Hello all,

This evening, I had the basically sound idea that I should turn a
lamp... I went out and got the hardware and decided that the plank of
bird's eye maple I had down in the shop would look great as a lamp
base. So, I got the blank cut to size and ready for assembly (I'm
using all kiln-dried lumber for now, so most or all of my blanks are
laminated) I figured that it'd be a whole lot easier to run the wires
through the finished lamp if I left a space in the center, so I cut a
half inch out of the middle of the center plank, and made some nice
plugs for each end to set the centers into. Seemed like a good idea
at the time, but it turns out that the hole in the center really
should be square, and not .75 x .5!

So, I got it up on the lathe, and started turning away. Everything
was basically fine except for a bit of extra vibration, until I turned
off the lathe to check my progress. Turns out that bit of extra
vibration caused the panels to crack apart about 1/32 of an inch in
four spots right in the most prominant space on the lamp. The cracks
are about 4" long, and approximately 1/16" deep.

I tried sanding the sucker for alomst an hour with 60 grit to no
avail, and any attempts to cut or scrape the area just makes the gaps
wider and deeper. And as an extra kick in the pants, most of the
bird's eyes turned right out of the blank- so it just looks like
regular maple with a little curl to it.

I doubt I'm going to save this piece unless I just fill it with wood
putty and paint it, but I was wondering if any of you folks have had
similar problems, and what my best options for avoiding this in the
future may be...

Thanks!
Aut inveniam viam aut faciam

Sorry to hear of your tribulations.

Normal woodworkers do a lot of planning, drawing, measuring... Turners do a whole lot less
(or none) of those things. For many turning projects just charging ahead without much
preparation works. For other turning projects -- lamps for example -- it doesn't. You need
to see ahead to what the problems will be -- getting a hole down the center for the hardware
and wire, attaching the base and hardware, etc. Additionally, we need to determine how we
are going to hold the work to the lathe -- none of these are trivial.

It would seem that a good place to start would be the library -- likely there is at least one
book with a plan for a lamp. I have an old book of turning projects written years ago by
somebody's shop teacher. The suggested turning tools and methods (scraping mainly) would
make you cringe but there is still much to be learned from the book although you would never
be tempted to make even one of the included projects.

Another useful thing to do is to sit down with pencil and paper, draw something which is
close to the desired shape and see where the glue joints and figure are going to end up.
Anyway, this would be a start.

Bill

In article , says...
Hello all,

This evening, I had the basically sound idea that I should turn a
lamp... I went out and got the hardware and decided that the plank of
bird's eye maple I had down in the shop would look great as a lamp
base. So, I got the blank cut to size and ready for assembly (I'm
using all kiln-dried lumber for now, so most or all of my blanks are
laminated) I figured that it'd be a whole lot easier to run the wires
through the finished lamp if I left a space in the center, so I cut a
half inch out of the middle of the center plank, and made some nice
plugs for each end to set the centers into. Seemed like a good idea
at the time, but it turns out that the hole in the center really
should be square, and not .75 x .5!

So, I got it up on the lathe, and started turning away. Everything
was basically fine except for a bit of extra vibration, until I turned
off the lathe to check my progress. Turns out that bit of extra
vibration caused the panels to crack apart about 1/32 of an inch in
four spots right in the most prominant space on the lamp. The cracks
are about 4" long, and approximately 1/16" deep.

I tried sanding the sucker for alomst an hour with 60 grit to no
avail, and any attempts to cut or scrape the area just makes the gaps
wider and deeper. And as an extra kick in the pants, most of the
bird's eyes turned right out of the blank- so it just looks like
regular maple with a little curl to it.

I doubt I'm going to save this piece unless I just fill it with wood
putty and paint it, but I was wondering if any of you folks have had
similar problems, and what my best options for avoiding this in the
future may be...

Thanks!
Aut inveniam viam aut faciam

Maybe the following link can help you identify what was missing from your
effort. Andy has an entire section of his site devoted to his process and
techniques, and the finished lamps are inspirational enough to warrant a
visit by themselves.

http://www.lampmaker.net/

Michael Latcha - at home in Redford, MI


"Prometheus" wrote in message
...
Hello all,

This evening, I had the basically sound idea that I should turn a
lamp... I went out and got the hardware and decided that the plank of
bird's eye maple I had down in the shop would look great as a lamp
base.
snip
I doubt I'm going to save this piece unless I just fill it with wood
putty and paint it, but I was wondering if any of you folks have had
similar problems, and what my best options for avoiding this in the
future may be...

