I'm adding a couple of steel outlet boxes and switch boxes in my
residence, fed by 12-2 w/g Romex. I've noticed in Lowes some of the
boxes have clamps built inside to secure the Romex, and some don't.
Are clamps required by NEC?

The other thing I'm wondering about is the knockout holes on the sides
and back of the boxes. Are rubber grommets required for the holes I
run the Romex through?

"Josh" wrote in message
...
I'm adding a couple of steel outlet boxes and switch boxes in my
residence, fed by 12-2 w/g Romex. I've noticed in Lowes some of the
boxes have clamps built inside to secure the Romex, and some don't.
Are clamps required by NEC?

The other thing I'm wondering about is the knockout holes on the
sides
and back of the boxes. Are rubber grommets required for the holes I
run the Romex through?

Whether they are required or not, I always use the clamps if they come
with the box. Otherwise I use rubber grommets. Metal rubbing on
plastic usually winds up with the metal winning and with electricity,
the results are often not pretty.

On Jul 29, 2:56*pm, Josh wrote:
I'm adding a couple of steel outlet boxes and switch boxes in my
residence, fed by 12-2 w/g Romex. *I've noticed in Lowes some of the
boxes have clamps built inside to secure the Romex, and some don't.
Are clamps required by NEC?

The other thing I'm wondering about is the knockout holes on the sides
and back of the boxes. *Are rubber grommets required for the holes I
run the Romex through?

Clamps are required. The knockout holes require separate clamps. The
reason those holes are used is to allow connection of conduit as well
as Romex and BX type cables. (you simply use a different clamp/
connector for each type of wiring.) If you buy boxes with integral
clamps make sure you get the ones for Romex not BX (they look similar
but are subtly different.)

For Romex, you can also use the little black Arlington buttons instead
of clamps

Romex clamp:

http://www.acehardwareoutlet.com/pro...?sku=998017976

Arlington button:

http://www.aifittings.com/whnew104.htm

nate

http://www.acehardwareoutlet.com/pro...?sku=998017976

Arlington button:

http://www.aifittings.com/whnew104.htm

nate


Thanks. The Arlington buttons look pretty nifty, serving as both a
grommet and clamp. Can they be split and added to existing steel
boxes too.....without pulling the Romex back out and gaining access to
the back or side of the outlet box?

On Jul 29, 3:39*pm, Josh wrote:
*http://www.acehardwareoutlet.com/pro...?sku=998017976



Arlington button:

http://www.aifittings.com/whnew104.htm

nate

Thanks. *The Arlington buttons look pretty nifty, serving as both a
grommet and clamp. *Can they be split and added to existing steel
boxes too.....without pulling the Romex back out and gaining access to
the back or side of the outlet box?

No. They're supposed to be pushed through the hole from the outside,
and I don't see how you would accomplish that without pulling out the
Romex, split or no. There's a flap inside the button similar to the
ones used on plastic old work boxes, to grab the cable - trying to
push the cable through the button in the reverse direction from what
is intended seems doomed to failure.

I don't think you need to worry about having a "grommet" as a properly
installed cable clamp will not allow the cable to move relative to the
box at all, so no possibility of chafing exists. The Arlington button
and the traditional Romex clamp accomplish the same thing but in
different ways. The main advantage of the Arlington button is reduced
installation time.

nate

On Thu, 29 Jul 2010 11:56:14 -0700 (PDT), Josh
wrote:

I'm adding a couple of steel outlet boxes and switch boxes in my
residence, fed by 12-2 w/g Romex. I've noticed in Lowes some of the
boxes have clamps built inside to secure the Romex, and some don't.
Are clamps required by NEC?

The other thing I'm wondering about is the knockout holes on the sides
and back of the boxes. Are rubber grommets required for the holes I
run the Romex through?

If the question is indicative of your your electrical knowledge,
please call an electrician.

