We live in the country and the power goes out quite often. So I bought
a 5000 watt generator, properly connected, which powers the furnace,
the water pump, the freezer anbd refrigerator and several light
circuits.
I'm told it is not wise to operator sensitivre electronics such as big
TV sets and computers on generator power. In fact I'm pretty sure
thats hiow I blew a DVD/VHS unit last year. And the digital read out
on the refrigerator has lost part of its alphanumerics.
My question...what is and is not safe to run?.
Will a surge protector ahead of the device in question prevent a
problem?.
I actually ran a small TV without a problem but not for very long.
Would appreciate a reply from some electrical guru.
ds

"DS" wrote in message
...
We live in the country and the power goes out quite often. So I bought
a 5000 watt generator, properly connected, which powers the furnace,
the water pump, the freezer anbd refrigerator and several light
circuits.
I'm told it is not wise to operator sensitivre electronics such as big
TV sets and computers on generator power. In fact I'm pretty sure
thats hiow I blew a DVD/VHS unit last year. And the digital read out
on the refrigerator has lost part of its alphanumerics.
My question...what is and is not safe to run?.
Will a surge protector ahead of the device in question prevent a
problem?.
I actually ran a small TV without a problem but not for very long.
Would appreciate a reply from some electrical guru.
ds

The electricity from cheap generators isn't very stable. For sensitive
electronics, I would buffer it through some type of UPS device

On Jan 22, 3:15*pm, DS wrote:
We live in the country and the power goes out quite often. So I bought
a 5000 watt generator, properly connected, which powers the furnace,
the water pump, the freezer anbd refrigerator and several light
circuits.
I'm told it is not wise to operator sensitivre electronics such as big
TV sets and computers on generator power. In fact I'm pretty sure
thats hiow I blew a DVD/VHS unit last year. And the digital read out
on the refrigerator has lost part of its alphanumerics.
My question...what is and is not safe to run?.
Will a surge protector ahead of the device in question prevent a
problem?.
I actually ran a small TV without a problem but not for very long.
Would appreciate a reply from some electrical guru.
ds

The problem is more a matter unstable & unfiltered than surges I don't
think a surge protector would help.
A really good UPS might though. We lived on our generator for 2 weeks
following a storm a few years ago, I finally freaked after a week &
booted a computer to make sure the internet hadn't forgotten me. I was
probably lucky, it didn't seem to do any harm, but it was up less than
an hour.

On 1/22/2009 1:48 PM RBM spake thus:

"DS" wrote in message
...

I'm told it is not wise to operator sensitivre electronics such as big
TV sets and computers on generator power. In fact I'm pretty sure
thats hiow I blew a DVD/VHS unit last year. And the digital read out
on the refrigerator has lost part of its alphanumerics.
My question...what is and is not safe to run?.
Will a surge protector ahead of the device in question prevent a
problem?.
I actually ran a small TV without a problem but not for very long.
Would appreciate a reply from some electrical guru.

The electricity from cheap generators isn't very stable. For sensitive
electronics, I would buffer it through some type of UPS device

Not stable how? Voltage fluctuations? Frequency fluctuations? Noise? Spikes?


--
"I know I will go to hell, because I pardoned Richard Nixon."

- Former President Gerald Ford to his golf partners, as related by
the late Hunter S. Thompson

On Jan 22, 6:09*pm, David Nebenzahl wrote:
On 1/22/2009 1:48 PM RBM spake thus:



"DS" wrote in message
...

I'm told it is not wise to operator sensitivre electronics such as big
TV sets and computers on generator power. In fact I'm pretty sure
thats hiow I blew a DVD/VHS unit last year. And the digital read out
on the refrigerator has lost part of its alphanumerics.
My question...what is and is not safe to run?.
Will a surge protector ahead of the device in question prevent a
problem?.
I actually ran a small TV without a problem but not for very long.
Would appreciate a reply from some electrical guru.

The electricity from cheap generators isn't very stable. For sensitive
electronics, I would buffer it through some type of UPS device

Not stable how? Voltage fluctuations? Frequency fluctuations? Noise? Spikes?

--
* "I know I will go to hell, because I pardoned Richard Nixon."

