Interesting show on Nova last night about a project to build a ship based on
engravings and models from ancient Egyptian tombs and temples. Barefoot
guys working enormous Douglas Fir beams with adzes is quite a sight,
presumably the Egyptian version of OSHA is fairly mellow. Those with
philosophical objections to PBS can skip it.

http://www.pbs.org/wgbh/nova/ancient...aohs-ship.html

"A magnificent trading vessel embarks on a royal expedition to a mysterious,
treasure-laden land called Punt. Is this journey, intricately depicted on
the wall of one of Egypt's most impressive temples, mere myth€”or was it a
reality? NOVA travels to the legendary temple, built some 3,500 years ago
for the celebrated female pharaoh Hatshepsut, in search of answers to this
tantalizing archeological mystery. Did Punt exist and, if so, where was it?
Did the ancient Egyptians, who built elaborate barges to sail down the Nile,
also have the expertise to embark on a long sea voyage? NOVA follows a team
of archeologists and boat builders as they reconstruct the mighty vessel
shown on the mysterious carving and then finally launch it on the Red Sea on
a unique voyage of discovery."

On 2010-11-24, DGDevin wrote:

presumably the Egyptian version of OSHA is fairly mellow. Those with
philosophical objections to PBS can skip it.

It's always fun to contemplate how life, as we know it, is circling
the drain, but we can still find a few million dollars and a few
thousand man hours to waste on a ship mankind figured out four
thousand years ago. Apparently, it didn't contribute to solving any
of our current problems then, but let's try it again. That's some
real forward thinking.

nb

notbob wrote:
On 2010-11-24, DGDevin wrote:

presumably the Egyptian version of OSHA is fairly mellow. Those with
philosophical objections to PBS can skip it.

It's always fun to contemplate how life, as we know it, is circling
the drain, but we can still find a few million dollars and a few
thousand man hours to waste on a ship mankind figured out four
thousand years ago. Apparently, it didn't contribute to solving any
of our current problems then, but let's try it again. That's some
real forward thinking.

Do you take the same jaundiced view of the Arts as
you do with History? What do you do for fun,
kick the dog?

On 2010-11-24, Greg Neill wrote:

Do you take the same jaundiced view of the Arts as
you do with History? What do you do for fun,
kick the dog?

No, jes cats.... and withhold charitable contributions to loser
organizations which contribute nothing to the betterment of my species.

nb

On Nov 24, 2:04*pm, notbob wrote:
On 2010-11-24, Greg Neill wrote:

Do you take the same jaundiced view of the Arts as
you do with History? *What do you do for fun,
kick the dog?

No, jes cats.... and withhold charitable contributions to loser
organizations which contribute nothing to the betterment of my species.

What species is that, and how do you know, from your very subjective
perch, what constitutes betterment?

R

On Nov 24, 1:11*pm, RicodJour wrote:

What species is that, and how do you know, from your very subjective
perch, what constitutes betterment?

R

I would guess (and feel pretty confident about it!) that I know.

I have a neighbor that chains his dog to a tree about 23 hours a day.
The dog cares NOTHING about anything that doesn't immediately affect/
benefit his life at that exact moment.

Eat, sleep, crap, and lick his naughty bits for fun.

All give him immediate satisfaction, and seem to make his day a lot
better.

He cares nothing for anything that doesn't immediately concern him.

The parallels just seem too obvious to me to think I am wrong.

Robert

wrote:
....

The parallels just seem too obvious to me to think I am wrong.
....

chuckle...

--

DGDevin wrote:
Interesting show on Nova last night about a project to build a ship
based on engravings and models from ancient Egyptian tombs and temples.
Barefoot guys working enormous Douglas Fir beams with adzes is quite a
sight, presumably the Egyptian version ...

I start by wondering where the Egyptians got the Doug fir from which to
build the craft--must be some more of those extraterrestrials that
helped w/ the pyramids, etc., ... beaming it over for 'em.

