I have a little shop in my basement, and it works, especially since
it's my only option right now. What are your alternatives?
Pros: Easy access from the house - don't have to go outside. Doesn't
get below freezing. Lots of floor joists from which to hang tools etc.
Access to electricity (main panel) is usually easy. Your tools and
projects are hidden from prying eyes. Noise is less likely to bother
neighbors.
Cons: Noise can bother others in your house. Access is limited - think
about getting all your machines and stock down whatever stairs and
through whatever doors are there... Windows for ventilation may be
limited. Size for shop expansion is limited. Dust can get into rest
of the house. Theoretically, dust and/or fumes can pose a threat with
the open flames (pilot) of furnaces/water heaters. Ceiling height
limited - a shed/outdoor shop can be higher, which could be nice.
That's what comes to mind right now - I'll let you know if I think of
anything else. Good luck,
Andy
(Sorry if this gets posted twice!)

Joe Roberts wrote:
I am looking for pros and cons of having a woodworking shop in a new house
basement mainly from woodworkers who have a woodworking shop in their
basement.
Thanks

I am looking for pros and cons of having a woodworking shop in a new house
basement mainly from woodworkers who have a woodworking shop in their
basement.
Thanks

In article . com, "Andy" wrote:
I have a little shop in my basement, and it works, especially since
it's my only option right now. What are your alternatives?
Pros: Easy access from the house - don't have to go outside. Doesn't
get below freezing. Lots of floor joists from which to hang tools etc.
Access to electricity (main panel) is usually easy. Your tools and
projects are hidden from prying eyes. Noise is less likely to bother
neighbors.

Add to that:
- temperature is more clement in the summer, too
- with central air conditioning, humidity fairly well matches the rest of the
house
- *much* less expensive to use space you already have, compared to the cost of
constructing, heating, and cooling a separate building

Cons: Noise can bother others in your house. Access is limited - think
about getting all your machines and stock down whatever stairs and
through whatever doors are there... Windows for ventilation may be
limited. Size for shop expansion is limited. Dust can get into rest
of the house. Theoretically, dust and/or fumes can pose a threat with
the open flames (pilot) of furnaces/water heaters. Ceiling height
limited - a shed/outdoor shop can be higher, which could be nice.

Add to that:
- access is a problem not just getting raw materials in, but even more so in
getting finished projects out
- many basements have water infiltration issues; you need to really be on top
of that -- and if you have a sump pump, make sure you have a battery backup
too.

--
Regards,
Doug Miller (alphageek at milmac dot com)

It's time to throw all their damned tea in the harbor again.

Joe Roberts wrote:
I am looking for pros and cons of having a woodworking shop in a new house
basement mainly from woodworkers who have a woodworking shop in their
basement.

My buddy has a basement shop.

Cons:
Dust and noise getting into the rest of the house, difficulty of getting
sheet goods and tools into the basement, difficulty of getting finished
projects out.

Pros:
Already heated, easy electrical access.

Chris

Joe Roberts wrote:
I am looking for pros and cons of having a woodworking shop in a new house
basement mainly from woodworkers who have a woodworking shop in their
basement.
Thanks


Well, there are several considerations. I won't classify them as pros
or cons:

How's your headroom?
Remember, you'll be handling potentially long pieces of lumber. It
would be nice to do so without bapping them (or yourself) into the
floor joists.

How's your access?
How will you get those long pieces in and out of the basement?
Through the house? Through a window?
I myself load lumber through a basement window. It works well for
me.
Also, you'll need to get machinery down your basement stairs (unless
you have a walkout). Can you do that safely? Will you be able to get
finished projects back up those stairs?

How's your layout?
Do you have enough infeed and outfeed space for your saw(s)? Will
you need to move one machine in order to use another?

How's your lighting?
Four 50-watt bulbs won't cut it. Figure on at least three times the
lighting you probably already have, plus task lighting where needed. I
use can lights set between the overhead floor joists. Works nicely.
Like clamps, you can never have enough lighting.

How's your dust control?
Get a dust collector if you don't already have one. Tracking sawdust
on the carpets is not appreciated. Your mate and your lungs and your
furnace will thank you.

Any open flames?
Solvents and flames, such as are produced by furnaces and water
heaters don't get along. Enough said.

How's your electric service?
Do you have enough capacity to run those additional lighting
circuits mentioned above, plus possibly dedicated 220V lines for
stationary tools, plus general-purpose 15 or 20 amp lines?

How's your lumber storage?
Can you store your stash accessibly and safely within your shop?

The preceding are just a few points off the top of my head. NOT an
exhaustive list and NOT meant to dissuade you. I have had my shop in
the basement for many years. Half the fun is constantly tinkering with
the shop layout and making things work more efficiently.

The other half of the fun is "sawdust therapy" - right downstairs!!

Good Luck.

