I'm hanging 3 x 6 x 1/4" tile in a half shower. I've got durock on the
bottom foot and treated sheetrock on everything above.

So I can tile the bottom of it conventionally, and would expect to use
what they recommend at lowe's: the tile mortar with polymer.

q1) There's two of them, one for $18 and another for $24. What should
I look for? By no means do I adhere to the Law of It's better because
It Costs More.

I wish I hadn't hung treated, but I did. I know I can make tiles stick
with all-purpose construction adhesive. But I'm in the market for
something that bridges that gap between the two.

"Mastic" doesn't really exist anymore, at least at the place where I'm
constrained to buy things that I can. That said, to find the right
adhesives or additives, I will seek out any bona fide recommendation.

Things are good in my hood,
--
Uno

On Jul 16, 6:51*pm, Uno wrote:
I'm hanging 3 x 6 x 1/4" tile in a half shower. *I've got durock on the
bottom foot and treated sheetrock on everything above.

So I can tile the bottom of it conventionally, and would expect to use
what they recommend at lowe's: *the tile mortar with polymer.

q1) *There's two of them, one for $18 and another for $24. *What should
I look for? *By no means do I adhere to the Law of It's better because
It Costs More.

I wish I hadn't hung treated, but I did. *I know I can make tiles stick
with all-purpose construction adhesive. *But I'm in the market for
something that bridges that gap between the two.

"Mastic" doesn't really exist anymore, at least at the place where I'm
constrained to buy things that I can. *That said, to find the right
adhesives or additives, I will seek out any bona fide recommendation.

If you're putting tile on drywall in a shower, it doesn't matter what
adhesive you use since it won't last long anyway.

Drywall is cheap, tile work isn't. From your post it's clear you know
you should replace the drywall - so do it. It won't take that much
time or that much money.

If you insist on throwing good money after bad, use a trowel on
waterproofing over everything, such as Redgard, before you put up the
tile. The use the standard latex/acrylic modified thinset to set the
tile. Redgard is not cheap, but it will allow you to proceed without
tearing anything out.

R

"RicodJour" wrote in message
...
On Jul 16, 6:51 pm, Uno wrote:
I'm hanging 3 x 6 x 1/4" tile in a half shower. I've got durock on the
bottom foot and treated sheetrock on everything above.

So I can tile the bottom of it conventionally, and would expect to use
what they recommend at lowe's: the tile mortar with polymer.

q1) There's two of them, one for $18 and another for $24. What should
I look for? By no means do I adhere to the Law of It's better because
It Costs More.

I wish I hadn't hung treated, but I did. I know I can make tiles stick
with all-purpose construction adhesive. But I'm in the market for
something that bridges that gap between the two.

"Mastic" doesn't really exist anymore, at least at the place where I'm
constrained to buy things that I can. That said, to find the right
adhesives or additives, I will seek out any bona fide recommendation.

If you're putting tile on drywall in a shower, it doesn't matter what
adhesive you use since it won't last long anyway.

Drywall is cheap, tile work isn't. From your post it's clear you know
you should replace the drywall - so do it. It won't take that much
time or that much money.

If you insist on throwing good money after bad, use a trowel on
waterproofing over everything, such as Redgard, before you put up the
tile. The use the standard latex/acrylic modified thinset to set the
tile. Redgard is not cheap, but it will allow you to proceed without
tearing anything out.

R

All very good advise. Also you cannot use thinset on the bottom and adhesive
on the top. The tiles will never be flat with each other, thinset is used
much thicker than adhesive.

On 7/16/2011 4:48 PM, EXT wrote:

"RicodJour" wrote in message
...
On Jul 16, 6:51 pm, Uno wrote:
I'm hanging 3 x 6 x 1/4" tile in a half shower. I've got durock on the
bottom foot and treated sheetrock on everything above.

So I can tile the bottom of it conventionally, and would expect to use
what they recommend at lowe's: the tile mortar with polymer.

q1) There's two of them, one for $18 and another for $24. What should
I look for? By no means do I adhere to the Law of It's better because
It Costs More.

I wish I hadn't hung treated, but I did. I know I can make tiles stick
with all-purpose construction adhesive. But I'm in the market for
something that bridges that gap between the two.

"Mastic" doesn't really exist anymore, at least at the place where I'm
constrained to buy things that I can. That said, to find the right
adhesives or additives, I will seek out any bona fide recommendation.

