Why is it that some people have problems showing up when that is all they
have to do to get the job?

I am in the throes of finishing a kitchen remodel. Something that was
supposed to be fun turned into an ordeal. The wall guys did their thing,
moving some walls, installing new lights, and doing wall things. The
drywall guy came and went, and did his usual outstanding job. The granite
guy came and went, and I don't even remember what he looked like, but left
outstanding granite work. We painted.

The cabinet guy drug his feet, as he was going through a separation, custody
battle, child care issues, and a new husband in law. He did finish the
work, and did a good job, although it was two months late.

He recommended a tile guy. The tile guy came and did an estimate. The
cabinet guy said he did nice work. Others tilers came and left estimates.
We decided to go with the original tile guy. A total of four times, he did
not call or show for appointments. My wife in her haste to get the job done
overlooked this. Then, Friday, he was to come and bring the contract. No
show. No call. I told her not to use him, as he would be unreliable in his
work. She said she would wait until Sunday, and if he hadn't called, she
would find someone else. He hasn't called.

My question is:

Why is it that some people have problems showing up when that is all they
have to do to get the job?

This job was for 850sf of Travertine, and ran about $3750, so wasn't a
piddly little job, IMHO. I have already removed the old floor, and scraped
the concrete.

Steve

i don't know, but i see it ALL THE TIME in the remodeling/building
(independent) trades and it gives the good guys a real bad rep!

--
rosie

"I think Senator Kerry should be proud of his record. No, I don't
think he lied."
.................................................. ...GEORGE W. BUSH
(8-25-04)














"SteveB" wrote in message
news:EmnYc.60477$yh.12687@fed1read05...
: Why is it that some people have problems showing up when that is
all they
: have to do to get the job?
:
: I am in the throes of finishing a kitchen remodel. Something that
was
: supposed to be fun turned into an ordeal. The wall guys did their
thing,
: moving some walls, installing new lights, and doing wall things.
The
: drywall guy came and went, and did his usual outstanding job. The
granite
: guy came and went, and I don't even remember what he looked like,
but left
: outstanding granite work. We painted.
:
: The cabinet guy drug his feet, as he was going through a
separation, custody
: battle, child care issues, and a new husband in law. He did
finish the
: work, and did a good job, although it was two months late.
:
: He recommended a tile guy. The tile guy came and did an estimate.
The
: cabinet guy said he did nice work. Others tilers came and left
estimates.
: We decided to go with the original tile guy. A total of four
times, he did
: not call or show for appointments. My wife in her haste to get
the job done
: overlooked this. Then, Friday, he was to come and bring the
contract. No
: show. No call. I told her not to use him, as he would be
unreliable in his
: work. She said she would wait until Sunday, and if he hadn't
called, she
: would find someone else. He hasn't called.
:
: My question is:
:
: Why is it that some people have problems showing up when that is
all they
: have to do to get the job?
:
: This job was for 850sf of Travertine, and ran about $3750, so
wasn't a
: piddly little job, IMHO. I have already removed the old floor,
and scraped
: the concrete.
:
: Steve
:
:

"SteveB" wrote in message
news:EmnYc.60477$yh.12687@fed1read05...
Why is it that some people have problems showing up when that is all they
have to do to get the job?

I am in the throes of finishing a kitchen remodel. Something that was
supposed to be fun turned into an ordeal. The wall guys did their thing,
moving some walls, installing new lights, and doing wall things. The
drywall guy came and went, and did his usual outstanding job. The granite
guy came and went, and I don't even remember what he looked like, but left
outstanding granite work. We painted.

The cabinet guy drug his feet, as he was going through a separation,
custody
battle, child care issues, and a new husband in law. He did finish the
work, and did a good job, although it was two months late.

He recommended a tile guy. The tile guy came and did an estimate. The
cabinet guy said he did nice work. Others tilers came and left estimates.
We decided to go with the original tile guy. A total of four times, he
did
not call or show for appointments. My wife in her haste to get the job
done
overlooked this. Then, Friday, he was to come and bring the contract. No
show. No call.

Why is it you were surprised about this?

I told her not to use him, as he would be unreliable in his
work. She said she would wait until Sunday,

What does it take to convince your wife he's unreliable?

and if he hadn't called, she
would find someone else. He hasn't called.

