Is there any type of wood that is sold as per its dimension anymore?

I tried to buy some cedar that was as advertised, nope even something as
simple as a 1x2 cedar strip is actually 5/8x 1 1/2. It sucks because I have
to buy a 1x4 board to fill a 2" gap or actually I have to buy a 2x4 board
and rip it 2 ways with a tablesaw to fit a 1x2 gap. This has to be a ploy
to sell more lumber, can't this be attacked as a "truth in advertising" or
false claims angle?

The dimension of lumber is the dimension before it is planed to make
it smooth.

It's like the quarter pound burger is a quarter pound before cooking.

If you want the true dimension of the lumber you need to buy it rough
sawn.

Surely this is a troll. Have you set the hook yet?
______________________________
Keep the whole world singing . . . .
DanG (remove the sevens)




"Eigenvector" wrote in message
. ..
Is there any type of wood that is sold as per its dimension
anymore?

I tried to buy some cedar that was as advertised, nope even
something as simple as a 1x2 cedar strip is actually 5/8x 1 1/2.
It sucks because I have to buy a 1x4 board to fill a 2" gap or
actually I have to buy a 2x4 board and rip it 2 ways with a
tablesaw to fit a 1x2 gap. This has to be a ploy to sell more
lumber, can't this be attacked as a "truth in advertising" or
false claims angle?

"DanG" wrote in message
...
Surely this is a troll. Have you set the hook yet?
______________________________

You're the one who answered, so look to thine own self.


"Eigenvector" wrote in message
. ..
Is there any type of wood that is sold as per its dimension anymore?

I tried to buy some cedar that was as advertised, nope even something as
simple as a 1x2 cedar strip is actually 5/8x 1 1/2. It sucks because I
have to buy a 1x4 board to fill a 2" gap or actually I have to buy a 2x4
board and rip it 2 ways with a tablesaw to fit a 1x2 gap. This has to be
a ploy to sell more lumber, can't this be attacked as a "truth in
advertising" or false claims angle?

wrote in message
oups.com...

The dimension of lumber is the dimension before it is planed to make
it smooth.

It's like the quarter pound burger is a quarter pound before cooking.

If you want the true dimension of the lumber you need to buy it rough
sawn.

I don't buy the hamburger argument for a second, but I won't argue it
because I'm sure you don't shill for the lumber industry and find it just as
irritating as everyone else.

That really hacks me off sometimes. Yes, it's no big deal when buying 2x4s
or construction lumber, precision isn't really required of it. But
something like cedar or oak or material that is chosen for its looks not
it's structural strength.

Is there at least a consistent dimension that can be assumed from the
measurments? Can you ALWAYS assume "x" inches removed from the advertised
dimension or does that depend of other factors as well? So if I buy a 2x4,
can I ALWAYS presume it's 1 5/8" x 3 1/2" (or whatever it really is) and
likewise 1x2 is 5/8" x 1 1/2"

"Eigenvector" wrote in message

That really hacks me off sometimes. Yes, it's no big deal when buying
2x4s or construction lumber, precision isn't really required of it. But
something like cedar or oak or material that is chosen for its looks not
it's structural strength.

Is there at least a consistent dimension that can be assumed from the
measurments? Can you ALWAYS assume "x" inches removed from the advertised
dimension or does that depend of other factors as well? So if I buy a
2x4, can I ALWAYS presume it's 1 5/8" x 3 1/2" (or whatever it really is)
and likewise 1x2 is 5/8" x 1 1/2"

The dimensions are before planing. I can buy 4/4 hardwood, but, by the time
I get done preparing it, the actual dimension will be 3/4". Boards are
rough cut, dried, then dimensioned. If you want a true 1" thick board, you
must start out with at least an extra 1/4 to 1/2" when cut from the tree.
Just the way lumber dries.

All 1x lumber is finished 3/4". Boards are, IIRC 1/2" less on the width up
to 6", but over that, they are 3/4" less. Been that way for about 100 years
or so.

On Sun, 11 Mar 2007 18:32:21 -0700, "Eigenvector"
wrote:

Is there any type of wood that is sold as per its dimension anymore?

