Yeah, this has been visited time and time again. BUT times change.

I am looking to repair/replace a Makita 2.6 Ah 12 volt battery. Visiting
PrimeCell I am looking at a rebuild price of $47 + $7 s&h plus at least $7
for me to ship to them. Expense, about $61.

Oddly, you can buy completely new with as high or higher amp ratings for
about the same price or less. I am looking at Battery Barn and can get a
new 12 volt increased amp to 3.0 for $60 shipped.
The new battery has a 1 year warranty as opposed to many rebuilds that
warrant the rebuild any where from 30-90 days.


Similarly Batterybank has the battery new for $48 plus $6 for the first
pound, or $54 shipped. They are out of my battery until the middle of
March.

IT seems a no brainer to go new. Although this is not genuine Makita,
neither is the rebuild.

Any thoughts or suggestions?

On Feb 25, 2:06 pm, "Leon" wrote:

IT seems a no brainer to go new. Although this is not genuine Makita,
neither is the rebuild.

I would try to find out the maker of the little "C" cell batteries in
the "new" not original batteries would be. (You know your batteries
are just several individual units daisy chained together, right?) I
have opened up batteries that lasted a long time like in an old
DeWalt, and they were Panasonic. They were cycled and used to death
before playing out in three years. They seem to be pretty good.

Opening up lousy batteries on lousy tools, I found that they had names
like "Mr. Cheer" and "Sunrise" and "Powerful".

Before this guy got big, he gave me a great education on batteries and
how they are assembled, and how blessed we are to not know what crap
might be under the plastic.

http://www.voltmanbatteries.com/

I have found him to have the best price and the best product. Note -
you only ship one way, so you can put it in a priority mail flat rate
box and ship it up there cheap.

As always, just my 0.02.

If uncomfortable to with a rebuild, get a knockoff. If the folks have
a good reputation, buy it with your American Express so you will have
someone on your side if it fails. Also, you could check with AE to
see if they will double the manufacturer's warranty. Since it is new
(even though not OEM), they might.

Robert

wrote in message
...
On Feb 25, 2:06 pm, "Leon" wrote:

IT seems a no brainer to go new. Although this is not genuine Makita,
neither is the rebuild.

I would try to find out the maker of the little "C" cell batteries in
the "new" not original batteries would be. (You know your batteries
are just several individual units daisy chained together, right?) I
have opened up batteries that lasted a long time like in an old
DeWalt, and they were Panasonic. They were cycled and used to death
before playing out in three years. They seem to be pretty good.

Too Late! ;~) I ordered from abatterypack.com. Thay do have a 30 day
money back guarantee and a 1 year warranty.




Opening up lousy batteries on lousy tools, I found that they had names
like "Mr. Cheer" and "Sunrise" and "Powerful".

Oh boy.


Before this guy got big, he gave me a great education on batteries and
how they are assembled, and how blessed we are to not know what crap
might be under the plastic.

http://www.voltmanbatteries.com/

I have found him to have the best price and the best product. Note -
you only ship one way, so you can put it in a priority mail flat rate
box and ship it up there cheap.

As always, just my 0.02.

If uncomfortable to with a rebuild, get a knockoff. If the folks have
a good reputation, buy it with your American Express so you will have
someone on your side if it fails. Also, you could check with AE to
see if they will double the manufacturer's warranty. Since it is new
(even though not OEM), they might.

Yeah, what I ordered is a knock off. Better warranty and cheaper than any
rebuild that I ran across.
Thanks for the thoughts and link Robert.




Robert

Damn Leon... waited less than two hours for a reply before pulling the
trigger?

Needin' that battery for anything else?

;^)

Robert

wrote in message
...
Damn Leon... waited less than two hours for a reply before pulling the
trigger?

Needin' that battery for anything else?

;^)

Robert


My finger was awful itchy. I had been surfing for 2 days to save $20. I
thought that if I was making a terrible mistake some one would have
hollered. Any way thanks again Robert.
Do I need it now. Heck no. But If I don't get it now the other one that I
marked as questionable would probably poop out after it realized that it was
my only one. ;~)

On Feb 25, 4:56*pm, "
wrote:
On Feb 25, 2:06 pm, "Leon" wrote:

IT seems a no brainer to go new. *Although this is not genuine Makita,
neither is the rebuild.

