.......or calcium chloride

I need about 10 lbs a year for my pool.

I was just quoted about $20 for 10lbs.

Anyone have good cheap source they want to share?

On Sat, 21 Apr 2012 00:56:49 -0500, gonjah gonjah.net wrote:

......or calcium chloride

I need about 10 lbs a year for my pool.

I was just quoted about $20 for 10lbs.

Anyone have good cheap source they want to share?

Ice melt?

On Sat, 21 Apr 2012 02:09:18 -0400, "
wrote:

On Sat, 21 Apr 2012 00:56:49 -0500, gonjah gonjah.net wrote:

......or calcium chloride

I need about 10 lbs a year for my pool.

I was just quoted about $20 for 10lbs.

Anyone have good cheap source they want to share?

Ice melt?

Salt pellets or crystals used in water softeners.

No intended for a pool.

On Apr 21, 1:56*am, gonjah gonjah.net wrote:
......or calcium chloride

I need about 10 lbs a year for my pool.

I was just quoted about $20 for 10lbs.

Anyone have good cheap source they want to share?

Use calcium hypochlorite as a disinfectant, you'll chlorinate the pool
*and* the calcium hardness will increase over time. As the calcium
hardness increases over time, you'll want to drop the total alkalinty
to maintain proper water balance.

Try getting at least 65% calcium hypochlorite, I've seen lower
concentration products around, 49%, and this is not worth getting.

On Fri, 20 Apr 2012 23:42:30 -0700, Oren wrote:

On Sat, 21 Apr 2012 02:09:18 -0400, "
wrote:

On Sat, 21 Apr 2012 00:56:49 -0500, gonjah gonjah.net wrote:

......or calcium chloride

I need about 10 lbs a year for my pool.

I was just quoted about $20 for 10lbs.

Anyone have good cheap source they want to share?

Ice melt?

Salt pellets or crystals used in water softeners.

He asked for calcium chloride not sodium chloride. I don't know anyone who
*hardens* drinking water. ;-)

No intended for a pool.

Neither is Chlorox but it works. ;-)

On Fri, 20 Apr 2012 23:25:19 -0700, Oren wrote:

On Sat, 21 Apr 2012 00:56:49 -0500, gonjah gonjah.net wrote:

......or calcium chloride

I need about 10 lbs a year for my pool.

I was just quoted about $20 for 10lbs.

Anyone have good cheap source they want to share?

Um, pools are not intended to have "soft water"; nor should they. It
would cost tons of dollars if you did.

Calcium will harden the water (it's called "calcium hardness"), not soften it.

Adjust the chemical balance, not the water "hardness".

I suppose pool water can be too "soft" but I've never encountered it.

On 4/21/2012 1:56 AM, gonjah wrote:
......or calcium chloride

I need about 10 lbs a year for my pool.

I was just quoted about $20 for 10lbs.

Anyone have good cheap source they want to share?

I doubt you'll find it any cheaper than Walmart or McLowes Depot.

On Apr 21, 9:24*am, "
wrote:
On Fri, 20 Apr 2012 23:25:19 -0700, Oren wrote:
On Sat, 21 Apr 2012 00:56:49 -0500, gonjah gonjah.net wrote:

......or calcium chloride

I need about 10 lbs a year for my pool.

I was just quoted about $20 for 10lbs.

Anyone have good cheap source they want to share?

Um, pools are not intended to have "soft water"; nor should they. *It
would *cost tons of dollars if you did.

Calcium will harden the water (it's called "calcium hardness"), not soften it.

Adjust the chemical balance, not the water "hardness".

I suppose pool water can be too "soft" but I've never encountered it.

Calcium hardness IS one of the chemicals you balance.
If the hardness is too low, the water will tend to extract
minerals from the pool materials. That is worse for
concrete pools than for those with liners. If the calcium
is too high, then it will tend to deposit itself of the
pool materials. And it all comes into play with the
other chemicals in the pool. So, you could tolerate a
somewhat lower calcium hardness if some of the other
components, eg PH are slightly off in the right direction.
There is a target zone for concrete and vinyl pools.

