How does the hysteresis work on the Honeywell old-style bulb thermostat?

My house has two of those tan round things, with a dial that has
only two indicators.
1. The desired temperature on top, and......
2. The current temperature on bottom.

I understand that the heat overshoots on the current temperature
and that it lets the current temp go below the set temperature,
so that the gas furnaces are not constantly turning on and off
exactly at the set temperature.

That makes sense (from a wear and tear and noise standpoint).

I call that delayed on and off time the "hysteresis" (but you can
call it whatever it's really called).

Pulling off the cover, I see a mercury bulb inside, which is at the
end of a curved metal strip (bi-metallic perhaps?), which explains
the *initial* on/off mechanism is from the expansion and contraction
of the coiled flat strip kicking the mercury switch on and off.

This can't be the actual on/off of the furnace, because hysteresis
decrees that the on time of the furnace itself is after the mercury
turns it on and so is the off time of the furnace being after the
mercury turns it off.

I can easily test this, simply by turning the thermostat to a
high or low temperature, where the actual on/off of the furnace
blower (and later, the heat) is something like a couple of
minutes delayed.

I get all that - but what I don't understand is *where* the
hysteresis is built in? Is it in the computer? Is there a dial
that sets the temperature range of the hysteresis? Is there
a potentiometer?

How do we *change* or *set* how much hysteresis there is?
Specifically, how do I get *more* hysteresis in my furnace?

On Saturday, December 26, 2015 at 2:38:03 PM UTC-6, Kirk Landaur wrote:
How does the hysteresis work on the Honeywell old-style bulb thermostat?

My house has two of those tan round things, with a dial that has
only two indicators.
1. The desired temperature on top, and......
2. The current temperature on bottom.

I understand that the heat overshoots on the current temperature
and that it lets the current temp go below the set temperature,
so that the gas furnaces are not constantly turning on and off
exactly at the set temperature.

That makes sense (from a wear and tear and noise standpoint).

I call that delayed on and off time the "hysteresis" (but you can
call it whatever it's really called).

Pulling off the cover, I see a mercury bulb inside, which is at the
end of a curved metal strip (bi-metallic perhaps?), which explains
the *initial* on/off mechanism is from the expansion and contraction
of the coiled flat strip kicking the mercury switch on and off.

This can't be the actual on/off of the furnace, because hysteresis
decrees that the on time of the furnace itself is after the mercury
turns it on and so is the off time of the furnace being after the
mercury turns it off.

I can easily test this, simply by turning the thermostat to a
high or low temperature, where the actual on/off of the furnace
blower (and later, the heat) is something like a couple of
minutes delayed.

I get all that - but what I don't understand is *where* the
hysteresis is built in? Is it in the computer? Is there a dial
that sets the temperature range of the hysteresis? Is there
a potentiometer?

How do we *change* or *set* how much hysteresis there is?
Specifically, how do I get *more* hysteresis in my furnace?

Inside you'll see a sliding resistor called an "Anticipator" which provides a tiny amount of heat to fool the thermostat. ヽ(€¢€¿€¢)ノ

http://www.familyhandyman.com/heatin...ostat/view-all

http://homerepair.about.com/od/heati...nticipator.htm

[8~{} Uncle HVAC Monster

On 12/26/2015 12:37 PM, Kirk Landaur wrote:
How does the hysteresis work on the Honeywell old-style bulb thermostat?

My house has two of those tan round things, with a dial that has
only two indicators.
1. The desired temperature on top, and......
2. The current temperature on bottom.

I understand that the heat overshoots on the current temperature
and that it lets the current temp go below the set temperature,
so that the gas furnaces are not constantly turning on and off
exactly at the set temperature.

That makes sense (from a wear and tear and noise standpoint).

I call that delayed on and off time the "hysteresis" (but you can
call it whatever it's really called).

Pulling off the cover, I see a mercury bulb inside, which is at the
end of a curved metal strip (bi-metallic perhaps?), which explains
the *initial* on/off mechanism is from the expansion and contraction
of the coiled flat strip kicking the mercury switch on and off.

This can't be the actual on/off of the furnace, because hysteresis
decrees that the on time of the furnace itself is after the mercury
turns it on and so is the off time of the furnace being after the
mercury turns it off.

I can easily test this, simply by turning the thermostat to a
high or low temperature, where the actual on/off of the furnace
blower (and later, the heat) is something like a couple of
minutes delayed.

I get all that - but what I don't understand is *where* the
hysteresis is built in? Is it in the computer? Is there a dial
that sets the temperature range of the hysteresis? Is there
a potentiometer?

How do we *change* or *set* how much hysteresis there is?
Specifically, how do I get *more* hysteresis in my furnace?


The hysteresis is set on the thermostat. I used to have one of those old
Honeywell units and as I recall it had a calibrated sub-dial that set
the hysteresis temperature range. Something like 0.5 degrees to around 3
degrees (F). You simply moved this sub-dial to the over/undershoot range
you desired.

Of course this info may well be searchable, rather than depending on
memory...

John :-#)#

--
(Please post followups or tech inquiries to the USENET newsgroup)
John's Jukes Ltd. 2343 Main St., Vancouver, BC, Canada V5T 3C9
(604)872-5757 or Fax 872-2010 (Pinballs, Jukes, Video Games)
www.flippers.com
"Old pinballers never die, they just flip out."

It's the weight of the mercury that moves the bimetal coil spring such that
it takes a higher temperature to bend the bimetal coil spring so that the
mercury flows back to the other end of the bulb. When the mercury moves to
one end of the bulb, it makes the spring reposition itself so that it takes
a much higher (or lower, depending on heat or cool mode) for the spring to
return back to its original position.
Here's a link to a web page that describes the operation very well, saving
me a lot of typing.
http://inspectapedia.com/heat/Thermo...e_Response.php

Cheers,
Dave M

Kirk Landaur wrote:
How does the hysteresis work on the Honeywell old-style bulb
thermostat?

My house has two of those tan round things, with a dial that has
only two indicators.
1. The desired temperature on top, and......
2. The current temperature on bottom.

I understand that the heat overshoots on the current temperature
and that it lets the current temp go below the set temperature,
so that the gas furnaces are not constantly turning on and off
exactly at the set temperature.

That makes sense (from a wear and tear and noise standpoint).

I call that delayed on and off time the "hysteresis" (but you can
call it whatever it's really called).