I tried to buy some cedar that was as advertised, nope even something as
simple as a 1x2 cedar strip is actually 5/8x 1 1/2. It sucks because I have
to buy a 1x4 board to fill a 2" gap or actually I have to buy a 2x4 board
and rip it 2 ways with a tablesaw to fit a 1x2 gap.

I'm not sure why this part bothers you so much. You gave one example
where you have to buy a bigger board and rip it. But if the lumber
was exactly 2x4, and the gap you needed to fill was 2 1/2 or 3 inches,
you would still have to buy something bigger than that and rip it.
Only a few gaps are actually the size of lumber, as long as lumber
only comes in a limited number of sizes.

This has to be a ploy
to sell more lumber, can't this be attacked as a "truth in advertising" or
false claims angle?

AIUI, 2x4's etc. were sold as 2 by 4 and the buyer had to smooth them.
Now they do this for us, much more efficiently than all but a few
customers could do it. It's usually considered worth it to pay less
for such extras than it would cost to do it oneself, like getting
one's milk pasteurized, one's corn already shucked and cooked, or
one's bread presliced.

Edwin Pawlowski wrote:

All 1x lumber is finished 3/4". Boards are, IIRC 1/2" less on the
width up to 6", but over that, they are 3/4" less. Been that way for
about 100 years or so.

Longer. The Bible says "Honest weights and measures you shall have."

The Rabbis in the Talmud said, when contemplating what's "honest" said: "It
depends."

If it is the custom in a particular community that one bushel of grain is
measured to be a "heaping" bushel, then an "even" bushel would not be an
honest measure.

The custom in the wood-measuring business is measurement before trimming.

On Mar 11, 8:32 pm, "Eigenvector" wrote:
Is there any type of wood that is sold as per its dimension anymore?

I tried to buy some cedar that was as advertised, nope even something as
simple as a 1x2 cedar strip is actually 5/8x 1 1/2. It sucks because I have
to buy a 1x4 board to fill a 2" gap or actually I have to buy a 2x4 board
and rip it 2 ways with a tablesaw to fit a 1x2 gap. This has to be a ploy
to sell more lumber, can't this be attacked as a "truth in advertising" or
false claims angle?

Naw, they have to measure it that way. It is not possible to measure
it any other way. I have a small saw-mill and have found that wood
shrinks a lot after it is cut. The dimensions quoted are alway called
nominal since it is assumed that a woodworker knows that no exact
dimension can be given.

Here's an example: I cut 2/4 stock on my mill. That is the nominal
size. It just gives us a name to call it even though we know the
dimension will be changing from the moment the board is cut and starts
to dry. I cut my "two inch" stock to 2 1/8" knowing that after it
shrinks I will have a board that may only be 1 15/16".

Only when the stock is totally dry can the dimensions become stable
enough to be able to plane and joint it and an relatively accurate
measurment be given. This is a moisture level less that 10%, hopefully
7 or 8% Then it is the final user who finds out that his "two-by"
stock is 1 3/4". It is still called a two-by.

Even after the wood has been dried and is in it's final use it still
gain and loses a bit of size due to fluctuations in temp and
humidity. So, 2x4 is just a name to call it. It tells you enough to
know what size board to expect. No exact measurement can ever be
given.

See chapter 5 of ts.nist.gov/Standards/Conformity/upload/ps20-05.pdf for
(minimum) standard lumber sizes.

Eigenvector wrote:
Is there any type of wood that is sold as per its dimension anymore?

I tried to buy some cedar that was as advertised, nope even something as
simple as a 1x2 cedar strip is actually 5/8x 1 1/2. It sucks because I
have to buy a 1x4 board to fill a 2" gap or actually I have to buy a 2x4
board and rip it 2 ways with a tablesaw to fit a 1x2 gap. This has to
be a ploy to sell more lumber, can't this be attacked as a "truth in
advertising" or false claims angle?

On Sun, 11 Mar 2007 20:28:25 -0700, "Eigenvector"
wrote:


wrote in message
roups.com...

The dimension of lumber is the dimension before it is planed to make
it smooth.

