Just wondering how you determine length to cut the rail on a cabinet
door. I am just getting into using Rail & stile bits, but looking the
way they join into the stile I was just wondering how you figure out
what you have to subtract. I am figuring if your bit cuts a 3/8" or 1/4"
you would have to subtract this from the total width e.g. if you want a
18" wide door and you are using 1 x 3 boards (lets say they are true 1 x
3 ) 18 - 6 = 12 for the rail minus 2 x 1/4 = 1/2" so a total of 11
1/2". Does this sound right or am I setting myself for a re-cut?

ADD to rail length the depth of your cutters times 2.

Also a good idea is to make your rail and stile 1/8 wider than your finish
size as to allow you to trim to size and squaring after glue ups. IE: if you
want to finish with a 3 inch rail and stile make them 3 1/8 wide but
remember to add 1/4 inch to your finish size so when you trim off the extra
1/8 on either side and top and bottom you end up with your finish size. If
your finish size would-be 18x25 make your glue up size 18 1/4 x 25 1/4. This
way you don't have to worry about clamp bruises and trying to be perfectly
square when you glue up if you are out 1/16 you can square up when you trim
to size and you would never notice it on the finished door but if you glue
up to finished size there is nothing you can do except look at an out of
square door in a square cabinet and you notice that a lot more than you do
one rail being a little smaller than the other.
If you want I could e mail you some spared sheets have made for 5 piece
doors that all you have to do is input your finished sizes and it will give
you your rail and stile size as well as your panel sizes. The addy is
blhmillwork at shaw dot ca I do not use my real email for the group because
of the spam but let me know the depth of you cut on you cutters so I could
make sure it works for you.

Chris Melanson
BLH Millwork LTD.

"bdeditch" wrote in message
et...
Just wondering how you determine length to cut the rail on a cabinet door.
I am just getting into using Rail & stile bits, but looking the way they
join into the stile I was just wondering how you figure out what you have
to subtract. I am figuring if your bit cuts a 3/8" or 1/4" you would have
to subtract this from the total width e.g. if you want a 18" wide door and
you are using 1 x 3 boards (lets say they are true 1 x 3 ) 18 - 6 = 12
for the rail minus 2 x 1/4 = 1/2" so a total of 11 1/2". Does this sound
right or am I setting myself for a re-cut?

On Wed, 25 Jan 2006 05:00:48 GMT, bdeditch
wrote:

Just wondering how you determine length to cut the rail on a cabinet
door. I am just getting into using Rail & stile bits, but looking the
way they join into the stile I was just wondering how you figure out
what you have to subtract. I am figuring if your bit cuts a 3/8" or 1/4"
you would have to subtract this from the total width e.g. if you want a
18" wide door and you are using 1 x 3 boards (lets say they are true 1 x
3 ) 18 - 6 = 12 for the rail minus 2 x 1/4 = 1/2" so a total of 11
1/2". Does this sound right or am I setting myself for a re-cut?

Most rail/stile cutters are 3/8 " cut depth. On a rail/stile door,
the rails don't lose any length, but the stiles do.

Assume your 18" wide door. Assume the bit cuts 3/8 ". If you cut
the rails and stiles at 2 3/8 "wide, that takes care of the bit cut to
give 2 " reveal or face of the stile. That leaves a 14 " rail.

Instead of doing a lot of arithmatic, settle on the door size, then
the reveal or door face frame size (2 " wide seems to look good for
most apps). Then add 3/8 " per rail and stile width.

You need to try this out on some scrap pieces to get a feel for the
way it works. Cut the end grain for the rails first, then all the
other cuts with the other bit - helps prevent tear/chip out. All of
which you will have to do anyways to set the cutter heights.

I use a two cutter set and set them into two routers for my table.
After diddling for a few hours (the first time) to get it right, I cut
a pair of guide blocks out of 1 " polyetheline for the next times.

Pete

MLCS offers its Cabinet Door Software. The software does the
calculations and produces a cut list. I recently used it on an inset
door project and it worked very well. It can even produce labels for
the individual cut pieces.


bdeditch wrote:
Just wondering how you determine length to cut the rail on a cabinet
door. I am just getting into using Rail & stile bits, but looking the
way they join into the stile I was just wondering how you figure out
what you have to subtract. I am figuring if your bit cuts a 3/8" or 1/4"
you would have to subtract this from the total width e.g. if you want a
18" wide door and you are using 1 x 3 boards (lets say they are true 1 x
3 ) 18 - 6 = 12 for the rail minus 2 x 1/4 = 1/2" so a total of 11
1/2". Does this sound right or am I setting myself for a re-cut?