Hi Joe,
I guess it matters on the size of the shop. The basement and the house were
built around the shop(10 ft ceilings, dust collecting pipes under the
concrete,extra large double walk out doors, vents to the outside ,ect) I was
lucky the wife wanted a sunroom and gave me the basement as a woodshop. I
have 3 areas that I use a 16x16 main ,a 10x12 finishing room,and a 16x12
wood storage room.. The main advantage I found with the basement shop over
the garage shop is the all year use of the room and controlled humidity and
security. You may also save some money on house insurance if the insurance
company doesn't see your equipment(the garage is readily visible and the
basement is not)


len

On Tue, 16 Jan 2007 17:50:01 +0000, Joe Roberts wrote:

I am looking for pros and cons of having a woodworking shop in a new
house basement mainly from woodworkers who have a woodworking shop in
their basement.

Pros--convenient, easy to heat. Cons, getting tools and wood downstairs,
noise and dust in house. Some basements just plain leak--something went
wrong with the membrane seal or there wasn't one and water gets in. If
yours is one of those then it's going to be hard on both tools and wood.
Make sure that there's at least one path that you can get a sheet of
plywood through without buggering it up. There are generally exposed
wires in a basement--make sure that you have them protected to the extent
that you're not going to continually be wanging board-ends into them. If
it's a new house currently under construction you may want to talk to the
builder about putting in electrical outlets and additional lighting--if
there's an electrician on site already to do other work the incremental
cost should be small, however the builder may charge a ludicrous markup
on it.

--
--John
to email, dial "usenet" and validate
(was jclarke at eye bee em dot net)

J. Clarke wrote:
Some basements just plain leak--something went
wrong with the membrane seal or there wasn't one and water gets in.

True dat! I run a dehumidifier most of the summer, but our area has
flooded in the past, so that's always in the back of my mind. Of
course, if I had a garageshop, security would probably be more of a
worry. Nothing's perfect.
Have fun,
Andy

I've noticed everyone agrees on getting the tools, material, and
finished products in and out.
There are a couple of companies that can cut a hole in your foundation
and add precast
stairs to the outside. just add the doors. I'ts a whole lot easier than
going through the house
with everything. Also, use a dust collector, even though most
unfinihsed basements have no
air returns in the basement it sure does help the breathing.
Lou

I have had a basement shop and presently have one over the garage.
Basement is cheap and has problems listed by others. One benefit I wasn't
expecting occurred when I build a boat in the cellar. EVERYONE who came by
to check out progress opined that it probably wouldn't make it out the
cellar steps. So, when I called people to help lift the boat out the cellar
steps, EVERYONE showed up.....hoping to witness a disaster? Needless to
say, the boat came out without a scratch.
Over the garage looked great on paper; it is a really big two car garage
and the roof is 45 degree with an 18 inch knee wall. Problem is....there is
very little wall space. Wall space is very valuable!
Dave

Joe Roberts wrote:
I am looking for pros and cons of having a woodworking shop in a new house
basement mainly from woodworkers who have a woodworking shop in their
basement.
Thanks

I'll agree with everything else already said. If its a new house as
you state, make sure it is a walkout. Or build in from the start those
outside cellar doors.

With the old basement shop I was always worried about how to get big,
huge, heavy, industrial equipment into the basement. This was always a
deterrent. Maybe a good deterrent to getting crazy big equipment. I
had a straight shot from the outside door directly down the stairs so
12 foot boards and 4x8 plywood were easy to get in and out of the
basement. An appliance dolly could have handled a cabinet saw easy
enough if I had ever bought one. I made do with a contractor saw.

Biggest benefit is it is always available anytime night or day for a
minute or two or hours. Just walk downstairs and you are in the shop.
No walking outside to the detached garage/workshop. No walking in the
rain. No walking in the snow. And as someone else said, you work with
what you have. In most parts of the US basements are standard on
houses. No building an extra outside building. If you can even do
that. Cost or permit restrictions. No having your car ice and snow
covered because your shop is in your garage. And security.

I never found ceiling height much of a problem. All the stuff I ever
built had the long boards cut down to 6 feet at most at the very start
of the project. And if you are working on an 8 foot dining table, why
would you be standing the boards up on end anyway? They would always
be in the horizontal position. Never considered ceiling height a
drawback to worry about.

Basement is temperature controlled. Never colder than 50 in the
winter. Rarely above 80 in the summer. Never have to preheat or
precool the shop before you can use it and worry about the extra time
and cost before you can start using the shop. If you only have 30
minutes to enjoy, are you going to spend 15 heating the shop from 35 to
55? Middle of the midwest location for me. Do have to run a
dehumidifier as a necessity or precaution.

Bathroom is right upstairs. Or maybe have one in the basement too.
Water is accessible. Nice in a shop. Main electric panel will be in
the basement. Or as my situation is now, its in the garage but I can
easily run a subpanel to the basement. Just use some half size
breakers in the main panel to get extra space and put in a 60 amp 220
breaker. Run some heavy wire to the new big subpanel in the basement
and I'm all set with electricity. Run lights and outlets all over the
basement.

I never noticed dust in the rest of the house. I think this is usually
a fear of people who don't have a shop in the basement or people who
are not woodworkers. I do use a dust collection system.

I guess if I was fabulously wealthy, I'd have a separate building for
the shop. But if building a new house, I'd put in a walkout basement
and plan for the shop in the basement. Lot more advantages than
disadvantages for the recreational woodworker. A full time
professional would likely be better off with a separate building.