"Josh" wrote in message
...
I'm adding a couple of steel outlet boxes and switch boxes in my
residence, fed by 12-2 w/g Romex. I've noticed in Lowes some of the
boxes have clamps built inside to secure the Romex, and some don't.
Are clamps required by NEC?

The other thing I'm wondering about is the knockout holes on the sides
and back of the boxes. Are rubber grommets required for the holes I
run the Romex through?


Depending upon the box type and composition, clamps or connectors may or may
not be required. For metal boxes, I'm a big fan of the Arlington button.
They take up very little space and are easy to use. Be sure to use boxes of
adequate size for the size and amount of cables you plan to use in each box.

On Thu, 29 Jul 2010 11:56:14 -0700 (PDT), Josh
wrote:

I'm adding a couple of steel outlet boxes and switch boxes in my
residence, fed by 12-2 w/g Romex. I've noticed in Lowes some of the
boxes have clamps built inside to secure the Romex, and some don't.
Are clamps required by NEC?

Probably. I'm not an electrician and I've never had a copy of the NEC,
so I can't say yes, but you should use clamps regardless.

The other thing I'm wondering about is the knockout holes on the sides
and back of the boxes. Are rubber grommets required for the holes I
run the Romex through?

You're supposed to use add-on clamps for those knockouts. They not
only hold the romex in place, they fill the rest of the hole, so that
sparking and fire will stay in the box and not spread to the wall.

I've never heard of the use of grommets here and I woudln't consider
using them. They don't fill the hole.

Felix has a point. IF you want to do this yourself, at least read a
couple books on the subject. They have DIY books that deal with
electricity. Some have long chapters. If they're long, maybe 2 or 3
of them would be enough. they have them at the libary and the book
department of Home Depot etc. (If they only have in stock, "How to
illuminate your patio", that will probalby go too fast past the basic
electrical wiring.)

http://www.acehardwareoutlet.com/pro...?sku=998017976

Arlington button:

http://www.aifittings.com/whnew104.htm

nate


Thanks. The Arlington buttons look pretty nifty, serving as both a
grommet and clamp. Can they be split and added to existing steel
boxes too.....without pulling the Romex back out and gaining access to
the back or side of the outlet box?


*Depending on the manufacturer, some button type Romex connectors come from
the factory with a slit in them. I have installed a few of these after the
wire was installed. I used Channellocks to squeeze the button over itself a
little and pushed it into the hole at the same time while also trying not to
damage the cable. A third hand could be useful, but not required. One
trick I learned in the process is to install the button over the individual
conductors and not the outer sheath. Once the button is in place you can
pull the cable with the outer sheath through.

N8N wrote:
Clamps are required. The knockout holes require separate clamps. The
reason those holes are used is to allow connection of conduit as well
as Romex and BX type cables. (you simply use a different clamp/
connector for each type of wiring.) If you buy boxes with integral
clamps make sure you get the ones for Romex not BX (they look similar
but are subtly different.)

For Romex, you can also use the little black Arlington buttons instead
of clamps

Thanks for the info. What about the little plastic (often blue in color)
outlet boxes? They have rectangular knockouts on the back end; is there a
clamping fixture for them, or does the wire just hang freely?

Jon

"Jon Danniken" wrote in message
...
N8N wrote:
Clamps are required. The knockout holes require separate clamps.
The
reason those holes are used is to allow connection of conduit as
well
as Romex and BX type cables. (you simply use a different clamp/
connector for each type of wiring.) If you buy boxes with integral
clamps make sure you get the ones for Romex not BX (they look
similar
but are subtly different.)

For Romex, you can also use the little black Arlington buttons
instead
of clamps

Thanks for the info. What about the little plastic (often blue in
color) outlet boxes? They have rectangular knockouts on the back
end; is there a clamping fixture for them, or does the wire just
hang freely?

Jon

You are not supposed to completely remove those flaps (for lack of a
better word), as they close back against the cable and hold it. I
absolutely hate plastic boxes.

