"[FLORIDA] The board of directors representing The Eagles, a deed restricted
community in Odessa, was trying to keep A.J. Vizzi from parking his Ford
pickup truck in his home's driveway. HOA rules state all trucks must be
parked in a garage."

Judge renders declaratory judgment in favor of truck owner, says HOA is
insane and must pay about $100,000 in legal fees. Take drug test.

http://www.tampabays10.com/news/most...9&provider=top

On Dec 17, 8:42�am, "HeyBub" wrote:
"[FLORIDA] The board of directors representing The Eagles, a deed restricted
community in Odessa, was trying to keep A.J. Vizzi from parking his Ford
pickup truck in his home's driveway. HOA rules state all trucks must be
parked in a garage."

Judge renders declaratory judgment in favor of truck owner, says HOA is
insane and must pay about $100,000 in legal fees. Take drug test.

http://www.tampabays10.com/news/most...yid=96159&prov....

why anyone buys into deed restricted communities leaves me at a
loss........

my home means if I want a purple flamingo in the front yard no one
should be able to do a thing about it

On Dec 17, 10:52*am, " wrote:
On Dec 17, 8:42 am, "HeyBub" wrote:

"[FLORIDA] The board of directors representing The Eagles, a deed restricted
community in Odessa, was trying to keep A.J. Vizzi from parking his Ford
pickup truck in his home's driveway. HOA rules state all trucks must be
parked in a garage."

Judge renders declaratory judgment in favor of truck owner, says HOA is
insane and must pay about $100,000 in legal fees. Take drug test.

http://www.tampabays10.com/news/most...yid=96159&prov....

why anyone buys into deed restricted communities leaves me at a
loss........

my home means if I want a purple flamingo in the front yard no one
should be able to do a thing about it

Gee: At that rate they wouldn't even allow my rig through the gate! Or
the $800 camper I bought and rebuilt, that occasionally goes on the
back of it! One of these months we must wash it.
A few thousand miles away people are dying for lack of clean water and
we have HOA worrying about nonsense like this!
It's all very well to set reasonable 'standards' for safety and health
but ................ !
BTW in many places the ownership of a large pickup is a 'status
symbol'. Soon to change possibly as economic conditions fall,
pollution rises and energy costs escalate however?
Also BTW does this kind of thing not smack of the European snobbery?
If you can afford a carriage, a team of horses and pay driver/ostler
you are in. But if all you can afford is a horse and cart and you look
after the horse yourself you are somehow not so worthy!
Same thing today with driving an SUV or pickup (many of which are
mechanically similar anyway)!
We know someone driving a Cadillac Escalade which is similar,
mechanically, to a Chevy pickup truck.
USA "Land of the free and the brave ..... " eh?????
Methinks there is more to this story??????? Sounds like the HOA
refrred to should hold an election.

The title company will not close the transaction unless the new owner signs
off on the CC&R's. The bank will not lend on the property unless the buyer
signs compliance with the CC& R's and By-Laws of the HOA.

CC&R's are voluntary agreements, intended to keep up property values. Works
very well, too. Nobody is forced to buy into a HO administered tract. Keeps
out a lot of trucks which spell "low income" and "blue collar" and
"rednecks" and cheap housing.

Who wants to live in a neighborhood were people cannot afford to drive
passenger cars? :-)
--

Walter

wrote in message
...
On Dec 17, 8:42?am, "HeyBub" wrote:
"[FLORIDA] The board of directors representing The Eagles, a deed
restricted
community in Odessa, was trying to keep A.J. Vizzi from parking his Ford
pickup truck in his home's driveway. HOA rules state all trucks must be
parked in a garage."

Judge renders declaratory judgment in favor of truck owner, says HOA is
insane and must pay about $100,000 in legal fees. Take drug test.

http://www.tampabays10.com/news/most...yid=96159&prov...

why anyone buys into deed restricted communities leaves me at a
loss........

my home means if I want a purple flamingo in the front yard no one
should be able to do a thing about it

"Walter R." wrote in message
...
The title company will not close the transaction unless the new owner signs
off on the CC&R's. The bank will not lend on the property unless the buyer
signs compliance with the CC& R's and By-Laws of the HOA.

CC&R's are voluntary agreements, intended to keep up property values. Works
very well, too. Nobody is forced to buy into a HO administered tract. Keeps
out a lot of trucks which spell "low income" and "blue collar" and "rednecks"
and cheap housing.

Who wants to live in a neighborhood were people cannot afford to drive
passenger cars? :-)

Who wants to live in a neighborhood where you have to?

"Bob F" wrote in message
...

"Walter R." wrote in message
...
The title company will not close the transaction unless the new owner
signs off on the CC&R's. The bank will not lend on the property unless
the buyer signs compliance with the CC& R's and By-Laws of the HOA.

CC&R's are voluntary agreements, intended to keep up property values.
Works very well, too. Nobody is forced to buy into a HO administered
tract. Keeps out a lot of trucks which spell "low income" and "blue
collar" and "rednecks" and cheap housing.

Who wants to live in a neighborhood were people cannot afford to drive
passenger cars? :-)

Who wants to live in a neighborhood where you have to?


