On Mon, 20 May 2013 21:25:28 -0700, Bob Penoyer
wrote:

On Mon, 20 May 2013 17:24:40 -0400, rickman wrote:

[snip snarky rickman BS]

I've followed this thread for a while and I'm struck by your strident
support for teachers and teaching.

You seem to suggest that we mere mortals can't understand teaching
despite being educated in grade school, high school, college, and
graduate school. And, despite having children and grandchildren go
through the same process.

Consider these facts about teaching and teachers:

* As a group, teaching majors have the lowest SAT scores

As per the old saw, "Those that can, DO; those that can't, TEACH"


* Schools of education are regarded as the dregs of universities'
schools

Absolutely!


* If it required special training to teach, why is it that a
5-year-old can teach a 3-year-old how to do something?

* University professors--people who teach--aren't required to have
teacher training or teaching credentials

* Teaching majors learn such things as teaching methods, teaching
tools, etc. The one thing they don't learn--specifically, elementary
school teachers--is something to teach; they are no better educated in
basic subjects than they were when they left high school.

When I was in elementary school, several teachers told our classes,
for example, that "I was never very good at math," or "I was never
very good at spelling." But they taught those subjects nevertheless.

Public schools are worse now than they were 50 years ago, and they
continue to get worse.

When I was in grade school, we had smart kids and we had dumb kids,
but ALL could read. That's not true today, even for high school kids.

Your vaunted teachers have failed us. Jim Thompson's examples of how
his granddaughter was given a problem for which she was not equipped,
and the teacher jumping into simultaneous equations with no prior
preparation in single-variable algebra are only two examples. The
examples of misguided teachers and teaching methods are endless.

Indeed! Even worse, the system seems designed to destroy the family
unit and place that authority in the hands of the government. Observe
how many holidays and traditions have been effectively killed by the
"education" system. If your kid says "Christmas" in school he's
likely to be suspended. And the kids can't even celebrate Halloween.

Rickman labels me "Larkinesque". What a laugh!

Rickman is the one that is "Larkinesque", because he meets the full
specification:

Head fully up butt. Head turned 90-degrees to lock it in place.

Unfortunately I'd also guess that Rickman _is_ a teacher :-(

...Jim Thompson
--
| James E.Thompson | mens |
| Analog Innovations | et |
| Analog/Mixed-Signal ASIC's and Discrete Systems | manus |
| Phoenix, Arizona 85048 Skype: Contacts Only | |
| Voice480)460-2350 Fax: Available upon request | Brass Rat |
| E-mail Icon at http://www.analog-innovations.com | 1962 |

I love to cook with wine. Sometimes I even put it in the food.

On Tue, 21 May 2013 07:16:36 -0700, Charlie E.
wrote:

On Mon, 20 May 2013 21:25:28 -0700, Bob Penoyer
wrote:
snip
Your vaunted teachers have failed us. Jim Thompson's examples of how
his granddaughter was given a problem for which she was not equipped,
and the teacher jumping into simultaneous equations with no prior
preparation in single-variable algebra are only two examples. The
examples of misguided teachers and teaching methods are endless.

Exactly! It was on the 'approved' syllabus, so that is how it MUST be
taught! Since the teacher doesn' really know what it means, anyway,
it must be right!

Or, she could be the opposite problem, the teacher is a wiz at math,
who just 'does' it, and never really thought about the process
involved. I had one teacher in grad school like that. For him, it
was just obvious and he couldn't understand that his explanation made
absolutely non sense!

Charlie

Even had one of those at M.I.T., Gordon Brown... couldn't teach for
****. Fortunately this was by the time I had been admitted to Honors
EE, so there were only six of us in the class, so we all marched in
unison to the Dean's office and had Brown replaced by Paul Penfield...
only a grad student at the time, but a real winner!

...Jim Thompson
--
| James E.Thompson | mens |
| Analog Innovations | et |
| Analog/Mixed-Signal ASIC's and Discrete Systems | manus |
| Phoenix, Arizona 85048 Skype: Contacts Only | |
| Voice480)460-2350 Fax: Available upon request | Brass Rat |
| E-mail Icon at http://www.analog-innovations.com | 1962 |

I love to cook with wine. Sometimes I even put it in the food.

