, 16 Oct 2020 11:03:50 -0500, Dean Hoffman
wrote:

On 10/16/20 10:54 AM, DerbyDad03 wrote:
On Friday, October 16, 2020 at 11:37:12 AM UTC-4, Dean Hoffman wrote:
On 10/16/20 9:08 AM, wrote:
On Friday, October 16, 2020 at 7:31:59 AM UTC-4, Dean Hoffman wrote:
On 10/15/20 11:11 PM, micky wrote:
The BBC guy said that Biden was "laid back to the pont of somnambulent",

What a boob. A boob on the Beeb. David Willister (sp?) in Los
Angeles.

I watched the whole thing and Biden was never anything other than
normal.

I saw a clip this morning of Biden saying he might mandate a
vaccine nationally. Do you remember that? That, by itself, is enough
reason to vote against him.
Yes, Trump is a jerk.

How are your polio treatments working out?
Have you recovered from smallpox? Tuberculosis?

Cindy Hamilton

Whether the vaccines work or not is beside the point. It's about
Big Brother's
limit to power.

How do you feel about the MMR vaccine and it's requirements related to school admission?

Parent's choice. It shouldn't be a requirement.
You would still have a choice. Innoculate or leave to wherever your
"libertarian utopia" is.

On Fri, 16 Oct 2020 18:19:23 -0400, wrote:

" wrote:

On Friday, October 16, 2020 at 1:07:39 PM UTC-4, wrote:
On Fri, 16 Oct 2020 07:08:52 -0700 (PDT), "
wrote:

On Friday, October 16, 2020 at 7:31:59 AM UTC-4, Dean Hoffman wrote:
On 10/15/20 11:11 PM, micky wrote:

snip

Yep. It remains to be seen. I won't be the first in line for a vaccine.
Then again, I don't mind wearing a mask, although when the weather
turns cold it'll make my glasses fog up.

Cindy Hamilton

A little practical advise: Wash your glasses with soapy (not
detergent) water and let them air dry. It results in an invisible film
that prevents the fogging.


The "anti fog" treatments that were common years back were just a
soft soap that you polished into the glass without water.
Not quite as effective on polycarbonate lens, apparently

"Neill Massello" wrote in message
.. .
wrote:

Depending on who you believe, a vaccine may not be effective on this
virus. It all gets back to that immunity question.

If vaccines don't prove out, the best approach may be masks: reduce
the viral load received by those who do get infected, so that they can
develop immunity while going through a milder form of the illness.

There isnt any evidence that the viral load makes any difference to the
outcome.

The virus replicates in the body.

"Frank" "frank wrote in message
...
On 10/16/2020 5:57 PM, Neill Massello wrote:
wrote:

Depending on who you believe, a vaccine may not be effective on this
virus. It all gets back to that immunity question.

If vaccines don't prove out, the best approach may be masks: reduce the
viral load received by those who do get infected, so that they can
develop immunity while going through a milder form of the illness.

I had wondered about that and you appear correct:

No he isnt. And it isnt possible to ethically test that question.

https://www.medpagetoday.com/infecti.../covid19/88692

That doesnt substantiate that claim and the claim that most
cruise ship pax who were issued with surgical masks and wore
them were positive and asymptomatic is just plain wrong too.

As a chemist who worked with toxicologists I knew that toxicity was dose
related.

The difference with a virus is that it replicates.

I know that viruses will replicate and wonder what dose might be needed to
assure replication.

No dose is required to see that happen.

No doubt that it is good to wear a mask.

But not for that reason.

On Fri, 16 Oct 2020 16:28:02 -0700, Bob F wrote:

On 10/16/2020 3:57 PM, Frank wrote:
On 10/16/2020 5:57 PM, Neill Massello wrote:
wrote:

Depending on who you believe, a vaccine may not be effective on this
virus. It all gets back to that immunity question.

If vaccines don't prove out, the best approach may be masks: reduce the
viral load received by those who do get infected, so that they can
develop immunity while going through a milder form of the illness.


I had wondered about that and you appear correct:

https://www.medpagetoday.com/infecti.../covid19/88692

As a chemist who worked with toxicologists I knew that toxicity was dose
related.* I know that viruses will replicate and wonder what dose might
be needed to assure replication.

No doubt that it is good to wear a mask.



That is a very good article.

"Cruise ship passengers who embarked from the coast of Argentina in
mid-March were unaware that they were living in a COVID-19 hotspot for
more than a week after the ship departed.