I would try to find out the maker of the little "C" cell batteries *in
the "new" not original batteries would be. *(You know your batteries
are just several individual units daisy chained together, right?) *I
have opened up batteries that lasted a long time like in an old
DeWalt, and they were Panasonic. *They were cycled and used to death
before playing out in three years. *They seem to be pretty good.

Opening up lousy batteries on lousy tools, I found that they had names
like "Mr. Cheer" and "Sunrise" and "Powerful".

Before this guy got big, he gave me a great education on batteries and
how they are assembled, and how blessed we are to not know what crap
might be under the plastic.

*http://www.voltmanbatteries.com/

I have found him to have the best price and the best product. *Note -
you only ship one way, so you can put it in a priority mail flat rate
box and ship it up there cheap.

As always, just my 0.02.

If uncomfortable to with a rebuild, get a knockoff. *If the folks have
a good reputation, buy it with your American Express so you will have
someone on your side if it fails. *Also, you could check with AE to
see if they will double the manufacturer's warranty. *Since it is new
(even though not OEM), they might.

Robert

Have you done one of their 3300 rebuilds? Sounds juicy but wondering
if more han 2x price is worth it?

Mark

On Feb 25, 5:59 pm, BDBConstruction wrote:

Have you done one of their 3300 rebuilds? Sounds juicy but wondering
if more han 2x price is worth it?

Mark

No, not yet. I might... but they didn't have those last time I needed
batteries.

I can tell you one thing, though. I am not going to buy any more
lithium ion batteried tools until they quit making NiCad.

I have had two different tools using the LI batteries and they both
sucked. My NiCads will stay charged for quite a while in the truck
tool box until I need them. I just rotate around on the job as the
one in the drill always has a little juice left in it. I keep the
second battery (or alternate) charged and ready. When the power
fades, the battery in the tool goes in the charger and the one in
reserve goes in the drill.

But with my Lithium Ion stuff, both drill batteries go dead or show
significant drain in just a few days, even when sitting. I know the
advantage of the LI battery is that you can top them off at any time,
they keep their power in use longer, etc.

I don't come home after a long day and think to myself, "hey - you
should go dig out the drill batteries and top them off in case you
need them tomorrow." If I was going to fool with that crap I would go
back to corded.

My old 18v DeWalt drill batteries would stay charged in the truck for
a month. My super Makita LI batteries on my 14v won't hold a good
charge for half that time.

I guess if I was working in a shop the Makitas setup would be good as
I would plunk the batteries down on the charger every night.

When I get in home late, tired, hungry, with material tied over the
tool box onto the headache rack so I can't get the lid up, the last
thing I want to do is untie material, off load it in the front yard,
get the friggin' drill, charger, etc. out and set it up to charge
overnight.

No thanks.

Robert

wrote in message
...
On Feb 25, 5:59 pm, BDBConstruction wrote:

Have you done one of their 3300 rebuilds? Sounds juicy but wondering
if more han 2x price is worth it?

Mark

No, not yet. I might... but they didn't have those last time I needed
batteries.

I saw a 4.0 amp battery rebuild being offered.

On Feb 25, 7:15 pm, "
wrote:
On Feb 25, 5:59 pm, BDBConstruction wrote:

Have you done one of their 3300 rebuilds? Sounds juicy but wondering
if more han 2x price is worth it?

Mark

No, not yet. I might... but they didn't have those last time I needed
batteries.

I can tell you one thing, though. I am not going to buy any more
lithium ion batteried tools until they quit making NiCad.

I have had two different tools using the LI batteries and they both
sucked. My NiCads will stay charged for quite a while in the truck
tool box until I need them. I just rotate around on the job as the
one in the drill always has a little juice left in it. I keep the
second battery (or alternate) charged and ready. When the power
fades, the battery in the tool goes in the charger and the one in
reserve goes in the drill.

But with my Lithium Ion stuff, both drill batteries go dead or show
significant drain in just a few days, even when sitting. I know the
advantage of the LI battery is that you can top them off at any time,
they keep their power in use longer, etc.

