writes:

I'm w/ Chuck on this one...the generation which survived the Depression
has a whole different understanding of "need" than current ones. I, for
one, am grateful that my grandfather did keep so much -- now, while
some of it is, in fact, not valuable, other things are fond
remembrances. Plus, all the old lumber salvaged from the old chicken
coop or other places and stored in the haymow for 60 years or more came
in extremely handy in the barn restoration. Not easy to find
full-dimension 2x stuff anymore...

You are so lucky to have things of your grandfather's. When my
grandmother moved out of their home years after my grandfather died, my
youngest half-sister sister took everything. That, in itself, wasn't so
bad, but when she divorced her first husband, he took most of it. When
her second husband divorced her, he took the rest. Now the real irony . .
.. she has two daughters, I have three sons. Seems to me the
great-grandsons would have more use for his tools than
great-granddaughters (especially the ones in question). Oh, well.

My solution is to watch for estate sales and pick up what I can. My
greatest finds of this past year are an old saw with a carved handle which
appears to have the original blade ($5) and a pair of ice tongs ($16).
The ice tongs will become a towel holder on my patio. The saw has been
used but mostly admired. :-)

Sadly, since I live in town, there aren't that many good estate sales;
most don't have tools of any substance.

Glenna

take.out.'takeout'.to.reply writes:

I can remember when IBM maintained no one would ever need a hard drive
larger than 10Meg.

Gee, my first computer was state-of-the-art with dual disk drives. LOL
And very, very expensive compared to today's.

Two years later, when I bought the 10MB hard drive and could run more than
one program at once, I thought it was heaven!

Now my first flash drive holds 256 MB; the external hard drive . . . won't
even go there as I do video work where 5 minutes of raw video uses 1 GB of
space. Back in 1982 and 1983, we "home users" could not even begin to
imagine a hard drive of more than 800 GB, and that being small. LOL

How time flies, and technology moves forward.

Glenna
loving Panther!

writes:

I still have my 1980 vintage notch cutter for turning single sided
floppies into
double sided.
I also have a box of 5 8" floppies with the original price still on the
box.
$99.95.

It does seem odd now, doesn't it? $20 bucks a disk.

I wish there were someplace for me to sell the 8-inch floppies I have
here, a full box of them, and I'm talking storage box, probably 100+ disks
in it. I'll likely wind up cutting them in half and dumping them (they
have data from another secretarial service bureau obtained in a sale from
her to me). It'd be great to be able to wipe the disks and sell them, or
even give them away. I'm a horrible recycler and don't like tossing
things that can be used, especially if they fall under serious pollutant
standards.

Of course I have hundreds of 5-1/4s from my own business and many, many
dozens of 3-1/2s. Now, it's stacks of CDs. How times change.g

Glenna
starting on DVDs for storage now

Glenna Rose wrote:

Of course I have hundreds of 5-1/4s from my own business and many, many
dozens of 3-1/2s. Now, it's stacks of CDs. How times change.g

starting on DVDs for storage now

I'm still holding out for those little 1" lucite cubes that are supposed to
hold 50 TB of data. Why aren't they here yet?

--
Michael McIntyre ---- Silvan
Linux fanatic, and certified Geek; registered Linux user #243621
http://www.geocities.com/Paris/Rue/5407/
http://rosegarden.sourceforge.net/tutorial/

In article fc.003d094101e005bd3b9aca00bf64f286.1e005d1@pmug. org,
(Glenna Rose) wrote:

How time flies, and technology moves forward.

Glenna
loving Panther!

I still recall driving from Windsor ON to Buffalo NY to look at a hard
drive. Hooked up to a Mac Plus, the thing came to life and plopped
itself on the desktop, the room gasped. I put my $795.00US down and
bought one on the spot. I waited for 3 weeks to get it. It was heaven.
..
..
..
..
..
5 MB

I still have my first 128K Mac. WITH extra floppy drive.
sn 4016. I am NOT going to say what I paid for that (new) should my ex
ever read this and explain why she didn't get that swimming-pool that
year....(Wringing hands with glee) Yessir.. 128K of whopping RAM (more
in my watch now)

I'm happy with Panther also, but with my wife's XPpro on a big Dell...
not enough of a difference to matter. The biggest reason why my Mac is
still my #1 box, is that all my Filemaker RDBMS stuff and CAD docs are
accessed every day. But the days of having the best computer by miles
are gone. So I hung my smug face up next to my Fender Telecaster.