On 16 Jan 2007 10:40:34 -0800, "Lou" wrote:

I've noticed everyone agrees on getting the tools, material, and
finished products in and out.
There are a couple of companies that can cut a hole in your foundation
and add precast
stairs to the outside. just add the doors.

But since the stairs are close to the wall you do have some height
limitations. No problem getting boards in, sheet goods can be done
but you have to be careful. Can be an issue getting something like a
bookcase out.


-Leuf

Joe Roberts wrote:
I am looking for pros and cons of having a woodworking shop in a new house
basement mainly from woodworkers who have a woodworking shop in their
basement.
Thanks


Others have listed the pros and cons. I will just add I have just
finished putting in a basement shop (my third one to date) and enjoy it
greatly. Closing the shop door keeps the sawdust in the shop and out of
the house. My children are grown, so I don't worry about waking up the
kids running power tools after bedtime. We insulated the basement
cinder block walls with 2 inch blue board foam insulation with sheetrock
on top which helped a lot in the home heating bill and made it warmer
and drier.
Since you are planning new construction, allow for lots of light,
lots of wall sockets, a 220 volt circuit, and a sink for cleaning
brushes and stuff. And as much space as you can afford. Your table saw
wants 8-10 feet in front and in back, and at least 8 feet on one side if
you are gonna cut up 4*8 sheets of stuff.


David Starr

I have a shop in the basement. For me, the only major advantage is when it
gets to minus 30 C outside. Inside, I am warm!



Happy woodworking from the frozen north,



Mike





"Joe Roberts" wrote in message
...
I am looking for pros and cons of having a woodworking shop in a new house
basement mainly from woodworkers who have a woodworking shop in their
basement.
Thanks

Joe Roberts wrote:
I am looking for pros and cons of having a woodworking shop in a new house
basement mainly from woodworkers who have a woodworking shop in their
basement.
Thanks



Mine is in a walk-out basement, so it's dry and easy to access.

The Cons that still remain:

Little natural light
Low ceiling
Noise, dust, and smell migrate into the living space
Little natural light
Low ceiling
Lolly columns and a center staircase eat space
Little natural light
Low ceiling
Concrete floors
Little natural light
Low ceiling
Little natural light
Low ceiling
Little natural light
Low ceiling
Little natural light
Low ceiling

Sorry, I got stuck on little natural light and low ceiling. I'm getting
cabin fever. G

With a choice, I'd greatly prefer WINDOWS and some head space in a
detached building with no columns and wood floors.

In fact, I'd trade half my space to be above ground.

I pretty much agree with russellseaton1 above.

"Bathroom is right upstairs. Or maybe have one in the basement too.
Water is accessible."

We have a half bath in the basement.

"Biggest benefit is it is always available anytime night or day for a
minute or two or hours. Just walk downstairs and you are in the shop."

This is particularly handy for me. I am retired and I do not work for 6 - 8
hours at anything as a rule. While there have been times I wished I had a
shop in a detached building because of dust and noise, I would not spend
much time in it as I would not want to heat it continuously, I would not
want to heat it up of a few minutes of work (or cool it). As it is, I may
run down stairs for 15 minutes or a couple of hours when ever the notion
strikes me. We do have a straight in the back door stairs which is wider
than normal and makes access a little easier plus I cut plywood to rough
sizes in the garage. A basement where ground level entry is possible would
be better. I also have a dust collector plus a filter on the return air from
the shop area.

"You may also save some money on house insurance if the insurance company
doesn't see your equipment"

Anyone who thinks they are fooling the Insurance Company are only fooling
themselves as hidden, unreported, items aren't likely to be covered and may
even void the entire Insurance Policy if the need for it ever arises. Hobby
equipment is covered under our Home Owner's Policy.

Walt Conner

"Joe Roberts" wrote in message
...
I am looking for pros and cons of having a woodworking shop in a new house
basement mainly from woodworkers who have a woodworking shop in their
basement.

I went from having a shop in the basement to building a separate building
for my woodworking and everything else that goes with it. I also added a
lean-to to the shop for storing a tractor. I enjoyed building the shop
myself, and thought of the carpentry as a distant cousin to woodworking.

Now I can easily back the truck with large sheets of MDF or plywood right
there at the door of the shop and put a rolling table there to catch them
and never lift a sheet by hand. That is really nice.

And it is useful to have the standalone shop as a catch-all place for doing
things other than woodworking including (but not limited to)
auto/mower/tractor & gardening tool maintenance & repair. I have all my
woodworking tools on mobile bases so I can slide them out of the way and
easily bring in (for example) a riding mower in the summer for a flat tire
or blade changing etc. The grinder is right there. My files for sharpening
are right there for touching up a chainsaw. Before I had this separate
shop, I had to do some of these things in the basement and some in the
garage (or even the driveway) which does not have space for a workbench or
cabinets, and it was a hassle having tools in two places. It is also nice
to not worry with making noise & dust. Of course it increases the value of
the house, but who cares anyway?...

Having said all that, when I sit and think about it, I believe I enjoyed the
woodworking shop in the basement more, and if it weren't for the thought of
hauling all those power tools down there (no large walk-out access
unfortunately), I might be tempted to move back. It was just cozier there,
and heating & cooling was not a problem at all.

