Hi All,

I am considering re-calling a 12V Drill battery.

Ive had a quick look, and hit a snag. I cant figure out how to get two
of the cells out of the €œturret€�.

I have put a couple of pictures up on Flickr

https://www.flickr.com/photos/191689.../shares/56144v

Anyone any ideas?

Also, the battery is rated at 1.2AH (10 cells).

I assume I should buy 1200mAH cells to maintain the 1.2AH capacity?

TIA

Chris

--
Chris

On 08/01/2021 11:59, Chris Holmes wrote:

Hi All,

I am considering re-calling a 12V Drill battery.

Ive had a quick look, and hit a snag. I cant figure out how to get two
of the cells out of the €œturret€�.

I have put a couple of pictures up on Flickr

https://www.flickr.com/photos/191689.../shares/56144v

Anyone any ideas?

Also, the battery is rated at 1.2AH (10 cells).

I assume I should buy 1200mAH cells to maintain the 1.2AH capacity?

TIA

Chris

Cells are sometimes very tight, the usual solution is violence. In this
case, you don't need sealing at the top of the turret, I'd suggest
drilling a couple of holes that would line up with the axis of each cell
and using these to press them out. The cells will presumably be bridged
by a conductor strip, so they will need to be pressed out together.

newshound wrote:
Cells are sometimes very tight, the usual solution is violence. In this
case, you don't need sealing at the top of the turret, I'd suggest
drilling a couple of holes that would line up with the axis of each cell
and using these to press them out. The cells will presumably be bridged
by a conductor strip, so they will need to be pressed out together.

It may also be that they're glued in. A little heat (hairdryer?) may loosen
the glue.

If there are 10 cells, that suggests NiMH - or is it old enough to be NiCd?
In principle there's no reason why you couldn't go for more capacious cells,
although your charger may not charge them correctly (a completely dumb
charger is likely to be fine, a 'smart' charger that isn't very smart may
terminate the charge too early)

Theo

Theo wrote:
newshound wrote:
Cells are sometimes very tight, the usual solution is violence. In this
case, you don't need sealing at the top of the turret, I'd suggest
drilling a couple of holes that would line up with the axis of each cell
and using these to press them out. The cells will presumably be bridged
by a conductor strip, so they will need to be pressed out together.

It may also be that they're glued in. A little heat (hairdryer?) may loosen
the glue.

If there are 10 cells, that suggests NiMH - or is it old enough to be NiCd?
In principle there's no reason why you couldn't go for more capacious cells,
although your charger may not charge them correctly (a completely dumb
charger is likely to be fine, a 'smart' charger that isn't very smart may
terminate the charge too early)

Theo


They are Nicads. And I think the charger is dumb.

I wonder if I could use NiMH instead?

I think Ive substituted those in Dect phones without any issues.

--
Chris

In message
Chris Holmes wrote:


Hi All,

I am considering re-calling a 12V Drill battery.

I‘ve had a quick look, and hit a snag. I can‘t figure out how to get two
of the cells out of the ”turret•.

I have put a couple of pictures up on Flickr

https://www.flickr.com/photos/191689.../shares/56144v

Anyone any ideas?

Also, the battery is rated at 1.2AH (10 cells).

I assume I should buy 1200mAH cells to maintain the 1.2AH capacity?

TIA

Chris

I had a similar drill battery and pushing hard on the terminals
alternatively did remove the cells.
The exposed metal parts are spot welded to the cells. The third terminal
if there is a temperature sensor.
You have nothing to fear as the battery is no longer serviceable.

Good luck and Happy New Year.


--
John Bryan

On 08/01/2021 13:31, Chris Holmes wrote:
Theo wrote:
newshound wrote:
Cells are sometimes very tight, the usual solution is violence. In this
case, you don't need sealing at the top of the turret, I'd suggest
drilling a couple of holes that would line up with the axis of each cell
and using these to press them out. The cells will presumably be bridged
by a conductor strip, so they will need to be pressed out together.

It may also be that they're glued in. A little heat (hairdryer?) may loosen
the glue.

If there are 10 cells, that suggests NiMH - or is it old enough to be NiCd?
In principle there's no reason why you couldn't go for more capacious cells,
although your charger may not charge them correctly (a completely dumb
charger is likely to be fine, a 'smart' charger that isn't very smart may
terminate the charge too early)

Theo


They are Nicads. And I think the charger is dumb.

There are two sorts of nickel chargers. One supplies such a low current
that it never switches off. Fast chargers all work on the delta peak
principle which is that, at a constant charge current, the cell voltage
drops slightly as full charge is reached.

Neither charger cares about how much capacity the cells are - big ones
will take longer to charge, that's all.

However there is one gotcha. The delta peak is far larger on NiCd which
means that a delta peak charger designed for NiCd may *not* stop
charging on the smaller delta of NiMh cells.

In short a NiMh charger will always work with NiCd *and* NiMh, but an
NiCd fast charger *may* not work with NiMh.


I wonder if I could use NiMH instead?
If the charger works, its a better bet, just dont flatten them - NiCds
will take it but NiMh will not...


I think Ive substituted those in Dect phones without any issues.



--
€œwhen things get difficult you just have to lie€�

€• Jean Claud Jüncker

On Friday, January 8, 2021 at 2:02:52 PM UTC, John Bryan wrote:
In message
Chris Holmes wrote:
Snip
Chris
I had a similar drill battery and pushing hard on the terminals
alternatively did remove the cells.
The exposed metal parts are spot welded to the cells. The third terminal
if there is a temperature sensor.
You have nothing to fear as the battery is no longer serviceable.

