I'm about to build a 12' x 8' gambrel roof shed.

I have some 4x4x8' PT for the skids. I was going to then put 5, 12' -
2x'4s spaces 24" OC atop those for the floor joists with an 8' 2x4 to
cap off the ends. The load bearing walls will be along the 12'
side. Is this OK? Or should I start with 12' skids and then atop
those run 8' joists?

I guess the question is -- does it make any difference which side
supports the load bearing walls? I have the 8' 4x4s, so I'm trying to
use then vs having to buy 12' ones.

On Sep 4, 7:01*am, Stuart wrote:
In article
,
* *kansascats wrote:

I have some 4x4x8' PT for the skids. *I was going to then put 5, 12' -
2x'4s spaces 24" OC atop those for the floor joists

What are you using for the actual floor and what loading are you putting
on it?

24" pitch is a bit wide, 16" centres are more usual, with 18mm thick T&G
boarding for "normal", loading 22mm thick for heavier loading. For a
workshop I would recommend you go for 22mm (all finished sizes)

My own shed is 6'x 6' with end supported 2x4, 16" apart and 22mm floor
boards.

--
Stuart Winsor

Stuart, Thanks. The flooring I bought was 3/4"-ish t/g. I'm
seriously thinking to go 16" o.c. as it just adds 2 more joists. I
made a chicken coop based on the same basic design and went 24" o.c.
with 1/2" plywood. Chickens don't mind, but it's pretty spongy if you
walk around. But primary question is does it matter which way the
joists run? Right now I planned to lay down 8' 4x4 skids, then put
12' joists perpendicular to those. The load bearing wall will sit
atop the 12' side walls -parallel to the joists (perpendicular to the
skids). It somewhat seems like it would be better to put the load
bearing wall perpendicular to the joists -- thereby having 8' joists,
and then 12' skids. I already "have" the 4x4 PT skids, else I need
to go buy 3 12' - 4x4 PT or possibly join together the 8' ones.

I would recommend using pressure treated 2X6 for floor joists, 16"
OC. It won't be that much more expensive and your FOUNDATION will be
sufficient for any future use of the shed, should you want to change
its use from simple storage (?) to something more substantial, later.
Don't skimp with your foundation construction, you'll possibly regret
it. Now is the time to, also, consider possible future use, different
needs/requirements, etc., not just your immediate use/needs. What
might you be doing in/with the shed in 3, 5 years from now? Invest in
the surety of the foundation, not just in what will be above the
foundation.

Sonny

On Sep 4, 8:51*am, Sonny wrote:
I would recommend using pressure treated 2X6 for floor joists, 16"
OC. *It won't be that much more expensive and your FOUNDATION will be
sufficient for any future use of the shed, should you want to change
its use from simple storage (?) to something more substantial, later.
Don't skimp with your foundation construction, you'll possibly regret
it. *Now is the time to, also, consider possible future use, different
needs/requirements, etc., not just your immediate use/needs. *What
might you be doing in/with the shed in 3, 5 years from now? *Invest in
the surety of the foundation, not just in what will be above the
foundation.

Sonny

Sonny - thanks, generally agree, but 2x4 flooring I think will be
sufficient. What I most need to know now is whether the layout of the
load bearing wall on the joists is OK. As-is, I was planning four
4x4 8' skids, then 12' 2x4 16" o.c. joists perpendicular to the skids,
and then the load bearing wall along the 12' length, which means the
wall sits parallel atop the outside 12' 2x4 rather than perpendicular
to the joists. Is that OK?

On Sun, 4 Sep 2011 06:05:00 -0700 (PDT), kansascats
wrote:


Stuart, Thanks. The flooring I bought was 3/4"-ish t/g. I'm
seriously thinking to go 16" o.c. as it just adds 2 more joists. I
made a chicken coop based on the same basic design and went 24" o.c.
with 1/2" plywood. Chickens don't mind, but it's pretty spongy if you
walk around. But primary question is does it matter which way the
joists run? Right now I planned to lay down 8' 4x4 skids, then put
12' joists perpendicular to those. The load bearing wall will sit
atop the 12' side walls -parallel to the joists (perpendicular to the
skids). It somewhat seems like it would be better to put the load
bearing wall perpendicular to the joists -- thereby having 8' joists,
and then 12' skids. I already "have" the 4x4 PT skids, else I need
to go buy 3 12' - 4x4 PT or possibly join together the 8' ones.

12' 2x4 joists on 16" centers is going to make for a springy floor
with little loading capacity. For that span you'd want 2x6" joists
16"OC. If you really want to use 2x4 joists, run them the other way
and put them 12"OC

On 9/4/2011 2:18 AM, kansascats wrote:
I'm about to build a 12' x 8' gambrel roof shed.

