Look here for an interactive demo. Looks pretty well thought out.

http://www.kregtool.com/products/tours/k3/index.html

Leon wrote:

Look here for an interactive demo. Looks pretty well thought out.

http://www.kregtool.com/products/tours/k3/index.html


I don't like the stock clamp jutting out at me, Leon. did you notice that?

Dave

"David" wrote in message
...
Leon wrote:

Look here for an interactive demo. Looks pretty well thought out.

http://www.kregtool.com/products/tours/k3/index.html
I don't like the stock clamp jutting out at me, Leon. did you notice
that?


Yeah I saw that. It appears to only stick out about 4". I doubt that I
would be standing any closer than that. Plus, it has a soft cover. About
3 weeks ago I was holding a piece of 3' long quarter round that I had just
milled. It was about 3/4" square to start. I ran it through my router
table, turned around with it pointing out from me with one end pointing at
my stomach and the other end aimed directly at the 2" wide edge of my work
bench. Oddly the end of the quarter round squarely hit the front of the
work bench and had the piece been pointed on my end it would have easily
gone through me. I bounced back off of the stick and I still have a red
spot. I can appreciate things sticking out. Ha.

Leon wrote:

"David" wrote in message
...

Leon wrote:


Look here for an interactive demo. Looks pretty well thought out.

http://www.kregtool.com/products/tours/k3/index.html

I don't like the stock clamp jutting out at me, Leon. did you notice
that?



Yeah I saw that. It appears to only stick out about 4". I doubt that I
would be standing any closer than that. Plus, it has a soft cover. About
3 weeks ago I was holding a piece of 3' long quarter round that I had just
milled. It was about 3/4" square to start. I ran it through my router
table, turned around with it pointing out from me with one end pointing at
my stomach and the other end aimed directly at the 2" wide edge of my work
bench. Oddly the end of the quarter round squarely hit the front of the
work bench and had the piece been pointed on my end it would have easily
gone through me. I bounced back off of the stick and I still have a red
spot. I can appreciate things sticking out. Ha.


You must have been wearing your lucky charm.

I think that Kreg should have the handle stick UP when it's locked
because that's when you'll be leaning towards it with drill in hand.

I'm still unhappy with them for making a bunch of the drawer slide
alignment tools not quite 90 degrees between the front plate and the
slide holder. They said they had gotten a bunch of complaints all of a
sudden on them. They sent me a new one which is exactly like the one I
got at the local WW show. I fiddled with it for quite some time. I
ended up putting progressively thicker layers of 3M blue tape on the
horizontal member to elevate the rear of the slides so they wouldn't
droop so much. They never called me back with a resolution. I wasted
my money on that tool and the drawer holders which also aren't made
accurately.

Except for the lack of versatility on stock thickness, I don't have an
issues with the K2000. the K3 looks like it incorporates some good
ideas, esp. DC. Drilling makes a mountain of a mess on and under my bench.

Dave

"David" wrote in message

I don't like the stock clamp jutting out at me, Leon. did you notice
that?

Yes. That would be a problem for me considering I'd be operating the jig
from a sitting position. I think it would have been better to have designed
the jig so that it locks by pulling the handle down 90° with the handle in
locked position pointing down to the floor.

Upscale wrote:

"David" wrote in message

I don't like the stock clamp jutting out at me, Leon. did you notice

that?

Yes. That would be a problem for me considering I'd be operating the jig
from a sitting position. I think it would have been better to have designed
the jig so that it locks by pulling the handle down 90° with the handle in
locked position pointing down to the floor.


You can bet they didn't use a focus group to comment on the design
before it went into production. I see the same sort of shortsightedness
of design from other small woodworking tool companies. I'm sure they
turn a profit and laugh all the way to the bank, but it would be nice if
they showed off their latest creation to a 3rd party for comments and
suggestions before putting the item "out there".

Even LV has produced some poor designs and I have no idea who they show
their new tools to before production. Luckily for us, they make plenty
of super nice tools to more than make up for the occasional clunker.
Wouldn't it be nice though, if everyone who bought last year's honing
guide got a credit towards the purchase of the MKII?



Dave

Except for the lack of versatility on stock thickness, I don't have an
issues with the K2000. the K3 looks like it incorporates some good
ideas, esp. DC. Drilling makes a mountain of a mess on and under my bench.

Dave


Hi Dave,

I just bought the K2000 a couple of days ago. I am
currently working on an entertainment center with
a lot of face frames and some strange angles.

I am always a little behind the curve with
something "new".