This coming April, this box (G3 B&W) will have been on and running for 4
years without a single crash... and I make it jump through hoops.
It went down with a couple of power failures (One big one a cpl of
summers back) but it righted itself right after the power came back on.
Not a virus or a worm...dead solid, flawless performance.

And as far as the wife's XPpro box at work is concerned? They have an IT
department that keeps the hospital humming. All is well.

*whispers* (psssst... she finishes her presentations off at home, MS
Powerpoint, on her Mac G-4 Powerbook.... and don't tell anybody, but
Bill Gates' 'Residential Compound' was designed on Macs...fact.)
Hell, if Mary Matlin and James Carville can live together, I can have a
PC and a Mac in my house, right?

Okay.. tea is ready...*poof*

On Wed, 05 Jan 2005 23:57:45 -0800, (Glenna Rose) wrote:

writes:

I still have my 1980 vintage notch cutter for turning single sided
floppies into
double sided.
I also have a box of 5 8" floppies with the original price still on the
box.
$99.95.

It does seem odd now, doesn't it? $20 bucks a disk.

Remember the plastic boxes for holding .5.25 floppies. A crappy plastic box with
a flip up lid $30.
I was making them out of oak with roll tops and selling them for just a bit more
to friends in the computer club.
I still have my pine prototype roll top and use it everyday.
The roll top was made with a chunk of my wife's old blue jeans and 1/8 paneling.
It was one of my first ever wood working projects.
I'll post a picture in the binary group so youse can all have a good laugh.

Do I get a prize for bringing the thread back on topic.g

I wish there were someplace for me to sell the 8-inch floppies I have
here, a full box of them, and I'm talking storage box, probably 100+ disks
in it. I'll likely wind up cutting them in half and dumping them (they
have data from another secretarial service bureau obtained in a sale from
her to me). It'd be great to be able to wipe the disks and sell them, or
even give them away. I'm a horrible recycler and don't like tossing
things that can be used, especially if they fall under serious pollutant
standards.

Me neither
I probably have every floppy I ever made from the early 80s.

Of course I have hundreds of 5-1/4s from my own business and many, many
dozens of 3-1/2s. Now, it's stacks of CDs. How times change.g

I have roughly 5000 burned DVD/CDs.g

Glenna
starting on DVDs for storage now

I'm way a head of you. It's that or get buried.

On Wed, 05 Jan 2005 23:57:45 -0800, Glenna Rose wrote:
writes:

I still have my 1980 vintage notch cutter for turning single sided
floppies into
double sided.
I also have a box of 5 8" floppies with the original price still on the
box.
$99.95.

It does seem odd now, doesn't it? $20 bucks a disk.

I wish there were someplace for me to sell the 8-inch floppies I have
here, a full box of them, and I'm talking storage box, probably 100+ disks
in it.

There's a company online that sells "obsolete media". Google for them,
they might be interested in giving you more than nothing for them. If you
can't find the link, let me know and I'll find it.

I'm a horrible recycler and don't like tossing
things that can be used, especially if they fall under serious pollutant
standards.

Well, they're mylar and iron oxide, so it's not like they're all _that_
nasty, but of course, I understand.

writes:

I still recall driving from Windsor ON to Buffalo NY to look at a hard
drive. Hooked up to a Mac Plus, the thing came to life and plopped
itself on the desktop, the room gasped. I put my $795.00US down and
bought one on the spot. I waited for 3 weeks to get it. It was heaven.
.
.
.
.
.
5 MB

Seems that is in the neighborhood of what I paid for my 10-MB external
drive for my Epson QX-10 (CPM, much better than DOS, had the opportunity
to compare). Like yours, it was heaven. (1984, 85?)