It's like the quarter pound burger is a quarter pound before cooking.

If you want the true dimension of the lumber you need to buy it rough
sawn.

I don't buy the hamburger argument for a second, but I won't argue it
because I'm sure you don't shill for the lumber industry and find it just as
irritating as everyone else.

That really hacks me off sometimes. Yes, it's no big deal when buying 2x4s
or construction lumber, precision isn't really required of it. But
something like cedar or oak or material that is chosen for its looks not
it's structural strength.

Is there at least a consistent dimension that can be assumed from the
measurments? Can you ALWAYS assume "x" inches removed from the advertised
dimension or does that depend of other factors as well? So if I buy a 2x4,
can I ALWAYS presume it's 1 5/8" x 3 1/2" (or whatever it really is) and
likewise 1x2 is 5/8" x 1 1/2"

With the caveat that wood changes sizes with water content:
It varies by what the nominal size is, but it should be consistant
for any given name. (Thus, all 2x4s should be the same size.)
You can find a table of nominal/true sizes in Glover's Handbook,
or online.

"Eigenvector" wrote in message
. ..
Is there any type of wood that is sold as per its dimension anymore?

Plywood?

Charles Schuler wrote:
"Eigenvector" wrote in message
. ..

Is there any type of wood that is sold as per its dimension anymore?

Plywood?

Nope. Most of it is metric and is slightly undersized from its nominal
thickness.

Chris

On Sun, 11 Mar 2007 18:32:21 -0700, "Eigenvector"
wrote:

Is there any type of wood that is sold as per its dimension anymore?

I tried to buy some cedar that was as advertised, nope even something as
simple as a 1x2 cedar strip is actually 5/8x 1 1/2. It sucks because I have
to buy a 1x4 board to fill a 2" gap or actually I have to buy a 2x4 board
and rip it 2 ways with a tablesaw to fit a 1x2 gap. This has to be a ploy
to sell more lumber, can't this be attacked as a "truth in advertising" or
false claims angle?

Its even worst than what you think.

My house is sided in 3/4" x7 1/2" redwood boards. A normal person
would call it a 1 x 8.

The house has stood here for 50 years with nary a problem but last
year a squirrel decides to gnaw through the siding. So I walk into
the local lumber yard and say I'd like to buy a couple 1 x 8 clear
redwood boards. The clerk says he has to special order them, I say OK
and leave.

A few days later the boards arrive, I go to pick them up and low and
behold, within the last 50 years the definition of a 1 x8 has changed
to be 5/8" x 7 1/2"! So the replacement board sits 1/8" shallower
than all the rest of the siding.. I had to buy a sheet of 1/8"
masonite and use it as a backing to my new 1 x 8 board to make
everything match.

Here's a question: What do all you Canadians out there do when all
the old houses are built to Imperial measures, but all the repair
parts you can buy are Metric. It must be a nightmare to do any
remodeling.

dickm

On Mar 12, 5:23 pm, dicko wrote:
On Sun, 11 Mar 2007 18:32:21 -0700, "Eigenvector"

wrote:
Is there any type of wood that is sold as per its dimension anymore?

....
Its even worst than what you think.

My house is sided in 3/4" x7 1/2" redwood boards. A normal person
would call it a 1 x 8.

The house has stood here for 50 years with nary a problem but last
year a squirrel decides to gnaw through the siding. So I walk into
the local lumber yard and say I'd like to buy a couple 1 x 8 clear
redwood boards. The clerk says he has to special order them, I say OK
and leave.

A few days later the boards arrive, I go to pick them up and low and
behold, within the last 50 years the definition of a 1 x8 has changed
to be 5/8" x 7 1/2"! So the replacement board sits 1/8" shallower
than all the rest of the siding.. I had to buy a sheet of 1/8"
masonite and use it as a backing to my new 1 x 8 board to make
everything match.
....

That's owing to the material being redwood -- what with the demand for
redwood combined with the difficulties from environmental, etc. on
logging redwood and the subsequent high prices, in the last 20-30
years there is tremendous pressure on stretching particularly clear
material to the limit. "Full" dimension 1x redwood is still available
but would require ordering architectural material rather than
dimension lumber to ensure it -- and the price would probably go up
50% or more not simply the ratio of thicknesses...

