At what point does a gloat become unethical or otherwise wrong?

Over on woodnet, someone posted that they were able to make an $80 off
coupon code work on a delta benchtop disk/belt sander. I headed over
to amazon and tried it out. Sure enough, I got the $89 tool with free
shipping and $80 off. The total was $9.94.

This didn't work for the vast majority of tools. There seemed to be no
sense as to why it worked for this tool and not others. Someone else
discovered that this code also worked for a $160 3.25 horse hitachi
plunge router. So many people placed an order for that, but I didn't.

A lot of people received emails saying that their orders were canceled.
Mine shipped. A lot of people were quiet which leads me to believe
that other orders shipped also. Someone posted that they got the
router.

Anyway, I feel sort of bad about it. On one hand, it wasn't really a
mispriced item. And I've seen online places unload things at silly
prices many times before. One time, I ordered some server backup
software for $9. I know this was the intended price since they were
liquidating a lot of other software at really low prices. When I
received it, I was surprised to learn that it normally sold for close
to $1000. The real kicker was that it had a $200 rebate, which worked.
So I actually made money on the software.

In hind-sight, I know that since they were cancelling orders that they
didn't mean for this to work. Or did they just run out of the stock
they were liquidating and only meant to sell the ones they had on hand?
By the time I heard about this, mine had already shipped. Had I
known, I probably would have canceled the order myself.

If this were a brick and mortar store, this wouldn't happen, since
there's a human clearing every sale. But if it did anyway, I would
take it back if I didn't catch it at checkout myself. This is
different though. It's a faceless megacorporation and everything is
done through the mail with computers. This wasn't a little old lady
not knowing the value of the powermatic saw she's trying to sell. The
scenario was plausible when I placed the order.

I'm not the kind of person who gets angry and expects a retailer to
honor a stupid price that was a mistake. And I always correct cashiers
that accidently give me too much change. But I've caught mistakes (in
my favor and not) in the past after I got home and not bothered to go
back to fix them.

So should I take the gloat and feel good about obtaining a good deal,
or should I hide and repent?

brian

What is "GLOAT"

Getting an exceptional deal on some tool or wood that's difficult or
impossible for others to reproduce.

Man, How can I get a deal like that?

You can't. It's a gloat. :-)

Get on woodnet (I can't believe I just said that) and watch the
powertool forum daily for sales. Awesome sales come along from time to
time. Also, you should watch ebay and the local paper for good deals.

brian

"brianlanning" wrote in message
oups.com...
At what point does a gloat become unethical or otherwise wrong?

Over on woodnet, someone posted that they were able to make an $80 off
coupon code work on a delta benchtop disk/belt sander. I headed over
to amazon and tried it out. Sure enough, I got the $89 tool with free
shipping and $80 off. The total was $9.94.

This didn't work for the vast majority of tools. There seemed to be no
sense as to why it worked for this tool and not others. Someone else
discovered that this code also worked for a $160 3.25 horse hitachi
plunge router. So many people placed an order for that, but I didn't.

A lot of people received emails saying that their orders were canceled.
Mine shipped. A lot of people were quiet which leads me to believe
that other orders shipped also. Someone posted that they got the
router.


To me, taking advantage of a website glitch to get something for practically
free is no different then stealing... but that's just me.

The purchase was unethical. The gloat? That was just unwise.

brianlanning wrote:
Also, you should watch ebay and the local paper for good deals.


www.slickdeals.net can work, as well.

Last November, I saved $350 (coupon + coupon + rebate) on the hottest
digicam out there right now, the Canon Digital Rebel, from Dell. Dell
sold all of their 200 cameras in 7 minutes.

To me, taking advantage of a website glitch to get something for practically
free is no different then stealing... but that's just me.

I agree. But I've seen places like amazon intentionally unload things
for silly prices before. I'm not sure why they do it, probably to free
up warehouse shelf space occupied by things that aren't moving. How
many 90% off sales have there been at home depot? I once bought two
carts full of tile at home depot for 1c a box. The whole two full
shopping carts totaled up to $6. But since amazon was canceling
orders, it's kind of obvious that they didn't mean to do it. But like
I said, it was too late.