Good luck and Happy New Year.


--
John Bryan

Happy New Year John,

I was just about to report that I had worked this out.

Cells are out.

I shall get ordering some NiCad replacements.

On 08/01/2021 14:06, Chris Holmes wrote:
On Friday, January 8, 2021 at 2:02:52 PM UTC, John Bryan wrote:
In message
Chris Holmes wrote:
Snip
Chris
I had a similar drill battery and pushing hard on the terminals
alternatively did remove the cells.
The exposed metal parts are spot welded to the cells. The third terminal
if there is a temperature sensor.
You have nothing to fear as the battery is no longer serviceable.

Good luck and Happy New Year.


--
John Bryan

Happy New Year John,

I was just about to report that I had worked this out.

Cells are out.

I shall get ordering some NiCad replacements.

I didn't think you could still get them

On 08/01/2021 14:34, newshound wrote:
On 08/01/2021 14:06, Chris Holmes wrote:
On Friday, January 8, 2021 at 2:02:52 PM UTC, John Bryan wrote:
In message
Chris Holmes wrote:
Snip
Chris
I had a similar drill battery and pushing hard on the terminals
alternatively did remove the cells.
The exposed metal parts are spot welded to the cells. The third terminal
if there is a temperature sensor.
You have nothing to fear as the battery is no longer serviceable.

Good luck and Happy New Year.


--
John Bryan

Happy New Year John,

I was just about to report that I had worked this out.

Cells are out.

I shall get ordering some NiCad replacements.

I didn't think you could still get them

ebay has plenty


--
I would rather have questions that cannot be answered...
....than to have answers that cannot be questioned

Richard Feynman

newshound wrote:

Chris Holmes wrote:

I shall get ordering some NiCad replacements.

I didn't think you could still get them

In general, consumers aren't intended to be able to buy them, there was
an exemption for power tool use which ended in 2016, they're still
permitted for emergency lighting, alarm systems and medical equipment.

RS and others still sell them, I doubt they give you the spanish
inquisition ..

https://www.legislation.gov.uk/eudr/2006/66#article-4-1

No doubt they'll soon get round to tippexing out "Member States" ...

In article ,
Andy Burns wrote:
newshound wrote:

Chris Holmes wrote:

I shall get ordering some NiCad replacements.

I didn't think you could still get them

In general, consumers aren't intended to be able to buy them, there was
an exemption for power tool use which ended in 2016, they're still
permitted for emergency lighting, alarm systems and medical equipment.

RS and others still sell them, I doubt they give you the spanish
inquisition ..

I certainly got some from CPC last year - for emergency lights. Otherwise
it would have meant 6 new fittings.

--
from KT24 in Surrey, England
"I'd rather die of exhaustion than die of boredom" Thomas Carlyle

"Chris Holmes" wrote in message
...
Theo wrote:
newshound wrote:
Cells are sometimes very tight, the usual solution is violence. In this
case, you don't need sealing at the top of the turret, I'd suggest
drilling a couple of holes that would line up with the axis of each cell
and using these to press them out. The cells will presumably be bridged
by a conductor strip, so they will need to be pressed out together.

It may also be that they're glued in. A little heat (hairdryer?) may
loosen
the glue.

If there are 10 cells, that suggests NiMH - or is it old enough to be
NiCd?
In principle there's no reason why you couldn't go for more capacious
cells,
although your charger may not charge them correctly (a completely dumb
charger is likely to be fine, a 'smart' charger that isn't very smart may
terminate the charge too early)

They are Nicads. And I think the charger is dumb.

I wonder if I could use NiMH instead?

I think Ive substituted those in Dect phones without any issues.

But some of those were happy with either.

Chris Holmes wrote:
They are Nicads. And I think the charger is dumb.

I wonder if I could use NiMH instead?

You can, although NiMH have higher internal resistance so don't have as much
'grunt' in power tools. It's worth getting 'low self discharge' cells
otherwise they self-discharge over a month or two - if you put the tool away
they'll be flat next time you use it.

If you go for lithium ion it'll give the tool a new lease of life but it's
more work - you can probably get 3x 18650s to fit inside the pack, although
you'll need a BMS board (search ebay for '3S BMS' for whatever current
rating) and a new 'dumb' 12.6v CC/CV charger, eg:
https://www.ebay.co.uk/itm/DC12-6V-1...r/254777843396

Although if you're doing that you'll probably get better performance by
buying a new drill...

Theo

On Sat, 9 Jan 2021 04:52:06 +1100, Rod Speedcantankerous trolling geezer
Rodent Speed, the auto-contradicting senile sociopath, blabbered, again:

FLUSH the trolling senile asshole's latest troll**** unread

--
Richard about senile Rodent:
"Rod Speed, a bare faced pig and ignorant ****."
MID:

Theo wrote:
Chris Holmes wrote:
They are Nicads. And I think the charger is dumb.

I wonder if I could use NiMH instead?

You can, although NiMH have higher internal resistance so don't have as much
'grunt' in power tools. It's worth getting 'low self discharge' cells
otherwise they self-discharge over a month or two - if you put the tool away
they'll be flat next time you use it.

If you go for lithium ion it'll give the tool a new lease of life but it's
more work - you can probably get 3x 18650s to fit inside the pack, although
you'll need a BMS board (search ebay for '3S BMS' for whatever current
rating) and a new 'dumb' 12.6v CC/CV charger, eg:
https://www.ebay.co.uk/itm/DC12-6V-1...r/254777843396

Although if you're doing that you'll probably get better performance by
buying a new drill...

Theo


Thanks all, NiCads bought and successfully fitted and charged.

--
Chris