On Mar 11, 9:28 pm, "Eigenvector" wrote:
wrote in message

oups.com...



The dimension of lumber is the dimension before it is planed to make
it smooth.

It's like the quarter pound burger is a quarter pound before cooking.

If you want the true dimension of the lumber you need to buy it rough
sawn.

I don't buy the hamburger argument for a second, ...

It's not really the same thing as the hamburger, but related -- in the
hamburger, the loss is in the cooking -- loss of moisture and fats
after you buy the raw meat. In dimensional lumber, the loss is from
rough-sawn, dried material then surfaced and sold, not in the
shrinkage of the material itself. But, basic idea is similar in that
there's a "nominal" dimension and the actual working dimensions.

That really hacks me off sometimes. Yes, it's no big deal when buying 2x4s
or construction lumber, precision isn't really required of it. But
something like cedar or oak or material that is chosen for its looks not
it's structural strength.

Is there at least a consistent dimension that can be assumed from the
measurments? Can you ALWAYS assume "x" inches removed from the advertised
dimension or does that depend of other factors as well? So if I buy a 2x4,
can I ALWAYS presume it's 1 5/8" x 3 1/2" (or whatever it really is) and
likewise 1x2 is 5/8" x 1 1/2"

For common structual sizes, yes, and it is actually pretty doggone
accurate which is _a_good_thing (tm ) for construction as it allows
for the ability to frame walls reasonably square and straight without
customizing every wall stud, for example, for width to be able to
subsequently hang sheetrock w/o inordinate shimming and trimming and
still get a reasonably straight finished wall.

I don't recall just when it was, but certainly after I first began a
fair amount of work helping when a 2x was 1-5/8" x 3-5/8" rather than
the -1/2" fractions. I can recall work where some material was of
each dimension or trying to work newer in with older -- now _there's_
a pita, for sure! Actually, while used to bitch about the
"cheaper new stuff" initially, in the end the half-inch was more
convenient by far than the 5/8 owing to being able to match up 3/4"
sheet material w/ it much more readily. Of course, now the shift to
metric or "minus-1/32nd" ply makes it a pita again for really close
work.

Someone else has already mentioned about the shift from full-dimension
rough-sawn dimension framing that was common before the 40s, roughly.

Eigenvector wrote:
Is there any type of wood that is sold as per its dimension anymore?

I tried to buy some cedar that was as advertised, nope even something as
simple as a 1x2 cedar strip is actually 5/8x 1 1/2. It sucks because I have
to buy a 1x4 board to fill a 2" gap or actually I have to buy a 2x4 board
and rip it 2 ways with a tablesaw to fit a 1x2 gap. This has to be a ploy
to sell more lumber, can't this be attacked as a "truth in advertising" or
false claims angle?

Your gaps are the wrong size, not the wood you're trying not to buy.

R

"RicodJour" wrote in message
ps.com...
Eigenvector wrote:
Is there any type of wood that is sold as per its dimension anymore?

I tried to buy some cedar that was as advertised, nope even something as
simple as a 1x2 cedar strip is actually 5/8x 1 1/2. It sucks because I
have
to buy a 1x4 board to fill a 2" gap or actually I have to buy a 2x4 board
and rip it 2 ways with a tablesaw to fit a 1x2 gap. This has to be a
ploy
to sell more lumber, can't this be attacked as a "truth in advertising"
or
false claims angle?

Your gaps are the wrong size, not the wood you're trying not to buy.

R

Actually as irritating as that response is, it's not in fact incorrect.
Adjusting the size of the cut to accomodate the wood is a perfectly valid
approach. That assumes you can control the size of the cut.

"Lawrence" wrote in message
oups.com...
On Mar 11, 8:32 pm, "Eigenvector" wrote:
Is there any type of wood that is sold as per its dimension anymore?

