On Friday, June 2, 2000 2:00:00 AM UTC-5, Bob Sosenko wrote:
Just thought I'd pass this along to those that have been having difficulty
in aligning the blade parallel to the miter slot on these particular
contractor saws. They may also apply to other Delta series saws as long as
they have two tie-bars as part of the undercarriage.

I installed a new blade the other night and checked alignment using my TS
Aligner Jr. and found that it was off by nearly 5 thousandths (front to
rear - using same tooth on blade as ref). Decided to align and while doing
so, managed to snap a trunnion bolt !

Well, the saw was due for a good cleaning and lube anyway, so I pulled out
the whole undercarriage mechanism. It was a fairly simple process actually
and not nearly as difficult as I was anticipating. Luckily, the bolt I
snapped was left with a few threads exposed and was easily removed. There
is no printed spec for these bolts in their literature so I called Delta
tech support and finally got connected with a very knowledgeable and helpful
individual (Ron as I recall).

He said a grade 5 bolt (same size) will do - but add lock washers to each of
the four trunnion bolts as long as I have it apart. These will help
maintain the alignment. There also is no spec for how tight these bolts
should be but "good 'n snug and not over-tightened" is all that's needed he
said. The trunnion bolts are not marked with a grade number and using a
grade 5 means that I probably will never be able to snap the bolt again, it
will most likely strip out the threads in the base before it breaks. So a
word of caution - tight enough is one turn before it strips or snaps -
wherever that is !

Considering that I was using a 6" long 1/2" box wrench and was not leaning
on it when it snapped, the original bolts are definitely not grade 5.

Now for the interesting part. Delta faxed me a two sheet procedure that
describes how to do this alignment. It's called "Blade Alignment
Instructions for Original Contractors-Type Saws (when the saw has two
Tie-Bars)". Pages are marked CS07 and CS07a and are not in the manual. I've
included the instructions below but since binaries are not appreciated in
this ng, I didn't scan the diagram.

Here's the procedure (minus diagram) as faxed to me: (unplug the saw first)

I've added a note or two to help which are denoted by (My note....).

.......................................Delta
Procedures........................................ .............

Initial Measurement:

1. Raise the sawblade to it's maximum height and mark one tooth, at the
front of the blade as a reference.
2. Using a combination square, measure from the left edge of the right-hand
miter gauge slot to the sawblade tooth that was marked in step 1 (Note this
measurement). Then rotate the blade to the rear and measure from the same
marked tooth to the miter slot. (Note this measurement).

IF the two measurements are NOT the same, proceed with step 3.

Note: refer to parts diagram on the following page for part locations.

(My note...this is the step I never knew had to be done, nor have I ever
heard anyone mention it before.)

3. Remove the sawblade. (Remember, it is still at it's maximum height)
4. Place a flat plate (or similar flat object) on top of the two tie-bars..
(The size of the plate should be at least 6" by 8", and the flatter the
better). Depress one corner of the plate and if it rocks, the tie-bars are
not parallel. This must be corrected as it will affect the alignment of the
blade.

To make the Tie-Bars parallel:
5. Loosen the tie-bar locknuts (2ea. ref #245) located at the rear of the
saw.
6. Grasp the motor bracket (ref #244) and move it left and/or right. Check
the rocking of the flat plate and when it can no longer rock, the tie-bars
are parallel...re-tighten the locknuts.

Aligning the saw undercarriage:
7. Remove the flat plate and re-install the sawblade.
8. Loosen the front trunnion bolts (2ea. ref #207) and the rear trunnion
bolts (2ea. ref #243).
9. Move the entire undercarriage around while measuring as in step 2.
10. When the two measurements are the same, re-tighten the front two
trunnion bolts (ref #207).
11. Before tightening the rear trunnion bolts, push forward on the rear
trunnion bracket to allow the undercarriage to snugly fit between the two
trunnions.
12. Re-check the blade to miter slot measurement and if they are still
equal, re-tighten the rear trunnion bolts (ref #243).
13. If the blade to miter slot measurements have changed, repeat steps 8
thru 12.

