On Tue, 15 Sep 2020 08:51:32 +0100, Paul wrote:

Commander Kinsey wrote:

160/120
Already have. Not quite as high as yours, but enough to make a
cardiologist's eyes open wide. But I've tried Perindopril, Amlodipine,
Bendroflumethiazide, and Eplerenone, and none did a damn thing. I was
told there were no others.

Question: Can you afford to let the matter drop ?

No choice in the matter.

told there were no other "what" ?

Drugs obviously, as that's what I just listed.

Has anyone tried to root-cause your situation?

2 cardiologists and a neurologist.

It took me about a year to get a result. And like
you, a lot of "clunkers" until you find not
necessarily the right doctor, but at least a
doctor who knows "which button to push on his console".

Have you at least had an echocardiogram ?

With a cardiac echocardiogram, the queue is only a week, and in
terms of instrumentation, it's better than nothing. No radiation.
No machines with tunnels.

All sorts of stuff like that.

And I don't believe high BP is a problem, since alledgedly 1 in 3 people have it. It's like saying the speed limit on motorways is 70, when 50% of us drive at 80. It's clearly the limit that's wrong.

I've had three of those total so far. The first two, to
earn the doctors a bit of pocket money.

The very first doctor, tried to "bag it in one",
by sending me for a chest XRay. Sorta like a five foot
tall basketball player, trying to slam dunk. And
that little incident was "a swing and a miss". But that's
what I mean by "clunkers", GPs taught how to titrate
BP one drug at a time. And drag things out.

My GPs (I tried three of them) refused to issue any drugs. The cardiologist was keen to try them all though.

The doctor who knew a bit about what he was doing,
he got it right on the very first drug. The
drug is an angiotensin II receptor blocker (ARB).
It's an ARB and a diuretic all in one tablet.
He said "I'm taking this one, and I'm putting you
on it". I presume more science was involved than that :-)
But at least in terms of nailing down the blood
pressure, that was the ticket.

That's also the doctor that sent me off to the
hospital. The doctor writes articles for the newspaper,
which is part of the reason he's a "button pusher".
If anyone knows which button to push on the console,
he's the guy. He made my form submission to the hospital
a little dramatic, but the people at the hospital aren't
idiots and they saw right through that immediately.
After a year of tests, I've seen a video on a doctors
computer screen, of why my heart sucks. A closeup of a
miserly little chamber, with a *lot* of muscle tissue
around it. A little work with an angle grinder should
fix this.

I find it insane in the 21st century that you can't just go into a doctor's surgery and say "fix me", then they do some tests, hand out a drug, and you're sorted. When I take my car into the garage, I just have to say "it's not running smoothly", and the mechanic finds the fault and fixes it. Try that with a doctor and they want details.

"Commander Kinsey" wrote in message
newsp.0qz6mnpiwdg98l@glass...
On Tue, 15 Sep 2020 08:51:32 +0100, Paul wrote:

Commander Kinsey wrote:

160/120
Already have. Not quite as high as yours, but enough to make a
cardiologist's eyes open wide. But I've tried Perindopril, Amlodipine,
Bendroflumethiazide, and Eplerenone, and none did a damn thing. I was
told there were no others.

Question: Can you afford to let the matter drop ?

No choice in the matter.

told there were no other "what" ?

Drugs obviously, as that's what I just listed.

Has anyone tried to root-cause your situation?

2 cardiologists and a neurologist.

It took me about a year to get a result. And like
you, a lot of "clunkers" until you find not
necessarily the right doctor, but at least a
doctor who knows "which button to push on his console".

Have you at least had an echocardiogram ?

With a cardiac echocardiogram, the queue is only a week, and in
terms of instrumentation, it's better than nothing. No radiation.
No machines with tunnels.

All sorts of stuff like that.

And I don't believe high BP is a problem, since alledgedly 1 in 3 people
have it. It's like saying the speed limit on motorways is 70, when 50% of
us drive at 80. It's clearly the limit that's wrong.

I've had three of those total so far. The first two, to
earn the doctors a bit of pocket money.

The very first doctor, tried to "bag it in one",
by sending me for a chest XRay. Sorta like a five foot
tall basketball player, trying to slam dunk. And
that little incident was "a swing and a miss". But that's
what I mean by "clunkers", GPs taught how to titrate
BP one drug at a time. And drag things out.

