Desperately need some solid advice. We purchased some unfinished maple
cabinet doors and drawers (fronts only) for our kitchen remodel.
Have tried way too many options for staining with no success at all.

1. Water based raises the grain too much; why sand all over again when they
came nice and smooth?
2. Penetrating stains will not penetrate.
3. Am told that I should not condiiton it.
4. Wiping stain will only penetrate if I weave it sit for close to an hour
and then it is gumming whenI remove it.
5. Last resort: Tried a polyshade and it raises grain as well.

Anyone have any suggestions. This maple is so dense that it does not want to
take anything. When I inquired at plant that made the doors they say they
have never had this complaint before.

I am getting very frustated.

"storiesr" u33171@uwe wrote in message news:706b0ccc3cf50@uwe...
Desperately need some solid advice. We purchased some unfinished maple
cabinet doors and drawers (fronts only) for our kitchen remodel.
Have tried way too many options for staining with no success at all.

1. Water based raises the grain too much; why sand all over again when
they
came nice and smooth?

Any stain you put on will raise the grain, wood is not sealed yet. YOu will
need to sand smooth after your first coat of what ever you put on.


2. Penetrating stains will not penetrate.3

Nope to hard and tight of grain

3. Am told that I should not condiiton it.

I would seal it with shellac(sp)

4. Wiping stain will only penetrate if I weave it sit for close to an
hour
and then it is gumming whenI remove it.

Junk don;t use it

5. Last resort: Tried a polyshade and it raises grain as well.

Poly is junk also. i would stay away.

Anyone have any suggestions. This maple is so dense that it does not want
to
take anything. When I inquired at plant that made the doors they say they
have never had this complaint before.

I am getting very frustated.


What are you trying to do. I like the look of natural maple, why would you
want to change it?

eric

Let me clarify: #3: I meant that I was told that PRE-conditioning would not
help.
Thanks for your comments Eric. I was hoping to add just a hint of grey stain
to the cabinet but at this point I have indeed thought of just sealing the
wood in its natural state.
You suggest shellac...oil based?



Eric wrote:
Desperately need some solid advice. We purchased some unfinished maple
cabinet doors and drawers (fronts only) for our kitchen remodel.
[quoted text clipped - 3 lines]
they
came nice and smooth?

Any stain you put on will raise the grain, wood is not sealed yet. YOu will
need to sand smooth after your first coat of what ever you put on.

2. Penetrating stains will not penetrate.3

Nope to hard and tight of grain

3. Am told that I should not condiiton it.

I would seal it with shellac(sp)

4. Wiping stain will only penetrate if I weave it sit for close to an
hour
and then it is gumming whenI remove it.

Junk don;t use it

5. Last resort: Tried a polyshade and it raises grain as well.

Poly is junk also. i would stay away.

Anyone have any suggestions. This maple is so dense that it does not want
to
take anything. When I inquired at plant that made the doors they say they
have never had this complaint before.

I am getting very frustated.

What are you trying to do. I like the look of natural maple, why would you
want to change it?

eric

Shellac is a brittle or flaky secretion of the lac insect Coccus lacca,
found in the forests of Assam and Thailand. Freed from wood it is called
"seedlac".

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Shellac

It's dissolved in alcohol so its neither oil or latex.


You suggest shellac...oil based?

3. Am told that I should not condiiton it.

We used conditioner from Home Depot, sanded lightly with 600 wet n dry paper
then rubbed on stain.
Worked fine

"Eric" wrote in message
news

"storiesr" u33171@uwe wrote in message news:706b0ccc3cf50@uwe...
Desperately need some solid advice. We purchased some unfinished maple
cabinet doors and drawers (fronts only) for our kitchen remodel.
Have tried way too many options for staining with no success at all.

1. Water based raises the grain too much; why sand all over again when
they
came nice and smooth?

Any stain you put on will raise the grain, wood is not sealed yet. YOu
will need to sand smooth after your first coat of what ever you put on.


2. Penetrating stains will not penetrate.3

Nope to hard and tight of grain

3. Am told that I should not condiiton it.

I would seal it with shellac(sp)

4. Wiping stain will only penetrate if I weave it sit for close to an
hour
and then it is gumming whenI remove it.

Junk don;t use it

5. Last resort: Tried a polyshade and it raises grain as well.

Poly is junk also. i would stay away.

Anyone have any suggestions. This maple is so dense that it does not
want to
take anything. When I inquired at plant that made the doors they say
they
have never had this complaint before.

I am getting very frustated.


What are you trying to do. I like the look of natural maple, why would
you want to change it?

Because He isnt planning on using it in your kitchen!!! WTF?

eric

There must be a sealer of some kind on these doors and drawers. take
them back to the plant and have them show you how to finish it

Visit www.refinishwizard.com forum to discussion your options.


