I recently moved into a new house in Michigan, that does not currently
have a Generator hook up.

I just ran 4 guage wire to my garage with a 60amp breaker on both sides
to run an Air Compessor/Welder/etc.

I'm wondering, could I take something like a 9000 watt generator, wire
a plug for it into a 60 amp breaker in the panel in my garage. Then if
our power went out, I go into the house, flip off the main breaker, and
all the breakers except the subpanel, furnace, refridgerator, pump, and
a few others.

Then I plug in and fire up the generator in my garage, or right outside
it, and feed power into the house from that to run those select items?

This seems like it would be a great idea, just want to make sure that
would be ok??

Thanks, James

sparty wrote:
I recently moved into a new house in Michigan, that does not currently
have a Generator hook up.

I just ran 4 guage wire to my garage with a 60amp breaker on both
sides to run an Air Compessor/Welder/etc.

I'm wondering, could I take something like a 9000 watt generator, wire
a plug for it into a 60 amp breaker in the panel in my garage. Then
if our power went out, I go into the house, flip off the main
breaker, and all the breakers except the subpanel, furnace,
refridgerator, pump, and a few others.

Then I plug in and fire up the generator in my garage, or right
outside it, and feed power into the house from that to run those
select items?

I hope you really mean outside only. Never put one inside unless you
have a unit designed for it and know how to safely install it inside.


This seems like it would be a great idea, just want to make sure that
would be ok??

Thanks, James


Let's start with the fact that it would be illegal and unsafe. You need
a special connection box that assures that you are totally disconnected from
the grid before you supply any power to your own home. Ignoring this can
kill a utility worked who might be trying to restore power to your home and
working on a line he knows is disconnected from the grid and therefore dead,
that you have just powered up. You also would be powering up every other
home in the neighborhood.

--
Joseph Meehan

Dia duit

I would be turning off the main breaker coming into my house first in
this scenario, wouldn't I be disconnected from the grid then??

When I said inside, I was talking my 3rd car garage not the house. I
could install the plug just outside my 3rd car garage and put a lock on
it.

Joseph Meehan wrote:
sparty wrote:
I recently moved into a new house in Michigan, that does not currently
have a Generator hook up.

I just ran 4 guage wire to my garage with a 60amp breaker on both
sides to run an Air Compessor/Welder/etc.

I'm wondering, could I take something like a 9000 watt generator, wire
a plug for it into a 60 amp breaker in the panel in my garage. Then
if our power went out, I go into the house, flip off the main
breaker, and all the breakers except the subpanel, furnace,
refridgerator, pump, and a few others.

Then I plug in and fire up the generator in my garage, or right
outside it, and feed power into the house from that to run those
select items?

I hope you really mean outside only. Never put one inside unless you
have a unit designed for it and know how to safely install it inside.


This seems like it would be a great idea, just want to make sure that
would be ok??

Thanks, James


Let's start with the fact that it would be illegal and unsafe. You need
a special connection box that assures that you are totally disconnected from
the grid before you supply any power to your own home. Ignoring this can
kill a utility worked who might be trying to restore power to your home and
working on a line he knows is disconnected from the grid and therefore dead,
that you have just powered up. You also would be powering up every other
home in the neighborhood.

--
Joseph Meehan

Dia duit

According to sparty :
I would be turning off the main breaker coming into my house first in
this scenario, wouldn't I be disconnected from the grid then??

Yes, but that's not enough for the electrical code. The code requires
it to be impossible for both the generator and mains be connected
at the same time. Double-male cordsets are called suicide cords
for good reason, and are code violations too.

A goof during a blackout can cause major damage or worse.

If you're going to have a generator big enough to be worth doing this
with, you should invest in a transfer switch and do it properly.
--
Chris Lewis, Una confibula non set est
It's not just anyone who gets a Starship Cruiser class named after them.

This is against the code rules, it is unsafe, and if something bad were
to happen, you are liable.

I know,I know, your going to turn off the main before connecting and
starting the generator, that is exactly what everyone who has caused
damage to utility systems and or injury to utility workers has said,
which is precisely why it is now totally against the rules to do it.
Generator transfer switches are not that expensive, I think a manual
switch to handle your generator can be had for around 300 bucks or
so.Honestly, the liability is just too great, you try to save a few
hundred bucks and someone gets killed or injured....is it REALLY worth
it?
Think of it like this, YOU know you would NEVER forget to switch off
the main breaker, your wife and kids would NEVER touch the thing, BUT,
one day during an outage a utility worker gets zapped......suddenly you
remember the old saying......NEVER say NEVER.