Pulling off the cover, I see a mercury bulb inside, which is at the
end of a curved metal strip (bi-metallic perhaps?), which explains
the *initial* on/off mechanism is from the expansion and contraction
of the coiled flat strip kicking the mercury switch on and off.

This can't be the actual on/off of the furnace, because hysteresis
decrees that the on time of the furnace itself is after the mercury
turns it on and so is the off time of the furnace being after the
mercury turns it off.

I can easily test this, simply by turning the thermostat to a
high or low temperature, where the actual on/off of the furnace
blower (and later, the heat) is something like a couple of
minutes delayed.

I get all that - but what I don't understand is *where* the
hysteresis is built in? Is it in the computer? Is there a dial
that sets the temperature range of the hysteresis? Is there
a potentiometer?

How do we *change* or *set* how much hysteresis there is?
Specifically, how do I get *more* hysteresis in my furnace?

On Sat, 26 Dec 2015 12:49:29 -0800, Uncle Monster wrote:

Inside you'll see a sliding resistor called an "Anticipator"
which provides a tiny amount of heat to fool the thermostat.
ヽ(€¢€¿€¢)ノ

Is this the anticipator?
http://i63.tinypic.com/280nvqs.jpg

Mine is currently set at 0.55 I think (if I'm reading the right thing).

Notice the distances get spread out non-linearly to the one end:
(1.2, 1.0, .9, .8, .7, .6, .5, .4, .3, .25, .2, .15, .12, .10)

It has a confusingly labeled slider that has "LONGER" and an arrow
indented on it.

The LONGER indent and the arrow fight each other.

On the one hand, the LONGER on one end *implies* that's the end
where the slider makes the hysteresis longer; but, on the other
hand, the arrow points in the opposite direction, which implies
the hysteresis is longer in the other direction?

Do you have experience with this confusing setup?

Mine is currently set to one side, but I want the hysteresis
to be greater.

To increase hysteresis, should I slide the slider toward LONGER?
Or should I slide the slider more towards the direction of the arrow?

Kirk Landaur wrote:
How does the hysteresis work on the Honeywell old-style bulb thermostat?

My house has two of those tan round things, with a dial that has
only two indicators.
1. The desired temperature on top, and......
2. The current temperature on bottom.

I understand that the heat overshoots on the current temperature
and that it lets the current temp go below the set temperature,
so that the gas furnaces are not constantly turning on and off
exactly at the set temperature.

That makes sense (from a wear and tear and noise standpoint).

I call that delayed on and off time the "hysteresis" (but you can
call it whatever it's really called).

Pulling off the cover, I see a mercury bulb inside, which is at the
end of a curved metal strip (bi-metallic perhaps?), which explains
the *initial* on/off mechanism is from the expansion and contraction
of the coiled flat strip kicking the mercury switch on and off.

This can't be the actual on/off of the furnace, because hysteresis
decrees that the on time of the furnace itself is after the mercury
turns it on and so is the off time of the furnace being after the
mercury turns it off.

I can easily test this, simply by turning the thermostat to a
high or low temperature, where the actual on/off of the furnace
blower (and later, the heat) is something like a couple of
minutes delayed.

I get all that - but what I don't understand is *where* the
hysteresis is built in? Is it in the computer? Is there a dial
that sets the temperature range of the hysteresis? Is there
a potentiometer?

How do we *change* or *set* how much hysteresis there is?
Specifically, how do I get *more* hysteresis in my furnace?

What are you trying to accomplish? To make things worse?
That is just dumb thermostat. Only thing you can set is anticipator.
And remember metal fatigue, bimetal strip calibration goes off with
age. I'd just replace them with decent smart digital programmable ones.
With this you can adjust some things in the service mode at initial
installation.

On Saturday, December 26, 2015 at 3:14:45 PM UTC-6, Kirk Landaur wrote:
On Sat, 26 Dec 2015 12:49:29 -0800, Uncle Monster wrote:

Inside you'll see a sliding resistor called an "Anticipator"
which provides a tiny amount of heat to fool the thermostat.
ヽ(€¢€¿€¢)ノ

Is this the anticipator?
http://i63.tinypic.com/280nvqs.jpg

Mine is currently set at 0.55 I think (if I'm reading the right thing).

Notice the distances get spread out non-linearly to the one end:
(1.2, 1.0, .9, .8, .7, .6, .5, .4, .3, .25, .2, .15, .12, .10)

It has a confusingly labeled slider that has "LONGER" and an arrow
indented on it.

The LONGER indent and the arrow fight each other.

On the one hand, the LONGER on one end *implies* that's the end
where the slider makes the hysteresis longer; but, on the other
hand, the arrow points in the opposite direction, which implies
the hysteresis is longer in the other direction?

Do you have experience with this confusing setup?

Mine is currently set to one side, but I want the hysteresis
to be greater.

To increase hysteresis, should I slide the slider toward LONGER?
Or should I slide the slider more towards the direction of the arrow?

Here's a link to a site that explains it better than I could in a post. ヽ(ヅ)ノ

http://inspectapedia.com/heat/Heat_A..._Adustment.php

[8~{} Uncle Heat Monster

Kirk Landaur wrote:
On Sat, 26 Dec 2015 12:49:29 -0800, Uncle Monster wrote:

Inside you'll see a sliding resistor called an "Anticipator"
which provides a tiny amount of heat to fool the thermostat.
ヽ(€¢€¿€¢)ノ

Is this the anticipator?
http://i63.tinypic.com/280nvqs.jpg

Mine is currently set at 0.55 I think (if I'm reading the right thing).

Notice the distances get spread out non-linearly to the one end:
(1.2, 1.0, .9, .8, .7, .6, .5, .4, .3, .25, .2, .15, .12, .10)

It has a confusingly labeled slider that has "LONGER" and an arrow
indented on it.

The LONGER indent and the arrow fight each other.

On the one hand, the LONGER on one end *implies* that's the end
where the slider makes the hysteresis longer; but, on the other
hand, the arrow points in the opposite direction, which implies
the hysteresis is longer in the other direction?

Do you have experience with this confusing setup?

Mine is currently set to one side, but I want the hysteresis
to be greater.

To increase hysteresis, should I slide the slider toward LONGER?
Or should I slide the slider more towards the direction of the arrow?

General rule of thumb on anticipator is matching the number on dial same
as current draw on your gas valve. You can play with setting it
little higher or lower. I used to set it slightly higher than gas valve
rating considering the length of wiring from furnace to thermostat.
Again go digital.