(DL - 2xRW) + 2xGD = Stile Length

DL - Desired Length

RW - Rail Width

GD - Gro0ve Depth ( the groove on the rail that hold the stiles and
panels)

In your example:

(18" - 2x3") + 2x3/8"=Stile Length
(18" - 6") + 3/4"=Stile Length
(12") + 3/4"=Stile Length
12 3/4" = Stile Length

"bdeditch" wrote in message
et...
Just wondering how you determine length to cut the rail on a cabinet door.
I am just getting into using Rail & stile bits, but looking the way they
join into the stile I was just wondering how you figure out what you have
to subtract. I am figuring if your bit cuts a 3/8" or 1/4" you would have
to subtract this from the total width e.g. if you want a 18" wide door and
you are using 1 x 3 boards (lets say they are true 1 x 3 ) 18 - 6 = 12
for the rail minus 2 x 1/4 = 1/2" so a total of 11 1/2". Does this sound
right or am I setting myself for a re-cut?

The simple answer. Add double the depth of the cut in the Stile to the
Rail length, Minus double the width of the Stile.

wrote in message ...

Most rail/stile cutters are 3/8 " cut depth. On a rail/stile door,
the rails don't lose any length, but the stiles do.

Do you know which is the rail and which is the stile?? Some of each end of
the Rail is going to disappear into the Stile. Stiles are cut to the exact
height of the door.

I remember it by Rails Recline; Stiles Stand.

works for me.

jc

"Leon" wrote in message
. net...

wrote in message ...

Most rail/stile cutters are 3/8 " cut depth. On a rail/stile door,
the rails don't lose any length, but the stiles do.

Do you know which is the rail and which is the stile?? Some of each end
of the Rail is going to disappear into the Stile. Stiles are cut to the
exact height of the door.

"noonenparticular" wrote in message
m...
I remember it by Rails Recline; Stiles Stand.


I like Fence Posts and Rails, Rail Road Rails.

The simple calculations assume you are cutting exacly the depth of your
cutter width. I actually take a little heavier cut, effectively letting
the cutter joint off a little wood, so I start with a little extra length
and maybe take a couple of cuts to sneak up on the length I want. The sad
truth is that I'll usually leave the rails a little long and trim to the
final dimension with the edge cutter. It sounds lazy and sloppy. OK, it
really is lazy and sloppy, but no one has ever put a caliper on any of my
doors to see if all the pieces are of equal or nominal width. I've never
been able to fix a door once I got the rails too short, except when I make
the doors before the face frame and can adjust the openings by widening the
face frame stock.
Wilson
"Howard" wrote in message
oups.com...
MLCS offers its Cabinet Door Software. The software does the
calculations and produces a cut list. I recently used it on an inset
door project and it worked very well. It can even produce labels for
the individual cut pieces.


bdeditch wrote:
Just wondering how you determine length to cut the rail on a cabinet
door. I am just getting into using Rail & stile bits, but looking the
way they join into the stile I was just wondering how you figure out
what you have to subtract. I am figuring if your bit cuts a 3/8" or 1/4"
you would have to subtract this from the total width e.g. if you want a
18" wide door and you are using 1 x 3 boards (lets say they are true 1 x
3 ) 18 - 6 = 12 for the rail minus 2 x 1/4 = 1/2" so a total of 11
1/2". Does this sound right or am I setting myself for a re-cut?

"Leon" wrote in message

wrote in message
Most rail/stile cutters are 3/8 " cut depth. On a rail/stile door,
the rails don't lose any length, but the stiles do.

Do you know which is the rail and which is the stile?? Some of each end
of
the Rail is going to disappear into the Stile. Stiles are cut to the
exact
height of the door.

I've got a couple of really slick "raised panel door" spreadsheet
calculators that I've scored down through the years, but I would hesitate to
post them publicly without knowing if the original author would appreciate
it.

The slickest is by "Roger Medbery" ... does that ring a bell?

--
www.e-woodshop.net
Last update: 12/13/05

"Swingman" wrote in message
...

I've got a couple of really slick "raised panel door" spreadsheet
calculators that I've scored down through the years, but I would hesitate
to
post them publicly without knowing if the original author would appreciate
it.

The slickest is by "Roger Medbery" ... does that ring a bell?

No.


I use my CAD program to indicate the length of the rails. I always draw the
doors and cabinets to scale and add the depth of the cut in the stile to the
over length of the Demension on the rail on both ends.


www.e-woodshop.net
Last update: 12/13/05

On Wed, 25 Jan 2006 15:10:57 GMT, "Leon"
wrote:


wrote in message ...

Most rail/stile cutters are 3/8 " cut depth. On a rail/stile door,
the rails don't lose any length, but the stiles do.

Do you know which is the rail and which is the stile?? Some of each end of
the Rail is going to disappear into the Stile. Stiles are cut to the exact
height of the door.

