All this talk about soldering irons makes me think how crummy too
much American industrial design is.

Some US industrial design looks great but some looks downright,
well, Russian.

Sure you can see crap-looking design in western Europe too but
there's a lot less of it than in the US.

Take soldering irons for example. An ordinary soldering iron in
the US with unregulated temperature still has great big mofo screws
holding the tip.

By comparison, my 30 year old British-made basic Antex is a sleek
looking baby and those Antexes are not particularly expensive.

Don't start me on the looks of cars!


--
Russian in America
http://www.funnyordie.com/videos/bc5...-pilot-episode

On Mon, 20 Apr 2009 21:08:32 +0100, Allus Smith
wrote:

All this talk about soldering irons makes me think how crummy too
much American industrial design is.

Some US industrial design looks great but some looks downright,
well, Russian.

Sure you can see crap-looking design in western Europe too but
there's a lot less of it than in the US.

Take soldering irons for example. An ordinary soldering iron in
the US with unregulated temperature still has great big mofo screws
holding the tip.

By comparison, my 30 year old British-made basic Antex is a sleek
looking baby and those Antexes are not particularly expensive.

Don't start me on the looks of cars!

Same troll. Must be bored...

--
Rich Webb Norfolk, VA

On 20 Apr 21:36, Rich Webb wrote:

On Mon, 20 Apr 2009 21:08:32 +0100, Allus Smith wrote:

All this talk about soldering irons makes me think how crummy
too much American industrial design is.

Some US industrial design looks great but some looks
downright, well, Russian.

Sure you can see crap-looking design in western Europe too but
there's a lot less of it than in the US.

Take soldering irons for example. An ordinary soldering iron
in the US with unregulated temperature still has great big
mofo screws holding the tip.

By comparison, my 30 year old British-made basic Antex is a
sleek looking baby and those Antexes are not particularly
expensive.

Don't start me on the looks of cars!

Same troll. Must be bored...


Hello Rich, I'm the OP. I'm sorry to hear you think I'm a troll.

I don't know what you mean by "same" becuase I have only posted
here recently and I hope there isn't another post which could be
misconstrued as a troll.

Perhaps you just don't like my point of view?

On Mon, 20 Apr 2009 21:08:32 +0100, Allus Smith
wrote:

All this talk about soldering irons makes me think how crummy too
much American industrial design is.

Some US industrial design looks great but some looks downright,
well, Russian.

Sure you can see crap-looking design in western Europe too but
there's a lot less of it than in the US.

Take soldering irons for example. An ordinary soldering iron in
the US with unregulated temperature still has great big mofo screws
holding the tip.

By comparison, my 30 year old British-made basic Antex is a sleek
looking baby and those Antexes are not particularly expensive.

Don't start me on the looks of cars!

If you buy cheap, you get cheap.

Get a Metcal. No screw at all.

Don't start me on the looks of cars!

Mini. Citroën. Vauxhall. Volvo. Rolls. Porsche. Fiat.

http://philip.greenspun.com/images/p...evaux-20.4.jpg


John

On 20 Apr 22:23, John Larkin wrote:

On Mon, 20 Apr 2009 21:08:32 +0100, Allus Smith
wrote:

All this talk about soldering irons makes me think how crummy
too much American industrial design is.

Some US industrial design looks great but some looks
downright, well, Russian.

Sure you can see crap-looking design in western Europe too but
there's a lot less of it than in the US.

Take soldering irons for example. An ordinary soldering iron
in the US with unregulated temperature still has great big
mofo screws holding the tip.

By comparison, my 30 year old British-made basic Antex is a
sleek looking baby and those Antexes are not particularly
expensive.

Don't start me on the looks of cars!

If you buy cheap, you get cheap.
Get a Metcal. No screw at all.

Don't start me on the looks of cars!

Mini. Citroën. Vauxhall. Volvo. Rolls. Porsche. Fiat.
http://philip.greenspun.com/images/pcd3815/
dublin-deux-chevaux-20.4.jpg

John



Yup, you're right! Which is why I wrote: "you can see crap-looking
design in western Europe too ..... but there's a lot less of it
than in the US".

One distinctive feature of US car design is a look I call: "I've
just rammed a wall"

Mercifully, it is almost never found on west European cars and
hopefully never will be. It is illustrated below.

There are probably 200 US cars with this sort of styling:
http://www.swiftweblog.com/media/1/2...2006_300_2.jpg
for every US car that looks like this:
http://www.carforums.net/reviews/mak...Chrysler11.jpg
and that one is still very angular.