I tried to buy some cedar that was as advertised, nope even something as
simple as a 1x2 cedar strip is actually 5/8x 1 1/2. It sucks because I
have
to buy a 1x4 board to fill a 2" gap or actually I have to buy a 2x4 board
and rip it 2 ways with a tablesaw to fit a 1x2 gap. This has to be a
ploy
to sell more lumber, can't this be attacked as a "truth in advertising"
or
false claims angle?

Naw, they have to measure it that way. It is not possible to measure
it any other way. I have a small saw-mill and have found that wood
shrinks a lot after it is cut. The dimensions quoted are alway called
nominal since it is assumed that a woodworker knows that no exact
dimension can be given.

Here's an example: I cut 2/4 stock on my mill. That is the nominal
size. It just gives us a name to call it even though we know the
dimension will be changing from the moment the board is cut and starts
to dry. I cut my "two inch" stock to 2 1/8" knowing that after it
shrinks I will have a board that may only be 1 15/16".

Only when the stock is totally dry can the dimensions become stable
enough to be able to plane and joint it and an relatively accurate
measurment be given. This is a moisture level less that 10%, hopefully
7 or 8% Then it is the final user who finds out that his "two-by"
stock is 1 3/4". It is still called a two-by.

Even after the wood has been dried and is in it's final use it still
gain and loses a bit of size due to fluctuations in temp and
humidity. So, 2x4 is just a name to call it. It tells you enough to
know what size board to expect. No exact measurement can ever be
given.


Wow, that was quite possibly the best explanation I've heard on this
subject. And I was sincerely hoping I could **** and moan about it for a
few days. Actually my heartburn has ended seeing how the job is done and
the results worked out after ripping a 1x3 to the needed dimensions.

On Mar 11, 6:47 pm, "DanG" wrote:
Surely this is a troll. Have you set the hook yet?
______________________________
Keep the whole world singing . . . .
DanG (remove the sevens)


"Eigenvector" wrote in message

. ..



Is there any type of wood that is sold as per its dimension
anymore?



Same thought here. Although I did experience the same disbelief from
my neighbor when he was trimming out his new addition. He had no
table saw and needed some stock ripped for window trim. Handed me a
batch of 1x4 and asked for it to be ripped 2". I did. He was shocked
to find a stack of 2" plus a stack of 1x1/2 (minus kerf). I had to
explain the facts of life to him.

Of course he was also the guy who grew up on a farm and didn't believe
me when I told him he had wasted his money planting all those seedling
trees in his pasture without fenceing them off. He never heard of
cattle being browswers. I don't think any of them got as far as
putting out the first leaf.

Harry K

On Mar 11, 10:30 pm, mm wrote:
On Sun, 11 Mar 2007 18:32:21 -0700, "Eigenvector"

wrote:
Is there any type of wood that is sold as per its dimension anymore?

I tried to buy some cedar that was as advertised, nope even something as
simple as a 1x2 cedar strip is actually 5/8x 1 1/2. It sucks because I have
to buy a 1x4 board to fill a 2" gap or actually I have to buy a 2x4 board
and rip it 2 ways with a tablesaw to fit a 1x2 gap.

I'm not sure why this part bothers you so much. You gave one example
where you have to buy a bigger board and rip it. But if the lumber
was exactly 2x4, and the gap you needed to fill was 2 1/2 or 3 inches,
you would still have to buy something bigger than that and rip it.
Only a few gaps are actually the size of lumber, as long as lumber
only comes in a limited number of sizes.

This has to be a ploy
to sell more lumber, can't this be attacked as a "truth in advertising" or
false claims angle?

AIUI, 2x4's etc. were sold as 2 by 4 and the buyer had to smooth them.
Now they do this for us, much more efficiently than all but a few
customers could do it. It's usually considered worth it to pay less
for such extras than it would cost to do it oneself, like getting
one's milk pasteurized, one's corn already shucked and cooked, or
one's bread presliced.

Anyone who has every tryied to build with rough cut or remodel a house
that was built with it is _very_ familiar with the problems. I have
done both. To build new with it you start with a stack of rough cut
and sort through to find the ones that match dimensions. Even knowing
the problems I tried to use lumber I salvaged off a schoolhouse to
build my 18x30 addition. Did manage to use it for floor joists but
only by shimming or trimming the ends of every one to match height.
Did build one 18' wall with the studs but only after lots of sorting.
I gave it up at that point, bit the bullet and bought new lumber.