So should I avoid good deals because they're too good and might not be
honest? Is it ok to assume that amazon will catch this sort of thing
if it's unintentional and cancel the order? (apparently not) At what
point is a good deal too good?

brian

I'm not really gloating about it, just talking about it. I guess I
could refuse the package. But that would probably end up costing them
more money. They'd have to pay the return postage, right?

brian

"brianlanning" wrote in message
oups.com...
To me, taking advantage of a website glitch to get something for
practically
free is no different then stealing... but that's just me.

I agree. But I've seen places like amazon intentionally unload things
for silly prices before. I'm not sure why they do it, probably to free
up warehouse shelf space occupied by things that aren't moving. How
many 90% off sales have there been at home depot? I once bought two
carts full of tile at home depot for 1c a box. The whole two full
shopping carts totaled up to $6. But since amazon was canceling
orders, it's kind of obvious that they didn't mean to do it. But like
I said, it was too late.

So should I avoid good deals because they're too good and might not be
honest? Is it ok to assume that amazon will catch this sort of thing
if it's unintentional and cancel the order? (apparently not) At what
point is a good deal too good?

brian


Why don't you just email them and ask if this was supposed to work, and if
not, offer to refuse the package? they may be appreciative of your honesty
and tell you to keep it, or they might ask you to send it back.

Either way, at least you would feel better. Since you are trying to justify
how it might have been legit, I imagine you are feeling a little guilty. I
always say to listen to those feelings, if it feels wrong, it might be.

Last November, I saved $350 (coupon + coupon + rebate) on the hottest
digicam out there right now, the Canon Digital Rebel, from Dell. Dell
sold all of their 200 cameras in 7 minutes.

So did they mean to allow you to combine coupons? Maybe that deal was
unethical and you shouldn't have done it! What if they lost money,
that would be just like stealing! ;-)

Amazon's coupon situation right now is really confusing. From what I
can tell, they had been allowing people to combine coupons, but now
they're not. I combined the current $150 off sale with a $100 off
(iirc) code that was printed on the latest catalog they mailed out to
get a sander at a really good price. And one of the codes only
registered $100 instead of $150 off iirc like it seemed like it was
supposed to, but I couldn't figure out why. I bought it anyway because
it was a good price. I'm wondering now if that was somehow dishonest,
since now they're not allowing people to combine the codes. Did they
make a mistake before and correct it or just change their minds later?

brian

Yeah, that's probably the way to go. This sort of thing is annoying
since I feel like I have to police amazon to make sure they're not
shooting themselves in the foot.

brian

My bad; I was unclear.

I was referring to the purchase with of the tools using a clearly incorrect
coupon, not the software.

The former suggest intent to defraud, the later does not.

I'm not really gloating about it, just talking about it. I guess I
could refuse the package. But that would probably end up costing them
more money. They'd have to pay the return postage, right?

brian


I recall being in the same situaton. I bought a rotory cut tool for my Dad.
He said he did not get it to I had amazon send him another. It turns out
thata UPS stuck it by his back door and it sat the for a few weeks.

The return processing would have come close to the cost of the tool, so we
kept the spare.

Not a gloat, justa screwup.

I called them. The guy thought I was nuts and had no idea what I was
talking about. He says they have stand-up meetings every morning to
talk about orders that are supposed to be cancelled for stuff like
this, and that there was nothing about this one. Maybe the
cancellations were for the router and they didn't know about this one
yet? He also said that refusing an order means they pay return
shipping. He kept telling me that I wouldn't be charged for the return
shipping if I refused it, but said that there was nothing wrong with
the order. I think he was sort of surprised that I was the slightest
bit concerned as to whether or not it would cost them extra money.
This whole thing is weird. I'm not sure what to think now.

brian

I guess I probably should have concluded that it was too good to be
true. I posted up higher that I called them.

brian

On 17 Feb 2006 07:48:04 -0800, "brianlanning"
wrote:

At what point does a gloat become unethical or otherwise wrong?