--

inc car group

On Apr 20, 5:41 pm, Allus Smith wrote:
On 20 Apr 22:23, John Larkin wrote:


There are probably 200 US cars with this sort of styling:
http://www.swiftweblog.com/media/1/2...2006_300_2.jpg


You are wrong. Despite the recession, Chrysler has sold considerably
more than 200 of that model.

"John-Del" wrote in message
...
On Apr 20, 5:41 pm, Allus Smith wrote:
On 20 Apr 22:23, John Larkin wrote:


There are probably 200 US cars with this sort of styling:
http://www.swiftweblog.com/media/1/2...2006_300_2.jpg


You are wrong. Despite the recession, Chrysler has sold considerably
more than 200 of that model.

That's the thing about being a troll ... no accountability ... they just
blather, and waste bandwidth and time. PLONK him!

On 21 Apr 00:01, John-Del wrote:

On Apr 20, 5:41 pm, Allus Smith wrote:
On 20 Apr 22:23, John Larkin wrote:


There are probably 200 US cars with this sort of styling:
http://www.swiftweblog.com/media/1/2...2006_300_2.jpg

You are wrong. Despite the recession, Chrysler has sold
considerably more than 200 of that model.


I should hope so too! :-) However I didn't say that. I said:

"There are probably 200 US cars with this sort of styling [Chrysler
300] for every US car that looks like this [Chrysler ME] and that
one is still very angular."

Of course that Chrysler ME 4-12 is a concept car and not for sale.

Allus Smith wrote:
On 21 Apr 00:01, John-Del wrote:

On Apr 20, 5:41 pm, Allus Smith wrote:
On 20 Apr 22:23, John Larkin wrote:

There are probably 200 US cars with this sort of styling:
http://www.swiftweblog.com/media/1/2...2006_300_2.jpg
You are wrong. Despite the recession, Chrysler has sold
considerably more than 200 of that model.


I should hope so too! :-) However I didn't say that. I said:

"There are probably 200 US cars with this sort of styling [Chrysler
300] for every US car that looks like this [Chrysler ME] and that
one is still very angular."

Of course that Chrysler ME 4-12 is a concept car and not for sale.


This is not a concept car and you can actually buy one for a reasonable
price. I lately had the pleasure and that thing sure corners well. Best
of all, on the freeway it doesn't use more gas than a compact passenger car:

http://www.chevrolet.com/corvette/

Same he

http://www.dodge.com/en/2008/viper/

--
Regards, Joerg

http://www.analogconsultants.com/

"gmail" domain blocked because of excessive spam.
Use another domain or send PM.

On Apr 20, 7:30*pm, Allus Smith wrote:
On 21 Apr *00:01, John-Del wrote:

On Apr 20, 5:41 pm, Allus Smith wrote:
On 20 Apr *22:23, John Larkin wrote:

There are probably 200 US cars with this sort of styling:
* *http://www.swiftweblog.com/media/1/2...2006_300_2.jpg

You are wrong. *Despite the recession, Chrysler has sold
considerably more than 200 of that model.

I should hope so too! *:-) *However I didn't say that. I said:

"There are probably 200 US cars with this sort of styling [Chrysler
300] for every US car that looks like this [Chrysler ME] and that
one is still very angular."

Of course that Chrysler ME 4-12 is a concept car and not for sale.

Is the Chrysler ME anything like Windows ME?

John-Del wrote:
On Apr 20, 5:41 pm, Allus Smith wrote:
On 20 Apr 22:23, John Larkin wrote:


There are probably 200 US cars with this sort of styling:
http://www.swiftweblog.com/media/1/2...2006_300_2.jpg


You are wrong. Despite the recession, Chrysler has sold considerably
more than 200 of that model.


To be fair, they did try to make it look like a Bentley!

On Mon, 20 Apr 2009 22:41:56 +0100, Allus Smith
wrote:

On 20 Apr 22:23, John Larkin wrote:

On Mon, 20 Apr 2009 21:08:32 +0100, Allus Smith
wrote:

All this talk about soldering irons makes me think how crummy
too much American industrial design is.

Some US industrial design looks great but some looks
downright, well, Russian.

Sure you can see crap-looking design in western Europe too but
there's a lot less of it than in the US.

Take soldering irons for example. An ordinary soldering iron
in the US with unregulated temperature still has great big
mofo screws holding the tip.

By comparison, my 30 year old British-made basic Antex is a
sleek looking baby and those Antexes are not particularly
expensive.

Don't start me on the looks of cars!

If you buy cheap, you get cheap.
Get a Metcal. No screw at all.

Don't start me on the looks of cars!

Mini. Citroën. Vauxhall. Volvo. Rolls. Porsche. Fiat.
http://philip.greenspun.com/images/pcd3815/
dublin-deux-chevaux-20.4.jpg

John



Yup, you're right! Which is why I wrote: "you can see crap-looking
design in western Europe too ..... but there's a lot less of it
than in the US".