"Jon Danniken" wrote in message
...
N8N wrote:
Clamps are required. The knockout holes require separate clamps. The
reason those holes are used is to allow connection of conduit as well
as Romex and BX type cables. (you simply use a different clamp/
connector for each type of wiring.) If you buy boxes with integral
clamps make sure you get the ones for Romex not BX (they look similar
but are subtly different.)

For Romex, you can also use the little black Arlington buttons instead
of clamps

Thanks for the info. What about the little plastic (often blue in color)
outlet boxes? They have rectangular knockouts on the back end; is there a
clamping fixture for them, or does the wire just hang freely?

Jon
Those don't use or require clamps or connectors, you simply staple the
cable close to the box

"The Post Quartermaster"
wrote in message ...

"Jon Danniken" wrote in message
...
N8N wrote:
Clamps are required. The knockout holes require separate clamps. The
reason those holes are used is to allow connection of conduit as well
as Romex and BX type cables. (you simply use a different clamp/
connector for each type of wiring.) If you buy boxes with integral
clamps make sure you get the ones for Romex not BX (they look similar
but are subtly different.)

For Romex, you can also use the little black Arlington buttons instead
of clamps

Thanks for the info. What about the little plastic (often blue in color)
outlet boxes? They have rectangular knockouts on the back end; is there
a clamping fixture for them, or does the wire just hang freely?

Jon

You are not supposed to completely remove those flaps (for lack of a
better word), as they close back against the cable and hold it. I
absolutely hate plastic boxes.
Some plastic boxes have built in "clamps", but others have plastic squares
that get completely knocked out.

The Post Quartermaster wrote:
"Jon Danniken" wrote in message

Thanks for the info. What about the little plastic (often blue in
color) outlet boxes? They have rectangular knockouts on the back
end; is there a clamping fixture for them, or does the wire just
hang freely?

Jon

You are not supposed to completely remove those flaps (for lack of a
better word), as they close back against the cable and hold it. I
absolutely hate plastic boxes.

Aye, I absolutely hate them as well, but they are (to my knowledge) the only
ones available with the flip-out "wings" to install them into a pre-existing
wall (without cutting out a hole larger than the box itself).

Jon

RBM wrote:
"Jon Danniken" wrote in message
...
N8N wrote:
Clamps are required. The knockout holes require separate clamps. The
reason those holes are used is to allow connection of conduit
as well as Romex and BX type cables. (you simply use a different
clamp/ connector for each type of wiring.) If you buy boxes with
integral clamps make sure you get the ones for Romex not BX (they
look similar but are subtly different.)

For Romex, you can also use the little black Arlington buttons
instead of clamps

Thanks for the info. What about the little plastic (often blue in
color) outlet boxes? They have rectangular knockouts on the back
end; is there a clamping fixture for them, or does the wire just
hang freely? Jon
Those don't use or require clamps or connectors, you simply staple
the cable close to the box

Interesting, thanks for that.

Jon

"Jon Danniken" wrote in message
...
The Post Quartermaster wrote:
"Jon Danniken" wrote in message

Thanks for the info. What about the little plastic (often blue in
color) outlet boxes? They have rectangular knockouts on the back
end; is there a clamping fixture for them, or does the wire just
hang freely?

Jon

You are not supposed to completely remove those flaps (for lack of a
better word), as they close back against the cable and hold it. I
absolutely hate plastic boxes.

Aye, I absolutely hate them as well, but they are (to my knowledge) the
only ones available with the flip-out "wings" to install them into a
pre-existing wall (without cutting out a hole larger than the box itself).

Jon
There are a number of box supports available for metal switch boxes that
don't require opening the wall larger than the box. I'm kind of partial to
the old fashioned "madison bars", but clip on wings and other stuff are also
available.

"RBM" wrote in message
...

"Josh" wrote in message
...
I'm adding a couple of steel outlet boxes and switch boxes in my
residence, fed by 12-2 w/g Romex. I've noticed in Lowes some of the
boxes have clamps built inside to secure the Romex, and some don't.
Are clamps required by NEC?