I only wish that I had bought this thing years ago.
I don't know if it can be improved - I always hate
the plastic look in a real tool - but it has been
an awsome time-saver. My face frame joints have
never been tighter with so little effort - plus I can
screw them together and test fit before gluing.

I am sold on pocket screw technology.

Don't much care which way the clamp faces
to tell you the truth.

Lou

On Sun, 03 Jul 2005 17:37:23 -0700, David wrote:

Upscale wrote:

"David" wrote in message


Even LV has produced some poor designs and I have no idea who they show
their new tools to before production. Luckily for us, they make plenty
of super nice tools to more than make up for the occasional clunker.
Wouldn't it be nice though, if everyone who bought last year's honing
guide got a credit towards the purchase of the MKII?

Dave
That suggestion was posted a while back. Robin Lee's reply was
"Believe it or not - we discussed that here, but the only way we could
do it, would be to pad the price so we'd have room to discount it."

"Scrub" wrote in message

Even LV has produced some poor designs and I have no idea who they show
their new tools to before production. Luckily for us, they make plenty
of super nice tools to more than make up for the occasional clunker.

That suggestion was posted a while back. Robin Lee's reply was
"Believe it or not - we discussed that here, but the only way we could
do it, would be to pad the price so we'd have room to discount it."

The solution would be obvious. When something new comes out on the market,
wait a little while and look at user comments before buying one. Of course,
not knowing that there's going to be a much better product out in near
future, (like the LV MK II), abrogates that sentiment a bit. But, by far a
large, it seems the sensible thing to do. Even so, the MK I is not a
completely useless sharpening jig.

"David" wrote in message
...

You must have been wearing your lucky charm.

I think that Kreg should have the handle stick UP when it's locked because
that's when you'll be leaning towards it with drill in hand.


That does not seem unreasonable and while we ar wishing. Why not make it
auto adjusting like a pair of ViceGrips. I hate having to readjust the
plunger if the thickness of a plywood panel varies a bit.

I'm still unhappy with them for making a bunch of the drawer slide
alignment tools not quite 90 degrees between the front plate and the slide
holder. They said they had gotten a bunch of complaints all of a sudden on
them. They sent me a new one which is exactly like the one I got at the
local WW show. I fiddled with it for quite some time. I ended up putting
progressively thicker layers of 3M blue tape on the horizontal member to
elevate the rear of the slides so they wouldn't droop so much. They never
called me back with a resolution. I wasted my money on that tool and the
drawer holders which also aren't made accurately.

You know I never have had a problem installing slides. I always lay the
draw side of the slide on the work bench and attach it to the bottom side of
the drawer and always lay the cabinet side of the slide on top of the face
frame opening. I cut plywood spacers to stack on top of the bottom slide on
the back end to keep sides parallel.


Except for the lack of versatility on stock thickness, I don't have an
issues with the K2000. the K3 looks like it incorporates some good ideas,
esp. DC. Drilling makes a mountain of a mess on and under my bench.


I have been using the K2 aluminum jig for a long time but it only works for
centering in 3/4" stock.

"loutent" wrote in message

I just bought the K2000 a couple of days ago.
snip
I only wish that I had bought this thing years ago.
snip
I am sold on pocket screw technology.

If you ever want to add to the convenience, get Kreg's flat plate and clamp
that can mounted in a recess in your bench. Last bunch of FF's I built I
sprung for one and speeded up the 'joining' process tremendously.

I recess mounted mine on a variation one of my plywood "i-beams"
(http://www.e-woodshop.net/Jigs.htm#I-Beam), which also allows me to easily
clamp rails and stiles securely before torquing the pocket hole screws.

--
www.e-woodshop.net
Last update: 5/14/05

"Swingman" wrote in
:

snip
I recess mounted mine on a variation one of my plywood "i-beams"
(http://www.e-woodshop.net/Jigs.htm#I-Beam), which also allows me to
easily clamp rails and stiles securely before torquing the pocket hole
screws.


Those are pretty darned clever. I may allow myself to be 'inspired' by
those.

Thanks!

Patriarch

In article , Swingman
wrote:

"loutent" wrote in message

I just bought the K2000 a couple of days ago.
snip
I only wish that I had bought this thing years ago.
snip
I am sold on pocket screw technology.

If you ever want to add to the convenience, get Kreg's flat plate and clamp
that can mounted in a recess in your bench. Last bunch of FF's I built I
sprung for one and speeded up the 'joining' process tremendously.

