Last year our roof was replaced with GAF Timberline architectural
shingles. One of the reasons we had the roof replaced was old aluminum
pans had been installed years ago to prevent ice damming, and the pans
were just nailed on from the top, so water leaked in through the
nailholes. Thank goodness we wouldn't have to worry about that anymore.

This year we had our house painted by whom we thought was a reputable
painting firm. As part of the painting, several small pieces of wood
needed to be replaced at the house corners, due to rot concerns. The
painting company said that they do this type of minor carpentry work,
which also included getting under the drip edges to access the wood,
remove, and replace.

After the conclusion of the painting job, I happened to notice that they
had actually put nails *through* my new shingles in several places. In
some areas the nails were under the preceding shingle (but still nowhere
near the GAF nail line) but in others the nail was just put right
through the shingle from the top, and there are even a few small holes
that are quite larger than a nail diameter.

Yikes! Needless to say I am not happy and unfortunately the final
payment has been made. Nevertheless, I intend to ask the painter to pay
for the repairs. Coincidentally, we've noticed that a roof gas vent
leaks a tiny amount in very hard rain, so I will need to get the roofing
company (a GAF "Master Elite" company) to ensure that this solved. I
intend to ask them to fix the painter's screw-ups too, and then I'll
just forward that bill to the painter. If they balk, my lawyer is ready
to help me and complaints will be made to the BBB and my state as well.
I was mildly annoyed at the painter for being sloppy in some other
aspects, but that was resolved and pales in comparison to holes in my
brand new beautiful roof. :-(

Is this a good approach? Where there are holes in the shingle near the
bottom of the roof near the edge, what is the proper way to repair it
without making it worse? Help!

Thanks for any advice.

On Sun, 23 Jul 2006 14:34:22 -0400, Joe Hiller
wrote:

Last year our roof was replaced with GAF Timberline architectural
shingles. One of the reasons we had the roof replaced was old aluminum
pans had been installed years ago to prevent ice damming, and the pans
were just nailed on from the top, so water leaked in through the
nailholes. Thank goodness we wouldn't have to worry about that anymore.

This year we had our house painted by whom we thought was a reputable
painting firm. As part of the painting, several small pieces of wood
needed to be replaced at the house corners, due to rot concerns. The
painting company said that they do this type of minor carpentry work,
which also included getting under the drip edges to access the wood,
remove, and replace.

After the conclusion of the painting job, I happened to notice that they
had actually put nails *through* my new shingles in several places. In
some areas the nails were under the preceding shingle (but still nowhere
near the GAF nail line) but in others the nail was just put right
through the shingle from the top, and there are even a few small holes
that are quite larger than a nail diameter.

Yikes! Needless to say I am not happy and unfortunately the final
payment has been made. Nevertheless, I intend to ask the painter to pay
for the repairs. Coincidentally, we've noticed that a roof gas vent
leaks a tiny amount in very hard rain, so I will need to get the roofing
company (a GAF "Master Elite" company) to ensure that this solved. I
intend to ask them to fix the painter's screw-ups too, and then I'll
just forward that bill to the painter. If they balk, my lawyer is ready
to help me and complaints will be made to the BBB and my state as well.
I was mildly annoyed at the painter for being sloppy in some other
aspects, but that was resolved and pales in comparison to holes in my
brand new beautiful roof. :-(

Is this a good approach? Where there are holes in the shingle near the
bottom of the roof near the edge, what is the proper way to repair it
without making it worse? Help!

Thanks for any advice.



I won't cross-post this, so read it here.

Ask for a meeting with the roofer and painter in a neutral location,
say lunch.

Maybe you can have a meeting of the minds.

Oren

You need to give him a chance to respond to the repair, it was his
mistake. Why should he pay a roofers higher Non bid repair wage. If
someone sent me a bill like that I would not pay, Your next mistake is
thinking of paying an atty when this would be a small claims issue,
finally the BBB is a joke. Call him to see if he will fix it, it might
of been a careless employee of his and he does all he can and makes you
happy, after all that is what you payed for, a good job.

"Joe Hiller" wrote in message

I
intend to ask them to fix the painter's screw-ups too, and then I'll
just forward that bill to the painter. If they balk, my lawyer is ready
to help me and complaints will be made to the BBB and my state as well.

I'm sure you realize that YOU must pay the roofer and collect from the
painter. The roofer has no dog in the race and must be paid for his work,
no matter who or what the cause.

m Ransley wrote:

You need to give him a chance to respond to the repair, it was his
mistake. Why should he pay a roofers higher Non bid repair wage. If
someone sent me a bill like that I would not pay, Your next mistake is
thinking of paying an atty when this would be a small claims issue,

Because of my relationship with my attorney, the fee for this would be
extremely minimal.


finally the BBB is a joke

Agreed.