The other thing I'm wondering about is the knockout holes on the sides
and back of the boxes. Are rubber grommets required for the holes I
run the Romex through?


Depending upon the box type and composition, clamps or connectors may or
may not be required. For metal boxes, I'm a big fan of the Arlington
button. They take up very little space and are easy to use. Be sure to use
boxes of adequate size for the size and amount of cables you plan to use
in each box.

I am curious...., why don't plastic boxes come with round knock-outs like
metal boxes have?

Instead of having to deal with the blue plastic bendable flaps, I would much
rather have a plastic box with round knock-out holes, and then use Arlington
buttons to secure the incoming wires.

On Thu, 29 Jul 2010 14:00:19 -0500, "The Post Quartermaster"
wrote:


"Josh" wrote in message
...
I'm adding a couple of steel outlet boxes and switch boxes in my
residence, fed by 12-2 w/g Romex. I've noticed in Lowes some of the
boxes have clamps built inside to secure the Romex, and some don't.
Are clamps required by NEC?

The other thing I'm wondering about is the knockout holes on the
sides
and back of the boxes. Are rubber grommets required for the holes I
run the Romex through?

Whether they are required or not, I always use the clamps if they come
with the box. Otherwise I use rubber grommets. Metal rubbing on
plastic usually winds up with the metal winning and with electricity,
the results are often not pretty.
As far as I know, the clamps are mandatory, and I've never seen
grommets used in interior domestic wiring.

On Thu, 29 Jul 2010 16:31:18 -0700, "Jon Danniken"
wrote:

The Post Quartermaster wrote:
"Jon Danniken" wrote in message

Thanks for the info. What about the little plastic (often blue in
color) outlet boxes? They have rectangular knockouts on the back
end; is there a clamping fixture for them, or does the wire just
hang freely?

Jon

You are not supposed to completely remove those flaps (for lack of a
better word), as they close back against the cable and hold it. I
absolutely hate plastic boxes.

Aye, I absolutely hate them as well, but they are (to my knowledge) the only
ones available with the flip-out "wings" to install them into a pre-existing
wall (without cutting out a hole larger than the box itself).

Jon

Lots of steel "rework" boxed also have capability of installing from
the front, through the hole, with expanding "jaws" to hold to the
drywall

"Jay-T" wrote in message
...
"RBM" wrote in message
...

"Josh" wrote in message
...
I'm adding a couple of steel outlet boxes and switch boxes in my
residence, fed by 12-2 w/g Romex. I've noticed in Lowes some of the
boxes have clamps built inside to secure the Romex, and some don't.
Are clamps required by NEC?

The other thing I'm wondering about is the knockout holes on the sides
and back of the boxes. Are rubber grommets required for the holes I
run the Romex through?


Depending upon the box type and composition, clamps or connectors may or
may not be required. For metal boxes, I'm a big fan of the Arlington
button. They take up very little space and are easy to use. Be sure to
use boxes of adequate size for the size and amount of cables you plan to
use in each box.

I am curious...., why don't plastic boxes come with round knock-outs like
metal boxes have?

Instead of having to deal with the blue plastic bendable flaps, I would
much rather have a plastic box with round knock-out holes, and then use
Arlington buttons to secure the incoming wires.

You can get larger plastic boxes, like 4" square with knockouts, but I've
never seen them on single gang boxes. I'm not real sure that a button will
hold tight in a plastic box. It may be slightly thicker than steel

If the question is indicative of your your electrical knowledge,
please call an electrician.


Felix, the trouble with Lectricians is them *******s want to be PAID.
What's up with that?

RBM wrote:
There are a number of box supports available for metal switch boxes
that don't require opening the wall larger than the box. I'm kind of
partial to the old fashioned "madison bars", but clip on wings and
other stuff are also available.

Ah, cool, it helps to know what those things are called. I'll try and see
if I can acquire some locally for the 240 box I'm putting in for my welder.