.........................................End of Delta
Procedures........................................ ....

Without a diagram to look at this may be confusing but I suspect most of us
never thought about the tie-bar alignment steps 5 & 6. If these are not
parallel to each other then you can tap / hammer / move / and swear at it
until the cows come home and it will never align correctly. Move the blade
(up / down) then recheck alignment and you will find that you're out of
alignment again ! You must keep the trunnion brackets tight to the rest of
the mechanism.

I'm off to find some grade 5 bolts, lockwashers and a flat plate (glass
maybe if I can't find a steel plate of some sort). I'll be reassembling and
aligning tonight. If I find a better or easier way, I'll make a follow-up
post and let you know what I did.

If you try to contact Delta tech support, (800) 438-2486 you'll most likely
get a busy signal like I did for two days. Finally contacted HQ at (901)
668-8600 and they paged tech support for me and he was on the line in less
than a minute. Course I was nice to the sweet young thing that answered the
call, told her I'd been trying for two days and could she help - sure 'nuff
!

I'll ding Delta for not including these procedures in the manual or at least
posting them on their web site but tech support (Ron) was very helpful and
friendly. He also gave me a few tips on how to adjust the blade height
(worm-gear) mechanism since mine is a bit to tight when raising/lowering the
blade.

The worm-gear is pinned to a shaft that goes thru another guide-shaft that
has an off-center hole bored thru it. By loosening the nut near the
worm-gear end, the shaft (with the off-center bore) can be rotated which
adjusts the gear meshing clearance between the worm-gear and the gear-height
mechanism. Confusing explanation but when you look at the mechanism, it
will be clear to you.

Hope all the above is useful to someone and provides a better explanation on
why we're having problems when making the blade to miter slot adjustment.

Bob S.

Thanks for posting Bob. I really appreciate it. I had an issue after a couple of 45 cuts and could not get the blade back in alignment. The back of the blade was closer to the fence than the front and all the trunion adjustments would not get it back in line. Finally found your post and found out the tie-bars came out of parallel. After following your post, it all as right as rain!

Thanks!

Tom

On 10/6/2013 8:44 PM, wrote:
On Friday, June 2, 2000 2:00:00 AM UTC-5, Bob Sosenko wrote:
Just thought I'd pass this along to those that have been having difficulty
in aligning the blade parallel to the miter slot on these particular
contractor saws. They may also apply to other Delta series saws as long as
they have two tie-bars as part of the undercarriage.

I installed a new blade the other night and checked alignment using my TS
Aligner Jr. and found that it was off by nearly 5 thousandths (front to
rear - using same tooth on blade as ref). Decided to align and while doing
so, managed to snap a trunnion bolt !

Well, the saw was due for a good cleaning and lube anyway, so I pulled out
the whole undercarriage mechanism. It was a fairly simple process actually
and not nearly as difficult as I was anticipating. Luckily, the bolt I
snapped was left with a few threads exposed and was easily removed. There
is no printed spec for these bolts in their literature so I called Delta
tech support and finally got connected with a very knowledgeable and helpful
individual (Ron as I recall).

He said a grade 5 bolt (same size) will do - but add lock washers to each of
the four trunnion bolts as long as I have it apart. These will help
maintain the alignment. There also is no spec for how tight these bolts
should be but "good 'n snug and not over-tightened" is all that's needed he
said. The trunnion bolts are not marked with a grade number and using a
grade 5 means that I probably will never be able to snap the bolt again, it
will most likely strip out the threads in the base before it breaks. So a
word of caution - tight enough is one turn before it strips or snaps -
wherever that is !

Considering that I was using a 6" long 1/2" box wrench and was not leaning
on it when it snapped, the original bolts are definitely not grade 5.

