Our coop apartment building is four floors, on irregular ground. The upshot
is, getting access to the windows makes painting and cleaning pretty costly.

Our painters/cleaners routinely use 60-foot ladders to get to the
upper-floor windows.

My question is this: Is it possible to fabricate some very sturdy hooks
which would fit over the sill of the windows, going over to the inside of
the building, to support a platform to do the painting and cleaning?

I realize this sounds dangerous, but it seems to me if the hooks and
platform could be very securely fastened, it would be made to be at least as
safe as those platforms dangling from ropes on high-rise buildings.

On Nov 13, 6:17*am, "Ray" wrote:
Our coop apartment building is four floors, on irregular ground. The upshot
is, getting access to the windows makes painting and cleaning pretty costly.

Our painters/cleaners routinely use 60-foot ladders to get to the
upper-floor windows.

My question is this: Is it possible to fabricate some very sturdy hooks
which would fit over the sill of the windows, going over to the inside of
the building, to support a platform to do the painting and cleaning?

I realize this sounds dangerous, but it seems to me if the hooks and
platform could be very securely fastened, it would be made to be at least as
safe as those platforms dangling from ropes on high-rise buildings.

The "ropes" that hose platforms are dangling from are actually steel
cable capable of holding 1,000's of pounds each.

What you are proposing is totally doable from a technical point of
view...... whether it is allowable from a legal point of view (OSAH or
other agency?) is another question.

The devil is in the details.
What does the exterior of the building look like?
Same questions about the interior & exterior sills.
How wide are the windows? SIngle windows or always a pair?

To have such a device properly designed, fabricated & tested could
cost many $1000's.
Depending on the size of your building, number of windows, frequency
of use and time saved per window.....your concept could wind up saving
money.

Before I left my previous employ, we were looking into a device such
as this (used not new)

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/File:JLG_450_AJ_2.jpg

Boom lifts come in all sorts of flavors...... IIRC we were looking at
less than $20,000
Whether this could work depends on the local terrain and the type of
lift used.

cheers
Bob

Many years back I would place two horizontal 2x4's sticking 2 feel outside the window (on both the left and right sides). Inside, the lumber was braced to the ceiling with an additional vertical 2x4. This was repeated at every window and planking was placed outside upon the cantilevered lumber. Great for nailing, painting, eave work etc. but lousy for washing windows. I'm sure this would never be considered safe or OSHA approved.

Ivan Vegvary

On 11/13/2011 10:08 AM, DD_BobK wrote:
On Nov 13, 6:17 am, wrote:
Our coop apartment building is four floors, on irregular ground. The upshot
is, getting access to the windows makes painting and cleaning pretty costly.

Our painters/cleaners routinely use 60-foot ladders to get to the
upper-floor windows.

My question is this: Is it possible to fabricate some very sturdy hooks
which would fit over the sill of the windows, going over to the inside of
the building, to support a platform to do the painting and cleaning?

I realize this sounds dangerous, but it seems to me if the hooks and
platform could be very securely fastened, it would be made to be at least as
safe as those platforms dangling from ropes on high-rise buildings.

The "ropes" that hose platforms are dangling from are actually steel
cable capable of holding 1,000's of pounds each.

What you are proposing is totally doable from a technical point of
view...... whether it is allowable from a legal point of view (OSAH or
other agency?) is another question.

The devil is in the details.
What does the exterior of the building look like?
Same questions about the interior& exterior sills.
How wide are the windows? SIngle windows or always a pair?

To have such a device properly designed, fabricated& tested could
cost many $1000's.
Depending on the size of your building, number of windows, frequency
of use and time saved per window.....your concept could wind up saving
money.

Before I left my previous employ, we were looking into a device such
as this (used not new)

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/File:JLG_450_AJ_2.jpg

Boom lifts come in all sorts of flavors...... IIRC we were looking at
less than $20,000
Whether this could work depends on the local terrain and the type of
lift used.

cheers
Bob

The building I work in still has some of the 80-100 YO (depending on
wing) window washer hooks in the brickwork on either side of the window
openings. They are fitted as building is built, presumably with a
backing plate behind the brick or something.

No, they don't use them anymore. I would not, either. They use a
portable bosun's ladder setup, set up on the flat roof. Think big-ass
fishing pole welded to a big metal plate, covered with hunks of ballast.

--
aem sends...