If you're putting tile on drywall in a shower, it doesn't matter what
adhesive you use since it won't last long anyway.

Drywall is cheap, tile work isn't. From your post it's clear you know
you should replace the drywall - so do it. It won't take that much
time or that much money.

If you insist on throwing good money after bad, use a trowel on
waterproofing over everything, such as Redgard, before you put up the
tile. The use the standard latex/acrylic modified thinset to set the
tile. Redgard is not cheap, but it will allow you to proceed without
tearing anything out.

R

All very good advise. Also you cannot use thinset on the bottom and
adhesive on the top. The tiles will never be flat with each other,
thinset is used much thicker than adhesive.



That's motivates the reason for more of a goopstick, if you follow my
vernacular.

Cheers,
--
Uno

RicodJour wrote:
If you're putting tile on drywall in a shower, it doesn't matter what
adhesive you use since it won't last long anyway.

Drywall is cheap, tile work isn't. From your post it's clear you know
you should replace the drywall - so do it. It won't take that much
time or that much money.

If you insist on throwing good money after bad, use a trowel on
waterproofing over everything, such as Redgard, before you put up the
tile. The use the standard latex/acrylic modified thinset to set the
tile. Redgard is not cheap, but it will allow you to proceed without
tearing anything out.

Yep. Do it right the first time or you will learn a very costly and painful
lesson. I did mine with hardiboard, covered that in redguard, and used
Flexbond thinset to stick the tiles on. Considering the amount of labor it
took to do, it is nice knowing that it will probably outlive me.

Jon

On 7/16/2011 9:54 PM, Jon Danniken wrote:
RicodJour wrote:
If you're putting tile on drywall in a shower, it doesn't matter what
adhesive you use since it won't last long anyway.

Drywall is cheap, tile work isn't. From your post it's clear you know
you should replace the drywall - so do it. It won't take that much
time or that much money.

If you insist on throwing good money after bad, use a trowel on
waterproofing over everything, such as Redgard, before you put up the
tile. The use the standard latex/acrylic modified thinset to set the
tile. Redgard is not cheap, but it will allow you to proceed without
tearing anything out.

Yep. Do it right the first time or you will learn a very costly and painful
lesson. I did mine with hardiboard, covered that in redguard, and used
Flexbond thinset to stick the tiles on. Considering the amount of labor it
took to do, it is nice knowing that it will probably outlive me.

Jon


Where do you live?
--
Uno

Uno wrote:
Where do you live?

Oregon, USA. It's raining today.

Jon

On 7/17/2011 6:09 AM, Jon Danniken wrote:
Uno wrote:
Where do you live?

Oregon, USA. It's raining today.

Jon



Oregon is as different from Albuquerque as one can imagine. It takes
about a half hour for a shower to get back to 20% humidity here--
without a window being open or the fan on.

Water will never seep into a crack and freeze in the interior of a
house. I've never seen moldy sheetrock around here.
--
Uno

On 7/16/2011 3:39 PM, RicodJour wrote:
On Jul 16, 6:51 pm, wrote:
I'm hanging 3 x 6 x 1/4" tile in a half shower. I've got durock on the
bottom foot and treated sheetrock on everything above.

So I can tile the bottom of it conventionally, and would expect to use
what they recommend at lowe's: the tile mortar with polymer.

q1) There's two of them, one for $18 and another for $24. What should
I look for? By no means do I adhere to the Law of It's better because
It Costs More.

I wish I hadn't hung treated, but I did. I know I can make tiles stick
with all-purpose construction adhesive. But I'm in the market for
something that bridges that gap between the two.

"Mastic" doesn't really exist anymore, at least at the place where I'm
constrained to buy things that I can. That said, to find the right
adhesives or additives, I will seek out any bona fide recommendation.

If you're putting tile on drywall in a shower, it doesn't matter what
adhesive you use since it won't last long anyway.

Drywall is cheap, tile work isn't. From your post it's clear you know
you should replace the drywall - so do it. It won't take that much
time or that much money.

If you insist on throwing good money after bad, use a trowel on
waterproofing over everything, such as Redgard, before you put up the
tile. The use the standard latex/acrylic modified thinset to set the
tile. Redgard is not cheap, but it will allow you to proceed without
tearing anything out.

R

Rico,

Thx for your comment. I'll look for Redgard.

Know that I value your opinion. If I were to speak to ameliorating
circumstances, it would be that I live in a desert.

