We have our number blocked on our land line phone. Imagine my surprise
when I called a merchants 800 number this morning and as soon as the call
was answered a computer voice informed me of the status of my order.

So I did some investigating. Seems there's a technique called automatic
number identification that's available to any owner of an 800 etc.
number. It ignores number blocking.

Sort of destroys the whole purpose, doesn't it?

At least the phone company isn't charging me for the blocking I thought I
had :-).

--
Intelligence is an experiment that failed - G. B. Shaw

On 7/28/10 11:12 PM, Larry Blanchard wrote:
We have our number blocked on our land line phone. Imagine my surprise
when I called a merchants 800 number this morning and as soon as the call
was answered a computer voice informed me of the status of my order.

So I did some investigating. Seems there's a technique called automatic
number identification that's available to any owner of an 800 etc.
number. It ignores number blocking.

Sort of destroys the whole purpose, doesn't it?

At least the phone company isn't charging me for the blocking I thought I
had :-).

It is a perk they get to avoid abuse of the 800 number, after all they
are paying for the call.

--
Froz...


The system will be down for 10 days for preventive maintenance.

Larry Blanchard wrote:

We have our number blocked on our land line phone. Imagine my surprise
when I called a merchants 800 number this morning and as soon as the call
was answered a computer voice informed me of the status of my order.

So I did some investigating. Seems there's a technique called automatic
number identification that's available to any owner of an 800 etc.
number. It ignores number blocking.

Sort of destroys the whole purpose, doesn't it?

At least the phone company isn't charging me for the blocking I thought I
had :-).


800 (and other toll-free) number owners are toting the tab for your call;
therefore, they want to know who is calling them. It avoids abuse.
--

There is never a situation where having more rounds is a disadvantage

Rob Leatham

"Larry Blanchard" wrote in message
...
We have our number blocked on our land line phone. Imagine my surprise
when I called a merchants 800 number this morning and as soon as the call
was answered a computer voice informed me of the status of my order.

So I did some investigating. Seems there's a technique called automatic
number identification that's available to any owner of an 800 etc.
number. It ignores number blocking.

Sort of destroys the whole purpose, doesn't it?

At least the phone company isn't charging me for the blocking I thought I
had :-).


IIRC, if you do business with a company ("order") they can call you.

In article ,
Larry Blanchard wrote:
We have our number blocked on our land line phone. Imagine my surprise
when I called a merchants 800 number this morning and as soon as the call
was answered a computer voice informed me of the status of my order.

So I did some investigating. Seems there's a technique called automatic
number identification that's available to any owner of an 800 etc.
number. It ignores number blocking.

Sort of destroys the whole purpose, doesn't it?

Nope. The owner of the 800 number is paying for the call. The only way
they can tell if they're paying the correct amount is if they know where
the call is coming from.

"CallerID blocking" blocks *only* callerid, not 800-numbe ANI.

If you don't want your number disclosed simply *DON'T*CALL*800* numbers.
As long as *YOU* pay for the call, your number won't be given out with
callerID blocking.

It's the 'golden rule' in action -- he who has the gold (and pays the bills)
gets to decide. ,grin

At least the phone company isn't charging me for the blocking I thought I
had :-).

You simply misunderstood _what_ you have. You have "CallerID blocking".
It works. It *DOES* do what it claims -- blocks delivery of CallerID
info - and **ONLY* 'CallerID' info. It does *NOT* block your info when
you call 911, as I'm sure you already knew, *if* you'd thought about it.

"Larry Blanchard" wrote in message
...
We have our number blocked on our land line phone. Imagine my surprise
when I called a merchants 800 number this morning and as soon as the call
was answered a computer voice informed me of the status of my order.

So I did some investigating. Seems there's a technique called automatic
number identification that's available to any owner of an 800 etc.
number. It ignores number blocking.

Sort of destroys the whole purpose, doesn't it?

At least the phone company isn't charging me for the blocking I thought I
had :-).

--
Intelligence is an experiment that failed - G. B. Shaw

ANI is a separate system from caller ID and uses different technology.
It was developed long before caller ID and is used by the phone
companies for routing and billing. No caller can block ANI when
making a call but any commercial customer, not just those with an 8xx
numbers, can pay a premium to the phone company so they can receive
the ANI information on every call. 911 emergency call centers all use
ANI to identify who is calling them.
Art

On Thu, 29 Jul 2010 11:49:35 -0500, Robert Bonomi wrote:


Nope. The owner of the 800 number is paying for the call. The only way
they can tell if they're paying the correct amount is if they know where
the call is coming from.