My GPs (I tried three of them) refused to issue any drugs. The
cardiologist was keen to try them all though.

The doctor who knew a bit about what he was doing,
he got it right on the very first drug. The
drug is an angiotensin II receptor blocker (ARB).
It's an ARB and a diuretic all in one tablet.
He said "I'm taking this one, and I'm putting you
on it". I presume more science was involved than that :-)
But at least in terms of nailing down the blood
pressure, that was the ticket.

That's also the doctor that sent me off to the
hospital. The doctor writes articles for the newspaper,
which is part of the reason he's a "button pusher".
If anyone knows which button to push on the console,
he's the guy. He made my form submission to the hospital
a little dramatic, but the people at the hospital aren't
idiots and they saw right through that immediately.
After a year of tests, I've seen a video on a doctors
computer screen, of why my heart sucks. A closeup of a
miserly little chamber, with a *lot* of muscle tissue
around it. A little work with an angle grinder should
fix this.

I find it insane in the 21st century that you can't just go into a
doctor's surgery and say "fix me", then they do some tests, hand out a
drug, and you're sorted. When I take my car into the garage, I just have
to say "it's not running smoothly", and the mechanic finds the fault and
fixes it. Try that with a doctor and they want details.

Wota terminal ****wit.

On Wed, 16 Sep 2020 07:02:12 +1000, cantankerous trolling geezer Rodent
Speed, the auto-contradicting senile sociopath, blabbered, again:

FLUSH the two subnormal sociopathic cretins' endless absolutely idiotic
blather

--
Another typical retarded "conversation" between Birdbrain and senile Rodent:

Senile Rodent: " Did you ever dig a hole to bury your own ****?"

Birdbrain: "I do if there's no flush toilet around."

Senile Rodent: "Yeah, I prefer camping like that, off by myself with
no dunnys around and have always buried the ****."

MID:

Commander Kinsey wrote:
On Tue, 15 Sep 2020 08:51:32 +0100, Paul wrote:

Commander Kinsey wrote:

160/120
Already have. Not quite as high as yours, but enough to make a
cardiologist's eyes open wide. But I've tried Perindopril, Amlodipine,
Bendroflumethiazide, and Eplerenone, and none did a damn thing. I was
told there were no others.

Question: Can you afford to let the matter drop ?

No choice in the matter.

told there were no other "what" ?

Drugs obviously, as that's what I just listed.

No.

First start with the "name of the syndrome". Something hypertension.

primary
secondary
resistant
malignant
isolated
essential === if cause/type unknown, that's what they call it
postural
... [could be many more names]

Of the 1200 essential drugs the doctors keep in a list,
maybe 200 are cardiac.

And whatever the name is for your condition, you should be
able to find a list for treating it.

The first three of your drugs, look like they were
prescribed by GP (general practitioner). The fourth smacks
of cardiologist. I have Perindopril sitting in the kitchen,
I just took Amlodipine five minutes ago. I take HCTZ instead of your
xxTZ (thiazide compound). HCTZ is a suspected carcinogen, yet
they still prescribe it - potentially cancer of the lips, thirty
years from now. Maybe your Bendroflumethiazide is minus the
carcinogenic part :-) The prescription with the HCTZ has a
"stay out of the sun" sticker, but it doesn't say why to
stay out of the sun. That's harder to look up.

There's no point of looking up analogs of Eplerenone, unless
there is substantive evidence that's the right direction to be
looking. Your cardiologist must have some sort of root cause
in mind, even if you're not using his "flowchart". The
flowchart is there to discover the root cause, so not only
do you get hypertension meds, you also get a suggestion of
what the future holds for you (dropping dead, stroking out, or
whatever is proposed). In my case, they've explained to me
how my heart is messed up, but they're very careful to *never*
use the word transplant. Mainly because I'm not there yet.
And it could also be, that I won't last long enough to see
a transplant. The doctors never go outside their professional
envelope.

And because doctors are not allowed to treat family members,
they can never become emotionally involved in decisions they make.
My brother in law is a doctor, but that doesn't help me one bit.
He has "pushed buttons on his console", to get things done, but
he can never appear to be "treating" one of us. He has to hide in
the shadows and play shadow-puppets. He's the one that helped
my mother get a new pair of hips. She'd been waiting for around
five years, and no progress. So he got her into a queue where
she could actually get some hips (at first, it didn't look like
a surgeon would be available). Still took time, but the
work was finished before COVID came along - perfect timing.
Another few months and she still wouldn't have hips today, so
it was a near miss. That's because all elective surgery here
stopped when COVID hit.