Over on woodnet, someone posted that they were able to make an $80 off
coupon code work on a delta benchtop disk/belt sander. I headed over
to amazon and tried it out. Sure enough, I got the $89 tool with free
shipping and $80 off. The total was $9.94.

This didn't work for the vast majority of tools. There seemed to be no
sense as to why it worked for this tool and not others. Someone else
discovered that this code also worked for a $160 3.25 horse hitachi
plunge router. So many people placed an order for that, but I didn't.

So should I take the gloat and feel good about obtaining a good deal,
or should I hide and repent?

If it makes you feel any better, I couldn't get the $100 off $500 on
saws on my band saw because it was $499.99 and nothing else I added
would qualify. So I only got $50 off. My anti gloat to balance your
gloat.


-Leuf

"brianlanning" wrote in message
oups.com...
I called them. The guy thought I was nuts and had no idea what I was
talking about. He says they have stand-up meetings every morning to
talk about orders that are supposed to be cancelled for stuff like
this, and that there was nothing about this one. Maybe the
cancellations were for the router and they didn't know about this one
yet? He also said that refusing an order means they pay return
shipping. He kept telling me that I wouldn't be charged for the return
shipping if I refused it, but said that there was nothing wrong with
the order. I think he was sort of surprised that I was the slightest
bit concerned as to whether or not it would cost them extra money.
This whole thing is weird. I'm not sure what to think now.

There ya go Brian.

That is what you get for interfereing with the general order of things in
this universe.

Remember, no good deed goes unpunished.

G

brianlanning wrote:

I called them. The guy thought I was nuts and had no idea what I was
talking about. He says they have stand-up meetings every morning to
talk about orders that are supposed to be cancelled for stuff like
this, and that there was nothing about this one. Maybe the
cancellations were for the router and they didn't know about this one
yet? He also said that refusing an order means they pay return
shipping. He kept telling me that I wouldn't be charged for the return
shipping if I refused it, but said that there was nothing wrong with
the order. I think he was sort of surprised that I was the slightest
bit concerned as to whether or not it would cost them extra money.
This whole thing is weird. I'm not sure what to think now.

brian




I guess there are two ways you can approach life. One is to try to do
the right thing. Set an example for your kids. Show them how to lead a
decent life by making the right decisions. Try to reverse the decline
of western civilization.

OR

Rape and pillage as you go. Take no responsibility. Who cares what
happens after you die. You got yours! Teach the kids how to steal and
victimize. Watch violent TV all day long. Enjoy the decline of western
civilization.

I guess you can choose either path, at whatever level you would be
comfortable with.

If Amazon sent me the code, I would use it. It is up to Amazon to
figure out who to share that code with. It isn't my job to go to
woodnet and share that code. I think that's where the raping and
pillaging began, when all involved jumped on the code to use it for
their own personal benefit. Aw heck, we all end up paying for it in the
end. Faceless companies are in the business to make money. When they
lose money, the consumer gets to make it up for them by paying higher
prices. Gotta make sure the CEO's get the bonuses they are accustomed to.

What the!! Where'd that soap box come from??

Brian, think of who you are dealing with. Amazon doesn't mind how many local
tool supplies they put out of business or how many suppliers they hold for
ramsom to offer these great deals. They are a giant company and can and
should hire enough compentant people to police their offers. They should and
can afford proper software to catch the problems that have been outlined
here.

If you use a coupon that you have received that you are not entitled to then
shame on you, but if you use a coupon that Amazon or any other faceless
company issues trying to entice you to buy from them you are doing the right
thing by using it.

Companies issue mail in rebate coupons because they know that the coupons
help sell the product and they also know that over 85% of all mail in
rebates are not taken advantage of. This type of marketing is really unfair
but it will continue until we all take advantage of the unrealistic offers
they make and hopefully in the future your local tool supplier will be able
to make a living again.

Have been on both sides of the counter. You did nothing wrong, you took
advantage of a company offer that was made to get you to buy a product. You
have no idea what Amazon has arranged with their suppliers and who is
actually 'losing' money, if anyone.

