I used to have a nice little 4-inch plastic caliper, with both decimal and
fractional rings on the dial. It lived in the breast pocket of my shop
apron, and was a really convenient size for woodworking. I'm sure that it
didn't have the absolute accuracy that my metal calipers do, but it was
always at hand and accurate enough for woodworking. Then one day, somewhere
along the line, it went missing and no matter how I searched for it I never
found it. And NOBODY sells anything like it nowadays, at least with a
fractional dial. I've spent hours on the web trying to find someone who
still sells it. No dice.

So I decided to finally step up into the 21st century, and bought a 4-inch
fractional digital caliper from Rockler.

And it's just about useless to me. I've tried to use it, but when the thing
tells me that what I'm measuring is say 55/128ths, there's no way that my
mind can turn that into "just a skosh under 7/16ths". With a dial caliper,
of course, it's obvious. So I go for a 6-inch metal caliper nowadays, even
though I can't carry it around in my pocket like the little one.

But then yesterday I had reason to measure a router bit shank which I
couldn't tell visually was 3/8th or 8mm, and I got out the digital caliper.
And you guessed it.

The damned battery was dead.

So to hell with it.

Tom

On 3/18/2013 2:32 PM, Tom Dacon wrote:

So I decided to finally step up into the 21st century, and bought a
4-inch fractional digital caliper from Rockler.

And it's just about useless to me. I've tried to use it, but when the
thing tells me that what I'm measuring is say 55/128ths, there's no way
that my mind can turn that into "just a skosh under 7/16ths". With a
dial caliper, of course, it's obvious. So I go for a 6-inch metal
caliper nowadays, even though I can't carry it around in my pocket like
the little one.

But then yesterday I had reason to measure a router bit shank which I
couldn't tell visually was 3/8th or 8mm, and I got out the digital
caliper. And you guessed it.

The damned battery was dead.

My "go to" caliper, which I use almost every time I walk in the shop, is
indeed an analog, fractional dial caliper.

Handy as an apron pocket ... just too damn big for one.

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KarlCaillouet@ (the obvious)

On 3/18/2013 1:32 PM, Tom Dacon wrote:
I used to have a nice little 4-inch plastic caliper, with both decimal
and fractional rings on the dial. It lived in the breast pocket of my
shop apron, and was a really convenient size for woodworking. ...Then one day,
somewhere along the line, it went missing and no matter how I searched
for it I never found it. And NOBODY sells anything like it nowadays, at
least with a fractional dial. I've spent hours on the web trying to find
someone who still sells it. No dice.

There's a 6-inch plastic fractional dial caliper he

http://www.amazon.com/General-Tools-...ractional+dial

If you really want a 4-inch one, you could cut 2 inches off.

On Mar 18, 4:00*pm, Just Wondering wrote:
On 3/18/2013 1:32 PM, Tom Dacon wrote: I used to have a nice little 4-inch plastic caliper, with both decimal
and fractional rings on the dial. It lived in the breast pocket of my
shop apron, and was a really convenient size for woodworking. ...Then one day,
somewhere along the line, it went missing and no matter how I searched
for it I never found it. And NOBODY sells anything like it nowadays, at
least with a fractional dial. I've spent hours on the web trying to find
someone who still sells it. No dice.

There's a 6-inch plastic fractional dial caliper he

http://www.amazon.com/General-Tools-...iper/dp/B00004...

If you really want a 4-inch one, you could cut 2 inches off.

....or extend his pocket.

On Mon, 18 Mar 2013 13:30:05 -0700 (PDT), DerbyDad03
wrote:

On Mar 18, 4:00*pm, Just Wondering wrote:
On 3/18/2013 1:32 PM, Tom Dacon wrote: I used to have a nice little 4-inch plastic caliper, with both decimal
and fractional rings on the dial. It lived in the breast pocket of my
shop apron, and was a really convenient size for woodworking. ...Then one day,
somewhere along the line, it went missing and no matter how I searched
for it I never found it. And NOBODY sells anything like it nowadays, at
least with a fractional dial. I've spent hours on the web trying to find
someone who still sells it. No dice.

There's a 6-inch plastic fractional dial caliper he

http://www.amazon.com/General-Tools-...iper/dp/B00004...

If you really want a 4-inch one, you could cut 2 inches off.

...or extend his pocket.
General tools still makes a composite dial caliper - but it is a
150mm unit.