One distinctive feature of US car design is a look I call: "I've
just rammed a wall"

If you want to stuff a huge V8 with 200 tons of air conditioning and
power-everything under the hood, you need a lot of hood.

But Cadillac and most things Chrysler are admittedly over the top.
They corner the ugly-car-lover market.

John

On Mon, 20 Apr 2009 19:51:20 -0700, John Larkin
wrote:

If you want to stuff a huge V8 with 200 tons of air conditioning and
power-everything under the hood, you need a lot of hood.

But Cadillac and most things Chrysler are admittedly over the top.
They corner the ugly-car-lover market.

John

For good reason. In 1978, the congress critters passed the gas
guzzlers tax:
http://www.epa.gov/fueleconomy/guzzler/index.htm
http://www.fueleconomy.gov/FEG/info.shtml#guzzler
The typical land yacht, with about 15mpg, pays about $4,000 in gas
guzzlers tax.

The idea was to discourage big ugly oversized non-commercial vehicles.
However, they exempted anything over 6000 lbs GVW. So, in accordance
to the law of unintended consequences, the industry simply delivered
monstrous vehicles that officially weighted 6001 lbs and save a bundle
on the taxes.

Of course, the government derives substantial revenue from taxing what
are now economy and mid size cars, so don't expect the situation to
change in the foreseeable future.


--
# Jeff Liebermann 150 Felker St #D Santa Cruz CA 95060
# 831-336-2558
# http://802.11junk.com
# http://www.LearnByDestroying.com AE6KS

On Mon, 20 Apr 2009 20:48:58 -0700, Jeff Liebermann
wrote:

On Mon, 20 Apr 2009 19:51:20 -0700, John Larkin
wrote:

If you want to stuff a huge V8 with 200 tons of air conditioning and
power-everything under the hood, you need a lot of hood.

But Cadillac and most things Chrysler are admittedly over the top.
They corner the ugly-car-lover market.

John

For good reason. In 1978, the congress critters passed the gas
guzzlers tax:
http://www.epa.gov/fueleconomy/guzzler/index.htm
http://www.fueleconomy.gov/FEG/info.shtml#guzzler
The typical land yacht, with about 15mpg, pays about $4,000 in gas
guzzlers tax.

The idea was to discourage big ugly oversized non-commercial vehicles.
However, they exempted anything over 6000 lbs GVW. So, in accordance
to the law of unintended consequences, the industry simply delivered
monstrous vehicles that officially weighted 6001 lbs and save a bundle
on the taxes.

Of course, the government derives substantial revenue from taxing what
are now economy and mid size cars, so don't expect the situation to
change in the foreseeable future.

If the politicoes had any guts+sense, they'd just up the taxes on
gasoline, and let the market take care of the rest.

John

On Mon, 20 Apr 2009 20:48:58 -0700, Jeff Liebermann wrote:

Of course, the government derives substantial revenue from taxing what are
now economy and mid size cars, so don't expect the situation to change in
the foreseeable future.

Until we all storm Washington, DC with our pitchforks and torches. :-

Cheers!
Rich

On Mon, 20 Apr 2009 19:51:20 -0700, John Larkin wrote:
On Mon, 20 Apr 2009 22:41:56 +0100, Allus Smith

One distinctive feature of US car design is a look I call: "I've just
rammed a wall"

If you want to stuff a huge V8 with 200 tons of air conditioning and
power-everything under the hood, you need a lot of hood.

But Cadillac and most things Chrysler are admittedly over the top. They
corner the ugly-car-lover market.

My second-favorite car actually was car-shaped:
http://image.hotrod.com/f/8929747/11...ide_ view.jpg
but mine was green.

Cheers!
Rich

"Rich Grise" wrote in message
news
But Cadillac and most things Chrysler are admittedly over the top. They
corner the ugly-car-lover market.

My second-favorite car actually was car-shaped:
http://image.hotrod.com/f/8929747/11...ide_ view.jpg
but mine was green.

I'm quite impressed at how ugly they've made that. It's the combination of
the little back back window and that huge pillar which seals it. Lose the
back seats, and glass, chop the roof back to the pillar, turn it into a ute
and it'd be a lot less wrong.

Allus Smith wrote:

On 20 Apr 22:23, John Larkin wrote:


On Mon, 20 Apr 2009 21:08:32 +0100, Allus Smith
wrote:


All this talk about soldering irons makes me think how crummy
too much American industrial design is.

Some US industrial design looks great but some looks
downright, well, Russian.

Sure you can see crap-looking design in western Europe too but
there's a lot less of it than in the US.

