My mates got an ancient Baxi back bolier (for gravity HW and pumped CH) and
attached 70's style gas fire located in a "chimney breast" bang in the
middle of the party wall of his 3 bed mid terraced house. Never had any
problems, but his SWMBO would like a change to gas fire to probably
something with flame effect coals.

In my last house in 1999 I had a similar back boiler changed and flame
effect fire put in no problems still gravity HW and pumped CH.

What options does my mate have, especially after April 2005 (?) when
condensing boilers must be fitted ? He likes the idea of back boiler (out of
the way) and attached gas fire, will these still be available ?

What options does my mate have, especially after April 2005 (?) when
condensing boilers must be fitted ? He likes the idea of back boiler (out
of
the way) and attached gas fire, will these still be available ?

There is some sort of exemption that he might be able to get after April
2005, provided the boiler manufacturers decide to support the few who use
it. They might just discontinue the ranges.

Christian.

In an earlier contribution to this discussion,
Ian Middleton wrote:

My mates got an ancient Baxi back bolier (for gravity HW and pumped
CH) and attached 70's style gas fire located in a "chimney breast"
bang in the middle of the party wall of his 3 bed mid terraced house.
Never had any problems, but his SWMBO would like a change to gas fire
to probably something with flame effect coals.

In my last house in 1999 I had a similar back boiler changed and flame
effect fire put in no problems still gravity HW and pumped CH.

What options does my mate have, especially after April 2005 (?) when
condensing boilers must be fitted ? He likes the idea of back boiler
(out of the way) and attached gas fire, will these still be available
?

It sounds like it's a Baxi Bermuda.

Depending on its age, he may be able to change the fire to a more acceptable
style without changing the boiler part. You can do this with later
Bermudas - but not older ones.

Otherwise, he'd have to replace the whole lot. Surprisingly, Baxi's website
seems to indicate that you can still get new Bermudas.
http://www.baxi.co.uk/products/gas/b...ers/index.html
--
Cheers,
Set Square
______
Please reply to newsgroup. Reply address is invalid.

Ian Middleton wrote:
My mates got an ancient Baxi back bolier (for gravity HW and pumped CH) and
attached 70's style gas fire located in a "chimney breast" bang in the
middle of the party wall of his 3 bed mid terraced house. Never had any
problems, but his SWMBO would like a change to gas fire to probably
something with flame effect coals.

In my last house in 1999 I had a similar back boiler changed and flame
effect fire put in no problems still gravity HW and pumped CH.

What options does my mate have, especially after April 2005 (?) when
condensing boilers must be fitted ? He likes the idea of back boiler (out of
the way) and attached gas fire, will these still be available ?

Does he like the idea that if there's a problem with either the
ventilation or flueing he and his SWMBO could end up as worm fodder? :-)
Admittedly the later BBs have oxygen depletion sensors so this shouldn't
happen, but even so the ventilation requirement for a back boiler means
you need about 2 house-bricks' worth of hole in the wall to let enough
air in, and if it's not arranged carefully that can give quite a draught.

On Tue, 1 Feb 2005 16:22:15 -0000, "Ian Middleton"
wrote:

My mates got an ancient Baxi back bolier (for gravity HW and pumped CH) and
attached 70's style gas fire located in a "chimney breast" bang in the
middle of the party wall of his 3 bed mid terraced house. Never had any
problems, but his SWMBO would like a change to gas fire to probably
something with flame effect coals.

In my last house in 1999 I had a similar back boiler changed and flame
effect fire put in no problems still gravity HW and pumped CH.

What options does my mate have, especially after April 2005 (?) when
condensing boilers must be fitted ? He likes the idea of back boiler (out of
the way) and attached gas fire, will these still be available ?



Have a look at this.

http://tinyurl.com/3t4xh

It's the points scoring system to allow for installation of non
condensing boilers from April.

Of course it does also assume that back boilers etc. will continue to
be available.



--

..andy

To email, substitute .nospam with .gl

Yes well, even though they know it's a lost cause Baxi are fighting for the continuation of the band D back boiler mainly because it is 50% of their market share. They'll probably win.

In the mean time they are still making the range with quite attractive fire fronts, and so do Gloworm. I only have knowledge of Baxi though.

Of course it does also assume that back boilers etc. will continue to
be available.

What I don't understand is why Baxi don't develop a condensing back boiler,
coupled with some sort of special bendy flue that could be easily shoved up
a chimney. They'd clean up in that market, especially as they have now
sorted out the 70s appearance. Some of their gas fire fronts are actually
acceptable in appearance.

Christian.

"Set Square" wrote in message
...
In an earlier contribution to this discussion,
Ian Middleton wrote:

My mates got an ancient Baxi back bolier (for gravity HW and pumped
CH) and attached 70's style gas fire located in a "chimney breast"
bang in the middle of the party wall of his 3 bed mid terraced house.
Never had any problems, but his SWMBO would like a change to gas fire
to probably something with flame effect coals.

In my last house in 1999 I had a similar back boiler changed and flame
effect fire put in no problems still gravity HW and pumped CH.

What options does my mate have, especially after April 2005 (?) when
condensing boilers must be fitted ? He likes the idea of back boiler
(out of the way) and attached gas fire, will these still be available
?

It sounds like it's a Baxi Bermuda.