Well, if anyone's still following this thread, my 4-inch dial caliper from
Hardwick's arrived today (Seattle's not far away), and it's a good tool.

That little plastic one that I was mourning was a compact little piece of
work, and actually shirt-pocket-sized. This one is just a somewhat shorter
version of the usual sort of 6-inch capacity stainless steel fractional dial
caliper, so it's not as compact. It's about 7 1/2" long, and fits an apron
breast pocket pretty well but is a little too long for a shirt pocket.
Visually, it looks just like the 6" iGaging fractional dial caliper that
Rockler sells, but of course is a smaller length and is un-branded.

But it'll do, it'll do. The fractional dial is on the outer ring, where it
belongs, and the usual major divisions are marked, with 1/64" minor
divisions.

So if you'd like to have something like that in your shop, or your pocket,
it's at http://www.ehardwicks.com, for $29.50, only a few bucks more than
the plastic 6" ones I see around the web.

Best regards,
Tom

On 3/21/2013 10:24 PM, tdacon wrote:
Well, if anyone's still following this thread, my 4-inch dial caliper
from Hardwick's arrived today (Seattle's not far away), and it's a good
tool.

That little plastic one that I was mourning was a compact little piece
of work, and actually shirt-pocket-sized. This one is just a somewhat
shorter version of the usual sort of 6-inch capacity stainless steel
fractional dial caliper, so it's not as compact. It's about 7 1/2" long,
and fits an apron breast pocket pretty well but is a little too long for
a shirt pocket. Visually, it looks just like the 6" iGaging fractional
dial caliper that Rockler sells, but of course is a smaller length and
is un-branded.

But it'll do, it'll do. The fractional dial is on the outer ring, where
it belongs, and the usual major divisions are marked, with 1/64" minor
divisions.

So if you'd like to have something like that in your shop, or your
pocket, it's at http://www.ehardwicks.com, for $29.50, only a few bucks
more than the plastic 6" ones I see around the web.

Thanks for the feedback ... I've got it on the wish list.

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KarlCaillouet@ (the obvious)

"Tom Dacon" wrote in
:

I used to have a nice little 4-inch plastic caliper, with both decimal
and fractional rings on the dial. It lived in the breast pocket of my
shop apron, and was a really convenient size for woodworking. I'm sure
that it didn't have the absolute accuracy that my metal calipers do,
but it was always at hand and accurate enough for woodworking. Then
one day, somewhere along the line, it went missing and no matter how I
searched for it I never found it. And NOBODY sells anything like it
nowadays, at least with a fractional dial. I've spent hours on the web
trying to find someone who still sells it. No dice.

So I decided to finally step up into the 21st century, and bought a
4-inch fractional digital caliper from Rockler.

And it's just about useless to me. I've tried to use it, but when the
thing tells me that what I'm measuring is say 55/128ths, there's no
way that my mind can turn that into "just a skosh under 7/16ths". With
a dial caliper, of course, it's obvious. So I go for a 6-inch metal
caliper nowadays, even though I can't carry it around in my pocket
like the little one.

But then yesterday I had reason to measure a router bit shank which I
couldn't tell visually was 3/8th or 8mm, and I got out the digital
caliper. And you guessed it.

The damned battery was dead.

So to hell with it.

Tom



I've got one of these:
http://www.woodcraft.com/product/202...-dual-display-
fractional-digital-caliper.aspx

It reads in both decimal and fractional inch (64ths), but it only
displays the fractional inch if within a certain tolerance. Sure would
be nice if it displayed the indication all the time with an up or down
arrow if it was close to another measurement.

I haven't changed the batteries yet, and it's more than a month old.
Don't have to remove them either, unlike the other digital caliper I
have.

Puckdropper
--
Make it to fit, don't make it fit.

"Tom Dacon" wrote in message ...

I used to have a nice little 4-inch plastic caliper, with both decimal and
fractional rings on the dial. It lived in the breast pocket of my shop
apron, and was a really convenient size for woodworking. I'm sure that it
didn't have the absolute accuracy that my metal calipers do, but it was
always at hand and accurate enough for woodworking. Then one day, somewhere
along the line, it went missing and no matter how I searched for it I never
found it. And NOBODY sells anything like it nowadays, at least with a
fractional dial. I've spent hours on the web trying to find someone who
still sells it. No dice.