This evening, I had the basically sound idea that I should turn a
lamp...

fyi: Actually, what you wanted to turn was a 'lamp stand,' 'light,' or
'light fixture.' A lamp is the portion that illuminates, sometimes called
an electric bulb. Dan

How to make laminated lamps . I go to the Home Depot and buy a 6"x10' plank
of pine or whatever. Have them cut it in half (marking the two sides of the
cut with an X) so it will go in my car. I also buy a Make-A-Lamp kit (about
$10). I also buy a 4" crossbar Tapped 1/8-IP (about $1). I put the two
pieces on my workbench (one X to the right the other X to the left). I
scribe as many circles as the diameter will bear on the two planks giving
the centers a good punch with an awl. I number the circles with a pencil (I
use roman numerals) I mark the first circle "bottom 1/2". Using a square I
draw a line from the center to the edge of the plank facing me (so that all
the grains will match. I cut the circles on a band saw. I get a piece of
metal curtain rod (3/8" diameter) of whatever length you like. Using a drill
press drill holes slightly larger than the diameter of the curtain
rod...but only going 1/2 way through the bottom piece (this is what the
centers marked by the awl are for). I stack the pieces from the bottom to
the top using the pencil lines to match the grain. With a magic marker and a
ruler draw a line from top to bottom so it's easy to match the grains from
the outside. I drill a tiny hole in the center of the bottom piece (so I
know the exact center later on). On the corner of my workbench I glue all
the pieces together from bottom to top using the curtain rod as a guide and
clamp tightly. I mount the stack on the lathe using a Slimline Revolving
Center (page 23 Packard Woodworks Catalog) at the top. Cut to the shape you
want (I scrape everything). At the top cut an indented circle about 1 1/2"
in diameter and 3/8" deep as close to the center as you safely can. Now sand
or finish the lamp any way you want. Using a hole saw on the drill press cut
a 2 1/2" circle out of 1/8" tempered masonite. Clamp the circle to a
workbench and widen the hole to 1/2" or 5/8 ". Sand the circle (I put a bolt
and nut through the center and sand on the drill press). Put the crossbar on
a vise and with a hacksaw cut off the ends leaving only enough to fasten to
the indented top with two screws. I usually round the outside corners on a
bench grinder. Widen the top hole slightly with a 3/4" bit. Using the 3/4"
bit cut about 1" deep in the center of the bottom. From the outside of the
bottom drill a hole to the center large enough to accomodate the wire. Screw
the crossbar (what's left of it) into the center of the indented top. Now
all you need is a piece of threaded hollow tubing (the same size as is in
the Lamp Kit) for the first part of the mounting. I spray the masonite
circle with gold paint so that it will match the brass parts and this goes
over the crossbar before mounting the rest of the parts.
"Michael Latcha" wrote in message
...
Maybe the following link can help you identify what was missing from your
effort. Andy has an entire section of his site devoted to his process and
techniques, and the finished lamps are inspirational enough to warrant a
visit by themselves.

http://www.lampmaker.net/

Michael Latcha - at home in Redford, MI


"Prometheus" wrote in message
...
Hello all,

This evening, I had the basically sound idea that I should turn a
lamp... I went out and got the hardware and decided that the plank of
bird's eye maple I had down in the shop would look great as a lamp
base.
snip
I doubt I'm going to save this piece unless I just fill it with wood
putty and paint it, but I was wondering if any of you folks have had
similar problems, and what my best options for avoiding this in the
future may be...

OK. Here are a few thoughts for you:

1- if I understand you correctly, you laminated the blank up from
boards. How long did you leave them clamped up? The way I understand it
you did the whole job in one evening. I would be leaving the blank
clamped overnight.

2- could the plugs you used have acted like wedges to open up the glue
lines.

3- you only see birdseyes on the flat sawn surfaces of the board. It
really doesn't make good material for spindle turning. The birdseyes are
formed as little tubes growing radially in the tree. If you make a
radial cut in a log, all you will see is the sides of these tubes.