I don't come home after a long day and think to myself, "hey - you
should go dig out the drill batteries and top them off in case you
need them tomorrow." If I was going to fool with that crap I would go
back to corded.

My old 18v DeWalt drill batteries would stay charged in the truck for
a month. My super Makita LI batteries on my 14v won't hold a good
charge for half that time.

I guess if I was working in a shop the Makitas setup would be good as
I would plunk the batteries down on the charger every night.

When I get in home late, tired, hungry, with material tied over the
tool box onto the headache rack so I can't get the lid up, the last
thing I want to do is untie material, off load it in the front yard,
get the friggin' drill, charger, etc. out and set it up to charge
overnight.

That's pretty weird. Li-ion batteries are known for holding their
charges for long periods - the shelf life is measured in years. NiCad
and NiMH both lose about 1 or 2 percent of their charge per day.
http://www.energizer.com/learning-ce...omparison.aspx

I recently pickes up some Makita Li-ion tools and do notice that they
drain more quickly in use, but they don't drain at all just sitting
there.

Battery technology has been a bottleneck for a long time, but there
does seem to be some interesting developments on the horizon:
http://news-service.stanford.edu/new...re-010908.html

R

On Feb 25, 10:11 pm, RicodJour wrote:

That's pretty weird. Li-ion batteries are known for holding their
charges for long periods - the shelf life is measured in years. NiCad
and NiMH both lose about 1 or 2 percent of their charge per day.

http://www.energizer.com/learning-ce...omparison.aspx

Note that they make NO claims as to the charge holding of the lithium
battery, only that it is lighter, and holds the charge for a long
time. The chart also make a clear delineation when referring to
rechargeable batteries like the NiMH battery you reference for the 1
-2% loss of charge. The lithium battery has no such reference.


I recently pickes up some Makita Li-ion tools and do notice that they
drain more quickly in use, but they don't drain at all just sitting
there.

That last damn drill was such a disappointment I wanted to beat it to
pieces with a hammer. I have no tolerance for tools that don't work.
I got the drill because I liked the feel, and that is certainly
important when you used it primarily as a screw driver.

But what they stress when you buy a lithium powered tool is the fact
that the lithium batteries don't develop a memory. That is their
claim to fame, the fact that you can top them off at will. I didn't
know until this second machine that the fault was the inherent fault
of the batteries and me not understanding their shortcomings.

Check this out it is the most comprehensive look at a lot of
researching I did when trying to return my Makita:

http://tinyurl.com/2ev5x2

I didn't know they had a much more limited life cycle than NiCads when
I popped for $240 for the Makita drill/driver. I didn't know that
they performed best in cooler weather - I live in a heat zone, and
wouldn't care to guess how hot it gets in the tool box every day. Or
on a an asphalt shingle roof, etc.

They work best when you store them at about a half charge. How would
you know that?

You aren't supposed to run the batteries all the way down. That means
when it won't drive that last screw and suddenly stops, you are the
one that gets screwed. Without a damn meter on the battery, how are
you supposed to know until the tool bogs down that you are low on
juice? By then it is too late.

Worse, it says in that document (and I have read it elsewhere) that
lithiums respond best to slow trickle charges. So that means every
time I plug it in to the quick charger I am contributing to its
shorter life. Great.

Look at those charts for ideas of diminishing performance, even under
great conditions.

Nope.. not for me. I was burned once, and although I am sure they
will get the technology where it needs to be, they aren't there yet.


Battery technology has been a bottleneck for a long time, but there
does seem to be some interesting developments on the horizon:

Soon I hope - before I need another cordless tool!

Robert

On Feb 25, 7:15*pm, "
wrote:
On Feb 25, 5:59 pm, BDBConstruction wrote:

Have you done one of their 3300 rebuilds? Sounds juicy but wondering
if more han 2x price is worth it?

Mark

No, not yet. *I might... but they didn't have those last time I needed
batteries.

I can tell you one thing, though. *I am not going to buy any more
lithium ion batteried tools until they quit making NiCad.

I have had two different tools using the LI batteries and they both
sucked. *My NiCads will stay charged for quite a while in the truck
tool box until I need them. *I just rotate around on the job as the
one in the drill always has a little juice left in it. *I keep the
second battery (or alternate) charged and ready. *When the power
fades, the battery in the tool goes in the charger and the one in
reserve goes in the drill.