So I decided to finally step up into the 21st century, and bought a 4-inch
fractional digital caliper from Rockler.

And it's just about useless to me. I've tried to use it, but when the thing
tells me that what I'm measuring is say 55/128ths, there's no way that my
mind can turn that into "just a skosh under 7/16ths". With a dial caliper,
of course, it's obvious. So I go for a 6-inch metal caliper nowadays, even
though I can't carry it around in my pocket like the little one.

But then yesterday I had reason to measure a router bit shank which I
couldn't tell visually was 3/8th or 8mm, and I got out the digital caliper.
And you guessed it.

The damned battery was dead.

So to hell with it.

Tom

Tom... I ordered a digital depth gauge from Rockler. Would not turn on.
Battery checked OK. I returned it and they sent another one. Same problem.
One more time and I asked if they would test it before sending. I guess not,
it was dead. They did cover all shipping both ways and returned credit to my
card. But I no longer purchase any thing from them except HARD items,
(metal tools etc.) WW

"WW" wrote in
:

Tom... I ordered a digital depth gauge from Rockler. Would not turn on.
Battery checked OK. I returned it and they sent another one. Same problem.
One more time and I asked if they would test it before sending. I guess not,
it was dead. They did cover all shipping both ways and returned credit to my
card. But I no longer purchase any thing from them except HARD items,
(metal tools etc.) WW

I use one of these for a depth gauge in the shop:
http://www.amazon.com/Milton-S448-Tr.../dp/B0002STSQM
No batteries to run down. Cheap, robust, measures accurately to 1/32", and allows estimation
of 1/64" increments -- plenty fine enough for woodworking -- and won't be damaged if dropped
on the concrete floor. No, no, I've never done anything that clumsy. Just speculating.

On Tue, 19 Mar 2013 14:48:18 +0000 (UTC), Doug Miller
wrote:

"WW" wrote in
:

Tom... I ordered a digital depth gauge from Rockler. Would not turn on.
Battery checked OK. I returned it and they sent another one. Same problem.
One more time and I asked if they would test it before sending. I guess not,
it was dead. They did cover all shipping both ways and returned credit to my
card. But I no longer purchase any thing from them except HARD items,
(metal tools etc.) WW

I use one of these for a depth gauge in the shop:
http://www.amazon.com/Milton-S448-Tr.../dp/B0002STSQM
No batteries to run down. Cheap, robust, measures accurately to 1/32", and allows estimation
of 1/64" increments -- plenty fine enough for woodworking -- and won't be damaged if dropped
on the concrete floor. No, no, I've never done anything that clumsy. Just speculating.
I have one similar to this one.
http://ontimepromo.en.alibaba.com/pr...pth_gauge.html.

On keyring.

On 3/18/2013 10:42 PM, WW wrote:


"Tom Dacon" wrote in message ...

I used to have a nice little 4-inch plastic caliper, with both decimal and
fractional rings on the dial. It lived in the breast pocket of my shop
apron, and was a really convenient size for woodworking. I'm sure that it
didn't have the absolute accuracy that my metal calipers do, but it was
always at hand and accurate enough for woodworking. Then one day, somewhere
along the line, it went missing and no matter how I searched for it I never
found it. And NOBODY sells anything like it nowadays, at least with a
fractional dial. I've spent hours on the web trying to find someone who
still sells it. No dice.

So I decided to finally step up into the 21st century, and bought a 4-inch
fractional digital caliper from Rockler.

And it's just about useless to me. I've tried to use it, but when the thing
tells me that what I'm measuring is say 55/128ths, there's no way that my
mind can turn that into "just a skosh under 7/16ths". With a dial caliper,
of course, it's obvious. So I go for a 6-inch metal caliper nowadays, even
though I can't carry it around in my pocket like the little one.

But then yesterday I had reason to measure a router bit shank which I
couldn't tell visually was 3/8th or 8mm, and I got out the digital caliper.
And you guessed it.

The damned battery was dead.

So to hell with it.

Tom

Tom... I ordered a digital depth gauge from Rockler. Would not turn on.
Battery checked OK. I returned it and they sent another one. Same
problem. One more time and I asked if they would test it before sending.
I guess not, it was dead. They did cover all shipping both ways and
returned credit to my card. But I no longer purchase any thing from them
except HARD items, (metal tools etc.) WW


So goto HF and get the dial metal fractional. its worth the $19.99 I got
it on sale for. It used to be $29, and is now regularly selling for
21.99 still worht it.

