I'm fairly sure that when this house was rewired that the cable
from the consumer unit to the cooker point was 6mm, but
recent discussion here has discussed 10mm and even 16mm.

Has the standard changed over the years?

On Friday, 31 January 2020 14:58:35 UTC, Gareth Evans wrote:
I'm fairly sure that when this house was rewired that the cable
from the consumer unit to the cooker point was 6mm, but
recent discussion here has discussed 10mm and even 16mm.

Has the standard changed over the years?

Had recently fitted two 6mm supplies for me and I got the impression it was fairly standard. That was for a separate hob and oven though so depending on your meaning/intention of the term 'cooker point' things might be different?

On Friday, 31 January 2020 15:21:21 UTC, Mathew Newton wrote:

Had recently fitted two 6mm supplies for me
^^^

That should be *Adam* not *Had* (bloody phone)

On Friday, 31 January 2020 14:58:35 UTC, Gareth Evans wrote:
I'm fairly sure that when this house was rewired that the cable
from the consumer unit to the cooker point was 6mm, but
recent discussion here has discussed 10mm and even 16mm.
Has the standard changed over the years?

6mm is normal but it does depend on cable routing. Perhaps newer homes have more likelihood the cable is running in insulation.

4mm is the minimum cable size for a 32A radial :-)

Owain

On 31/01/2020 14:58, Gareth Evans wrote:
I'm fairly sure that when this house was rewired that the cable
from the consumer unit to the cooker point was 6mm, but
recent discussion here has discussed 10mm and even 16mm.

Has the standard changed over the years?


The cable size depends on the cooker kW or current rating, the cicuit
length and the installation conditions e.g under insulation or clipped
direct.

On 31/01/2020 14:58, Gareth Evans wrote:

I'm fairly sure that when this house was rewired that the cable
from the consumer unit to the cooker point was 6mm, but
recent discussion here has discussed 10mm and even 16mm.

Has the standard changed over the years?

There is probably a wider availability of more powerful cookers (or hob
/ oven combinations) than in the past.

However 6mm^2 is a fairly common choice in most cases. Note also that
you can apply fairly generous diversity adjustments to cookers in a
domestic situation, and that tends to lower the design load quite a bit.

See:

http://wiki.diyfaq.org.uk/index.php/Diversity


--
Cheers,

John.

/================================================== ===============\
| Internode Ltd - http://www.internode.co.uk |
|-----------------------------------------------------------------|
| John Rumm - john(at)internode(dot)co(dot)uk |
\================================================= ================/

On 31/01/2020 15:56, John Rumm wrote:
On 31/01/2020 14:58, Gareth Evans wrote:

I'm fairly sure that when this house was rewired that the cable
from the consumer unit to the cooker point was 6mm, but
recent discussion here has discussed 10mm and even 16mm.

Has the standard changed over the years?

There is probably a wider availability of more powerful cookers (or hob
/ oven combinations) than in the past.

However 6mm^2 is a fairly common choice in most cases. Note also that
you can apply fairly generous diversity adjustments to cookers in a
domestic situation, and that tends to lower the design load quite a bit.

See:

http://wiki.diyfaq.org.uk/index.php/Diversity

Thanks.

Interesting Wiki, especially the chapter on electronics repair.

On 31/01/2020 15:56:05, John Rumm wrote:
On 31/01/2020 14:58, Gareth Evans wrote:

I'm fairly sure that when this house was rewired that the cable
from the consumer unit to the cooker point was 6mm, but
recent discussion here has discussed 10mm and even 16mm.

Has the standard changed over the years?

There is probably a wider availability of more powerful cookers (or hob
/ oven combinations) than in the past.

I would have said quite the opposite. It's quite common for an oven to
be low enough power to use a standard plug.

On Friday, 31 January 2020 14:58:35 UTC, Gareth Evans wrote:
I'm fairly sure that when this house was rewired that the cable
from the consumer unit to the cooker point was 6mm, but
recent discussion here has discussed 10mm and even 16mm.

Has the standard changed over the years?

Cookers cover a wide range. Some are fine on 2.5mm or 1.5mm, some demand 6mm. 10 & 16 square mm are a bit OTT for domestic kit, though I'm sure you'll find sufficiently extravagant cookers if you look.


NT

Fredxx wrote:
On 31/01/2020 15:56:05, John Rumm wrote:
On 31/01/2020 14:58, Gareth Evans wrote:

I'm fairly sure that when this house was rewired that the cable
from the consumer unit to the cooker point was 6mm, but
recent discussion here has discussed 10mm and even 16mm.

Has the standard changed over the years?

There is probably a wider availability of more powerful cookers (or hob
/ oven combinations) than in the past.

I would have said quite the opposite. It's quite common for an oven to
be low enough power to use a standard plug.


But now multi-ring, multi-oven €œrange€� cookers are fashionable...