And who wants to live in a home where the next door neighbor has an RV on
the lawn blocking the view of the purple house next to him with the five
foot weeks in the front lawn? To each his own. If you want to live that way,
don't buy in an HOA. But anyone that tells you they were not given the docs
in advance is probably lying to you. Even at a closing you'd be asked if you
were given a copy of the docs in advance, did your read and approve them.

"Sanity" wrote in
:


"Bob F" wrote in message
...

"Walter R." wrote in message
...
The title company will not close the transaction unless the new
owner signs off on the CC&R's. The bank will not lend on the
property unless the buyer signs compliance with the CC& R's and
By-Laws of the HOA.

CC&R's are voluntary agreements, intended to keep up property
values. Works very well, too. Nobody is forced to buy into a HO
administered tract. Keeps out a lot of trucks which spell "low
income" and "blue collar" and "rednecks" and cheap housing.

Who wants to live in a neighborhood were people cannot afford to
drive passenger cars? :-)

Who wants to live in a neighborhood where you have to?


And who wants to live in a home where the next door neighbor has an RV
on the lawn blocking the view of the purple house next to him with the
five foot weeks in the front lawn?

Hey,they are always free to move elsewhere.Views are not "rights".
In most locales,RVs and such are prohibited from the FRONT part of the
property.

To each his own. If you want to
live that way, don't buy in an HOA.


Easy to say,but not so easy in practice.

--
Jim Yanik
jyanik
at
kua.net

On Wed, 17 Dec 2008 17:35:25 -0800, "Bob F"
wrote:


"Walter R." wrote in message
...
The title company will not close the transaction unless the new owner signs
off on the CC&R's. The bank will not lend on the property unless the buyer
signs compliance with the CC& R's and By-Laws of the HOA.

CC&R's are voluntary agreements, intended to keep up property values. Works
very well, too. Nobody is forced to buy into a HO administered tract. Keeps
out a lot of trucks which spell "low income" and "blue collar" and "rednecks"
and cheap housing.

Who wants to live in a neighborhood were people cannot afford to drive
passenger cars? :-)

Who wants to live in a neighborhood where you have to?

It can also mean an area with a lot of entrepeneurs and building
contractors and others who drive $60,000 pickup trucks.

In my neighbourhood there are quite a few skilled tradesmen and
contractors, and a good many business owners who bring there shiny
pickups and vans home every night.

"Walter R." wrote in message
...
The title company will not close the transaction unless the new owner
signs off on the CC&R's. The bank will not lend on the property unless the
buyer signs compliance with the CC& R's and By-Laws of the HOA.

CC&R's are voluntary agreements, intended to keep up property values.
Works very well, too. Nobody is forced to buy into a HO administered
tract. Keeps out a lot of trucks which spell "low income" and "blue
collar" and "rednecks" and cheap housing.

Who wants to live in a neighborhood were people cannot afford to drive
passenger cars? :-)
--

Walter

This varies from state to state, Walter. Some states, like Utah have very
few laws regarding HOAs.

Steve

On Wed, 17 Dec 2008 05:52:28 -0800 (PST), "
wrote:

On Dec 17, 8:42?am, "HeyBub" wrote:
"[FLORIDA] The board of directors representing The Eagles, a deed restricted
community in Odessa, was trying to keep A.J. Vizzi from parking his Ford
pickup truck in his home's driveway. HOA rules state all trucks must be
parked in a garage."

Judge renders declaratory judgment in favor of truck owner, says HOA is
insane and must pay about $100,000 in legal fees. Take drug test.

http://www.tampabays10.com/news/most...yid=96159&prov...

why anyone buys into deed restricted communities leaves me at a
loss........

my home means if I want a purple flamingo in the front yard no one
should be able to do a thing about it

In many areas the only new homes you can buy are in deed
restricted/HOA areas. There is a desire by cities to foist off on the
property owners the "governing" of themselves so they city can escape
as much financial involvement as possible. I don't think it's even
possible in the larger cities in AZ to find a new home that isn't
under an HOA. When we bought our home new about 20 years ago it was
in one of the few subdivisions that did not have an HOA. There are
"deed restrictions", but not too bad, but no real enforcement method.
there are provisions for the property owners to form an HOA if they
wish but if they chose to do so they cannot assess any dues. I've
never understood why anyone would want an HOA. The typical dues are
anywhere from $100 to $200 a month and I've heard of them as high as
$600 a month. At $100 a month it's like adding around $20,000 to your
mortgage. Why not just buy a house in a $20,000 better neighborhood.

On Dec 20, 2:27*am, Ashton Crusher wrote:
On Wed, 17 Dec 2008 05:52:28 -0800 (PST), "





wrote:
On Dec 17, 8:42?am, "HeyBub" wrote:
"[FLORIDA] The board of directors representing The Eagles, a deed restricted
community in Odessa, was trying to keep A.J. Vizzi from parking his Ford
pickup truck in his home's driveway. HOA rules state all trucks must be
parked in a garage."

