First, I have my actual written warranty for the double-paned windows
on my house; and the windows are still within the period that the
window manufacturer will 100% replace any windows with seal failures.
I've owned the windows for less than 5 years. These are likely
less-expensive double-paned windows that the builder installed.

I want to be reasonable with the manufacturer, and so here is what I've
done so far.

First, I cleaned all of the windows on my house, and inspected them for
different grades of moisture between the panes.

1 - visible small droplets / fog in the window - no ambiquity of seal
failure

2 - mild streaks of fog with a few small spots of heavier moisture

3 - mild streaks of fog visible between the panes, no visible droplets

4 - few streaks of fog visible

5 - window looks fine

Now, I went around my home and graded each window.

Question: For the above grades, what do you think is reasonsable to
expect the window manufacturer to replace under warranty due to seal
failures?

I'm thinking of definitely pushing for all of the 1s and 2s. I'm not
as sure about pushing for the 3s and 4s.

Thanks.

Jack wrote:
First, I have my actual written warranty for the double-paned windows
on my house; and the windows are still within the period that the
window manufacturer will 100% replace any windows with seal failures.
I've owned the windows for less than 5 years. These are likely
less-expensive double-paned windows that the builder installed.

I want to be reasonable with the manufacturer, and so here is what
I've done so far.

First, I cleaned all of the windows on my house, and inspected them
for different grades of moisture between the panes.

1 - visible small droplets / fog in the window - no ambiquity of seal
failure

2 - mild streaks of fog with a few small spots of heavier moisture

3 - mild streaks of fog visible between the panes, no visible droplets

4 - few streaks of fog visible

5 - window looks fine

Now, I went around my home and graded each window.

Question: For the above grades, what do you think is reasonsable to
expect the window manufacturer to replace under warranty due to seal
failures?

I'm thinking of definitely pushing for all of the 1s and 2s. I'm not
as sure about pushing for the 3s and 4s.

Any indication of moisture is too much. There should not none at all.


Thanks.

--
Joseph Meehan

Dia duit

grab the warranty coverage now on 1-2-3-4's and hope your 5's dont fail
soon after warranty expires.

Your warranty will state the condition . Pellas 20yr warranty states "a
permanent material obstruction of vision'" in the warranty. I see it as
any obstruction-moisture, indicates seal failure. So 1-4, no matter how
small the issue. If many are defective, they all may soon be bad.

"Jack" wrote in message
ps.com...
First, I have my actual written warranty for the double-paned windows
on my house; and the windows are still within the period that the
window manufacturer will 100% replace any windows with seal failures.
I've owned the windows for less than 5 years. These are likely
less-expensive double-paned windows that the builder installed.

I want to be reasonable with the manufacturer, and so here is what I've
done so far.

First, I cleaned all of the windows on my house, and inspected them for
different grades of moisture between the panes.

1 - visible small droplets / fog in the window - no ambiquity of seal
failure

2 - mild streaks of fog with a few small spots of heavier moisture

3 - mild streaks of fog visible between the panes, no visible droplets

4 - few streaks of fog visible

5 - window looks fine

Now, I went around my home and graded each window.

Question: For the above grades, what do you think is reasonsable to
expect the window manufacturer to replace under warranty due to seal
failures?

I'm thinking of definitely pushing for all of the 1s and 2s. I'm not
as sure about pushing for the 3s and 4s.

Thanks.

When the seal breaks, the argon gas that is normally sandwiched in between
the panes will escape rendering the insulation value to nearly nothing.

FDR wrote:

When the seal breaks, the argon gas that is normally sandwiched in between
the panes will escape rendering the insulation value to nearly nothing.

Well, it might become an R2 window.

Nick

Over 20 yrs 10% of the argon is expected to leak out resulting in only a
few % reduction in R value.

m Ransley wrote:

Over 20 yrs 10% of the argon is expected to leak out resulting in only a
few % reduction in R value.

What's the written guarantee say?

Nick

"FDR" writes:
When the seal breaks, the argon gas that is normally sandwiched in between
the panes will escape rendering the insulation value to nearly
nothing.

Which, it bears mention, is only slightly worse than the insulation
value of argon gas! Gas is not a terribly good insulator.

The biggest problem with seal breakage is the appearance of the
moisture, and as another poster said, any appearance of moisture is
too much.

Best Regards,
--
Todd H.
http://www.toddh.net/

Todd H. wrote:

"FDR" writes:

When the seal breaks, the argon gas that is normally sandwiched in between
the panes will escape rendering the insulation value to nearly
nothing.

Which, it bears mention, is only slightly worse than the insulation
value of argon gas! Gas is not a terribly good insulator.

It's not bad. Neither is air.

http://www.farleywindows.com/perform..._canadian.html

shows a low-e and argon combination raises the US R-value of double glass
by about 1, from 2.04 to 2.86. Neither are "nearly nothing," altho they
are small, compared to an R30 wall.

Nick

"buffalobill" wrote in message
ups.com...
grab the warranty coverage now on 1-2-3-4's and hope your 5's dont fail
soon after warranty expires.


Second that! Get what you can while you can. If you stay there you will
have plenty of time to pay later.


Colbyt

Note to all of my firends.

R-values have no place in the window industry, because the resistance
value of the glass pack and the frame are always compromised by the air
infiltration around the opening and the amount of passive energy from
short wave radiation (light).

The window industry therefore uses U values. Though they are basically
1/R-Value, U values can fluctuate where R-values are relatively static.

Any moisture inside the glass pack indicates seal failure. It is up to
the window manufacturer to honor his warranty.

Odds are, that the warranty does NOT include installation or removal of
the old window. Odds also are, that the manufacturer will ignore you.

You might be best to request replacement sahes (the parts that hold the
glass. If your windows tilt in and out, you will be able to replace
these yourself very easily.

U values have no place for most of us in window rating. U values are
the mathematical inverse of R values. So an R value of 2 equals a U
value of .05 or 1/2. I use R values they are a logical comparison
instead of throwing in U values as a comparitor. U value to R for most
is like metric with feet, or scones to Decibels, confusing and unessary.
And what is that 1/ R comparitor you posted, its wrong.. So is air
infiltration as an R factor. R or U just convert it, its measured the
same.

D4 wrote:

The window industry therefore uses U values. Though they are basically
1/R-Value, U values can fluctuate where R-values are relatively static.

No. U = 1/R. :-)

Nick

Nick please show the math conversion formula expressed out, so I can do
it.

buffalobill wrote:
grab the warranty coverage now on 1-2-3-4's and hope your 5's dont fail
soon after warranty expires.

The window manufacturer is replacing all of the 1-2-3-4's under
warranty including labor

So far the only cost to me is my time.