On Sun, 08 Apr 2007 23:35:32 GMT, "storiesr" u33171@uwe wrote:

Desperately need some solid advice. We purchased some unfinished maple
cabinet doors and drawers (fronts only) for our kitchen remodel.
Have tried way too many options for staining with no success at all.

1. Water based raises the grain too much; why sand all over again when they
came nice and smooth?
2. Penetrating stains will not penetrate.
3. Am told that I should not condiiton it.
4. Wiping stain will only penetrate if I weave it sit for close to an hour
and then it is gumming whenI remove it.
5. Last resort: Tried a polyshade and it raises grain as well.

Anyone have any suggestions. This maple is so dense that it does not want to
take anything. When I inquired at plant that made the doors they say they
have never had this complaint before.

I am getting very frustated.

"storiesr" u33171@uwe wrote in message news:706b0ccc3cf50@uwe...
| Desperately need some solid advice. We purchased some unfinished
maple
| cabinet doors and drawers (fronts only) for our kitchen remodel.
| Have tried way too many options for staining with no success at all.
|
| 1. Water based raises the grain too much; why sand all over again
when they
| came nice and smooth?
| 2. Penetrating stains will not penetrate.
| 3. Am told that I should not condiiton it.
| 4. Wiping stain will only penetrate if I weave it sit for close to an
hour
| and then it is gumming whenI remove it.
| 5. Last resort: Tried a polyshade and it raises grain as well.
|
| Anyone have any suggestions. This maple is so dense that it does not
want to
| take anything. When I inquired at plant that made the doors they say
they
| have never had this complaint before.
|
| I am getting very frustated.
|



fool proof method for staining maple

sand with 180 grit sand paper
wet the wood with a damp rag (raise wood)
let dry completely

stain with desired color
seal with clear coat sealer

sand with 320 grit sand paper
apply 2nd clear coat

sand with 320 grit sand paper
apply 3rd clear coat

if you don't raise the grain first, before staining,
the maple will look blotchy.
by raising the grain, the maple absorbs the stain like an end grain more
evenly.

"storiesr" u33171@uwe wrote in message news:706c0304003e6@uwe...
| Let me clarify: #3: I meant that I was told that PRE-conditioning
would not
| help.
| Thanks for your comments Eric. I was hoping to add just a hint of
grey stain
| to the cabinet but at this point I have indeed thought of just sealing
the
| wood in its natural state.
| You suggest shellac...oil based?


fool proof method for staining maple

sand with 180 grit sand paper
wet the wood with a damp rag (raise wood)
let dry completely

stain with desired color
seal with clear coat sealer

sand with 320 grit sand paper
apply 2nd clear coat

sand with 320 grit sand paper
apply 3rd clear coat

if you don't raise the grain first, before staining,
the maple will look blotchy.
by raising the grain, the maple absorbs the stain like an end grain more
evenly.








|
|
|
| Eric wrote:
| Desperately need some solid advice. We purchased some unfinished
maple
| cabinet doors and drawers (fronts only) for our kitchen remodel.
| [quoted text clipped - 3 lines]
| they
| came nice and smooth?
|
| Any stain you put on will raise the grain, wood is not sealed yet.
YOu will
| need to sand smooth after your first coat of what ever you put on.
|
| 2. Penetrating stains will not penetrate.3
|
| Nope to hard and tight of grain
|
| 3. Am told that I should not condiiton it.
|
| I would seal it with shellac(sp)
|
| 4. Wiping stain will only penetrate if I weave it sit for close to
an
| hour
| and then it is gumming whenI remove it.
|
| Junk don;t use it
|
| 5. Last resort: Tried a polyshade and it raises grain as well.
|
| Poly is junk also. i would stay away.
|
| Anyone have any suggestions. This maple is so dense that it does
not want
| to
| take anything. When I inquired at plant that made the doors they
say they
| have never had this complaint before.
|
| I am getting very frustated.
|
| What are you trying to do. I like the look of natural maple, why
would you
| want to change it?
|
| eric
|

storiesr wrote:

Desperately need some solid advice. We purchased some unfinished maple
cabinet doors and drawers (fronts only) for our kitchen remodel.
Have tried way too many options for staining with no success at all.

1. Water based raises the grain too much; why sand all over again when they
came nice and smooth?
2. Penetrating stains will not penetrate.
3. Am told that I should not condiiton it.
4. Wiping stain will only penetrate if I weave it sit for close to an hour
and then it is gumming whenI remove it.
5. Last resort: Tried a polyshade and it raises grain as well.

Anyone have any suggestions. This maple is so dense that it does not want to
take anything. When I inquired at plant that made the doors they say they
have never had this complaint before.

I am getting very frustated.