Jon

wrote:

Lots of steel "rework" boxed also have capability of installing from
the front, through the hole, with expanding "jaws" to hold to the
drywall

I don't see stuff like that at my local hardware store. Professionals get
all the good stuff.

Jon

On Thu, 29 Jul 2010 20:14:11 -0700, "Jon Danniken"
wrote:

wrote:

Lots of steel "rework" boxed also have capability of installing from
the front, through the hole, with expanding "jaws" to hold to the
drywall

I don't see stuff like that at my local hardware store. Professionals get
all the good stuff.

I bet they do. Lowes and the BORG certainly do. Perhaps you don't know what
you're looking at? BTW, they're normally called "old work boxes".

zzzzzzzzzz wrote:
On Thu, 29 Jul 2010 20:14:11 -0700, "Jon Danniken"
wrote:

wrote:

Lots of steel "rework" boxed also have capability of installing from
the front, through the hole, with expanding "jaws" to hold to the
drywall

I don't see stuff like that at my local hardware store.
Professionals get all the good stuff.

I bet they do. Lowes and the BORG certainly do. Perhaps you don't
know what you're looking at? BTW, they're normally called "old work
boxes".

Well, I've seen the plastic boxes with the wings that flip out and tighten
up against the back of the drywall, and I do know the difference between
old-work and new-work. Just haven't seen any metal boxes with a similar
feature.

Jon

wrote in message
...
On Thu, 29 Jul 2010 20:14:11 -0700, "Jon Danniken"
wrote:

wrote:

Lots of steel "rework" boxed also have capability of installing from
the front, through the hole, with expanding "jaws" to hold to the
drywall

I don't see stuff like that at my local hardware store. Professionals get
all the good stuff.

I bet they do. Lowes and the BORG certainly do. Perhaps you don't know
what
you're looking at? BTW, they're normally called "old work boxes".

"Jon Danniken" wrote in message
...
zzzzzzzzzz wrote:
On Thu, 29 Jul 2010 20:14:11 -0700, "Jon Danniken"
wrote:

wrote:

Lots of steel "rework" boxed also have capability of installing from
the front, through the hole, with expanding "jaws" to hold to the
drywall

I don't see stuff like that at my local hardware store.
Professionals get all the good stuff.

I bet they do. Lowes and the BORG certainly do. Perhaps you don't
know what you're looking at? BTW, they're normally called "old work
boxes".

Well, I've seen the plastic boxes with the wings that flip out and tighten
up against the back of the drywall, and I do know the difference between
old-work and new-work. Just haven't seen any metal boxes with a similar
feature.

Jon

Boxes made for existing walls will have some sort of bracket to prevent the
box from falling into the wall, then you need some other type of device to
prevent the box from falling out of the wall, such as plaster tins=madison
bars=switch box supports. But be careful as things are "normally" called by
different names in different places. Such as cut in gem box = wet wall box
=old work box

I havn't got the electrical code handy, but that's my thought. Sharp
edges of metal boxes aren't good for wires.

When I replaced my old furnace, I found out that the last guy hadn't
used a romex clamp where the wire comes into my furnace. I'm surprised
and pleased that the metal edge of the furnace hadn't worn through.

--
Christopher A. Young
Learn more about Jesus
www.lds.org
..


"The Post Quartermaster"
wrote in message
...

Whether they are required or not, I always use the clamps if they come
with the box. Otherwise I use rubber grommets. Metal rubbing on
plastic usually winds up with the metal winning and with electricity,
the results are often not pretty.

On Jul 30, 12:41*am, "Jon Danniken"
wrote:
wrote:
On Thu, 29 Jul 2010 20:14:11 -0700, "Jon Danniken"
wrote:

wrote:

Lots of steel "rework" boxed also have capability of installing from
the front, through the hole, with expanding "jaws" to hold to the
drywall

I don't see stuff like that at my local hardware store.
Professionals get all the good stuff.

