On 23 jun, 00:19, Hipupchuck wrote:
I don't think digital is ready for prime time.
I haven't had a single digital cell phone conversation without some
audio ****ups of some kind. I can't watch a single television program or
documentary without some kind of audio or video ****up of some kind.
I listen to PBS radio a lot and every day they have some audio or RF
****up of some kind or some ****ing emergency test ****up of some kind.
This is digital **** is really a ****ed up system. Maybe I'm too old or
something but I don't remember this problem in the old days with analog
things.

on a related note, a relative bought one of those 'mini' digital set
top boxes that are really just an extended scart plug (US: AV
connector used in europe) with a plug-in IR detector to stick on the
front or top of your TV.
I have never seen such crap in all my life, even with a known good
signal there was breakup and pixellating. They must use a cheap tuner
or something. In the end I used a first generation box and all was
well!

I think the DVB spec, MHP and the compression needed to cram more
channels into existing bandwidth means that errors are more pronounced
under digital. Anything that interrupts the datastream is disasterous
for digital, whereas with analogue this just wasn't an issue.

-B

On 23 Juny, 12:20, b wrote:
on a related note, a relative bought one of those 'mini' digital set
top boxes that are really just an extended scart plug (US: AV
connector used in europe) with a plug-in IR detector to stick on the
front or top of your TV.
I have never seen such crap in all my life, even with a known good
signal there was breakup and pixellating. They must use a cheap tuner
or something. In the end I used a first generation box and all was
well!

I also bought one of these (an NPG) and it is pretty good given it was
the cheapest. The tuner is good, somewhat more sensitive than average
cheap top boxes but what I really like about it is its separate IR
sensor that you can place where it will properly see your remote. The
remote works from everywhere unlike typical boxes that you must point
to very precisely.

I also found most of the times where a particular brand or model of
receiver appears to be less sensitive it is actually a problem with
self generated noise or marginal shielding. Not the tuner itself but
poor supply filtering or shielding from its digital circuits, in most
of them you can see the noise on some weak analog channels (assuming
the receiver is connected between the antenna and TV). I have found
two effective solutions:
- use better RF cable along with properly shielded antenna connectors
(note that in these last years its has become very common to use cheap
prebuilt antenna cables that have very bad shielding, if any at all)
- connect some other active device between the antenna and the
receiver (eg. a VCR or a satellite receiver with antenna passthrough).
It really helps, have done that many times, and my theory is that the
lower noise of the other device helps sense the weak antenna signals
and stops the receiver noise to reach the antenna.

Anything that interrupts the datastream is disasterous
for digital, whereas with analogue this just wasn't an issue.

For marginal reception you can still see the program quite well with
just some small coloured rectangles appearing randomly. However I
agree that where the analog was still viewable the digital does not
work.

On 23 jun, 19:56, Jeroni Paul wrote:
On 23 Juny, 12:20, b wrote:

on a related note, a relative bought one of those 'mini' digital set
top boxes

I also bought one of these (an NPG) and it is pretty good given it was
the cheapest. T

well, I had the misfortune to get one of these: http://www.saxem.com/index_electronica.html

......and my experience was the opposite of yours. I have contacted the
manufacturers and will let you know what they say-don't hold your
breath though!