Take a door down to a good woodworking or paint store and ask about dye
stains. A decent shop will let you try before you buy. Maple is about
the most difficult wood to get stain into.

If you don't like "blotchy", take the maple back and get oak ) Maple
usually has a "curly" grain.

http://www.popularwoodworking.com/fe...ea.asp?id=1097

http://www.rockler.com/blog/index.cfm?CommentID=168

"Norminn" wrote in message
link.net...
storiesr wrote:

Desperately need some solid advice. We purchased some unfinished maple
cabinet doors and drawers (fronts only) for our kitchen remodel.
Have tried way too many options for staining with no success at all. 1.
Water based raises the grain too much; why sand all over again when they
came nice and smooth?
2. Penetrating stains will not penetrate.
3. Am told that I should not condiiton it.
4. Wiping stain will only penetrate if I weave it sit for close to an
hour
and then it is gumming whenI remove it.
5. Last resort: Tried a polyshade and it raises grain as well.

Anyone have any suggestions. This maple is so dense that it does not
want to
take anything. When I inquired at plant that made the doors they say
they
have never had this complaint before.

I am getting very frustated.

Take a door down to a good woodworking or paint store and ask about dye
stains. A decent shop will let you try before you buy. Maple is about
the most difficult wood to get stain into.

If you don't like "blotchy", take the maple back and get oak ) Maple
usually has a "curly" grain.

http://www.popularwoodworking.com/fe...ea.asp?id=1097

http://www.rockler.com/blog/index.cfm?CommentID=168

Well, first you have to find exactly what type of maple you got.
Real sap maple will take some degree of stain.
I myself to not use stain anymore.
If it is real maple I suggest you use Tung oil as the first coat on a test
piece.
First start sanding with 120 grit then wash it with water to raise the
grain.
Then after the wood is dry begin sanding with 150 grit and work you way up
to 220 and even 320.
After that apply a coat of Tung oil. This should give it a little honey
tone.
Once it is dry apply a coat of Danish oil as directed. Let dry for 24 hours
and use an ultra fine steel wool to give an uniformed finish then apply and
another coat of Danish oil. If you feel like it you may apply a third coat.
Once the test piece is finish you and your wife can decide if you like it or
not.
Real maple is too nice of a wood to be stained.

On Apr 8, 6:35 pm, "storiesr" u33171@uwe wrote:
Desperately need some solid advice. We purchased some unfinished maple
cabinet doors and drawers (fronts only) for our kitchen remodel.
Have tried way too many options for staining with no success at all.
....

Rather than try to describe it in a short response, I'll point you to
the pros --

Teri Masachi wrote a really nice article in FWW not _too_ long ago--
let's see, oh, there it is--

http://www.taunton.com/finewoodworki...F.aspx?id=2847

Also, I recall in the past Lonnie Bird had an article on his way to
achieve an "old-appearing" finish on maple and anything by either Jeff
Jewitt or Chris Minck is bound to be worth reading...a search for
"maple" and "finishing" will undoubtedly find a wealth of
information. If you're really lucky you're local library will have
FWW back issues...

Upshot is, as others have noted, maple is a little tricky owing to
it's grain. Depending on whether it is "hard" or "soft" maple, makes
a difference as well, but the general techniques of these articles
will go a long way to solve your problems and give you some
alternatives depending on the look you need/want...

HTH...

I've had good luck using tinted shellack as a base coat. After a light
sanding, apply your fovorite top coats. Shellack comes in several natural
tints and can be tinted easily with commercial tints.

On Sun, 08 Apr 2007 23:35:32 GMT, "storiesr" u33171@uwe wrote:


Anyone have any suggestions. This maple is so dense that it does not want to
take anything. When I inquired at plant that made the doors they say they
have never had this complaint before.

"Stain" consists of finely ground insoluble pigments suspended in a
vehicle; it darkens wood by settling in the pores. As you've
discovered, maple has tight, dense, closed grain and is difficult to
stain. Since what you really want to do is darken the wood, you could
try an aniline dye. Dyes are soluble in water or alcohol, and are
drawn into the wood fibers along with the solvent. Some oil finishes
also will darken the wood to some extent. Since only you know exactly
what look you want, it's difficult to tell you precisely how to
proceed. Your best bet will be to get some scraps of the unfinished
maple from the cabinet shop and experiment with a few different
techniques. Getting a good finish is not easy, and even experienced
woodworkers do a lot of experimenting on scrap pieces. Unfortunately,
you're learning the hard way that a high-visibility item like kitchen
cabinetry is not a good place to do your testing. Good luck.

Bill wrote:
On Sun, 08 Apr 2007 23:35:32 GMT, "storiesr" u33171@uwe wrote:



Anyone have any suggestions. This maple is so dense that it does not want to
take anything. When I inquired at plant that made the doors they say they
have never had this complaint before.