--

On Nov 24, 2:51*pm, dpb wrote:
DGDevin wrote:
Interesting show on Nova last night about a project to build a ship
based on engravings and models from ancient Egyptian tombs and temples. *
Barefoot guys working enormous Douglas Fir beams with adzes is quite a
sight, presumably the Egyptian version ...

I start by wondering where the Egyptians got the Doug fir from which to
build the craft--must be some more of those extraterrestrials that
helped w/ the pyramids, etc., ... beaming it over for 'em.

Surely you are joisting!

R

dpb wrote:
DGDevin wrote:
Interesting show on Nova last night about a project to build a ship
based on engravings and models from ancient Egyptian tombs and temples.
Barefoot guys working enormous Douglas Fir beams with adzes is quite a
sight, presumably the Egyptian version ...

I start by wondering where the Egyptians got the Doug fir from which to
build the craft--must be some more of those extraterrestrials that
helped w/ the pyramids, etc., ... beaming it over for 'em.

I believe that they would have used timbers from Lebanon. They
had quite the reputation for supplying wood in the ancient past.

On Nov 24, 2:44*pm, "
wrote:
On Nov 24, 1:11*pm, RicodJour wrote:

What species is that, and how do you know, from your very subjective
perch, what constitutes betterment?


I would guess (and feel pretty confident about it!) that I know.

I have a neighbor that chains his dog to a tree about 23 hours a day.
The dog cares NOTHING about anything that doesn't immediately affect/
benefit his life at that exact moment.

Eat, sleep, crap, and lick his naughty bits for fun.

All give him immediate satisfaction, and seem to make his day a lot
better.

He cares nothing for anything that doesn't immediately concern him.

The parallels just seem too obvious to me to think I am wrong.

Knowing something is wrong is different than knowing what is right -
particularly when you're planning for the future. Betterment of the
species, right? Stronger species - that requires culling, which we
already do, but in a more socially accepted way. I'm not talking
about abortion, either, and I'm looking at this in a strict, rationale
way, but cutting out the 'deadwood' is what nature does already, so
shouldn't we be saving resources and allocating them where they make
the most sense? Then you run into morals, sentiments, religious
beliefs, and that just muddies the water and makes a lot of viewpoints
make some sense with no clear direction to go. So how does anyone
know what is better for the species? We're making the choices, but
our choices and priorities, our skills, everything changes over time.
What makes our current choices more than subjective, marginally
effective moves towards an indeterminate goal?

R

On 2010-11-24, wrote:

Eat, sleep, crap, and lick his naughty bits for fun.

What? You've given up the first three for art? Neat trick! And I
love your characterization of the parts of the natural anatomy as
"naughty bits". No doubt you've made it high on the reigning
judgemental scale.

Truth be told, if I could lick my balls, I'd be even more personally
pre-occupied than I already am.

nb

In article ,
says...

dpb wrote:
DGDevin wrote:
Interesting show on Nova last night about a project to build a ship
based on engravings and models from ancient Egyptian tombs and temples.
Barefoot guys working enormous Douglas Fir beams with adzes is quite a
sight, presumably the Egyptian version ...

I start by wondering where the Egyptians got the Doug fir from which to
build the craft--must be some more of those extraterrestrials that
helped w/ the pyramids, etc., ... beaming it over for 'em.

I believe that they would have used timbers from Lebanon. They
had quite the reputation for supplying wood in the ancient past.

However Douglas Fir is not native to Lebananon or Egypt or anywhere else
in Europe or Africa--there is a species that is found in the Eastern
parts of China but even there it's rare.

"notbob" wrote in message ...

presumably the Egyptian version of OSHA is fairly mellow. Those with
philosophical objections to PBS can skip it.

It's always fun to contemplate how life, as we know it, is circling
the drain, but we can still find a few million dollars and a few
thousand man hours to waste on a ship mankind figured out four
thousand years ago. Apparently, it didn't contribute to solving any
of our current problems then, but let's try it again. That's some
real forward thinking.

Yeah, good point, we might as well shut down all the museums too, and for
sure scrap the arts--who needs music or literature or history to actually
live? Of course that means the fancy woodworking some folks are into would
go as well, lah-de-dah inlays and dovetails and what not are just a big
waste of time and money when we have machines that can punch out
particle-board furniture by the truckload.

