I need to staple thin aluminum flashing to pine. I have an old Arrow
T50M gun, which doesn't quite have enough oomph to sink a 3/8" long
staple flush. I could try using 1/4" or 5/16" long staples, but I'd
prefer to go with a wider crown, and I know that staple gun technolgy has
improved a good bit since the T50 was designed. This will be used
outdoors, and electric or pneumatic is overkill (& over-$$).

The T50's use a 3/8" width (presumably OD). My research shows that there
are two flavors of "wide crown". Ace Hardware sells staples as either
"Wide Crown I" or "Wide Crown II". The Wide crown I's fit various
flavors of Ace, B&D, and Craftsman. I think that these are 14mm wide,
which is ~ 0.55". The Wide Crown II's fit some Master Mechanic, Stanley
and Swinglines. I think these are 1/2" wide. I also found an indication
that Bostitch uses 7/16" wide staples, which I consider too narrow.

From the Googling I did, there aren't a lot of _manual_ wide-crown guns
around anymore. Swingline appears to be out of the manual gun business
entirely. Stanley & Bostich appear to have merged, and don't seem to
have much for sale that still uses the wide crown staples. Craftsman's
stuff is mostly re-labled B&D, and the B&D Powershot's have gotten a lot
of bad reviews (although a lot of them are from idiots who can't deal
with the "backward" design).

I can wade through all of the specific model numbers that Ace claims use
the wide crown staples to see if any are still sold. In the meantime, I
figured I see if anyone has any recommendations or warnings.

Thanks!

Doug White

"Doug White" wrote in message
.. .
I need to staple thin aluminum flashing to pine. I have an old Arrow
T50M gun, which doesn't quite have enough oomph to sink a 3/8" long
staple flush. I could try using 1/4" or 5/16" long staples, but I'd
prefer to go with a wider crown, and I know that staple gun technolgy has
improved a good bit since the T50 was designed. This will be used
outdoors, and electric or pneumatic is overkill (& over-$$).

The T50's use a 3/8" width (presumably OD). My research shows that there
are two flavors of "wide crown". Ace Hardware sells staples as either
"Wide Crown I" or "Wide Crown II". The Wide crown I's fit various
flavors of Ace, B&D, and Craftsman. I think that these are 14mm wide,
which is ~ 0.55". The Wide Crown II's fit some Master Mechanic, Stanley
and Swinglines. I think these are 1/2" wide. I also found an indication
that Bostitch uses 7/16" wide staples, which I consider too narrow.

From the Googling I did, there aren't a lot of _manual_ wide-crown guns
around anymore. Swingline appears to be out of the manual gun business
entirely. Stanley & Bostich appear to have merged, and don't seem to
have much for sale that still uses the wide crown staples. Craftsman's
stuff is mostly re-labled B&D, and the B&D Powershot's have gotten a lot
of bad reviews (although a lot of them are from idiots who can't deal
with the "backward" design).

I can wade through all of the specific model numbers that Ace claims use
the wide crown staples to see if any are still sold. In the meantime, I
figured I see if anyone has any recommendations or warnings.

Thanks!

Doug White

Bite the bullet and get air. So much better, and you can get smaller
nailers for reasonable that do a LOT of work you used to do manually. You
will also do BETTER work. Little pancake compressors can be had used for
cheap if you just shop around.

Friend of mine bought a new Porter Cable pancake, and three new nailguns,
1", 2", and 3" for $135 at a hock shop.

Get one. You know you want it.

Steve

Heart surgery pending?
www.cabgbypasssurgery.com

Doug White wrote:

I need to staple thin aluminum flashing to pine. I have an old Arrow
T50M gun, which doesn't quite have enough oomph to sink a 3/8" long
staple flush.


The springs get weak in those guns as they get old. Try a new gun
and see what happens.


--
You can't fix stupid. You can't even put a Band-Aid™ on it, because it's
Teflon coated.

On Sun, 03 Apr 2011 18:52:35 GMT, Doug White
wrote:

I need to staple thin aluminum flashing to pine. I have an old Arrow
T50M gun, which doesn't quite have enough oomph to sink a 3/8" long
staple flush. I could try using 1/4" or 5/16" long staples, but I'd
prefer to go with a wider crown, and I know that staple gun technolgy has
improved a good bit since the T50 was designed. This will be used
outdoors, and electric or pneumatic is overkill (& over-$$).
snip

Hello Doug,

If there is a 1/2" version of the Arrow Power-Shot, and if it gets
reasonable reviews...

I have the 3/8" Power-Shot and for hands that aren't as strong as
they once were, it is definitely an improvement. Much easier to
squeeze.

(OT: they now make manual desk staplers that don't require one to
hammer the thing with a fist. Similar in nature to the Power Shot. I
bought one a year ago, works very well. Have to guard it to make sure
that it doesn't walk away. ;-))
--
Best -- Terry

In article ,
Terry wrote:

On Sun, 03 Apr 2011 18:52:35 GMT, Doug White
wrote:

I need to staple thin aluminum flashing to pine. I have an old Arrow
T50M gun, which doesn't quite have enough oomph to sink a 3/8" long
staple flush. I could try using 1/4" or 5/16" long staples, but I'd
prefer to go with a wider crown, and I know that staple gun technolgy has
improved a good bit since the T50 was designed. This will be used
outdoors, and electric or pneumatic is overkill (& over-$$).
snip

Hello Doug,

If there is a 1/2" version of the Arrow Power-Shot, and if it gets
reasonable reviews...