Please take that into consideration. Cheers,
--
Uno

On Jul 17, 2:05*am, Uno wrote:
On 7/16/2011 3:39 PM, RicodJour wrote:









On Jul 16, 6:51 pm, *wrote:
I'm hanging 3 x 6 x 1/4" tile in a half shower. *I've got durock on the
bottom foot and treated sheetrock on everything above.

So I can tile the bottom of it conventionally, and would expect to use
what they recommend at lowe's: *the tile mortar with polymer.

q1) *There's two of them, one for $18 and another for $24. *What should
I look for? *By no means do I adhere to the Law of It's better because
It Costs More.

I wish I hadn't hung treated, but I did. *I know I can make tiles stick
with all-purpose construction adhesive. *But I'm in the market for
something that bridges that gap between the two.

"Mastic" doesn't really exist anymore, at least at the place where I'm
constrained to buy things that I can. *That said, to find the right
adhesives or additives, I will seek out any bona fide recommendation.

If you're putting tile on drywall in a shower, it doesn't matter what
adhesive you use since it won't last long anyway.

Drywall is cheap, tile work isn't. *From your post it's clear you know
you should replace the drywall - so do it. *It won't take that much
time or that much money.

If you insist on throwing good money after bad, use a trowel on
waterproofing over everything, such as Redgard, before you put up the
tile. *The use the standard latex/acrylic modified thinset to set the
tile. *Redgard is not cheap, but it will allow you to proceed without
tearing anything out.

R

Rico,

Thx for your comment. *I'll look for Redgard.

Know that I value your opinion. *If I were to speak to ameliorating
circumstances, it would be that I live in a desert.

Please take that into consideration. *Cheers,

More importantly, what type of construction is backing the shower and
what's below it? If your house is concrete block on a slab, then
you're looking at a tile job that won't last as long as it could and
should. Your money, your labor, you get to tell yourself, "I told you
so." when/if you redo it.

If the house is wood-framed and the bathroom is upstairs, the downside
is considerably greater.

R

On Jul 16, 6:39*pm, RicodJour wrote:

If you're putting tile on drywall in a shower, it doesn't matter what
adhesive you use since it won't last long anyway.

That's probably true, but the fault of the installer, not the drywall.

The idea that drywall isn't worth **** as a shower substrate is due to
poor tile work.

Real tilesetters became scarce in the '60s with the advent of the one-
piece fiberglass enclosure (or I'd probably still be setting tile. I
liked it, and it beat the hell out of farming).

Homeowners do not understand that a competent tile job on "3 walls
over the tub" make those walls a "unit". You can see them still
standing (and still serviceable) after a house has burned to a pile of
ashes.

One of the main tricks in unitizing those wall is in the grouting.
You have to dampen the joints before grouting if you want good
adhesion (that may no longer be true, I don't know *anything* about
the "new" grouts), and you have to *fill* the joints.

If your tile job leaks, it doesn't matter what's behind it. Sure,
drywall will absorb the water and ruin your tile job, but with rock it
will immediately run down and affect another part of the house as
well.

Drywall is cheap, tile work isn't.

It should be, considering what passes for tile work these days.

*From your post it's clear you know
you should replace the drywall - so do it. *It won't take that much
time or that much money.

That depends on how much money you got. I've been in a position where
$5 was like $500.
-----

- gpsman

On Jul 17, 9:43*am, gpsman wrote:
On Jul 16, 6:39*pm, RicodJour wrote:

If you're putting tile on drywall in a shower, it doesn't matter what
adhesive you use since it won't last long anyway.

That's probably true, but the fault of the installer, not the drywall.

The best installer wouldn't start with an inferior material,
particularly when the better material would add only a small amount to
the overall job cost.

The idea that drywall isn't worth **** as a shower substrate is due to
poor tile work.

I have to disagree with you on that. It's not worth the minor cost
saving to use drywall. It's false economy, and the downsides of
drywall in a shower far outweigh the minor benefits in cost savings
and labor. It's not even a close call in a typical shower.

Real tilesetters became scarce in the '60s with the advent of the one-
piece fiberglass enclosure (or I'd probably still be setting tile. I
liked it, and it beat the hell out of farming).

I guess that's dependent on where you are and how much somebody is
willing to pay. But I agree that true craftsmen are scarce - and
probably always have been.