Take soldering irons for example. An ordinary soldering iron
in the US with unregulated temperature still has great big
mofo screws holding the tip.

By comparison, my 30 year old British-made basic Antex is a
sleek looking baby and those Antexes are not particularly
expensive.

Don't start me on the looks of cars!

If you buy cheap, you get cheap.
Get a Metcal. No screw at all.


Don't start me on the looks of cars!

Mini. Citroën. Vauxhall. Volvo. Rolls. Porsche. Fiat.
http://philip.greenspun.com/images/pcd3815/
dublin-deux-chevaux-20.4.jpg

John




Yup, you're right! Which is why I wrote: "you can see crap-looking
design in western Europe too ..... but there's a lot less of it
than in the US".

One distinctive feature of US car design is a look I call: "I've
just rammed a wall"

Mercifully, it is almost never found on west European cars and
hopefully never will be. It is illustrated below.

There are probably 200 US cars with this sort of styling:
http://www.swiftweblog.com/media/1/2...2006_300_2.jpg
for every US car that looks like this:
http://www.carforums.net/reviews/mak...Chrysler11.jpg
and that one is still very angular.









That last one looks more like a racing car than something for
everyday use.

Allus Smith wrote:

There are probably 200 US cars with this sort of styling:
http://www.swiftweblog.com/media/1/2...2006_300_2.jpg
for every US car that looks like this:
http://www.carforums.net/reviews/mak...Chrysler11.jpg
and that one is still very angular.

What's wrong with the 300C? Put a mesh grille on it and most people
think it's a Bentley. I don't mind kicking the septics for their
dreadful taste in car design, but the 300C or Merc E-class as we call it
here, is a relatively successful design. It's just a shame that the
powertrain and suspension engineering isn't as good as the chassis.

John Larkin wrote:
On Mon, 20 Apr 2009 21:08:32 +0100, Allus Smith
wrote:

All this talk about soldering irons makes me think how crummy too
much American industrial design is.

Some US industrial design looks great but some looks downright,
well, Russian.

Sure you can see crap-looking design in western Europe too but
there's a lot less of it than in the US.

Take soldering irons for example. An ordinary soldering iron in
the US with unregulated temperature still has great big mofo screws
holding the tip.

By comparison, my 30 year old British-made basic Antex is a sleek
looking baby and those Antexes are not particularly expensive.

Don't start me on the looks of cars!

If you buy cheap, you get cheap.

Get a Metcal. No screw at all.

Don't start me on the looks of cars!

Mini. Citroën. Vauxhall. Volvo. Rolls. Porsche. Fiat.

http://philip.greenspun.com/images/p...evaux-20.4.jpg


Now, now, don't diss that car. I had one for years. IMHO one of the most
clever car designs ever. It boasted features that none of the other cars
even came close to, regardless of which part of the planet they came
from. The epiphany happened on a German autobahn. Hardcore traffic jam,
nothing moved and it didn't look good for the next couple hours or so.
Within less than 60 seconds I had both front seats and the rear bench
sitting on the tarmac, so we could hold a proper poker game. No help,
all by myself. The guy who later joined us for the card game stood there
with his mouth wide open.

--
Regards, Joerg

http://www.analogconsultants.com/

"gmail" domain blocked because of excessive spam.
Use another domain or send PM.

On Mon, 20 Apr 2009 14:23:09 -0700, John Larkin wrote:
On Mon, 20 Apr 2009 21:08:32 +0100, Allus Smith

Don't start me on the looks of cars!

Mini. Citroën. Vauxhall. Volvo. Rolls. Porsche. Fiat.

http://philip.greenspun.com/images/p...evaux-20.4.jpg

I thought the Miata was ugly, until I saw a PT Cruiser. ;-)

Cheers!
Rich

I thought the Miata was ugly, until I saw a PT Cruiser. ;-)

The design is reminiscent of the Chrysler Airstream, which was a major flop
70+ years ago.

William Sommerwerck wrote:
I thought the Miata was ugly, until I saw a PT Cruiser. ;-)

The design is reminiscent of the Chrysler Airstream, which was a major flop
70+ years ago.


AFAIK the Airstream was not a major flop. The Airflow was, but mostly
due to really bad manufacturing defects.

--
Regards, Joerg

http://www.analogconsultants.com/

"gmail" domain blocked because of excessive spam.
Use another domain or send PM.

I thought the Miata was ugly, until I saw a PT Cruiser. ;-)

The design is reminiscent of the Chrysler Airstream, which was
a major flop 70+ years ago.

AFAIK the Airstream was not a major flop. The Airflow was, but
mostly due to really bad manufacturing defects.

I might have gotten the name wrong, as I was in a rush. Regardless, Chrysler
produced a "streamlined" car that the public didn't warm to.

