Had a proper look at the earthing on the new place today. The supply earth is provided by a clamp onto the sheath. It's not, so far as I can, a tightenable clamp.

https://www.flickr.com/photos/383551...posted-public/

It has a 10mm cable in which looks like it only just fits, can't see how I'd get a 16 in there. (tails are - at the moment - 25mm as far as a Henley, then down to 16mm)

I noticed that the clamp rotates freely around the sheath. Is that to be expected? I will get round to measuring the earth soon when the replacement test lead turns up.

wrote:

It has a 10mm cable in which looks like it only just fits, can't see how I'd get a 16 in there.

Crimp a ring terminal on the cable? Depends what size ratchet crimp
you've got/can borrow?

On Sunday, 24 May 2020 21:03:22 UTC+1, Andy Burns wrote:
wrote:

It has a 10mm cable in which looks like it only just fits, can't see how I'd get a 16 in there.

Crimp a ring terminal on the cable? Depends what size ratchet crimp
you've got/can borrow?

Thanks!. Why didn't I think of that.

My crimper stops at 10mm, but I'm sure I can find someone with a 16.

On 24/05/2020 20:49, wrote:
Had a proper look at the earthing on the new place today. The supply earth is provided by a clamp onto the sheath. It's not, so far as I can, a tightenable clamp.

https://www.flickr.com/photos/383551...posted-public/

It has a 10mm cable in which looks like it only just fits, can't see how I'd get a 16 in there. (tails are - at the moment - 25mm as far as a Henley, then down to 16mm)

I noticed that the clamp rotates freely around the sheath. Is that to be expected? I will get round to measuring the earth soon when the replacement test lead turns up.



FWLIW I think I'd ask if a "proper" PME can be supplied

https://www.ukpowernetworks.co.uk/electricity/earthing



--
Robin
reply-to address is (intended to be) valid

On Sunday, 24 May 2020 21:44:45 UTC+1, Robin wrote:
On 24/05/2020 20:49, wrote:
Had a proper look at the earthing on the new place today. The supply earth is provided by a clamp onto the sheath. It's not, so far as I can, a tightenable clamp.

https://www.flickr.com/photos/383551...posted-public/

It has a 10mm cable in which looks like it only just fits, can't see how I'd get a 16 in there. (tails are - at the moment - 25mm as far as a Henley, then down to 16mm)

I noticed that the clamp rotates freely around the sheath. Is that to be expected? I will get round to measuring the earth soon when the replacement test lead turns up.



FWLIW I think I'd ask if a "proper" PME can be supplied

https://www.ukpowernetworks.co.uk/electricity/earthing

I was considering that. Assuming the clamp isn't expected to move as it does (??) I was going to call up and express concern about it, and see if that ended up with a PME conversion.

On 24/05/2020 22:31, wrote:
On Sunday, 24 May 2020 21:44:45 UTC+1, Robin wrote:
On 24/05/2020 20:49, wrote:
Had a proper look at the earthing on the new place today. The supply earth is provided by a clamp onto the sheath. It's not, so far as I can, a tightenable clamp.

https://www.flickr.com/photos/383551...posted-public/

It has a 10mm cable in which looks like it only just fits, can't see how I'd get a 16 in there. (tails are - at the moment - 25mm as far as a Henley, then down to 16mm)

I noticed that the clamp rotates freely around the sheath. Is that to be expected? I will get round to measuring the earth soon when the replacement test lead turns up.



FWLIW I think I'd ask if a "proper" PME can be supplied

https://www.ukpowernetworks.co.uk/electricity/earthing

I was considering that. Assuming the clamp isn't expected to move as it does (??) I was going to call up and express concern about it, and see if that ended up with a PME conversion.

I was leaving the clamp to my youngers and betters But FWIW (a) a
clamp that moves patently means your Ze can change randomly, (b) clamps
(even constant force clamps) on lead sheathing are now a no-no, and (c)
I think tightening a clamp is for the brave and courageous.