My question is:

Why is it that some people have problems showing up when that is all they
have to do to get the job?

Some people are just that way...

My question is:

Why do people give these kinds of people more than one opportunity to prove
they are this way?

Disappoint me once, shame on you...Disappoint me twice, shame on me.

Words to live by.

Brigitte

"SteveB" wrote

My question is:

Why is it that some people have problems showing up when that is all they
have to do to get the job?
Steve

Why did you spend so much time waiting on this person? You should have
dropped them like a hot potatoe.

On Sun, 29 Aug 2004 09:19:50 -0700, "SteveB"
wrote:

Why is it that some people have problems showing up when that is all they
have to do to get the job?

(Snipped for brevity)

He recommended a tile guy. The tile guy came and did an estimate. The
cabinet guy said he did nice work. Others tilers came and left estimates.
We decided to go with the original tile guy. A total of four times, he did
not call or show for appointments. My wife in her haste to get the job done
overlooked this. Then, Friday, he was to come and bring the contract. No
show. No call. I told her not to use him, as he would be unreliable in his
work. She said she would wait until Sunday, and if he hadn't called, she
would find someone else. He hasn't called.

My question is:

Why is it that some people have problems showing up when that is all they
have to do to get the job?

That's why it's ALWAYS better to have 3 or more quotes and letting
the others KNOW you have them. This says "I have others waiting in the
wings"

Frankly, 2 strikes and the cabinet and tile maker would have been
out...

"Gene" wrote


Frankly, 2 strikes and the cabinet and tile maker would have been
out...

I agree. But I am not in charge of the kitchen remodeling. The cabinet guy
custom made the cabinets, and lots of money was hanging in space for quite a
while. $18k all together. I just wanted to get even with him, and then
shoo him away. That time came, we did, and he agreed to come and finish a
lot of small details, which he did. So, no money lost. Had we canned him,
we would have been out a hefty chunk of change, and been looking for someone
to come in and take over in the middle of the job and finish it. Not a good
prospect. And fergeddabout calling the contractor's board or BBB.

With the tile guy, no money has changed hands. Now, the wife is beginning
to see things other than just getting the kitchen finished. Or at least I
hope.

Steve

: In my 15 years as a self employed contractor my grandmother died
at least a
: dozen times.g
:
:
:

YUP!

"Jøn Zone" wrote in message

Why did you spend so much time waiting on this person? You should have
dropped them like a hot potatoe.


Truth is, this happens a lot. Some of the best work is done by some strange
characters and sometimes they are worth waiting for. Sometimes you just
can't get anyone else to do a special job except for the guy with the
personality disorder.

On Sun, 29 Aug 2004 11:32:29 -0500, " rosie"
wrote:

| i don't know, but i see it ALL THE TIME in the remodeling/building
| (independent) trades and it gives the good guys a real bad rep!
|
| --
| rosie
|

I've gone through this my entire 25-year career as owner of an old
house. As only one example, I once called 28 asphalt driveway
contractors in order to get 4 of them to deign to give me an estimate
to replace my drive . Not a cheap job either, and I am quite easy to
deal with, so my manner had nothing to do with it. I could imagine a
few not showing but I called every single one in the phone book to get
more than one guy to respond. Even companies recommended by neighbors
didn't return calls. One guy who came gave me a price that was triple
the other prices! Sheesh.

Likewise, roofers. Likewise masons. And even a very reliable
contractor who once did major renovations on my house couldn't get the
drywall sub to show up for over three weeks, ultimately forcing me to
take off work to paint the new walls day and night to meet my move-in
deadline.

And not all are tradesmen. I had such a hard time finding an architect
or engineer/designer to help us re-design our third floor that I
finally did it myself. Of the three people who did show up, one came
four hours late and brought his two little kids and his two large dogs
with him. He was rude and unpleasant and sarcastic throughout our
entire conversation. Another seemed interested and had good ideas but
never came back with an estimate or a fee schedule and never returned
our calls again. Maybe it's my breath.

Not everyone is like that, however. Our long-time housepainter shows
up right on the dot, every time we call, and has for 20 years.
Landscapers and arborists we have hired from time to time have always
been reliable. And many others show up and do the work as promised.

I think there are a variety of reasons for all this:

1. Some are good at what they do but just not good at business and
scheduling. Their work is hard and they are tired at night. They limp
through life, missing appointments.