I don't know which brands you're referring to, but I've owned EDSYN
(Engineering Dedicated To Suit Your Needs!) irons for 20+ years, and they
don't look anything like that.

William Sommerwerck wrote:
I don't know which brands you're referring to, but I've owned EDSYN
(Engineering Dedicated To Suit Your Needs!) irons for 20+ years, and they
don't look anything like that.


.... and wherever in the world I happened to be, there were always those
Weller stations. Antex? Never seen it, never heard of it. Strange, ain't it?

--
Regards, Joerg

http://www.analogconsultants.com/

"gmail" domain blocked because of excessive spam.
Use another domain or send PM.

"Joerg" wrote in message
...
William Sommerwerck wrote:
I don't know which brands you're referring to, but I've owned EDSYN
(Engineering Dedicated To Suit Your Needs!) irons for 20+ years, and they
don't look anything like that.


... and wherever in the world I happened to be, there were always those
Weller stations. Antex? Never seen it, never heard of it. Strange, ain't
it?


The weller irons were once the best money could buy - then they got took
over by cooper tools, since then the bean counters reduced the thickness of
the iron plating so the bit oxidises in the barrel, "freezing" in and
impossible to remove without damaging the element.

Years ago I bought a new weller - the stat lasted nearly 2 weeks before
welding closed, they sent me a replacement FOC which lasted nearly a month
before also welding closed - unfortunately I was away from my bench at the
time and it burned out the element, I've been using Antex irons ever since,
they usually last at least 5 years as long as the bit is replaced at the
proper interval and I can buy at least a 30 year supply of Antex irons for
just the weller (not including transformer base) iron.

I'd only use weller again if it was free (and I was allowed to keep an Antex
on standby for when the weller packs up).

ian field wrote:
"Joerg" wrote in message
...
William Sommerwerck wrote:
I don't know which brands you're referring to, but I've owned EDSYN
(Engineering Dedicated To Suit Your Needs!) irons for 20+ years, and they
don't look anything like that.


... and wherever in the world I happened to be, there were always those
Weller stations. Antex? Never seen it, never heard of it. Strange, ain't
it?


The weller irons were once the best money could buy - then they got took
over by cooper tools, since then the bean counters reduced the thickness of
the iron plating so the bit oxidises in the barrel, "freezing" in and
impossible to remove without damaging the element.

Years ago I bought a new weller - the stat lasted nearly 2 weeks before
welding closed, they sent me a replacement FOC which lasted nearly a month
before also welding closed - unfortunately I was away from my bench at the
time and it burned out the element, I've been using Antex irons ever since,
they usually last at least 5 years as long as the bit is replaced at the
proper interval and I can buy at least a 30 year supply of Antex irons for
just the weller (not including transformer base) iron.

I'd only use weller again if it was free (and I was allowed to keep an Antex
on standby for when the weller packs up).


Strange. I've suggested the Weller WES51 with the PES51 pencil to many
clients and then they bought oodles of those. Never a problem, in years,
and this stuff is cranking at least 10h/day. Ok, they don't light
cigarettes anymore like people use to with the older Wellers because
smoking is no longer allowed in US businesses.

Last year in December I bought a WES51 also here for the lab, to have a
spare. But I started using it a lot because the tiny PES51 pencil lays
much nicer in the hand than the fat LR-20 of the older stations. They
also added a nice feature, not important to me but to companies and the
fire marshall: If the iron isn't moved in an hour or so it automatically
shuts down. Grand total of $92 plus tax, with pencil and one tip, not a
bad deal at all.

--
Regards, Joerg

http://www.analogconsultants.com/

"gmail" domain blocked because of excessive spam.
Use another domain or send PM.

"Joerg" wrote in message
...
ian field wrote:
"Joerg" wrote in message
...
William Sommerwerck wrote:
I don't know which brands you're referring to, but I've owned EDSYN
(Engineering Dedicated To Suit Your Needs!) irons for 20+ years, and
they
don't look anything like that.


... and wherever in the world I happened to be, there were always those
Weller stations. Antex? Never seen it, never heard of it. Strange, ain't
it?


The weller irons were once the best money could buy - then they got took
over by cooper tools, since then the bean counters reduced the thickness
of the iron plating so the bit oxidises in the barrel, "freezing" in and
impossible to remove without damaging the element.

Years ago I bought a new weller - the stat lasted nearly 2 weeks before
welding closed, they sent me a replacement FOC which lasted nearly a
month before also welding closed - unfortunately I was away from my bench
at the time and it burned out the element, I've been using Antex irons
ever since, they usually last at least 5 years as long as the bit is
replaced at the proper interval and I can buy at least a 30 year supply
of Antex irons for just the weller (not including transformer base) iron.