Dave M wrote:
It's the weight of the mercury that moves the bimetal coil spring such that
it takes a higher temperature to bend the bimetal coil spring so that the
mercury flows back to the other end of the bulb. When the mercury moves to
one end of the bulb, it makes the spring reposition itself so that it takes
a much higher (or lower, depending on heat or cool mode) for the spring to
return back to its original position.
Here's a link to a web page that describes the operation very well, saving
me a lot of typing.
http://inspectapedia.com/heat/Thermo...e_Response.php

Cheers,

Dave M

I think you are thinking backward. Spring controls the position of bulb
depending on temperature. Not the other way around.


Kirk Landaur wrote:
How does the hysteresis work on the Honeywell old-style bulb
thermostat?

My house has two of those tan round things, with a dial that has
only two indicators.
1. The desired temperature on top, and......
2. The current temperature on bottom.

I understand that the heat overshoots on the current temperature
and that it lets the current temp go below the set temperature,
so that the gas furnaces are not constantly turning on and off
exactly at the set temperature.

That makes sense (from a wear and tear and noise standpoint).

I call that delayed on and off time the "hysteresis" (but you can
call it whatever it's really called).

Pulling off the cover, I see a mercury bulb inside, which is at the
end of a curved metal strip (bi-metallic perhaps?), which explains
the *initial* on/off mechanism is from the expansion and contraction
of the coiled flat strip kicking the mercury switch on and off.

This can't be the actual on/off of the furnace, because hysteresis
decrees that the on time of the furnace itself is after the mercury
turns it on and so is the off time of the furnace being after the
mercury turns it off.

I can easily test this, simply by turning the thermostat to a
high or low temperature, where the actual on/off of the furnace
blower (and later, the heat) is something like a couple of
minutes delayed.

I get all that - but what I don't understand is *where* the
hysteresis is built in? Is it in the computer? Is there a dial
that sets the temperature range of the hysteresis? Is there
a potentiometer?

How do we *change* or *set* how much hysteresis there is?
Specifically, how do I get *more* hysteresis in my furnace?

Ralph Mowery wrote:
"Kirk Landaur" wrote in message
...
How does the hysteresis work on the Honeywell old-style bulb thermostat?

My house has two of those tan round things, with a dial that has
only two indicators.
1. The desired temperature on top, and......
2. The current temperature on bottom.

I understand that the heat overshoots on the current temperature
and that it lets the current temp go below the set temperature,
so that the gas furnaces are not constantly turning on and off
exactly at the set temperature.

That makes sense (from a wear and tear and noise standpoint).

I call that delayed on and off time the "hysteresis" (but you can
call it whatever it's really called).
and
Pulling off the cover, I see a mercury bulb inside, which is at the
end of a curved metal strip (bi-metallic perhaps?), which explains
the *initial* on/off mechanism is from the expansion and contraction
of the coiled flat strip kicking the mercury switch on and off.

This can't be the actual on/off of the furnace, because hysteresis
decrees that the on time of the furnace itself is after the mercury
turns it on and so is the off time of the furnace being after the
mercury turns it off.

I can easily test this, simply by turning the thermostat to a
high or low temperature, where the actual on/off of the furnace
blower (and later, the heat) is something like a couple of
minutes delayed.

I get all that - but what I don't understand is *where* the
hysteresis is built in? Is it in the computer? Is there a dial
that sets the temperature range of the hysteresis? Is there
a potentiometer?

How do we *change* or *set* how much hysteresis there is?
Specifically, how do I get *more* hysteresis in my furnace?


Part of it is in the house its self. It takes a while for the air and walls
in the house to heat up. Then the thermostat cuts off, but the air handler
will blow for a while to cool off the frunace heat chamber. The furnace
should have a control for this near the heat chamber. Say the house over
shoots 2 degrees during all of this. Then it cools down and the furnace
starts back up.


That is why blower does not come on with flame on, does not go off with
flame off(this going off delay is usually adjustable at the control board)

"Kirk Landaur" wrote in message
...
How does the hysteresis work on the Honeywell old-style bulb thermostat?

My house has two of those tan round things, with a dial that has
only two indicators.
1. The desired temperature on top, and......
2. The current temperature on bottom.

I understand that the heat overshoots on the current temperature
and that it lets the current temp go below the set temperature,
so that the gas furnaces are not constantly turning on and off
exactly at the set temperature.

That makes sense (from a wear and tear and noise standpoint).

I call that delayed on and off time the "hysteresis" (but you can
call it whatever it's really called).

Pulling off the cover, I see a mercury bulb inside, which is at the
end of a curved metal strip (bi-metallic perhaps?), which explains
the *initial* on/off mechanism is from the expansion and contraction
of the coiled flat strip kicking the mercury switch on and off.

This can't be the actual on/off of the furnace, because hysteresis
decrees that the on time of the furnace itself is after the mercury
turns it on and so is the off time of the furnace being after the
mercury turns it off.

I can easily test this, simply by turning the thermostat to a
high or low temperature, where the actual on/off of the furnace
blower (and later, the heat) is something like a couple of
minutes delayed.

I get all that - but what I don't understand is *where* the
hysteresis is built in? Is it in the computer? Is there a dial
that sets the temperature range of the hysteresis? Is there
a potentiometer?

How do we *change* or *set* how much hysteresis there is?
Specifically, how do I get *more* hysteresis in my furnace?


Part of it is in the house its self. It takes a while for the air and walls
in the house to heat up. Then the thermostat cuts off, but the air handler
will blow for a while to cool off the frunace heat chamber. The furnace
should have a control for this near the heat chamber. Say the house over
shoots 2 degrees during all of this. Then it cools down and the furnace
starts back up.

On 12/26/2015 3:55 PM, John Robertson wrote:
The hysteresis is set on the thermostat. I used to have one of those old
Honeywell units and as I recall it had a calibrated sub-dial that set
the hysteresis temperature range. Something like 0.5 degrees to around 3
degrees (F). You simply moved this sub-dial to the over/undershoot range
you desired.
...

That is the "anticipator", not hysteresis setting. It is actually a
heater that warms the thermostat in anticipation of the room heating up
and minimizing overshoot.

On 12/26/2015 3:58 PM, Dave M wrote:
It's the weight of the mercury that moves the bimetal coil spring such that
it takes a higher temperature to bend the bimetal coil spring so that the
mercury flows back to the other end of the bulb. When the mercury moves to
one end of the bulb, it makes the spring reposition itself so that it takes
a much higher (or lower, depending on heat or cool mode) for the spring to
return back to its original position. ...