I might get another. Damn nice.

As far as plastic, I have never seen a plastic dial caliper, only
vernier in plastic.

Yes I have a blindmans fractional digital from Lee Valley.. but I don't
use it anymore. I have 3 other digitals.. having a dial fractional is
easy to read and calculate. and no batteries.

--
Jeff

On Mon, 18 Mar 2013 12:32:25 -0700, "Tom Dacon"
wrote:

I used to have a nice little 4-inch plastic caliper, with both decimal and
fractional rings on the dial. It lived in the breast pocket of my shop
apron, and was a really convenient size for woodworking. I'm sure that it
didn't have the absolute accuracy that my metal calipers do, but it was
always at hand and accurate enough for woodworking. Then one day, somewhere
along the line, it went missing and no matter how I searched for it I never
found it. And NOBODY sells anything like it nowadays, at least with a
fractional dial. I've spent hours on the web trying to find someone who
still sells it. No dice.

So I decided to finally step up into the 21st century, and bought a 4-inch
fractional digital caliper from Rockler.

And it's just about useless to me. I've tried to use it, but when the thing
tells me that what I'm measuring is say 55/128ths, there's no way that my
mind can turn that into "just a skosh under 7/16ths". With a dial caliper,
of course, it's obvious. So I go for a 6-inch metal caliper nowadays, even
though I can't carry it around in my pocket like the little one.

But then yesterday I had reason to measure a router bit shank which I
couldn't tell visually was 3/8th or 8mm, and I got out the digital caliper.
And you guessed it.

The damned battery was dead.

So to hell with it.

Tom


I have one of these from Starrett and love it. It's available many
places for less than the $98.00 list price. Or you could go to Searz
and pay...

http://www.sears.com/starrett-1202f-...p-00940176000P

On 3/18/2013 1:32 PM, Tom Dacon wrote:
I used to have a nice little 4-inch plastic caliper, with both decimal
and fractional rings on the dial. It lived in the breast pocket of my
shop apron, and was a really convenient size for woodworking. I'm sure
that it didn't have the absolute accuracy that my metal calipers do, but
it was always at hand and accurate enough for woodworking. Then one day,
somewhere along the line, it went missing and no matter how I searched
for it I never found it. And NOBODY sells anything like it nowadays, at
least with a fractional dial. I've spent hours on the web trying to find
someone who still sells it. No dice.

So I decided to finally step up into the 21st century, and bought a
4-inch fractional digital caliper from Rockler.

And it's just about useless to me. I've tried to use it, but when the
thing tells me that what I'm measuring is say 55/128ths, there's no way
that my mind can turn that into "just a skosh under 7/16ths". With a
dial caliper, of course, it's obvious. So I go for a 6-inch metal
caliper nowadays, even though I can't carry it around in my pocket like
the little one.

But then yesterday I had reason to measure a router bit shank which I
couldn't tell visually was 3/8th or 8mm, and I got out the digital
caliper. And you guessed it.

The damned battery was dead.

So to hell with it.

I have two of these:

http://tinyurl.com/calg3mj

http://www.amazon.com/gp/product/B00...?ie=UTF8&psc=1

"Tom Dacon" wrote in message ...

And it's just about useless to me. I've tried to use it, but when the thing
tells me that what I'm measuring is say 55/128ths, there's no way that my
mind can turn that into "just a skosh under 7/16ths". With a dial caliper,
of course, it's obvious. So I go for a 6-inch metal caliper nowadays, even
though I can't carry it around in my pocket like the little one.

Some of those "fine" numbers do get to be a bit useless in most
woodworking... especially on machines with "give it a tap" fine adjustments!

I use my Starrett fractional combination square for most stuff like this...
I either set it using my finger to detect "flush" or I lay the board down
flat on the bench/saw table and then press the body of the square down so
the scale slides into the head until the body is flat on the board. Then I
read the scale and adjust my machine using its scale and a tap as needed.
There is enough backlash in the adjustment threads, even when approached
from the same adjustment side (e.g., always clockwise, or always counter
clockwise), that a tad more may be needed than the scale would suggest.

I seldom use calipers with wood... an exception being in setting up the
stacked head dado cutter where it is handy to measure shims to adjust the
width of the cut.