Remember you are not being paid by Amazon or anyone else to find and fix
their mistakes. One of the rules of being in business is to make sure you
make a profit. That is their job, not yours.

Bob


"brianlanning" wrote in message
oups.com...
What is "GLOAT"

Getting an exceptional deal on some tool or wood that's difficult or
impossible for others to reproduce.

Man, How can I get a deal like that?

You can't. It's a gloat. :-)

Get on woodnet (I can't believe I just said that) and watch the
powertool forum daily for sales. Awesome sales come along from time to
time. Also, you should watch ebay and the local paper for good deals.

brian

"brianlanning" wrote in
oups.com:

My 2c interspersed ... and not really commenting on you or this "deal"
particularly

To me, taking advantage of a website glitch to get something for
practically free is no different then stealing... but that's just me.

I agree. But I've seen places like amazon intentionally unload things
for silly prices before. I'm not sure why they do it, probably to
free up warehouse shelf space occupied by things that aren't moving.

Or to generate customers/hits on their website? -- They've been doing a
lot of this stuff kind of like this lately, haven't they? -- Really,
really low prices for a brief period, then back to 'normal'.

How many 90% off sales have there been at home depot? I once bought
two carts full of tile at home depot for 1c a box. The whole two full
shopping carts totaled up to $6.

This is perhaps a different scenario. In the HD case, you pretty much
know their motivation. I, too, have bought tile for really, really cheap
on closeout (marble tiles for sharpening substrates).

OTOH, we really don't know Amazon's motivation.

But since amazon was canceling
orders, it's kind of obvious that they didn't mean to do it. But like
I said, it was too late.

If they intended to cancel orders, why didn't they cancel all of them?
Unless the product was already out the door an on a UPS truck, I'd think
they have the ability to cancel at any time up to that point. (I don't
remember if you said or knew exactly where in the pipeline your order
was ..)

So should I avoid good deals because they're too good and might not be
honest? Is it ok to assume that amazon will catch this sort of thing
if it's unintentional and cancel the order? (apparently not) At what
point is a good deal too good?

Well, IMO, a deal is "too good" if you are either intentionally screwing
someone over (it seems you weren't), or if you know (or have strong
suspicion) you are dealing in stolen goods (clearly not the case here).

If you are really concerned, why not call them and ask? (or email them).

In the past, either SWMBO or I've received items from vendors that we
didn't order (screwup on their part). We've always called to ask about
this kind of thing. In some cases, they've said 'keep it'. In others,
they've sent mailers to cover the cost of shipping back to them.


brian



Interesting topic ...


--
Regards,

JT
Speaking only for myself....

brianlanning wrote:
Last November, I saved $350 (coupon + coupon + rebate) on the hottest
digicam out there right now, the Canon Digital Rebel, from Dell. Dell
sold all of their 200 cameras in 7 minutes.

So did they mean to allow you to combine coupons? Maybe that deal was
unethical and you shouldn't have done it! What if they lost money,
that would be just like stealing! ;-)

It was actually advertised in advance and definitely not a mistake. G

Dell did their very best to try to get you to buy something else while
you were there. My guess is that some of these deals, including
Amazon's, are simply loss leaders.

Newegg is another who does ridiculous 4 hour sales all the time.

As far as web "mistakes" go, every online vendor has the ability to
check and double check a price before we, the customer, sees it. If a
price online truly is a mistake, the vendor does have the ability to
send me an email explaining the mistake and cancel the order. For
example, here's Amazon's policy:

From
http://www.amazon.com/exec/obidos/tg/browse/-/508088/qid=1140200997/sr=1-6/102-1340764-9272931

"PRICING

Except where noted otherwise, the List Price displayed for products on
our website represents the full retail price listed on the product
itself, suggested by the manufacturer or supplier, or estimated in
accordance with standard industry practice. The List Price is a
comparative price estimate and may or may not represent the prevailing
price in every area on any particular day. For certain items that are
offered as a set, the List Price may represent "open-stock" prices,
which means the aggregate of the manufacturer's estimated or suggested
retail price for each of the items included in the set. Where an item is
offered for sale by one of our merchants, the List Price may be provided
by the merchant.