Yes!

On 12/26/2015 4:14 PM, Kirk Landaur wrote:
On Sat, 26 Dec 2015 12:49:29 -0800, Uncle Monster wrote:

Inside you'll see a sliding resistor called an "Anticipator"
which provides a tiny amount of heat to fool the thermostat.
ヽ(€¢€¿€¢)ノ

Is this the anticipator?
http://i63.tinypic.com/280nvqs.jpg

Yes

...
On the one hand, the LONGER on one end *implies* that's the end
where the slider makes the hysteresis longer; but, on the other
hand, the arrow points in the opposite direction, which implies
the hysteresis is longer in the other direction?
...

The anticipator has nothing to do with hysteresis. It's adjustable to
account for different currents that are drawn by different "heaters".
Once adjusted to the current that your heater draws, it will put heat
into the thermostat to anticipate the room heating up.

Tony Hwang wrote:

Dave M wrote:
It's the weight of the mercury that moves the bimetal coil spring such that
it takes a higher temperature to bend the bimetal coil spring so that the
mercury flows back to the other end of the bulb. When the mercury moves to
one end of the bulb, it makes the spring reposition itself so that it takes
a much higher (or lower, depending on heat or cool mode) for the spring to
return back to its original position.
Here's a link to a web page that describes the operation very well, saving
me a lot of typing.
http://inspectapedia.com/heat/Thermo...e_Response.php

Cheers,

Dave M

I think you are thinking backward. Spring controls the position of bulb
depending on temperature. Not the other way around.


They are interactive.

Kirk Landaur wrote:

How does the hysteresis work on the Honeywell old-style bulb thermostat?

My house has two of those tan round things, with a dial that has
only two indicators.
1. The desired temperature on top, and......
2. The current temperature on bottom.

I understand that the heat overshoots on the current temperature
and that it lets the current temp go below the set temperature,
so that the gas furnaces are not constantly turning on and off
exactly at the set temperature.

That makes sense (from a wear and tear and noise standpoint).

I call that delayed on and off time the "hysteresis" (but you can
call it whatever it's really called).

Pulling off the cover, I see a mercury bulb inside, which is at the
end of a curved metal strip (bi-metallic perhaps?), which explains
the *initial* on/off mechanism is from the expansion and contraction
of the coiled flat strip kicking the mercury switch on and off.

This can't be the actual on/off of the furnace, because hysteresis
decrees that the on time of the furnace itself is after the mercury
turns it on and so is the off time of the furnace being after the
mercury turns it off.

I can easily test this, simply by turning the thermostat to a
high or low temperature, where the actual on/off of the furnace
blower (and later, the heat) is something like a couple of
minutes delayed.

I get all that - but what I don't understand is *where* the
hysteresis is built in? Is it in the computer? Is there a dial
that sets the temperature range of the hysteresis? Is there
a potentiometer?

How do we *change* or *set* how much hysteresis there is?
Specifically, how do I get *more* hysteresis in my furnace?


Have you read the instructions for the thermostat?

https://customer.honeywell.com/resources/techlit/TechLitDocuments/60-0000s/60-0830.pdf

On Sat, 26 Dec 2015 14:20:25 -0700, Tony Hwang wrote:

What are you trying to accomplish?

I'm simply trying to make the hysteresis of longer duration.

On Sat, 26 Dec 2015 21:14:41 +0000, Kirk Landaur wrote:

Is this the anticipator?
http://i63.tinypic.com/280nvqs.jpg

This seems to be the correct URL to the picture.
http://oi63.tinypic.com/280nvqs.jpg

Notice the "LONGER" and "------" fight each other.

Kirk Landaur wrote:
On Sat, 26 Dec 2015 14:20:25 -0700, Tony Hwang wrote:

What are you trying to accomplish?

I'm simply trying to make the hysteresis of longer duration.

Then move the anticipator to higher number from what it is now.
When we were running 4 stores in the past, one store had that
old thermostat, I played with it during summer cooling, winter heating
months.
After all that time spent, I drew a conclusion original setting was best
optimized setting. Eventually I replaced it with digital 7 day
programmable thermostat which realized some savings on utility bill.

On 12/26/2015 5:37 PM, Michael A. Terrell wrote:


Have you read the instructions for the thermostat?

https://customer.honeywell.com/resources/techlit/TechLitDocuments/60-0000s/60-0830.pdf


Men never read instructions. Nor ask travel
directions. It's part of the male code. We
can also pretty much always find a place to
go potty, even if it's behind second base in
a crowded baseball theatre. No guy will ever
comment on another guy who is.... no comment.

When I was doing AC installs, we'd jump R to W
with AC ammeter, and then use that figure to set
the slider in the old style round stat.

--
..
Christopher A. Young
learn more about Jesus
.. www.lds.org
..
..

On Saturday, December 26, 2015 at 3:58:56 PM UTC-5, Dave M wrote:
It's the weight of the mercury that moves the bimetal coil spring such that
it takes a higher temperature to bend the bimetal coil spring so that the
mercury flows back to the other end of the bulb. When the mercury moves to
one end of the bulb, it makes the spring reposition itself so that it takes
a much higher (or lower, depending on heat or cool mode) for the spring to
return back to its original position.
Here's a link to a web page that describes the operation very well, saving
me a lot of typing.
http://inspectapedia.com/heat/Thermo...e_Response.php

Cheers,
Dave M


That would be how I would think it would work too. Once the mercury
rolls in one direction, it's going to take X amount of temp change
to make it shift enough to roll back the other way. That's the
hysteresis. As othere have said, the anticipator just heats the
thermostat so that it opens a bit early, to avoid overshooting. The
anticipator can be set. I haven't seen an old mercury type thermostat
where you could set the hysteresis.

They are related.
The weight of the mercury provides an
Amount of hysteresis that is usually excessive.
The anticipator heater resistor allows you the reduce
the hysteresis to the desired value.
The anticipator provides negative hysteresis
if you want to think of it that way.
To the OP. Simply take a note or photo
of where the setting is now? then move
it and see what happens.
If it does the opposite of what you want
move it the other way.
M

Kirk Landaur wrote:
On Sat, 26 Dec 2015 21:14:41 +0000, Kirk Landaur wrote:

Is this the anticipator?
http://i63.tinypic.com/280nvqs.jpg

This seems to be the correct URL to the picture.
http://oi63.tinypic.com/280nvqs.jpg

Notice the "LONGER" and "------" fight each other.