I bet they do. *Lowes and the BORG certainly do. *Perhaps you don't
know what you're looking at? *BTW, they're normally called "old work
boxes".

Well, I've seen the plastic boxes with the wings that flip out and tighten
up against the back of the drywall, and I do know the difference between
old-work and new-work. *Just haven't seen any metal boxes with a similar
feature.

Metal old-wiring boxes are available in every home improvement store
and larger hardware stores I've ever looked for such stuff in.
Instead of the flip-out tabs, they have a metal strip on the side that
deforms out behind the wall as the screw is turned, much like a molly-
bolt.

You can also use the 'E' fingers that slip behind the wall and then
are bent into the box.

On Jul 29, 11:14*pm, "Jon Danniken"
wrote:
wrote:

Lots of steel "rework" boxed also have capability of installing from
the front, through the hole, with expanding "jaws" to hold to the
drywall

I don't see stuff like that at my local hardware store. *Professionals get
all the good stuff.

Jon

Same here. Those just aren't available at the Big Boxen, and in fact,
even metal old work boxes and Madison hangers are hard to find,
although they do have them (and they are usually on different shelves
from each other, what's up with that?)

nate

On Jul 30, 8:16*am, keith wrote:
On Jul 30, 12:41*am, "Jon Danniken"





wrote:
wrote:
On Thu, 29 Jul 2010 20:14:11 -0700, "Jon Danniken"
wrote:

wrote:

Lots of steel "rework" boxed also have capability of installing from
the front, through the hole, with expanding "jaws" to hold to the
drywall

I don't see stuff like that at my local hardware store.
Professionals get all the good stuff.

I bet they do. *Lowes and the BORG certainly do. *Perhaps you don't
know what you're looking at? *BTW, they're normally called "old work
boxes".

Well, I've seen the plastic boxes with the wings that flip out and tighten
up against the back of the drywall, and I do know the difference between
old-work and new-work. *Just haven't seen any metal boxes with a similar
feature.

Metal old-wiring boxes are available in every home improvement store
and larger hardware stores I've ever looked for such stuff in.
Instead of the flip-out tabs, they have a metal strip on the side that
deforms out behind the wall as the screw is turned, much like a molly-
bolt.

Around here, those are only available at supply houses. But
fortunately at least one of them is open on Saturday mornings.

nate

On Jul 30, 7:22*am, N8N wrote:
On Jul 30, 8:16*am, keith wrote:



On Jul 30, 12:41*am, "Jon Danniken"

wrote:
wrote:
On Thu, 29 Jul 2010 20:14:11 -0700, "Jon Danniken"
wrote:

wrote:

Lots of steel "rework" boxed also have capability of installing from
the front, through the hole, with expanding "jaws" to hold to the
drywall

I don't see stuff like that at my local hardware store.
Professionals get all the good stuff.

I bet they do. *Lowes and the BORG certainly do. *Perhaps you don't
know what you're looking at? *BTW, they're normally called "old work
boxes".

Well, I've seen the plastic boxes with the wings that flip out and tighten
up against the back of the drywall, and I do know the difference between
old-work and new-work. *Just haven't seen any metal boxes with a similar
feature.

Metal old-wiring boxes are available in every home improvement store
and larger hardware stores I've ever looked for such stuff in.
Instead of the flip-out tabs, they have a metal strip on the side that
deforms out behind the wall as the screw is turned, much like a molly-
bolt.

Around here, those are only available at supply houses. *But
fortunately at least one of them is open on Saturday mornings.

Really? Have you checked at the BORG?

In article , N8N wrote:
On Jul 30, 8:16=A0am, keith wrote:

Metal old-wiring boxes are available in every home improvement store
and larger hardware stores I've ever looked for such stuff in.
Instead of the flip-out tabs, they have a metal strip on the side that
deforms out behind the wall as the screw is turned, much like a molly-
bolt.

Around here, those are only available at supply houses. But
fortunately at least one of them is open on Saturday mornings.