George

sparty wrote:
I recently moved into a new house in Michigan, that does not currently
have a Generator hook up.

I just ran 4 guage wire to my garage with a 60amp breaker on both sides
to run an Air Compessor/Welder/etc.

I'm wondering, could I take something like a 9000 watt generator, wire
a plug for it into a 60 amp breaker in the panel in my garage. Then if
our power went out, I go into the house, flip off the main breaker, and
all the breakers except the subpanel, furnace, refridgerator, pump, and
a few others.

Then I plug in and fire up the generator in my garage, or right outside
it, and feed power into the house from that to run those select items?

This seems like it would be a great idea, just want to make sure that
would be ok??

Thanks, James

sparty wrote:
I would be turning off the main breaker coming into my house first in
this scenario, wouldn't I be disconnected from the grid then??

When I said inside, I was talking my 3rd car garage not the house. I
could install the plug just outside my 3rd car garage and put a lock on
it.

Joseph Meehan wrote:
sparty wrote:
I recently moved into a new house in Michigan, that does not currently
have a Generator hook up.

I just ran 4 guage wire to my garage with a 60amp breaker on both
sides to run an Air Compessor/Welder/etc.

I'm wondering, could I take something like a 9000 watt generator, wire
a plug for it into a 60 amp breaker in the panel in my garage. Then
if our power went out, I go into the house, flip off the main
breaker, and all the breakers except the subpanel, furnace,
refridgerator, pump, and a few others.

Then I plug in and fire up the generator in my garage, or right
outside it, and feed power into the house from that to run those
select items?
I hope you really mean outside only. Never put one inside unless you
have a unit designed for it and know how to safely install it inside.

This seems like it would be a great idea, just want to make sure that
would be ok??

Thanks, James

Let's start with the fact that it would be illegal and unsafe. You need
a special connection box that assures that you are totally disconnected from
the grid before you supply any power to your own home. Ignoring this can
kill a utility worked who might be trying to restore power to your home and
working on a line he knows is disconnected from the grid and therefore dead,
that you have just powered up. You also would be powering up every other
home in the neighborhood.

--
Joseph Meehan

Dia duit


In order to do this in a code compliant way you will need a separate run
of wire to the house main lighting and appliance panel that will connect
the generator inlet to the transfer mechanism. You cannot make one run
of wire provide current in two different directions accept as a part of
an expensive power management system that uses electrically interlocked
contactors backed up by shunt trip breakers. It is far less expensive
in a residence to run separate wires.
--
Tom Horne

"This alternating current stuff is just a fad. It is much too dangerous
for general use." Thomas Alva Edison

Ok, thank you all for your response, I will not do it this way then. I
agree, there is a chance over the years, that somehow accidently, a
person may forget to turn of the main switch.

I have seen something similar to what you guys are talking about in my
brother-in-laws house. So what exactly do I need to buy, and is this
something I could install myself? I am pretty proficient in wiring,
just curious if it's possible to do it yourself, and what EXACTLY I
need to buy.

Thanks again, James

George wrote:
This is against the code rules, it is unsafe, and if something bad were
to happen, you are liable.

I know,I know, your going to turn off the main before connecting and
starting the generator, that is exactly what everyone who has caused
damage to utility systems and or injury to utility workers has said,
which is precisely why it is now totally against the rules to do it.
Generator transfer switches are not that expensive, I think a manual
switch to handle your generator can be had for around 300 bucks or
so.Honestly, the liability is just too great, you try to save a few
hundred bucks and someone gets killed or injured....is it REALLY worth
it?
Think of it like this, YOU know you would NEVER forget to switch off
the main breaker, your wife and kids would NEVER touch the thing, BUT,
one day during an outage a utility worker gets zapped......suddenly you
remember the old saying......NEVER say NEVER.

George

sparty wrote:
I recently moved into a new house in Michigan, that does not currently
have a Generator hook up.

I just ran 4 guage wire to my garage with a 60amp breaker on both sides
to run an Air Compessor/Welder/etc.

I'm wondering, could I take something like a 9000 watt generator, wire
a plug for it into a 60 amp breaker in the panel in my garage. Then if
our power went out, I go into the house, flip off the main breaker, and
all the breakers except the subpanel, furnace, refridgerator, pump, and
a few others.

Then I plug in and fire up the generator in my garage, or right outside
it, and feed power into the house from that to run those select items?

This seems like it would be a great idea, just want to make sure that
would be ok??