Homeowners do not understand that a competent tile job on "3 walls
over the tub" make those walls a "unit". *You can see them still
standing (and still serviceable) after a house has burned to a pile of
ashes.

That doesn't mean that the walls won't move in relation to each other
a miniscule amount when in normal use. That miniscule movement is
enough to crack a grout/tile bond and create a potential leak.

One of the main tricks in unitizing those wall is in the grouting.
You have to dampen the joints before grouting if you want good
adhesion (that may no longer be true, I don't know *anything* about
the "new" grouts), and you have to *fill* the joints.

The best grouting job in the world won't deal with differential
movement between walls meeting in a corner. Any time there's an
inside corner it should be caulked. And before you say it - caulking
is also a lost art!

If your tile job leaks, it doesn't matter what's behind it. *Sure,
drywall will absorb the water and ruin your tile job, but with rock it
will immediately run down and affect another part of the house as
well.

I'm not sure I follow you on this one. It almost sounds like you're
suggesting using drywall as a sponge to catch the water getting past
the tile. The best thing that can happen with any leak is to catch it
quickly. That little leak will turn into a big problem if it's not
caught quickly. It's not just a question of what the tile is set on,
but also mold and ruined framing.

Drywall is cheap, tile work isn't.

It should be, considering what passes for tile work these days.

*From your post it's clear you know
you should replace the drywall - so do it. *It won't take that much
time or that much money.

That depends on how much money you got. *I've been in a position where
$5 was like $500.

Well, hopefully you've also been in a position where $500 seemed like
$5...or at the very least, $500 seemed like $500.

R

On Jul 17, 10:59*am, RicodJour wrote:
On Jul 17, 9:43*am, gpsman wrote:

On Jul 16, 6:39*pm, RicodJour wrote:

If you're putting tile on drywall in a shower, it doesn't matter what
adhesive you use since it won't last long anyway.

That's probably true, but the fault of the installer, not the drywall.

The best installer wouldn't start with an inferior material,
particularly when the better material would add only a small amount to
the overall job cost.

The idea that drywall isn't worth **** as a shower substrate is due to
poor tile work.

I have to disagree with you on that. *It's not worth the minor cost
saving to use drywall. *It's false economy, and the downsides of
drywall in a shower far outweigh the minor benefits in cost savings
and labor. *It's not even a close call in a typical shower.

Not the point.

Real tilesetters became scarce in the '60s with the advent of the one-
piece fiberglass enclosure (or I'd probably still be setting tile. I
liked it, and it beat the hell out of farming).

I guess that's dependent on where you are and how much somebody is
willing to pay. *But I agree that true craftsmen are scarce - and
probably always have been.

I knew lots of them, once upon a time.

Homeowners do not understand that a competent tile job on "3 walls
over the tub" make those walls a "unit". *You can see them still
standing (and still serviceable) after a house has burned to a pile of
ashes.

That doesn't mean that the walls won't move in relation to each other
a miniscule amount when in normal use. *That miniscule movement is
enough to crack a grout/tile bond and create a potential leak.

A competent tile job will remain a unit and move the drywall.

One of the main tricks in unitizing those wall is in the grouting.

The best grouting job in the world won't deal with differential
movement between walls meeting in a corner.

Neither will rock.

*Any time there's an
inside corner it should be caulked.

First, it should be grouted.

And before you say it - caulking
is also a lost art!

And I've lost it, too...

If your tile job leaks, it doesn't matter what's behind it. *Sure,
drywall will absorb the water and ruin your tile job, but with rock it
will immediately run down and affect another part of the house as
well.

I'm not sure I follow you on this one. *It almost sounds like you're
suggesting using drywall as a sponge to catch the water getting past
the tile. *The best thing that can happen with any leak is to catch it
quickly.

Right. Do you want a tile repair, or a ceiling drywall.

That little leak will turn into a big problem if it's not
caught quickly. *It's not just a question of what the tile is set on,
but also mold and ruined framing.

I think leaks become apparent before that.

*From your post it's clear you know
you should replace the drywall - so do it. *It won't take that much
time or that much money.

That depends on how much money you got. *I've been in a position where
$5 was like $500.

Well, hopefully you've also been in a position where $500 seemed like
$5...or at the very least, $500 seemed like $500. *

I got lots of $500, but $5 is still $5. I had lots then, too, but at
the time that money was put away to care for my parents, so I missed
some meals.
-----

- gpsman

RicodJour wrote in
:

On Jul 16, 6:51*pm, Uno wrote:
I'm hanging 3 x 6 x 1/4" tile in a half shower. *I've got durock on
the bottom foot and treated sheetrock on everything above.