*--
Robin
reply-to address is (intended to be) valid

On 24/05/2020 20:49, wrote:
Had a proper look at the earthing on the new place today. The supply earth is provided by a clamp onto the sheath. It's not, so far as I can, a tightenable clamp.

https://www.flickr.com/photos/383551...posted-public/

It has a 10mm cable in which looks like it only just fits, can't see how I'd get a 16 in there. (tails are - at the moment - 25mm as far as a Henley, then down to 16mm)

I noticed that the clamp rotates freely around the sheath. Is that to be expected? I will get round to measuring the earth soon when the replacement test lead turns up.


No, the clamp should not move and will be an ineffective earth connection.

Report it to your DNO and they should either rectify it or provide PME.
(this may be delayed due to Coronovirus Regs)

On Monday, 25 May 2020 09:44:10 UTC+1, Jack Harry Teesdale wrote:
On 24/05/2020 20:49, wrote:
Had a proper look at the earthing on the new place today. The supply earth is provided by a clamp onto the sheath. It's not, so far as I can, a tightenable clamp.

https://www.flickr.com/photos/383551...posted-public/

It has a 10mm cable in which looks like it only just fits, can't see how I'd get a 16 in there. (tails are - at the moment - 25mm as far as a Henley, then down to 16mm)

I noticed that the clamp rotates freely around the sheath. Is that to be expected? I will get round to measuring the earth soon when the replacement test lead turns up.


No, the clamp should not move and will be an ineffective earth connection..

Report it to your DNO and they should either rectify it or provide PME.
(this may be delayed due to Coronovirus Regs)

Thanks. That's what I thought, but nice to have it confirmed.

I rang up UK power and they were somewhat unhelpful, and want to know what Ze is before they will do anything (I tried arguing that what it is NOW is irrelevant, and I don't want to start waggling their clamp to demonstrate that it will change). Well, gives me something to do. I will call back and hope I get someone more helpful.

There's a lead water main. Turns out it does have its uses....

On Mon, 25 May 2020 01:59:14 -0700 (PDT),
wrote:

On Monday, 25 May 2020 09:44:10 UTC+1, Jack Harry Teesdale wrote:
On 24/05/2020 20:49, wrote:
Had a proper look at the earthing on the new place today. The supply earth is provided by a clamp onto the sheath. It's not, so far as I can, a tightenable clamp.

https://www.flickr.com/photos/383551...posted-public/

It has a 10mm cable in which looks like it only just fits, can't see how I'd get a 16 in there. (tails are - at the moment - 25mm as far as a Henley, then down to 16mm)

I noticed that the clamp rotates freely around the sheath. Is that to be expected? I will get round to measuring the earth soon when the replacement test lead turns up.


No, the clamp should not move and will be an ineffective earth connection.

Report it to your DNO and they should either rectify it or provide PME.
(this may be delayed due to Coronovirus Regs)

Thanks. That's what I thought, but nice to have it confirmed.

I rang up UK power and they were somewhat unhelpful, and want to know what Ze is before they will do anything (I tried arguing that what it is NOW is irrelevant, and I don't want to start waggling their clamp to demonstrate that it will change). Well, gives me something to do. I will call back and hope I get someone more helpful.

You would always give them an 'estimated' figure :-)

On 25/05/2020 10:21, Scott wrote:
On Mon, 25 May 2020 01:59:14 -0700 (PDT),
wrote:

On Monday, 25 May 2020 09:44:10 UTC+1, Jack Harry Teesdale wrote:
On 24/05/2020 20:49, wrote:
Had a proper look at the earthing on the new place today. The supply earth is provided by a clamp onto the sheath. It's not, so far as I can, a tightenable clamp.

https://www.flickr.com/photos/383551...posted-public/

It has a 10mm cable in which looks like it only just fits, can't see how I'd get a 16 in there. (tails are - at the moment - 25mm as far as a Henley, then down to 16mm)

I noticed that the clamp rotates freely around the sheath. Is that to be expected? I will get round to measuring the earth soon when the replacement test lead turns up.


No, the clamp should not move and will be an ineffective earth connection.

Report it to your DNO and they should either rectify it or provide PME.
(this may be delayed due to Coronovirus Regs)

Thanks. That's what I thought, but nice to have it confirmed.

I rang up UK power and they were somewhat unhelpful, and want to know what Ze is before they will do anything (I tried arguing that what it is NOW is irrelevant, and I don't want to start waggling their clamp to demonstrate that it will change). Well, gives me something to do. I will call back and hope I get someone more helpful.