Thanks, James

sparty wrote:

I recently moved into a new house in Michigan, that does not currently
have a Generator hook up.

I just ran 4 guage wire to my garage with a 60amp breaker on both sides
to run an Air Compessor/Welder/etc.

I'm wondering, could I take something like a 9000 watt generator, wire
a plug for it into a 60 amp breaker in the panel in my garage. Then if
our power went out, I go into the house, flip off the main breaker, and
all the breakers except the subpanel, furnace, refridgerator, pump, and
a few others.

Then I plug in and fire up the generator in my garage, or right outside
it, and feed power into the house from that to run those select items?

This seems like it would be a great idea, just want to make sure that
would be ok??

You can get purpose-made generator sets at Home Depot and other places that
come with the necessary hardware to comply with code and crank up and do
the transfer automatically.

Use a proper transfer switch--you do _not_ want to be on the receiving end
of the lawsuit when your non-code-compliant jury rig electrocutes the guy
from the power company.

--
--John
to email, dial "usenet" and validate
(was jclarke at eye bee em dot net)

sparty wrote:
I would be turning off the main breaker coming into my house first in
this scenario, wouldn't I be disconnected from the grid then??

When I said inside, I was talking my 3rd car garage not the house. I
could install the plug just outside my 3rd car garage and put a lock
on it.


It will still not be legal, nor in my view safe. Even if YOU would
remember to do it right, what if it happened when you were not at home and
someone else wanted to turn it on?

It is both a legal issue and a safety issue. Don't try and second guess
the electrical code. Every time I see someone who things they know better
than the code, it is foolish. If you are going to do it, do it right.


--
Joseph Meehan

Dia duit

sparty wrote:
Ok, thank you all for your response, I will not do it this way then.
I agree, there is a chance over the years, that somehow accidently, a
person may forget to turn of the main switch.

I have seen something similar to what you guys are talking about in my
brother-in-laws house. So what exactly do I need to buy, and is this
something I could install myself? I am pretty proficient in wiring,
just curious if it's possible to do it yourself, and what EXACTLY I
need to buy.


It is a power transfer switch. Any electrical supply will know what it
is when you tell them what it is for. Note, there may be some local codes
that apply in addition to the ones we know of.


--
Joseph Meehan

Dia duit

In article ,
"J. Clarke" wrote:

Use a proper transfer switch--you do _not_ want to be on the receiving end
of the lawsuit when your non-code-compliant jury rig electrocutes the guy
from the power company.

As one that climbs poles (occasionally) for a living (33-years), I am VERY
pleased to see so many folks unanimously reply to the occasional DIY, would-be
generator user insisting that a proper transfer switch is used.

Utility restoration following a bad storm is dangerous enough without having
to worry (too much) about an ignorant generator user causing even more risk.

Virtually all "dead" power lines are bonded to ground prior to their being
worked on, and other safety measures are employed (insulated gauntlets, hot
sticks, etc) but there is always the risk of encountering an energized line.

A great bunch here, for sure. Thanks!
--

JR

Joseph Meehan wrote:
sparty wrote:
I recently moved into a new house in Michigan, that does
not currently have a Generator hook up.

I just ran 4 guage wire to my garage with a 60amp breaker
on both sides to run an Air Compessor/Welder/etc.

I'm wondering, could I take something like a 9000 watt
generator, wire a plug for it into a 60 amp breaker in
the panel in my garage. Then if our power went out, I go
into the house, flip off the main breaker, and all the
breakers except the subpanel, furnace, refridgerator,
pump, and a few others. Then I plug in and fire up the
generator in my garage, or
right outside it, and feed power into the house from that
to run those select items?

I hope you really mean outside only. Never put one
inside unless you have a unit designed for it and know how
to safely install it inside.

This seems like it would be a great idea, just want to
make sure that would be ok??

Thanks, James


Let's start with the fact that it would be illegal and
unsafe.

Well, against code at the best; disastrous at worst.

You need a special connection box that assures

It's called a Transfer Switch. Google for it.

that you are totally disconnected from the grid before you
supply any power to your own home. Ignoring this can kill
a utility worked who might be trying to restore power to
your home and working on a line he knows is disconnected
from the grid and therefore dead, that you have just
powered up. You also would be powering up every other home
in the neighborhood.

More realitically, you could do some pretty good damage to your
genset if you miwsire it and don't notice it. Or forget the
sequence and apply line power directly to your genset. Smoke,
fire, all kind os things become possible. Never depend on a
dependable brain: It's gotta be foolproof to work, or as nearly
so as possible.

sparty wrote:
I would be turning off the main breaker coming into my
house first in this scenario, wouldn't I be disconnected
from the grid then??