But with my Lithium Ion stuff, both drill batteries go dead *or show
significant drain in just a few days, even when sitting. *I know the
advantage of the LI battery is that you can top them off at any time,
they keep their power in use longer, etc.

I don't come home after a long day and think to myself, "hey - you
should go dig out the drill batteries and top them off in case you
need them tomorrow." *If I was going to fool with that crap I would go
back to corded.

My old 18v DeWalt drill batteries would stay charged in the truck for
a month. *My super Makita LI batteries on my 14v won't hold a good
charge for half that time.

I guess if I was working in a shop the Makitas setup would be good as
I would plunk the batteries down on the charger every night.

When I get in home late, tired, hungry, with material tied over the
tool box onto the headache rack so I can't get the lid up, the last
thing I want to do is untie material, off load it in the front yard,
get the friggin' drill, charger, etc. out and set it up to charge
overnight.

No thanks.

Robert

Robert,

On Feb 25, 7:15*pm, "
wrote:
On Feb 25, 5:59 pm, BDBConstruction wrote:

Have you done one of their 3300 rebuilds? Sounds juicy but wondering
if more han 2x price is worth it?

Mark

No, not yet. *I might... but they didn't have those last time I needed
batteries.

I can tell you one thing, though. *I am not going to buy any more
lithium ion batteried tools until they quit making NiCad.

I have had two different tools using the LI batteries and they both
sucked. *My NiCads will stay charged for quite a while in the truck
tool box until I need them. *I just rotate around on the job as the
one in the drill always has a little juice left in it. *I keep the
second battery (or alternate) charged and ready. *When the power
fades, the battery in the tool goes in the charger and the one in
reserve goes in the drill.

But with my Lithium Ion stuff, both drill batteries go dead *or show
significant drain in just a few days, even when sitting. *I know the
advantage of the LI battery is that you can top them off at any time,
they keep their power in use longer, etc.

I don't come home after a long day and think to myself, "hey - you
should go dig out the drill batteries and top them off in case you
need them tomorrow." *If I was going to fool with that crap I would go
back to corded.

My old 18v DeWalt drill batteries would stay charged in the truck for
a month. *My super Makita LI batteries on my 14v won't hold a good
charge for half that time.

I guess if I was working in a shop the Makitas setup would be good as
I would plunk the batteries down on the charger every night.

When I get in home late, tired, hungry, with material tied over the
tool box onto the headache rack so I can't get the lid up, the last
thing I want to do is untie material, off load it in the front yard,
get the friggin' drill, charger, etc. out and set it up to charge
overnight.

No thanks.

Robert

Whooops, hit send by accident on that last one,
Your post is all too familiar to us. That said, we have had a little
better results with Li than you it seems. I only have a couple tools
using them (bosch Idrive and impactor) and they have held charge for a
long time and worked fine. Our primary cordless' however are a bunch
of makita 12v and 14.4v impact drivers running NiMH batteries. My only
complaint with the NiMH is they dont perform well in extreme cold
which hurts in the winter. We also take pretty good care of them as I
have read alot about NiMH not wanting to be deeply drained a lot (swap
at first sign of slowdown), and that they like an overnight charge
periodically. This hasnt been a problem for us so far. We are only
about a year or so back into cordless as we quit on them all together
for about 10 years or so. I got real sick of paying 3-4 hundred
dollars a year for batteries when extension cords are all over every
job and free. When I finally quit on cordless I wondered why I hadnt
done it earlier. The power, no batteries, far outweight the issues of
stringing a cord. With the new compact impacts however the tables have
again turned. I dont know what I would do without the half dozen
impacts laying around the job. They are just astounding the work they
will do and how long they run.

Anyway, I was always thinking of getting some of the 3.0ah NiMH
batteries from makita for these impacts but now I am thinking about
rebuilding a couple of the dead ones with the 3300 option on that
site. Will let you know if I do.

Mark

On Feb 26, 11:33 am, BDBConstruction
wrote:

Anyway, I was always thinking of getting some of the 3.0ah NiMH
batteries from makita for these impacts but now I am thinking about
rebuilding a couple of the dead ones with the 3300 option on that
site. Will let you know if I do.