Thinking back, the fences on the table saws I used way back were crude
enough and moved enough in use that maintaining a 1/16" tolerance was a good
feat. I guess our expectations have changed!

John

On 3/19/2013 9:08 AM, John Grossbohlin wrote:

I seldom use calipers with wood... an exception being in setting up the
stacked head dado cutter where it is handy to measure shims to adjust
the width of the cut.

I use a fractional caliper almost daily to check/verify the thickness of
purchased stock and sheet goods, particularly when they come from a
different supplier, batch or lot.

Thickness being that one dimension which, when it varies from part to
part in a project, can cause a good deal of grief to the unsuspecting,
from "square", to dadoes and grooves cut to the project width no longer
fitting when the material comes from different lots/bins/suppliers.

I recently purchased from a supplier where the thickness of the "S2S"
hardwood in the same bin (sold as 4/4, 5/4, etc) varied by as much as
3/32" in thickness from board to board.

IMO, and considering the importance of "thickness" in most of my
woodworking, that is totally unacceptable for material sold as "surfaced
two sides", and a potential problem for the unwary.

It's why I like having a fractional caliper that can easily fit in a
pocket.

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KarlCaillouet@ (the obvious)

"Swingman" wrote in message
...

On 3/19/2013 9:08 AM, John Grossbohlin wrote:

I seldom use calipers with wood... an exception being in setting up the
stacked head dado cutter where it is handy to measure shims to adjust
the width of the cut.

I recently purchased from a supplier where the thickness of the "S2S"
hardwood in the same bin (sold as 4/4, 5/4, etc) varied by as much as 3/32"
in thickness from board to board.

IMO, and considering the importance of "thickness" in most of my
woodworking, that is totally unacceptable for material sold as "surfaced
two sides", and a potential problem for the unwary.

This actually raises a good point that stems from the type of work one does
and the type of wood (a term I use loosely here)... I almost always use
rough cut air dried wood when I'm using solid wood. Sometimes I end up with
surfaced pine but even that tends to be reworked to flatten/straighten....
but generally even the pine I work with is rough cut and air dried. It helps
to "live in the woods" of the Catskills and Hudson Valley where there are a
lot of bandsaw mills.

When I'm doing one off pieces, particularly those with hand cut dimensions
and joinery, the actual measured thickness is not nearly as important to me
as the visual "measurement," i.e., it has to look right where it's being
used. Put another way, as long as all the related stock is the same
thickness I don't care what the thickness measures as long as it looks
right. Using hand cut dovetails and working from the reference face when
using mortise and tenons (either hand cut or machine cut) lets me "get away"
with this...

If I were a production shop I'd be far more concerned with meeting specific
measured thickness dimensions. This as parts generally aren't made relative
to what is already there they are made to a specification.

Sheet goods are another story... sheet goods involve power tool dimensioning
and joinery! That is where I use the calipers to help shim the dado blade...

John

On 3/19/2013 10:19 AM, John Grossbohlin wrote:

Put another way, as long as all the related stock is the same thickness
I don't care what the thickness measures ....

Bingo ... that's precisely why I find fractional calipers very handy
devices, to insure a corresponding relative thickness of like parts, the
more portable the device, the better.

Reminds me ... I need to run back out to the shop and grab mine ...
heading out momentarily to buy 8/4 walnut for table legs for a custom
table for a client. g

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KarlCaillouet@ (the obvious)

"Swingman" wrote

It's why I like having a fractional caliper that can easily fit in a
pocket.

Reminds me of a very formative experience of mine many years ago.

While I was in my 20's, I started metalworking. I have already been doing
woodwork for a number of years. I used to go to this salvage yard. It had
a bit of everything. I would crawl through the boxes and warehouses full of
fascinating materials and scheme on how I could convert them to something
useful for my purposes. It took that junkyard thing I learned growing up on
the farm to a whole 'nother level. I bought all kinds of things from them.
Tools, teflon metal, plastics, cable, pulleys, industrial plywood, paints,
consumables and even some kitchenware.

I always carried calipers to measure the thickness of anything I bought. I
always had a tape measure on my belt. I just thought it was the way to do
it. I had a question, one day, about some stock sitting in a bin. I went
over to the guy who works there and asked him about the item in question.
He answered my question and referred to me as a "professional". I was
shocked. I had only been working with metal for a few months and certainly
did not consider myself to be a professional just yet. So I asked him why
he called me a professional.