The reason why these passengers were oblivious? Because a majority of
the cruise ship's cases were asymptomatic.

Researchers are now pointing to this cruise ship outbreak, in which all
passengers were provided surgical masks, as evidence that universal
masking may result in a higher proportion of asymptomatic COVID-19
cases. Other outbreaks of mostly asymptomatic cases where widespread
masking was implemented, in places like jails and meatpacking plants,
provide epidemiological data that masks could reduce viral inoculum --
and as a result, decrease the severity of illness."

"
share to facebook
share to twitter
share to linkedin
email article
A photo composition of a person wearing a mask, a cruise ship, and
coronaviruses

Cruise ship passengers who embarked from the coast of Argentina in
mid-March were unaware that they were living in a COVID-19 hotspot for
more than a week after the ship departed.

The reason why these passengers were oblivious? Because a majority of
the cruise ship's cases were asymptomatic.

Researchers are now pointing to this cruise ship outbreak, in which all
passengers were provided surgical masks, as evidence that universal
masking may result in a higher proportion of asymptomatic COVID-19
cases. Other outbreaks of mostly asymptomatic cases where widespread
masking was implemented, in places like jails and meatpacking plants,
provide epidemiological data that masks could reduce viral inoculum --
and as a result, decrease the severity of illness.

Writing in the New England Journal of Medicine, Monica Gandhi, MD, and
George Rutherford, MD, of the University of California in San Francisco,
hypothesized that widespread population masking may act as a sort of
"variolation," exposing individuals to a smaller amount of viral
particles and producing an immune response.

Gandhi told MedPage Today that the viral inoculum, or the initial dose
of virus that a patient takes in, is one likely determinant of ultimate
illness severity. That's separate from patients' subsequent viral load,
the level of replicating virus as measured by copies per mL.

The "variolation" hypothesis holds that, at some level, the inoculum
overwhelms the immune system, leading to serious illness. With less than
that (and the threshold may vary from one person to the next), the
individual successfully fights off the infection, with mild or no
clinical illness.

"Diseases in which your immune system has a big role to play in how sick
you get -- and your immune system contributes to pathogenesis -- do not
seem to be able to handle a large viral inoculum," Gandhi said in an
interview.

Severe COVID-19 may be caused by a reaction known as the cytokine storm,
an immune response in which the body attacks its own cells and tissues
as opposed to the virus itself. Although this theory has yet to be
proven (and other theories, such as the bradykinin storm, have been
suggested), a large initial dose of SARS-CoV-2 may be the trigger.

Trials that give humans different doses of viral RNA are not ethical, of
course. But animal studies provide preliminary evidence that viral
inoculum could impact disease severity, Gandhi noted. In a study of
Syrian hamsters, for example, those infected with a higher dose of
SARS-CoV-2 had worse outcomes compared to those infected with smaller
amounts of virus.

Masked hamsters were also shown to be less likely to get COVID-19
illness than those without masks, a separate study found. And if they
did acquire the illness, it was more mild.

"We know that a higher inoculum of an infectious agent generally makes
people sicker," said Peter Katona, MD, an infectious disease specialist
and professor at the University of California in Los Angeles."

Masked hamsters? I need photos. :-)

On Sat, 17 Oct 2020 16:21:50 +1100, %%, better known as cantankerous
trolling senile geezer Rodent Speed, wrote:


The difference with a virus is that it replicates.

You are a virus in your own right, you abnormal, obnoxious, trolling, senile
pest! Guess why you got NOBODY in real life to talk to and everybody avoids
you! BG

--
Norman Wells addressing trolling senile Rodent:
"Ah, the voice of scum speaks."
MID:

"Bob F" wrote in message
...
On 10/16/2020 3:57 PM, Frank wrote:
On 10/16/2020 5:57 PM, Neill Massello wrote:
wrote:

Depending on who you believe, a vaccine may not be effective on this
virus. It all gets back to that immunity question.

If vaccines don't prove out, the best approach may be masks: reduce the
viral load received by those who do get infected, so that they can
develop immunity while going through a milder form of the illness.


I had wondered about that and you appear correct:

https://www.medpagetoday.com/infecti.../covid19/88692

As a chemist who worked with toxicologists I knew that toxicity was dose
related. I know that viruses will replicate and wonder what dose might
be needed to assure replication.

No doubt that it is good to wear a mask.