With respect to items sold by Amazon.com, we cannot confirm the price of
an item until you order; however, we do NOT charge your credit card
until after your order has entered the shipping process. Despite our
best efforts, a small number of the items in our catalog may be
mispriced. If we discover a mispricing, we will do one of the following:

* If an item's correct price is lower than our stated price, we
will charge the lower amount and ship you the item.
* If an item's correct price is higher than our stated price, we
will, at our discretion, either contact you for instructions before
shipping or cancel your order and notify you of such cancellation."

So, I don't see an ethical reason to forgo buying something at a
ridiculous price from Amazon, as they reserve the right to pull it back.

Most other online vendors have similar policies posted.

Barry

As far as web "mistakes" go, every online vendor has the ability to
check and double check a price before we, the customer, sees it. If a
price online truly is a mistake, the vendor does have the ability to
send me an email explaining the mistake and cancel the order.""

And unlike an error in a newspaper or magazine ad or catalog, an online
vendor has the opportunity to make a correction the moment a mistake is
spotted and thus cut his losses.

Lee

--
To e-mail, replace "bucketofspam" with "dleegordon"

_________________________________
Lee Gordon
http://www.leegordonproductions.com

Lee Gordon wrote:
As far as web "mistakes" go, every online vendor has the ability to
check and double check a price before we, the customer, sees it. If a
price online truly is a mistake, the vendor does have the ability to
send me an email explaining the mistake and cancel the order.""

And unlike an error in a newspaper or magazine ad or catalog, an online
vendor has the opportunity to make a correction the moment a mistake is
spotted and thus cut his losses.

I think a paper ad always has the out: printing "not responsible for
typos"[1] somewhere in the ad. It's commonly used in the local free
computer magazine, for example.

1] Something like that, anyway.

er
--
email not valid

brianlanning (in
) said:

| Anyway, I feel sort of bad about it.

So? What would it take (have taken) for you to feel better about the
situation?

--
Morris Dovey
DeSoto Solar
DeSoto, Iowa USA
http://www.iedu.com/DeSoto

"brianlanning" wrote in message
oups.com...
At what point does a gloat become unethical or otherwise wrong?

It is unethical when you do something wrong; hack into their system, deceive
them somehow, return something after sending in the rebate...
If you have done nothing wrong, it is ethical.

It is their responsibility to get their systems to work, not yours.

I got my 5 Besseys today in 3 boxes and 2 tubes. Somebody should be fired
for that, but it is not my fault.

Over on woodnet, someone posted that they were able to make an $80 off
coupon code work on a delta benchtop disk/belt sander. I headed over
to amazon and tried it out. Sure enough, I got the $89 tool with free
shipping and $80 off. The total was $9.94.

This didn't work for the vast majority of tools. There seemed to be no
sense as to why it worked for this tool and not others. Someone else
discovered that this code also worked for a $160 3.25 horse hitachi
plunge router. So many people placed an order for that, but I didn't.

A lot of people received emails saying that their orders were canceled.
Mine shipped. A lot of people were quiet which leads me to believe
that other orders shipped also. Someone posted that they got the
router.

Anyway, I feel sort of bad about it. On one hand, it wasn't really a
mispriced item. And I've seen online places unload things at silly
prices many times before. One time, I ordered some server backup
software for $9. I know this was the intended price since they were
liquidating a lot of other software at really low prices. When I
received it, I was surprised to learn that it normally sold for close
to $1000. The real kicker was that it had a $200 rebate, which worked.
So I actually made money on the software.

In hind-sight, I know that since they were cancelling orders that they
didn't mean for this to work. Or did they just run out of the stock
they were liquidating and only meant to sell the ones they had on hand?
By the time I heard about this, mine had already shipped. Had I
known, I probably would have canceled the order myself.

If this were a brick and mortar store, this wouldn't happen, since
there's a human clearing every sale. But if it did anyway, I would
take it back if I didn't catch it at checkout myself. This is
different though. It's a faceless megacorporation and everything is
done through the mail with computers. This wasn't a little old lady
not knowing the value of the powermatic saw she's trying to sell. The
scenario was plausible when I placed the order.