"Stain" consists of finely ground insoluble pigments suspended in a
vehicle; it darkens wood by settling in the pores. As you've
discovered, maple has tight, dense, closed grain and is difficult to
stain. Since what you really want to do is darken the wood, you could
try an aniline dye. Dyes are soluble in water or alcohol, and are
drawn into the wood fibers along with the solvent. Some oil finishes
also will darken the wood to some extent. Since only you know exactly
what look you want, it's difficult to tell you precisely how to
proceed. Your best bet will be to get some scraps of the unfinished
maple from the cabinet shop and experiment with a few different
techniques. Getting a good finish is not easy, and even experienced
woodworkers do a lot of experimenting on scrap pieces. Unfortunately,
you're learning the hard way that a high-visibility item like kitchen
cabinetry is not a good place to do your testing. Good luck.

I used a dye stain, I believe, on a maple cabinet years and years ago.
At the time, I didn't know the difference between types of stain, but
this one reeked to high heaven....like lacquer. It left a nice, light
brown finish. I know I tried other stains, and the wood was hard as a
rock so there was no sanding or raised grain. I will do ANYTHING to
avoid sanding, but this refinish did not need sanding.

I've met delightful folks in paint stores who will go to great lengths
to get the color of stain or paint that is needed. You can also find
supplies on line to mix your own, although OP sounds like a newbie.
Another reason for suggesting dye stain is that it is (I believe) less
likely to cloud the grain - you can hit oak with anything and not hide
the grain.

After way too many samplings we did like you said and embraced the beauty of
the maple all on its own. They look gorgeous. And it was much simpler too!!!

Thank you all for your input.
Since I have not yet added the hardware I do have a thought in the back of my
mind....which can be trouble.....
If the hardware makes the cabinets appear too new or sterile I thought I
might see what a little aging glaze would look like. Any thoughts??

Eric wrote:
Desperately need some solid advice. We purchased some unfinished maple
cabinet doors and drawers (fronts only) for our kitchen remodel.
[quoted text clipped - 3 lines]
they
came nice and smooth?

Any stain you put on will raise the grain, wood is not sealed yet. YOu will
need to sand smooth after your first coat of what ever you put on.

2. Penetrating stains will not penetrate.3

Nope to hard and tight of grain

3. Am told that I should not condiiton it.

I would seal it with shellac(sp)

4. Wiping stain will only penetrate if I weave it sit for close to an
hour
and then it is gumming whenI remove it.

Junk don;t use it

5. Last resort: Tried a polyshade and it raises grain as well.

Poly is junk also. i would stay away.

Anyone have any suggestions. This maple is so dense that it does not want
to
take anything. When I inquired at plant that made the doors they say they
have never had this complaint before.

I am getting very frustated.

What are you trying to do. I like the look of natural maple, why would you
want to change it?

eric

--
Message posted via HomeKB.com
http://www.homekb.com/Uwe/Forums.aspx/repair/200704/1

After way too many samplings we did like you said and embraced the beauty of
the maple all on its own. They look gorgeous. And it was much simpler too!!!


Thank you all for your input.
Since I have not yet added the hardware I do have a thought in the back of my
mind....which can be trouble.....
If the hardware makes the cabinets appear too new or sterile I thought I
might see what a little aging glaze would look like. Any thoughts??


storiesr wrote:
Desperately need some solid advice. We purchased some unfinished maple
cabinet doors and drawers (fronts only) for our kitchen remodel.
Have tried way too many options for staining with no success at all.

1. Water based raises the grain too much; why sand all over again when they
came nice and smooth?
2. Penetrating stains will not penetrate.
3. Am told that I should not condiiton it.
4. Wiping stain will only penetrate if I weave it sit for close to an hour
and then it is gumming whenI remove it.
5. Last resort: Tried a polyshade and it raises grain as well.

Anyone have any suggestions. This maple is so dense that it does not want to
take anything. When I inquired at plant that made the doors they say they
have never had this complaint before.

I am getting very frustated.

--
Message posted via http://www.homekb.com

storiesr via HomeKB.com wrote:
After way too many samplings we did like you said and embraced the beauty of
the maple all on its own. They look gorgeous. And it was much simpler too!!!


Thank you all for your input.
Since I have not yet added the hardware I do have a thought in the back of my
mind....which can be trouble.....
If the hardware makes the cabinets appear too new or sterile I thought I
might see what a little aging glaze would look like. Any thoughts??


Glaze doesn't wear - you would need to put additional coats of clear
finish. If they look gorgeous, don't mess with them. We got new doors
and drawers in our kitchen - light maple finish - and used the 35 y/o
hardware from the old doors/drawers. They are plain brushed nickel
finish, simple shape, and look nice. Plain, but that is how I like them.