Judge renders declaratory judgment in favor of truck owner, says HOA is
insane and must pay about $100,000 in legal fees. Take drug test.

http://www.tampabays10.com/news/most...yid=96159&prov....

why anyone buys into deed restricted communities leaves me at a
loss........

my home means if I want a purple flamingo in the front yard no one
should be able to do a thing about it

In many areas the only new homes you can buy are in deed
restricted/HOA areas. *There is a desire by cities to foist off on the
property owners the "governing" of themselves so they city can escape
as much financial involvement as possible. *I don't think it's even
possible in the larger cities in AZ to find a new home that isn't
under an HOA. *When we bought our home new about 20 years ago it was
in one of the few subdivisions that did not have an HOA. *There are
"deed restrictions", but not too bad, *but no real enforcement method.
there are provisions for the property owners to form an HOA if they
wish but if they chose to do so they cannot assess any dues. *I've
never understood why anyone would want an HOA. *The typical dues are
anywhere from $100 to $200 a month and I've heard of them as high as
$600 a month. *At $100 a month it's like adding around $20,000 to your
mortgage. *Why not just buy a house in a $20,000 better neighborhood.- Hide quoted text -

- Show quoted text -

Again a good discussion.

In many areas, having a HOA will cause potential buyers to NOT buy
into an area.

And in this housing market (and for the foreseeable future), that is
the kiss of death to anyone who wants to sell their home.

TMT

On Wed, 17 Dec 2008 16:38:46 -0500, wrote:

On Wed, 17 Dec 2008 05:52:28 -0800 (PST), "
wrote:

why anyone buys into deed restricted communities leaves me at a
loss........

my home means if I want a purple flamingo in the front yard no one
should be able to do a thing about it

There are people who don't want anyone around them to upset their
little world with anything different than what their narrow mind finds
acceptable.
I wouldn't be shocked if this case is appealed. This fires a shot
across the bow of every HOA in Florida.

BTW truck restrictions are not that rare around here. In Cape Coral
you can't have a truck in your driveway by city ordinance.

Cape Coral: A Boy Scout family was fined for setting up tents in a
front yard. Just for a day; after a camping trip, so the tents would
air-out. It started when "snow-birds" didn't go back North...

This was in the late '70's.

On Dec 17, 1:38*pm, wrote:
On Wed, 17 Dec 2008 05:52:28 -0800 (PST), "

wrote:
why anyone buys into deed restricted communities leaves me at a
loss........

my home means if I want a purple flamingo in the front yard no one
should be able to do a thing about it

There are people who don't want anyone around them to upset their
little world with anything different than what their narrow mind finds
acceptable.
I wouldn't be shocked if this case is appealed. This fires a shot
across the bow of every HOA in Florida.

BTW truck restrictions are not that rare around here. In Cape Coral
you can't have a truck in your driveway by city ordinance.

Wonder what kind of stroke the HOA would have were one to buy a junker
car, chop the top back off and remove the trunk lid, viola! a Pickup
but the registration will show it is a car.

Harry K

"Harry K" wrote in message
...
On Dec 17, 1:38 pm, wrote:
On Wed, 17 Dec 2008 05:52:28 -0800 (PST), "

wrote:
why anyone buys into deed restricted communities leaves me at a
loss........

my home means if I want a purple flamingo in the front yard no one
should be able to do a thing about it

There are people who don't want anyone around them to upset their
little world with anything different than what their narrow mind finds
acceptable.
I wouldn't be shocked if this case is appealed. This fires a shot
across the bow of every HOA in Florida.

BTW truck restrictions are not that rare around here. In Cape Coral
you can't have a truck in your driveway by city ordinance.

Wonder what kind of stroke the HOA would have were one to buy a junker
car, chop the top back off and remove the trunk lid, viola! a Pickup
but the registration will show it is a car.

Harry K

Explain something to me. Someone buys a home in an HOA. Prior to buying
they are given the docs and sign a statement to abide by them. Then all of a
sudden they scream, kick and cry when one of the regs from the docs are
enforced. Please explain why that person bought in an HOA in the first
place if he didn't want to follow their rules. Don't get me wrong, I don't
like HOA's but I sure wouldn't buy in one if I disagreed with the docs and
had no intention of following them.

Sanity wrote:
"Harry K" wrote in message
...
On Dec 17, 1:38 pm, wrote:
On Wed, 17 Dec 2008 05:52:28 -0800 (PST), "

wrote:
why anyone buys into deed restricted communities leaves me at a
loss........ my home means if I want a purple flamingo in the
front yard no one should be able to do a thing about it
There are people who don't want anyone around them to upset their
little world with anything different than what their narrow mind
finds acceptable. I wouldn't be shocked if this case is appealed.
This fires a shot across the bow of every HOA in Florida.

BTW truck restrictions are not that rare around here. In Cape Coral
you can't have a truck in your driveway by city ordinance.

Wonder what kind of stroke the HOA would have were one to buy a
junker car, chop the top back off and remove the trunk lid, viola! a
Pickup but the registration will show it is a car.

Harry K

Explain something to me. Someone buys a home in an HOA. Prior to
buying they are given the docs and sign a statement to abide by them.
Then all of a sudden they scream, kick and cry when one of the regs
from the docs are enforced. Please explain why that person bought in
an HOA in the first place if he didn't want to follow their rules.
Don't get me wrong, I don't like HOA's but I sure wouldn't buy in one
if I disagreed with the docs and had no intention of following them.