Depending on its age, he may be able to change the fire to a more
acceptable
style without changing the boiler part. You can do this with later
Bermudas - but not older ones.

Otherwise, he'd have to replace the whole lot. Surprisingly, Baxi's
website
seems to indicate that you can still get new Bermudas.
http://www.baxi.co.uk/products/gas/b...ers/index.html
--
Mine was a 1970's Baxi and pre-dated the "you can change the front" so the
whole lot was replaced. The fitters did look into replacing the boiler with
a wall mounted condensing boiler, but even if you don't mind loosing some of
your room due to the ducting required there was no suitable place to vent
it. At the front of the house there were opening windows and neighbours
front door and rear of house (even further away) the back door.

My mates talked to some fitters and they didn't mention any problems with
just changing like for like after April 2005 and have quoted for it using a
Baxi back boiler.

We had had tremendous problems initially with our back boiler (don't think
it was a Baxi), had the fitters back numerous times including the
manufacturers back looking at it. Basically it would just lock out with the
red oxygen depletion light lit, press reset and all ok until next time.
Usual way of finding out was either no hot water in the morning or no
central heating. Caught it doing at other times as well, you could hear the
boiler working and suddenlty "clunk" off it went. Manufacturers claimed
incorrect fitting, fitters came back sealed gaps around surround etc etc.
Even had the manufacturer who was visiting at the time stating that room
ventilation was insufficient and there was oxygen depletion !!! Then it did,
locked out, it right in front of him with the back door wide open so that
stuffed his theory. Anyway over a couple of weeks they changed the
electronics, changed wiring, changed most of it, fitted baffles, flame
deflectors, metal sheets etc etc, ran fine with oxygen depletion "bypassed"
not that one would do that of course.

Anyway one of the final guys that came to fit some bits finally identified
the problem (cured by adding baffle plates and draft deflectors) basically
the pilot light was being blown by draughts, thus triggering the oxygen
depletion sensor, but all the standard baffle work assumed draughts come via
the front. The draughts were coming into the the backboiler space from
behind the plaster board, thus sometimes deflecting the pilot flame. Did
mange to stuff rockwool in some of the gaps, but very difficult as there was
a back boiler in the way!!!. Anyway final fiddling cured it and no more
problems at all.

"Christian McArdle" wrote in message
. net...
Of course it does also assume that back boilers etc. will continue to
be available.

What I don't understand is why Baxi don't develop a condensing back
boiler,
coupled with some sort of special bendy flue that could be easily shoved
up
a chimney. They'd clean up in that market, especially as they have now
sorted out the 70s appearance. Some of their gas fire fronts are actually
acceptable in appearance.

Christian.


Yep, I had my 70's glow worm replaced by a Baxi BB in 2001, with decent fire
front. I'd be dissapointed if I can't find a replacement boiler to drop in
it's place in X years when it's beyond economical repair.

Alan.

Well I'd be wanting to change it, Baxi will never make them condensing because of the impracticality of draining the condensate. I assure you they have no intention to make it condense, they have a deliberate policy to prevent that.

No, sooner you realise that it's a stupid style of boiler the better. Get a room sealed condensing boiler when it goes wrong, and stop sharing your oxygen supply with your fire and boiler.

On Wed, 02 Feb 2005 23:15:08 +0000, Paul Barker wrote:


Alan Wrote:



Well I'd be wanting to change it, Baxi will never make them condensing
because of the impracticality of draining the condensate. I assure you
they have no intention to make it condense, they have a deliberate
policy to prevent that.

No, sooner you realise that it's a stupid style of boiler the better.
Get a room sealed condensing boiler when it goes wrong, and stop
sharing your oxygen supply with your fire and boiler.

Nicely put. The price will also tip the balance the back boiler
replacement may well cost almost as much as the wall mounted unit and
fitting.


--
Ed Sirett - Property maintainer and registered gas fitter.
The FAQ for uk.diy is at http://www.diyfaq.org.uk
Gas fitting FAQ http://www.makewrite.demon.co.uk/GasFitting.html
Sealed CH FAQ http://www.makewrite.demon.co.uk/SealedCH.html

Well I'd be wanting to change it, Baxi will never make them condensing
because of the impracticality of draining the condensate. I assure you
they have no intention to make it condense, they have a deliberate
policy to prevent that.

No, sooner you realise that it's a stupid style of boiler the better.
Get a room sealed condensing boiler when it goes wrong, and stop
sharing your oxygen supply with your fire and boiler.

Nicely put. The price will also tip the balance the back boiler
replacement may well cost almost as much as the wall mounted unit and
fitting.

The problem my mates got with his replacement back boiler is he can't change
it to a wall mounted condensing boiler as the back boiler is in the middle
of the terraced house
- there is no way to vent the fumes (existing flue goes staight upto roof).
- Can't vent sideway as front of house is just windows and at rear of house
end up next to back door.
- there is no where to drain any condensate
- All the water, hot water and CH pipes are in the back boiler space.

Anyway a gas fitter/plumber came round, spent a while looking, filled a form
to work out if possible to fit an alternative, eyed up kitchen cupbards to
put boiler there, measured required pipework/bent lengths and a lot of other
stuff and said "it's a back boiler for you mate". Something to do with
scoring and locations. Anyway I think my mate said £2.2K total for
replacement boiler + some other work (replacing leaking radiators) +
replacing some damaged valves in airing cupboard. Work starts soon.