I have some 4x4x8' PT for the skids. I was going to then put 5, 12' -
2x'4s spaces 24" OC atop those for the floor joists with an 8' 2x4 to
cap off the ends. The load bearing walls will be along the 12'
side. Is this OK? Or should I start with 12' skids and then atop
those run 8' joists?

I guess the question is -- does it make any difference which side
supports the load bearing walls? I have the 8' 4x4s, so I'm trying to
use then vs having to buy 12' ones.

I would suggest at least a 2x10 perimeter for the walls to set on and
2x6 for the floor joists If they too will be supported. If not
supported 2x8.

On Sep 4, 7:01*am, Stuart wrote:
In article
,
* *kansascats wrote:

I have some 4x4x8' PT for the skids. *I was going to then put 5, 12' -
2x'4s spaces 24" OC atop those for the floor joists

What are you using for the actual floor and what loading are you putting
on it?

24" pitch is a bit wide, 16" centres are more usual, with 18mm thick T&G
boarding for "normal", loading 22mm thick for heavier loading. For a
workshop I would recommend you go for 22mm (all finished sizes)

My own shed is 6'x 6' with end supported 2x4, 16" apart and 22mm floor
boards.

--
Stuart Winsor

Pick up a couple treated 4X6X12 (or 14s even better- the extra length
can support a nice step in front) for your skids, cut an angle on the
bottom corners so they can actually perform as skids if you move it
later. Set them level on 4 concrete pads. Use treated 8' 2x6s for your
joists. Cantilever the joists out over the edges of the skids about a
foot or so (effective joist span 6'). Use a double rim joist if you
want under the load bearing walls. Square up the joist system and
hurricane tie the joists to skids. I built a similar shed 10X14, and
use the space under the joists between the skids to store utility
lumber.
Nothing really wrong with the direction your proposed joists run, its
just that they run 12 ' unsupported and will be spongy at best.

In article ,
Jim Levie wrote:
12' 2x4 joists on 16" centers is going to make for a springy floor
with little loading capacity. For that span you'd want 2x6" joists
16"OC. If you really want to use 2x4 joists, run them the other way
and put them 12"OC

Note that he is using four 4x4 skids so, as I read it, with those spaced
equidistant, the joists will be supported at intermediate points and the
maximum required span only 4'

--
Stuart Winsor

On Sun, 4 Sep 2011 00:18:07 -0700 (PDT), kansascats
wrote:

I'm about to build a 12' x 8' gambrel roof shed.

I have some 4x4x8' PT for the skids. I was going to then put 5, 12' -
2x'4s spaces 24" OC atop those for the floor joists with an 8' 2x4 to
cap off the ends. The load bearing walls will be along the 12'
side. Is this OK? Or should I start with 12' skids and then atop
those run 8' joists?

I guess the question is -- does it make any difference which side
supports the load bearing walls? I have the 8' 4x4s, so I'm trying to
use then vs having to buy 12' ones.

It appears that you have not gotten a permit. For a building that
size the cost of the permit would be minimal. You would have a
qualified person that you could get all of these questions answered.

Some of the answers you have received would not be to code in many
locals. I gather from your question that this shed is one of your
first projects. Do yourself a favor and get a permit and build it
right.

I'll work up a diagram and post so it's clearer.

On Sun, 4 Sep 2011 00:18:07 -0700 (PDT), kansascats
wrote:

I'm about to build a 12' x 8' gambrel roof shed.

I have some 4x4x8' PT for the skids. I was going to then put 5, 12' -
2x'4s spaces 24" OC atop those for the floor joists with an 8' 2x4 to
cap off the ends. The load bearing walls will be along the 12'
side. Is this OK? Or should I start with 12' skids and then atop
those run 8' joists?

I guess the question is -- does it make any difference which side
supports the load bearing walls? I have the 8' 4x4s, so I'm trying to
use then vs having to buy 12' ones.
If the outer 12 foot 2X4s are directly supported on the 4X4X8
sleepers, putting the load bearing wall directly on top of the 4X4
would appear to be the best solution, assuming you are using solid
lumber for the floor decking, and that decking extends to the outside
of the platform so the sill of the load bearing wall rests on top of
the flooring. I would not try that with OSB floor decking. I'd have
the sill extend 1/2 inch past the end of the floor (basically center
the joist under the sill) to adeqately sheild the ends of the floor
deck from the elements - and bring the siding about the same distance
below the sill.
Just my opinion/observation

I would also strongly suggest 2X6 for the floor joists though - even
on 16" centers.