I believe in the case that hit fark.com recently (I assume that that is
what this thread is about) the home moaner actually did check out the
requirements before buying, but the ones being enforced are not the same
ones given to him to review pre-purchase. I think that he does have a
case if the facts are as represented in the article I read.

Oh, and HOA's suck.

nate


--
replace "roosters" with "cox" to reply.
http://members.cox.net/njnagel

"Nate Nagel" wrote in message
...
Sanity wrote:
"Harry K" wrote in message
...
On Dec 17, 1:38 pm, wrote:
On Wed, 17 Dec 2008 05:52:28 -0800 (PST), "

wrote:
why anyone buys into deed restricted communities leaves me at a
loss........ my home means if I want a purple flamingo in the
front yard no one should be able to do a thing about it
There are people who don't want anyone around them to upset their little
world with anything different than what their narrow mind
finds acceptable. I wouldn't be shocked if this case is appealed.
This fires a shot across the bow of every HOA in Florida.

BTW truck restrictions are not that rare around here. In Cape Coral
you can't have a truck in your driveway by city ordinance.

Wonder what kind of stroke the HOA would have were one to buy a
junker car, chop the top back off and remove the trunk lid, viola! a
Pickup but the registration will show it is a car.

Harry K

Explain something to me. Someone buys a home in an HOA. Prior to
buying they are given the docs and sign a statement to abide by them.
Then all of a sudden they scream, kick and cry when one of the regs
from the docs are enforced. Please explain why that person bought in
an HOA in the first place if he didn't want to follow their rules.
Don't get me wrong, I don't like HOA's but I sure wouldn't buy in one
if I disagreed with the docs and had no intention of following them.

I believe in the case that hit fark.com recently (I assume that that is
what this thread is about) the home moaner actually did check out the
requirements before buying, but the ones being enforced are not the same
ones given to him to review pre-purchase. I think that he does have a
case if the facts are as represented in the article I read.

Oh, and HOA's suck.

nate


--
replace "roosters" with "cox" to reply.
http://members.cox.net/njnagel


He only has a case if the docs and bylaws were not presented to him. And I
guaranty he signed that he received and reviewed them before closing.

Explain something to me. Someone buys a home in an HOA. Prior to buying
they are given the docs and sign a statement to abide by them. Then all of
a sudden they scream, kick and cry when one of the regs from the docs are
enforced. Please explain why that person bought in an HOA in the first
place if he didn't want to follow their rules. Don't get me wrong, I
don't like HOA's but I sure wouldn't buy in one if I disagreed with the
docs and had no intention of following them.


Just out of curiosity - do you have the right to refuse to sign the
agreement if you buy the house? IOW, can you buy a house in one of these HOA
neighborhoods, but refuse to sign or comply?

Zootal wrote:

Explain something to me. Someone buys a home in an HOA. Prior to buying
they are given the docs and sign a statement to abide by them. Then all of
a sudden they scream, kick and cry when one of the regs from the docs are
enforced. Please explain why that person bought in an HOA in the first
place if he didn't want to follow their rules. Don't get me wrong, I
don't like HOA's but I sure wouldn't buy in one if I disagreed with the
docs and had no intention of following them.




Just out of curiosity - do you have the right to refuse to sign the
agreement if you buy the house? IOW, can you buy a house in one of these HOA
neighborhoods, but refuse to sign or comply?




Deed restricted........rules go with the land. There is a way to
dissolve condo. associations in Florida,
so probably also for HOA's. Different statutes. For condo, I believe
it requires assent by all of the
unit owners.

Zootal wrote:
Explain something to me. Someone buys a home in an HOA. Prior to
buying they are given the docs and sign a statement to abide by
them. Then all of a sudden they scream, kick and cry when one of the
regs from the docs are enforced. Please explain why that person
bought in an HOA in the first place if he didn't want to follow
their rules. Don't get me wrong, I don't like HOA's but I sure
wouldn't buy in one if I disagreed with the docs and had no
intention of following them.

Just out of curiosity - do you have the right to refuse to sign the
agreement if you buy the house? IOW, can you buy a house in one of
these HOA neighborhoods, but refuse to sign or comply?

Purchase of a home is a contract. Accepting the HOA's rules is part of the
contract. It's all or nothing.

Generally.

A covenant or rules cannot, for example, be enforced against public policy
such as "... buyer agrees to never sell the property to anyone not of the
Caucasian race..."

What's a little weird is agreeing to not only the HOA rules, but agreeing to
abide by any changes in the rules the HOA makes in the future.

"Zootal" wrote in message
...
Explain something to me. Someone buys a home in an HOA. Prior to buying
they are given the docs and sign a statement to abide by them. Then all
of a sudden they scream, kick and cry when one of the regs from the docs
are enforced. Please explain why that person bought in an HOA in the
first place if he didn't want to follow their rules. Don't get me wrong,
I don't like HOA's but I sure wouldn't buy in one if I disagreed with the
docs and had no intention of following them.


Just out of curiosity - do you have the right to refuse to sign the
agreement if you buy the house? IOW, can you buy a house in one of these
HOA neighborhoods, but refuse to sign or comply?


Nope. The main provision in buying is that you read and agree to follow the
docs and bylaws. Otherwise, why would they have them?