Yes, but it depends on YOU being perfect an ddoing everything
right, besides anyone else that might try it when you aren't
around. Get a Transfer Switch and do it right.

Jim Redelfs wrote:


Jim, if you are one of those who work on those lines ..... THANKS.


--
Joseph Meehan

Dia duit

On 13 Jul 2006 07:18:09 -0700, "sparty" wrote:

I would be turning off the main breaker coming into my house first in
this scenario, wouldn't I be disconnected from the grid then??


You may well be absolutely certain that neither you nor anyone
in your house will never make a mistake and screw that up,
but the last guy to kill a lineman with his generator was
just as certain as you are.

sparty wrote:
Ok, thank you all for your response, I will not do it this way then.
I agree, there is a chance over the years, that somehow accidently, a
person may forget to turn of the main switch.

I have seen something similar to what you guys are talking about in my
brother-in-laws house. So what exactly do I need to buy, and is this
something I could install myself? I am pretty proficient in wiring,
just curious if it's possible to do it yourself, and what EXACTLY I
need to buy.

Thanks again, James

One method:

Go to your panel maker's web site. They may have a small kit for your panel
that's approved (I know HomeLite does). It's essentially a sliding bit of
metal that prevents the breaker connecting your generator and the main panel
switch from both being on at the same time.

With a piece of aluminum, careful measurements, a Dremel, and a couple of
screws, you can fabricate your own.

Anyway, the HomeLite thingy costs about $45 retail.

It also depends upon what you want to run off the generator. Typical
generators don't put out clean electricity (117 volt sine wave AC) and
not every electrical device can handle them without problems.

Your fridge would probably work (unless it has some electronics in it)
but I wouldn't run a PC or fancy TV off a generator without first
checking with the generator company or TV/PC manufacturer to ask their
opinion.

Shaun Eli
www.BrainChampagne.com
Brain Champagne: Clever Comedy for Smart Minds (sm)

On 13 Jul 2006 07:18:09 -0700, "sparty" wrote:

I would be turning off the main breaker coming into my house first in
this scenario, wouldn't I be disconnected from the grid then??


I thought I might do that someday. That is, until I read about it
here. About how one little mistake could have such severe
consequences.

[snip]
--
Mark Lloyd
http://notstupid.laughingsquid.com

"Democracy is two wolves and a lamb voting on what
to have for lunch. Liberty is a well armed lamb
contesting the vote." - Benjamin Franklin

Excellent comments posted regarding transfer switches, etc. But let's
back up to the overall strategy:

1. All year long, you need refrigeration for food. During freezing
weather, it can be placed in the garage in a cooler.
2. In the winter, you need heat. If your heat is electric, you may not
have sufficient power for it. If it's gas-fired, it won't take much
power to run the fan and thermostat.
3. In summer, you may want A/C, but you may not have sufficient power
to run more than some fans.
4. The pump may be needed, depending on the season and weather.

A 9000 watt generator fueled by gasoline is fairly thirsty. Something
like 3500-5500 watts with at least 6-10 hours runtime is probably a
better choice. If you are iced in, you are not likely to be able to
obtain more fuel except to siphon from vehicles. You may need 5-6
gallons of fuel every 8 hours (for example) for the outage duration.
That's 18 gallons per day. Flammable fuel storage will be an issue.

Consider supplementing your electrically powered items with things
like coolers, camp stoves, fish cookers, gas grills, camping lanterns
and battery-powered fans. Creating total dependency on a single
generator and its fuel supply does not allow a backup plan.

Determine what the longest power outage has been in the past 5-10
years and plan accordingly. You will also need to perform periodic
maintenance and fuel replacement for whatever solution is implemented.
It cannot just sit on the floor or shelf until the instant of need.

On 13 Jul 2006 06:36:07 -0700, "sparty" wrote:

I recently moved into a new house in Michigan, that does not currently
have a Generator hook up.

On 13 Jul 2006 08:56:14 -0700, "sparty" wrote:


I have seen something similar to what you guys are talking about in my
brother-in-laws house. So what exactly do I need to buy, and is this
something I could install myself? I am pretty proficient in wiring,
just curious if it's possible to do it yourself, and what EXACTLY I
need to buy.
http://www.popularmechanics.com/home...t/1275631.html

Besides the code and practical conditions of electrically connecting it
theres the BIGGIE!