2. Some won't or can't say no when the job is not to their liking for
whatever reason. They promise to show but then disappear.

3. Some have a primitive financial outlook and simply live from month
to month. If they don't feel like doing the work and they have enough
money to pay the bills that week or that month they just turn on the
answering machine and go back to bed.

4. They get a better job that takes up all their time and they don't
know how to tell you.

5. They are afraid to turn down work and become overbooked. Business
is too good.

6. They are secret substance abusers who can't get to work reliably.


It's all very annoying, but there are still many good workers out
there who want the job and know how to show up. Gotta be patient --
hey, you had pretty good luck with everyone else on your project

|
|
|
| "SteveB" wrote in message
| news:EmnYc.60477$yh.12687@fed1read05...
| : Why is it that some people have problems showing up when that is
| all they
| : have to do to get the job?
| :
| : I am in the throes of finishing a kitchen remodel. Something that
| was
| : supposed to be fun turned into an ordeal. The wall guys did their
| thing,
| : moving some walls, installing new lights, and doing wall things.
| The
| : drywall guy came and went, and did his usual outstanding job. The
| granite
| : guy came and went, and I don't even remember what he looked like,
| but left
| : outstanding granite work. We painted.
| :
| : The cabinet guy drug his feet, as he was going through a
| separation, custody
| : battle, child care issues, and a new husband in law. He did
| finish the
| : work, and did a good job, although it was two months late.
| :
| : He recommended a tile guy. The tile guy came and did an estimate.
| The
| : cabinet guy said he did nice work. Others tilers came and left
| estimates.
| : We decided to go with the original tile guy. A total of four
| times, he did
| : not call or show for appointments. My wife in her haste to get
| the job done
| : overlooked this. Then, Friday, he was to come and bring the
| contract. No
| : show. No call. I told her not to use him, as he would be
| unreliable in his
| : work. She said she would wait until Sunday, and if he hadn't
| called, she
| : would find someone else. He hasn't called.
| :
| : My question is:
| :
| : Why is it that some people have problems showing up when that is
| all they
| : have to do to get the job?
| :
| : This job was for 850sf of Travertine, and ran about $3750, so
| wasn't a
| : piddly little job, IMHO. I have already removed the old floor,
| and scraped
| : the concrete.
| :
| : Steve
| :
| :
|
|

On Sun, 29 Aug 2004 09:19:50 -0700, "SteveB"
wrote:

Why is it that some people have problems showing up when that is all they
have to do to get the job?

I am in the throes of finishing a kitchen remodel. Something that was
supposed to be fun turned into an ordeal. The wall guys did their thing,
moving some walls, installing new lights, and doing wall things. The
drywall guy came and went, and did his usual outstanding job. The granite
guy came and went, and I don't even remember what he looked like, but left
outstanding granite work. We painted.

The cabinet guy drug his feet, as he was going through a separation, custody
battle, child care issues, and a new husband in law. He did finish the
work, and did a good job, although it was two months late.

He recommended a tile guy. The tile guy came and did an estimate. The
cabinet guy said he did nice work. Others tilers came and left estimates.
We decided to go with the original tile guy. A total of four times, he did
not call or show for appointments. My wife in her haste to get the job done
overlooked this. Then, Friday, he was to come and bring the contract. No
show. No call. I told her not to use him, as he would be unreliable in his
work. She said she would wait until Sunday, and if he hadn't called, she
would find someone else. He hasn't called.

My question is:

Why is it that some people have problems showing up when that is all they
have to do to get the job?

This job was for 850sf of Travertine, and ran about $3750, so wasn't a
piddly little job, IMHO. I have already removed the old floor, and scraped
the concrete.

Steve


Obviously he doesn't want the job or has other fish to fry. It is a
good idea to get several interviews and estimates, then rank them. If
you gave him the benefit of the doubt, he may just do half the work
and stall. Go with your second best choice.

ya i could live with someone saying 'i cant get to it for 3 months' but what
****es me off is the 'ill be there in two weeks' and not showing, then when
you call them they tell you 'two weeks' again.

i try not to ask much of people, just that you do what you say you will do.

randy

"SteveB" wrote in message
news:EmnYc.60477$yh.12687@fed1read05...
Why is it that some people have problems showing up when that is all they
have to do to get the job?