On Dec 17, 5:43*pm, "Zootal" wrote:
Explain something to me. Someone buys a home in an HOA. *Prior to buying
they are given the docs and sign a statement to abide by them. Then all of
a sudden they scream, kick and cry when one of the regs from the docs are
enforced. *Please explain why that person bought in an HOA in the first
place if he didn't want to follow their rules. *Don't get me wrong, I
don't like HOA's but I sure wouldn't buy in one if I disagreed with the
docs and had no intention of following them.

Just out of curiosity - do you have the right to refuse to sign the
agreement if you buy the house? IOW, can you buy a house in one of these HOA
neighborhoods, but refuse to sign or comply?

NOPE!

Zootal wrote:

Just out of curiosity - do you have the right to refuse to sign the
agreement if you buy the house? IOW, can you buy a house in one of these HOA
neighborhoods, but refuse to sign or comply?

An HOA is a corporate equivalent of a government, and it controls
the community. Signing the agreement is mandatory when purchasing
into the community. For those people who wonder if government would
be better if it were run like a business, look at HOAs before
deciding if that alternative is preferable.

Dissolving an HOA usually isn't as simple as voting it out of
existence. The development of the community carried a lot of costs
that were not born by the local governments but were carried up by
the developer, who passed that responsibility onto the HOA. Those
development expenses are usually only partly included in the costs
of the houses. A lot of it is also structured into the HOA fees,
along with the maintenance costs. Even if the HOA were dissolved,
the debts remain, and somebody has to pay them. The local
governments usually don't want to, which is why they encourage HOAs
in the first place.

On 12/17/08 06:02 pm Sanity wrote:

Explain something to me. Someone buys a home in an HOA. Prior to buying
they are given the docs and sign a statement to abide by them. Then all of a
sudden they scream, kick and cry when one of the regs from the docs are
enforced. Please explain why that person bought in an HOA in the first
place if he didn't want to follow their rules. Don't get me wrong, I don't
like HOA's but I sure wouldn't buy in one if I disagreed with the docs and
had no intention of following them.

I've read of cases where prospective purchasers have been denied the
opportunity to read the HOA rules before purchasing the property and
thus being bound by them: "This is proprietary information."

Perce

"Percival P. Cassidy" wrote in message
...
On 12/17/08 06:02 pm Sanity wrote:

Explain something to me. Someone buys a home in an HOA. Prior to buying
they are given the docs and sign a statement to abide by them. Then all
of a
sudden they scream, kick and cry when one of the regs from the docs are
enforced. Please explain why that person bought in an HOA in the first
place if he didn't want to follow their rules. Don't get me wrong, I
don't
like HOA's but I sure wouldn't buy in one if I disagreed with the docs
and
had no intention of following them.

I've read of cases where prospective purchasers have been denied the
opportunity to read the HOA rules before purchasing the property and thus
being bound by them: "This is proprietary information."

Perce


Huh..I would think that you wouldn't need that sharp of a lawyer to get out
of that one. Unless they signed a statement agreeing to follow the rules
sight unseen.

HOAs are evil. I personally would *never* buy a house in a neighborhood with
an HOA. But I guess some people like them, so what-evah....

Percival P. Cassidy wrote:

On 12/17/08 06:02 pm Sanity wrote:

Explain something to me. Someone buys a home in an HOA. Prior to buying
they are given the docs and sign a statement to abide by them. Then
all of a
sudden they scream, kick and cry when one of the regs from the docs are
enforced. Please explain why that person bought in an HOA in the first
place if he didn't want to follow their rules. Don't get me wrong, I
don't
like HOA's but I sure wouldn't buy in one if I disagreed with the
docs and
had no intention of following them.


I've read of cases where prospective purchasers have been denied the
opportunity to read the HOA rules before purchasing the property and
thus being bound by them: "This is proprietary information."

Perce

Prospective purchasers must, by law, be furnished with documents - the
bylaws, rules, etc.. Minutes of board meetings
would not be available to prospective buyer from the association, but
any seller in their
right mind would furnish copies. Unless the assn. is a hell hole and
the seller doesn't want
that disclosure. It would be a very good guage of the issues that
arise, how business
is transacted, etc.

Percival P. Cassidy wrote:
On 12/17/08 06:02 pm Sanity wrote:

Explain something to me. Someone buys a home in an HOA. Prior to buying
they are given the docs and sign a statement to abide by them. Then
all of a
sudden they scream, kick and cry when one of the regs from the docs are
enforced. Please explain why that person bought in an HOA in the first
place if he didn't want to follow their rules. Don't get me wrong, I
don't
like HOA's but I sure wouldn't buy in one if I disagreed with the docs
and
had no intention of following them.

I've read of cases where prospective purchasers have been denied the
opportunity to read the HOA rules before purchasing the property and
thus being bound by them: "This is proprietary information."

Perce


There's only one thing to do in a situation like that: RUN.

nate



--
replace "roosters" with "cox" to reply.
http://members.cox.net/njnagel

"Percival P. Cassidy" wrote in message
...
On 12/17/08 06:02 pm Sanity wrote:

Explain something to me. Someone buys a home in an HOA. Prior to buying
they are given the docs and sign a statement to abide by them. Then all
of a
sudden they scream, kick and cry when one of the regs from the docs are
enforced. Please explain why that person bought in an HOA in the first
place if he didn't want to follow their rules. Don't get me wrong, I
don't
like HOA's but I sure wouldn't buy in one if I disagreed with the docs
and
had no intention of following them.