Paul

On Tue, 15 Sep 2020 23:06:19 -0400, Paul, the brain dead, notorious,
troll-feeding, senle asshole, blathered:


No.

First start with the "name of the syndrome". Something hypertension.

primary
secondary

Just WTF is wrong with you, demented troll-feeding senile cretin?

On Wed, 16 Sep 2020 04:06:19 +0100, Paul wrote:

Commander Kinsey wrote:
On Tue, 15 Sep 2020 08:51:32 +0100, Paul wrote:

Commander Kinsey wrote:

160/120
Already have. Not quite as high as yours, but enough to make a
cardiologist's eyes open wide. But I've tried Perindopril, Amlodipine,
Bendroflumethiazide, and Eplerenone, and none did a damn thing. I was
told there were no others.

Question: Can you afford to let the matter drop ?

No choice in the matter.

told there were no other "what" ?

Drugs obviously, as that's what I just listed.

No.

First start with the "name of the syndrome". Something hypertension.

They never gave me one. Since it's high but they don't know why.

primary
secondary
resistant
malignant
isolated
essential === if cause/type unknown, that's what they call it
postural
... [could be many more names]

Of the 1200 essential drugs the doctors keep in a list,
maybe 200 are cardiac.

I was told there were only 4 drugs for high blood pressure.

And whatever the name is for your condition, you should be
able to find a list for treating it.

The first three of your drugs, look like they were
prescribed by GP (general practitioner). The fourth smacks
of cardiologist.

All cardiologist. The GPs refused to issue any. They were too scared to do harm as they have no knowledge of treating such things.

I have Perindopril sitting in the kitchen,
I just took Amlodipine five minutes ago. I take HCTZ instead of your
xxTZ (thiazide compound). HCTZ is a suspected carcinogen, yet
they still prescribe it - potentially cancer of the lips, thirty
years from now. Maybe your Bendroflumethiazide is minus the
carcinogenic part :-) The prescription with the HCTZ has a
"stay out of the sun" sticker, but it doesn't say why to
stay out of the sun. That's harder to look up.

There's no point of looking up analogs of Eplerenone, unless
there is substantive evidence that's the right direction to be
looking. Your cardiologist must have some sort of root cause
in mind, even if you're not using his "flowchart".

No, he has no idea. All tests they did showed I'm in perfect health, except the pressure is way too high. The drugs were tried at random, or in order of how often they have an effect. All he said was some people react to one and some to another, and some to none. Just like some people don't get a cured headache with paracetamol, but they do with ibuprofen.

The flowchart is there to discover the root cause, so not only
do you get hypertension meds, you also get a suggestion of
what the future holds for you (dropping dead, stroking out, or
whatever is proposed). In my case, they've explained to me
how my heart is messed up, but they're very careful to *never*
use the word transplant. Mainly because I'm not there yet.
And it could also be, that I won't last long enough to see
a transplant. The doctors never go outside their professional
envelope.

Well apparently my heart, liver, and kidneys are fine. Whatever is wrong with me has not yet been discovered. But I've had it for 18 years without it causing me to fail any test so it can't be that bad.

And because doctors are not allowed to treat family members,
they can never become emotionally involved in decisions they make.
My brother in law is a doctor, but that doesn't help me one bit.
He has "pushed buttons on his console", to get things done, but
he can never appear to be "treating" one of us. He has to hide in
the shadows and play shadow-puppets.

Red tape bull****. If I was a doctor an a member of my family needed treatment, I'd bloody well do it.

He's the one that helped
my mother get a new pair of hips. She'd been waiting for around
five years, and no progress. So he got her into a queue where
she could actually get some hips (at first, it didn't look like
a surgeon would be available).

Producing cash makes the queue go away.

Still took time, but the
work was finished before COVID came along - perfect timing.
Another few months and she still wouldn't have hips today, so
it was a near miss. That's because all elective surgery here
stopped when COVID hit.

Yip, people dying of cancer because of the fuss about a virus.