Where are you going to store your fuel supply so its safe secure and
sufficent to run the generator?

check the manufacturers specs its probably over 5 gallons per hour at
low load....

a small generator just big enoufg to run a fridge OR gas furnace
ORwell pump OR a small window AC unit plus a few lights and perhaps a
tiny tv is all most need for camping out.

Big operators need a natural gas or propane generator.

i have a couple generators and have wrestled with these issues myself
plus the noise of a generator running.

the best option is likely a car inverter 12 volts to 120 the cars fuel
tank is the portable container.

remember in a widespread outage gas stations depend on electric to
dispense pump gas...

sadly its not ust plug in the big hugger generator sit back and
relax....

sparty wrote:
I recently moved into a new house in Michigan, that does not currently
have a Generator hook up.

I just ran 4 guage wire to my garage with a 60amp breaker on both sides
to run an Air Compessor/Welder/etc.

I'm wondering, could I take something like a 9000 watt generator, wire
a plug for it into a 60 amp breaker in the panel in my garage. Then if
our power went out, I go into the house, flip off the main breaker, and
all the breakers except the subpanel, furnace, refridgerator, pump, and
a few others.

Then I plug in and fire up the generator in my garage, or right outside
it, and feed power into the house from that to run those select items?

This seems like it would be a great idea, just want to make sure that
would be ok??

Thanks, James
George wrote:
This is against the code rules, it is unsafe, and if something bad were
to happen, you are liable.

I know,I know, your going to turn off the main before connecting and
starting the generator, that is exactly what everyone who has caused
damage to utility systems and or injury to utility workers has said,
which is precisely why it is now totally against the rules to do it.
Generator transfer switches are not that expensive, I think a manual
switch to handle your generator can be had for around 300 bucks or
so.Honestly, the liability is just too great, you try to save a few
hundred bucks and someone gets killed or injured....is it REALLY worth
it?
Think of it like this, YOU know you would NEVER forget to switch off
the main breaker, your wife and kids would NEVER touch the thing, BUT,
one day during an outage a utility worker gets zapped......suddenly you
remember the old saying......NEVER say NEVER.

George


sparty wrote:
Ok, thank you all for your response, I will not do it this way then.
I agree, there is a chance over the years, that somehow accidently, a
person may forget to turn of the main switch.

I have seen something similar to what you guys are talking about in my
brother-in-laws house. So what exactly do I need to buy, and is this
something I could install myself? I am pretty proficient in wiring,
just curious if it's possible to do it yourself, and what EXACTLY I
need to buy.

Thanks again, James


I would need to know the make and model number of your main panel in
order to give you your best options.
--
Tom Horne

"This alternating current stuff is just a fad. It is much too dangerous
for general use." Thomas Alva Edison

Tom Horne, Electrician wrote:
I would need to know the make and model number of your main panel in
order to give you your best options.
--
Tom Horne

I have a 150 amp HOM Square D Breaker Panel.

One of the options I'm considering now is a 50 amp Transfer Switch
Panel, that goes next to your main panel. This has a Wire Bundle that
you run into your main panel. Then you pull the hot wires out of the
breakers that you want to bypass, connect them to these wires, then run
more wires from that bundle into those breakers.

By doing this, I would be slightly rewiring about 8 breakers that I
would want to run in the case of an outage, and all the rest would be
left alone. If the Transfer Switch Panel is set to normal power, then
it will allow the power coming into your house to power those 8
breakers in your main panel. If you switch it to Generator, then the 8
breakers are disconnected from the main power, and are then able to
receive power from a generator. By doing this, there is no way to
reverse power back to the main panel from a generator and vise versa.

This is a very slick and easy to install option. The only thing I
don't like, is the price tag. It's somewhere around $300 - $400.

sparty wrote:
Tom Horne, Electrician wrote:
I would need to know the make and model number of your main panel in
order to give you your best options.
--
Tom Horne

I have a 150 amp HOM Square D Breaker Panel.

One of the options I'm considering now is a 50 amp Transfer Switch
Panel, that goes next to your main panel. This has a Wire Bundle that
you run into your main panel. Then you pull the hot wires out of the
breakers that you want to bypass, connect them to these wires, then run
more wires from that bundle into those breakers.

By doing this, I would be slightly rewiring about 8 breakers that I
would want to run in the case of an outage, and all the rest would be
left alone. If the Transfer Switch Panel is set to normal power, then
it will allow the power coming into your house to power those 8
breakers in your main panel. If you switch it to Generator, then the 8
breakers are disconnected from the main power, and are then able to
receive power from a generator. By doing this, there is no way to
reverse power back to the main panel from a generator and vise versa.