I'm not the kind of person who gets angry and expects a retailer to
honor a stupid price that was a mistake. And I always correct cashiers
that accidently give me too much change. But I've caught mistakes (in
my favor and not) in the past after I got home and not bothered to go
back to fix them.

So should I take the gloat and feel good about obtaining a good deal,
or should I hide and repent?

brian

"Toller" wrote in message

I got my 5 Besseys today in 3 boxes and 2 tubes. Somebody should be fired
for that, but it is not my fault.

Check your credit card statement. Mine has six, like dated, Amazon charges
on it ... one for each clamp, and a mysterious $1.06 for who knows what.

Maybe the extra 120' of bubble wrap?

--
www.e-woodshop.net
Last update: 12/13/05

What you did is called STEALING. The $80 rebate was for orders of $420 or
more. Even if the code did work for an $89 item, it was WRONG to do what
you did.


"brianlanning" wrote in message
oups.com...
At what point does a gloat become unethical or otherwise wrong?

Over on woodnet, someone posted that they were able to make an $80 off
coupon code work on a delta benchtop disk/belt sander. I headed over
to amazon and tried it out. Sure enough, I got the $89 tool with free
shipping and $80 off. The total was $9.94.

This didn't work for the vast majority of tools. There seemed to be no
sense as to why it worked for this tool and not others. Someone else
discovered that this code also worked for a $160 3.25 horse hitachi
plunge router. So many people placed an order for that, but I didn't.

A lot of people received emails saying that their orders were canceled.
Mine shipped. A lot of people were quiet which leads me to believe
that other orders shipped also. Someone posted that they got the
router.

Anyway, I feel sort of bad about it. On one hand, it wasn't really a
mispriced item. And I've seen online places unload things at silly
prices many times before. One time, I ordered some server backup
software for $9. I know this was the intended price since they were
liquidating a lot of other software at really low prices. When I
received it, I was surprised to learn that it normally sold for close
to $1000. The real kicker was that it had a $200 rebate, which worked.
So I actually made money on the software.

In hind-sight, I know that since they were cancelling orders that they
didn't mean for this to work. Or did they just run out of the stock
they were liquidating and only meant to sell the ones they had on hand?
By the time I heard about this, mine had already shipped. Had I
known, I probably would have canceled the order myself.

If this were a brick and mortar store, this wouldn't happen, since
there's a human clearing every sale. But if it did anyway, I would
take it back if I didn't catch it at checkout myself. This is
different though. It's a faceless megacorporation and everything is
done through the mail with computers. This wasn't a little old lady
not knowing the value of the powermatic saw she's trying to sell. The
scenario was plausible when I placed the order.

I'm not the kind of person who gets angry and expects a retailer to
honor a stupid price that was a mistake. And I always correct cashiers
that accidently give me too much change. But I've caught mistakes (in
my favor and not) in the past after I got home and not bothered to go
back to fix them.

So should I take the gloat and feel good about obtaining a good deal,
or should I hide and repent?

brian

Right its like this . . .
1. Someone decided to start selling books online.
2. Turns out to be a great success.
3. So now we can sell anything and make money (Good luck to them for the
great idea in the first place).
4. We employ the best brains to program and develop our site.
5. Just like any other business they make mistakes. (If WE cut a plank in
the wrong place do we ask our customer to pay?)
6. With all the combined computing power and programmers at Amazon.com if
they get it wrong we'll that just tough sh*t

When this shows on a report somewere it will be a hard lesson. And I hope
they can fix it because I would'nt like it happening in my business. But
maybe if I sold tools to woodworkers online. I might go to the odd
newsgroup to see them gloating about the success of shopping with me. And
maybe fix it.



%69%20%6c%6f%76%65%20%77%6f%6f%64%77%6f%72%6b%69%6 e%67%20%62%75%74%20%69%6d%20%63%72%61%70
http://www.connoraston.com

On Fri, 17 Feb 2006 11:08:54 -0500, "Stephen M"
wrote:

The purchase was unethical. The gloat? That was just unwise.