Mark

Love to hear your results, Mark. As Rico pointed out, battery drives
are a work in progress. There are different types of chemical mixes
for the batteries we get, and sadly we are the guinea pigs for the
industry.

Depending on the type of job I am doing, I will usually bring corded
backup. I don't care if I am down for just an hour, it ****es me
off. I don't need the help tidying up the site while the tools, and
when I think of what a couple of guys cost (crap, I;m cheap compared
to them!) I will take a reliable tool over a slick tool any time.
Over the years (as you can probably tell) I have developed a deep hate
for unreliable or difficult tools.

The two best cordless drills I ever had on site: My old DeWalt 18v
cordless. It lasted three years of doing everything from boring
several doors a day, installing cabinets, to hanging gutter. And when
the second battery was about to die, the transmission broke. I got
every nickel and many more out of that drill.

The other one is a Sears "professional series" 14v drill. I bought it
on ebay for $53 to the door. I thought it would be a good drill to
send out on the job with the Indians. It won't die, performs all the
same duties that the old 18v DeWalt did, and still works great after 3
1/2 years of solid use.

The guys at the big tool warranty service center (not Sears) where I
buy parts told me that the difference between the professional series
from Sears is they put a Johnson motor in for power (same as the old
DeWalts) instead of the Chinese knockoff, Panasonic batteries, and
metal gears in the transmission.

I don't know that I like it well enough to pay full price for it,
though.

All I want is solid performance. So hard to find these days. I guess
I could get the Festools, Feins, and others on the job, and I might if
I was the only one that used them. But I am not, because from time to
time I feel like I have probably equipped most of the city with
carpentry tools that have walked off the job. No need to equip the
city with the best, they seem to be doing well with my Bosch, DeWalt
and PC tools.

It is a constant balancing act for me to find a good solid performing
tool at a price that I can afford if it gets lost or damaged.

I will look for your post on the batteries.

Robert

On Feb 26, 12:33 pm, BDBConstruction
wrote:
On Feb 25, 7:15 pm, "
wrote:



On Feb 25, 5:59 pm, BDBConstruction wrote:

Have you done one of their 3300 rebuilds? Sounds juicy but wondering
if more han 2x price is worth it?

Mark

No, not yet. I might... but they didn't have those last time I needed
batteries.

I can tell you one thing, though. I am not going to buy any more
lithium ion batteried tools until they quit making NiCad.

I have had two different tools using the LI batteries and they both
sucked. My NiCads will stay charged for quite a while in the truck
tool box until I need them. I just rotate around on the job as the
one in the drill always has a little juice left in it. I keep the
second battery (or alternate) charged and ready. When the power
fades, the battery in the tool goes in the charger and the one in
reserve goes in the drill.

But with my Lithium Ion stuff, both drill batteries go dead or show
significant drain in just a few days, even when sitting. I know the
advantage of the LI battery is that you can top them off at any time,
they keep their power in use longer, etc.

I don't come home after a long day and think to myself, "hey - you
should go dig out the drill batteries and top them off in case you
need them tomorrow." If I was going to fool with that crap I would go
back to corded.

My old 18v DeWalt drill batteries would stay charged in the truck for
a month. My super Makita LI batteries on my 14v won't hold a good
charge for half that time.

I guess if I was working in a shop the Makitas setup would be good as
I would plunk the batteries down on the charger every night.

When I get in home late, tired, hungry, with material tied over the
tool box onto the headache rack so I can't get the lid up, the last
thing I want to do is untie material, off load it in the front yard,
get the friggin' drill, charger, etc. out and set it up to charge
overnight.

No thanks.