I am in the throes of finishing a kitchen remodel. Something that was
supposed to be fun turned into an ordeal. The wall guys did their thing,
moving some walls, installing new lights, and doing wall things. The
drywall guy came and went, and did his usual outstanding job. The granite
guy came and went, and I don't even remember what he looked like, but left
outstanding granite work. We painted.

The cabinet guy drug his feet, as he was going through a separation,
custody
battle, child care issues, and a new husband in law. He did finish the
work, and did a good job, although it was two months late.

He recommended a tile guy. The tile guy came and did an estimate. The
cabinet guy said he did nice work. Others tilers came and left estimates.
We decided to go with the original tile guy. A total of four times, he
did
not call or show for appointments. My wife in her haste to get the job
done
overlooked this. Then, Friday, he was to come and bring the contract. No
show. No call. I told her not to use him, as he would be unreliable in
his
work. She said she would wait until Sunday, and if he hadn't called, she
would find someone else. He hasn't called.

My question is:

Why is it that some people have problems showing up when that is all they
have to do to get the job?

This job was for 850sf of Travertine, and ran about $3750, so wasn't a
piddly little job, IMHO. I have already removed the old floor, and
scraped
the concrete.

Steve

SteveB writes:

Why is it that some people have problems showing up when that is all
they have to do to get the job?

This is human nature, and has always been thus.

In our relatively free US marketplace, manufactured products hide this.
Finished goods sit on shelves waiting for your purchase. You don't see
the many heartaches and tragedies that went into making them. You can
judge the products without having to deal with the complexities of the
real people who made them.

When you have custom work done, then you have to deal with the human
realities. Much different process. The more "custom" and less
"routine" the work, the worse this applies. More complex, more prone to
error, more unfamiliar to most of us.

This accounts for the popularity and premium pricing of buying new,
finished homes from corporate builders in large developments. You buy a
certain ready product, without the risks and uncertainties of
contracting.

Most people are not very critical buyers of custom work, and that tends
to encourage contractors who are good at weaseling out of specs and
schedules, rather than good at delivering.

The typical contractor is someone who means well and hopes for the best,
but to make the sale promises too much, then delivers halfway, and
finally is most expert at avoiding the consequences.

Tom Miller writes:

As only one example, I once called 28 asphalt driveway
contractors in order to get 4 of them to deign to give me an estimate
to replace my drive .

Perhaps there are only 4 contractors, using 28 different phone numbers?
Common scam, using multiple ads in the phone book. Of course the phone
company is happy to further it.

SteveB wrote:
Why is it that some people have problems showing up when that is all they
have to do to get the job?

I am in the throes of finishing a kitchen remodel.

snipped for brevity

AARGH! We are contemplating starting one, and this is making me phobic!

My question is:

Why is it that some people have problems showing up when that is all they
have to do to get the job?

Contractors not showing up hasn't been our problem in the past. It's
getting the business owners to return the initial phone calls!

What are the majic words? Tell them, "We have a $100k to spend on a
kitchen remodeling job?" [But they wouldn't believe this anyhow when
they hear our address...]

Any suggestions?

FurPaw
--
"Like the reason a dog
Has so many friends
He wags his tail
Instead of his tongue" - Aerosmith

To reply, unleash the dog

rosie wrote:

i don't know, but i see it ALL THE TIME in the remodeling/building
(independent) trades and it gives the good guys a real bad rep!



Are there any good guys?
Where I live, it seems that all contractors are working part-time jobs.
Of all the jobs I have had done by contractors in the last 20 years, 80%
have not completed the jobs. Fortunately, they have not collected the
last payment either, and I have contracted other part-timers to finish
the jobs at a lower cost.
If I was to remodel my kitchen, I would go with Sears, or Lowes, or Home
Depot. They are easier to find when the job is not done right.

On Sun, 29 Aug 2004 15:14:22 -0500, Richard J Kinch
wrote:

| Tom Miller writes:
|
| As only one example, I once called 28 asphalt driveway
| contractors in order to get 4 of them to deign to give me an estimate
| to replace my drive .
|
| Perhaps there are only 4 contractors, using 28 different phone numbers?
| Common scam, using multiple ads in the phone book. Of course the phone
| company is happy to further it.