. Call him to see if he will fix it, it might
of been a careless employee of his and he does all he can and makes you
happy, after all that is what you payed for, a good job.

Oh I do plan to let him know, however it is obvious that his crew of two
does not know anything about shingles, roof repairs, proper techniques for
roofing, etc. Since my roof is brand new I am not interested in a hack
repair, I believe the damaged shingles should be properly replaced by
somebody who knows what they are doing. Am I wrong?

Edwin Pawlowski wrote:

"Joe Hiller" wrote in message

I
intend to ask them to fix the painter's screw-ups too, and then I'll
just forward that bill to the painter. If they balk, my lawyer is ready
to help me and complaints will be made to the BBB and my state as well.

I'm sure you realize that YOU must pay the roofer and collect from the
painter. The roofer has no dog in the race and must be paid for his work,
no matter who or what the cause.

Roger that, I would of of course first pay the roofer for the proper repairs.
I do however believe that the painter should reimburse me for the damage
caused by putting holes in the top of the shingles! I honestly don't know
what they were thinking. It is like hiring somebody to fix your car door and
finding out they put holes through the top of the car.

Joe Hiller wrote:

Last year our roof was replaced with GAF Timberline architectural
shingles. One of the reasons we had the roof replaced was old aluminum
pans had been installed years ago to prevent ice damming, and the pans
were just nailed on from the top, so water leaked in through the
nailholes. Thank goodness we wouldn't have to worry about that anymore.

This year we had our house painted by whom we thought was a reputable
painting firm. As part of the painting, several small pieces of wood
needed to be replaced at the house corners, due to rot concerns. The
painting company said that they do this type of minor carpentry work,
which also included getting under the drip edges to access the wood,
remove, and replace.

After the conclusion of the painting job, I happened to notice that they
had actually put nails *through* my new shingles in several places. In
some areas the nails were under the preceding shingle (but still nowhere

I'm very puzzled - why would the painter put nails through the shingles.
Do you mean that some nails are under the tabs of the shingle above
but not in the nail line? Are you CERTAIN the nails were not placed by
the roofer? I would be, before I contact the painter about damage. A
painter is a poor choice to do carpentry - fascia and drip cap would be
more appropriate for the roofer or (carpenter). I would not talk lawyer
without contacting the contractor nicely, by letter, to make
corrections. How many nails are we talking about? I have a hunch the
roofer will dab cement on them to plug potential leaks, or mess up a
good deal of your roof taking off the shingles and replacing them.

Norminn wrote:

Joe Hiller wrote:

Last year our roof was replaced with GAF Timberline architectural
shingles. One of the reasons we had the roof replaced was old aluminum
pans had been installed years ago to prevent ice damming, and the pans
were just nailed on from the top, so water leaked in through the
nailholes. Thank goodness we wouldn't have to worry about that anymore.

This year we had our house painted by whom we thought was a reputable
painting firm. As part of the painting, several small pieces of wood
needed to be replaced at the house corners, due to rot concerns. The
painting company said that they do this type of minor carpentry work,
which also included getting under the drip edges to access the wood,
remove, and replace.

After the conclusion of the painting job, I happened to notice that they
had actually put nails *through* my new shingles in several places. In
some areas the nails were under the preceding shingle (but still nowhere

I'm very puzzled - why would the painter put nails through the shingles.
Do you mean that some nails are under the tabs of the shingle above
but not in the nail line? Are you CERTAIN the nails were not placed by
the roofer?

Yes, I am. I can look out my window at a section of the roof and I am certain
there was no nail there before . That's what led me to inspect the other
locations.

I would be, before I contact the painter about damage. A
painter is a poor choice to do carpentry - fascia and drip cap would be
more appropriate for the roofer or (carpenter). I would not talk lawyer
without contacting the contractor nicely, by letter, to make
corrections. How many nails are we talking about?

Painter's carpenter lifted up drip edge along the rake edges of the roof in
four corners of the house to replace some fascia boards (actually these boards
were the last foot or several feet of the wood on the rake edge of the house,
so they are perpindicular to the fascia boards behind the gutter.

Total nails looks to be about a dozen. There are also a few holes that looks
like were placed there by very rough handling of the shingles and/or putting a
nail in a spot, letting it to all the way through to the gutter or whereever
and removing it.


I have a hunch the
roofer will dab cement on them to plug potential leaks, or mess up a
good deal of your roof taking off the shingles and replacing them.

