My gara... shop is unheated, except for the heat that bleeds from the
house, and wintertime woodworking in Seattle, although not quite as
rugged as in the Northeast, can be a bit chilly. Nonetheless, I have
glued up projects in temperatures colder than the minimum stated on
Titebond I many times, and have never had a glueline fail. I have
seen the chalking you would expect from glue that's too cold, but only
on the squeezeout.

However, this year I decided to try Titebond III, in part because it
has a lower working temperature than Titebond I. To my surprise, I
had a couple of joints fail, even though I was gluing at around the
minimum working temperature, 45 deg. F. Has anyone else experienced
this, or did I mess up some other factor, like starving the joint, or
maybe not having the surfaces in tight-enough contact?

wrote:
....
However, this year I decided to try Titebond III, in part because it
has a lower working temperature than Titebond I. To my surprise, I
had a couple of joints fail, even though I was gluing at around the
minimum working temperature, 45 deg. F. Has anyone else experienced
this, or did I mess up some other factor, like starving the joint, or
maybe not having the surfaces in tight-enough contact?

I'd go w/ the cold as the primary culprit. Yes, I've had the problem.

Remember it's the actual temperature of the material not just the glue
that will be controlling. Even if you bring the glue out from the
house, when it gets in contact w/ the wood surfaces that remained in the
shop it'll get to their temperature real quick.

I wouldn't risk low-temperature gluing -- the time involved in getting
to glue up plus the pita of repairing the results of a failure just
don't make it a paying proposition in my book. If you can't arrange
some heat or bring the work inside, my recommendation is to wait 'til
warmer weather.

--

On Jan 31, 10:42*am, dpb wrote:
wrote:

...

However, this year I decided to try Titebond III, in part because it
has a lower working temperature than Titebond I. *To my surprise, I
had a couple of joints fail, even though I was gluing at around the
minimum working temperature, 45 deg. F. *Has anyone else experienced
this, or did I mess up some other factor, like starving the joint, or
maybe not having the surfaces in tight-enough contact?

I'd go w/ the cold as the primary culprit. *Yes, I've had the problem.

Remember it's the actual temperature of the material not just the glue
that will be controlling. *Even if you bring the glue out from the
house, when it gets in contact w/ the wood surfaces that remained in the
shop it'll get to their temperature real quick.

I wouldn't risk low-temperature gluing -- the time involved in getting
to glue up plus the pita of repairing the results of a failure just
don't make it a paying proposition in my book. *If you can't arrange
some heat or bring the work inside, my recommendation is to wait 'til
warmer weather.

--

I too would recommend getting some heat to your project. I assume you
have Lectricity, so even a small portable radiant heater may do the
job. Maybe some real experts on the subject can verify my guess that
you would only need the heat for about an hour for the joint to set.
Hope this helps.....

Earlier this year someone here steered me to butane heaters.

I have an unheated space that I have to warm up intermittently. This
thing is just the ticket.

http://www.heatershop.com/propane_infrared_heaters.html

I think you just got lucky in the past. The chalking temp is pretty
well established and maybe just a humidty or other factor changed it
by chance.

If you don't want to warm the whole shop, and the projects are small
enough, let the wood and glue sit in the house and warm for a few
hours, take it all into the shop for glue-up and return it back to the
house to setup. Even just the warmth of a mud room, etc is probably
enough.


On Jan 31, 9:25*am, wrote:
My gara... shop is unheated, except for the heat that bleeds from the
house, and wintertime woodworking in Seattle, although not quite as
rugged as in the Northeast, can be a bit chilly. *Nonetheless, I have
glued up projects in temperatures colder than the minimum stated on
Titebond I many times, and have never had a glueline fail. *I have
seen the chalking you would expect from glue that's too cold, but only
on the squeezeout.

However, this year I decided to try Titebond III, in part because it
has a lower working temperature than Titebond I. *To my surprise, I
had a couple of joints fail, even though I was gluing at around the
minimum working temperature, 45 deg. F. *Has anyone else experienced
this, or did I mess up some other factor, like starving the joint, or
maybe not having the surfaces in tight-enough contact?

On Feb 3, 10:32*am, "SonomaProducts.com" wrote:
I think you just got lucky in the past. The chalking temp is pretty
well established and maybe just a humidty or other factor changed it
by chance.

If you don't want to warm the whole shop, and the projects are small
enough, let the wood and glue sit in the house and warm for a few
hours, take it all into the shop for glue-up and return it back to the
house to setup. Even just the warmth of a mud room, etc is probably
enough.

On Jan 31, 9:25*am, wrote:

My gara... shop is unheated, except for the heat that bleeds from the
house, and wintertime woodworking in Seattle, although not quite as
rugged as in the Northeast, can be a bit chilly. *Nonetheless, I have
glued up projects in temperatures colder than the minimum stated on
Titebond I many times, and have never had a glueline fail. *I have
seen the chalking you would expect from glue that's too cold, but only
on the squeezeout.

However, this year I decided to try Titebond III, in part because it
has a lower working temperature than Titebond I. *To my surprise, I
had a couple of joints fail, even though I was gluing at around the
minimum working temperature, 45 deg. F. *Has anyone else experienced
this, or did I mess up some other factor, like starving the joint, or
maybe not having the surfaces in tight-enough contact?