On Sun, 04 Sep 2011 12:08:01 -0500, Gordon Shumway wrote:

On Sun, 4 Sep 2011 00:18:07 -0700 (PDT), kansascats
wrote:

I'm about to build a 12' x 8' gambrel roof shed.

I have some 4x4x8' PT for the skids. I was going to then put 5, 12' -
2x'4s spaces 24" OC atop those for the floor joists with an 8' 2x4 to
cap off the ends. The load bearing walls will be along the 12'
side. Is this OK? Or should I start with 12' skids and then atop
those run 8' joists?

I guess the question is -- does it make any difference which side
supports the load bearing walls? I have the 8' 4x4s, so I'm trying to
use then vs having to buy 12' ones.

It appears that you have not gotten a permit. For a building that
size the cost of the permit would be minimal. You would have a
qualified person that you could get all of these questions answered.

Some of the answers you have received would not be to code in many
locals. I gather from your question that this shed is one of your
first projects. Do yourself a favor and get a permit and build it
right.
In many areas (mine included) with no permanent foundation and under
100Sq Ft no permit is required or issued and no "code" applies. Put a
permanent foundation (concrete slab or sonotube frost foundation
included) under it and a 30 sq foot shed requires a permit and has to
meet all applicable codes.

Pour a 100 sq foot slab this year, and drop a 50 sq foot shed on it
next year, and no permit is required.
Bolt (lag) a 100 sq foot shed to that slab, and you better have a
permit.

On Sep 4, 11:05*am, kansascats wrote:
On Sep 4, 8:51*am, Sonny wrote:

I would recommend using pressure treated 2X6 for floor joists, 16"
OC. *It won't be that much more expensive and your FOUNDATION will be
sufficient for any future use of the shed, should you want to change
its use from simple storage (?) to something more substantial, later.
Don't skimp with your foundation construction, you'll possibly regret
it. *Now is the time to, also, consider possible future use, different
needs/requirements, etc., not just your immediate use/needs. *What
might you be doing in/with the shed in 3, 5 years from now? *Invest in
the surety of the foundation, not just in what will be above the
foundation.

Sonny

Sonny - thanks, generally agree, but 2x4 flooring I think will be
sufficient. *What I most need to know now is whether the layout of the
load bearing wall on the joists is OK. * As-is, I was planning four
4x4 8' skids, then 12' 2x4 16" o.c. joists perpendicular to the skids,
and then the load bearing wall along the 12' length, which means the
wall sits parallel atop the outside 12' 2x4 rather than perpendicular
to the joists. *Is that OK?

On Sep 4, 3:18 am, kansascats wrote:
I'm about to build a 12' x 8' gambrel roof shed.

I have some 4x4x8' PT for the skids. I was going to then put 5, 12' -
2x'4s spaces 24" OC atop those for the floor joists with an 8' 2x4 to
cap off the ends. The load bearing walls will be along the 12'
side. Is this OK? Or should I start with 12' skids and then atop
those run 8' joists?

I guess the question is -- does it make any difference which side
supports the load bearing walls? I have the 8' 4x4s, so I'm trying to
use then vs having to buy 12' ones.

It does not make any difference which way the skids are oriented - at
least in regards to the "bearing" walls. Think of a house - there is
no change in wall construction or framing between a house with a gable
roof or one with a hip roof. The floor platform can take whatever you
throw at it...as long as your floor platform is built to standards.

If you're ever going to move the shed, it would be better to have the
skids running the long way - it'd be a bit easier to move.

R

On Sep 4, 3:18*am, kansascats wrote:
I'm about to build a 12' x 8' gambrel roof shed.

I have some 4x4x8' PT for the skids. *I was going to then put 5, 12' -
2x'4s spaces 24" OC atop those for the floor joists with an 8' 2x4 to
cap off the ends. * The load bearing walls will be along the 12'
side. * Is this OK? *Or should I start with 12' skids and then atop
those run 8' joists?

I guess the question is -- does it make any difference which side
supports the load bearing walls? *I have the 8' 4x4s, so I'm trying to
use then vs having to buy 12' ones.

Floor joists should be 2x6 material 16 inches on center.

Beams (your 4x4's) really should be 2x6 material, too - doubled up /
sistered together.

If you go to LOWES (or equivalent) and use their design tool to build
a deck of the imensions required, you will get a "foundation plan for
your shed that will carry the load of a single-story shed with ease.

The metal re-enforcing stuff (forgot the name) is a good place to look
for details on deck building as they produce a booklet on it which
provides load factors and joist spacing for different size beams and
joists. And diagrams.

I used these tools to build a 12 x 16 deck and it's as solid as the
house - maybe better!