Now for the interesting part. Delta faxed me a two sheet procedure that
describes how to do this alignment. It's called "Blade Alignment
Instructions for Original Contractors-Type Saws (when the saw has two
Tie-Bars)". Pages are marked CS07 and CS07a and are not in the manual. I've
included the instructions below but since binaries are not appreciated in
this ng, I didn't scan the diagram.

Here's the procedure (minus diagram) as faxed to me: (unplug the saw first)

I've added a note or two to help which are denoted by (My note....).

.......................................Delta
Procedures........................................ .............

Initial Measurement:

1. Raise the sawblade to it's maximum height and mark one tooth, at the
front of the blade as a reference.
2. Using a combination square, measure from the left edge of the right-hand
miter gauge slot to the sawblade tooth that was marked in step 1 (Note this
measurement). Then rotate the blade to the rear and measure from the same
marked tooth to the miter slot. (Note this measurement).

IF the two measurements are NOT the same, proceed with step 3.

Note: refer to parts diagram on the following page for part locations.

(My note...this is the step I never knew had to be done, nor have I ever
heard anyone mention it before.)

3. Remove the sawblade. (Remember, it is still at it's maximum height)
4. Place a flat plate (or similar flat object) on top of the two tie-bars.
(The size of the plate should be at least 6" by 8", and the flatter the
better). Depress one corner of the plate and if it rocks, the tie-bars are
not parallel. This must be corrected as it will affect the alignment of the
blade.

To make the Tie-Bars parallel:
5. Loosen the tie-bar locknuts (2ea. ref #245) located at the rear of the
saw.
6. Grasp the motor bracket (ref #244) and move it left and/or right. Check
the rocking of the flat plate and when it can no longer rock, the tie-bars
are parallel...re-tighten the locknuts.

Aligning the saw undercarriage:
7. Remove the flat plate and re-install the sawblade.
8. Loosen the front trunnion bolts (2ea. ref #207) and the rear trunnion
bolts (2ea. ref #243).
9. Move the entire undercarriage around while measuring as in step 2.
10. When the two measurements are the same, re-tighten the front two
trunnion bolts (ref #207).
11. Before tightening the rear trunnion bolts, push forward on the rear
trunnion bracket to allow the undercarriage to snugly fit between the two
trunnions.
12. Re-check the blade to miter slot measurement and if they are still
equal, re-tighten the rear trunnion bolts (ref #243).
13. If the blade to miter slot measurements have changed, repeat steps 8
thru 12.

.........................................End of Delta
Procedures........................................ ....

Without a diagram to look at this may be confusing but I suspect most of us
never thought about the tie-bar alignment steps 5 & 6. If these are not
parallel to each other then you can tap / hammer / move / and swear at it
until the cows come home and it will never align correctly. Move the blade
(up / down) then recheck alignment and you will find that you're out of
alignment again ! You must keep the trunnion brackets tight to the rest of
the mechanism.

I'm off to find some grade 5 bolts, lockwashers and a flat plate (glass
maybe if I can't find a steel plate of some sort). I'll be reassembling and
aligning tonight. If I find a better or easier way, I'll make a follow-up
post and let you know what I did.

If you try to contact Delta tech support, (800) 438-2486 you'll most likely
get a busy signal like I did for two days. Finally contacted HQ at (901)
668-8600 and they paged tech support for me and he was on the line in less
than a minute. Course I was nice to the sweet young thing that answered the
call, told her I'd been trying for two days and could she help - sure 'nuff
!

I'll ding Delta for not including these procedures in the manual or at least
posting them on their web site but tech support (Ron) was very helpful and
friendly. He also gave me a few tips on how to adjust the blade height
(worm-gear) mechanism since mine is a bit to tight when raising/lowering the
blade.

The worm-gear is pinned to a shaft that goes thru another guide-shaft that
has an off-center hole bored thru it. By loosening the nut near the
worm-gear end, the shaft (with the off-center bore) can be rotated which
adjusts the gear meshing clearance between the worm-gear and the gear-height
mechanism. Confusing explanation but when you look at the mechanism, it
will be clear to you.