My $0.02..
Cheers!
Dukester

Joe Roberts wrote:
I am looking for pros and cons of having a woodworking shop in a new house
basement mainly from woodworkers who have a woodworking shop in their
basement.
Thanks
I don't think anyone's told this particular story yet:
Years ago, I started my shop in the basement. One winter day I resawed
some cedar with the tablesaw, the dust collection wasn't all that good
yet, and I put a very teensy tiny little bitty light coat of sawdust
over everything in the basement including the washer and dryer. SWMBO
put me in the garage the first warm day of spring. She was not open to
negotiation.

When I was done with the wiring and had all the tools out there and put
everything on wheels to accommodate her car, she told me I could have
her side of the garage and she'd park outside.

I like the garage better. More room. No laundry. Heat is a problem but
I'm okay with the tradeoff. Everything's fine with the marriage.

Joe Roberts wrote:
I am looking for pros and cons of having a woodworking shop in a new house
basement mainly from woodworkers who have a woodworking shop in their
basement.
Thanks

Basement, hell. I'm taking over the entire house. Wood storage --
right next to the refrigerator. The people I live with couldn't give a

damn less.

Biggest probs with a basement shop are noise (don't locate machines
under living room areas, agree to a cutoff time) and dust, meaning
dust onto your projects during finishing, not from them.

It's a little better if your basement layout permits your workbench to be
near those walkout slider doors and a relaxing view through them is
achievable.

David Merrill


"B A R R Y" wrote in message
et...
Joe Roberts wrote:
I am looking for pros and cons of having a woodworking shop in a new
house
basement mainly from woodworkers who have a woodworking shop in their
basement.
Thanks



Mine is in a walk-out basement, so it's dry and easy to access.

The Cons that still remain:

Little natural light
Low ceiling
Noise, dust, and smell migrate into the living space
Little natural light
Low ceiling
Lolly columns and a center staircase eat space
Little natural light
Low ceiling
Concrete floors
Little natural light
Low ceiling
Little natural light
Low ceiling
Little natural light
Low ceiling
Little natural light
Low ceiling

Sorry, I got stuck on little natural light and low ceiling. I'm getting
cabin fever. G

With a choice, I'd greatly prefer WINDOWS and some head space in a
detached building with no columns and wood floors.

In fact, I'd trade half my space to be above ground.

My wife wants me to build a detached shop, but I'm resisting. I'm now
in the 1400 SF basement. It is heated and air conditioned 24/7/365,
has telephone, cable, ethernet, hot and cold running water, a bathroom
with a shower, a walkout entrance, and is a 10 second walk from
anywhere in the house, in my underwear if I want.

Her main objections to the status quo:


Foot- and clothes-borne Dust & Shavings: Shavings and dust gets tracked

through the house and fall off my person. My solution: Try to keep
the shop floor swept. Brush myself off. Resolve to wear shoes in the

shop. Go upstairs only when summoned.


Airborne Dust: The 2 HP Grizzley gets most of it, but catching all the

fine dust from every machine is pretty tough. My solution: Do my best
to collect the dust. Try to limit long- duration dust-generating
activities, instead spreading them out to more frequent, smaller
dust-generating incidents. This reduces my culpability by making my
dust mostly disappear in the dust background noise floor.


Noise: Two or three horsepower's worth of abuse to a piece of wood can

create some pretty obxoxious noise levels. My solution: Insulate &
acoustically decouple the shop ceiling. Keep doors closed. Save the
noisest stuff for when no one else is home, or after my wife goes to
bed. Suggest the next day that maybe she dreamt it.


Odors: My wife actually says she likes the smell of some cut woods,
but it's some of the finishes, paints, and adhesives that are the
problem. My solution: Do these smelly operations outside when
possible. Otherwise, do them after she goes to bed. The odors will
normally be gone in the morning, and I can play dumb be especially
sympathetic about any headache complaints. Give waterborne finishes
and adhesives yet another chance.


On the other hand, my wife does acknowledge that accessibility (to me)
is pretty good the way it is, and she'd hate to give up the immediate
response she now enjoys in emergency situations like, say, a bug in the

sink.





Joe Roberts wrote:
I am looking for pros and cons of having a woodworking shop in a new house
basement mainly from woodworkers who have a woodworking shop in their
basement.
Thanks

I happen to work in "my" half of the two-car garage, both bays of which
are below the living space. Pros: easy access, can expand into the
driveway during warm weather, excellent light with the garage door open,
sufficiently well insulated so as not to bother the folks upstairs.
Cons: it's dark in winter and a little cramped, had to wall off the shop
to keep dust/shavings from littering "her" half and the family station
wagon, the central vacuum scares the bejeezus out of me whenever someone
upstairs decides a carpet needs cleaning.

Without the garage bay door I think my woodworking would be limited to
quite small projects (and tooling) that would fit around tight corners
and through standard 3 foot doors. Staircases to the cellar are not
often well placed. (Mine aren't.)

J.

Joe Roberts wrote:
I am looking for pros and cons of having a woodworking shop in a new house
basement mainly from woodworkers who have a woodworking shop in their
basement.
Thanks

On Tue, 16 Jan 2007 17:50:01 GMT, "Joe Roberts"
wrote:

I am looking for pros and cons of having a woodworking shop in a new house
basement mainly from woodworkers who have a woodworking shop in their
basement.

