In a victorian house of standard construction with an apex roof, how
much weight can one put in the loft? I have a bunch of old books and
tapes I'd like to hide, but I've never had a loft before...don't wantthe
ceiling coming down.

Cheers

John

In a victorian house of standard construction with an apex roof, how
much weight can one put in the loft?

There are all sorts of roof construction with different constructions, so it
is not possible to give you a definitive answer. However, it is unlikely
that a Victorian loft would be suitable for heavy storage, as the joist
sizes are very unlikely to be anywhere near that required by modern building
regulations.

If you give some idea of the joist dimensions, the span and the type of
support (i.e. hanging from ceiling, attached to rafters, lying on structural
wall, someone might give you some sort of idea.

Christian.

"JK" wrote in message ...
In a victorian house of standard construction with an apex roof, how much
weight can one put in the loft? I have a bunch of old books and tapes I'd
like to hide, but I've never had a loft before...don't wantthe ceiling
coming down.

In all probability, you should be careful of simply walking around up there.
The joists were usually just strong enough to hold up the ceiling and not
always strong enough to do that.

Colin Bignell

nightjar nightjar@ wrote:
"JK" wrote in message ...

In a victorian house of standard construction with an apex roof, how much
weight can one put in the loft? I have a bunch of old books and tapes I'd
like to hide, but I've never had a loft before...don't wantthe ceiling
coming down.


In all probability, you should be careful of simply walking around up there.
The joists were usually just strong enough to hold up the ceiling and not
always strong enough to do that.

Colin Bignell


Thanks, both of you, it's as I thought. Now I can explain to the
management that we have to keep the books under the bed!

In article ,
"Christian McArdle" writes:
In a victorian house of standard construction with an apex roof, how
much weight can one put in the loft?

There are all sorts of roof construction with different constructions, so it
is not possible to give you a definitive answer. However, it is unlikely
that a Victorian loft would be suitable for heavy storage, as the joist
sizes are very unlikely to be anywhere near that required by modern building
regulations.

Agreed. I generally keep only empty boxes up there for packing
things back in when I move. There are a few heavy things up
there, and they are all positioned in a line along the top of
the structural wall which supports the centres of the loft
joists.

--
Andrew Gabriel

JK wrote:

In a victorian house of standard construction with an apex roof, how
much weight can one put in the loft? I have a bunch of old books and
tapes I'd like to hide, but I've never had a loft before...don't wantthe
ceiling coming down.

It won't collapse, but it may bow unacceptably.

Weigh yourself, and the books, and then walk around in it.

You will know when the deflection is too severe.



Cheers

John

Weigh yourself, and the books, and then walk around in it.

You will know when the deflection is too severe.

And even with narrow joists, you can normally get some useful heavy storage
right over a supporting structural wall, if there are any.

Christian.

Andrew Gabriel wrote:
In article ,
"Christian McArdle" writes:
In a victorian house of standard construction with an apex roof, how
much weight can one put in the loft?

There are all sorts of roof construction with different constructions, so it
is not possible to give you a definitive answer. However, it is unlikely
that a Victorian loft would be suitable for heavy storage, as the joist
sizes are very unlikely to be anywhere near that required by modern building
regulations.

Agreed. I generally keep only empty boxes up there for packing
things back in when I move. There are a few heavy things up
there, and they are all positioned in a line along the top of
the structural wall which supports the centres of the loft
joists.

I'm amazed at how flimsy many people's lofts seem to be, I've never
seen one of these lofts with 4" or less ceiling joists. In all my
experience from my parent's 1950s built house through all the houses
we've owned the joists have, in the main, been overkill for the job.

Our present 1920s built house has 6" (at least) by 2" ceiling joists
at, I would guess, less than 18" spacing. It feels much the same as
previous lofts that I remember. I think the major stress on our
joists is tension from the weight of the roof, maybe that's why
they're much bigger than needed to support the ceiling.

--
Chris Green

In all my experience from my parent's 1950s built house through all
the houses we've owned the joists have, in the main, been overkill
for the job.

Building regulations recognise that lofts are used for storage and mandate
reasonable joist sizes. Old Victorian houses often have joists sufficient
for holding up the ceiling and a person performing maintenance but little
more. You may be influenced by living in more modern houses that have been
subject to building regs.

Having said this, some modern houses using prefabricated roof trusses seem
to have smaller joists than recommended by building regulations for
freestanding joists, presumably because there is a hanging effect from the
struts.

Christian.

JK wrote in message ...
nightjar nightjar@ wrote:
"JK" wrote in message ...

In a victorian house of standard construction with an apex roof, how much
weight can one put in the loft? I have a bunch of old books and tapes I'd
like to hide, but I've never had a loft before...don't wantthe ceiling
coming down.


In all probability, you should be careful of simply walking around up there.
The joists were usually just strong enough to hold up the ceiling and not
always strong enough to do that.

Colin Bignell


Thanks, both of you, it's as I thought. Now I can explain to the
management that we have to keep the books under the bed!