I'd only use weller again if it was free (and I was allowed to keep an
Antex on standby for when the weller packs up).

Strange. I've suggested the Weller WES51 with the PES51 pencil to many
clients and then they bought oodles of those. Never a problem, in years,
and this stuff is cranking at least 10h/day. Ok, they don't light
cigarettes anymore like people use to with the older Wellers because
smoking is no longer allowed in US businesses.

Last year in December I bought a WES51 also here for the lab, to have a
spare. But I started using it a lot because the tiny PES51 pencil lays
much nicer in the hand than the fat LR-20 of the older stations. They also
added a nice feature, not important to me but to companies and the fire
marshall: If the iron isn't moved in an hour or so it automatically shuts
down. Grand total of $92 plus tax, with pencil and one tip, not a bad deal
at all.


Maybe they learned from the mass exodus of customers and fixed the non
existent reliability since the last time I had the misfortune to pay good
money for one of their products, but once bitten twice shy, I'm not giving
them any more of my money.

On Wed, 22 Apr 2009 13:47:14 -0700, Joerg wrote:

Strange. I've suggested the Weller WES51 with the PES51 pencil to many
clients and then they bought oodles of those. Never a problem, in years,
and this stuff is cranking at least 10h/day. Ok, they don't light
cigarettes anymore like people use to with the older Wellers because
smoking is no longer allowed in US businesses.

Unless it's a weld shop and the boss is a smoker. It is private property,
after all. ;-)

Cheers!
Rich

In article ,
says...

"Joerg" wrote in message
...
William Sommerwerck wrote:
I don't know which brands you're referring to, but I've owned EDSYN
(Engineering Dedicated To Suit Your Needs!) irons for 20+ years, and they
don't look anything like that.


... and wherever in the world I happened to be, there were always those
Weller stations. Antex? Never seen it, never heard of it. Strange, ain't
it?


The weller irons were once the best money could buy - then they got took
over by cooper tools, since then the bean counters reduced the thickness of
the iron plating so the bit oxidises in the barrel, "freezing" in and
impossible to remove without damaging the element.

Years ago I bought a new weller - the stat lasted nearly 2 weeks before
welding closed, they sent me a replacement FOC which lasted nearly a month
before also welding closed - unfortunately I was away from my bench at the
time and it burned out the element, I've been using Antex irons ever since,
they usually last at least 5 years as long as the bit is replaced at the
proper interval and I can buy at least a 30 year supply of Antex irons for
just the weller (not including transformer base) iron.

I'd only use weller again if it was free (and I was allowed to keep an Antex
on standby for when the weller packs up).

I've got this one. Works perfectly - the only issue I've run into is
having to know the melting point temps. Other than that I love it.

http://www.mpja.com/productsdirect.a...79&item1=15860
+TL&item2=15845+TL&item3=15140+TL&item4=15141+TL

On 20 Apr 21:08, Allus Smith wrote:

On 21 Apr 01:08, William Sommerwerck wrote:

All this talk about soldering irons makes me think how crummy
too much American industrial design is.

Some US industrial design looks great but some looks
downright, well, Russian.

Sure you can see crap-looking design in western Europe too
but there's a lot less of it than in the US.

Take soldering irons for example. An ordinary soldering iron
in the US with unregulated temperature still has great big
mofo screws holding the tip.

By comparison, my 30 year old British-made basic Antex is a
sleek looking baby and those Antexes are not particularly
expensive.

Don't start me on the looks of cars!


I don't know which brands you're referring to, but I've owned
EDSYN (Engineering Dedicated To Suit Your Needs!) irons for
20+ years, and they don't look anything like that.


EDSYN are lovely irons but none of them list for under $100 and
I believe they all have temperature regulation.

Apologies if I wasn't clear but EDSYN wasn't what I had in mind
when I said "An ordinary soldering iron in the US with
unregulated temperature". I mean the cheaper end of the market
but not as cheap the rock-bottom $5 irons!

http://www.edsyn.com/index.php?Mode=SolderingStations

Allus Smith wrote:
On 20 Apr 21:08, Allus Smith wrote:

On 21 Apr 01:08, William Sommerwerck wrote:
All this talk about soldering irons makes me think how crummy
too much American industrial design is.

Some US industrial design looks great but some looks
downright, well, Russian.

Sure you can see crap-looking design in western Europe too
but there's a lot less of it than in the US.

Take soldering irons for example. An ordinary soldering iron
in the US with unregulated temperature still has great big
mofo screws holding the tip.

By comparison, my 30 year old British-made basic Antex is a
sleek looking baby and those Antexes are not particularly
expensive.