That is a very good article.

Nope, it mangles the real story.

"Cruise ship passengers who embarked from the coast of Argentina in
mid-March were unaware that they were living in a COVID-19 hotspot for
more than a week after the ship departed.

The reason why these passengers were oblivious? Because a majority of the
cruise ship's cases were asymptomatic.

It isnt known that they were positive and asymptomatic.

Researchers are now pointing to this cruise ship outbreak, in which all
passengers were provided surgical masks, as evidence that universal
masking may result in a higher proportion of asymptomatic COVID-19 cases.

Problem with that claim is that US jail which certainly had very
high levels of positive asymptomatic which had no masks at all.

Other outbreaks of mostly asymptomatic cases where widespread masking was
implemented, in places like jails and meatpacking plants, provide
epidemiological data that masks could reduce viral inoculum --
and as a result, decrease the severity of illness."

Pity about the ones where there was no widespread use of masks.

Writing in the New England Journal of Medicine, Monica Gandhi, MD, and
George Rutherford, MD, of the University of California in San Francisco,
hypothesized that widespread population masking may act as a sort of
"variolation," exposing individuals to a smaller amount of viral particles
and producing an immune response.

But she has no evidence for that.

Gandhi told MedPage Today that the viral inoculum, or the initial dose of
virus that a patient takes in, is one likely determinant of ultimate
illness severity.

But she has no evidence for that.

That's separate from patients' subsequent viral load, the level of
replicating virus as measured by copies per mL.

The "variolation" hypothesis holds that, at some level, the inoculum
overwhelms the immune system, leading to serious illness.

But there is no evidence for that either.

With less than that (and the threshold

There is no evidence that there is any threshold.

may vary from one person to the next), the individual successfully fights
off the infection, with mild or no clinical illness.

No evidence for that either.

"Diseases in which your immune system has a big role to play in how sick
you get -- and your immune system contributes to pathogenesis -- do not
seem to be able to handle a large viral inoculum," Gandhi said in an
interview.

No evidence for that either.

Severe COVID-19 may be caused by a reaction known as the cytokine storm,
an immune response in which the body attacks its own cells and tissues as
opposed to the virus itself. Although this theory has yet to be proven
(and other theories, such as the bradykinin storm, have been suggested), a
large initial dose of SARS-CoV-2 may be the trigger.

No evidence for that either.

Trials that give humans different doses of viral RNA are not ethical, of
course. But animal studies provide preliminary evidence that viral
inoculum could impact disease severity, Gandhi noted. In a study of Syrian
hamsters, for example, those infected with a higher dose of SARS-CoV-2 had
worse outcomes compared to those infected with smaller amounts of virus.

Masked hamsters were also shown to be less likely to get COVID-19 illness
than those without masks, a separate study found. And if they id acquire
the illness, it was more mild.

"We know that a higher inoculum of an infectious agent generally
? makes people sicker," said Peter Katona, MD, an infectious disease
specialist and professor at the University of California in Los Angeles."

No evidence for that either.

On 10/16/20 11:54 PM, %% wrote:


"Neill Massello" wrote in message .. .
wrote:

Depending on who you believe, a vaccine may not be effective on this
virus. It all gets back to that immunity question.

If vaccines don't prove out, the best approach may be masks: reduce
the viral load received by those who do get infected, so that they can
develop immunity while going through a milder form of the illness.

There isnt any evidence that the viral load makes any difference to the outcome.

The virus replicates in the body.


So unless a mask filters out *all* the virus particles, it's use won't make any difference to the outcome?

On Friday, October 16, 2020 at 6:19:21 PM UTC-4, wrote:
" wrote:

On Friday, October 16, 2020 at 1:07:39 PM UTC-4, wrote:
On Fri, 16 Oct 2020 07:08:52 -0700 (PDT), "
wrote:

On Friday, October 16, 2020 at 7:31:59 AM UTC-4, Dean Hoffman wrote:
On 10/15/20 11:11 PM, micky wrote:
snip
Yep. It remains to be seen. I won't be the first in line for a vaccine.
Then again, I don't mind wearing a mask, although when the weather
turns cold it'll make my glasses fog up.

Cindy Hamilton
A little practical advise: Wash your glasses with soapy (not
detergent) water and let them air dry. It results in an invisible film
that prevents the fogging.

I can't let them air dry. I need them to see. Sometimes I put them
on in the middle of the night when I get up to pee in the same bathroom
I've been using for 20 years.