If you are intent upon placing your"skids" i ground contact, consider
laying a few inches of gravel underneath each skid. It will elp with
leveling and water run-off.

On Sep 4, 11:05*am, kansascats wrote:
2x4 16" o.c. joists perpendicular to the skids, Is that OK?

No, it's NOT "OK"

Hoosierpopi wrote:
On Sep 4, 11:05 am, kansascats wrote:
2x4 16" o.c. joists perpendicular to the skids, Is that OK?

No, it's NOT "OK"

Huh?

--

-Mike-

And if not on gravel that can run off - and I suggest making
a tray of cement that holds the gravel - keeping it from just
sinking into the ground - but have the tray that holds piles of
stone have holes in all corners. e.g. just have plastic pipe
act as a form to keep out the cement - then knock them out.

They will drain - they will hold up the stone from just being
driven into the ground.

This is a lesson learned on doing driveways. Never pave them with
stone when muddy. Only dry and hard - lay down stone.

Martin

On 9/5/2011 1:20 PM, Hoosierpopi wrote:
On Sep 4, 3:18 am, wrote:
I'm about to build a 12' x 8' gambrel roof shed.

I have some 4x4x8' PT for the skids. I was going to then put 5, 12' -
2x'4s spaces 24" OC atop those for the floor joists with an 8' 2x4 to
cap off the ends. The load bearing walls will be along the 12'
side. Is this OK? Or should I start with 12' skids and then atop
those run 8' joists?

I guess the question is -- does it make any difference which side
supports the load bearing walls? I have the 8' 4x4s, so I'm trying to
use then vs having to buy 12' ones.

Floor joists should be 2x6 material 16 inches on center.

Beams (your 4x4's) really should be 2x6 material, too - doubled up /
sistered together.

If you go to LOWES (or equivalent) and use their design tool to build
a deck of the imensions required, you will get a "foundation plan for
your shed that will carry the load of a single-story shed with ease.

The metal re-enforcing stuff (forgot the name) is a good place to look
for details on deck building as they produce a booklet on it which
provides load factors and joist spacing for different size beams and
joists. And diagrams.

I used these tools to build a 12 x 16 deck and it's as solid as the
house - maybe better!

If you are intent upon placing your"skids" i ground contact, consider
laying a few inches of gravel underneath each skid. It will elp with
leveling and water run-off.

I plan to sit the skids on a few inches of concrete blocks.

I built an 8x8 of similar design, and pulled it with my 20hp tractor.
Now then 8x12 is going to be 50% heavier, so not sure dragging it
around is going to be much of an option, but if I had to, then it
could be possible.

Planning 6' sidewall studs and a gambrel roof. I tend to sort of play
with the layout to optimize the standard building materials.

So it sounds like the 8' skids are fine; I also got that from a
reputable contractor I know.

"Gordon Shumway" wrote

It appears that you have not gotten a permit. For a building that
size the cost of the permit would be minimal. You would have a
qualified person that you could get all of these questions answered.

Some of the answers you have received would not be to code in many
locals. I gather from your question that this shed is one of your
first projects. Do yourself a favor and get a permit and build it
right.


In many or areas, if it is built on skids, it is portable, and no permit is
required, or perhaps even impossible to get on such a building. That is why
most sheds are built on skids, even if they are never moved.

I would add to put a hole in a 4x6 skid for a chain to pull the shed, and
fasten the joists to the skid with metal connectors, like the hurricane
clips that are used to attach roofs to the wall. You would likely pull the
skid loose, if you ever moved it without clips.
Also get a tiedown kit and keep it from blowing over in a strong wind storm.

-- Jim in NC

bnnvhgjgfh

On Sep 13, 2:08*am, "Morgans" wrote:
"Gordon Shumway" wrote

It appears that you have not gotten a permit. *For a building that
size the cost of the permit would be minimal. *You would have a
qualified person that you could get all of these questions answered.

Some of the answers you have received would not be to code in many
locals. *I gather from your question that this shed is one of your
first projects. *Do yourself a favor and get a permit and build it
right.



In many or areas, if it is built on skids, it is portable, and no permit is
required, or perhaps even impossible to get on such a building. *That is why
most sheds are built on skids, even if they are never moved.

I would add to put a hole in a 4x6 skid for a chain to pull the shed, and
fasten the joists to the skid with metal connectors, like the hurricane
clips that are used to attach roofs to the wall. *You would likely pull the
skid loose, if you ever moved it without clips.
Also get a tiedown kit and keep it from blowing over in a strong wind storm.

-- Jim in NC

OMG! Are we still on this post? Go to Lowes or HD and spend a few
minutes at the literature rack - look at a few plans, get all your
answers w/pitchers!