This is a very slick and easy to install option. The only thing I
don't like, is the price tag. It's somewhere around $300 - $400.


sparty
Because you have a Square-D Homeline panel you can obtain an interlock
kit that will allow you to use a double pole breaker installed in
position 2&4 as the generator breaker. The interlock kit prevents the
2-4 breaker from being closed until you have opened the main breaker.
That kit runs about fifty dollars at an electrical supply house. The
size of the breaker that you install in position 2-4 will limit the
amount of current you can supply to your home through the connection.
Your generator must be equipped with a 120/240 volt outlet for it's
power to be safe to connect to the home in this way. No matter what
size your generator is you may want to consider installing a fifty
ampere breaker so that any generator that you would ever want to use, up
to 12000 watts, could be connected through that connection. You then
run a four wire cable from the panel back to were the inlet connector
for the generator will be installed. The cable is sized for the size of
the position 2-4 breaker. Fifty amperes is the largest size of inlet
that is commonly available. The actual limit on the amount of current
the line will carry is the sizing of the breakers on the generator. The
simplest arrangement is to match the inlet to the outlet on the
generator so that you will not need an adapter to connect the generator
cable to the inlet. It is perfectly OK to use a twenty ampere inlet on
the fifty ampere cable but if the generator isn't at least 5000 watts it
is probably not worth connecting it to your home in this way. The power
inlet you use should be weatherproof while in use. The total materials
cost of this installation is approximately $200.

Once this installation is in place you can use any load in your home up
to the ability of the generator to carry the total load. You are not
limited to the particular loads that are connected to a special panel.
--
Tom Horne

"This alternating current stuff is just a fad. It is much too dangerous
for general use." Thomas Alva Edison

That multi color gen you brought up may have poor power- not for
circuits and last only 250-300hrs, you get what you pay for.

So to be able to do that, it sounds like I would have to move breakers
2 & 4 to the bottom to make room for this? If the hot wire isn't long
enough to do that, is it ok to use a wire nut and lengthen it?

Also, yes I plan on buying a 12000W Generator and a 50amp breaker to
run it. I will then run 6 guage wire from my basement to my garage and
install a plug outside with a weatherproof case around it and a lock.

So I need to call an electrical supply house and tell them I need a
interlock kit for a Square-D Homeline panel? Is that the exact name?
If I can get one of these, then this would probably be the best and
cheapest option then, thanks.

Member, Takoma Park Volunteer Fire Department wrote:
Because you have a Square-D Homeline panel you can obtain an interlock
kit that will allow you to use a double pole breaker installed in
position 2&4 as the generator breaker. The interlock kit prevents the
2-4 breaker from being closed until you have opened the main breaker.
That kit runs about fifty dollars at an electrical supply house. The
size of the breaker that you install in position 2-4 will limit the
amount of current you can supply to your home through the connection.
Your generator must be equipped with a 120/240 volt outlet for it's
power to be safe to connect to the home in this way. No matter what
size your generator is you may want to consider installing a fifty
ampere breaker so that any generator that you would ever want to use, up
to 12000 watts, could be connected through that connection. You then
run a four wire cable from the panel back to were the inlet connector
for the generator will be installed. The cable is sized for the size of
the position 2-4 breaker. Fifty amperes is the largest size of inlet
that is commonly available. The actual limit on the amount of current
the line will carry is the sizing of the breakers on the generator. The
simplest arrangement is to match the inlet to the outlet on the
generator so that you will not need an adapter to connect the generator
cable to the inlet. It is perfectly OK to use a twenty ampere inlet on
the fifty ampere cable but if the generator isn't at least 5000 watts it
is probably not worth connecting it to your home in this way. The power
inlet you use should be weatherproof while in use. The total materials
cost of this installation is approximately $200.

Once this installation is in place you can use any load in your home up
to the ability of the generator to carry the total load. You are not
limited to the particular loads that are connected to a special panel.
--
Tom Horne

"This alternating current stuff is just a fad. It is much too dangerous
for general use." Thomas Alva Edison

Yep, it may be junk. Just wondering if I can get it for $700 - $800,
if I should give it a shot. I'm guessing the Named Brand 12000W
Generators are in the $2K - $3K range.


m Ransley wrote:
That multi color gen you brought up may have poor power- not for
circuits and last only 250-300hrs, you get what you pay for.