Good suggestions, all. Man, I wish I had a mud room! Or near
Seattle, where I am, a pine-needle room!

wrote:
My gara... shop is unheated, except for the heat that bleeds from the
house, and wintertime woodworking in Seattle, although not quite as
rugged as in the Northeast, can be a bit chilly. Nonetheless, I have
glued up projects in temperatures colder than the minimum stated on
Titebond I many times, and have never had a glueline fail. I have
seen the chalking you would expect from glue that's too cold, but only
on the squeezeout.

However, this year I decided to try Titebond III, in part because it
has a lower working temperature than Titebond I. To my surprise, I
had a couple of joints fail, even though I was gluing at around the
minimum working temperature, 45 deg. F. Has anyone else experienced
this, or did I mess up some other factor, like starving the joint, or
maybe not having the surfaces in tight-enough contact?


I live in one of the coldest climates of anyone in the Wreck. I also
have a shop that is mostly unheated, except for the time that I'm in it.
I keep my Titebond in a cabinet that is kept warm all the time to avoid
the -30° days. I've thrown out Titebond that has frozen and then been
thawed.

Having said that, I've also had some pretty serious glue failures in the
past, attributed to the cold. Not only just the temperature of the day,
but of the glue and of the surfaces I'm trying to glue.

I've learned that lesson. If I need to glue something up, the glue, and
the surfaces must have been in 60° for more than a couple of hours. If
that's not possible, I bring everything (including the clanky clamps
that my wife hates) inside and let them acclimatize. That's normally
overnight.

Since I've taken that attitude, the only glue failures I've had are from
badly mated surfaces.

Tanus

On Feb 5, 5:15*pm, Tanus wrote:
wrote:
My gara... shop is unheated, except for the heat that bleeds from the
house, and wintertime woodworking in Seattle, although not quite as
rugged as in the Northeast, can be a bit chilly. *Nonetheless, I have
glued up projects in temperatures colder than the minimum stated on
Titebond I many times, and have never had a glueline fail. *I have
seen the chalking you would expect from glue that's too cold, but only
on the squeezeout.

However, this year I decided to try Titebond III, in part because it
has a lower working temperature than Titebond I. *To my surprise, I
had a couple of joints fail, even though I was gluing at around the
minimum working temperature, 45 deg. F. *Has anyone else experienced
this, or did I mess up some other factor, like starving the joint, or
maybe not having the surfaces in tight-enough contact?

I live in one of the coldest climates of anyone in the Wreck. I also
have a shop that is mostly unheated, except for the time that I'm in it.
I keep my Titebond in a cabinet that is kept warm all the time to avoid
the -30° days. I've thrown out Titebond that has frozen and then been
thawed.

Having said that, I've also had some pretty serious glue failures in the
past, attributed to the cold. Not only just the temperature of the day,
but of the glue and of the surfaces I'm trying to glue.

I've learned that lesson. If I need to glue something up, the glue, and
the surfaces must have been in 60° for more than a couple of hours. If
that's not possible, I bring everything (including the clanky clamps
that my wife hates) inside and let them acclimatize. That's normally
overnight.

Since I've taken that attitude, the only glue failures I've had are from
badly mated surfaces.

Tanus

You could always ship your glue jobs to me here in Canada's Banana
Belt. G

Robatoy wrote:
On Feb 5, 5:15 pm, Tanus wrote:
wrote:
My gara... shop is unheated, except for the heat that bleeds from the
house, and wintertime woodworking in Seattle, although not quite as
rugged as in the Northeast, can be a bit chilly. Nonetheless, I have
glued up projects in temperatures colder than the minimum stated on
Titebond I many times, and have never had a glueline fail. I have
seen the chalking you would expect from glue that's too cold, but only
on the squeezeout.
However, this year I decided to try Titebond III, in part because it
has a lower working temperature than Titebond I. To my surprise, I
had a couple of joints fail, even though I was gluing at around the
minimum working temperature, 45 deg. F. Has anyone else experienced
this, or did I mess up some other factor, like starving the joint, or
maybe not having the surfaces in tight-enough contact?
I live in one of the coldest climates of anyone in the Wreck. I also
have a shop that is mostly unheated, except for the time that I'm in it.
I keep my Titebond in a cabinet that is kept warm all the time to avoid
the -30° days. I've thrown out Titebond that has frozen and then been
thawed.

Having said that, I've also had some pretty serious glue failures in the
past, attributed to the cold. Not only just the temperature of the day,
but of the glue and of the surfaces I'm trying to glue.

I've learned that lesson. If I need to glue something up, the glue, and
the surfaces must have been in 60° for more than a couple of hours. If
that's not possible, I bring everything (including the clanky clamps
that my wife hates) inside and let them acclimatize. That's normally
overnight.

Since I've taken that attitude, the only glue failures I've had are from
badly mated surfaces.

Tanus

You could always ship your glue jobs to me here in Canada's Banana
Belt. G

To save on the shipping (both ways) I could just toss them in the truck
and bring them down on my forays to the Great White South.

One of these days, I just gotta get a building that's heated.

Tanus

"Tanus" wrote

I've learned that lesson. If I need to glue something up, the glue, and
the surfaces must have been in 60° for more than a couple of hours. If
that's not possible, I bring everything (including the clanky clamps that
my wife hates) inside and let them acclimatize. That's normally overnight.

Ditto ... I have assembled full blown projects on the kitchen island when
it's below 45 degrees outside for any length of time, the parts come in the
night before, and the big bottle of TiteBond stays in my office in the
house, year around.


--
www.e-woodshop.net
Last update: 10/22/08
KarlC@ (the obvious)