- Former President Gerald Ford to his golf partners, as related by
the late Hunter S. Thompson

Yes

"David Nebenzahl" wrote in message
s.com...
On 1/22/2009 1:48 PM RBM spake thus:

"DS" wrote in message
...

I'm told it is not wise to operator sensitivre electronics such as big
TV sets and computers on generator power. In fact I'm pretty sure
thats hiow I blew a DVD/VHS unit last year. And the digital read out
on the refrigerator has lost part of its alphanumerics.
My question...what is and is not safe to run?.
Will a surge protector ahead of the device in question prevent a
problem?.
I actually ran a small TV without a problem but not for very long.
Would appreciate a reply from some electrical guru.

The electricity from cheap generators isn't very stable. For sensitive
electronics, I would buffer it through some type of UPS device

Not stable how? Voltage fluctuations? Frequency fluctuations? Noise?
Spikes?

Yes



--
"I know I will go to hell, because I pardoned Richard Nixon."

- Former President Gerald Ford to his golf partners, as related by
the late Hunter S. Thompson

On Jan 22, 6:15*pm, Van Chocstraw
wrote:
DS wrote:
We live in the country and the power goes out quite often. So I bought
a 5000 watt generator, properly connected, which powers the furnace,
the water pump, the freezer anbd refrigerator and several light
circuits.
I'm told it is not wise to operator sensitivre electronics such as big
TV sets and computers on generator power. In fact I'm pretty sure
thats hiow I blew a DVD/VHS unit last year. And the digital read out
on the refrigerator has lost part of its alphanumerics.
My question...what is and is not safe to run?.
Will a surge protector ahead of the device in question prevent a
problem?.
I actually ran a small TV without a problem but not for very long.
Would appreciate a reply from some electrical guru.
ds

Power plants use generators.

--
//--------------------\\
* * * * Van Chocstraw
*\\--------------------//

& the trash man had a horse, but it would not be confused with Man
o'War

On Jan 22, 3:15*pm, DS wrote:
We live in the country and the power goes out quite often. So I bought
a 5000 watt generator, properly connected, which powers the furnace,
the water pump, the freezer anbd refrigerator and several light
circuits.
I'm told it is not wise to operator sensitivre electronics such as big
TV sets and computers on generator power. In fact I'm pretty sure
thats hiow I blew a DVD/VHS unit last year. And the digital read out
on the refrigerator has lost part of its alphanumerics.
My question...what is and is not safe to run?.
Will a surge protector ahead of the device in question prevent a
problem?.
I actually ran a small TV without a problem but not for very long.
Would appreciate a reply from some electrical guru.
ds

60hz 120v is at 3600 rpm, some cheap units have poor govenors and even
better small units move alot in voltage from low to high load. You
need to monitor and know your unit and how to adjust engine speed and
monitor voltage. It is safe if load and speed is constant.

DS wrote:
We live in the country and the power goes out quite often. So I bought
a 5000 watt generator, properly connected, which powers the furnace,
the water pump, the freezer anbd refrigerator and several light
circuits.
I'm told it is not wise to operator sensitivre electronics such as big
TV sets and computers on generator power. In fact I'm pretty sure
thats hiow I blew a DVD/VHS unit last year. And the digital read out
on the refrigerator has lost part of its alphanumerics.
My question...what is and is not safe to run?.
Will a surge protector ahead of the device in question prevent a
problem?.
I actually ran a small TV without a problem but not for very long.
Would appreciate a reply from some electrical guru.
ds



If you have a computer that you want to run during a power outage, and
it is considered "mission critical" run it through a "true online" style
UPS, something like these:

http://www.tripplite.com/EN/products...=661&EID=13820

NOT cheap, but if it absolutely positively must be protected, it's what
you need. Basically the line voltage charges the batteries, and the
load is connected to the inverter *all the time* so the power delivered
to your computer is dependent on the quality of the inverter, not your
generator.