Is that 12000w surge or continous, or 6-7000w continous load, does it
supply 120v 60hz at no load and full load, or does it sag so 90v 50hz?
How good is the govenor and output. There is alot more to generators
then a frame, motor and gen head. It may be a deal, or it may be a
dump, you should find out first.

Member, Takoma Park Volunteer Fire Department wrote:
Because you have a Square-D Homeline panel you can obtain an interlock
kit that will allow you to use a double pole breaker installed in
position 2&4 as the generator breaker. The interlock kit prevents the
2-4 breaker from being closed until you have opened the main breaker.
That kit runs about fifty dollars at an electrical supply house. The
size of the breaker that you install in position 2-4 will limit the
amount of current you can supply to your home through the connection.
Your generator must be equipped with a 120/240 volt outlet for it's
power to be safe to connect to the home in this way. No matter what
size your generator is you may want to consider installing a fifty
ampere breaker so that any generator that you would ever want to use, up
to 12000 watts, could be connected through that connection. You then
run a four wire cable from the panel back to were the inlet connector
for the generator will be installed. The cable is sized for the size of
the position 2-4 breaker. Fifty amperes is the largest size of inlet
that is commonly available. The actual limit on the amount of current
the line will carry is the sizing of the breakers on the generator. The
simplest arrangement is to match the inlet to the outlet on the
generator so that you will not need an adapter to connect the generator
cable to the inlet. It is perfectly OK to use a twenty ampere inlet on
the fifty ampere cable but if the generator isn't at least 5000 watts it
is probably not worth connecting it to your home in this way. The power
inlet you use should be weatherproof while in use. The total materials
cost of this installation is approximately $200.

Once this installation is in place you can use any load in your home up
to the ability of the generator to carry the total load. You are not
limited to the particular loads that are connected to a special panel.
--
Tom Horne

"This alternating current stuff is just a fad. It is much too dangerous
for general use." Thomas Alva Edison

sparty wrote:
So to be able to do that, it sounds like I would have to move breakers
2 & 4 to the bottom to make room for this? If the hot wire isn't long
enough to do that, is it ok to use a wire nut and lengthen it?

Also, yes I plan on buying a 12000W Generator and a 50amp breaker to
run it. I will then run 6 guage wire from my basement to my garage and
install a plug outside with a weatherproof case around it and a lock.

So I need to call an electrical supply house and tell them I need a
interlock kit for a Square-D Homeline panel? Is that the exact name?
If I can get one of these, then this would probably be the best and
cheapest option then, thanks.


Sparty
The custom on Usenet is to post replies at the bottom of any quoted
material. It makes the conversation easier for others to follow.

Yes it is OK to splice in the panels wiring trough.

When you say that you will "install a plug outside" what do you mean?
You can install a cord that is spliced right on to the cable or you can
install a flanged inlet which is the same pins as a plug end of a cord
rigidly fastened to a mount to receive a receptacle cord cap. Do not
install a receptacle at the supply end of the cable.
--
Tom Horne

"This alternating current stuff is just a fad. It is much too dangerous
for general use." Thomas Alva Edison

Member, Takoma Park Volunteer Fire Department wrote:
Member, Takoma Park Volunteer Fire Department wrote:
Because you have a Square-D Homeline panel you can obtain an interlock
kit that will allow you to use a double pole breaker installed in
position 2&4 as the generator breaker. The interlock kit prevents the
2-4 breaker from being closed until you have opened the main breaker.
That kit runs about fifty dollars at an electrical supply house. The
size of the breaker that you install in position 2-4 will limit the
amount of current you can supply to your home through the connection.
Your generator must be equipped with a 120/240 volt outlet for it's
power to be safe to connect to the home in this way. No matter what
size your generator is you may want to consider installing a fifty
ampere breaker so that any generator that you would ever want to use, up
to 12000 watts, could be connected through that connection. You then
run a four wire cable from the panel back to were the inlet connector
for the generator will be installed. The cable is sized for the size of
the position 2-4 breaker. Fifty amperes is the largest size of inlet
that is commonly available. The actual limit on the amount of current
the line will carry is the sizing of the breakers on the generator. The
simplest arrangement is to match the inlet to the outlet on the
generator so that you will not need an adapter to connect the generator
cable to the inlet. It is perfectly OK to use a twenty ampere inlet on
the fifty ampere cable but if the generator isn't at least 5000 watts it
is probably not worth connecting it to your home in this way. The power
inlet you use should be weatherproof while in use. The total materials
cost of this installation is approximately $200.