"notbob" wrote in message ...

No, jes cats.... and withhold charitable contributions to loser
organizations which contribute nothing to the betterment of my species.

The best documentaries on television--bar none--on aired on the PBS show
Frontline. Nova is the best science show you're going to find. New Yankee
Workshop (now sadly ended) and This Old House are worth the cost of a
donation all by themselves. PBS has been responsible for some of the best
television produced in America, even the goofs from the commercial networks
will admit that if you get a couple of beers into them. Loser organization?
Not even close.

wrote in message
...


He cares nothing for anything that doesn't immediately concern him.

The parallels just seem too obvious to me to think I am wrong.

By any chance is the dog's name Notbob?

"dpb" wrote in message ...

I start by wondering where the Egyptians got the Doug fir from which to
build the craft--must be some more of those extraterrestrials that helped
w/ the pyramids, etc., ... beaming it over for 'em.

Shipped in from France, the cedars of Lebanon used for the ancient versions
no longer being available.

"DGDevin" wrote in message
m...
"notbob" wrote in message
...

No, jes cats.... and withhold charitable contributions to loser
organizations which contribute nothing to the betterment of my species.

The best documentaries on television--bar none--on aired on the PBS show
Frontline. Nova is the best science show you're going to find. New
Yankee Workshop (now sadly ended) and This Old House are worth the cost of
a donation all by themselves. PBS has been responsible for some of the
best television produced in America, even the goofs from the commercial
networks will admit that if you get a couple of beers into them. Loser
organization? Not even close.


Not really PBS. Most of the shows are funded by member stations or other
groups. PBS happens to broadcast them. WGBH in Boston, IIRC, does both
Frontline and Nova.


--
If your name is No, I voted for you - more than once ...

"Greg Neill" wrote in message
.. .
dpb wrote:
DGDevin wrote:
Interesting show on Nova last night about a project to build a ship
based on engravings and models from ancient Egyptian tombs and temples.
Barefoot guys working enormous Douglas Fir beams with adzes is quite a
sight, presumably the Egyptian version ...

I start by wondering where the Egyptians got the Doug fir from which to
build the craft--must be some more of those extraterrestrials that
helped w/ the pyramids, etc., ... beaming it over for 'em.

I believe that they would have used timbers from Lebanon. They
had quite the reputation for supplying wood in the ancient past.



Cedars of Lebanon no doubt

--
If your name is No, I voted for you - more than once ...

On Nov 24, 3:01*pm, "Greg Neill" wrote:
dpb wrote:
DGDevin wrote:
Interesting show on Nova last night about a project to build a ship
based on engravings and models from ancient Egyptian tombs and temples..
Barefoot guys working enormous Douglas Fir beams with adzes is quite a
sight, presumably the Egyptian version ...

I start by wondering where the Egyptians got the Doug fir from which to
build the craft--must be some more of those extraterrestrials that
helped w/ the pyramids, etc., ... beaming it over for 'em.

I believe that they would have used timbers from Lebanon. *They
had quite the reputation for supplying wood in the ancient past.

Most of that wood came from the Sahara Forest. My grand dad was a
lumberjack there.

J. Clarke wrote:
In article ,
says...

dpb wrote:
DGDevin wrote:
Interesting show on Nova last night about a project to build a ship
based on engravings and models from ancient Egyptian tombs and temples.
Barefoot guys working enormous Douglas Fir beams with adzes is quite a
sight, presumably the Egyptian version ...

I start by wondering where the Egyptians got the Doug fir from which to
build the craft--must be some more of those extraterrestrials that
helped w/ the pyramids, etc., ... beaming it over for 'em.

I believe that they would have used timbers from Lebanon. They
had quite the reputation for supplying wood in the ancient past.

However Douglas Fir is not native to Lebananon or Egypt or anywhere else
in Europe or Africa--there is a species that is found in the Eastern
parts of China but even there it's rare.

Douglas Fir was an available substitute for the original
resource.