This certainly isn't a practical solution for every piece of electronics
in your house, however. Not sure how much a typical "surge suppressor"
will help when dirty power from a generator is the issue.

nate

--
replace "roosters" with "cox" to reply.
http://members.cox.net/njnagel

"ransley" wrote in message
...
On Jan 22, 3:15 pm, DS wrote:
We live in the country and the power goes out quite often. So I bought
a 5000 watt generator, properly connected, which powers the furnace,
the water pump, the freezer anbd refrigerator and several light
circuits.
I'm told it is not wise to operator sensitivre electronics such as big
TV sets and computers on generator power. In fact I'm pretty sure
thats hiow I blew a DVD/VHS unit last year. And the digital read out
on the refrigerator has lost part of its alphanumerics.
My question...what is and is not safe to run?.
Will a surge protector ahead of the device in question prevent a
problem?.
I actually ran a small TV without a problem but not for very long.
Would appreciate a reply from some electrical guru.
ds

60hz 120v is at 3600 rpm, some cheap units have poor govenors and even
better small units move alot in voltage from low to high load. You
need to monitor and know your unit and how to adjust engine speed and
monitor voltage. It is safe if load and speed is constant.

There in lies the problem. With well pumps, refrigerators, burner motors,
they ain't nothing constant

the honda generator sight reccomends inverter generators for
sensitive electronics , i guess the ups mentioned is same
thing,different way..

----------------------------------------------------------------
http://www.minibite.com/america/malone.htm

DS wrote:
We live in the country and the power goes out quite often. So I bought
a 5000 watt generator, properly connected, which powers the furnace,
the water pump, the freezer anbd refrigerator and several light
circuits.
I'm told it is not wise to operator sensitivre electronics such as big
TV sets and computers on generator power. In fact I'm pretty sure
thats hiow I blew a DVD/VHS unit last year. And the digital read out
on the refrigerator has lost part of its alphanumerics.
My question...what is and is not safe to run?.
Will a surge protector ahead of the device in question prevent a
problem?.
I actually ran a small TV without a problem but not for very long.
Would appreciate a reply from some electrical guru.
ds


Hi,
What brand is yoyr gen set? Good ones cost more fora reason.

On Jan 22, 7:13*pm, "RBM" wrote:
"ransley" wrote in message

...
On Jan 22, 3:15 pm, DS wrote:

We live in the country and the power goes out quite often. So I bought
a 5000 watt generator, properly connected, which powers the furnace,
the water pump, the freezer anbd refrigerator and several light
circuits.
I'm told it is not wise to operator sensitivre electronics such as big
TV sets and computers on generator power. In fact I'm pretty sure
thats hiow I blew a DVD/VHS unit last year. And the digital read out
on the refrigerator has lost part of its alphanumerics.
My question...what is and is not safe to run?.
Will a surge protector ahead of the device in question prevent a
problem?.
I actually ran a small TV without a problem but not for very long.
Would appreciate a reply from some electrical guru.
ds

60hz 120v is at 3600 rpm, some cheap units have poor govenors and even
better small units move alot in voltage from low to high load. You
need to monitor and know your unit and how to adjust engine speed and
monitor voltage. It is safe if load and speed is constant.

There in lies the problem. With well pumps, refrigerators, burner motors,
they ain't nothing constant

Bigger units with what ever voltage stabilisation they advertise may
only swing 4-5v, or dont start the things with big surge and draw when
watching tv. Running a gen is expensive anyway, just to get by.

On Thu, 22 Jan 2009 13:15:17 -0800 (PST), DS wrote:

We live in the country and the power goes out quite often. So I bought
a 5000 watt generator, properly connected, which powers the furnace,
the water pump, the freezer anbd refrigerator and several light
circuits.
I'm told it is not wise to operator sensitivre electronics such as big
TV sets and computers on generator power. In fact I'm pretty sure
thats hiow I blew a DVD/VHS unit last year. And the digital read out
on the refrigerator has lost part of its alphanumerics.
My question...what is and is not safe to run?.
Will a surge protector ahead of the device in question prevent a
problem?.
I actually ran a small TV without a problem but not for very long.
Would appreciate a reply from some electrical guru.
ds

I vote for the UPS.

I have 3 of them running right now and wouldn't hesitate to run them
with my generator.

"David Nebenzahl" wrote in message
s.com...
On 1/22/2009 1:48 PM RBM spake thus:

"DS" wrote in message
...