I recess mounted mine on a variation one of my plywood "i-beams"
(http://www.e-woodshop.net/Jigs.htm#I-Beam), which also allows me to easily
clamp rails and stiles securely before torquing the pocket hole screws.

Hi Swing,

I just checked it out. The one little gripe that I encountered
with the Kreg jig was that it was sometime awkward trying
to get the clamp in the right position - I usually propped
up the FF on 2x4 scraps in order to get the clamp under it.
I can see where that plate/clamp combo would speed things
up quite a bit.

Thanks for the tip.

Lou

Leon wrote:


You know I never have had a problem installing slides. I always lay the
draw side of the slide on the work bench and attach it to the bottom side of
the drawer and always lay the cabinet side of the slide on top of the face
frame opening. I cut plywood spacers to stack on top of the bottom slide on
the back end to keep sides parallel.

Leon, I've installed slides exactly the same way as you have. I was
hoping (erroneously) that the Kreg would make the process faster and
would be sufficiently accurate.

Dave

On Sun, 03 Jul 2005 15:50:57 -0700, David wrote:

snip

I think that Kreg should have the handle stick UP when it's locked
because that's when you'll be leaning towards it with drill in hand.


A agree. I won't be purchasing this tool until that handle points in
another direction. Don't manufacturers test their new-fangled tools
anymore?

"David" wrote in message
...
Leon wrote:




Leon, I've installed slides exactly the same way as you have. I was hoping
(erroneously) that the Kreg would make the process faster and would be
sufficiently accurate.


Apparently not uh?

Leon wrote:
"David" wrote in message
...

Leon wrote:




Leon, I've installed slides exactly the same way as you have. I was hoping
(erroneously) that the Kreg would make the process faster and would be
sufficiently accurate.



Apparently not uh?


If they retool the molds and re-release the product so that a drawer
slide will sit perfectly perpendicular to the face plate of the Kreg
jig, THEN it will be a useful tool. Their selling point is that it
allows for fast positioning of a drawer slide. The reality is that the
slides tilt down at the rear.

Dave

"David" wrote in message
...
Leon wrote:


If they retool the molds and re-release the product so that a drawer slide
will sit perfectly perpendicular to the face plate of the Kreg jig, THEN
it will be a useful tool. Their selling point is that it allows for fast
positioning of a drawer slide. The reality is that the slides tilt down
at the rear.

How much do they tilt down? I wonder if that is to make the slides self
closing and or at least to help prevent the slide from opening on its own.
The only problem I can see is that the drawer fronts will not fit flush to
the face frame.

Leon wrote:

"David" wrote in message
...

Leon wrote:


If they retool the molds and re-release the product so that a drawer slide
will sit perfectly perpendicular to the face plate of the Kreg jig, THEN
it will be a useful tool. Their selling point is that it allows for fast
positioning of a drawer slide. The reality is that the slides tilt down
at the rear.


How much do they tilt down? I wonder if that is to make the slides self
closing and or at least to help prevent the slide from opening on its own.
The only problem I can see is that the drawer fronts will not fit flush to
the face frame.


they tilt down WAAY too far. Besides the tech support guy admitted they
are having problems! He hasn't called me back with any solution other
than for me to tweak the one I have. I had hoped that by now they would
have addressed the issue properly by fixing the molds and sending out
replacements.

Dave

David wrote in
:

Leon wrote:

"David" wrote in message
...

Leon wrote:


If they retool the molds and re-release the product so that a drawer
slide will sit perfectly perpendicular to the face plate of the Kreg
jig, THEN it will be a useful tool. Their selling point is that it
allows for fast positioning of a drawer slide. The reality is that
the slides tilt down at the rear.


How much do they tilt down? I wonder if that is to make the slides
self closing and or at least to help prevent the slide from opening
on its own. The only problem I can see is that the drawer fronts will
not fit flush to the face frame.


they tilt down WAAY too far. Besides the tech support guy admitted
they are having problems! He hasn't called me back with any solution
other than for me to tweak the one I have. I had hoped that by now
they would have addressed the issue properly by fixing the molds and
sending out replacements.

Dave


A gentle email to the Kreg product line manager, perhaps?

Patriarch

Patriarch wrote:

David wrote in
:


Leon wrote:


"David" wrote in message
...


Leon wrote:


If they retool the molds and re-release the product so that a drawer
slide will sit perfectly perpendicular to the face plate of the Kreg
jig, THEN it will be a useful tool. Their selling point is that it
allows for fast positioning of a drawer slide. The reality is that
the slides tilt down at the rear.