So I can tile the bottom of it conventionally, and would expect to
use what they recommend at lowe's: *the tile mortar with polymer.

q1) *There's two of them, one for $18 and another for $24. *What shou
ld
I look for? *By no means do I adhere to the Law of It's better
because It Costs More.

I wish I hadn't hung treated, but I did. *I know I can make tiles
stick with all-purpose construction adhesive. *But I'm in the market
for something that bridges that gap between the two.

"Mastic" doesn't really exist anymore, at least at the place where
I'm constrained to buy things that I can. *That said, to find the
right adhesives or additives, I will seek out any bona fide
recommendation.

If you're putting tile on drywall in a shower, it doesn't matter what
adhesive you use since it won't last long anyway.

Truthfully funny reply.


Drywall is cheap, tile work isn't. From your post it's clear you know
you should replace the drywall - so do it. It won't take that much
time or that much money.

If you insist on throwing good money after bad, use a trowel on
waterproofing over everything, such as Redgard, before you put up the
tile. The use the standard latex/acrylic modified thinset to set the
tile. Redgard is not cheap, but it will allow you to proceed without
tearing anything out.

R

I would remove all the existing wallboard and install concrete board,
then mortar the joints.

if the OP proceeds with his current plans at least in a few years when
the tile fails he will be experienced making it easier to begin all
over again

On 7/16/2011 6:51 PM, Uno wrote:
I'm hanging 3 x 6 x 1/4" tile in a half shower. I've got durock on the
bottom foot and treated sheetrock on everything above.

So I can tile the bottom of it conventionally, and would expect to use
what they recommend at lowe's: the tile mortar with polymer.

q1) There's two of them, one for $18 and another for $24. What should I
look for? By no means do I adhere to the Law of It's better because It
Costs More.

I wish I hadn't hung treated, but I did. I know I can make tiles stick
with all-purpose construction adhesive. But I'm in the market for
something that bridges that gap between the two.

"Mastic" doesn't really exist anymore, at least at the place where I'm
constrained to buy things that I can. That said, to find the right
adhesives or additives, I will seek out any bona fide recommendation.

Things are good in my hood,

Some special reason you didn't use backer board to above the splash
line? (say 6 feet or so, or however high the tile will go.) That
'treated' sheetrock is not for showers, it is for above showers and the
other bathroom walls. I know greenboard and whatever replaced it were
SOP for several decades after mudbeds died out, but we know better now.

Ya wanna fix it now, or in 7-10 years when it fails? Saw out the fancy
sheetrock, replace it to proper height with backer board, and use the
same adhesive all the way up.

--
aem sends...

On 7/16/2011 5:00 PM, aemeijers wrote:
On 7/16/2011 6:51 PM, Uno wrote:
I'm hanging 3 x 6 x 1/4" tile in a half shower. I've got durock on the
bottom foot and treated sheetrock on everything above.

So I can tile the bottom of it conventionally, and would expect to use
what they recommend at lowe's: the tile mortar with polymer.

q1) There's two of them, one for $18 and another for $24. What should I
look for? By no means do I adhere to the Law of It's better because It
Costs More.

I wish I hadn't hung treated, but I did. I know I can make tiles stick
with all-purpose construction adhesive. But I'm in the market for
something that bridges that gap between the two.

"Mastic" doesn't really exist anymore, at least at the place where I'm
constrained to buy things that I can. That said, to find the right
adhesives or additives, I will seek out any bona fide recommendation.

Things are good in my hood,

Some special reason you didn't use backer board to above the splash
line? (say 6 feet or so, or however high the tile will go.) That
'treated' sheetrock is not for showers, it is for above showers and the
other bathroom walls. I know greenboard and whatever replaced it were
SOP for several decades after mudbeds died out, but we know better now.

Ya wanna fix it now, or in 7-10 years when it fails? Saw out the fancy
sheetrock, replace it to proper height with backer board, and use the
same adhesive all the way up.



Thanks all for replies. I've read them summarily and again thank
contributors to criticisms of details.

As I proceeded with design, I imagined that I would use an appropriate
adhesive for any given region, with the durock at the bottom, so that I
know things aren't going to F* up from the start.

I'm looking for some Klebbig stoff, and prefer to mix it myself.
--
Uno