On Nov 13, 8:17*am, "Ray" wrote:
Our coop apartment building is four floors, on irregular ground. The upshot
is, getting access to the windows makes painting and cleaning pretty costly.

Our painters/cleaners routinely use 60-foot ladders to get to the
upper-floor windows.

My question is this: Is it possible to fabricate some very sturdy hooks
which would fit over the sill of the windows, going over to the inside of
the building, to support a platform to do the painting and cleaning?

I realize this sounds dangerous, but it seems to me if the hooks and
platform could be very securely fastened, it would be made to be at least as
safe as those platforms dangling from ropes on high-rise buildings.

Have you thought of renting the local fire dept for a short period of
time, their ladder trucks and high-pressure hoses should make short
work of it. Maybe some off-duty firemen would do this as a charitable
fund-raiser???

On Nov 13, 2:17*pm, "Ray" wrote:
Our coop apartment building is four floors, on irregular ground. The upshot
is, getting access to the windows makes painting and cleaning pretty costly.

Our painters/cleaners routinely use 60-foot ladders to get to the
upper-floor windows.

My question is this: Is it possible to fabricate some very sturdy hooks
which would fit over the sill of the windows, going over to the inside of
the building, to support a platform to do the painting and cleaning?

I realize this sounds dangerous, but it seems to me if the hooks and
platform could be very securely fastened, it would be made to be at least as
safe as those platforms dangling from ropes on high-rise buildings.

Such systems are very common.
Especially if the building has a flat roof, you can buy a complete
platform system.
Eg.
http://www.applegate.co.uk/all-indus...em-1175798.htm
I expect they have them in the US too.
Not cheap and training required in their use.
How about a cherry picker?

On Nov 13, 9:17*am, "Ray" wrote:

Our coop apartment building is four floors, on irregular ground. The upshot
is, getting access to the windows makes painting and cleaning pretty costly.

Our painters/cleaners routinely use 60-foot ladders to get to the
upper-floor windows.

My question is this: Is it possible to fabricate some very sturdy hooks
which would fit over the sill of the windows, going over to the inside of
the building, to support a platform to do the painting and cleaning?

I realize this sounds dangerous, but it seems to me if the hooks and
platform could be very securely fastened, it would be made to be at least as
safe as those platforms dangling from ropes on high-rise buildings.

Replace the windows, starting with the top floor down. Use vinyl tilt-
in windows, which makes cleaning the windows easy (make it the
occupant's responsibility). You'll upgrade the energy efficiency of
the building, largely eliminate a recurring expense and get an energy
credit to boot.

R

Thanks. Cherry pickers are very expensive to rent. And they require
expertise to operate.



"harry" wrote in message
...

On Nov 13, 2:17 pm, "Ray" wrote:
Our coop apartment building is four floors, on irregular ground. The
upshot
is, getting access to the windows makes painting and cleaning pretty
costly.

Our painters/cleaners routinely use 60-foot ladders to get to the
upper-floor windows.

My question is this: Is it possible to fabricate some very sturdy hooks
which would fit over the sill of the windows, going over to the inside of
the building, to support a platform to do the painting and cleaning?

I realize this sounds dangerous, but it seems to me if the hooks and
platform could be very securely fastened, it would be made to be at least
as
safe as those platforms dangling from ropes on high-rise buildings.

Such systems are very common.
Especially if the building has a flat roof, you can buy a complete
platform system.
Eg.
http://www.applegate.co.uk/all-indus...em-1175798.htm
I expect they have them in the US too.
Not cheap and training required in their use.
How about a cherry picker?

Thanks -- replacement certainly is an option, but an extremely expensive
one -- $300,000 for our building of six apartments. No doubt in time this
would pay for itself, but I think it's all but impossible that we could get
enough tenants to go that route.



"RicodJour" wrote in message
...

On Nov 13, 9:17 am, "Ray" wrote:

Our coop apartment building is four floors, on irregular ground. The
upshot
is, getting access to the windows makes painting and cleaning pretty
costly.

Our painters/cleaners routinely use 60-foot ladders to get to the
upper-floor windows.

My question is this: Is it possible to fabricate some very sturdy hooks
which would fit over the sill of the windows, going over to the inside of
the building, to support a platform to do the painting and cleaning?

I realize this sounds dangerous, but it seems to me if the hooks and
platform could be very securely fastened, it would be made to be at least
as
safe as those platforms dangling from ropes on high-rise buildings.