There is something called the Langelier Saturation Index
where all the components of pool chemistry come together.
There is a circular slide tool where you can put in the PH,
calcium, water temp, total alkalinity, etc and it gives the
value. The goal is a value of zero.

On 4/21/2012 12:56 AM, gonjah wrote:
......or calcium chloride

I need about 10 lbs a year for my pool.

I was just quoted about $20 for 10lbs.

Anyone have good cheap source they want to share?

Thanks for the responses.

This is what it is:

http://www.aldenleeds.com/products/d...ess-increaser/

Helps to keep the plaster healthy.

On 4/21/2012 8:27 AM, Bernie Ward wrote:
On 4/21/2012 1:56 AM, gonjah wrote:
......or calcium chloride

I need about 10 lbs a year for my pool.

I was just quoted about $20 for 10lbs.

Anyone have good cheap source they want to share?

I doubt you'll find it any cheaper than Walmart or McLowes Depot.

I'll check. Thanks.

On Apr 22, 1:52*pm, gonjah wrote:
On 4/21/2012 12:56 AM, gonjah wrote:

......or calcium chloride

I need about 10 lbs a year for my pool.

I was just quoted about $20 for 10lbs.

Anyone have good cheap source they want to share?

Thanks for the responses.

This is what it is:

http://www.aldenleeds.com/products/d...ess-increaser/

Helps to keep the plaster healthy.

I've bought 50lbs of it for anywhere from $18 locally to $50 for
having it shipped to my door. But since you're on my undesirable
list
I'm having memory loss as to how.

On 4/22/2012 2:13 PM, wrote:
On Apr 22, 1:52 pm, wrote:
On 4/21/2012 12:56 AM, gonjah wrote:

......or calcium chloride
I need about 10 lbs a year for my pool.
I was just quoted about $20 for 10lbs.
Anyone have good cheap source they want to share?
Thanks for the responses.

This is what it is:

http://www.aldenleeds.com/products/d...ess-increaser/

Helps to keep the plaster healthy.
I've bought 50lbs of it for anywhere from $18 locally to $50 for
having it shipped to my door. But since you're on my undesirable
list
I'm having memory loss as to how.

meh Somehow I think I'll survive.

On 4/20/2012 10:56 PM, gonjah wrote:
......or calcium chloride

I need about 10 lbs a year for my pool.

I was just quoted about $20 for 10lbs.

Anyone have good cheap source they want to share?

Usually a locally owned pool store, not a national chain pool store, is
best for pool chemicals. I.e. I go to a store where 12% chlorine in
returnable bottles is $2.50/gallon, while at Leslie's, much weaker
chlorine is about $4.50/gallon.

For phosphorus remover, Leslie's sells Phos-Free which is much less
concentrated/more expensive than the Kem-Tek phosphorus remover. I
expect the same is the case for harness increaser. Also, Leslie's has
stopped selling dry chemicals in plastic buckets which is really
annoying (at least this was the case last time I was in there).

Remember that chlorine tablets will result in cyanuric acid building up
to undesirable levels, requiring the complete or partial draining of the
pool, since there are no neutralizers for cyanuric acid being sold. If
the cyanuric acid is too high then the chlorine loses effectiveness.

Rather surprising that you need to keep adding calcium chloride, since
it should not be necessary unless you are draining and refilling.

On 4/22/2012 11:45 PM, SMS wrote:
On 4/20/2012 10:56 PM, gonjah wrote:
......or calcium chloride

I need about 10 lbs a year for my pool.

I was just quoted about $20 for 10lbs.

Anyone have good cheap source they want to share?

Usually a locally owned pool store, not a national chain pool store,
is best for pool chemicals. I.e. I go to a store where 12% chlorine in
returnable bottles is $2.50/gallon, while at Leslie's, much weaker
chlorine is about $4.50/gallon.

For phosphorus remover, Leslie's sells Phos-Free which is much less
concentrated/more expensive than the Kem-Tek phosphorus remover. I
expect the same is the case for harness increaser. Also, Leslie's has
stopped selling dry chemicals in plastic buckets which is really
annoying (at least this was the case last time I was in there).


What's your dosage on Kem-Tek?