No they don't. Following your picture in the URL above,
the numbers on the scale go from 1.2 to .10 (left to right).

The 'LONGER' label indicates what happens when you move the pointer in
the direction indicated below it by the arrow. Moving the pointer to
the left, to a higher number say from .2 to .3, in the direction of the
arrow, makes whatever you are adjusting 'LONGER'. No ambiguity there at
all, except for what that 'LONGER' adjustment is specifically doing (I
guess that would be in the manual).

S.

On 12/26/2015 02:37 PM, Kirk Landaur wrote:

[snip]

I get all that - but what I don't understand is *where* the
hysteresis is built in? Is it in the computer? Is there a dial
that sets the temperature range of the hysteresis? Is there
a potentiometer?

The mercury switch provides some hysteresis.

How do we *change* or *set* how much hysteresis there is?
Specifically, how do I get *more* hysteresis in my furnace?



--
Mark Lloyd
http://notstupid.us/

"In fact, when you get right down to it, almost every explanation Man
came up with for *anything* until about 1926 was stupid." [Dave Barry]

Tony Hwang wrote:
Dave M wrote:
It's the weight of the mercury that moves the bimetal coil spring
such that it takes a higher temperature to bend the bimetal coil
spring so that the mercury flows back to the other end of the bulb. When
the mercury moves to one end of the bulb, it makes the spring
reposition itself so that it takes a much higher (or lower,
depending on heat or cool mode) for the spring to return back to its
original position. Here's a link to a web page that describes the
operation very well,
saving me a lot of typing.
http://inspectapedia.com/heat/Thermo...e_Response.php

Cheers,

Dave M

I think you are thinking backward. Spring controls the position of
bulb depending on temperature. Not the other way around.


Kirk Landaur wrote


Yep, I understand that the "Spring controls the position of bulb depending
on temperature". That was, I thought, my intention to describe. When the
spring bends far enough to tip the bulb, the weight of the mercury in the
bulb swings the bulb a bit farther , requiring the temperature to cause a
greater swing in the other direction to make it switch back. That's where
the hysteresis comes from. That was the question from the OP, which is what
I was trying to answer.

cheers,
Dave M

"Mark Lloyd" wrote in message
...
On 12/26/2015 02:37 PM, Kirk Landaur wrote:

[snip]

I get all that - but what I don't understand is *where* the
hysteresis is built in? Is it in the computer? Is there a dial
that sets the temperature range of the hysteresis? Is there
a potentiometer?

The mercury switch provides some hysteresis.

How do we *change* or *set* how much hysteresis there is?
Specifically, how do I get *more* hysteresis in my furnace?



--

That's the main reason it is so important to level the t-stat.

Dave M wrote:
Tony Hwang wrote:
Dave M wrote:
It's the weight of the mercury that moves the bimetal coil spring
such that it takes a higher temperature to bend the bimetal coil
spring so that the mercury flows back to the other end of the bulb.
When the mercury moves to one end of the bulb, it makes the spring
reposition itself so that it takes a much higher (or lower,
depending on heat or cool mode) for the spring to return back to its
original position. Here's a link to a web page that describes the
operation very well,
saving me a lot of typing.
http://inspectapedia.com/heat/Thermo...e_Response.php

Cheers,

Dave M

I think you are thinking backward. Spring controls the position of
bulb depending on temperature. Not the other way around.


Kirk Landaur wrote


Yep, I understand that the "Spring controls the position of bulb
depending on temperature". That was, I thought, my intention to
describe. When the spring bends far enough to tip the bulb, the
weight of the mercury in the bulb swings the bulb a bit farther ,
requiring the temperature to cause a greater swing in the other
direction to make it switch back. That's where the hysteresis comes
from. That was the question from the OP, which is what I was trying
to answer.
cheers,
Dave M

I forgot to add that, in more direct response to the OP's question, that the
hysteresis (temperature difference required to switch the HVAC unit from off
to on, and back to off) is created by the temperature characteristics of the
bimetal spring, the weight of the mercury ball (both unchangeable by the
user), and modified by the anticipator resistor.

More Cheers,
Dave M

In sci.electronics.repair Tony Hwang wrote:
Ralph Mowery wrote:
"Kirk Landaur" wrote in message
...
How does the hysteresis work on the Honeywell old-style bulb thermostat?

My house has two of those tan round things, with a dial that has
only two indicators.
1. The desired temperature on top, and......
2. The current temperature on bottom.

I understand that the heat overshoots on the current temperature
and that it lets the current temp go below the set temperature,
so that the gas furnaces are not constantly turning on and off
exactly at the set temperature.

That makes sense (from a wear and tear and noise standpoint).

I call that delayed on and off time the "hysteresis" (but you can
call it whatever it's really called).
and
Pulling off the cover, I see a mercury bulb inside, which is at the
end of a curved metal strip (bi-metallic perhaps?), which explains
the *initial* on/off mechanism is from the expansion and contraction
of the coiled flat strip kicking the mercury switch on and off.

This can't be the actual on/off of the furnace, because hysteresis
decrees that the on time of the furnace itself is after the mercury
turns it on and so is the off time of the furnace being after the
mercury turns it off.

I can easily test this, simply by turning the thermostat to a
high or low temperature, where the actual on/off of the furnace
blower (and later, the heat) is something like a couple of
minutes delayed.

I get all that - but what I don't understand is *where* the
hysteresis is built in? Is it in the computer? Is there a dial
that sets the temperature range of the hysteresis? Is there
a potentiometer?

How do we *change* or *set* how much hysteresis there is?
Specifically, how do I get *more* hysteresis in my furnace?


Part of it is in the house its self. It takes a while for the air and walls
in the house to heat up. Then the thermostat cuts off, but the air handler
will blow for a while to cool off the frunace heat chamber. The furnace
should have a control for this near the heat chamber. Say the house over
shoots 2 degrees during all of this. Then it cools down and the furnace
starts back up.


That is why blower does not come on with flame on, does not go off with
flame off(this going off delay is usually adjustable at the control board)

That depends on the furnace. MY blower comes on as soon as the burner
ignites, it's a high efficiency furnace, so the blower must start to
cool the secondary heat exchanger.

Jerry Peters wrote:
In sci.electronics.repair Tony Hwang wrote:
Ralph Mowery wrote:
"Kirk Landaur" wrote in message
...
How does the hysteresis work on the Honeywell old-style bulb thermostat?

My house has two of those tan round things, with a dial that has
only two indicators.
1. The desired temperature on top, and......
2. The current temperature on bottom.