Tim

--
Please don't feed the trolls

On 31/01/2020 16:34, Fredxx wrote:
On 31/01/2020 15:56:05, John Rumm wrote:
On 31/01/2020 14:58, Gareth Evans wrote:

I'm fairly sure that when this house was rewired that the cable
from the consumer unit to the cooker point was 6mm, but
recent discussion here has discussed 10mm and even 16mm.

Has the standard changed over the years?

There is probably a wider availability of more powerful cookers (or
hob / oven combinations) than in the past.

I would have said quite the opposite. It's quite common for an oven to
be low enough power to use a standard plug.

True, but its not usually the oven that is the main load with separate
components. Hobs with a maximum demand of 7kW are not uncommon. Whereas
that would have been very high for a complete "electric cooker" of the 70's

--
Cheers,

John.

/================================================== ===============\
| Internode Ltd - http://www.internode.co.uk |
|-----------------------------------------------------------------|
| John Rumm - john(at)internode(dot)co(dot)uk |
\================================================= ================/

Tim+ wrote:
Fredxx wrote:
On 31/01/2020 15:56:05, John Rumm wrote:
On 31/01/2020 14:58, Gareth Evans wrote:

I'm fairly sure that when this house was rewired that the cable
from the consumer unit to the cooker point was 6mm, but
recent discussion here has discussed 10mm and even 16mm.

Has the standard changed over the years?

There is probably a wider availability of more powerful cookers (or hob
/ oven combinations) than in the past.

I would have said quite the opposite. It's quite common for an oven to
be low enough power to use a standard plug.


But now multi-ring, multi-oven €œrange€� cookers are fashionable...

Tim


These things go in cycles.

The Aga like range things seem to come into vogue every few years, to be
replaced by separate hobs an ovens for a while.

I actually like the range style, in fact we looked seriously at an Aga but
decided they were more suited to old houses and ones which were €˜built
around the kitchen almost. I even had the surveyor check the kitchen floor
would take the weight before we bought the house. Senior Management wanted
a sleek modern hob and oven so we ended up with an induction hob and a
couple of fan ovens, one is also a microwave etc. Both have grills. The
induction hob is excellent. In retrospect, I wish wed gone for the 6 ring
although now there are (mostly) only two of us at home 4 is fine. When
everyone is here etc just having the 4 can require some shuffling of pans
etc.

Eldest bought a house which has a very nice looking range style cooker in
it. Im not sure of the make but AKAIK they are happy with it. They needed
to replace the glass on the door (it got broken when cleaning it) but,
other than that, it has been no trouble.

John Rumm wrote:
On 31/01/2020 16:34, Fredxx wrote:
On 31/01/2020 15:56:05, John Rumm wrote:
On 31/01/2020 14:58, Gareth Evans wrote:

I'm fairly sure that when this house was rewired that the cable
from the consumer unit to the cooker point was 6mm, but
recent discussion here has discussed 10mm and even 16mm.

Has the standard changed over the years?

There is probably a wider availability of more powerful cookers (or
hob / oven combinations) than in the past.

I would have said quite the opposite. It's quite common for an oven to
be low enough power to use a standard plug.

True, but its not usually the oven that is the main load with separate
components. Hobs with a maximum demand of 7kW are not uncommon. Whereas
that would have been very high for a complete "electric cooker" of the 70's


I think some of the €˜combi ovens are on the border line for being suitable
to be plugged into a socket.

I recall when we were buying our kitchen, the company checking if the one
we had selected required an extra spur or could run from a socket.

Weve also got a stand alone combi, which we bought before the new kitchen
but still works, and it runs off a normal socket.

Get a bluetooth keyboard.
Brian

--
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This newsgroup posting comes to you directly from...
The Sofa of Brian Gaff...

Blind user, so no pictures please
Note this Signature is meaningless.!
"Mathew Newton" wrote in message
...
On Friday, 31 January 2020 15:21:21 UTC, Mathew Newton wrote:

Had recently fitted two 6mm supplies for me
^^^

That should be *Adam* not *Had* (bloody phone)

On Sat, 1 Feb 2020 01:28:25 +0000, John Rumm wrote:

On 31/01/2020 16:34, Fredxx wrote:
On 31/01/2020 15:56:05, John Rumm wrote:
On 31/01/2020 14:58, Gareth Evans wrote:

I'm fairly sure that when this house was rewired that the cable
from the consumer unit to the cooker point was 6mm, but
recent discussion here has discussed 10mm and even 16mm.

Has the standard changed over the years?

There is probably a wider availability of more powerful cookers (or
hob / oven combinations) than in the past.

I would have said quite the opposite. It's quite common for an oven to
be low enough power to use a standard plug.