I still have my first 128K Mac. WITH extra floppy drive.
sn 4016. I am NOT going to say what I paid for that (new) should my ex
ever read this and explain why she didn't get that swimming-pool that
year....(Wringing hands with glee) Yessir.. 128K of whopping RAM (more
in my watch now)

Understood. I still have both of my original QX-10 machines. But then I
also have all of the DOS and later Windows machines I bought in addition
to my Macs. I don't even want to think of how many computers are in this
house/basement/garage! Must remember, however, computers were the base of
my secretarial/bookkeeping service bureau, and I had to buy newer/better
to keep current. Now, my computers are mostly just for fun. :-) (It is
nice to choose when to buy new rather than be "forced" into it by market.)
Though what started out as fun has helped me immensely at work. No
kidding, I designed my granddaughter's bedside table on InDesign, not even
that kind of program, it's a page layout program (publishing, newspapers,
magazines). Like a hammer and saw, it all depends on the user what can be
created, inventive can result in some unusual results. Note: I *do not*
recommend using what is a intricate word processing program for furniture
design! I did it more for the challenge than for practical use; but I
don't have any type of drafting program, and it worked.g

I'm happy with Panther also, but with my wife's XPpro on a big Dell...
not enough of a difference to matter. The biggest reason why my Mac is
still my #1 box, is that all my Filemaker RDBMS stuff and CAD docs are
accessed every day. But the days of having the best computer by miles
are gone. So I hung my smug face up next to my Fender Telecaster.

LOL. Methinks the diehard Mac users have something to be satisfied with;
like any, it's how it's used that matters. I made the switch in 2000 for
iMovie because of my interest in Video. I taught DOS and Windows (all
flavors)through my business, two school districts' community ed programs,
then at Computer City at Jantzen Beach in Portland until they went
bye-bye. Now it's only an occasional Mac class at PMUG (taught one last
night) and was college dean for a year or so (that one is volunteer!)
until I went to work where I am now. I could not list all of the programs
I've taught and even fewer of all that I've used; no one would believe it
anyway. My eldest son has even more but started later than me, and hates
Windows (refers all Windows requests to other consultants). Each O/S has
its place and its champions.

What CAD programs do you use on your Mac?

This coming April, this box (G3 B&W) will have been on and running for 4
years

My G-4 (this one) has been on my desk since August 2004. On it, I've
learned iMovie (simple), FinalCut Pro, FileMaker Pro, PhotoShop, InDesign
(preceded by FrameMaker and Quark), QuickBooks, and on and on and on.g
Versatility can be both a blessing and a curse. It's like hobbies, what
takes priority, the shop, the garden, the yard, the sewing machine, what?


*whispers* (psssst... she finishes her presentations off at home, MS
Powerpoint, on her Mac G-4 Powerbook

LOL, I won't tell. I know folks that run emulators so they can use their
Macs for business-specific programs (inspectors, florists, etc.) that are
part of a corporation environment.

.... and don't tell anybody, but
Bill Gates' 'Residential Compound' was designed on Macs...fact.)
Hell, if Mary Matlin and James Carville can live together, I can have a
PC and a Mac in my house, right?

They both have their place. Both my desktop PC and Mac (OS 9 and X) are
on their respective desks and powered up most of the time. The laptop
(which has Panther installed, previously Jaguar) doesn't get as much use
since I have Panther at work. *And* I'm spoiled at work with dual
monitors!!!

Windows 3.1 for Workgroups is what I went back to on my PC as it is so
much more stable than all the others. I didn't even take 98 out of the box
and wasn't interested in the others after I explored them. It does what I
need there, *and* I have my Mac for the "fancy" stuff. :-)

All of them have served me well.


Okay.. tea is ready...*poof*

Enjoy.

BTW, are you aware of any low-end drafting type programs to be used for
simple projects for the Mac? (Middle son, P.E., is a mite busy with work,
family and church so not much time to draw for me, and I like to do stuff
myself anyway, maybe let him refine it.)

Glenna

writes:

The new ones are crap, and this one exceeded its life expectancy several
million switch cycles ago, I'm sure. I'm not sure what I'm going to do.
I
really, really, really hate the new ones. Anybody want to get rid of an
early '90s vintage Microsoft Natural Keyboard, from before they redesigned
it, when they were still made in the USA?

If I hadn't returned it, you could have mine. Everyone raved about them
so I bought one, just too entrenched in my hand/finger movements to adapt
to it and returned it after two or three weeks of trying. To this day,
everyone else I know who used one absolutely loved/loves them. My oldest
son has a really bizarre keyboard on his desktop Mac, another which I
cannot use. (Old dogs, new tricks thing, I guess.g)

Glenna

In article fc.003d094101e020d93b9aca00bf64f286.1e0216c@pmug. org,
(Glenna Rose) wrote:

BTW, are you aware of any low-end drafting type programs to be used for
simple projects for the Mac? (Middle son, P.E., is a mite busy with work,
family and church so not much time to draw for me, and I like to do stuff
myself anyway, maybe let him refine it.)