I've read of cases where prospective purchasers have been denied the
opportunity to read the HOA rules before purchasing the property and thus
being bound by them: "This is proprietary information."

Perce


You'd have to prove that to me and everyone here. It's an illegal act and
any idiot that would sign without reading and agreeing to them is exactly
that, an idiot.

"Percival P. Cassidy" wrote in message
...
On 12/17/08 06:02 pm Sanity wrote:

Explain something to me. Someone buys a home in an HOA. Prior to buying
they are given the docs and sign a statement to abide by them. Then all of a
sudden they scream, kick and cry when one of the regs from the docs are
enforced. Please explain why that person bought in an HOA in the first
place if he didn't want to follow their rules. Don't get me wrong, I don't
like HOA's but I sure wouldn't buy in one if I disagreed with the docs and
had no intention of following them.

I've read of cases where prospective purchasers have been denied the
opportunity to read the HOA rules before purchasing the property and thus
being bound by them: "This is proprietary information."

That would give them a good case to void the rules.

"Sanity" wrote in
:


Explain something to me. Someone buys a home in an HOA. Prior to
buying they are given the docs and sign a statement to abide by them.
Then all of a sudden they scream, kick and cry when one of the regs
from the docs are enforced. Please explain why that person bought in
an HOA in the first place if he didn't want to follow their rules.
Don't get me wrong, I don't like HOA's but I sure wouldn't buy in one
if I disagreed with the docs and had no intention of following them.




many people must not READ the HOA docs.
On the news last night was a report about how a local Orlando-area HOA is
banning sales or rentals to unmarried couples or single people.

--
Jim Yanik
jyanik
at
kua.net

"Jim Yanik" wrote in message
...
"Sanity" wrote in
:


Explain something to me. Someone buys a home in an HOA. Prior to
buying they are given the docs and sign a statement to abide by them.
Then all of a sudden they scream, kick and cry when one of the regs
from the docs are enforced. Please explain why that person bought in
an HOA in the first place if he didn't want to follow their rules.
Don't get me wrong, I don't like HOA's but I sure wouldn't buy in one
if I disagreed with the docs and had no intention of following them.




many people must not READ the HOA docs.
On the news last night was a report about how a local Orlando-area HOA is
banning sales or rentals to unmarried couples or single people.

--
Jim Yanik
jyanik
at
kua.net


If you don't read the docs before purchase and you sign that you read them,
you deserve everything you get. And I'd like to see the article you are
referring to.

On Wed, 17 Dec 2008 18:02:41 -0500, "Sanity" wrote:



Explain something to me. Someone buys a home in an HOA. Prior to buying
they are given the docs and sign a statement to abide by them. Then all of a

That's not always the case. In my case, I came from another state I
had no clue there even was an HOA until the closing, and it was either
the middle or the end of that. I didn't see the docs at that time, and
I don't think anyone in this n'hood has ever signed a statement to
abide by them. I don't think anyone in Maryland signs a statement to
abide by the rules, and some or many of my neighbors have completed
the closing and moved into the house before they see a copy of
anything (Articles of Incorporation, by-laws, and I think one other)

Actually I was pleased to see the papers, and I agree with everything,
or almost everything in the papers I got. These are townhouses and it
protects me from obnoxious neighbors. I suspect the typical rules for
free-standing houses are different, and I suspect if I saw a typical
set of them, I'd like them too.

Although some people might not. But even if one does know and
approve of the rules, the rules are often changed later by stupid or
excessively selfish or dishonest boards, or even a couple members of
the board. Or rules are imposed by a "Architecture committee" that
might only have one person on it if no one else voluteers, of if they
do but the chairman doesn't bother to call them under after he has
made the rules he wants.

There are many ways to screw over one's neighbors using the HOA rules,
some of which are inevitably judgment calls, and it's very hard to
show that personal malice was a motive, as it often is. Or at the very
list, "I like to do things my way, and I'm going to make sure you do
things my way too". The written documents rarely go into much detail,
so there is plenty of room for abuse.

In my case, the current pres of the HOA is a liar, a cheat, and a
thief, but no one wants the job but she. She does it for the
emotional satisfaction of getting her way and pushing people around,
and slightly for the graft she gets. Fortunately for me, her bad
traits have only caused me slight inconvenience, until perhaps these
past 10 months, and then only because an unreasonable neighbor moved
next door to me. But she's caused lots of other small and big
problems for others. Details on request.

But absolutely, I would say that 23 or 24 of my 25 years here were
good, and the HOA rules helped them a great deal to be that way,
rather than hindered them.

In theory there's something positive to be said for keeping some
amount of goverment almost as close to oneself as possible, and not
having the county government make one set of rules for everyone in the
county. Details on request.