Someone here turned me on PR-10000 it and it is fantastic. This IS the
bomb for phosphate remover. It's saved me boocoo bucks and my pool is
always clear now. Stuff is amazing. I use it in my gold fish pond too!
Totally non-toxic.

http://www.saltcells.com/phosphate-r...000-p-875.html

I'll never buy Phosfree again. I told my pool supply store they should
dump that stuff. Total rip off.



Remember that chlorine tablets will result in cyanuric acid building
up to undesirable levels, requiring the complete or partial draining
of the pool, since there are no neutralizers for cyanuric acid being
sold. If the cyanuric acid is too high then the chlorine loses
effectiveness.

Rather surprising that you need to keep adding calcium chloride, since
it should not be necessary unless you are draining and refilling.

It uses very little. I think I've added it once in 8 years? Probably
because I have a slow leak. I need to do repairs and I say every season
this is the one. I know I said 10# a year but I don't know where that
came from. Old age I guess.

It really not a big deal but I thought I should run it by here because
I've you never know.

Thanks

On Apr 23, 1:02*am, gonjah wrote:
On 4/22/2012 11:45 PM, SMS wrote:





On 4/20/2012 10:56 PM, gonjah wrote:
......or calcium chloride

I need about 10 lbs a year for my pool.

I was just quoted about $20 for 10lbs.

Anyone have good cheap source they want to share?

Usually a locally owned pool store, not a national chain pool store,
is best for pool chemicals. I.e. I go to a store where 12% chlorine in
returnable bottles is $2.50/gallon, while at Leslie's, much weaker
chlorine is about $4.50/gallon.

For phosphorus remover, Leslie's sells Phos-Free which is much less
concentrated/more expensive than the Kem-Tek phosphorus remover. I
expect the same is the case for harness increaser. Also, Leslie's has
stopped selling dry chemicals in plastic buckets which is really
annoying (at least this was the case last time I was in there).

What's your dosage on Kem-Tek?

Someone here turned me on PR-10000 it and it is fantastic. This IS the
bomb for phosphate remover. It's saved me boocoo bucks and my pool is
always clear now. Stuff is amazing. I use it in my gold fish pond too!
Totally non-toxic.

http://www.saltcells.com/phosphate-r...000-p-875.html

I'll never buy Phosfree again. I told my pool supply store they should
dump that stuff. Total rip off.



Remember that chlorine tablets will result in cyanuric acid building
up to undesirable levels, requiring the complete or partial draining
of the pool, since there are no neutralizers for cyanuric acid being
sold. If the cyanuric acid is too high then the chlorine loses
effectiveness.

Rather surprising that you need to keep adding calcium chloride, since
it should not be necessary unless you are draining and refilling.

It uses very little. I think I've added it once in 8 years? Probably
because I have a slow leak. I need to do repairs and I say every season
this is the one. I know I said 10# a year but I don't know where that
came from. Old age I guess.

It really not a big deal but I thought I should run it by here because
I've you never know.

Thanks- Hide quoted text -

- Show quoted text -

I'm feeling a little more charitable this morning. So, I'm going
to help out gonjah.

KRW suggested ice melt and he's on the right track. You
want calcium chloride, which is one of the types of ice melt.
You can use any one that is 100% calcium chloride. But the
preferred one is Dow Flake, which is flake form that dissolves
nicely instead of pellets. The problem is that it's obviously easier
to
find in the winter. But hardware stores may have
some left if you ask. If you buy it locally like that you can
get it for $18 or so for 50lbs. I also have had it shipped,
but the shipping cost drives the price up to more
like $50. Still, it's half the price of buying the same thing
at the pool store.

On 4/22/2012 10:02 PM, gonjah wrote:

What's your dosage on Kem-Tek?

Someone here turned me on PR-10000 it and it is fantastic. This IS the
bomb for phosphate remover. It's saved me boocoo bucks and my pool is
always clear now. Stuff is amazing. I use it in my gold fish pond too!
Totally non-toxic.