Replace the windows, starting with the top floor down. Use vinyl tilt-
in windows, which makes cleaning the windows easy (make it the
occupant's responsibility). You'll upgrade the energy efficiency of
the building, largely eliminate a recurring expense and get an energy
credit to boot.

R

On Nov 13, 5:20*pm, "Ray" wrote:

Thanks -- replacement certainly is an option, but an extremely expensive
one -- $300,000 for our building of six apartments. No doubt in time this
would pay for itself, but I think it's all but impossible that we could get
enough tenants to go that route.

Three hundred grand....? Huh? I'm not sure what type of building
you're in or anything, but that seems extremely high. Is it a
historic building or some sort of loft building with acres of glass?

R

On Nov 13, 5:38*pm, RicodJour wrote:
On Nov 13, 5:20*pm, "Ray" wrote:



Thanks -- replacement certainly is an option, but an extremely expensive
one -- $300,000 for our building of six apartments. No doubt in time this
would pay for itself, but I think it's all but impossible that we could get
enough tenants to go that route.

Three hundred grand....? *Huh? *I'm not sure what type of building
you're in or anything, but that seems extremely high. *Is it a
historic building or some sort of loft building with acres of glass?

R

I know, I have seen and heard of school buildings 200,000 square
feet being re-gazed for less than that...

Seems like maybe they might have gold leafed windows in this
six unit building or they live on a cliff or something...

~~ Evan

On Sun, 13 Nov 2011 14:38:03 -0800 (PST), RicodJour
wrote:

On Nov 13, 5:20*pm, "Ray" wrote:

Thanks -- replacement certainly is an option, but an extremely expensive
one -- $300,000 for our building of six apartments. No doubt in time this
would pay for itself, but I think it's all but impossible that we could get
enough tenants to go that route.

Three hundred grand....? Huh? I'm not sure what type of building
you're in or anything, but that seems extremely high. Is it a
historic building or some sort of loft building with acres of glass?

R

It does seem very costly for "six apartments".

On Nov 13, 4:50*pm, RicodJour wrote:
On Nov 13, 9:17*am, "Ray" wrote:



Our coop apartment building is four floors, on irregular ground. The upshot
is, getting access to the windows makes painting and cleaning pretty costly.

Our painters/cleaners routinely use 60-foot ladders to get to the
upper-floor windows.

My question is this: Is it possible to fabricate some very sturdy hooks
which would fit over the sill of the windows, going over to the inside of
the building, to support a platform to do the painting and cleaning?

I realize this sounds dangerous, but it seems to me if the hooks and
platform could be very securely fastened, it would be made to be at least as
safe as those platforms dangling from ropes on high-rise buildings.

Replace the windows, starting with the top floor down. *Use vinyl tilt-
in windows, which makes cleaning the windows easy (make it the
occupant's responsibility). *You'll upgrade the energy efficiency of
the building, largely eliminate a recurring expense and get an energy
credit to boot.

R

Yes, good idea. But won't happen. Americans can't gettheir heads
round expensive energy and resist all change.

On Nov 13, 10:38*pm, RicodJour wrote:
On Nov 13, 5:20*pm, "Ray" wrote:



Thanks -- replacement certainly is an option, but an extremely expensive
one -- $300,000 for our building of six apartments. No doubt in time this
would pay for itself, but I think it's all but impossible that we could get
enough tenants to go that route.

Three hundred grand....? *Huh? *I'm not sure what type of building
you're in or anything, but that seems extremely high. *Is it a
historic building or some sort of loft building with acres of glass?

R

My thoughts too.

On Nov 14, 3:06*am, harry wrote:
On Nov 13, 4:50*pm, RicodJour wrote:

Replace the windows, starting with the top floor down. *Use vinyl tilt-
in windows, which makes cleaning the windows easy (make it the
occupant's responsibility). *You'll upgrade the energy efficiency of
the building, largely eliminate a recurring expense and get an energy
credit to boot.

Yes, good idea. *But won't happen. Americans can't get their heads
round expensive energy and resist all change.

Please stop braying - it annoys the other barnyard animals.

The OP has yet to reply to the question about the cost of the
replacement windows, but assuming that the $300K number is correct,
for six apartments, what is your ex-compos-mentis engineer-emeritus
calculation for the payback period? Include figures for how much
energy would be expended to replace those windows - manufacture,
transportation, labor, etc.

There is a cost to energy saving. Nobody reading this will live to
see a $50K savings in energy from window replacement. I still think
the OP's figure is high, but I _know_ you are.

R