He gave me this little presentation, from a guy who works in the salvage
yard perspective, as to why he referred to me as a professional. "I see
these guys come in here al the time and buy things. A lot of times they
come back and complain. We are a salvage yard. This is recycled stuff.
The materials vary widely in hardness and thickness. You have to be careful
of what you buy. I have guys come in here and buy a $100,000 worth of stuff
and return it because it wasn't the right thickness. I see these guys in
here in fancy suits. I don't trust them. Only about one guy in twenty
carries calipers. I never have any problem with those guys. You come in
here and measure everything. You are very careful. You are not a big guy
obviously. You don't buy that much. But everything you do is careful and
precise. I am sure your work is good. I know I will not have any problems
with you. And in my mind that makes you a professional."

My chest swelled with pride. I never forgot that little talk he gave me. I
have calipers everywhere. In all the vehicles. In my office. In the shop.
And a tape measure laying along side of it. It just seemed natural for me
to verify the thickness of anything I build with. Be it metal, wood.
plastic or whatever. How can you possible expect to do a good job joining
different material together if you don't know their exact size? As pointed
out to me by a kind salvage yard guy, it is the "professional" way to do
things.

On 3/19/2013 10:25 AM, Lee Michaels wrote:


"Swingman" wrote

It's why I like having a fractional caliper that can easily fit in a
pocket.

Reminds me of a very formative experience of mine many years ago.

While I was in my 20's, I started metalworking. I have already been
doing woodwork for a number of years. I used to go to this salvage
yard. It had a bit of everything. I would crawl through the boxes and
warehouses full of fascinating materials and scheme on how I could
convert them to something useful for my purposes. It took that junkyard
thing I learned growing up on the farm to a whole 'nother level. I
bought all kinds of things from them. Tools, teflon metal, plastics,
cable, pulleys, industrial plywood, paints, consumables and even some
kitchenware.

I always carried calipers to measure the thickness of anything I
bought. I always had a tape measure on my belt. I just thought it was
the way to do it. I had a question, one day, about some stock sitting
in a bin. I went over to the guy who works there and asked him about
the item in question. He answered my question and referred to me as a
"professional". I was shocked. I had only been working with metal for
a few months and certainly did not consider myself to be a professional
just yet. So I asked him why he called me a professional.

He gave me this little presentation, from a guy who works in the salvage
yard perspective, as to why he referred to me as a professional. "I see
these guys come in here al the time and buy things. A lot of times they
come back and complain. We are a salvage yard. This is recycled stuff.
The materials vary widely in hardness and thickness. You have to be
careful of what you buy. I have guys come in here and buy a $100,000
worth of stuff and return it because it wasn't the right thickness. I
see these guys in here in fancy suits. I don't trust them. Only about
one guy in twenty carries calipers. I never have any problem with those
guys. You come in here and measure everything. You are very careful.
You are not a big guy obviously. You don't buy that much. But
everything you do is careful and precise. I am sure your work is good.
I know I will not have any problems with you. And in my mind that makes
you a professional."

My chest swelled with pride. I never forgot that little talk he gave
me. I have calipers everywhere. In all the vehicles. In my office.
In the shop. And a tape measure laying along side of it. It just seemed
natural for me to verify the thickness of anything I build with. Be it
metal, wood. plastic or whatever. How can you possible expect to do a
good job joining different material together if you don't know their
exact size? As pointed out to me by a kind salvage yard guy, it is the
"professional" way to do things.

And there you go, Bubba.

"Attention to detail is the difference between mediocrity and supremacy"

A concept drilled into me in both growing up, and in training in the
service when lives counted on it, to the point it becomes pertinent to
everything you do. (Thanks, Dad.)

Scroll down to "Residential Construction" header on my website below



--
eWoodShop: www.eWoodShop.com
Wood Shop: www.e-WoodShop.net
https://plus.google.com/114902129577517371552/posts
http://www.custommade.com/by/ewoodshop/
KarlCaillouet@ (the obvious)

"Lee Michaels" wrote in message
eb.com...

My chest swelled with pride. I never forgot that little talk he gave me.
I have calipers everywhere. In all the vehicles. In my office. In the
shop. And a tape measure laying along side of it. It just seemed natural
for me to verify the thickness of anything I build with. Be it metal,
wood. plastic or whatever. How can you possible expect to do a good job
joining different material together if you don't know their exact size? As
pointed out to me by a kind salvage yard guy, it is the "professional" way
to do things.