How much do they tilt down? I wonder if that is to make the slides
self closing and or at least to help prevent the slide from opening
on its own. The only problem I can see is that the drawer fronts will
not fit flush to the face frame.



they tilt down WAAY too far. Besides the tech support guy admitted
they are having problems! He hasn't called me back with any solution
other than for me to tweak the one I have. I had hoped that by now
they would have addressed the issue properly by fixing the molds and
sending out replacements.

Dave



A gentle email to the Kreg product line manager, perhaps?

Patriarch
Their tech support guy failed on 2 occasions to call me back. How much
more am I supposed to "bug" them? I'll just vote with my tool dollars,
at this point.

Dave

In article ,
says...
Patriarch wrote:

David wrote in
:


Leon wrote:


"David" wrote in message
...


Leon wrote:


If they retool the molds and re-release the product so that a drawer
slide will sit perfectly perpendicular to the face plate of the Kreg
jig, THEN it will be a useful tool. Their selling point is that it
allows for fast positioning of a drawer slide. The reality is that
the slides tilt down at the rear.


How much do they tilt down? I wonder if that is to make the slides
self closing and or at least to help prevent the slide from opening
on its own. The only problem I can see is that the drawer fronts will
not fit flush to the face frame.



they tilt down WAAY too far. Besides the tech support guy admitted
they are having problems! He hasn't called me back with any solution
other than for me to tweak the one I have. I had hoped that by now
they would have addressed the issue properly by fixing the molds and
sending out replacements.

Dave



A gentle email to the Kreg product line manager, perhaps?

Patriarch
Their tech support guy failed on 2 occasions to call me back. How much
more am I supposed to "bug" them? I'll just vote with my tool dollars,
at this point.

Dave

Uh, don't they all ready have your dollars at this point?

Why does one need to buy the new expensive kreg, just for the vacuum
addition?? When you do pocket holes on a project are you going to make more
excessive dust? That's what a shop vac is for. If I were to do ph's on a
production basis, I would buy the PC outfit. Before I invest more money in
the jig I'll buy another tool/toy. My 2 cents worth.


"KS" wrote in message
...
In article ,
says...
Patriarch wrote:

David wrote in
:


Leon wrote:


"David" wrote in message
...


Leon wrote:


If they retool the molds and re-release the product so that a drawer
slide will sit perfectly perpendicular to the face plate of the Kreg
jig, THEN it will be a useful tool. Their selling point is that it
allows for fast positioning of a drawer slide. The reality is that
the slides tilt down at the rear.


How much do they tilt down? I wonder if that is to make the slides
self closing and or at least to help prevent the slide from opening
on its own. The only problem I can see is that the drawer fronts will
not fit flush to the face frame.



they tilt down WAAY too far. Besides the tech support guy admitted
they are having problems! He hasn't called me back with any solution
other than for me to tweak the one I have. I had hoped that by now
they would have addressed the issue properly by fixing the molds and
sending out replacements.

Dave



A gentle email to the Kreg product line manager, perhaps?

Patriarch
Their tech support guy failed on 2 occasions to call me back. How much
more am I supposed to "bug" them? I'll just vote with my tool dollars,
at this point.

Dave

Uh, don't they all ready have your dollars at this point?

KS wrote:

In article ,
says...

Patriarch wrote:


David wrote in
:



Leon wrote:



"David" wrote in message
...



Leon wrote:


If they retool the molds and re-release the product so that a drawer
slide will sit perfectly perpendicular to the face plate of the Kreg
jig, THEN it will be a useful tool. Their selling point is that it
allows for fast positioning of a drawer slide. The reality is that
the slides tilt down at the rear.


How much do they tilt down? I wonder if that is to make the slides
self closing and or at least to help prevent the slide from opening
on its own. The only problem I can see is that the drawer fronts will
not fit flush to the face frame.



they tilt down WAAY too far. Besides the tech support guy admitted
they are having problems! He hasn't called me back with any solution
other than for me to tweak the one I have. I had hoped that by now
they would have addressed the issue properly by fixing the molds and
sending out replacements.

Dave



A gentle email to the Kreg product line manager, perhaps?

Patriarch

Their tech support guy failed on 2 occasions to call me back. How much
more am I supposed to "bug" them? I'll just vote with my tool dollars,
at this point.

Dave


Uh, don't they all ready have your dollars at this point?
Can't change the past. I can control my FUTURE spending. AAMOF I might
get a refund.

Dave

"Leon" wrote in message
"David" wrote in message

If they retool the molds and re-release the product so that a drawer
slide
will sit perfectly perpendicular to the face plate of the Kreg jig, THEN
it will be a useful tool. Their selling point is that it allows for
fast
positioning of a drawer slide. The reality is that the slides tilt down
at the rear.