Stiles go up and down, rails go side to side (like fence rails). I
say it this way to make it easy for those who can't remember. None of
the rail length is going to disappear anywhere. The cut edge (the
part of the wood that gets machined ) of the stile and rail will lose
3/8 " off the face of the wood and will become 'moulding'. Some of
that stile 'moulding' will become the rail's multi profile glue
section. The 3/8 " assumes that the cutters are based on the
standard that I see these days. If you are not sure what you have,
then make the very first cuts on scrap pieces and measure them before
and after.

Stile length is cut to your preference for squaring, fitting and
sanding.

Pete

"Leon" wrote in message

"Swingman" wrote in message

I've got a couple of really slick "raised panel door" spreadsheet
calculators that I've scored down through the years, but I would
hesitate
to
post them publicly without knowing if the original author would
appreciate
it.

The slickest is by "Roger Medbery" ... does that ring a bell?

No.


I use my CAD program to indicate the length of the rails. I always draw
the
doors and cabinets to scale and add the depth of the cut in the stile to
the
over length of the Demension on the rail on both ends.

Don't know if this is where I got it, but a DAGS picked it up ... I would
think it worth the short download for the OP or anyone else interested.

http://tinyurl.com/daoko

--
www.e-woodshop.net
Last update: 12/13/05

wrote:

The 3/8 " assumes that the cutters are based on the
standard that I see these days. If you are not sure what you have,
then make the very first cuts on scrap pieces and measure them before
and after.

Stile length is cut to your preference for squaring, fitting and
sanding.

Pete
7/16" on CMT cutters. That's why they suggest making the parts 2-7/16"
wide. With the 7/16 depth, it's easy to figure how long to make the
rails to arrive at the need door width.

dave

bdeditch wrote:

Just wondering how you determine length to cut the rail on a cabinet
door. I am just getting into using Rail & stile bits, but looking the
way they join into the stile I was just wondering how you figure out
what you have to subtract. I am figuring if your bit cuts a 3/8" or 1/4"
you would have to subtract this from the total width e.g. if you want a
18" wide door and you are using 1 x 3 boards (lets say they are true 1 x
3 ) 18 - 6 = 12 for the rail minus 2 x 1/4 = 1/2" so a total of 11
1/2". Does this sound right or am I setting myself for a re-cut?

Well, give it a little thought. If uncut, 1x3 stiles and 12" rails
will give you an 18" wide door. If you cut the rails only 11-1/2"
long, there will be a 1/4" gap between the rail and stiles. Will
routing away some of that wood fill this gap? g
--
Alex -- Replace "nospam" with "mail" to reply by email. Checked infrequently.

wrote in message ...

Stiles go up and down, rails go side to side (like fence rails). I
say it this way to make it easy for those who can't remember. None of
the rail length is going to disappear anywhere.

I do not know about your rails but about 1/2" of both ends of my rails
disappear into the Stile when assembled.

writes:

On Wed, 25 Jan 2006 15:10:57 GMT, "Leon"
wrote:

[...]

Do you know which is the rail and which is the stile?? Some of each end of
the Rail is going to disappear into the Stile. Stiles are cut to the exact
height of the door.

Stiles go up and down, rails go side to side (like fence rails). I
say it this way to make it easy for those who can't remember. None of
the rail length is going to disappear anywhere. The cut edge (the

You forget the part of the rail that becomes the tenon inside the
mortice in the stile side.

--
Dr. Juergen Hannappel http://lisa2.physik.uni-bonn.de/~hannappe
Phone: +49 228 73 2447 FAX ... 7869
Physikalisches Institut der Uni Bonn Nussallee 12, D-53115 Bonn, Germany
CERN: Phone: +412276 76461 Fax: ..77930 Bat. 892-R-A13 CH-1211 Geneve 23

"Leon" wrote in message

wrote in message

Stiles go up and down, rails go side to side (like fence rails). I
say it this way to make it easy for those who can't remember. None of
the rail length is going to disappear anywhere.

I do not know about your rails but about 1/2" of both ends of my rails
disappear into the Stile when assembled.

Not when you use that new Kreg jig you're so proud of ...




--
www.e-woodshop.net
Last update: 12/13/05

"Swingman" wrote in message
...

Not when you use that new Kreg jig you're so proud of ...



:~')

On Wed, 25 Jan 2006 20:29:59 +0100, Juergen Hannappel
wrote:

writes:

Stiles go up and down, rails go side to side (like fence rails). I
say it this way to make it easy for those who can't remember. None of
the rail length is going to disappear anywhere. The cut edge (the

You forget the part of the rail that becomes the tenon inside the
mortice in the stile side.

You mean the part of the stile that disappears inside rail. The stile
is the tenon inside the rail. The rail gets the mortise and does not
get shorter. Go look at rail.stile door and rethink this.