Reminds me of my father... he went through an apprenticeship as a tool and
die maker and worked as same early in his career. Precision, tolerances, and
good workmanship and machines matter. I also recall him saying half
jokingly that "Williamsburg ruined you." He was referring to my time working
as a skilled craft interpreter at Colonial Williamsburg. The day he made the
comment I was wrestling with a home renovation decision... Assuming equal
physical and workmanship quality, there were various options and to me it
HAD to look right or it would detract from the whole.

Williamsburg sensitized me to the whole notion of aesthetics and making
parts relative to other parts instead of to detailed technical drawings.
Both things became an important part of what I do. The aesthetics part takes
time to plan out... Golden mean, Fibonacci progressions, etc. Making parts
relative to what is already there, but within the design, frees me from
"hard" plans. Often my "plans" are a rough sketch with gross dimensions, the
rest is built to fit.... yellow sticky notes are sometimes enough paper. ;~)
I apply the quality workmanship to the design... Seems to work out well
judging by my success at shows.

John

On 3/19/2013 11:15 AM, John Grossbohlin wrote:
"Lee Michaels" wrote in message
eb.com...

My chest swelled with pride. I never forgot that little talk he gave
me. I have calipers everywhere. In all the vehicles. In my office.
In the shop. And a tape measure laying along side of it. It just
seemed natural for me to verify the thickness of anything I build
with. Be it metal, wood. plastic or whatever. How can you possible
expect to do a good job joining different material together if you
don't know their exact size? As pointed out to me by a kind salvage
yard guy, it is the "professional" way to do things.

Reminds me of my father... he went through an apprenticeship as a tool
and die maker and worked as same early in his career. Precision,
tolerances, and good workmanship and machines matter. I also recall him
saying half jokingly that "Williamsburg ruined you." He was referring to
my time working as a skilled craft interpreter at Colonial Williamsburg.
The day he made the comment I was wrestling with a home renovation
decision... Assuming equal physical and workmanship quality, there were
various options and to me it HAD to look right or it would detract from
the whole.

Williamsburg sensitized me to the whole notion of aesthetics and making
parts relative to other parts instead of to detailed technical drawings.
Both things became an important part of what I do. The aesthetics part
takes time to plan out... Golden mean, Fibonacci progressions, etc.
Making parts relative to what is already there, but within the design,
frees me from "hard" plans. Often my "plans" are a rough sketch with
gross dimensions, the rest is built to fit.... yellow sticky notes are
sometimes enough paper. ;~) I apply the quality workmanship to the
design... Seems to work out well judging by my success at shows.

You are indeed practicing "attention to detail", and at a very exacting
level, in order to accomplish your above.

It is not a matter of degree, it is a matter of context.

--
eWoodShop: www.eWoodShop.com
Wood Shop: www.e-WoodShop.net
https://plus.google.com/114902129577517371552/posts
http://www.custommade.com/by/ewoodshop/
KarlCaillouet@ (the obvious)

On 3/18/2013 12:32 PM, Tom Dacon wrote:
I used to have a nice little 4-inch plastic caliper, with both decimal
and fractional rings on the dial.

Not plastic but what you are looking for...

http://www.ptreeusa.com/layout_products.htm#1241

or

http://www.woodcraft.com/product/200...l-caliper.aspx

or

http://woodworker.com/6-fractional-d...su-149-426.asp

http://woodworker.com/5-slide-caliper-mssu-946-638.asp (my favorite)

http://www.harborfreight.com/6-inch-...per-92437.html

On 3/19/2013 10:27 AM, Pat Barber wrote:
On 3/18/2013 12:32 PM, Tom Dacon wrote:
I used to have a nice little 4-inch plastic caliper, with both decimal
and fractional rings on the dial.

Not plastic but what you are looking for...

http://www.ptreeusa.com/layout_products.htm#1241

or

http://www.woodcraft.com/product/200...l-caliper.aspx


or

http://woodworker.com/6-fractional-d...su-149-426.asp

http://woodworker.com/5-slide-caliper-mssu-946-638.asp (my favorite)

http://www.harborfreight.com/6-inch-...per-92437.html


I took a look at the woodriver. They did not have good action, the HF
unit beat it out. The woodriver was rough to move, and the bezel had no
knurling and felt like soft aluminum.