Bull****. Judging by your IP address, "around here" appears to be Dallas, TX.
Are there no Lowe's, Home Depot, Menards, or Ace Hardware stores in the Dallas
area?

In article , N8N wrote:
On Jul 29, 11:14=A0pm, "Jon Danniken"
wrote:
wrote:

Lots of steel "rework" boxed also have capability of installing from
the front, through the hole, with expanding "jaws" to hold to the
drywall

I don't see stuff like that at my local hardware store. Professionals get
all the good stuff.

Same here. Those just aren't available at the Big Boxen,

Yes, they are. You just haven't found them yet.

http://www.homedepot.
com/h_d1/N-5yc1vZ1xno/R-100197582/h_d2/ProductDisplay?catalogId=10053

http://www.lowes.com/pd_74219-427-506_0_

and in fact,
even metal old work boxes and Madison hangers are hard to find,

Oddly enough, I have no trouble finding them.

although they do have them (and they are usually on different shelves
from each other, what's up with that?)

Different products are in different places. What's hard to understand about
that?

On Jul 30, 9:15*am, (Doug Miller) wrote:
In article , N8N wrote:

On Jul 30, 8:16=A0am, keith wrote:
Metal old-wiring boxes are available in every home improvement store
and larger hardware stores I've ever looked for such stuff in.
Instead of the flip-out tabs, they have a metal strip on the side that
deforms out behind the wall as the screw is turned, much like a molly-
bolt.

Around here, those are only available at supply houses. *But
fortunately at least one of them is open on Saturday mornings.

Bull****. Judging by your IP address, "around here" appears to be Dallas, TX.
Are there no Lowe's, Home Depot, Menards, or Ace Hardware stores in the Dallas
area?

I'm actually in northern VA, and we have tons of Home Depots although
there are none of the others convenient to me (there's a Lowe's about
20 miles away.) They do NOT carry anything other than the plastic
boxes, new work boxes, and the traditional old work boxes that are
used with Madison hangers.

nate

On Jul 30, 9:22*am, (Doug Miller) wrote:
In article , N8N wrote:

On Jul 29, 11:14=A0pm, "Jon Danniken"
wrote:
wrote:

Lots of steel "rework" boxed also have capability of installing from
the front, through the hole, with expanding "jaws" to hold to the
drywall

I don't see stuff like that at my local hardware store. Professionals get
all the good stuff.
Same here. *Those just aren't available at the Big Boxen,

Yes, they are. You just haven't found them yet.

http://www.homedepot.
com/h_d1/N-5yc1vZ1xno/R-100197582/h_d2/ProductDisplay?catalogId=10053

http://www.lowes.com/pd_74219-427-506_0_

Come to the store with me and show me where I can actually purchase
them.


and in fact,
even metal old work boxes and Madison hangers are hard to find,

Oddly enough, I have no trouble finding them.

although they do have them (and they are usually on different shelves
from each other, what's up with that?)

Different products are in different places. What's hard to understand about
that?

It makes no sense?

Think about it, if one product is worthless without the other and vice
versa, wouldn't it make sense to stock them close to each other?

nate

On Jul 29, 4:58*pm, "RBM" wrote:
"Josh" wrote in message

...

I'm adding a couple of steel outlet boxes and switch boxes in my
residence, fed by 12-2 w/g Romex. *I've noticed in Lowes some of the
boxes have clamps built inside to secure the Romex, and some don't.
Are clamps required by NEC?

The other thing I'm wondering about is the knockout holes on the sides
and back of the boxes. *Are rubber grommets required for the holes I
run the Romex through?

Depending upon the box type and composition, clamps or connectors may or may
not be required. For metal boxes, I'm a big fan of the Arlington button.
They take up very little space and are easy to use. Be sure to use boxes of
adequate size for the size and amount of cables you plan to use in each box.