As to why one would buy in such a place, surely that was a rhetorical
question. There are a dozen major factors to consider when buying a
house and this is only one of them. The usual way to avoid a problem
while still having the good things one wants is to spend more money,
and not everyone has more money. There is a constant theme in many
newsgroups that people are at fault when they don't just spend more
money to avoid problems.




sudden they scream, kick and cry when one of the regs from the docs are
enforced. Please explain why that person bought in an HOA in the first
place if he didn't want to follow their rules. Don't get me wrong, I don't
like HOA's but I sure wouldn't buy in one if I disagreed with the docs and
had no intention of following them.

On Dec 17, 5:02*pm, "Sanity" wrote:
"Harry K" wrote in message

...
On Dec 17, 1:38 pm, wrote:





On Wed, 17 Dec 2008 05:52:28 -0800 (PST), "

wrote:
why anyone buys into deed restricted communities leaves me at a
loss........

my home means if I want a purple flamingo in the front yard no one
should be able to do a thing about it

There are people who don't want anyone around them to upset their
little world with anything different than what their narrow mind finds
acceptable.
I wouldn't be shocked if this case is appealed. This fires a shot
across the bow of every HOA in Florida.

BTW truck restrictions are not that rare around here. In Cape Coral
you can't have a truck in your driveway by city ordinance.

Wonder what kind of stroke the HOA would have were one to buy a junker
car, chop the top back off and remove the trunk lid, viola! a Pickup
but the registration will show it is a car.

Harry K

Explain something to me. Someone buys a home in an HOA. *Prior to buying
they are given the docs and sign a statement to abide by them. Then all of a
sudden they scream, kick and cry when one of the regs from the docs are
enforced. *Please explain why that person bought in an HOA in the first
place if he didn't want to follow their rules. *Don't get me wrong, I don't
like HOA's but I sure wouldn't buy in one if I disagreed with the docs and
had no intention of following them.- Hide quoted text -

- Show quoted text -

A friend of mine bought in a HOA and totally reviewed and approved of
the rules presented at that time. What he didn't approve of was that
those rules were just the start of what has become a never ending
addition of stupid rules. As an example, shortly after he move there
his inlaws came for a visit. (This is a subdivision where the minimum
lot size is two acres and my friends house sits on 4 acres.) He
inlaws came in a $200K motor home and spent two nights. They pulled
totally in the driveway at the back part of the house. The motor home
could only be seen from one side of the house. Two weeks after that he
received a notice from the HOA that they had voted a new rule that
disallowed the parking of a motorhome overnight anywhere within the
subdivision.

A few months after that, he pulled the fuselage of a plane he is
building in his 4-car garage out onto the driveway to do a trial
mounting of the wings. He just had it out there for Saturday and
Sunday before putting everything back inside his garage. A few days
after that, he received notice that the board had again imposed a new
rule against building an airplane in his garage. That is only a
couple of the rules that have been implemented since he bought his
home.

"Sanity" wrote

Explain something to me. Someone buys a home in an HOA. Prior to buying
they are given the docs and sign a statement to abide by them. Then all of
a sudden they scream, kick and cry when one of the regs from the docs are
enforced. Please explain why that person bought in an HOA in the first
place if he didn't want to follow their rules. Don't get me wrong, I
don't like HOA's but I sure wouldn't buy in one if I disagreed with the
docs and had no intention of following them.

I am nearly an expert in this field. Many people do not get a copy of the
cc&r's until AFTER closing. Many cc&r's are faulty, and I mean faulty in
major ways. I read one where the property was described as being in two
counties and three different townships. Someone had cut and pasted the
document together, and musta been smokin' some good **** that day. The
trouble is that mostly you run into problems after the fact, and then it
costs a lot to fight. AND, usually, it's the BOARD that interprets the
cc&r's and can legislate from the podium, much like the US legal system
today. They're wrong, but until the law is overturned, it's the law. As in
the case of the pickup. And hoisting the flag. And other cases. And cases
to come.

$100,000 in legal fees? This guy won. Do you know how many people lost and
are on the hook for a lot of dough? A lot.

HTH. Info from an insider.

Steve

Some jerks don't read the rules or think that they are special.
Jerry


http://community.webtv.net/awoodbutc...oodWorkingPage


http://community.webtv.net/awoodbutcher/1974Tryke

Harry K wrote in news:cfc62494-e6e5-4f8c-abe5-
:

On Dec 17, 1:38*pm, wrote:
On Wed, 17 Dec 2008 05:52:28 -0800 (PST), "

wrote:
why anyone buys into deed restricted communities leaves me at a
loss........

my home means if I want a purple flamingo in the front yard no one
should be able to do a thing about it

There are people who don't want anyone around them to upset their
little world with anything different than what their narrow mind finds
acceptable.
I wouldn't be shocked if this case is appealed. This fires a shot
across the bow of every HOA in Florida.

BTW truck restrictions are not that rare around here. In Cape Coral
you can't have a truck in your driveway by city ordinance.

Wonder what kind of stroke the HOA would have were one to buy a junker
car, chop the top back off and remove the trunk lid, viola! a Pickup
but the registration will show it is a car.