Cindy Hamilton

On 10/17/2020 4:41 AM, wrote:
On Friday, October 16, 2020 at 6:19:21 PM UTC-4, wrote:
" wrote:

On Friday, October 16, 2020 at 1:07:39 PM UTC-4, wrote:
On Fri, 16 Oct 2020 07:08:52 -0700 (PDT), "
wrote:

On Friday, October 16, 2020 at 7:31:59 AM UTC-4, Dean Hoffman wrote:
On 10/15/20 11:11 PM, micky wrote:
snip
Yep. It remains to be seen. I won't be the first in line for a vaccine.
Then again, I don't mind wearing a mask, although when the weather
turns cold it'll make my glasses fog up.

Cindy Hamilton
A little practical advise: Wash your glasses with soapy (not
detergent) water and let them air dry. It results in an invisible film
that prevents the fogging.

I can't let them air dry. I need them to see. Sometimes I put them
on in the middle of the night when I get up to pee in the same bathroom
I've been using for 20 years.

You don't have to do it every single time you put them on, and you don't
need to wear your mask to go to the bathroom.

On 10/17/2020 4:15 AM, Fony Tauci wrote:
On 10/16/20 11:54 PM, %% wrote:


"Neill Massello" wrote in message
.. .
wrote:

Depending on who you believe, a vaccine may not be effective on this
virus. It all gets back to that immunity question.

If vaccines don't prove out, the best approach may be masks: reduce
the viral load received by those who do get infected, so that they can
develop immunity while going through a milder form of the illness.

There isnt any evidence that the viral load makes any difference to
the outcome.

The virus replicates in the body.


So unless a mask filters out *all* the virus particles, it's use won't
make any difference to the outcome?



Except, the above claims are not true. Masks make a big difference, and
may even increase the % of asymptomatic infections.


"Cruise ship passengers who embarked from the coast of Argentina in
mid-March were unaware that they were living in a COVID-19 hotspot for
more than a week after the ship departed.

The reason why these passengers were oblivious? Because a majority of
the cruise ship's cases were asymptomatic.

Researchers are now pointing to this cruise ship outbreak, in which all
passengers were provided surgical masks, as evidence that universal
masking may result in a higher proportion of asymptomatic COVID-19
cases. Other outbreaks of mostly asymptomatic cases where widespread
masking was implemented, in places like jails and meatpacking plants,
provide epidemiological data that masks could reduce viral inoculum --
and as a result, decrease the severity of illness.

Writing in the New England Journal of Medicine, Monica Gandhi, MD, and
George Rutherford, MD, of the University of California in San Francisco,
hypothesized that widespread population masking may act as a sort of
"variolation," exposing individuals to a smaller amount of viral
particles and producing an immune response.

Gandhi told MedPage Today that the viral inoculum, or the initial dose
of virus that a patient takes in, is one likely determinant of ultimate
illness severity. That's separate from patients' subsequent viral load,
the level of replicating virus as measured by copies per mL.

The "variolation" hypothesis holds that, at some level, the inoculum
overwhelms the immune system, leading to serious illness. With less than
that (and the threshold may vary from one person to the next), the
individual successfully fights off the infection, with mild or no
clinical illness.

"Diseases in which your immune system has a big role to play in how sick
you get -- and your immune system contributes to pathogenesis -- do not
seem to be able to handle a large viral inoculum," Gandhi said in an
interview.

Severe COVID-19 may be caused by a reaction known as the cytokine storm,
an immune response in which the body attacks its own cells and tissues
as opposed to the virus itself. Although this theory has yet to be
proven (and other theories, such as the bradykinin storm, have been
suggested), a large initial dose of SARS-CoV-2 may be the trigger.

Trials that give humans different doses of viral RNA are not ethical, of
course. But animal studies provide preliminary evidence that viral
inoculum could impact disease severity, Gandhi noted. In a study of
Syrian hamsters, for example, those infected with a higher dose of
SARS-CoV-2 had worse outcomes compared to those infected with smaller
amounts of virus.

Masked hamsters were also shown to be less likely to get COVID-19
illness than those without masks, a separate study found. And if they
did acquire the illness, it was more mild.

"We know that a higher inoculum of an infectious agent generally makes
people sicker," said Peter Katona, MD, an infectious disease specialist
and professor at the University of California in Los Angeles."