Y'know, that just registered... I think for 12/2 you will need to use
a large box. the standard 2-1/2" switch boxes don't have enough
capacity to accomodate two cables, clamps, and a device by current
code. you'll need whatever the deeper size is.

nate

In article ,
Felix Oska wrote:

On Thu, 29 Jul 2010 11:56:14 -0700 (PDT), Josh
wrote:

I'm adding a couple of steel outlet boxes and switch boxes in my
residence, fed by 12-2 w/g Romex. I've noticed in Lowes some of the
boxes have clamps built inside to secure the Romex, and some don't.
Are clamps required by NEC?

The other thing I'm wondering about is the knockout holes on the sides
and back of the boxes. Are rubber grommets required for the holes I
run the Romex through?

If the question is indicative of your your electrical knowledge,
please call an electrician.

If we chose to treat ignorance by deliberately remaining ignorant, we'd
still be sucking on the bottle and crapping our diapers. Life is about
learning, Felix.

In article , N8N wrote:
On Jul 30, 9:22=A0am, (Doug Miller) wrote:
In article .=
com, N8N wrote:

On Jul 29, 11:14=3DA0pm, "Jon Danniken"
wrote:
wrote:

Lots of steel "rework" boxed also have capability of installing from
the front, through the hole, with expanding "jaws" to hold to the
drywall

I don't see stuff like that at my local hardware store. Professionals =
get
all the good stuff.
Same here. Those just aren't available at the Big Boxen,

Yes, they are. You just haven't found them yet.

http://www.homedepot.
com/h_d1/N-5yc1vZ1xno/R-100197582/h_d2/ProductDisplay?catalogId=10053

http://www.lowes.com/pd_74219-427-506_0_

Come to the store with me and show me where I can actually purchase
them.

I don't work there. Talk to the people that do.

and in fact,
even metal old work boxes and Madison hangers are hard to find,

Oddly enough, I have no trouble finding them.

although they do have them (and they are usually on different shelves
from each other, what's up with that?)

Different products are in different places. What's hard to understand about
that?

It makes no sense?

Think about it, if one product is worthless without the other and vice
versa, wouldn't it make sense to stock them close to each other?

So you expect to find nails on the same aisle as the 2x4s? When you go to the
grocery, you expect to find baking pans right next to the flour, or milk with
the cereal? Do they keep charcoal in the meat case?

On Jul 30, 10:37*am, (Doug Miller) wrote:
In article , N8N wrote:





On Jul 30, 9:22=A0am, (Doug Miller) wrote:
In article .=
com, N8N wrote:

On Jul 29, 11:14=3DA0pm, "Jon Danniken"
wrote:
wrote:

Lots of steel "rework" boxed also have capability of installing from
the front, through the hole, with expanding "jaws" to hold to the
drywall

I don't see stuff like that at my local hardware store. Professionals =
get
all the good stuff.
Same here. Those just aren't available at the Big Boxen,

Yes, they are. You just haven't found them yet.

http://www.homedepot.
com/h_d1/N-5yc1vZ1xno/R-100197582/h_d2/ProductDisplay?catalogId=10053

http://www.lowes.com/pd_74219-427-506_0_

Come to the store with me and show me where I can actually purchase
them.

I don't work there. Talk to the people that do.

and in fact,
even metal old work boxes and Madison hangers are hard to find,

Oddly enough, I have no trouble finding them.

although they do have them (and they are usually on different shelves
from each other, what's up with that?)

Different products are in different places. What's hard to understand about
that?

It makes no sense?

Think about it, if one product is worthless without the other and vice
versa, wouldn't it make sense to stock them close to each other?

So you expect to find nails on the same aisle as the 2x4s? When you go to the
grocery, you expect to find baking pans right next to the flour, or milk with
the cereal? Do they keep charcoal in the meat case?- Hide quoted text -

- Show quoted text -

My Borg sells 2 x 4's with the nails already pounded in. That sure
saves a lot of work.

I just screw them up where I need them and never have to swing a
hammer. Sweet!