Most of the issues I would add to have already been addressed, and
pretty much the way I would address them.

I worked in a basement shop for 21 years (in Northern Illinois). I
liked it in the main. However, I didn't have a full complement of
Delta tools then, and I shudder now to think of getting them down to
the basement if I were still there. Not so much size, but
overstressing what are essentially two half 2x12s holding things up. I
think I'd do some major reinforcing, were I in that position again.

Lighting. This goes for any shop. Your eyes are the best right now
that they will ever be. There is no such thing, in my mind, as too
much light. I was always happy with what I had in my shop.
Approximately 350 ft^2, with five or six 8' two tube fixtures, and a
couple of two tube 4'ers.

I didn't realize how good I had it until I took the shop apart. I went
down in the basement afterwards at midday on a sunny day, and even
with the puny single incandescant on, it was like being in a cave. I
was shocked.

Gawd, wiring was easy.

Can't over-agree on the low ceiling assessment. I've since been in
basements that had 9' foot ceilings, and my thought is, "oh, if I'd
only known." Of course even if I had, it probably would have wound up
being, "oh, if I only could afford it."

One problem no one has touched on, and it might have been slightly
unique to me. We had a two story colonial with essentially a full
attic. I had my ham radio room in a bedroom on the second floor. The
attic had lots of associated coaxial and control cable. The second
floor was also where many of my wreck pearls in the late '90s came
from, as it doubled as the computer room. Although I've long been
smart enough to have radio room tools, garage tools, kitchen tools, as
well as shop tools, that pertains mostly to screwdrivers, small
wrenches, and small socket sets. If I needed a saw or drill bits, it
was a two to three story hike down to the shop and a two or three
story hike back up. That was less a problem when I was 30 than it was
when I was 51.

In the main, I liked it.

--
LRod

Master Woodbutcher and seasoned termite

Shamelessly whoring my website since 1999

http://www.woodbutcher.net

Proud participant of rec.woodworking since February, 1997

email addy de-spam-ified due to 1,000 spams per month.
If you can't figure out how to use it, I probably wouldn't
care to correspond with you anyway.

David Merrill wrote:
It's a little better if your basement layout permits your workbench to be
near those walkout slider doors and a relaxing view through them is
achievable.

The furnace is right next to the non-sliding doors.8^(

On Tue, 16 Jan 2007 17:50:01 GMT, "Joe Roberts"
wrote:

I am looking for pros and cons of having a woodworking shop in a new house
basement mainly from woodworkers who have a woodworking shop in their
basement.

Pros:

Semi climate controlled, easy access to wiring and plumbing. Sound is
almost entirely blocked so the neighbors can't complain.

Cons:

Difficult to get things in/out (though that isn't true in my case, as
I have a 36" door to the garage in my basement.), finishing fumes will
raise up through the floor and stink up the house from time to time,
low ceiling (mine is 7") and the furnace will need filters and
regular cleaning more often.

Having had both a garage and a basement shop, it's been my experience
that the basement shop is far nicer for me. There's no additional
heating or cooling costs, and I never have to wade through snow to get
to the shop. It is also more secure, and nobody knows it's there
unless I tell them- which isn't necessarily true about a garage shop
if you work with the door open in the summer. The furnace is far less
of a problem than I was afraid it might be- I give it a good cleaning
every couple of months, and it usually doesn't even really seem to
need it.

On 16 Jan 2007 09:57:50 -0800, "Gus" wrote:

How's your dust control?
Get a dust collector if you don't already have one. Tracking sawdust
on the carpets is not appreciated. Your mate and your lungs and your
furnace will thank you.

One thing that really helps, and I can't even really take credit for
it, is that the basement stairs in my place were carpeted when I
bought the place. Works really well for scrubbing the sawdust off
while climbing the stairs.

David Merrill wrote:
It's a little better if your basement layout permits your workbench to be
near those walkout slider doors and a relaxing view through them is
achievable.

David Merrill


The shop in my old house had an interesting view. The lady that lived
behind me had two college aged daughters that would sunbathe in the
backyard in bikinis every afternoon.. made it hard to get work done.

ed_h wrote:
Odors: My wife actually says she likes the smell of some cut woods,
but it's some of the finishes, paints, and adhesives that are the
problem. My solution: Do these smelly operations outside when
possible. Otherwise, do them after she goes to bed. The odors will
normally be gone in the morning, and I can play dumb be especially
sympathetic about any headache complaints. Give waterborne finishes
and adhesives yet another chance.

I have a small window in the basement shop. I got one of those window
fans and use it to blow
air outside when finishing. I'll let it run until I go to bed (as the
finish dries). It makes a huge difference
in the amount of odor that gets in the house.

In fact, I've gotten to the point where I do almost no finishing in
cold weather because I don't like the odors of finishing all over the
house either.. So when spring comes, I usually have a backlog of things
to stain and poly.
Gives me an excuse to start new projects in the winter.. Darn it, it's
just too cold to go any further on this project, time to start another.

LRod wrote:

I worked in a basement shop for 21 years (in Northern Illinois). I
liked it in the main. However, I didn't have a full complement of
Delta tools then, and I shudder now to think of getting them down to
the basement if I were still there. Not so much size, but
overstressing what are essentially two half 2x12s holding things up. I
think I'd do some major reinforcing, were I in that position again.