That was probably me that told you about PR1000.

http://i43.tinypic.com/14deiqh.jpg

Kemtek is the second most cost-effective phosphorus remover. Phos-Free
(regular version) is about 8x the price of PR-10000, and 5x the price of
Kem-Tek. Pool chemicals are like jewelery, a lot of people have no
concept of where to buy or how much to pay.

I saw PR10000 here as well:
http://www.stevethepoolman.com/PR-10000---1-Gallon.

I need to order some. I was hoping that my local pool store, which buys
PR10000 in 275 gallon containers, would just sell me a gallon in my own
container, for $100, but they won't. They use it for their own pool
maintenance business, but won't sell it to customers in the store.
Weird. They pay around $55/gallon for it in bulk.

On 4/23/2012 9:13 AM, SMS wrote:
On 4/22/2012 10:02 PM, gonjah wrote:

What's your dosage on Kem-Tek?

Someone here turned me on PR-10000 it and it is fantastic. This IS the
bomb for phosphate remover. It's saved me boocoo bucks and my pool is
always clear now. Stuff is amazing. I use it in my gold fish pond too!
Totally non-toxic.

That was probably me that told you about PR1000.

http://i43.tinypic.com/14deiqh.jpg


Yup. That was you.

Kemtek is the second most cost-effective phosphorus remover. Phos-Free
(regular version) is about 8x the price of PR-10000, and 5x the price
of Kem-Tek. Pool chemicals are like jewelery, a lot of people have no
concept of where to buy or how much to pay.

I saw PR10000 here as well:
http://www.stevethepoolman.com/PR-10000---1-Gallon.

I need to order some. I was hoping that my local pool store, which
buys PR10000 in 275 gallon containers, would just sell me a gallon in
my own container, for $100, but they won't. They use it for their own
pool maintenance business, but won't sell it to customers in the
store. Weird. They pay around $55/gallon for it in bulk.

Thanks. That stuff has made my life so much easier. Where do you get
your phosphate test? The one I'm using is worthless at levels that low.
Now if I see any algae I add 10ml PR-10000 until it clears up. BTW: If
anyone asks, it's appears safe for fresh water fish ponds. In my 55gal
pond I add 1ml as needed but when the fish are spawning nothing works.

I'm going to remind my pool store every time I go in there what a rip
phos-free is. Besides, the manger is a cute Hispanic chick. Gives me an
excuse to flirt with her.

Thanks for the heads up on calcium chloride. If I have pool chemical
questions I think I'll just ping you in the future.

On 4/23/2012 8:35 AM, gonjah wrote:

I'm going to remind my pool store every time I go in there what a rip
phos-free is. Besides, the manger is a cute Hispanic chick. Gives me an
excuse to flirt with her.

Why bother. They don't want to carry more concentrated versions of
phosphate removers because it's less profitable. Few people are aware of
the differences in pool chemicals. Tri-Chlor tabs have different amounts
of active ingredients, liquid chlorine is diluted to different
concentrations, etc..

I didn't realize the huge difference in cost in phosphate removers until
I had very high phosphate levels in the pool and figured that treating
it with Phos-Free would cost several hundred dollars.

The other issue with PR-10000 is that some pool owners may not like the
side effects (turns the water milky then as the water clears the filter
becomes saturated with the residue, though I prefer dealing with one
filter cleaning with a concentrated product rather than using less
concentrated products with the same effect spread over a longer period
of time.

On 4/23/2012 12:20 PM, SMS wrote:
On 4/23/2012 8:35 AM, gonjah wrote:

I'm going to remind my pool store every time I go in there what a rip
phos-free is. Besides, the manger is a cute Hispanic chick. Gives me an
excuse to flirt with her.

Why bother. They don't want to carry more concentrated versions of
phosphate removers because it's less profitable. Few people are aware
of the differences in pool chemicals. Tri-Chlor tabs have different
amounts of active ingredients, liquid chlorine is diluted to different
concentrations, etc..

Yup. Sad but true.. I'm learning as much as I can.


I didn't realize the huge difference in cost in phosphate removers
until I had very high phosphate levels in the pool and figured that
treating it with Phos-Free would cost several hundred dollars.


What strikes me as odd is how little people seem to understand the
phosphate algae cycle. The approach of many seems to be kill the algae.