Hope all the above is useful to someone and provides a better explanation on
why we're having problems when making the blade to miter slot adjustment.

Bob S.

Thanks for posting Bob. I really appreciate it. I had an issue after a couple of 45 cuts and could not get the blade back in alignment. The back of the blade was closer to the fence than the front and all the trunion adjustments would not get it back in line. Finally found your post and found out the tie-bars came out of parallel. After following your post, it all as right as rain!

Thanks!

Tom


This had been posted many years ago on either this site, or various
other forums. Good to see it again.

I had done this, but still can not get 45 degree cuts to be dead on, the
blade does not track straight.

When I get my saw stop, I will enjoy not fighting my 45 degree cuts.

--
Jeff

snip....of long post...

This had been posted many years ago on either this site, or various
other forums. Good to see it again.

I had done this, but still can not get 45 degree cuts to be dead on, the
blade does not track straight.

When I get my saw stop, I will enjoy not fighting my 45 degree cuts.

--
Jeff

Jeff,

Been a number of years but there were some follow-up posts by others that
addressed the misalignments at angles other than 90° when the blade is
tilted. I found on my own saw (at the time) that the trunion lands on the
underside of the top were not at the same height. So when you adjust the
tie bars at 90°, they are not parallel at any other setting.

Turn the saw upside down, use a flat plate and check at 90° and then again
at 45° and see if the plate wobbles. You have to hold the plate to the bars
obviously but you'll know if they're parallel or not. The procedure for
finding which land was not at same height others was trial and error. I
simply placed a small shim ( a thou or two) on one of the trunion lands and
rechecked alignment until I found which combination of shim and position
worked.

I have to attribute that tip to Ron at Delta also. We talked for quite
awhile that day and he mentioned that some of the iron Delta got for the
tops was not aged the full 3 years and would warp after being machined. So
while he didn't have a good procedure to give me, he said it was worth
checking and trying to adjust for it by adding shims. Conversely if a land
is higher, stone or file it down but keep it flat.

I don't recall if I ever made any posts on that trial and error procedure
since others were already coming up with ideas on how to check and make that
adjustment. Trying to think of the right terminology to search on but
coming up blank at the moment.

Glad that original post was found to be helpful to others.

Bob S.

On 10/7/2013 9:59 PM, Bob wrote:
snip....of long post...

This had been posted many years ago on either this site, or various
other forums. Good to see it again.

I had done this, but still can not get 45 degree cuts to be dead on, the
blade does not track straight.

When I get my saw stop, I will enjoy not fighting my 45 degree cuts.


There is no guarantee of that. That said the chances of any new cabinet
saw not being set up properly from the factory is probably close to
zero. BUT the Sawstop, at least the industrial model, has specific
instructions to correct that problem should it occur. Typically with
most cabinet saws you use shims between the table and the trunnion/yoke.
The industrial SawStop has an engineered adjustment found at the back
inside of the saw cabinet.

Now simply making the blade parallel to the miter slot at the 90 degree
bevel setting is a piece of cake with the SawStop.

"Bob" wrote in :


When I get my saw stop, I will enjoy not fighting my 45 degree cuts.


Bob -- Could you post the pdf somewhere?
Thanks!!

Bob -- Could you post the pdf somewhere?
Thanks!!

.................................................. ..................

Have any idea how old that post was and how many computers I've had since
then....;-) I never had a pdf file, just a fax.

But I did do a search of all my hard drives (13 of them) and then did a
quick Google and if you can believe it, I found it he

http://media.ptg-online.com/media/dm..._Cs07m.TSD.pdf

After all these years... It doesn't say it's for the Delta 34-444 / 445Z
series but the reference numbers and diagrams are what I put in my original
post.

Hope it helps - at least you now have a diagram.

Bob S.