I understand that the heat overshoots on the current temperature
and that it lets the current temp go below the set temperature,
so that the gas furnaces are not constantly turning on and off
exactly at the set temperature.

That makes sense (from a wear and tear and noise standpoint).

I call that delayed on and off time the "hysteresis" (but you can
call it whatever it's really called).
and
Pulling off the cover, I see a mercury bulb inside, which is at the
end of a curved metal strip (bi-metallic perhaps?), which explains
the *initial* on/off mechanism is from the expansion and contraction
of the coiled flat strip kicking the mercury switch on and off.

This can't be the actual on/off of the furnace, because hysteresis
decrees that the on time of the furnace itself is after the mercury
turns it on and so is the off time of the furnace being after the
mercury turns it off.

I can easily test this, simply by turning the thermostat to a
high or low temperature, where the actual on/off of the furnace
blower (and later, the heat) is something like a couple of
minutes delayed.

I get all that - but what I don't understand is *where* the
hysteresis is built in? Is it in the computer? Is there a dial
that sets the temperature range of the hysteresis? Is there
a potentiometer?

How do we *change* or *set* how much hysteresis there is?
Specifically, how do I get *more* hysteresis in my furnace?


Part of it is in the house its self. It takes a while for the air and walls
in the house to heat up. Then the thermostat cuts off, but the air handler
will blow for a while to cool off the frunace heat chamber. The furnace
should have a control for this near the heat chamber. Say the house over
shoots 2 degrees during all of this. Then it cools down and the furnace
starts back up.


That is why blower does not come on with flame on, does not go off with
flame off(this going off delay is usually adjustable at the control board)

That depends on the furnace. MY blower comes on as soon as the burner
ignites, it's a high efficiency furnace, so the blower must start to
cool the secondary heat exchanger.

How high efficiency? Ours are 96% 2 stage one. There is built-in delay
for blower to come one. Off delay is adjustable by dip switches. Inducer
blower purges vent already before ingnition comes on.

Jerry Peters wrote:
In sci.electronics.repair Tony Hwang wrote:
Ralph Mowery wrote:
"Kirk Landaur" wrote in message
...
How does the hysteresis work on the Honeywell old-style bulb thermostat?

My house has two of those tan round things, with a dial that has
only two indicators.
1. The desired temperature on top, and......
2. The current temperature on bottom.

I understand that the heat overshoots on the current temperature
and that it lets the current temp go below the set temperature,
so that the gas furnaces are not constantly turning on and off
exactly at the set temperature.

That makes sense (from a wear and tear and noise standpoint).

I call that delayed on and off time the "hysteresis" (but you can
call it whatever it's really called).
and
Pulling off the cover, I see a mercury bulb inside, which is at the
end of a curved metal strip (bi-metallic perhaps?), which explains
the *initial* on/off mechanism is from the expansion and contraction
of the coiled flat strip kicking the mercury switch on and off.

This can't be the actual on/off of the furnace, because hysteresis
decrees that the on time of the furnace itself is after the mercury
turns it on and so is the off time of the furnace being after the
mercury turns it off.

I can easily test this, simply by turning the thermostat to a
high or low temperature, where the actual on/off of the furnace
blower (and later, the heat) is something like a couple of
minutes delayed.

I get all that - but what I don't understand is *where* the
hysteresis is built in? Is it in the computer? Is there a dial
that sets the temperature range of the hysteresis? Is there
a potentiometer?

How do we *change* or *set* how much hysteresis there is?
Specifically, how do I get *more* hysteresis in my furnace?


Part of it is in the house its self. It takes a while for the air and walls
in the house to heat up. Then the thermostat cuts off, but the air handler
will blow for a while to cool off the frunace heat chamber. The furnace
should have a control for this near the heat chamber. Say the house over
shoots 2 degrees during all of this. Then it cools down and the furnace
starts back up.


That is why blower does not come on with flame on, does not go off with
flame off(this going off delay is usually adjustable at the control board)

That depends on the furnace. MY blower comes on as soon as the burner
ignites, it's a high efficiency furnace, so the blower must start to
cool the secondary heat exchanger.

Sounds funny, then your system will blow cool air before warm air start
blowing out.

On Sunday, December 27, 2015 at 5:08:30 PM UTC-5, Tony Hwang wrote:
Jerry Peters wrote:
In sci.electronics.repair Tony Hwang wrote:
Ralph Mowery wrote:
"Kirk Landaur" wrote in message
...
How does the hysteresis work on the Honeywell old-style bulb thermostat?

My house has two of those tan round things, with a dial that has
only two indicators.
1. The desired temperature on top, and......
2. The current temperature on bottom.

I understand that the heat overshoots on the current temperature
and that it lets the current temp go below the set temperature,
so that the gas furnaces are not constantly turning on and off
exactly at the set temperature.

That makes sense (from a wear and tear and noise standpoint).

I call that delayed on and off time the "hysteresis" (but you can
call it whatever it's really called).
and
Pulling off the cover, I see a mercury bulb inside, which is at the
end of a curved metal strip (bi-metallic perhaps?), which explains
the *initial* on/off mechanism is from the expansion and contraction
of the coiled flat strip kicking the mercury switch on and off.

This can't be the actual on/off of the furnace, because hysteresis
decrees that the on time of the furnace itself is after the mercury
turns it on and so is the off time of the furnace being after the
mercury turns it off.

I can easily test this, simply by turning the thermostat to a
high or low temperature, where the actual on/off of the furnace
blower (and later, the heat) is something like a couple of
minutes delayed.

I get all that - but what I don't understand is *where* the
hysteresis is built in? Is it in the computer? Is there a dial
that sets the temperature range of the hysteresis? Is there
a potentiometer?

How do we *change* or *set* how much hysteresis there is?
Specifically, how do I get *more* hysteresis in my furnace?


Part of it is in the house its self. It takes a while for the air and walls
in the house to heat up. Then the thermostat cuts off, but the air handler
will blow for a while to cool off the frunace heat chamber. The furnace
should have a control for this near the heat chamber. Say the house over
shoots 2 degrees during all of this. Then it cools down and the furnace
starts back up.


That is why blower does not come on with flame on, does not go off with
flame off(this going off delay is usually adjustable at the control board)

That depends on the furnace. MY blower comes on as soon as the burner
ignites, it's a high efficiency furnace, so the blower must start to
cool the secondary heat exchanger.