4- with a few exceptions, notably some very well though out segmented
bowls, laminating blanks leads to finished products that have little
aesthetic appeal, to me at any rate.

Derek

Prometheus wrote:
This evening, I had the basically sound idea that I should turn a
lamp... I went out and got the hardware and decided that the plank of
bird's eye maple I had down in the shop would look great as a lamp
base. So, I got the blank cut to size and ready for assembly (I'm
using all kiln-dried lumber for now, so most or all of my blanks are
laminated) I figured that it'd be a whole lot easier to run the wires
through the finished lamp if I left a space in the center, so I cut a
half inch out of the middle of the center plank, and made some nice
plugs for each end to set the centers into. Seemed like a good idea
at the time, but it turns out that the hole in the center really
should be square, and not .75 x .5!

So, I got it up on the lathe, and started turning away. Everything
was basically fine except for a bit of extra vibration, until I turned
off the lathe to check my progress. Turns out that bit of extra
vibration caused the panels to crack apart about 1/32 of an inch in
four spots right in the most prominant space on the lamp. The cracks
are about 4" long, and approximately 1/16" deep.

I tried sanding the sucker for alomst an hour with 60 grit to no
avail, and any attempts to cut or scrape the area just makes the gaps
wider and deeper. And as an extra kick in the pants, most of the
bird's eyes turned right out of the blank- so it just looks like
regular maple with a little curl to it.


--
Derek Andrews, woodturner

http://www.seafoamwoodturning.com
Wedding Favors ~ Artisan Crafted Gifts ~ One-of-a-Kind Woodturning

Thanks for the illuminating info, Dan. I wonder how many of us scurried
to the dictionary hoping to refute you, but failed. Best I can do is
suggest that he might be asking about turning an "electric bulb".

Happy New Year. ... or should that correctly be 'Next Year'?


Turn to Safety, Arch
Fortiter



http://community.webtv.net/almcc/MacsMusings

Thanks for the illuminating info, Dan. I wonder how many of us scurried
to the dictionary hoping to refute you, but failed. Best I can do is
suggest that he might be asking about turning an "electric bulb".

Happy New Year. ... or should that correctly be 'Next Year'?

LOL! I get corrected everytime I got to the industrial supply house to by
Metal Halide 'lamps' for the 'lights' at work.

Just curious - How long was it between glue up and mounting in the lathe? I
know th bottles say cured in X (hour, 2 hours, etc.). When I mount an
object in the lathe, especially with a fair amout of face-gluing, I like for
it to sit on the bench for at least a day. I may be wrong, but it seems
like a larger face-glued surface might take longer to set.

At least it makes me feel better.

I make furniture and now I only use exterior glue. Where structural
strength is required I use mechanical devices, dowels or biscuits with
Gorilla glue or epoxy.
I agreed with leaving the pressure on for a minimum of 24 hours in ambient
temperature. For routine work I have had success with leaving the clamps on
for only 2-4 hours when the temperature is dry and above 70F/20C
Again this is subject to the type of wood and its oil, sap and humidity
content.
If the lumber come from Home Depot (or similar sources) where it was
probably kiln dried and store either outside or into unheated warehouse the
situation is different.
The best success I had was with air dried lumber. After the wood is dried
Its stored indoor at ambient temperature. Then when Its need it, the wood
is rough cut, glued and finished as required. Still at that I have about
1/16 - 3/16" expansion taking place every summer when its very humid and
winter when the indoor heat is dry.

"RonB" wrote in message
newsGABd.31989$F25.24714@okepread07...
Just curious - How long was it between glue up and mounting in the lathe?
I
know th bottles say cured in X (hour, 2 hours, etc.). When I mount an
object in the lathe, especially with a fair amout of face-gluing, I like
for
it to sit on the bench for at least a day. I may be wrong, but it seems
like a larger face-glued surface might take longer to set.

At least it makes me feel better.

On Fri, 31 Dec 2004 15:43:17 GMT, Derek Andrews
wrote:

OK. Here are a few thoughts for you:

1- if I understand you correctly, you laminated the blank up from
boards. How long did you leave them clamped up? The way I understand it
you did the whole job in one evening. I would be leaving the blank
clamped overnight.