Robert

Whooops, hit send by accident on that last one,
Your post is all too familiar to us. That said, we have had a little
better results with Li than you it seems. I only have a couple tools
using them (bosch Idrive and impactor) and they have held charge for a
long time and worked fine. Our primary cordless' however are a bunch
of makita 12v and 14.4v impact drivers running NiMH batteries. My only
complaint with the NiMH is they dont perform well in extreme cold
which hurts in the winter. We also take pretty good care of them as I
have read alot about NiMH not wanting to be deeply drained a lot (swap
at first sign of slowdown), and that they like an overnight charge
periodically. This hasnt been a problem for us so far. We are only
about a year or so back into cordless as we quit on them all together
for about 10 years or so. I got real sick of paying 3-4 hundred
dollars a year for batteries when extension cords are all over every
job and free. When I finally quit on cordless I wondered why I hadnt
done it earlier. The power, no batteries, far outweight the issues of
stringing a cord. With the new compact impacts however the tables have
again turned. I dont know what I would do without the half dozen
impacts laying around the job. They are just astounding the work they
will do and how long they run.

Anyway, I was always thinking of getting some of the 3.0ah NiMH
batteries from makita for these impacts but now I am thinking about
rebuilding a couple of the dead ones with the 3300 option on that
site. Will let you know if I do.

My experience with the Makita NiMH differs somewhat. I get the same
experience, in essence, that I get with AA NiMH batteries for flash
units and cameras: they work well for a week, whether heavy or
intermittent; if they are left sitting for two weeks, the batteries
are drained enough to need recharging (without ANY use). The self-
discharge features is a royal PITA when you're handling a couple dozen
batteries. I'm about to toss the drill the batteries go in, and put
the charger up on eBay. Actually, I guess, the drill is OK, but I
don't have any NiCads and see no reason to buy them when I have two
DeWalt and one Bosch drill, plus a whole bunch of Ryobi LiOn gear.

Another factor: almost every NiMH battery I've used was shot at
between two and three years of age, would no longer hold a charge
longer than a couple hours, if that long.

Mon, Feb 25, 2008, 2:06pm (EST-1) (Leon)
doth sayeth:
snip Any thoughts or suggestions?

My thought is, all this merely reinforces my decision to stick with
corded drills.

Both of my sons own, and use, at their jobs, battery tools.
Because they often work at job sites with no power available, thus
require them. At home, I don't think either uses battery tools, just
corded tools.



JOAT
10 Out Of 10 Terrorists Prefer Hillary For President - Bumper Sticker

I do not have a problem with a woman president - except for Hillary.

"J T" wrote in message
...
Mon, Feb 25, 2008, 2:06pm (EST-1) (Leon)
doth sayeth:
snip Any thoughts or suggestions?

My thought is, all this merely reinforces my decision to stick with
corded drills.

Both of my sons own, and use, at their jobs, battery tools.
Because they often work at job sites with no power available, thus
require them. At home, I don't think either uses battery tools, just
corded tools.


Well corded is a must have and I have a couple but the clutch on the
cordless drills is a nice feature that would probably cut deeply into
battery drill sales, so we will probably never see one.

On Feb 27, 6:08*pm, (J T) wrote:

* * *Both of my sons own, and use, at their jobs, battery tools.
Because they often work at job sites with no power available, thus
require them. *At home, I don't think either uses battery tools, just
corded tools.

For me, if I was working on a site that had no power and wanted to
insure my days pay, the last thing I would rely on is a cordless tool.
I would have a small 1.5 or 2 KW genset (carry with one hand) or a
true sine inverter in the truck. I may still have the cordless but I
surely wouldnt rely on them for my days pay. Too short sighted. An
even further suck factor for cordless tools is many of the chargers
will not perform, or perform at 1/2 power or less, on genset or
inverted (not true sine) power. This means plugging them in to a
generator or low end inverter may result in slow charging or majic
smoke. Buying dedicated 12vdc chargers is a further nudge toward a
good small genset.

Mark

Wed, Feb 27, 2008, 4:59pm (EST-3)
(BDBConstruction) doth sayeth:
For me, if I was working on a site that had no power and wanted to
insure my days pay, the last thing I would rely on is a cordless tool. I
would have a small 1.5 or 2 KW genset snip

Normally I would agree. However, they only need to drill a hole or
two, maybe cut a 2X4, 2X6, etc. One does heating and air, the other
refrigeration. In their case it would take them more time getting a
genset out and setting it up than just using a battery tool. In their
situation, battery tools actually make sense.



JOAT
10 Out Of 10 Terrorists Prefer Hillary For President - Bumper Sticker

I do not have a problem with a woman president - except for Hillary.