On Saturday, October 17, 2020 at 9:27:20 AM UTC-4, Bob F wrote:
On 10/17/2020 4:41 AM, wrote:
On Friday, October 16, 2020 at 6:19:21 PM UTC-4, wrote:
" wrote:

On Friday, October 16, 2020 at 1:07:39 PM UTC-4, wrote:
On Fri, 16 Oct 2020 07:08:52 -0700 (PDT), "
wrote:

On Friday, October 16, 2020 at 7:31:59 AM UTC-4, Dean Hoffman wrote:
On 10/15/20 11:11 PM, micky wrote:
snip
Yep. It remains to be seen. I won't be the first in line for a vaccine.
Then again, I don't mind wearing a mask, although when the weather
turns cold it'll make my glasses fog up.

Cindy Hamilton
A little practical advise: Wash your glasses with soapy (not
detergent) water and let them air dry. It results in an invisible film
that prevents the fogging.

I can't let them air dry. I need them to see. Sometimes I put them
on in the middle of the night when I get up to pee in the same bathroom
I've been using for 20 years.
You don't have to do it every single time you put them on, and you don't
need to wear your mask to go to the bathroom.

Thanks. I still cannot let them air dry. Don't they waterspot something fierce?

Cindy Hamilton

On 10/17/2020 6:49 AM, wrote:
On Saturday, October 17, 2020 at 9:27:20 AM UTC-4, Bob F wrote:
On 10/17/2020 4:41 AM, wrote:
On Friday, October 16, 2020 at 6:19:21 PM UTC-4, wrote:
" wrote:

On Friday, October 16, 2020 at 1:07:39 PM UTC-4, wrote:
On Fri, 16 Oct 2020 07:08:52 -0700 (PDT), "
wrote:

On Friday, October 16, 2020 at 7:31:59 AM UTC-4, Dean Hoffman wrote:
On 10/15/20 11:11 PM, micky wrote:
snip
Yep. It remains to be seen. I won't be the first in line for a vaccine.
Then again, I don't mind wearing a mask, although when the weather
turns cold it'll make my glasses fog up.

Cindy Hamilton
A little practical advise: Wash your glasses with soapy (not
detergent) water and let them air dry. It results in an invisible film
that prevents the fogging.

I can't let them air dry. I need them to see. Sometimes I put them
on in the middle of the night when I get up to pee in the same bathroom
I've been using for 20 years.
You don't have to do it every single time you put them on, and you don't
need to wear your mask to go to the bathroom.

Thanks. I still cannot let them air dry. Don't they waterspot something fierce?

Cindy Hamilton


The idea is to have a very thin film of soap left on the lens. It keep
condensed water on the lens from forming tiny droplets, which form the
fog on the lens. Instead, the water forms a very thin film which doesn't
block vision so much and evaporates quickly. The same principle probably
prevents the water spots. You can also just rub wet fingertips on a bar
of soap and rub the soap paste on the lens, then wipe it off with cloth
or tissue until the lens is clear. You just want to leave an invisible
film of the soap on the lens.

There are also anti-fog products available commercially.

On 10/17/2020 07:49 AM, wrote:
On Saturday, October 17, 2020 at 9:27:20 AM UTC-4, Bob F wrote:
On 10/17/2020 4:41 AM, wrote:
On Friday, October 16, 2020 at 6:19:21 PM UTC-4, wrote:
" wrote:

On Friday, October 16, 2020 at 1:07:39 PM UTC-4, wrote:
On Fri, 16 Oct 2020 07:08:52 -0700 (PDT), "
wrote:

On Friday, October 16, 2020 at 7:31:59 AM UTC-4, Dean Hoffman wrote:
On 10/15/20 11:11 PM, micky wrote:
snip
Yep. It remains to be seen. I won't be the first in line for a vaccine.
Then again, I don't mind wearing a mask, although when the weather
turns cold it'll make my glasses fog up.

Cindy Hamilton
A little practical advise: Wash your glasses with soapy (not
detergent) water and let them air dry. It results in an invisible film
that prevents the fogging.

I can't let them air dry. I need them to see. Sometimes I put them
on in the middle of the night when I get up to pee in the same bathroom
I've been using for 20 years.
You don't have to do it every single time you put them on, and you don't
need to wear your mask to go to the bathroom.

Thanks. I still cannot let them air dry. Don't they waterspot something fierce?

Cindy Hamilton


DI water.