How much do they tilt down? I wonder if that is to make the slides self
closing and or at least to help prevent the slide from opening on its
own.
The only problem I can see is that the drawer fronts will not fit flush to
the face frame.

Strange ...

It's been awhile, but I just had the opportunity to use my Kreg drawer slide
mounting jig again today to mount two drawers in a cabinet.

The drawer slides were those el cheapo/Euro, low profile, 3/4 extension,
white/brown ones ... the ones that have that slight dip downward at the back
of the cabinet end to facilitate closing.

I waited until after the drawers were mounted to check the 'squareness' of
the jig. As reported in this thread, it is definitely not square at the "T"
where the handle joins, at least to a well maintained 6" engineers square..

However, after installation, the top of the drawer slides _are_ square to
the cabinet front with that same engineers square, and the overlay drawer
fronts are flush with the cabinet all the way round.

IOW, the thing works, as it always has for me, without any apparent
problems. (I've only used it rarely with side mount ball bearing slides and
don't recall having a problem there either)

Go figure ... and trust me, SNAFU is the operative word in my life here
lately.

--
www.e-woodshop.net
Last update: 5/14/05

"Swingman" wrote in message news:deCdnS5EyaXSO1DfRVn-
However, after installation, the top of the drawer slides _are_ square to
the cabinet front with that same engineers square, and the overlay drawer
fronts are flush with the cabinet all the way round.

Any chance there's allowance somewhere for screws to pull them into place?

"Upscale" wrote
"Swingman" wrote in message
However, after installation, the top of the drawer slides _are_ square
to
the cabinet front with that same engineers square, and the overlay
drawer
fronts are flush with the cabinet all the way round.

Any chance there's allowance somewhere for screws to pull them into place?

I don't think that's the case, as the screw holes in the slide are fully
accessible when the slide is mounted in the jig ... and one thing us anal
retentive's are always on the lookout for is that telltale movement from an
off-center mounting screw, be it drawer slide or hinge.

I really don't have a dog in the fight, not going to argue with the OP, or
lose any sleep over whether the jig is poorly designed/made by Kreg, but I
just happened to remember the thread as I was finishing up that cabinet
today and decided to throw in my current experience/observation with the jig
in question, FWIW.

--
www.e-woodshop.net
Last update: 5/14/05

"Swingman" wrote in message
accessible when the slide is mounted in the jig ... and one thing us anal
retentive's are always on the lookout for is that telltale movement from
an
off-center mounting screw, be it drawer slide or hinge.

Agree with you there. If there's nothing that burns my butt more, then it's
a properly centred screw that pulls everything out of alignment. Happened to
me once with some drawer slides I bought. Turns out the slides had too much
paint adhering to one side of the screw holes. Had to go over them all
lightly with a counter sink. Last time I bought no-name drawer slides.

In article , says...
"Leon" wrote in message
"David" wrote in message

If they retool the molds and re-release the product so that a drawer
slide
will sit perfectly perpendicular to the face plate of the Kreg jig, THEN
it will be a useful tool. Their selling point is that it allows for
fast
positioning of a drawer slide. The reality is that the slides tilt down
at the rear.

How much do they tilt down? I wonder if that is to make the slides self
closing and or at least to help prevent the slide from opening on its
own.
The only problem I can see is that the drawer fronts will not fit flush to
the face frame.

Strange ...

It's been awhile, but I just had the opportunity to use my Kreg drawer slide
mounting jig again today to mount two drawers in a cabinet.

The drawer slides were those el cheapo/Euro, low profile, 3/4 extension,
white/brown ones ... the ones that have that slight dip downward at the back
of the cabinet end to facilitate closing.

I waited until after the drawers were mounted to check the 'squareness' of
the jig. As reported in this thread, it is definitely not square at the "T"
where the handle joins, at least to a well maintained 6" engineers square..

However, after installation, the top of the drawer slides _are_ square to
the cabinet front with that same engineers square, and the overlay drawer
fronts are flush with the cabinet all the way round.

IOW, the thing works, as it always has for me, without any apparent
problems. (I've only used it rarely with side mount ball bearing slides and
don't recall having a problem there either)

snip

They did NOT work for me with ball bearing slides, which infuriatingly
tipped like a sliding pond. I think the jig is a great idea badly under
engineered. You would think Kreg would not play fast and loose with a
basically good reputation deservedly earned on its pocket jigs.