Harry K

Hmmm, how about vans? The Red Green Possum van would be an eyecatcher.
Here it is making light work of making apple sauce:

http://www.treehugger.com/picture-re...applesauce.jpg

This should be OK. It is a car.

http://allcarsreview.com/wp-content/.../01/151255.jpg

clipped


Hmmm, how about vans? The Red Green Possum van would be an eyecatcher.
Here it is making light work of making apple sauce:

http://www.treehugger.com/picture-re...applesauce.jpg

This should be OK. It is a car.

http://allcarsreview.com/wp-content/.../01/151255.jpg


Our neighborhood has deed restrictions, and then the neighborhood and
City adopted an
"overlay" code that further restricts property use/appearance. No
campers or commercial
vehicles parked outside, certain setbacks, etc. We had a small pop-up
camper in our condo
lot until that was passed. Condo assn. said we couldn't park it. Got
rid of it. The condo
assn. tried to keep another owner from parking a "commercial" truck in
the lot....the guy
worked for the city and took home the city vehicle when he was on call.

The latest issue is three out of eight owners who have liens on their
units for unpaid
monthly assessments. One, who purchased his unit (doesn't live in it)
in September
has been delinquent since September. Mo. assess. close to $300/month.
Just had
the fourth sewer blockage in about 3 years. I contacted the city after
the plumber
did his work to see if city side could be the problem. City said their
end was good
but ran a camera up our pipe and said it was bad........I can finally
thank the city for
doing something. Looks like we have considerable digging in our future )

On Dec 18, 8:24*am, Norminn wrote:
clipped



Hmmm, how about vans? The Red Green Possum van would be an eyecatcher.
Here it is making light work of making apple sauce:

* * * * * *http://www.treehugger.com/picture-re...applesauce.jpg

This should be OK. It is a car.

* * * * * *http://allcarsreview.com/wp-content/.../01/151255.jpg

Our neighborhood has deed restrictions, and then the neighborhood and
City adopted an
"overlay" code that further restricts property use/appearance. *No
campers or commercial
vehicles parked outside, certain setbacks, etc. *We had a small pop-up
camper in our condo
lot until that was passed. *Condo assn. said we couldn't park it. *Got
rid of it. *The condo
assn. tried to keep another owner from parking a "commercial" truck in
the lot....the guy
worked for the city and took home the city vehicle when he was on call.

See, that is why I don't like HOA's. I consider both of those
restrictions unreasonable, and while neither directly affects me,
who's to say that something that I consider reasonable to do with my
property wouldn't offend some of my more sensitive neighbors? I do
own a pickup truck, and it's not particularly shiny or new. I use it
for getting materials for home renovation projects, hauling large
loads of trash/yard debris to the dump, etc. Not having it would
result in the overall appearance of my property declining, as it would
be more difficult for me to clean up around the place so it'd likely
get done less often.

Fortunately I live on a laid back street with no HOA and the only
comments I've heard from neighbors were thanking me for cleaning up
the place. (previous owners were well-intentioned eco-nuts, but I had
to neaten up some of the things that they did to the yard because it
bothered me to let everything go *too* wild. It's an ongoing process,
too...)

nate

wrote in message
news
On Wed, 17 Dec 2008 05:52:28 -0800 (PST), "
wrote:

why anyone buys into deed restricted communities leaves me at a
loss........

my home means if I want a purple flamingo in the front yard no one
should be able to do a thing about it

There are people who don't want anyone around them to upset their
little world with anything different than what their narrow mind finds
acceptable.
I wouldn't be shocked if this case is appealed. This fires a shot
across the bow of every HOA in Florida.

Who's going to pay the lawyer bills this time? That would be real smart.

wrote in message
news
On Wed, 17 Dec 2008 05:52:28 -0800 (PST), "
wrote:

why anyone buys into deed restricted communities leaves me at a
loss........

my home means if I want a purple flamingo in the front yard no one
should be able to do a thing about it

There are people who don't want anyone around them to upset their
little world with anything different than what their narrow mind finds
acceptable.
I wouldn't be shocked if this case is appealed. This fires a shot
across the bow of every HOA in Florida.

BTW truck restrictions are not that rare around here. In Cape Coral
you can't have a truck in your driveway by city ordinance.

I wouldn't be shocked if this case is appealed. This fires a shot
across the bow of every HOA in Florida.

Because of the state of things in Florida, the ripple effect has been felt
as far away as Nevada. Because HOA members wanted accountability, Florida
enacted the first law requiring a full reserve study be done by a state
licensed and approved reserve specialist. This study includes a 30 year
projection of all costs of common areas and appurtenances, depreciation of
same, interest rates earned on money collected and deposited in interest
bearing accounts, and bottom line, what the HOA dues per owner will be to
meet the 30 year plan.

Nevada has such a law.

Now, a new subdivision or condo bunch may not be built without the builder
forming a HOA, and then turning it over to members.

I love watching this stuff. We do the inspections on these properties, the
largest one being 1200 acres. Smallest one 7 houses. It's about $80 an
hour for our work.

We love HOAs, but I wouldn't live in one for anything, even if I got old and
couldn't mow the yard. Right now, I live at the end of a dirt road. I can
**** off the front step whenever I want to and shoot coyotes out of the back
acreage. I live in AG1 agricultural zoning, and can do almost anything.
Still have to get permits for new construction, but that's all.

I do own a cabin where there is a HOA. But the dues are $25 per year, and
there has never been a meeting, and not $1 of dues has been collected. When
we need something done, we get the 7 cabin owners together, and do it. Like
it should be.

Steve