Why? Amazon has some outstanding deals--I've purchased books, tools,
machines, etc at very good prices. I offer local stores equal money
for the same goods--some take it, others refuse. Having a gloat is
just telling everyone they found a good buy, and chances are that they
are smart shoppers. I wish our "ethical" government had gloats!!!

I ordered a Unisaw about ten years ago from a national woodworkers
catalog. At the time they were about $1200.00. When it hadn't arrived
in three weeks I called to see what was going on. They said they had no
record of an order. After checking with my credit card company to make
sure I wasn't charged for it I reordered it. Yep, you guessed already.
Three weeks later on Wednesday, I got my new saw. Three weeks later on
Thursday I received another new saw. Call to the credit card company
first, only one charge. After at least six different phone calls to the
company, I spoke to a vice president of the company. You guessed again
he told me to consider it an early Christmas present. I guess a big
company like that just can't be bothered with a trivial $1200.00.

wrote in message

sure I wasn't charged for it I reordered it. Yep, you guessed already.
Three weeks later on Wednesday, I got my new saw. Three weeks later on
Thursday I received another new saw.

Had to laugh at that one. Times don't always change, except maybe in
magnitude and morality. I spent the best part of the year between 6 and 7
looking over my shoulder and pretty sure I was either going to jail, to
hell, or both.

I had ordered Roy Rogers, Dale Evans, Trigger, Buttermilk, Pat Brady and his
jeep, Nelly Belle, and Bullet, all for 50 cents and a box top from Post
Toasties cereal. When I didn't get my order in the promised "allow three
weeks for delivery", I wrote a complaint letter, the first of a lifetime's
worth as it turned out. The next day the package arrived, and three weeks
later the second box, in response to my block printed letter.

In my 6 year old mind, raised with a strict brand of morality that was a lot
more prevalent in those days, that was outright theft and I figured I was
done for, one way or the other ... but I did gain a respect for the power of
words on a piece of paper, even by a six year old.

--
www.e-woodshop.net
Last update: 12/13/05

"Phisherman" wrote in message
...
On Fri, 17 Feb 2006 11:08:54 -0500, "Stephen M"
wrote:

The purchase was unethical. The gloat? That was just unwise.


Why? Amazon has some outstanding deals--I've purchased books, tools,
machines, etc at very good prices. I offer local stores equal money
for the same goods--some take it, others refuse. Having a gloat is
just telling everyone they found a good buy, and chances are that they
are smart shoppers. I wish our "ethical" government had gloats!!!

When I say "you I don't mean personally"

Ther are a couple of scenearios laying around here so let me be clear on the
one to which I was referring.... Using a SAV500 coupon on a $119 item. *If*
you *know* that the coupon is intended for a $500 purchase you are taking
advantage of their mistake. I see this as pretty much the same thing as
getting change for a 20 when you gave the cashier a 10. Yes, I think
knowingly pocketing the extra 10 in unethical.

If you say "lookie what I got... and extra $10" this is unwise as can
reflect poorly on your character (at least in a forum of strangers).

My 2 cents

1. Someone decided to start selling books online.

Someone opens a corner grocery/convenience store

2. Turns out to be a great success.

They are just scaping by.

3. So now we can sell anything and make money (Good luck to them for the
great idea in the first place).

Doing their best to sell the lousy old inventory that come with the store
because they have no extra capital to write it off and replace it.

4. We employ the best brains to program and develop our site.

It's a family business

5. Just like any other business they make mistakes. (If WE cut a plank in
the wrong place do we ask our customer to pay?)

6. With all the combined computing power and programmers at Amazon.com if
they get it wrong we'll that just tough sh*t

It's a manual business. The owner is working, as always, a double and
mis-labels cans of dinty-moore stew as .19 rather than 3.19. Is it ethical
to wait until the owner's 14 year old daughter is helping out on the cash
register to buy up their entire inventory of stew?

You be the judge.

But size of the retailer should not be a parameter any ethics function that
returns a "right or "wrong".

-Steve