The HF unit is a quality unit. At least mine is.


--
Jeff

On 3/19/13 9:45 PM, woodchucker wrote:
On 3/19/2013 10:27 AM, Pat Barber wrote:
On 3/18/2013 12:32 PM, Tom Dacon wrote:
I used to have a nice little 4-inch plastic caliper, with both decimal
and fractional rings on the dial.

Not plastic but what you are looking for...

http://www.ptreeusa.com/layout_products.htm#1241

or

http://www.woodcraft.com/product/200...l-caliper.aspx



or

http://woodworker.com/6-fractional-d...su-149-426.asp

http://woodworker.com/5-slide-caliper-mssu-946-638.asp (my favorite)

http://www.harborfreight.com/6-inch-...per-92437.html


I took a look at the woodriver. They did not have good action, the HF
unit beat it out. The woodriver was rough to move, and the bezel had no
knurling and felt like soft aluminum.

The HF unit is a quality unit. At least mine is.



I love my HF digital dial calipers. They are dead nuts on accurate.
I am very suspect of any measuring devices (ok, any *thing,* really)
with the woodriver name (who else sees that and thinks, "wood driver?"
bad marketing) on it, after having checked several, maybe more than a
dozen different squares, rules, tapes, and assorted other devices and
found them to be as off as any HF tool I've ever tried.

NONE on the combination squares I tried were square. They were all off
by a good 16" per foot and more. And yes, I checked my reference square
and rechecked with a few other engineering squares.


--

-MIKE-

"Playing is not something I do at night, it's my function in life"
--Elvin Jones (1927-2004)
--
http://mikedrums.com

---remove "DOT" ^^^^ to reply

-MIKE- wrote:



NONE on the combination squares I tried were square. They were all off
by a good 16" per foot and more.

Just trying to picture that...


--
Alex -- Replace "nospam" with "mail" to reply by email. Checked infrequently.

On 3/21/13 10:04 PM, alexy wrote:
-MIKE- wrote:



NONE on the combination squares I tried were square. They were all off
by a good 16" per foot and more.

Just trying to picture that...




LMAO! Oh, that's a great typo right there, huh? :-)
Ok for anyone keeping score, I forgot the hyphen. 1/16"

Awesome.


--

-MIKE-

"Playing is not something I do at night, it's my function in life"
--Elvin Jones (1927-2004)
--
http://mikedrums.com

---remove "DOT" ^^^^ to reply

On 3/21/2013 10:04 PM, alexy wrote:
-MIKE- wrote:



NONE on the combination squares I tried were square. They were all off
by a good 16" per foot and more.

Just trying to picture that...





Perhaps he was actually measuring with a triangle. ;~)

woodchucker wrote:

I took a look at the woodriver. They did not have good action, the HF
unit beat it out. The woodriver was rough to move, and the bezel had
no knurling and felt like soft aluminum.

The HF unit is a quality unit. At least mine is.

I recently went with the HF unit too. My battery operated digital crapped
out - was not just a bad battery, and I was always dissatisfied with the
battery issues it had. So - I went with the fractional dial caliper and
like you said - it works smoothly, easy to read, and no more battery issues.

--

-Mike-

"Tom Dacon" wrote in message ...

So after I posted my petulant little rant, I headed off to the web to look
once again for a 4-inch fractional caliper, and to my vast surprise someone
has re-introduced such a thing into the market since the last time I scoured
the web for it. A company I hadn't heard of called Hardwicks
(http://www.ehardwicks.com) in Seattle, "Rust and dust since 1932" offers
both a 4-inch and a 6-inch fractional/decimal caliper, in metal, no less.
And in stock. So I fired off an order right away for a four-incher - I'll
see how it works out and report back, in case anyone cares except me.

But anyway, thanks for all your comments. Puckdropper had a good
suggestion - if there was a little up or down arrow that was visible when
the measurement was close to a major division, that would be pretty handy,
even better if it showed you what that nearest division was. Although it
leaves it up in the air what constitutes a major division - kind of depends
on the precision you're working to, I guess. I like to work to a pretty
close tolerance in the shop, but I'm a wooden boat guy not a cabinet maker,
and these are the words I live by:

A cabinet maker works to the nearest 64th;
a house builder works to the nearest 8th;
a boat builder works to the nearest boat.

Tom