On 21/05/2013 15:20, Jim Thompson wrote:
On Tue, 21 May 2013 10:26:26 +0100, Martin Brown
wrote:

Martin Brown wrote:

given a^2 + b^2 = c^2 where a,b,c are integers


I am actually not going to post the answer here and would ask that
anyone who does work it out do likewise. It is obvious once you see it.

[snip]

But it falls into my category of "trick" questions. I finally figured
it out, but I frown on using such gimmicky problems with students.

...Jim Thompson

I disagree. That one isn't a trick question at all. It is difficult to
find the solution under pressure in an interview but how someone goes
about trying is very informative as to their capabilities. You really
either see it pretty much instantly or you don't without playing around.

Anyone who could be a top grade mathematician is reckoned to get it.

If you want a trick question what is the next number in the series:

10, 11, 12, 13, 14, 20, 22, 31, ?

Unhelpful hint - it isn't 42.

--
Regards,
Martin Brown

"Jim Thompson" wrote in message
...

I'm fighting the school system with, now, the 5th granddaughter, 6th
Grade.

Last week they were peddling how to cut corners out of a piece of
cardboard to form a box with the maximum volume, with no established
skill set.... "guess" your way to the solution :-(

This week they suddenly jumped to Algebra, simultaneous equations,
without even any single variable background.

And she says her teacher is already using the word "Calculus". I
guess that's the leftist way anymore, speaking the words makes you
expert :-(

No wonder US students rank so low, worldwide, in math (and science).

Fortunately the school year is almost over, and she'll be with us for
a month in July.

So my question...

Can anyone recommend an available Algebra book that instructs in the
old fashioned sequential way... lots of one variable word problems
first, then go on to more advanced topics?

I'll become teacher of the month ;-)

(I taught math back in 1964-65 to disadvantaged youth (aka "thugs")
from South Phoenix with a very high success rate :-)

...Jim Thompson
--
| James E.Thompson | mens |
| Analog Innovations | et |
| Analog/Mixed-Signal ASIC's and Discrete Systems | manus |
| Phoenix, Arizona 85048 Skype: Contacts Only | |
| Voice480)460-2350 Fax: Available upon request | Brass Rat |
| E-mail Icon at http://www.analog-innovations.com | 1962 |

I love to cook with wine. Sometimes I even put it in the food.

To solve a problem with more than two variables, or even with two variable
equations is easier with simultaneous equations. Once you learn how to do
it, you can solve problems that you could not before. You can also use a
matrix which simplifies solving the problem. I learned them in 1990 and
into college too.

On Tue, 21 May 2013 22:33:22 -0500, "Mike Kaddaver"
wrote:



"Jim Thompson" wrote in message
.. .

I'm fighting the school system with, now, the 5th granddaughter, 6th
Grade.

Last week they were peddling how to cut corners out of a piece of
cardboard to form a box with the maximum volume, with no established
skill set.... "guess" your way to the solution :-(

This week they suddenly jumped to Algebra, simultaneous equations,
without even any single variable background.

And she says her teacher is already using the word "Calculus". I
guess that's the leftist way anymore, speaking the words makes you
expert :-(

No wonder US students rank so low, worldwide, in math (and science).

Fortunately the school year is almost over, and she'll be with us for
a month in July.

So my question...

Can anyone recommend an available Algebra book that instructs in the
old fashioned sequential way... lots of one variable word problems
first, then go on to more advanced topics?

I'll become teacher of the month ;-)

(I taught math back in 1964-65 to disadvantaged youth (aka "thugs")
from South Phoenix with a very high success rate :-)

...Jim Thompson

Of course. The debate is not about HOW to solve such a problem but
whether such a problem belongs in 6th grade. There are numerous ways
to solve it... none of which comes from the typical skill set of a 6th
grader.

...Jim Thompson
--
| James E.Thompson | mens |
| Analog Innovations | et |
| Analog/Mixed-Signal ASIC's and Discrete Systems | manus |
| Phoenix, Arizona 85048 Skype: Contacts Only | |
| Voice480)460-2350 Fax: Available upon request | Brass Rat |
| E-mail Icon at http://www.analog-innovations.com | 1962 |

I love to cook with wine. Sometimes I even put it in the food.

$1 for pushing the lever, $49 for knowing which lever to push, BTDT
:-}


Exactly