How high efficiency? Ours are 96% 2 stage one. There is built-in delay
for blower to come one. Off delay is adjustable by dip switches. Inducer
blower purges vent already before ingnition comes on.

Same here with 93%. I'd have to measure it, but the air handler
blower comes on about 30 secs or a min after the burner lights.

In sci.electronics.repair Tony Hwang wrote:
Jerry Peters wrote:
In sci.electronics.repair Tony Hwang wrote:
Ralph Mowery wrote:
"Kirk Landaur" wrote in message
...
How does the hysteresis work on the Honeywell old-style bulb thermostat?

My house has two of those tan round things, with a dial that has
only two indicators.
1. The desired temperature on top, and......
2. The current temperature on bottom.

I understand that the heat overshoots on the current temperature
and that it lets the current temp go below the set temperature,
so that the gas furnaces are not constantly turning on and off
exactly at the set temperature.

That makes sense (from a wear and tear and noise standpoint).

I call that delayed on and off time the "hysteresis" (but you can
call it whatever it's really called).
and
Pulling off the cover, I see a mercury bulb inside, which is at the
end of a curved metal strip (bi-metallic perhaps?), which explains
the *initial* on/off mechanism is from the expansion and contraction
of the coiled flat strip kicking the mercury switch on and off.

This can't be the actual on/off of the furnace, because hysteresis
decrees that the on time of the furnace itself is after the mercury
turns it on and so is the off time of the furnace being after the
mercury turns it off.

I can easily test this, simply by turning the thermostat to a
high or low temperature, where the actual on/off of the furnace
blower (and later, the heat) is something like a couple of
minutes delayed.

I get all that - but what I don't understand is *where* the
hysteresis is built in? Is it in the computer? Is there a dial
that sets the temperature range of the hysteresis? Is there
a potentiometer?

How do we *change* or *set* how much hysteresis there is?
Specifically, how do I get *more* hysteresis in my furnace?


Part of it is in the house its self. It takes a while for the air and walls
in the house to heat up. Then the thermostat cuts off, but the air handler
will blow for a while to cool off the frunace heat chamber. The furnace
should have a control for this near the heat chamber. Say the house over
shoots 2 degrees during all of this. Then it cools down and the furnace
starts back up.


That is why blower does not come on with flame on, does not go off with
flame off(this going off delay is usually adjustable at the control board)

That depends on the furnace. MY blower comes on as soon as the burner
ignites, it's a high efficiency furnace, so the blower must start to
cool the secondary heat exchanger.

How high efficiency? Ours are 96% 2 stage one. There is built-in delay
for blower to come one. Off delay is adjustable by dip switches. Inducer
blower purges vent already before ingnition comes on.

93%. It's 30 years old, no digital controls. There's a standard
fan/limit thermal switch, but it only turns the blower off.

In sci.electronics.repair Tony Hwang wrote:
Jerry Peters wrote:
In sci.electronics.repair Tony Hwang wrote:
Ralph Mowery wrote:
"Kirk Landaur" wrote in message
...
How does the hysteresis work on the Honeywell old-style bulb thermostat?

My house has two of those tan round things, with a dial that has
only two indicators.
1. The desired temperature on top, and......
2. The current temperature on bottom.

I understand that the heat overshoots on the current temperature
and that it lets the current temp go below the set temperature,
so that the gas furnaces are not constantly turning on and off
exactly at the set temperature.

That makes sense (from a wear and tear and noise standpoint).

I call that delayed on and off time the "hysteresis" (but you can
call it whatever it's really called).
and
Pulling off the cover, I see a mercury bulb inside, which is at the
end of a curved metal strip (bi-metallic perhaps?), which explains
the *initial* on/off mechanism is from the expansion and contraction
of the coiled flat strip kicking the mercury switch on and off.

This can't be the actual on/off of the furnace, because hysteresis
decrees that the on time of the furnace itself is after the mercury
turns it on and so is the off time of the furnace being after the
mercury turns it off.

I can easily test this, simply by turning the thermostat to a
high or low temperature, where the actual on/off of the furnace
blower (and later, the heat) is something like a couple of
minutes delayed.

I get all that - but what I don't understand is *where* the
hysteresis is built in? Is it in the computer? Is there a dial
that sets the temperature range of the hysteresis? Is there
a potentiometer?

How do we *change* or *set* how much hysteresis there is?
Specifically, how do I get *more* hysteresis in my furnace?


Part of it is in the house its self. It takes a while for the air and walls
in the house to heat up. Then the thermostat cuts off, but the air handler
will blow for a while to cool off the frunace heat chamber. The furnace
should have a control for this near the heat chamber. Say the house over
shoots 2 degrees during all of this. Then it cools down and the furnace
starts back up.


That is why blower does not come on with flame on, does not go off with
flame off(this going off delay is usually adjustable at the control board)

That depends on the furnace. MY blower comes on as soon as the burner
ignites, it's a high efficiency furnace, so the blower must start to
cool the secondary heat exchanger.

Sounds funny, then your system will blow cool air before warm air start
blowing out.

For perhaps 30 seconds or so, then the secondary heat exchanger starts
warming the air while the primary is heating up.

trader_4 wrote:
On Sunday, December 27, 2015 at 5:08:30 PM UTC-5, Tony Hwang wrote:
Jerry Peters wrote:
In sci.electronics.repair Tony Hwang wrote:
Ralph Mowery wrote:
"Kirk Landaur" wrote in message
...
How does the hysteresis work on the Honeywell old-style bulb thermostat?

My house has two of those tan round things, with a dial that has
only two indicators.
1. The desired temperature on top, and......
2. The current temperature on bottom.

I understand that the heat overshoots on the current temperature
and that it lets the current temp go below the set temperature,
so that the gas furnaces are not constantly turning on and off
exactly at the set temperature.

That makes sense (from a wear and tear and noise standpoint).

I call that delayed on and off time the "hysteresis" (but you can
call it whatever it's really called).
and
Pulling off the cover, I see a mercury bulb inside, which is at the
end of a curved metal strip (bi-metallic perhaps?), which explains
the *initial* on/off mechanism is from the expansion and contraction
of the coiled flat strip kicking the mercury switch on and off.

This can't be the actual on/off of the furnace, because hysteresis
decrees that the on time of the furnace itself is after the mercury
turns it on and so is the off time of the furnace being after the
mercury turns it off.

I can easily test this, simply by turning the thermostat to a
high or low temperature, where the actual on/off of the furnace
blower (and later, the heat) is something like a couple of
minutes delayed.