Harry K

Eigenvector wrote:
"RicodJour" wrote in message

Eigenvector wrote:
Is there any type of wood that is sold as per its dimension anymore?

I tried to buy some cedar that was as advertised, nope even something as
simple as a 1x2 cedar strip is actually 5/8x 1 1/2. It sucks because I
have
to buy a 1x4 board to fill a 2" gap or actually I have to buy a 2x4 board
and rip it 2 ways with a tablesaw to fit a 1x2 gap. This has to be a
ploy
to sell more lumber, can't this be attacked as a "truth in advertising"
or
false claims angle?

Your gaps are the wrong size, not the wood you're trying not to buy.


Actually as irritating as that response is, it's not in fact incorrect.
Adjusting the size of the cut to accomodate the wood is a perfectly valid
approach. That assumes you can control the size of the cut.

Irritation often accompanies growth.

R

On Mar 13, 9:08 am, "Harry K" wrote:
....
Anyone who has every tryied to build with rough cut or remodel a house
that was built with it is _very_ familiar with the problems. ...
....
...I tried to use lumber I salvaged off a schoolhouse to
build my 18x30 addition. ...
Did build one 18' wall with the studs but only after lots of sorting.
I gave it up at that point, bit the bullet and bought new lumber.

Just a note...

Wasn't as much a problem until the advent of drywall -- with lath and
plaster, wall surfaces were much more readily finished to accomodate
some irregularity than with drywall where the finish surface plane is
the board itself. Of course, as anyone who has remodeled old houses
knows, rarely, if ever, are walls straight or corners square...

I regularly salvage old material, but generally would go to the
trouble of cleaning it up and dimensioning it before beginning a major
project with it. Of course, it helps to have a large industrial-
strength jointer and planer, of course...

In VA years ago, they salvaged material from an early schoolhouse and
stacked it for sale. Went for the purpose of getting one of the old
slate blackboards for the kids. Wandering around looking through
piles of joists and other framing lumber and noticed it was all quite
dark in color. Hmmm, me says...let's look at this. Scrape a little
corner off a 3x12 18-footer and yep! -- just what I thought:
virtually the whole thing was framed w/ walnut.

Placed a bid of $3000 for the entire stack of lumber and came away
with something under 8000 bd-ft of #1C and better walnut.

dpb wrote:

In VA years ago, they salvaged material from an early schoolhouse and
stacked it for sale. Went for the purpose of getting one of the old
slate blackboards for the kids. Wandering around looking through
piles of joists and other framing lumber and noticed it was all quite
dark in color. Hmmm, me says...let's look at this. Scrape a little
corner off a 3x12 18-footer and yep! -- just what I thought:
virtually the whole thing was framed w/ walnut.

Placed a bid of $3000 for the entire stack of lumber and came away
with something under 8000 bd-ft of #1C and better walnut.

What did you end up doing with the wood, Duane?

R

dpb wrote:

And whatever happened to that settling foundation?

R

On Mar 13, 10:28 am, "RicodJour" wrote:
dpb wrote:

....snip story of old schoolhouse salvage...

Placed a bid of $3000 for the entire stack of lumber and came away
with something under 8000 bd-ft of #1C and better walnut.

What did you end up doing with the wood, Duane?

Long story short version

Split it w/ buddy had met (since $3k was over third of annual salary
at the time, it was an expenditure not made lightly) and had been
moonlighting doing custom woodworking with. Built quite a lot of
furniture and other architectural work with the bulk of it (was also
w/ a bunch of other guys rehabbing old ante- and shortly-after-post-
bellum houses which needed original mouldings and other w/w repaired/
restored/replaced). Sold a sizable chunk of the thicker as blanks for
shotgun gunstocks to one of the high-end gunmakers for mostly
competitive skeet and trap. Unfortunately, had to sell the remainder
some years later when moved to TN from VA and had nowhere to store it
although by then there were only a couple hundred feet left. Still
rue that decision -- should have paid the storage fees until got the
space.

