On Fri, 2 Jul 2010 17:59:35 -0400, RBM wrote:

The bulb inside the fixture shouldn't be in any water.
Now that it is fixed, I finally realize that fact. Water was leaking in,
and taking about 5 minutes to flip the GFCI.

If it is, the seal on the fixture is bad
That solved the problem. I didn't see anything wrong with the old seal,
but, I put it back on twice and water still leaked in, so I replaced the
Hayward seal (even though it was an American Products light assembly) and
that solved the problem.

One question I have is HOW TIGHT to make the steel band. The tightening
screw is about two inches long and I tighted it until it wouldn't go any
further but I don't know how tight to make it since it "sealed" in the
first quarter inch, but I kept going for about 2 inches.

most likely the entire fixture needs to be replaced.
That's what the pool supply store said but it was the seal.

The GFCI is tripping because the bulb is in the water.
It's interesting that it was ALWAYS in the water (the leak was always
there, not just when I turned the lights on) but that it still took about 5
minutes after resetting the GFCI before the GFCI tripped again. You'd think
it would trip right away, not 5 minutes after resetting as the light
fixture was half full of water.

You can disconnect each fixture individually at it's deck box
I have no idea where or what a "deck box" is ...

On Sun, 04 Jul 2010 02:00:49 -0400, wrote:

That is where the power, the cable from the light and the
8 gauge bond wire from the pool shell all get connected.

I do have a few pipes popping out of the ground above the pool, one of
which is the GFCI for the pool lights so I guess that is the modern
replacement for the deck box.

BTW, what is a "bond wire"? Is that a ground wire that grounds the
poolitself? I never heard of that but will try to look it up.

wrote in message
...
On Sat, 3 Jul 2010 22:41:17 -0700, Terra Arcane
wrote:

You can disconnect each fixture individually at it's deck box
I have no idea where or what a "deck box" is ...
I haven't seen a deck box in 30 years. They used to put the junction
box right in the deck and pot it solid with some goo. These days you
will have a PVC J box somewhere away from the pool and elevated a foot
or so higher than the water level. It usually has 3 pipes coming up in
the bottom. That is where the power, the cable from the light and the
8 gauge bond wire from the pool shell all get connected.

And, if it is an older pool and you have flush deck boxes, you'll probably
see brass cover plates in the pool deck, in line with each fixture. The
newer above ground deck boxes will usually be farther away from the
fixtures, but generally in line with them.

"Terra Arcane" wrote in message
...
On Sun, 04 Jul 2010 02:00:49 -0400, wrote:

That is where the power, the cable from the light and the
8 gauge bond wire from the pool shell all get connected.

I do have a few pipes popping out of the ground above the pool, one of
which is the GFCI for the pool lights so I guess that is the modern
replacement for the deck box.

BTW, what is a "bond wire"? Is that a ground wire that grounds the
poolitself? I never heard of that but will try to look it up.

The deck box is just a special junction box for connection of under water
light fixtures. The cord that's attached to the niche fixture terminates in
the deck box. The bonding wire is a solid #8 copper wire which is attached
to all things metal associated with the pool. Once you locate the deck box,
you will find the cable from the niche fixture, the power wires, and the
bond wire inside. Here is a picture of an above ground deck box:
http://www.grainger.com/Grainger/items/4RG46?Pid=search

On Sun, 4 Jul 2010 09:19:31 -0400, RBM wrote:

newer above ground deck boxes will usually be farther away from the
fixtures, but generally in line with them.

I saw the picture kindly provided of the deck box and I don't seem to have
them. Also no brass plates. There's concrete for fifteen feet all around
the pool so I'd know if something was sticking out of that.

What I do have is the GFCI sticking about a foot and a half out of the
ground in the grass outside that concrete perimeter, and a few other
plastic pipes sticking up.

Come to think of it, some of those plastic pipes sticking up do have
plastic junction boxes, so, probably those are the missing "deck boxes".

I think what you're saying is that the wires from the lights (and the pool
#8 ground wire) don't go directly to the electronic controls but meet first
at a junction box above ground and probably in the middle between the pool
itself and the controls which are about 20 feet from the concrete perimeter
outside edge (about 35 feet from the pool edge).

Is that right?

"Terra Arcane" wrote in message
...
On Sun, 4 Jul 2010 09:19:31 -0400, RBM wrote:

newer above ground deck boxes will usually be farther away from the
fixtures, but generally in line with them.

I saw the picture kindly provided of the deck box and I don't seem to have
them. Also no brass plates. There's concrete for fifteen feet all around
the pool so I'd know if something was sticking out of that.

What I do have is the GFCI sticking about a foot and a half out of the
ground in the grass outside that concrete perimeter, and a few other
plastic pipes sticking up.

Come to think of it, some of those plastic pipes sticking up do have
plastic junction boxes, so, probably those are the missing "deck boxes".

I think what you're saying is that the wires from the lights (and the pool
#8 ground wire) don't go directly to the electronic controls but meet
first
at a junction box above ground and probably in the middle between the pool
itself and the controls which are about 20 feet from the concrete
perimeter
outside edge (about 35 feet from the pool edge).

Is that right?

The #8 Bonding conductor is literally connected to everything metal
associated with the pool, including rebar in the concrete, metal fittings
that hold ladders, the metal under water niche that holds the fixture,
pumps, heaters...

On Sun, 4 Jul 2010 13:54:09 -0400, RBM wrote:

The #8 Bonding conductor is literally connected to everything metal
associated with the pool, including rebar in the concrete,

Is it for lightning?

"Terra Arcane" wrote in message
...
On Sun, 4 Jul 2010 13:54:09 -0400, RBM wrote:

The #8 Bonding conductor is literally connected to everything metal
associated with the pool, including rebar in the concrete,

Is it for lightning?

No, it's purpose is to assure that everything metal associated with the pool
is ultimately connected to the pools grounding system, so no metal part can
become electrically live

On 04/07/10 10:00 AM, Terra Arcane wrote:
On Sun, 4 Jul 2010 09:19:31 -0400, RBM wrote:

newer above ground deck boxes will usually be farther away from the
fixtures, but generally in line with them.

I saw the picture kindly provided of the deck box and I don't seem to have
them. Also no brass plates. There's concrete for fifteen feet all around
the pool so I'd know if something was sticking out of that.

What I do have is the GFCI sticking about a foot and a half out of the
ground in the grass outside that concrete perimeter, and a few other
plastic pipes sticking up.

Come to think of it, some of those plastic pipes sticking up do have
plastic junction boxes, so, probably those are the missing "deck boxes".

I think what you're saying is that the wires from the lights (and the pool
#8 ground wire) don't go directly to the electronic controls but meet first
at a junction box above ground and probably in the middle between the pool
itself and the controls which are about 20 feet from the concrete perimeter
outside edge (about 35 feet from the pool edge).

Is that right?

When we re-did our pool that's how it was done. Since water fills the
niche, it will go up the conduit to the same level as the pool water, do
the box needs to be higher than the level of the pool.

The old pool lights were low voltage (12V), and there was a transformer
over by the pump. The new pool lights are 120VAC and don't use a
transformer. This seemed like a bad idea to me.