I understand what you are saying, but in this case, nah. I live in a
major metropolitan area (next to New York City) and there is no
shortage of contractors. These names were not all from the phone book,
either, but from friends' rolledexes too.

"Bill Schnakenberg" wrote in message
...
rosie wrote:

i don't know, but i see it ALL THE TIME in the remodeling/building
(independent) trades and it gives the good guys a real bad rep!


Are there any good guys?
Where I live, it seems that all contractors are working part-time jobs.
Of all the jobs I have had done by contractors in the last 20 years, 80%
have not completed the jobs. Fortunately, they have not collected the last
payment either, and I have contracted other part-timers to finish the jobs
at a lower cost.
If I was to remodel my kitchen, I would go with Sears, or Lowes, or Home
Depot. They are easier to find when the job is not done right.

The cabinets were MUCH higher cost at Home Depot, and FERGEDDABOUT! anything
that wasn't the same size as the pictures in the catalogs. Home Depot would
have run about $7k more FOR JUST THE CABINETS. Granite would have been just
about double.

And what's your point about HD being easy to find if you have problems? We
had problems with doors we bought at HD, and they weren't a lot of help
after the sale. You are naive if you think you can do anything when a
megacorporation doesn't do a good job. They have attorneys on retainer just
to keep you in court until you die, commit suicide, or just go away.

Or at least that has been my experience.

Steve

"Bill Schnakenberg" wrote in message
...
rosie wrote:

i don't know, but i see it ALL THE TIME in the remodeling/building
(independent) trades and it gives the good guys a real bad rep!



Are there any good guys?
Where I live, it seems that all contractors are working part-time jobs.
Of all the jobs I have had done by contractors in the last 20 years, 80%
have not completed the jobs. Fortunately, they have not collected the
last payment either, and I have contracted other part-timers to finish
the jobs at a lower cost.
If I was to remodel my kitchen, I would go with Sears, or Lowes, or Home
Depot. They are easier to find when the job is not done right.


Yea...those companies sub out to the same guys that wont show....
But..you knew that right?

for the most part - my kitchen remodel went flawlessly. I did spend the
$100 for the HD design services as it gave me great ideas. NOW, mine was a
smalllll job - fit in between BIG jobs - start to finish 5 days. painter 2
days; counter 1 afternoon.

had a great "handyman" do handcrafted molding after an OUTSTANDING painting
contractor finished.

BUT in the past I have also had the nightmare contractor stories and finally
understand that contractor calendars are different from Roman calendars. 2
weeks includes the delays and runs for parts, that are not part of the 2
weeks. SIGH
__________________________
Totus Tuus
Claudia Satori

Steve@carolinabreezehvac wrote:

"Bill Schnakenberg" wrote in message
...


rosie wrote:



i don't know, but i see it ALL THE TIME in the remodeling/building
(independent) trades and it gives the good guys a real bad rep!





Are there any good guys?
Where I live, it seems that all contractors are working part-time jobs.
Of all the jobs I have had done by contractors in the last 20 years, 80%
have not completed the jobs. Fortunately, they have not collected the
last payment either, and I have contracted other part-timers to finish
the jobs at a lower cost.
If I was to remodel my kitchen, I would go with Sears, or Lowes, or Home
Depot. They are easier to find when the job is not done right.




Yea...those companies sub out to the same guys that wont show....
But..you knew that right?


Yep, but I didn't sign a contract with those guys. I signed with the big
name store. The big name store doesn't move out of the area, or go
bankrupt, or skip off with the company money. The big name store is
responsible for completion of the job.

"Bill Schnakenberg" wrote

Yep, but I didn't sign a contract with those guys. I signed with the big
name store. The big name store doesn't move out of the area, or go
bankrupt, or skip off with the company money. The big name store is
responsible for completion of the job.

All they are is a bigger turnip that you are trying to get blood out of.
You make it sound as if you can actually MAKE them do something. That has
not been my experience. And I have heard many stories, and read many
stories here of people who had negative experiences with the big name
stores.

So, either way, ya pays ya money and ya takes ya chances.

Steve

Well, Carlos, the no show is history.

I called the granite guy who did an outstanding job, and he recommended
Kirby. Kirby came by this morning and looked at the job. He starts
tomorrow morning, and he is bidding less than the others.

We'll see how it goes.

I just hope I don't shoot someone before all this is
over...........................

Steve