I see the logic to that - no argument. I guess my complaint is that the
phone company doesn't make that clear when someone opts for blocking. In
fact, I called the phone company to ask why my number wasn't blocked and
was told they had no idea. Hopefully, that was because of a single
employee's ignorance, not a company policy.

--
Intelligence is an experiment that failed - G. B. Shaw

Robatoy wrote:


My house phone is multiplexed on my internet and digital cable. Free
calls all across the US and Canuckistan. I wonder if I make a friend
of mine pay when I call his 800 number. Curious.

Yes. The owner of the 800 number always pays for every call received. It's
one of the priviledges of owning an 800 number.

--

-Mike-

Robert Bonomi wrote:


You simply misunderstood _what_ you have. You have "CallerID
blocking".
It works. It *DOES* do what it claims -- blocks delivery of CallerID
info - and **ONLY* 'CallerID' info. It does *NOT* block your info
when
you call 911, as I'm sure you already knew, *if* you'd thought about
it.

Precisely. CallerID and ANI are not the same thing. CallerID is a feature
your phone company offers to you as a fee based service. ANI exists on
every call made. The phone company knows and transfers this information
throughout their network on all calls. Just because you block CallerID, or
do not subscribe to the service, does not in any way imply that the
telephone company network is not fully aware of your number. How else would
phone billing work?

--

-Mike-

On Thu, 29 Jul 2010 23:14:18 -0400, "Mike Marlow"
wrote:

Robatoy wrote:


My house phone is multiplexed on my internet and digital cable. Free
calls all across the US and Canuckistan. I wonder if I make a friend
of mine pay when I call his 800 number. Curious.

Yes. The owner of the 800 number always pays for every call received. It's
one of the priviledges of owning an 800 number.

I believe some of the VOIP phone providers are now providing InWatts
service (800 numbers) free of incoming charges with some of their
packages.

"Larry Blanchard" wrote in message
...
On Thu, 29 Jul 2010 11:49:35 -0500, Robert Bonomi wrote:


Nope. The owner of the 800 number is paying for the call. The only way
they can tell if they're paying the correct amount is if they know where
the call is coming from.


I see the logic to that - no argument. I guess my complaint is that the
phone company doesn't make that clear when someone opts for blocking. In
fact, I called the phone company to ask why my number wasn't blocked and
was told they had no idea. Hopefully, that was because of a single
employee's ignorance, not a company policy.

Which phone company? Could very well be top to bottom ignorance.


--
Intelligence is an experiment that failed - G. B. Shaw

In article ,
Larry Blanchard wrote:
On Thu, 29 Jul 2010 11:49:35 -0500, Robert Bonomi wrote:


Nope. The owner of the 800 number is paying for the call. The only way
they can tell if they're paying the correct amount is if they know where
the call is coming from.


I see the logic to that - no argument. I guess my complaint is that the
phone company doesn't make that clear when someone opts for blocking.

They sell "CallerID", and "CallerID blocking".

CallerID blocking does _exactly_ wht it says it does. blocks the delivery
of _CallerID_ information.

Would you expect, if you have CallerID blocking on, that '911' would
_not_ get your phone number?

See, you _already_ knew that 'callerID blocking' doesn't block *all*
delivery of your phone number. *BIG* grin

You're just 'surprised' because there are *more* exceptions than you
_thought_ there were.

You 'jumped to a conclusion' without hard facts. The telco doesn't
tell you that 'callerID blocking' isn't effective when calling 911,
but you already -knew- that that was the case. The telco doesn't
tell you about other exceptions, and you _assumed_ that there weren't
any. with the usual result of 'ass-u-me'ing anything.


Toll-free number owners have _always_ gotten the "calling number", even
before either ANI or "CalleriD" *existed*. In the old days, they got
it, on paper, in the bill at the end of the billing cycle. ANI was a
'minor' enhancement, that simply provided the information in 'real time'.

I'd have to check, but I _believe_ that ANI _predates_ 'CallerID". In
it's traditional form, it was available *only* if you have full-blown
digital trunk lines (i.e., a "T-1" or above), delivering calls to
_your_ switchgear. There _used_ to be a few "CLECs" (competing local-
exchange carriers -- not the 'incumbant, the former 'ma bell' company)
who offered ANI delivered via callerID technology for folks with _small_
toll-fre operations. I don't know if anybody _still_ does that.

In
fact, I called the phone company to ask why my number wasn't blocked and
was told they had no idea. Hopefully, that was because of a single
employee's ignorance, not a company policy.

Did you explain you had 'callerID blocking' *AND* were calling a toll-free
number? If yes, you did get a poorly informed front-line service rep.