The other issue with PR-10000 is that some pool owners may not like
the side effects (turns the water milky then as the water clears the
filter becomes saturated with the residue, though I prefer dealing
with one filter cleaning with a concentrated product rather than using
less concentrated products with the same effect spread over a longer
period of time.


I haven't noticed any issues with the water turning milky, If fact,
quite the opposite. If my sand filter backups I just backwash. Maybe an
issue with other media.

On 4/23/2012 11:44 AM, gonjah wrote:

What strikes me as odd is how little people seem to understand the
phosphate algae cycle. The approach of many seems to be kill the algae.

The pool stores seem pretty adept at explaining the cycle because it
enables them to sell phosphate removers. Of all consumer products, pool
chemicals rank right up there with soda in terms of having huge profit
margins. The good thing for the pool stores is that draining and
refilling often doesn't work for phosphate removal because the water
used to fill the pool has too high of a phosphate level.

What is most odd to me is the times I've been in Leslie's, waiting for a
pool water test, and overhearing the Leslie's employee explain to the
customer the effect that high levels of cyanuric acid are having on
algae growth (because they lessen the effectiveness of the chlorine).

Once the cyanuric acid is way too high you can increase the chlorine
level in a vain effort to sanitize the pool
http://www.aliaswater.com/cyanuric_acid.pdf.

The customer then asks for the chemical to bring the cyanuric acid level
down, but there isn't one--you have to drain and refill.

The customer then asks how the cyanuric acid level got so high, and is
told that the cause is the use of chlorinating tablets, all of which
contain cyanuric acid even though you don't need so much stabilizer, and
which were sold to the customer in big buckets.

Then the customer is told to either use liquid chlorine or told to
switch to a salt system.

What I really need is a way to take the phosphates out of the pool and
use them in the dishwasher. It's rather ironic that I have to go through
contortions in order to purchase dishwasher detergent with phosphates,
while purchasing phosphate remover for the pool.

On Apr 24, 2:58*am, SMS wrote:
On 4/23/2012 11:44 AM, gonjah wrote:

What strikes me as odd is how little people seem to understand the
phosphate algae cycle. The approach of many seems to be kill the algae.

The pool stores seem pretty adept at explaining the cycle because it
enables them to sell phosphate removers.

The local pool store here is only capable of putting
the water into the automated test machine and then
telling you the results:

You need 20lbs of Balance Pack 100 and 15lbs
of Balance Pack 300. That will be $100. A hundred
dollars for common chemicals like sodium carbonate
or calcium chloride that are just renamed. They have
teenagers working there that don't know anymore
about pool chemistry than the computer spits out.

After a few cycles of that, I too learned and bought
my own test kit. Have not been back since. Now
I know what it actually needs and can buy the
chemicals where they are cheapest.




Of all consumer products, pool
chemicals rank right up there with soda in terms of having huge profit
margins. The good thing for the pool stores is that draining and
refilling often doesn't work for phosphate removal because the water
used to fill the pool has too high of a phosphate level.

What is most odd to me is the times I've been in Leslie's, waiting for a
pool water test, and overhearing the Leslie's employee explain to the
customer the effect that high levels of cyanuric acid are having on
algae growth (because they lessen the effectiveness of the chlorine).

Once the cyanuric acid is way too high you can increase the chlorine
level in a vain effort to sanitize the pool
http://www.aliaswater.com/cyanuric_acid.pdf.

The customer then asks for the chemical to bring the cyanuric acid level
down, but there isn't one--you have to drain and refill.

The customer then asks how the cyanuric acid level got so high, and is
told that the cause is the use of chlorinating tablets, all of which
contain cyanuric acid even though you don't need so much stabilizer, and
which were sold to the customer in big buckets.

Then the customer is told to either use liquid chlorine or told to
switch to a salt system.

Of course they only tell them that when there is a problem.
Otherwise the customer would realize that liquid chlorine
is a cheap alternative to their more expensive tablets,
shock, etc.

Around here where we winterize I think winding up with
too much stabilizer is less of a problem. Between
winterizing, backwashing, and having to occasionally
pump water out due to rain, enough gets taken out
so that it usually remains OK.