Glenna

Hello Glenna... *waves*

Microspot MacDraft PE 5.5 Quartz Edition hands down.
http://www.microspot.com/products/macdraftPE.htm

You'll find the environment instantly familiar from the MacDraw days.
(MacPaint even..lol)
Microspot has never taken the eye off the ball when it came to CAD on
the Mac. US$ 116.00 that's for the download version. For the same price,
Microspot Interiors for OSX is a lot of fun. Download a demo?

I use Vectorworks 10 by Nemetschek.
http://www.nemetschek.net/

I have been with them since it was designed for a mini computer (You
know, the ones the size of a washer dryer) and called MiniCAD. I still
have the MiniCAD 1 manuals. *S*

When loyal MiniCAD users were constantly complaining that the name
MiniCAD gave the wrong impression of its capabilities, they finally
broke down when OS X was on the horizon and called it Vectoworks.

Daniel Libeskind won the World Trade Center Design Study competition in
New York City..The Freedom Tower.. another happy Vectorworks user. *VBS*

It's everything anybody could want in a CAD program. AutoCAD has nothing
better to offer (for me) and I say this with confidence, because I took
AutoCAD for 3 years at the local college and have my 3D-modelling
diploma from them. I did that because most industry around here is all
AutoCAD.

Vectorworks supports .dwg file formats flawlessly, it is not an issue.
VectorWorks is my program of choice because of its versatility and
comprehensiveness. Another important factor is that it has been around
for a long time with a refined interface and good support. It is also a
lot of bang for the buck..... even though it is US 1345.00.. that is
with Renderworks included.
( I have a LOT more invested if you add up about 10 major upgrades over
the last 15 years... hence.. the Mac.
Vectorworks is available for Windows, and people are happy with that.

I am hearing a lot about SketchUp for Mac OSX. I have a demo of it, but
I have yet to take the time to look at it. That's under US$ 500.00

...****...look at the time....

gone

Rob

In article fc.003d094101e022163b9aca0020b2cc83.1e02227@pmug. org,
(Glenna Rose) wrote:

writes:

The new ones are crap, and this one exceeded its life expectancy several
million switch cycles ago, I'm sure. I'm not sure what I'm going to do.
I
really, really, really hate the new ones. Anybody want to get rid of an
early '90s vintage Microsoft Natural Keyboard, from before they redesigned
it, when they were still made in the USA?

If I hadn't returned it, you could have mine. Everyone raved about them
so I bought one, just too entrenched in my hand/finger movements to adapt
to it and returned it after two or three weeks of trying. To this day,
everyone else I know who used one absolutely loved/loves them. My oldest
son has a really bizarre keyboard on his desktop Mac, another which I
cannot use. (Old dogs, new tricks thing, I guess.g)

WOOF!

Glenna Rose wrote:

to it and returned it after two or three weeks of trying. To this day,
everyone else I know who used one absolutely loved/loves them. My oldest

I can't stand a regular keyboard for long. My wrists start hurting almost
immediately from the awkward angle. One reason I've never considered
buying a laptop.

son has a really bizarre keyboard on his desktop Mac, another which I
cannot use. (Old dogs, new tricks thing, I guess.g)

A Kensington by chance? I think that was the name. I used to have my eye
on this really weird keyboard that was two dish-shaped pads. All the keys
equidistant from your fingers, and you could put the pads some considerable
distance apart. I looked at it in magazines. It was extremely expensive.
Then the Natural came out shortly thereafter. It's close enough. About
the only good idea Microsoft ever had. Unless they ripped off this idea
too.

--
Michael McIntyre ---- Silvan
Linux fanatic, and certified Geek; registered Linux user #243621
http://www.geocities.com/Paris/Rue/5407/
http://rosegarden.sourceforge.net/tutorial/

Silvan wrote:

Then the Natural came out shortly
thereafter. It's close enough. About the only good idea Microsoft
ever had. Unless they ripped off this idea too.

IIRC the idea had been around for years. MS, with their name, made it
successful.

-- Mark