That's what I'm worried about, both scenarios. At any rate, I plan to ask the
roofer about the area first before I do anything else, if I can get the
roofing company here. I've been trying to get them to come out for months but
they have been busy, plus the weather hasn't been too great for roofing this
year (rain, rain, rain) in New England.

Joe Hiller wrote:

Norminn wrote:

Joe Hiller wrote:

Last year our roof was replaced with GAF Timberline architectural
shingles. One of the reasons we had the roof replaced was old aluminum
pans had been installed years ago to prevent ice damming, and the pans
were just nailed on from the top, so water leaked in through the
nailholes. Thank goodness we wouldn't have to worry about that anymore.

This year we had our house painted by whom we thought was a reputable
painting firm. As part of the painting, several small pieces of wood
needed to be replaced at the house corners, due to rot concerns. The
painting company said that they do this type of minor carpentry work,
which also included getting under the drip edges to access the wood,
remove, and replace.

After the conclusion of the painting job, I happened to notice that they
had actually put nails *through* my new shingles in several places. In
some areas the nails were under the preceding shingle (but still nowhere

I'm very puzzled - why would the painter put nails through the shingles.
Do you mean that some nails are under the tabs of the shingle above
but not in the nail line? Are you CERTAIN the nails were not placed by
the roofer?

Yes, I am. I can look out my window at a section of the roof and I am certain
there was no nail there before . That's what led me to inspect the other
locations.

I should add that the nails-through-the-shingles are only located where the
painting crew did its work, the rest of the roof appears to be fine.

No atty charges a minimal fee, they don`t know how to, it may be
minimal to them but never you.

m Ransley wrote:
No atty charges a minimal fee, they don`t know how to, it may be
minimal to them but never you.



It could be if the attorney's his brother...

Jeff

--
Jeffry Wisnia
(W1BSV + Brass Rat '57 EE)
"What do you expect from a pig but a grunt?"

This is a good example of why before starting many projects it can be a
good idea to take a bunch of pictures to establish what the condition
was before the work started. In this case, it's pretty clear.
However, in other cases some pics would be a great help.

I just had a similar experience with a Honda VFR750 motorcycle. It was
in excellent condition, only 8K miles on it. But unfortunately, the
carbs got fouled up from very limited riding over the last few years.
I did put fresh gas and fuel stabilizer in it last Oct, but in May, it
would only run on full choke.

So, I take it to a local Honda dealer. While there, they keep me
waiting for 3 weeks, claiming they need an air filter that is on back
order and a "trim piece." Finally, I had enough and started really
questioning them, especially about the mysterious "trim" piece. Turns
out the trim piece was the whole right rear fairing, which they broke!
Then they lied to me, claiming that wasn't the piece they were waiting
for on backorder for 2 weeks, that they just broke it 3 days ago.
But, they had told me they were waiting for it over 2 weeks ago.
Finally, the owner came up with the truth on that too. Turns out they
ordered the left one by mistake first, then ordered the correct one 3
days ago, etc.

Well, upon inspection of the bike, now I see that the rear fairing
piece over the license plate has one large crack down the middle and
small cracks in the corner. It also moves around when you touch it,
like maybe the little interlocking finger tabs on the back are broken
off. I know it wasn't like that when I brought it there. However,
they say they don;t believe their guy, who they fired, did it. They
say he broke it near the front section while trying to fasten it on.
I don't believe it, as I had taken this off and put it back on just
prior to taking it in. It goes on very easily, no need to use force.
Also, my buddy is buying the bike and he was there when we took it
off/on. He had looked the bike over as buyer and did not see any
damage to that rear piece of fairing. I think what most likely
happened was they took off the whole rear section, consisting of the
right, rear and left pieces that come off the bike as one. Then they
had it sitting somewhere where something fell on it or a bike was run
into it etc,


Finally, I did get them to agree to replace that piece at their cost
too. So, they are out $350 for the right fairing, plus ?? for the rear
piece. But this got me to thinking. It would always be a good idea to
take some quick pics of a bike or car being taken in for service. That
way you would have proof of the condition and it would be a lot easier
to prove who did what.

BTW, I still don't have the bike back. They even called me last Sat,
telling me it was ready. When I got there, they said, "Oh, we tried to
call you again. It failed QA test, it's not runnning right."
Unbelievable! Given that the moneky that broke the fairing is the guy
that took apart and cleaned the carbs, God only knows what else I'm in
for!

wrote:
BTW, I still don't have the bike back. They even called me last Sat,
telling me it was ready. When I got there, they said, "Oh, we tried
to call you again. It failed QA test, it's not runnning right."

Time for a letter to American Honda corporate management.