I'm afraid youve been quite misinformed today. This is explained fully
in another thread.... see if I can find it...
http://groups.google.com/groups?hl=e...ing.google.com
The thread's called loft costs


NT

Christian McArdle wrote:

In all my experience from my parent's 1950s built house through all
the houses we've owned the joists have, in the main, been overkill
for the job.


Building regulations recognise that lofts are used for storage and mandate
reasonable joist sizes. Old Victorian houses often have joists sufficient
for holding up the ceiling and a person performing maintenance but little
more. You may be influenced by living in more modern houses that have been
subject to building regs.

Having said this, some modern houses using prefabricated roof trusses seem
to have smaller joists than recommended by building regulations for
freestanding joists, presumably because there is a hanging effect from the
struts.


Yes. Prefab W braced strus shwo far elss deformatiuon per unit load, and
are lighter to boot than single joists sapaning - particularly large -
spans. Also restricted access in such a roof discourages its use for
storage.

I don't think the regs actually specify the use of strong structures
UNLESS intended for storage.


There is a commoin confusion between strength and rigidity. Victorian
stuff is usually well strong enough, but flexible which is what 'brings
the plaster down'

If you hae a flexibility problem installing your own hangers from roof
to ceiling joist will help immmensely.



Christian.

The OP has been answered but here's a little p.s.: Our house was built
in 1962. Dunno what the technical name for the roof construction is,
but it's a triangular void, with a couple of very long spanning timbers
joining the two sides of the roof, at about the half-way point.

My next door neighbour put a carpet (or two) in his loft many years
ago; then a couple of glass doors ; then a few boxes; etc etc etc.

The ceiling has never fallen in .... but his ROOF SAGS! It's been
pulled down, over the years, by the geological movement caused by the
total weight of carpets etc. pulling against the spanning timbers.

It's not a disastrous problem, nor one that can't really be fixed by
getting rid of most of the weight ... but it's summat to think about,
innit?

John

"N. Thornton" wrote in message
m...
JK wrote in message ...
nightjar nightjar@ wrote:
"JK" wrote in message
...

In a victorian house of standard construction with an apex roof, how
much
weight can one put in the loft? I have a bunch of old books and tapes
I'd
like to hide, but I've never had a loft before...don't wantthe ceiling
coming down.


In all probability, you should be careful of simply walking around up
there.
The joists were usually just strong enough to hold up the ceiling and
not
always strong enough to do that.

Colin Bignell


Thanks, both of you, it's as I thought. Now I can explain to the
management that we have to keep the books under the bed!

I'm afraid youve been quite misinformed today. This is explained fully
in another thread.... see if I can find it...
http://groups.google.com/groups?hl=e...ing.google.com
The thread's called loft costs

Unless they have been underdrawn or otherwise strengthened, Victorian houses
will have lath and plaster ceilings, which, by now, tend to be held up as
much by habit as anything else. It does not need the ceiling to change shape
by much for them to decide to give up the habit and fall into the room
below.

Colin Bignell

"Ian Middleton" wrote in message ...

Christian.
A friend of mine in an 1890's terrace house with 2inch (?) joists that
deflected when you walked on them (and cracked ceiling plaster) fitted
shelves onto the two dividing walls and placed all the heavy items on them.
Installed a couple of 8x2 sheets of flooring board (on raised battons so as
to no squash the insullation and add extra strength) to allow easy access to
walls, but basically tried to keep everything off joists. Also suffered from
severe dirt and dust as no roofing felt in house of this age.


If lofts are barely strong enough for a person, how are water tanks supported??

In article , Adder
wrote:
If lofts are barely strong enough for a person, how are water
tanks supported??

By being placed over/close to a loadbearing wall and/or the weight
being spread across a number of joists. When you walk around your
loft there is a fair chance that your entire 200lbs (or whatever)
will at times be applied at the centre of a single joist.

--
Tony Bryer SDA UK 'Software to build on' http://www.sda.co.uk
Free SEDBUK boiler database browser http://www.sda.co.uk/qsedbuk.htm

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This article was posted to usenet, the information in it may
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In usenet article , Tony Bryer
wrote:

In article , Adder
wrote:
If lofts are barely strong enough for a person, how are water
tanks supported??

By being placed over/close to a loadbearing wall and/or the weight
being spread across a number of joists.

But it's surprising what can be got away with. Some years ago I removed
an old leaky tank from the airing cupboard. At first sight it _appeared_
to be well supported on a couple of 4 x 2 timbers spanning the width of
the cupboard. But the ends of the 4 x 2's were only resting on pieces of
t&g floorboard fastened on edge to the side walls running fore and aft.
After removing the tank I was able to lift the 4 x 2's off their
supports. The t&g was just nailed to the 2 x 2 studding in the
plasterboard wall and was easily pulled off by hand. The local spec.
builder must have got away with building hundreds of houses this way.

--
Mike Clarke