On Wed, 24 Nov 2010 20:55:52 -0800 (PST), Robatoy
wrote:

On Nov 24, 3:01*pm, "Greg Neill" wrote:
dpb wrote:
DGDevin wrote:
Interesting show on Nova last night about a project to build a ship
based on engravings and models from ancient Egyptian tombs and temples.
Barefoot guys working enormous Douglas Fir beams with adzes is quite a
sight, presumably the Egyptian version ...

I start by wondering where the Egyptians got the Doug fir from which to
build the craft--must be some more of those extraterrestrials that
helped w/ the pyramids, etc., ... beaming it over for 'em.

I believe that they would have used timbers from Lebanon. *They
had quite the reputation for supplying wood in the ancient past.

Most of that wood came from the Sahara Forest. My grand dad was a
lumberjack there.

He did a hell of a job!

On Wed, 24 Nov 2010 19:23:45 -0800, "DGDevin"
wrote:

"notbob" wrote in message ...

No, jes cats.... and withhold charitable contributions to loser
organizations which contribute nothing to the betterment of my species.

The best documentaries on television--bar none--on aired on the PBS show
Frontline. Nova is the best science show you're going to find. New Yankee
Workshop (now sadly ended) and This Old House are worth the cost of a
donation all by themselves. PBS has been responsible for some of the best
television produced in America, even the goofs from the commercial networks
will admit that if you get a couple of beers into them. Loser organization?
Not even close.

Some excellent programs [Nature (with George Page, RIP), Nova, Roy
Underhill ;] and some good ones [TOH, NYW] came out of PBSs otherwise
lackluster, politically-correct, extremely liberal programming.

Those (5% good) programs could have stood on their own, bringing in
any necessary funding. The others (95% bad) can't, and that's why PBS
is foundering.

It's loser admin, not org.

--
Experience is a good teacher, but she send in terrific bills.
-- Minna Thomas Antrim

On Wed, 24 Nov 2010 20:55:52 -0800 (PST), Robatoy
wrote:

On Nov 24, 3:01*pm, "Greg Neill" wrote:
dpb wrote:
DGDevin wrote:
Interesting show on Nova last night about a project to build a ship
based on engravings and models from ancient Egyptian tombs and temples.
Barefoot guys working enormous Douglas Fir beams with adzes is quite a
sight, presumably the Egyptian version ...

I start by wondering where the Egyptians got the Doug fir from which to
build the craft--must be some more of those extraterrestrials that
helped w/ the pyramids, etc., ... beaming it over for 'em.

I believe that they would have used timbers from Lebanon. *They
had quite the reputation for supplying wood in the ancient past.

Most of that wood came from the Sahara Forest. My grand dad was a
lumberjack there.

Ohhhhhhhhhhhhhhh! So it's for _him_ The Lumberjack Song was written.

--
Experience is a good teacher, but she send in terrific bills.
-- Minna Thomas Antrim

DGDevin wrote:


"dpb" wrote in message ...

I start by wondering where the Egyptians got the Doug fir from which
to build the craft--must be some more of those extraterrestrials that
helped w/ the pyramids, etc., ... beaming it over for 'em.

Shipped in from France, ...

Doug fir from _FRANCE_????

Somehow the irony seems lost in the followups, here...

--

In article ,
says...

DGDevin wrote:


"dpb" wrote in message ...

I start by wondering where the Egyptians got the Doug fir from which
to build the craft--must be some more of those extraterrestrials that
helped w/ the pyramids, etc., ... beaming it over for 'em.

Shipped in from France, ...

Doug fir from _FRANCE_????

Somehow the irony seems lost in the followups, here...

Apparently the question they were trying to answer was whether the
Egyptians could build a ship that could operate safely on the Red Sea.
No big cedars in Lebanon anymore so the archaeologists had to do the
best they could with what they could get.

It's on Netflix for streaming--kind of interesting actually.

"dpb" wrote in message ...

Shipped in from France, ...

Doug fir from _FRANCE_????

Somehow the irony seems lost in the followups, here...

Apparently large quantities are also grown in Germany and New Zealand.