You would always give them an 'estimated' figure :-)



Especially after slackening the earth clamp off.

Couple of ohms should do it.

I like your thinking.

--
Adam

On Monday, 25 May 2020 09:59:17 UTC+1, wrote:
On Monday, 25 May 2020 09:44:10 UTC+1, Jack Harry Teesdale wrote:
On 24/05/2020 20:49, wrote:

Had a proper look at the earthing on the new place today. The supply earth is provided by a clamp onto the sheath. It's not, so far as I can, a tightenable clamp.

https://www.flickr.com/photos/383551...posted-public/

It has a 10mm cable in which looks like it only just fits, can't see how I'd get a 16 in there. (tails are - at the moment - 25mm as far as a Henley, then down to 16mm)

I noticed that the clamp rotates freely around the sheath. Is that to be expected? I will get round to measuring the earth soon when the replacement test lead turns up.


No, the clamp should not move and will be an ineffective earth connection.

Report it to your DNO and they should either rectify it or provide PME.
(this may be delayed due to Coronovirus Regs)

Thanks. That's what I thought, but nice to have it confirmed.

I rang up UK power and they were somewhat unhelpful, and want to know what Ze is before they will do anything (I tried arguing that what it is NOW is irrelevant, and I don't want to start waggling their clamp to demonstrate that it will change). Well, gives me something to do. I will call back and hope I get someone more helpful.

There's a lead water main. Turns out it does have its uses....

If you're 100% RCDed it's not ideal, but not an immediate threat to life. If you're not RCDed it is.

Be aware that they will only reconnect your supply after the work if your water & gas/oil are bonded.


NT

On 25/05/2020 11:48, wrote:
On Monday, 25 May 2020 09:59:17 UTC+1, wrote:
On Monday, 25 May 2020 09:44:10 UTC+1, Jack Harry Teesdale wrote:
On 24/05/2020 20:49, wrote:

Had a proper look at the earthing on the new place today. The supply earth is provided by a clamp onto the sheath. It's not, so far as I can, a tightenable clamp.

https://www.flickr.com/photos/383551...posted-public/

It has a 10mm cable in which looks like it only just fits, can't see how I'd get a 16 in there. (tails are - at the moment - 25mm as far as a Henley, then down to 16mm)

I noticed that the clamp rotates freely around the sheath. Is that to be expected? I will get round to measuring the earth soon when the replacement test lead turns up.


No, the clamp should not move and will be an ineffective earth connection.

Report it to your DNO and they should either rectify it or provide PME.
(this may be delayed due to Coronovirus Regs)

Thanks. That's what I thought, but nice to have it confirmed.

I rang up UK power and they were somewhat unhelpful, and want to know what Ze is before they will do anything (I tried arguing that what it is NOW is irrelevant, and I don't want to start waggling their clamp to demonstrate that it will change). Well, gives me something to do. I will call back and hope I get someone more helpful.

There's a lead water main. Turns out it does have its uses....

If you're 100% RCDed it's not ideal, but not an immediate threat to life. If you're not RCDed it is.

Be aware that they will only reconnect your supply after the work if your water & gas/oil are bonded.



and IIRC to current (continuous 10mm) standard

--
Robin
reply-to address is (intended to be) valid

On Monday, 25 May 2020 13:13:32 UTC+1, Robin wrote:
On 25/05/2020 11:48, wrote:

Be aware that they will only reconnect your supply after the work if your water & gas/oil are bonded.



and IIRC to current (continuous 10mm) standard

Sorting out the bonding mess was how I noticed the problem in the first place!

Robin wrote:

On 25/05/2020 11:48, wrote:
On Monday, 25 May 2020 09:59:17 UTC+1, wrote:
On Monday, 25 May 2020 09:44:10 UTC+1, Jack Harry Teesdale wrote: On
24/05/2020 20:49, wrote:

Had a proper look at the earthing on the new place today. The supply
earth is provided by a clamp onto the sheath. It's not, so far as I
can, a tightenable clamp.
https://www.flickr.com/photos/383551.../dateposted-pu
blic/ It has a 10mm cable in which looks like it only just fits,
can't see how I'd get a 16 in there. (tails are - at the moment - 25mm
as far as a Henley, then down to 16mm) I noticed that the clamp
rotates freely around the sheath. Is that to be expected? I will get
round to measuring the earth soon when the replacement test lead turns
up. No, the clamp should not move and will be an ineffective earth
connection.