I'm told it is not wise to operator sensitivre electronics such as big
TV sets and computers on generator power. In fact I'm pretty sure
thats hiow I blew a DVD/VHS unit last year. And the digital read out
on the refrigerator has lost part of its alphanumerics.
My question...what is and is not safe to run?.
Will a surge protector ahead of the device in question prevent a
problem?.
I actually ran a small TV without a problem but not for very long.
Would appreciate a reply from some electrical guru.

The electricity from cheap generators isn't very stable. For sensitive
electronics, I would buffer it through some type of UPS device

Not stable how? Voltage fluctuations? Frequency fluctuations? Noise?
Spikes?

I have said it before and I will say it again. A "generator" is two items,
and engine and the electrical generator. Usually a manufacturer may make one
part and buy the other to assemble the unit, sometimes they buy both. It is
usually easy to identify the make, model and type of engine to check out its
quality and approximate usefulness. Many times it is impossible to identify
the make, model and quality of the electrical alternator used to generate
the electricity. It is the quality of this part that determines the quality
of the electricity made. Many create electricity with bad sine waves, with
voltage spikes, brush noises and other problems that can destroy some
electronics. Quality generators will have both good engines and good
generators, sometimes the generators will be a branded model such as the
Stamford-Newage. Cheap generators do not have any quality parts and do not
usually produce quality electricity.

"EXT" wrote in message
anews.com...

of the electricity made. Many create electricity with bad sine waves, with
voltage spikes, brush noises and other problems that can

Looking at the wiring diagram of my 5 KW generator it looks like the brushes
are not for the 120/240 power but for the megnetic field generation. That
is the AC output of the generator does not go through any brushes. Would
this make the bad brush noise ?

Lots of electronic devices have switching supplies in them and the sine wave
internally generated is not that great either. It is then converted to DC
to run the internal electronics.
I can see the voltage fluctuations causing problems.

Here is what the electricity looks like from some inverters and generators
(not good!)...

http://www.jkovach.net/projects/powerquality/

On 1/23/2009 8:18 AM Bill spake thus:

Here is what the electricity looks like from some inverters and generators
(not good!)...

http://www.jkovach.net/projects/powerquality/

Now we're getting somewhere; some real-world data to look at.

The waveforms for the Honda generator (EU2000i) actually look better
than the power-company's juice. On the other hand, the cheap generators
look like hell.

Inverters seem to rule the roost here.


--
"I know I will go to hell, because I pardoned Richard Nixon."

- Former President Gerald Ford to his golf partners, as related by
the late Hunter S. Thompson

On Jan 22, 6:57*pm, Eric in North TX wrote:
The problem is more a matter unstable & unfiltered than surges I don't
think asurgeprotectorwould help.
A really good UPS might though. We lived on our generator for 2 weeks
following a storm a few years ago, I finally freaked after a week &
booted a computer to make sure the internet hadn't forgotten me.

Good reason why so many use Honda generators; not some discount
generator attached to a Briggs & Stratton engine.

Surge protectors are for single events that occur typically once
every seven years. Repeated 'surges' means protector failure and no
appliance protection.

Computer grade UPSes output electricity so dirty (and constantly)
that manufacturers quietly recommend no surge protectors on a UPS
output. Just another example of why the surge protector question is
an obvious "No solution".

What does a UPS do? It typically connects AC electric directly to
appliances when not in battery backup mode. Instead, many assume a
UPS magically 'cleans' electricity. Well the 'cleanest' electricity
comes directly from AC mains - when UPS is not in battery backup
mode. 'Dirtiest' electricity (and why a surge protector should not be
connected) occurs when UPS battery provides power.

Solution starts and ends with that generator.

Read numbers provided with a laptop. What voltages must a laptop
work at? Any voltage from 90 to 260 volts. What happens when a 120
volt generator outputs 150 volts? If may harm a refrigerator or DVD/
VCR. But it must not harm the laptop. Others feared damage because
they did not first read the numbers. Laptop would be more robust than
the refrigerator.

What does each appliance manufacture list for voltage variation?
Always first get numbers. Just more reasons why some generators (ie
Honda) cost a little more money (as well as operate so much longer on
same fuel when loads are constantly changing).