That's actually not a concern. My basement stairs are even wimpier than
2 X 12s .. they are prehab crap.

I've gotten a 18" bandsaw down there (I think it was around 400 lbs),
as well as
other very heavy stuff. It's not fun, but it's doable. The loads as you
bring them down
the stairs are only temporary.

Of course, my basement stairway is straight, which helps a lot. If you
have a bend or landing
on your basement stairs, that makes things a lot more difficult. That
was the main requirement for
me buying any house.. either a walk out basement or woodworking
accessable stairs down there.

As far as dust control, I walled off half the basement for the shop. I
sealed it off from the rest of the house pretty good, but it could be
better.

Let me summarize my rambling response. And agree with WConner. With
the shop in the basement, it is far more likely to be used because it
is so close and always ready to go. No preheating for 15 minutes to
use it for 10 minutes, no precooling. Since a basement is mentioned, I
assume the house is in the colder climates where heating a detached
building or even attached garage would be required. Think about how
often you just walk into your shop for a minute or two? Easy to do if
the shop is in the basement. That convenience trumps lots of
disadvantages. If starting with a new house you can build in ways to
overcome the main disadvantage of accessibility for big heavy tools and
wood and plywood and finished projects. Walkout basement, outside
Bilco door, straight wide stairs to the basement from outside. As for
dust getting in the rest of the house, new nice gas furnaces can use
outside air for combustion so they can almost be selaed off from the
inside air. Double door vestibules to keep dust downstairs can be put
in. Weather stripping on doors downstairs. Lots of easy ways to keep
dust in the basement. And put a bathroom in the basement so you can
clean up and not track dust and dirt upstairs. Put a small cheap
refrigerator in the basement so you don't have to go upstairs and track
dust for a drink.


wrote:
Joe Roberts wrote:
I am looking for pros and cons of having a woodworking shop in a new house
basement mainly from woodworkers who have a woodworking shop in their
basement.
Thanks

I'll agree with everything else already said. If its a new house as
you state, make sure it is a walkout. Or build in from the start those
outside cellar doors.

With the old basement shop I was always worried about how to get big,
huge, heavy, industrial equipment into the basement. This was always a
deterrent. Maybe a good deterrent to getting crazy big equipment. I
had a straight shot from the outside door directly down the stairs so
12 foot boards and 4x8 plywood were easy to get in and out of the
basement. An appliance dolly could have handled a cabinet saw easy
enough if I had ever bought one. I made do with a contractor saw.

Biggest benefit is it is always available anytime night or day for a
minute or two or hours. Just walk downstairs and you are in the shop.
No walking outside to the detached garage/workshop. No walking in the
rain. No walking in the snow. And as someone else said, you work with
what you have. In most parts of the US basements are standard on
houses. No building an extra outside building. If you can even do
that. Cost or permit restrictions. No having your car ice and snow
covered because your shop is in your garage. And security.

I never found ceiling height much of a problem. All the stuff I ever
built had the long boards cut down to 6 feet at most at the very start
of the project. And if you are working on an 8 foot dining table, why
would you be standing the boards up on end anyway? They would always
be in the horizontal position. Never considered ceiling height a
drawback to worry about.

Basement is temperature controlled. Never colder than 50 in the
winter. Rarely above 80 in the summer. Never have to preheat or
precool the shop before you can use it and worry about the extra time
and cost before you can start using the shop. If you only have 30
minutes to enjoy, are you going to spend 15 heating the shop from 35 to
55? Middle of the midwest location for me. Do have to run a
dehumidifier as a necessity or precaution.

Bathroom is right upstairs. Or maybe have one in the basement too.
Water is accessible. Nice in a shop. Main electric panel will be in
the basement. Or as my situation is now, its in the garage but I can
easily run a subpanel to the basement. Just use some half size
breakers in the main panel to get extra space and put in a 60 amp 220
breaker. Run some heavy wire to the new big subpanel in the basement
and I'm all set with electricity. Run lights and outlets all over the
basement.

I never noticed dust in the rest of the house. I think this is usually
a fear of people who don't have a shop in the basement or people who
are not woodworkers. I do use a dust collection system.

I guess if I was fabulously wealthy, I'd have a separate building for
the shop. But if building a new house, I'd put in a walkout basement
and plan for the shop in the basement. Lot more advantages than
disadvantages for the recreational woodworker. A full time
professional would likely be better off with a separate building.

B A R R Y wrote:
Joe Roberts wrote:
I am looking for pros and cons of having a woodworking shop in a new house
basement mainly from woodworkers who have a woodworking shop in their
basement.
Thanks



Mine is in a walk-out basement, so it's dry and easy to access.

The Cons that still remain:

Little natural light
Low ceiling
Noise, dust, and smell migrate into the living space
Little natural light
Low ceiling
Lolly columns and a center staircase eat space
Little natural light
Low ceiling
Concrete floors
Little natural light
Low ceiling
Little natural light
Low ceiling
Little natural light
Low ceiling
Little natural light
Low ceiling

Sorry, I got stuck on little natural light and low ceiling. I'm getting
cabin fever. G

With a choice, I'd greatly prefer WINDOWS and some head space in a
detached building with no columns and wood floors.