Don't start me on the looks of cars!

I don't know which brands you're referring to, but I've owned
EDSYN (Engineering Dedicated To Suit Your Needs!) irons for
20+ years, and they don't look anything like that.


EDSYN are lovely irons but none of them list for under $100 and
I believe they all have temperature regulation.


Ahm, what? See below.


Apologies if I wasn't clear but EDSYN wasn't what I had in mind
when I said "An ordinary soldering iron in the US with
unregulated temperature". I mean the cheaper end of the market
but not as cheap the rock-bottom $5 irons!

http://www.edsyn.com/index.php?Mode=SolderingStations


Tell me, where's that ugly side-screw on this one?

http://www.edsyn.com/index.php?Mode=piw&pn=CL1481

Regarding your comment above, last time I checked $54.86 was still less
than $100 ...

Oh, and no temperature regulation :-)

--
Regards, Joerg

http://www.analogconsultants.com/

"gmail" domain blocked because of excessive spam.
Use another domain or send PM.

On 21 Apr 01:45, Joerg wrote:

Allus Smith wrote:
On 20 Apr 21:08, Allus Smith wrote:

On 21 Apr 01:08, William Sommerwerck wrote:
All this talk about soldering irons makes me think how
crummy too much American industrial design is.

Some US industrial design looks great but some looks
downright, well, Russian.

Sure you can see crap-looking design in western Europe too
but there's a lot less of it than in the US.

Take soldering irons for example. An ordinary soldering
iron in the US with unregulated temperature still has great
big mofo screws holding the tip.

By comparison, my 30 year old British-made basic Antex is a
sleek looking baby and those Antexes are not particularly
expensive.

Don't start me on the looks of cars!

I don't know which brands you're referring to, but I've
owned EDSYN (Engineering Dedicated To Suit Your Needs!)
irons for 20+ years, and they don't look anything like that.


EDSYN are lovely irons but none of them list for under $100
and I believe they all have temperature regulation.


Ahm, what? See below.


Apologies if I wasn't clear but EDSYN wasn't what I had in
mind when I said "An ordinary soldering iron in the US with
unregulated temperature". I mean the cheaper end of the
market but not as cheap the rock-bottom $5 irons!

http://www.edsyn.com/index.php?Mode=SolderingStations


Tell me, where's that ugly side-screw on this one?

http://www.edsyn.com/index.php?Mode=piw&pn=CL1481

Regarding your comment above, last time I checked $54.86 was
still less than $100 ...

Oh, and no temperature regulation :-)


Good point Joerg. I missed that one in the online catalogue.

You may be misunderstanding me if you think I said ALL basic
American soldering irons look Russian. I meant to say there was a
lot more of this sort of poor design in the US than in western
Europe. A single item doesn't really prove or disprove it.

However. as you kindly drew my attention to EDSYN then I show
illustrate the Antexes I mentioned.

http://www.antex.co.uk/prodtype.asp?CAT_ID=180
&strPageHistory=category

Consumer goods are cheaper in the US, so the usual $1 = £1 is
probably a good indicator of the sort of price level these irons
are at. It's the sub $20 market (including tax).

Allus Smith wrote:
On 21 Apr 01:45, Joerg wrote:

Allus Smith wrote:
On 20 Apr 21:08, Allus Smith wrote:
On 21 Apr 01:08, William Sommerwerck wrote:
All this talk about soldering irons makes me think how
crummy too much American industrial design is.

Some US industrial design looks great but some looks
downright, well, Russian.

Sure you can see crap-looking design in western Europe too
but there's a lot less of it than in the US.

Take soldering irons for example. An ordinary soldering
iron in the US with unregulated temperature still has great
big mofo screws holding the tip.

By comparison, my 30 year old British-made basic Antex is a
sleek looking baby and those Antexes are not particularly
expensive.

Don't start me on the looks of cars!

I don't know which brands you're referring to, but I've
owned EDSYN (Engineering Dedicated To Suit Your Needs!)
irons for 20+ years, and they don't look anything like that.

EDSYN are lovely irons but none of them list for under $100
and I believe they all have temperature regulation.

Ahm, what? See below.


Apologies if I wasn't clear but EDSYN wasn't what I had in
mind when I said "An ordinary soldering iron in the US with
unregulated temperature". I mean the cheaper end of the
market but not as cheap the rock-bottom $5 irons!

http://www.edsyn.com/index.php?Mode=SolderingStations

Tell me, where's that ugly side-screw on this one?

http://www.edsyn.com/index.php?Mode=piw&pn=CL1481

Regarding your comment above, last time I checked $54.86 was
still less than $100 ...

Oh, and no temperature regulation :-)


Good point Joerg. I missed that one in the online catalogue.