I have the 3/8" Power-Shot and for hands that aren't as strong as
they once were, it is definitely an improvement. Much easier to
squeeze.

(OT: they now make manual desk staplers that don't require one to
hammer the thing with a fist. Similar in nature to the Power Shot. I
bought one a year ago, works very well. Have to guard it to make sure
that it doesn't walk away. ;-))

What make and model?

Thanks,

Joe Gwinn

Gunner Asch wrote in
:

On Mon, 04 Apr 2011 22:33:52 GMT, Doug White
wrote:

Snip

The only wide-crown vaguely conventional staple guns I've found are a
Black & Decker and a Duo-Fast. The latter got one glowing review on
Amazon, and the guy compared it to a couple of other narrow crown
guns, including the T50:

http://www.amazon.com/Duo-Fast-CS500.../dp/B000YSF80K

He claims it has much better penetration than the T50, so I think I'll
give it a try.

Give us a review after you have used it a while.

I got the Duo-Fast, and I like it! It is easier to operate than my T50,
and has a couple of additional nice features. It has a knob on top that
allows you to dial in the power needed for a given job, and it has a
mechanism so you can pop it open to clear a jam easily. With the power
cranked all the way up, it gives significantly better penetration than
the T50, with less firing effort.

The Duo-Fast staples are "chisel point", which means the tips are just
ground to a wedge, parallel to the stack. I'm used to the T50 "divergent
point" staples, where each staple has a sharp point cut 90 degrees from
the orientation of the points on the chisel point staples. Each side is
cut with the point in the opposite direction, so they tend to splay as
they go in. This is supposed to give better holding power. I originally
thought the divergent point ones would also have better penetration
through the aluminum flashing I was working with. Arrow sells wide crown
divergent point staples for Duo-Fast guns, although the box doesn't list
the CS5000. I bought some to try, and they seem to work OK, although the
very first one jammed (it may also have been the last of the chisel
points from before). In any event, the quick jam clearing feature worked
very nicely, and I didn't have a problem after that. Penetration of the
two styles of staples was pretty much indistinguishable. I didn't try
prying them out, so I don't know if the divergent points hold appreciably
better. I doubt I could tell the difference with just a screw driver.

When stapling flashing to soft pine, the variable power feature was very
nice. I could easily adjust it so that the bottom of the staple was just
flat & in contact against the flashing, or crank it up so they were
driven flush across the top (which stresses the aluminum, and is probably
weaker, although esthetically nicer). If I hit a harder or softer piece
of pine, I could tweak the power to suit.

All in all, I consider it a significant improvement over my old T50, and
it has become my staple gun of choice for future projects.

Doug White

On Apr 16, 11:33*am, Doug White wrote:
Gunner Asch wrote :









On Mon, 04 Apr 2011 22:33:52 GMT, Doug White
wrote:

Snip

The only wide-crown vaguely conventional staple guns I've found are a
Black & Decker and a Duo-Fast. *The latter got one glowing review on
Amazon, and the guy compared it to a couple of other narrow crown
guns, including the T50:

http://www.amazon.com/Duo-Fast-CS500.../dp/B000YSF80K

He claims it has much better penetration than the T50, so I think I'll
give it a try.

Give us a review after you have used it a while.

I got the Duo-Fast, and I like it! *It is easier to operate than my T50,
and has a couple of additional nice features. *It has a knob on top that
allows you to dial in the power needed for a given job, and it has a
mechanism so you can pop it open to clear a jam easily. *With the power
cranked all the way up, it gives significantly better penetration than
the T50, with less firing effort.

The Duo-Fast staples are "chisel point", which means the tips are just
ground to a wedge, parallel to the stack. *I'm used to the T50 "divergent
point" staples, where each staple has a sharp point cut 90 degrees from
the orientation of the points on the chisel point staples. *Each side is
cut with the point in the opposite direction, so they tend to splay as
they go in. *This is supposed to give better holding power. *I originally
thought the divergent point ones would also have better penetration
through the aluminum flashing I was working with. *Arrow sells wide crown
divergent point staples for Duo-Fast guns, although the box doesn't list
the CS5000. *I bought some to try, and they seem to work OK, although the
very first one jammed (it may also have been the last of the chisel
points from before). *In any event, the quick jam clearing feature worked
very nicely, and I didn't have a problem after that. *Penetration of the
two styles of staples was pretty much indistinguishable. *I didn't try
prying them out, so I don't know if the divergent points hold appreciably
better. *I doubt I could tell the difference with just a screw driver.

When stapling flashing to soft pine, the variable power feature was very
nice. *I could easily adjust it so that the bottom of the staple was just
flat & in contact against the flashing, or crank it up so they were
driven flush across the top (which stresses the aluminum, and is probably
weaker, although esthetically nicer). *If I hit a harder or softer piece
of pine, I could tweak the power to suit.

All in all, I consider it a significant improvement over my old T50, and
it has become my staple gun of choice for future projects.

Doug White

Good to know.
Thanks
Karl