Report it to your DNO and they should either rectify it or provide
PME. (this may be delayed due to Coronovirus Regs)

Thanks. That's what I thought, but nice to have it confirmed.

I rang up UK power and they were somewhat unhelpful, and want to know
what Ze is before they will do anything (I tried arguing that what it is
NOW is irrelevant, and I don't want to start waggling their clamp to
demonstrate that it will change). Well, gives me something to do. I
will call back and hope I get someone more helpful.

There's a lead water main. Turns out it does have its uses....

If you're 100% RCDed it's not ideal, but not an immediate threat to
life. If you're not RCDed it is.

Be aware that they will only reconnect your supply after the work if
your water & gas/oil are bonded.



and IIRC to current (continuous 10mm) standard

What does 'continuous' mean in this context? Surely it doesn't mean no
joints? Or does it means no thinner sections?

--

Roger Hayter

On 25/05/2020 11:48, wrote:


Be aware that they will only reconnect your supply after the work if your water & gas/oil are bonded.



More likely they will not commence work if they are not bonded.


--
Adam

On Monday, 25 May 2020 09:59:17 UTC+1, wrote:
On Monday, 25 May 2020 09:44:10 UTC+1, Jack Harry Teesdale wrote:
On 24/05/2020 20:49, wrote:
Had a proper look at the earthing on the new place today. The supply earth is provided by a clamp onto the sheath. It's not, so far as I can, a tightenable clamp.

https://www.flickr.com/photos/383551...posted-public/

It has a 10mm cable in which looks like it only just fits, can't see how I'd get a 16 in there. (tails are - at the moment - 25mm as far as a Henley, then down to 16mm)

I noticed that the clamp rotates freely around the sheath. Is that to be expected? I will get round to measuring the earth soon when the replacement test lead turns up.


No, the clamp should not move and will be an ineffective earth connection.

Report it to your DNO and they should either rectify it or provide PME.
(this may be delayed due to Coronovirus Regs)

Thanks. That's what I thought, but nice to have it confirmed.

I rang up UK power and they were somewhat unhelpful, and want to know what Ze is before they will do anything (I tried arguing that what it is NOW is irrelevant, and I don't want to start waggling their clamp to demonstrate that it will change). Well, gives me something to do. I will call back and hope I get someone more helpful.

There's a lead water main. Turns out it does have its uses....

Leads finally turned up. Ze is 0.2. I moved their clamp gently, and established that it's a) stiffer than I remembered from Monday, and b) didn't affect the measurement. BTW it's not a 951 clamp.

In article ,
wrote:
Had a proper look at the earthing on the new place today. The supply earth is provided by a clamp onto the sheath. It's not, so far as I can, a tightenable clamp.


That sounds like what existed here on an old installation. Where the
incoming lead water main and the sheath to the mains riser provided the
rudimentary earth.

If you can use the mains riser for earth it needs the correct clamp - but
that's really a job for the supply company to make sure it is up to it.

--
*How much deeper would the oceans be without sponges? *

Dave Plowman London SW
To e-mail, change noise into sound.

In article ,
Dave Plowman (News) wrote:
In article ,
wrote:
Had a proper look at the earthing on the new place today. The supply
earth is provided by a clamp onto the sheath. It's not, so far as I
can, a tightenable clamp.


That sounds like what existed here on an old installation. Where the
incoming lead water main and the sheath to the mains riser provided the
rudimentary earth.

If you can use the mains riser for earth it needs the correct clamp - but
that's really a job for the supply company to make sure it is up to it.

The electrical installaton here, probably 1920s, got its earth from the
incoming cable sheath. However, after a few days of being fed from a
generator, tests on reconnection showed an inadequate earth from that cable
sheath. The supply company changed things to PME.

--
from KT24 in Surrey, England
"I'd rather die of exhaustion than die of boredom" Thomas Carlyle