Pete

nope, you've got it bward pete.

wrote in message ...
On Wed, 25 Jan 2006 20:29:59 +0100, Juergen Hannappel
wrote:

writes:

Stiles go up and down, rails go side to side (like fence rails). I
say it this way to make it easy for those who can't remember. None of
the rail length is going to disappear anywhere. The cut edge (the

You forget the part of the rail that becomes the tenon inside the
mortice in the stile side.

You mean the part of the stile that disappears inside rail. The stile
is the tenon inside the rail. The rail gets the mortise and does not
get shorter. Go look at rail.stile door and rethink this.

Pete

wrote in message ...
On Wed, 25 Jan 2006 20:29:59 +0100, Juergen Hannappel
wrote:
You mean the part of the stile that disappears inside rail. The stile
is the tenon inside the rail. The rail gets the mortise and does not
get shorter. Go look at rail.stile door and rethink this.

You have that all bassackwards.

I have probably looked at and built 4 or 5 hundred. The STILE has 1 side
milled for the joint and that is it. The Rail is milled on 1 side and both
ends to mate with the Stile. The ends disappear into the Stiles.

wrote in message

Juergen Hannappel wrote:

writes:

Stiles go up and down, rails go side to side (like fence rails). I
say it this way to make it easy for those who can't remember. None of
the rail length is going to disappear anywhere. The cut edge (the

You forget the part of the rail that becomes the tenon inside the
mortice in the stile side.

You mean the part of the stile that disappears inside rail. The stile
is the tenon inside the rail. The rail gets the mortise and does not
get shorter. Go look at rail.stile door and rethink this.

Bzzzzt ... think (rethink) again ... In traditional woodworking joinery,
rails have tenons, stiles have mortises.

Be careful, like trains that jump the tracks (rails), whether you jump a
fence or a frame, it's the rails that'll trip you up.

--
www.e-woodshop.net
Last update: 12/13/05

wrote in message ...

You mean the part of the stile that disappears inside rail. The stile
is the tenon inside the rail. The rail gets the mortise and does not
get shorter. Go look at rail.stile door and rethink this.

Pete

Here are 2 links with drawings that will show what a rail and stile are and
how to make them.

Router bits and a drawing of a rail mated to the side of a stile.
http://www.infinitytools.com/prodinf...item=1&mitem=7

And direction of how to make rail and stiles with a rail and stile bit.

http://www.infinitytools.com/PDF/RailandStile.pdf

In article ,
"Swingman" wrote:

Bzzzzt ... think (rethink) again ... In traditional woodworking joinery,
rails have tenons, stiles have mortises.

Be careful, like trains that jump the tracks (rails), whether you jump a
fence or a frame, it's the rails that'll trip you up.

--
www.e-woodshop.net
Last update: 12/13/05

I understand where he was coming from - with a cope and stick joint,
there is the appearence of a bit of the rail entering the stile, even
thought that isn't really what is happening.


--Wade

You might want to check out some software I've developed that is based
on Microsoft Excel. I believe it would make your job much easier. Check
out CabinetCRUNCHER at www.cabinetcruncher.com or let me know if you
have any questions - thanks.

Tom Helle
www.cabinetcruncher.com

Tom,

That's an impressive suite of software. I took a quick look at the User
Guide and from what I read, it looks to be decent documentation. One bit of
confusion is the "packages" and if you only purchase say one package, then
add the others later - there is no seamless integration. You have to open
each program independently is what I read or purchase the full package for a
fully integrated workflow. Is there an "upgrade" path that will allow
integration of the packages?

The warranty is only good for 30 days and you don't address updates or bug
fixes that I read - perhaps I just missed it someplace. I have a lot of
software and doubtful that I get to exercise all the features in 30 days.
One wouldn't know how accurate your cut sheets truly are until they cut some
wood. If the software is good - why not extend the warranty out to 90 days
minimum or offer a trial version - perhaps even a crippled version - as much
as I hate that kind of software but I understand the need to protect your
investment too.

Bob S.


"a-better-builder" wrote in message
ups.com...
You might want to check out some software I've developed that is based
on Microsoft Excel. I believe it would make your job much easier. Check
out CabinetCRUNCHER at www.cabinetcruncher.com or let me know if you
have any questions - thanks.

Tom Helle
www.cabinetcruncher.com

Bob,

Thanks for your reply. Each of the applications are actually separate
files that can either be accessed independently or they can be opened
via hyperlinks on each of the main menues. At some point, we will
probably offer each of the applications independently but expect that
it will be much more cost effective to purchase one of the packages
similar to those currently offered.

Regarding software updates and bug fixes, we do provide updated
versions upon request. Based on excellent customer feedback we've
received thus far, the 30 day trial period has not yet been an issue
but your point is well taken. We've contemplated some sort of trial
version but haven't quite gotten that far yet.

Thanks again and let me know if we can provide any further information.

Tom Helle
www.cabinetcruncher.com