True, but its not usually the oven that is the main load with separate
components. Hobs with a maximum demand of 7kW are not uncommon. Whereas
that would have been very high for a complete "electric cooker" of the 70's

I've a Belling that was given to me in early '80s; it had 4x2kW radiant
rings on the hob. One is now 1100W. I rarely use more than one at a time -
just as well, as it's on a 30A MCB.
The cable isn't all that long and is in mini-trunking and above the ceiling,
so I could get away with a 40A MCB.
It has a standard oven and two grill elements, so the whole load is over 40A
by a bit.
--
Peter.
The gods will stay away
whilst religions hold sway

On 01/02/2020 09:46, PeterC wrote:
On Sat, 1 Feb 2020 01:28:25 +0000, John Rumm wrote:

On 31/01/2020 16:34, Fredxx wrote:
On 31/01/2020 15:56:05, John Rumm wrote:
On 31/01/2020 14:58, Gareth Evans wrote:

I'm fairly sure that when this house was rewired that the cable
from the consumer unit to the cooker point was 6mm, but
recent discussion here has discussed 10mm and even 16mm.

Has the standard changed over the years?

There is probably a wider availability of more powerful cookers (or
hob / oven combinations) than in the past.

I would have said quite the opposite. It's quite common for an oven to
be low enough power to use a standard plug.

True, but its not usually the oven that is the main load with separate
components. Hobs with a maximum demand of 7kW are not uncommon. Whereas
that would have been very high for a complete "electric cooker" of the 70's

I've a Belling that was given to me in early '80s; it had 4x2kW radiant
rings on the hob. One is now 1100W. I rarely use more than one at a time -
just as well, as it's on a 30A MCB.
The cable isn't all that long and is in mini-trunking and above the ceiling,
so I could get away with a 40A MCB.
It has a standard oven and two grill elements, so the whole load is over 40A
by a bit.

So if you assume a max load of 40A and apply diversity - take 10A of the
actual load, then 30% of the remainder you get 10 + 0.3 x 30 = 19A, So
in reality a 32A circuit will be fine. (a 32A MCB will likely carry 40A
indefinitely[1])


[1] http://wiki.diyfaq.org.uk/images/d/d...e-MCBTypeB.png






--
Cheers,

John.

/================================================== ===============\
| Internode Ltd - http://www.internode.co.uk |
|-----------------------------------------------------------------|
| John Rumm - john(at)internode(dot)co(dot)uk |
\================================================= ================/

On Sat, 1 Feb 2020 14:38:49 +0000, John Rumm wrote:

On 01/02/2020 09:46, PeterC wrote:
On Sat, 1 Feb 2020 01:28:25 +0000, John Rumm wrote:

On 31/01/2020 16:34, Fredxx wrote:
On 31/01/2020 15:56:05, John Rumm wrote:
On 31/01/2020 14:58, Gareth Evans wrote:

I'm fairly sure that when this house was rewired that the cable
from the consumer unit to the cooker point was 6mm, but
recent discussion here has discussed 10mm and even 16mm.

Has the standard changed over the years?

There is probably a wider availability of more powerful cookers (or
hob / oven combinations) than in the past.

I would have said quite the opposite. It's quite common for an oven to
be low enough power to use a standard plug.

True, but its not usually the oven that is the main load with separate
components. Hobs with a maximum demand of 7kW are not uncommon. Whereas
that would have been very high for a complete "electric cooker" of the 70's

I've a Belling that was given to me in early '80s; it had 4x2kW radiant
rings on the hob. One is now 1100W. I rarely use more than one at a time -
just as well, as it's on a 30A MCB.
The cable isn't all that long and is in mini-trunking and above the ceiling,
so I could get away with a 40A MCB.
It has a standard oven and two grill elements, so the whole load is over 40A
by a bit.

So if you assume a max load of 40A and apply diversity - take 10A of the
actual load, then 30% of the remainder you get 10 + 0.3 x 30 = 19A, So
in reality a 32A circuit will be fine. (a 32A MCB will likely carry 40A
indefinitely[1])

[1] http://wiki.diyfaq.org.uk/images/d/d...e-MCBTypeB.png

Indeed - I consulted that when I was changing an MCB.
As I use most of the elements from not a lot to close to never I try to
remember to turn them on once a year to keep them dry. That's when I have to
be careful - diversity doesn't apply! Usually do 2 rings, grill, oven -
preferably on a frosty morning so that the heat is useful.
--
Peter.
The gods will stay away
whilst religions hold sway

On 31/01/2020 14:58, Gareth Evans wrote:
I'm fairly sure that when this house was rewired that the cable
from the consumer unit to the cooker point was 6mm, but
recent discussion here has discussed 10mm and even 16mm.

Has the standard changed over the years?


Some cookers got chunkier - in particular induction and the concept of
the Range cooker. The latter in induction mode can pull frightening
amounts of power.

On Saturday, 1 February 2020 22:33:58 UTC, PeterC wrote:
As I use most of the elements from not a lot to close to never I try to
remember to turn them on once a year to keep them dry. That's when I have to
be careful - diversity doesn't apply!

I'm not sure I remember diversity after cleaning the hob.

It's on a 13 amp plug (temporarily since 2016). Hasn't blown yet though.

Owain