In fact, I'd trade half my space to be above ground.

But new construction can easily solve most of your basement problems.
You can build a new house with a walkout basement with plenty of
windows and sliding doors on the walkout side(s). You can put the
staircase and furnace off to one corner, along a wall, etc. And make
sure the water main does not come up in the middle of the basement.
These are free changes at time of construction. Lally columns can be
minimized by using deeper rafters or steel beams as the support beam.
Some extra cost here. But not a lot. Also the foundation shape will
affect whether the ends of beams can be born by the foundation walls
without any lally columns. Something to be considered in the planning
stage. Make the basement 1 foot or 2 feet deeper. A little extra cost
for concrete and digging. All of these things are relatively
cheap/free and easy to do if PLANNED for at time of construction. I
almost always work in the shop at night so natural light is meaningless.

The cost is very high -- I was told to think about
$ 5000 as a minimum starting point and another $ 2000
for proper drainage.

You can hire a lot of people to help move your tools
and supplies for that much money.

Lou wrote:
I've noticed everyone agrees on getting the tools, material, and
finished products in and out.
There are a couple of companies that can cut a hole in your foundation
and add precast
stairs to the outside. just add the doors. I'ts a whole lot easier than
going through the house
with everything.

wrote:


But new construction can easily solve most of your basement problems.

Sure can! But if I were building new, I'd still prefer to make the shop
an attached building on grade. Even with windows all along one side,
it's still not the same.

All of these things are relatively
cheap/free and easy to do if PLANNED for at time of construction.

And all I need is a new house. G

M Berger wrote:
The cost is very high -- I was told to think about
$ 5000 as a minimum starting point and another $ 2000
for proper drainage.

You can hire a lot of people to help move your tools
and supplies for that much money.


Yes, it is pretty expensive add on. Even if you are requesting it when
building new, the builder is going to probably charge you considerably,
since an outside stairway to the basement is a pretty custom thing.

If you are willing to have a sloped yard with a walkout basement, that
works well. Otherwise, try to buy a house with a straight stairwell
that is fairly accessable. Ideally it's a straight shot from the garage
door or is in an open area like a kitchen. Even if you have to move the
kitchen table everytime you move a new big tool down, that's not too
bad.

Even if you DIY it.. I was considering it.. it's a lot of time and
labor that could be spent in the shop.

On 17 Jan 2007 11:01:02 -0800, "bf" wrote:


M Berger wrote:
The cost is very high -- I was told to think about
$ 5000 as a minimum starting point and another $ 2000
for proper drainage.

You can hire a lot of people to help move your tools
and supplies for that much money.


Yes, it is pretty expensive add on. Even if you are requesting it when
building new, the builder is going to probably charge you considerably,
since an outside stairway to the basement is a pretty custom thing.

If you are willing to have a sloped yard with a walkout basement, that
works well. Otherwise, try to buy a house with a straight stairwell
that is fairly accessable. Ideally it's a straight shot from the garage
door or is in an open area like a kitchen. Even if you have to move the
kitchen table everytime you move a new big tool down, that's not too
bad.

Even if you DIY it.. I was considering it.. it's a lot of time and
labor that could be spent in the shop.

Yep, a guy could DIY it, but it's unlikely to be easy or pretty. I've
done the job as part of a professional crew, and it was a real PITA
even then.

Big things to consider are digging the hole- you could use a shovel,
but it'll be an insane amount of work, and cutting the foundation.
Cutting the foundation is the hardest part, if you ask me- we used a
"partner" saw with a diamond tipped blade for the job, and it was
about the loudest tool I've ever used, and created a huge amount of
dust. The footing could be left in place for a stairwell, but the one
we did required it's removal, and nearly took off a guy's foot in the
process (the only real access was standing on top of the concrete
itself while cutting it.)

Those saws are available as rentals, and a guy can get them- but using
them is very much like real work. Once that is done, then you've got
to pour a new footing, slab, and three walls. A guy can do all that
as well with some plywood and wailers, but then you're left with a lot
of concrete-splattered plywood at the end of the job.

There's really no part of the job that is fun for a woodworker, with
the possible exception of laying out the stairs and building the
doors. Having done it before, I'd consider $5000 a bargin for that
particular job. If I were pressed, and someone really, really wanted
*me* to do it, I'd quote at least double that.

I guess the moral of the story is that if you want it, and intend to
stay in your house for the forseeable future, I'd bite the bullet and
pay the man who gave you that quote. It wouldn't be a terrible idea
to check with an asessor as well- there's a fair chance that that
would increase the value of your house quite a lot. If you think
about it, it makes the basement legal living space (you've added the
required second exit, after all) and depending on your house's layout,
it may effectively double the square footage you can report when it
comes time to sell.

I wonder if anyone has had the oppertunity to have
a shop under the garage? It's an idea that I've been playing with.
Quite a bit of wasted space without requiring extra realestate.
Lou

On Thu, 18 Jan 2007 06:02:55 -0600, Prometheus
wrote:

On 17 Jan 2007 11:01:02 -0800, "bf" wrote:


M Berger wrote:
The cost is very high -- I was told to think about
$ 5000 as a minimum starting point and another $ 2000
for proper drainage.