The telco's _are_ very careful as to what they say -- in their marketing,
etc. -- about callerID and callerID blocking. Part of it is what they
say, and part of it is what they _don't_ day. And they _are_ careful
to always say that 'callerID blocking" blocks the delivery of CallerID
info. That people who _have_callerID_ will not get your number.

Those who got your number in the past, *without* having callerID, can,
will, and *do* get your number _in_the_same_way_, today. Without
callerID.

'CallerID' blocking was implemented to provide the _same_ degree of 'privacy'
that was available *before* 'callerID' was available 'to the masses'.

It does -not- provide *complete* privacy/anonymity, and you won't find
anything in the telco literature promising that it does. -- if you *that*
is what you want, use a pay phone.

"Mike Marlow" wrote in message
...
Robatoy wrote:


My house phone is multiplexed on my internet and digital cable. Free
calls all across the US and Canuckistan. I wonder if I make a friend
of mine pay when I call his 800 number. Curious.

Yes. The owner of the 800 number always pays for every call received.
It's one of the priviledges of owning an 800 number.

--

-Mike-



Even more fun when your 800 number is one digit different than Alaska
Airline.

In article ,
Ed Pawlowski wrote:

"Mike Marlow" wrote in message
.. .
Robatoy wrote:


My house phone is multiplexed on my internet and digital cable. Free
calls all across the US and Canuckistan. I wonder if I make a friend
of mine pay when I call his 800 number. Curious.

Yes. The owner of the 800 number always pays for every call received.
It's one of the priviledges of owning an 800 number.

--

-Mike-



Even more fun when your 800 number is one digit different than Alaska
Airline.

Don't fight it, just 'accept' the reservations -- you've *always* got
seats available. And 'unadvertised specials' for pricing. evil grin

"Larry Blanchard" wrote in message
...
We have our number blocked on our land line phone. Imagine my surprise
when I called a merchants 800 number this morning and as soon as the call
was answered a computer voice informed me of the status of my order.

So I did some investigating. Seems there's a technique called automatic
number identification that's available to any owner of an 800 etc.
number. It ignores number blocking.

Sort of destroys the whole purpose, doesn't it?

At least the phone company isn't charging me for the blocking I thought I
had :-).

As others have said, ANI is available to 800, 888, 877, 866 and any other
toll free number protocol users that exist because they are paying for the
call. There is no simple way to block ANI when calling an 800 number.

Robort Bonomi - ANI absolutely does pre-date consumer caller ID by the
way...

However, it can be done contrary to what Artemus says. It just isn't as
simple as paying a few pennies to block your number the same way you do for
Caller ID.

The "best" way to block your number is to spoof it with your own private
PBX.

there are other ways by redirtecting your call through certain services or
operators who re-route your call and thus strip your call of ANI information
before it hits the 800 number...

So many details. I suggest searching Google for "ANI blocking", "Spoofing
my ANI", "Hiding ANI info", etc.

....And if you are really interested, subscribe to the magazine offered at
www.2600.com and learn lots about this and other technology stuff. There
are books written on this subject - some of which are available through
"vendors" listed in the back pages of 2600 magazines. Their magazines are
often found in Borders in the technology magazine section. They are smaller
than the rest of the offerings there.

Whatever you do, keep it moral. Teach others. Become a leader of the
ignorant, not their enemy. Knowledge is power.

(Soap box broke... Gotta go.)

Regards,
Joe Agro, Jr.
(800) 871-5022
01.908.542.0244
Automatic / Pneumatic Drills: http://www.AutoDrill.com
Multiple Spindle Drills: http://www.Multi-Drill.com
Production Tapping: http://Production-Tapping-Equipment.com/
Flagship Site: http://www.Drill-N-Tap.com
VIDEOS: http://www.youtube.com/user/AutoDrill
TWITTER: http://twitter.com/AutoDrill
FACEBOOK: http://tinyurl.com/AutoDrill-Facebook

V8013-R

In article ,
Joe AutoDrill wrote:
"Larry Blanchard" wrote in message
...
We have our number blocked on our land line phone. Imagine my surprise
when I called a merchants 800 number this morning and as soon as the call
was answered a computer voice informed me of the status of my order.

So I did some investigating. Seems there's a technique called automatic
number identification that's available to any owner of an 800 etc.
number. It ignores number blocking.

Sort of destroys the whole purpose, doesn't it?

At least the phone company isn't charging me for the blocking I thought I
had :-).

As others have said, ANI is available to 800, 888, 877, 866 and any other
toll free number protocol users that exist because they are paying for the
call. There is no simple way to block ANI when calling an 800 number.

Robort Bonomi - ANI absolutely does pre-date consumer caller ID by the
way...