Two hours- Coming from a more furniture-based approach to things where
30 minutes is usually long enough to get back to work, I figured that
would be long enough. Of course, then I tried this with another
blank, and I had exactly the same problem- must have jumped the gun
with the cure time. My previous laminated blanks were mahogany that
set for weeks, not hours.

2- could the plugs you used have acted like wedges to open up the glue
lines.

No, they were cut from the same board, and set perfectly flush.

3- you only see birdseyes on the flat sawn surfaces of the board. It
really doesn't make good material for spindle turning. The birdseyes are
formed as little tubes growing radially in the tree. If you make a
radial cut in a log, all you will see is the sides of these tubes.

On the bright side, I went back to work on the piece yesterday, and
turned the thing down to a much thinner diameter, taking the two
outside pieces of the laminated blank right off with the roughing
gouge, and the finished product has some bird's eye again. It's
thinner than I would have liked, but it turned out all right after
all. In the future, I'll be saving the bird's eye for other things
(Though I have decided I'm a big fan of the way Maple in general
finishes up)

4- with a few exceptions, notably some very well though out segmented
bowls, laminating blanks leads to finished products that have little
aesthetic appeal, to me at any rate.

It's pretty hit or miss, that's for sure- but when it works out, they
can be very striking. For now, I'm mainly focusing on chisel
technique and finishing, so it works out ok for my purposes. Of
course I'd love to have big hunks of burl to work on, but that's down
the road a ways- it's unlikely I'll be able to find anything until the
spring storms hit, and some trees start coming down.

Derek

Prometheus wrote:
This evening, I had the basically sound idea that I should turn a
lamp... I went out and got the hardware and decided that the plank of
bird's eye maple I had down in the shop would look great as a lamp
base. So, I got the blank cut to size and ready for assembly (I'm
using all kiln-dried lumber for now, so most or all of my blanks are
laminated) I figured that it'd be a whole lot easier to run the wires
through the finished lamp if I left a space in the center, so I cut a
half inch out of the middle of the center plank, and made some nice
plugs for each end to set the centers into. Seemed like a good idea
at the time, but it turns out that the hole in the center really
should be square, and not .75 x .5!

So, I got it up on the lathe, and started turning away. Everything
was basically fine except for a bit of extra vibration, until I turned
off the lathe to check my progress. Turns out that bit of extra
vibration caused the panels to crack apart about 1/32 of an inch in
four spots right in the most prominant space on the lamp. The cracks
are about 4" long, and approximately 1/16" deep.

I tried sanding the sucker for alomst an hour with 60 grit to no
avail, and any attempts to cut or scrape the area just makes the gaps
wider and deeper. And as an extra kick in the pants, most of the
bird's eyes turned right out of the blank- so it just looks like
regular maple with a little curl to it.

Aut inveniam viam aut faciam

On Sat, 01 Jan 2005 20:50:54 GMT, "Denis Marier"
wrote:

I make furniture and now I only use exterior glue. Where structural
strength is required I use mechanical devices, dowels or biscuits with
Gorilla glue or epoxy.
I agreed with leaving the pressure on for a minimum of 24 hours in ambient
temperature. For routine work I have had success with leaving the clamps on
for only 2-4 hours when the temperature is dry and above 70F/20C
Again this is subject to the type of wood and its oil, sap and humidity
content.
If the lumber come from Home Depot (or similar sources) where it was
probably kiln dried and store either outside or into unheated warehouse the
situation is different.

No Home Depot here! The only place worth going to in my area is a
hardwood supplier that kiln dries and then stores the lumber in racks
indoors. Unfortunately, they don't have much thick stock- the thickest
I've found there is 9/4 cherry and basswood.

The best success I had was with air dried lumber. After the wood is dried
Its stored indoor at ambient temperature. Then when Its need it, the wood
is rough cut, glued and finished as required. Still at that I have about
1/16 - 3/16" expansion taking place every summer when its very humid and
winter when the indoor heat is dry.

I'll be moving into my new house soon (hopefully!), so I'll have space
to start air-drying my own, but for the time being I'm stuck with what
I can buy and use right away.

Thanks to all who responded!
Aut inveniam viam aut faciam