You may be misunderstanding me if you think I said ALL basic
American soldering irons look Russian. I meant to say there was a
lot more of this sort of poor design in the US than in western
Europe. A single item doesn't really prove or disprove it.


Well, there are tons of them that look sleek and modern. Visit a good
hardware store over here and see for yourself. Or any major Radio Shack.


However. as you kindly drew my attention to EDSYN then I show
illustrate the Antexes I mentioned.

http://www.antex.co.uk/prodtype.asp?CAT_ID=180
&strPageHistory=category

Consumer goods are cheaper in the US, so the usual $1 = £1 is
probably a good indicator of the sort of price level these irons
are at. It's the sub $20 market (including tax).


Antex may be good but they seem to have the same problem as Ersa (I
loved their irons while in Europe): International marketing may be lacking.

Well, check this one out, under $10, no side screw, the tip is threaded
and that screws in as a whole from the front (IIRC):
http://www.radioshack.com/product/in...ductId=2062737

If I'd need a simple iron I'd got for a good name brand, like this one
for $40:

http://www.radioshack.com/product/in...ductId=3348440

--
Regards, Joerg

http://www.analogconsultants.com/

"gmail" domain blocked because of excessive spam.
Use another domain or send PM.

On Tue, 21 Apr 2009 02:23:15 +0100, Allus Smith wrote:

You may be misunderstanding me if you think I said ALL basic American
soldering irons look Russian. I meant to say there was a lot more of this
sort of poor design in the US than in western Europe. A single item
doesn't really prove or disprove it.

Now, you ARE trolling.

See ya!
Rich

Allus Smith wrote:

On 20 Apr 21:08, Allus Smith wrote:

On 21 Apr 01:08, William Sommerwerck wrote:

All this talk about soldering irons makes me think how crummy
too much American industrial design is.

Some US industrial design looks great but some looks
downright, well, Russian.

Sure you can see crap-looking design in western Europe too
but there's a lot less of it than in the US.

Take soldering irons for example. An ordinary soldering iron
in the US with unregulated temperature still has great big
mofo screws holding the tip.

By comparison, my 30 year old British-made basic Antex is a
sleek looking baby and those Antexes are not particularly
expensive.

Don't start me on the looks of cars!


I don't know which brands you're referring to, but I've owned
EDSYN (Engineering Dedicated To Suit Your Needs!) irons for
20+ years, and they don't look anything like that.


EDSYN are lovely irons but none of them list for under $100 and
I believe they all have temperature regulation.

Apologies if I wasn't clear but EDSYN wasn't what I had in mind
when I said "An ordinary soldering iron in the US with
unregulated temperature". I mean the cheaper end of the market
but not as cheap the rock-bottom $5 irons!


How about the Weller irons like the SP23? I have owned one or more at
a time from the early '70s. The tip is threaded into the heating
element and it retails for under $20. I bought a new one last year
after the threads finally corroded out of the element after 35 years of
use. I only use the non regulated irons to make cables, or for antique
electronics. For modern ESD sensitive equipment I used the Edsyn Loner
series and had three irons on my bench, one with a .015" tip in a
reducing collet.

I also have the 175 watt version that does use a set screw to hold the
tip.

25 watt:
http://www.cooperhandtools.com/brands/CF_Files/model_detail.cfm?upc=037103169228
175 watt:
http://www.cooperhandtools.com/brands/CF_Files/model_detail.cfm?upc=037103474674

--
You can't have a sense of humor, if you have no sense!

On Mon, 20 Apr 2009 21:08:32 +0100, Allus Smith wrote:

Take soldering irons for example. An ordinary soldering iron in the US
with unregulated temperature still has great big mofo screws holding the
tip.

Lol, idiot yank doesn't realise that "Made in the USA" really means
assembled in the USA by illegal immigrant workers.

Welcome to the third work, Yank.

terryc wrote:

On Mon, 20 Apr 2009 21:08:32 +0100, Allus Smith wrote:

Take soldering irons for example. An ordinary soldering iron in the US
with unregulated temperature still has great big mofo screws holding the
tip.

Lol, idiot yank doesn't realise that "Made in the USA" really means
assembled in the USA by illegal immigrant workers.


Didn't you hear? A lot of them are out of work and driving
overloaded old pieces of junk back to mexico, loaded down with
everything they can haul.

Welcome to the third work, Yank.


You should talk. You Aussies bred and raised Phil Allison.


--
You can't have a sense of humor, if you have no sense!

On Mon, 20 Apr 2009 20:56:34 -0400, "Michael A. Terrell"
wrote:


You should talk. You Aussies INbred and MISraised Phil Allison.


IFYPFY, idiot.