However, it can be done contrary to what Artemus says. It just isn't as
simple as paying a few pennies to block your number the same way you do for
Caller ID.

The "best" way to block your number is to spoof it with your own private
PBX.

That fools CallerID, but _not_ ANI. If it did_, you could run up 'infinite'
LD charges on "somebody else's number". grin

there are other ways by redirtecting your call through certain services or
operators who re-route your call and thus strip your call of ANI information
before it hits the 800 number...

Yup. if you go through certai kinds of 'forwarding' services -- that *you*
PAY FOR -- they'll take out your call information and insert their own.

The "best" way to block your number is to spoof it with your own private
PBX.

That fools CallerID, but _not_ ANI. If it did_, you could run up
'infinite'
LD charges on "somebody else's number". grin

You are correct. My error.

there are other ways by redirtecting your call through certain services or
operators who re-route your call and thus strip your call of ANI
information
before it hits the 800 number...

Yup. if you go through certai kinds of 'forwarding' services -- that *you*
PAY FOR -- they'll take out your call information and insert their own.

There are some free ways to do it also... But they are few and far between
these days and probably pseudo-legal or at least pseudo-moral. I'd just use
a pay phone... Oh wait, they are all gone for the most part.

Regards,
Joe Agro, Jr.
(800) 871-5022
01.908.542.0244
Automatic / Pneumatic Drills: http://www.AutoDrill.com
Multiple Spindle Drills: http://www.Multi-Drill.com
Production Tapping: http://Production-Tapping-Equipment.com/
Flagship Site: http://www.Drill-N-Tap.com
VIDEOS: http://www.youtube.com/user/AutoDrill
TWITTER: http://twitter.com/AutoDrill
FACEBOOK: http://tinyurl.com/AutoDrill-Facebook

V8013-R

On 8/2/2010 8:20 AM, Joe AutoDrill wrote:
The "best" way to block your number is to spoof it with your own private
PBX.

That fools CallerID, but _not_ ANI. If it did_, you could run up
'infinite'
LD charges on "somebody else's number".grin

You are correct. My error.

there are other ways by redirtecting your call through certain services or
operators who re-route your call and thus strip your call of ANI
information
before it hits the 800 number...

Yup. if you go through certai kinds of 'forwarding' services -- that *you*
PAY FOR -- they'll take out your call information and insert their own.

There are some free ways to do it also... But they are few and far between
these days and probably pseudo-legal or at least pseudo-moral. I'd just use
a pay phone... Oh wait, they are all gone for the most part.

For now, just go down to the convenience store or Wally World or Worst
Buy or wherever and shell out green money for a prepaid no-contract cell
phone. A few states require that you show ID when paying cash for a
prepaid cell phone and Schumer is trying to get it required nationally,
but it's so far not required in most places. They can still track the
phone but they can't trace it to you unless they catch you with it.

For now, just go down to the convenience store or Wally World or Worst Buy
or wherever and shell out green money for a prepaid no-contract cell
phone. A few states require that you show ID when paying cash for a
prepaid cell phone and Schumer is trying to get it required nationally,
but it's so far not required in most places. They can still track the
phone but they can't trace it to you unless they catch you with it.

True... Good idea.
--


Regards,
Joe Agro, Jr.
(800) 871-5022
01.908.542.0244
Automatic / Pneumatic Drills: http://www.AutoDrill.com
Multiple Spindle Drills: http://www.Multi-Drill.com
Production Tapping: http://Production-Tapping-Equipment.com/
Flagship Site: http://www.Drill-N-Tap.com
VIDEOS: http://www.youtube.com/user/AutoDrill
TWITTER: http://twitter.com/AutoDrill
FACEBOOK: http://tinyurl.com/AutoDrill-Facebook

V8013-R

Try signing up at the following web site:

http://www.spoofcard.com

For toll free numbers, it forwards spoofcard's phone number when you make
the call.

For typical (non-800# type) calls, it forwards the numbr you request that it
send.

The price is a bit high if you look at the per minute charges... but if you
want the privacy, then it's important and worthwhile.

Regards,
Joe Agro, Jr.
(800) 871-5022
01.908.542.0244
Automatic / Pneumatic Drills: http://www.AutoDrill.com
Multiple Spindle Drills: http://www.Multi-Drill.com
Production Tapping: http://Production-Tapping-Equipment.com/
Flagship Site: http://www.Drill-N-Tap.com
VIDEOS: http://www.youtube.com/user/AutoDrill
TWITTER: http://twitter.com/AutoDrill
FACEBOOK: http://tinyurl.com/AutoDrill-Facebook

V8013-R