You can hire a lot of people to help move your tools
and supplies for that much money.


Yes, it is pretty expensive add on. Even if you are requesting it when
building new, the builder is going to probably charge you considerably,
since an outside stairway to the basement is a pretty custom thing.

If you are willing to have a sloped yard with a walkout basement, that
works well. Otherwise, try to buy a house with a straight stairwell
that is fairly accessable. Ideally it's a straight shot from the garage
door or is in an open area like a kitchen. Even if you have to move the
kitchen table everytime you move a new big tool down, that's not too
bad.

Even if you DIY it.. I was considering it.. it's a lot of time and
labor that could be spent in the shop.

Yep, a guy could DIY it, but it's unlikely to be easy or pretty. I've
done the job as part of a professional crew, and it was a real PITA
even then.

Big things to consider are digging the hole- you could use a shovel,
but it'll be an insane amount of work, and cutting the foundation.
Cutting the foundation is the hardest part, if you ask me- we used a
"partner" saw with a diamond tipped blade for the job, and it was
about the loudest tool I've ever used, and created a huge amount of
dust. The footing could be left in place for a stairwell, but the one
we did required it's removal, and nearly took off a guy's foot in the
process (the only real access was standing on top of the concrete
itself while cutting it.)

Those saws are available as rentals, and a guy can get them- but using
them is very much like real work. Once that is done, then you've got
to pour a new footing, slab, and three walls. A guy can do all that
as well with some plywood and wailers, but then you're left with a lot
of concrete-splattered plywood at the end of the job.

There's really no part of the job that is fun for a woodworker, with
the possible exception of laying out the stairs and building the
doors. Having done it before, I'd consider $5000 a bargin for that
particular job. If I were pressed, and someone really, really wanted
*me* to do it, I'd quote at least double that.

I guess the moral of the story is that if you want it, and intend to
stay in your house for the forseeable future, I'd bite the bullet and
pay the man who gave you that quote. It wouldn't be a terrible idea
to check with an asessor as well- there's a fair chance that that
would increase the value of your house quite a lot. If you think
about it, it makes the basement legal living space

Maybe, if the basement meets the other requirements of code. Mine
doesn't, not because of the lack of an outside access (carefully sized
to make it very difficult to get a piece of Baltic Birch in without
buggering it up) but because of the ceiling height--the distance from
the first floor joists to the basement floor is a few inches shy of
what code requires--I'd have to jack the whole house up about 6 inches
to have the basement become legal living space..

(you've added the
required second exit, after all) and depending on your house's layout,
it may effectively double the square footage you can report when it
comes time to sell.

Lou wrote:
I wonder if anyone has had the oppertunity to have
a shop under the garage? It's an idea that I've been playing with.
Quite a bit of wasted space without requiring extra realestate.
Lou

I know a reasonably wealthy individual who built a nice, custom ranch
house with 3 or 4 car garage and had the builder use engineered
concrete floor panels or whatever to have a basement under the garage
itself. The part of the basement under the house was nicely finished
and I think the under garage part was work shop or something. I did
not look but I suspect there was also official engineered supports for
the engineered official floor panels used for the garage floor to hold
up the vehicles. I don't know how much it cost, but I would guess the
cost per square foot of space under the garage was far more than the
cost per square foot of the master bath or kitchen. Kitchens and baths
as you might know are high cost rooms. Unless real estate is extremely
dear, like San Francisco or New York City, or cost is of no concern,
its probably not practical to have usable space under the garage.

On 18 Jan 2007 05:57:40 -0800, "Lou" wrote:


I wonder if anyone has had the oppertunity to have
a shop under the garage? It's an idea that I've been playing with.
Quite a bit of wasted space without requiring extra realestate.
Lou

Never thought of it, but it would be neat- with a couple of
provisions. It'd still have to have a concrete floor, at least in my
area, and that floor would have to have some kind of drainage piping
run through it so that oil and other drips that come off the cars
doesn't fall on your tools.

Probably be too expensive for most budgets, as the floor of the garage
would have to be built like a parking garage (though I confess I
really don't know what that entails.) But if you've got the money, it
could be pretty cool- especially if you put some kind of industrial
lift in the corner for raising finished projects and lowering tools
and wood.

On Thu, 18 Jan 2007 09:37:56 -0500, J. Clarke
wrote:

I guess the moral of the story is that if you want it, and intend to
stay in your house for the forseeable future, I'd bite the bullet and
pay the man who gave you that quote. It wouldn't be a terrible idea
to check with an asessor as well- there's a fair chance that that
would increase the value of your house quite a lot. If you think
about it, it makes the basement legal living space

Maybe, if the basement meets the other requirements of code. Mine
doesn't, not because of the lack of an outside access (carefully sized
to make it very difficult to get a piece of Baltic Birch in without
buggering it up) but because of the ceiling height--the distance from
the first floor joists to the basement floor is a few inches shy of
what code requires--I'd have to jack the whole house up about 6 inches
to have the basement become legal living space..

Ah yes- I hadn't thought about that... The last basement remodel I did
was in a newer house with an 8' basement ceiling, so the second exit
was all that was required.