Once this installation is in place you can use any load in your home up
to the ability of the generator to carry the total load. You are not
limited to the particular loads that are connected to a special panel.
--
Tom Horne

"This alternating current stuff is just a fad. It is much too dangerous
for general use." Thomas Alva Edison

sparty wrote:
So to be able to do that, it sounds like I would have to move breakers
2 & 4 to the bottom to make room for this? If the hot wire isn't long
enough to do that, is it ok to use a wire nut and lengthen it?

Also, yes I plan on buying a 12000W Generator and a 50amp breaker to
run it. I will then run 6 guage wire from my basement to my garage and
install a plug outside with a weatherproof case around it and a lock.

So I need to call an electrical supply house and tell them I need a
interlock kit for a Square-D Homeline panel? Is that the exact name?
If I can get one of these, then this would probably be the best and
cheapest option then, thanks.


Sparty
The custom on Usenet is to post replies at the bottom of any quoted
material. It makes the conversation easier for others to follow.

Yes it is OK to splice in the panels wiring trough.

When you say that you will "install a plug outside" what do you mean?
You can install a cord that is spliced right on to the cable or you can
install a flanged inlet which is the same pins as a plug end of a cord
rigidly fastened to a mount to receive a receptacle cord cap. Do not
install a receptacle at the supply end of the cable.
--
Tom Horne

"This alternating current stuff is just a fad. It is much too dangerous
for general use." Thomas Alva Edison


I would like to run 6 guage wire from my basement to my garage like I
mentioned. I want to make this nice and clean looking. Then on the
outside of my 3rd stall garage, I would like to have something that a
generator can plug into, using an extension cord.

I would like to make about a 10 foot or so 6 guage extension cord. One
side would plug into the generator and the other side to the plug, or
whatever I need to install outside.

Sparty
When you say that you will "install a plug outside" what do you mean?
You can install a cord that is spliced right on to the cable or you can
install a flanged inlet which is the same pins as a plug end of a cord
rigidly fastened to a mount to receive a receptacle cord cap. Do not
install a receptacle at the supply end of the cable.
--
Tom Horne

"This alternating current stuff is just a fad. It is much too dangerous
for general use." Thomas Alva Edison


I would like to run 6 guage wire from my basement to my garage like I
mentioned. I want to make this nice and clean looking. Then on the
outside of my 3rd stall garage, I would like to have something that a
generator can plug into, using an extension cord.

I would like to make about a 10 foot or so 6 guage extension cord. One
side would plug into the generator and the other side to the plug, or
whatever I need to install outside.


Since the generator will be 12000 watts or fifty amperes your least
expensive solution will be to Install a hard wired flexible cord from a
suitably sized junction box at the garage end. That cord will have a
male cord cap that matches the receptacle on your generator. Flanged
inlets in the 240/120 volt fifty ampere pattern are expensive and hard
to find.
--
Tom Horne

Well we aren't no thin blue heroes and yet we aren't no blackguards to.
We're just working men and woman most remarkable like you.

Thomas D. Horne, FF EMT wrote:
Sparty
When you say that you will "install a plug outside" what do you mean?
You can install a cord that is spliced right on to the cable or you can
install a flanged inlet which is the same pins as a plug end of a cord
rigidly fastened to a mount to receive a receptacle cord cap. Do not
install a receptacle at the supply end of the cable.
--
Tom Horne

"This alternating current stuff is just a fad. It is much too dangerous
for general use." Thomas Alva Edison


I would like to run 6 guage wire from my basement to my garage like I
mentioned. I want to make this nice and clean looking. Then on the
outside of my 3rd stall garage, I would like to have something that a
generator can plug into, using an extension cord.

I would like to make about a 10 foot or so 6 guage extension cord. One
side would plug into the generator and the other side to the plug, or
whatever I need to install outside.


Since the generator will be 12000 watts or fifty amperes your least
expensive solution will be to Install a hard wired flexible cord from a
suitably sized junction box at the garage end. That cord will have a
male cord cap that matches the receptacle on your generator. Flanged
inlets in the 240/120 volt fifty ampere pattern are expensive and hard
to find.
--
Tom Horne

Well we aren't no thin blue heroes and yet we aren't no blackguards to.
We're just working men and woman most remarkable like you.

I'm also thinking, since I'm considering a 12K Watt Generator, I should
do 6 guage wire and a 60amp breaker/interlock kit, to handle the surge
that could happen. Just in case, it surges to 13K or 14K Watts. I'll
think about the junction box, and also look into the price of a flanged
inlet to run the cord to.

Thanks, James