I get all that - but what I don't understand is *where* the
hysteresis is built in? Is it in the computer? Is there a dial
that sets the temperature range of the hysteresis? Is there
a potentiometer?

How do we *change* or *set* how much hysteresis there is?
Specifically, how do I get *more* hysteresis in my furnace?


Part of it is in the house its self. It takes a while for the air and walls
in the house to heat up. Then the thermostat cuts off, but the air handler
will blow for a while to cool off the frunace heat chamber. The furnace
should have a control for this near the heat chamber. Say the house over
shoots 2 degrees during all of this. Then it cools down and the furnace
starts back up.


That is why blower does not come on with flame on, does not go off with
flame off(this going off delay is usually adjustable at the control board)

That depends on the furnace. MY blower comes on as soon as the burner
ignites, it's a high efficiency furnace, so the blower must start to
cool the secondary heat exchanger.

How high efficiency? Ours are 96% 2 stage one. There is built-in delay
for blower to come one. Off delay is adjustable by dip switches. Inducer
blower purges vent already before ingnition comes on.

Same here with 93%. I'd have to measure it, but the air handler
blower comes on about 30 secs or a min after the burner lights.

Exactly, there is one logical step B4 blower starts. Flame sensor has to
sense the flame is on steady B4 letting the blower starts. Furnace
operation is single line logical sequence.

On Monday, December 28, 2015 at 3:39:49 PM UTC-5, Jerry Peters wrote:
In sci.electronics.repair Tony Hwang wrote:
Jerry Peters wrote:
In sci.electronics.repair Tony Hwang wrote:
Ralph Mowery wrote:
"Kirk Landaur" wrote in message
...
How does the hysteresis work on the Honeywell old-style bulb thermostat?

My house has two of those tan round things, with a dial that has
only two indicators.
1. The desired temperature on top, and......
2. The current temperature on bottom.

I understand that the heat overshoots on the current temperature
and that it lets the current temp go below the set temperature,
so that the gas furnaces are not constantly turning on and off
exactly at the set temperature.

That makes sense (from a wear and tear and noise standpoint).

I call that delayed on and off time the "hysteresis" (but you can
call it whatever it's really called).
and
Pulling off the cover, I see a mercury bulb inside, which is at the
end of a curved metal strip (bi-metallic perhaps?), which explains
the *initial* on/off mechanism is from the expansion and contraction
of the coiled flat strip kicking the mercury switch on and off.

This can't be the actual on/off of the furnace, because hysteresis
decrees that the on time of the furnace itself is after the mercury
turns it on and so is the off time of the furnace being after the
mercury turns it off.

I can easily test this, simply by turning the thermostat to a
high or low temperature, where the actual on/off of the furnace
blower (and later, the heat) is something like a couple of
minutes delayed.

I get all that - but what I don't understand is *where* the
hysteresis is built in? Is it in the computer? Is there a dial
that sets the temperature range of the hysteresis? Is there
a potentiometer?

How do we *change* or *set* how much hysteresis there is?
Specifically, how do I get *more* hysteresis in my furnace?


Part of it is in the house its self. It takes a while for the air and walls
in the house to heat up. Then the thermostat cuts off, but the air handler
will blow for a while to cool off the frunace heat chamber. The furnace
should have a control for this near the heat chamber. Say the house over
shoots 2 degrees during all of this. Then it cools down and the furnace
starts back up.


That is why blower does not come on with flame on, does not go off with
flame off(this going off delay is usually adjustable at the control board)

That depends on the furnace. MY blower comes on as soon as the burner
ignites, it's a high efficiency furnace, so the blower must start to
cool the secondary heat exchanger.

How high efficiency? Ours are 96% 2 stage one. There is built-in delay
for blower to come one. Off delay is adjustable by dip switches. Inducer
blower purges vent already before ingnition comes on.

93%. It's 30 years old, no digital controls. There's a standard
fan/limit thermal switch, but it only turns the blower off.

They made a 93%, back in 1985? What brand and model?

On Monday, December 28, 2015 at 3:41:47 PM UTC-5, Jerry Peters wrote:
In sci.electronics.repair Tony Hwang wrote:
Jerry Peters wrote:
In sci.electronics.repair Tony Hwang wrote:
Ralph Mowery wrote:
"Kirk Landaur" wrote in message
...
How does the hysteresis work on the Honeywell old-style bulb thermostat?

My house has two of those tan round things, with a dial that has
only two indicators.
1. The desired temperature on top, and......
2. The current temperature on bottom.

I understand that the heat overshoots on the current temperature
and that it lets the current temp go below the set temperature,
so that the gas furnaces are not constantly turning on and off
exactly at the set temperature.

That makes sense (from a wear and tear and noise standpoint).

I call that delayed on and off time the "hysteresis" (but you can
call it whatever it's really called).
and
Pulling off the cover, I see a mercury bulb inside, which is at the
end of a curved metal strip (bi-metallic perhaps?), which explains
the *initial* on/off mechanism is from the expansion and contraction
of the coiled flat strip kicking the mercury switch on and off.

This can't be the actual on/off of the furnace, because hysteresis
decrees that the on time of the furnace itself is after the mercury
turns it on and so is the off time of the furnace being after the
mercury turns it off.

I can easily test this, simply by turning the thermostat to a
high or low temperature, where the actual on/off of the furnace
blower (and later, the heat) is something like a couple of
minutes delayed.

I get all that - but what I don't understand is *where* the
hysteresis is built in? Is it in the computer? Is there a dial
that sets the temperature range of the hysteresis? Is there
a potentiometer?

How do we *change* or *set* how much hysteresis there is?
Specifically, how do I get *more* hysteresis in my furnace?


Part of it is in the house its self. It takes a while for the air and walls
in the house to heat up. Then the thermostat cuts off, but the air handler
will blow for a while to cool off the frunace heat chamber. The furnace
should have a control for this near the heat chamber. Say the house over
shoots 2 degrees during all of this. Then it cools down and the furnace
starts back up.


That is why blower does not come on with flame on, does not go off with
flame off(this going off delay is usually adjustable at the control board)

That depends on the furnace. MY blower comes on as soon as the burner
ignites, it's a high efficiency furnace, so the blower must start to
cool the secondary heat exchanger.

Sounds funny, then your system will blow cool air before warm air start
blowing out.

For perhaps 30 seconds or so, then the secondary heat exchanger starts
warming the air while the primary is heating up.

Which makes no sense. How is the secondary going to get hot faster
than the primary?