On Mar 13, 10:29 am, "RicodJour" wrote:
dpb wrote:

And whatever happened to that settling foundation?

Gosh, been away too long -- don't recall details enough to remember
the particular one in question???

dpb wrote:
On Mar 13, 10:29 am, "RicodJour" wrote:
dpb wrote:

And whatever happened to that settling foundation?

Gosh, been away too long -- don't recall details enough to remember
the particular one in question???

Church building. You were selected, after the fact, as resident
expert to deal with settling due to clay. I recall there was some
gutter runoff that was adding to the problem. Ring a bell?

R

On Mar 13, 12:11 pm, "RicodJour" wrote:
dpb wrote:
On Mar 13, 10:29 am, "RicodJour" wrote:
dpb wrote:

And whatever happened to that settling foundation?

Gosh, been away too long -- don't recall details enough to remember
the particular one in question???

Church building. You were selected, after the fact, as resident
expert to deal with settling due to clay. I recall there was some
gutter runoff that was adding to the problem. Ring a bell?

R


Oh, yeah, that one! Had a couple related threads and at least one
that followed offline more recently and wasn't sure what you might
have been referring to, specifically.

Anyway, on that one, fixed the drainage issues and waited and
watched. Seems to have ceased moving. Appears in talking w/ a local
structural engineer and in examining all we could get at that what
actually happened was the old foundation from an existing building on
the building site was removed but the resulting trench only backfilled
by the demolition crew and superficially packed by driving their
'dozer over the trench a few times. Looks like the new building
straddles that location on one side and there was some subsidence
along one of the old foundation locations but the new building is
wider than the old and so the other side is on newly excavated area.
Looks like the center section which also wasn't formerly trenched held
the floor slab like the center of a teeter-totter and the slab cracked
along the center and sank a little w/ the outer wall on the south side
as well. But, it's now been nearly two years and the last time I
checked all the out-of-square doors and windows were the same amount
of out-of-square and the expansion joint separation in the brick
veneer is still virtually the same so at this point I'm planning on
simply fixing the cosmetic damage over the summer and then just
continue to watch and wait until forced into something else. But,
given the amount of moisture we had this fall after another dry summer
and no additional discernible movement, I think it has reached an
equilibrium.

On Mar 14, 2:56 am, "dpb" wrote:
On Mar 13, 12:11 pm, "RicodJour" wrote:

dpb wrote:
On Mar 13, 10:29 am, "RicodJour" wrote:
dpb wrote:

And whatever happened to that settling foundation?

Gosh, been away too long -- don't recall details enough to remember
the particular one in question???

Church building. You were selected, after the fact, as resident
expert to deal with settling due to clay. I recall there was some
gutter runoff that was adding to the problem. Ring a bell?

R

Oh, yeah, that one! Had a couple related threads and at least one
that followed offline more recently and wasn't sure what you might
have been referring to, specifically.

Anyway, on that one, fixed the drainage issues and waited and
watched. Seems to have ceased moving. Appears in talking w/ a local
structural engineer and in examining all we could get at that what
actually happened was the old foundation from an existing building on
the building site was removed but the resulting trench only backfilled
by the demolition crew and superficially packed by driving their
'dozer over the trench a few times. Looks like the new building
straddles that location on one side and there was some subsidence
along one of the old foundation locations but the new building is
wider than the old and so the other side is on newly excavated area.
Looks like the center section which also wasn't formerly trenched held
the floor slab like the center of a teeter-totter and the slab cracked
along the center and sank a little w/ the outer wall on the south side
as well. But, it's now been nearly two years and the last time I
checked all the out-of-square doors and windows were the same amount
of out-of-square and the expansion joint separation in the brick
veneer is still virtually the same so at this point I'm planning on
simply fixing the cosmetic damage over the summer and then just
continue to watch and wait until forced into something else. But,
given the amount of moisture we had this fall after another dry summer
and no additional discernible movement, I think it has reached an
equilibrium.

Self-resolving structural failure...I like it! Glad to hear it didn't
turn into some nightmare for you.

R