On Jan 23, 8:27*pm, Bubba wrote:
On Fri, 23 Jan 2009 04:46:52 -0800 (PST), ransley





wrote:
On Jan 22, 7:13*pm, "RBM" wrote:
"ransley" wrote in message

....
On Jan 22, 3:15 pm, DS wrote:

We live in the country and the power goes out quite often. So I bought
a 5000 watt generator, properly connected, which powers the furnace,
the water pump, the freezer anbd refrigerator and several light
circuits.
I'm told it is not wise to operator sensitivre electronics such as big
TV sets and computers on generator power. In fact I'm pretty sure
thats hiow I blew a DVD/VHS unit last year. And the digital read out
on the refrigerator has lost part of its alphanumerics.
My question...what is and is not safe to run?.
Will a surge protector ahead of the device in question prevent a
problem?.
I actually ran a small TV without a problem but not for very long.
Would appreciate a reply from some electrical guru.
ds

60hz 120v is at 3600 rpm, some cheap units have poor govenors and even
better small units move alot in voltage from low to high load. You
need to monitor and know your unit and how to adjust engine speed and
monitor voltage. It is safe if load and speed is constant.

There in lies the problem. With well pumps, refrigerators, burner motors,
they ain't nothing constant

Bigger units with what ever voltage stabilisation they advertise may
only swing 4-5v, or dont start the things with big surge and draw when
watching tv. Running a gen is expensive anyway, just to get by.

There you go again ransley. Tossing out numbers from your ass.
4 or 5v? You get that out of the air after you smoked a joint with
your sister in your trailer? Im going to go get my shovel because the
**** you are slinging is getting deep in here.
Bubba- Hide quoted text -

- Show quoted text -

Hey Bubba. Mr Moron, Mr dont know nada, I have 2 gens I have tested
many Mr Moron, I know gens and how they perform.

"DS" wrote in message
...
We live in the country and the power goes out
quite
often. So I bought a 5000 watt generator,
properly
connected, which powers the furnace, the water
pump, the
freezer anbd refrigerator and several light
circuits.
I'm told it is not wise to operator sensitivre
electronics such as big TV sets and computers
on
generator power. In fact I'm pretty sure thats
hiow I
blew a DVD/VHS unit last year. And the digital
read out
on the refrigerator has lost part of its
alphanumerics. My question...what is and is not
safe to run?.
Will a surge protector ahead of the device in
question
prevent a problem?.
I actually ran a small TV without a problem but
not for
very long. Would appreciate a reply from some
electrical
guru. ds

The electricity from cheap generators isn't
very stable.
For sensitive electronics, I would buffer it
through
some type of UPS device

Unless you've found some real old piece of crap,
generators put out power to the same voltgae/freq
specs the grid uses. Other things about them can
bother electronic equipment, but not those
fluctuations unless the genset if being
overloaded.

On Jan 22, 3:15 pm, DS wrote:
We live in the country and the power goes out
quite
often. So I bought a 5000 watt generator,
properly
connected, which powers the furnace, the water
pump, the
freezer anbd refrigerator and several light
circuits.
I'm told it is not wise to operator sensitivre
electronics such as big TV sets and computers
on
generator power. In fact I'm pretty sure thats
hiow I
blew a DVD/VHS unit last year. And the digital
read out
on the refrigerator has lost part of its
alphanumerics.
My question...what is and is not safe to run?.
Will a surge protector ahead of the device in
question
prevent a problem?.
I actually ran a small TV without a problem but
not for
very long. Would appreciate a reply from some
electrical
guru.
ds

The problem is more a matter unstable &
unfiltered than
surges I don't think a surge protector would
help.
A really good UPS might though. We lived on our
generator
for 2 weeks following a storm a few years ago, I
finally
freaked after a week & booted a computer to make
sure the
internet hadn't forgotten me. I was probably
lucky, it
didn't seem to do any harm, but it was up less
than an
hour.

That's bass ackwards, but in my case I've run my
computer on the genset via my UPS with no problem.
I know it's not advised, however, to run them
directly. I've looked at the output of mine with a
scope and it's actually a very good sinusoidal
output with no spikes/surges on it. House-born
surges however tended to be higher than normal,
probably because of the last of the grid xfmr and
split phase connection. Not sure I'd do it
without a UPS though without knowing a lot more
about the output specs than they normally give.