Hi All,

I have run cat 6 cables to all rooms in my house all terminated in a comms cupboard. The BT master socket is in another room and again a cat 6 cable is run from it to the comms cupboard terminated with a BT socket. In the comms cupboard I have terminated all cat 6 cables in a patch panel.

So, the question is how best to I connect the 3 patch panel ports which are connected to phone sockets in rooms to the BT socket. So far I have thought of the following
1. Create patch cables with RJ45 one end and BT socket the other. The connect these into the BT socket via a normal phone splitter
2. Create a 3 way cable by having 3 cables with RJ45 connectors one end and the other ends all soldered together. Then solder this onto a phone cable connected to BT socket
3. I tried looking for a RJ45 splitter (RJ45 version of a normal phone one) but couldn't find one

Neither of which seem ideal. Anyone have any better ideas?

Also, I assume I have to terminate the cable from the BT master socket in a BT socket rather than terminate it in the patch panel?

Thanks in advance for your help

Lee.

On Wednesday, 17 April 2019 20:38:10 UTC+1, wrote:
Also, I assume I have to terminate the cable from the BT master socket
in a BT socket rather than terminate it in the patch panel?

No, terminate the phone line on paralleled RJ45 sockets, eg on your patch panel if you have an spares, or on something like this

https://www.network-cabling.co.uk/st...-modules-p-590

The use RJ45-RJ45 patch leads between the data panel and the phone panel.

On my home patch panel I have 4 phone lines per group of 5 jacks, jacks 1-4 are a single line on the first pair each, and jack 5 has 4 lines using all four pairs. Thus I can take 4 lines to a location only using 1 data line. (And as in the main rooms the jacks are in quads, I can take 16 lines to any one location.)

(They're not BT lines, I do have a number of switchboards.)

Owain

What I did was to fit a second patch panel that had 16 sockets. I wired all the sockets in parallel and ran the cat 5 cable back to the BT master socket.

The idea was to have 16 ethernet sockets all wired as secondary BT sockets.

The first patch panel was wired to all the ethernet wall sockets in the house.

I had a 48 port gigabit switch also in the rack connected to the LAN port of my internet modem.

I have a set of green and a set of white short patch cables.

The green ones were used to patch between the wall sockets and the internet connected gigabit switch ports.

The white ones were used to patch between the wall sockets and the 16 socket BT sockets patch panel.

Incidentally if you wire the phone patch panel as eia/Tia 568b instead of Tia/eia 568a, this will then take on the same wiring convention colours as BT wiring and the phones will just then work without fear of mis-wiring between patch panel and BT master socket. 😀


All I needed then was commonly available RJ45 plug to BT socket adapters where a phone was required to plug into the ethernet socket.

Kenable have them at https://www.kenable.co.uk/en/network...CABEgKS0_D_BwE

P.s. that reminds me, you need to keep an eye on the REN load on the phone line.

BT phone lines can support a REN of 4.

Simply add up all the individual REN numbers of your telephony devices. If t comes to 4 or more, you will need to fit a REN amplifier between the BT master socket and your telephony patch panel.

REN stands for ringer equivalent number.

wrote in message
...
P.s. that reminds me, you need to keep an eye on the REN load on the phone
line.

BT phone lines can support a REN of 4.

Simply add up all the individual REN numbers of your telephony devices. If
t comes to 4 or more, you will need to fit a REN amplifier between the BT
master socket and your telephony patch panel.

REN stands for ringer equivalent number.

Not convinced that that matters anymore with modern electronic phones.

And it makes a lot more sense to use cordless phones
now than fart around with lots of non cordless phones.

On Thu, 18 Apr 2019 07:27:57 +1000, cantankerous trolling geezer Rot Speed,
the auto-contradicting senile sociopath, blabbered, again:

Simply add up all the individual REN numbers of your telephony devices. If
t comes to 4 or more, you will need to fit a REN amplifier between the BT
master socket and your telephony patch panel.

REN stands for ringer equivalent number.

Not convinced that that matters anymore

In auto-contradicting mode again, senile Ozzietard? Of COURSE! LOL

--
"Anonymous" to trolling senile Rot Speed:
"You can **** off as you know less than pig **** you sad
little ignorant ****."
MID:

On 17/04/2019 22:21, wrote:
P.s. that reminds me, you need to keep an eye on the REN load on the phone line.

BT phone lines can support a REN of 4.

Simply add up all the individual REN numbers of your telephony devices. If t comes to 4 or more, you will need to fit a REN amplifier between the BT master socket and your telephony patch panel.

REN stands for ringer equivalent number.

Modern phones usually have a pretty low REN anyway, so you should get
away with a fair few. However, just turning off the ringer on some of
the handsets will normally solve any REN problems.

(or better still, fit a cheap PABX!)



--
Cheers,

John.

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On 17/04/2019 20:38, wrote:
Hi All,

I have run cat 6 cables to all rooms in my house all terminated in a comms cupboard. The BT master socket is in another room and again a cat 6 cable is run from it to the comms cupboard terminated with a BT socket. In the comms cupboard I have terminated all cat 6 cables in a patch panel.

So, the question is how best to I connect the 3 patch panel ports which are connected to phone sockets in rooms to the BT socket. So far I have thought of the following
1. Create patch cables with RJ45 one end and BT socket the other. The connect these into the BT socket via a normal phone splitter
2. Create a 3 way cable by having 3 cables with RJ45 connectors one end and the other ends all soldered together. Then solder this onto a phone cable connected to BT socket
3. I tried looking for a RJ45 splitter (RJ45 version of a normal phone one) but couldn't find one

Neither of which seem ideal. Anyone have any better ideas?

Also, I assume I have to terminate the cable from the BT master socket in a BT socket rather than terminate it in the patch panel?

Thanks in advance for your help


PABX?

Lee.



--
€œIdeas are inherently conservative. They yield not to the attack of
other ideas but to the massive onslaught of circumstance"

- John K Galbraith

On 17/04/2019 20:38, wrote:
Hi All,

I have run cat 6 cables to all rooms in my house all terminated in a
comms cupboard. The BT master socket is in another room and again a
cat 6 cable is run from it to the comms cupboard terminated with a BT
socket. In the comms cupboard I have terminated all cat 6 cables in
a patch panel.

So, the question is how best to I connect the 3 patch panel ports
which are connected to phone sockets in rooms to the BT socket. So
far I have thought of the following 1. Create patch cables with RJ45
one end and BT socket the other. The connect these into the BT
socket via a normal phone splitter 2. Create a 3 way cable by having
3 cables with RJ45 connectors one end and the other ends all soldered
together. Then solder this onto a phone cable connected to BT
socket 3. I tried looking for a RJ45 splitter (RJ45 version of a
normal phone one) but couldn't find one

If you have spare patch panel sockets free, then wire 4 in parallel,
patch three to the other patch sockets you want to connect phones to,
and connect a BT to RJ11/45 to the remaining paralleled socket.

(Note that you can plug a RJ11 into a RJ45 socket - hence a "normal" BT
to RJ11 lead will often be adequate to connect a BT phone socket to a
patch panel)

Neither of which seem ideal. Anyone have any better ideas?

A basic PABX would probably be overkill for three phones, but might be
worth it if you would like to be able to call between extensions, or
want to add a VoIP line to the system, e.g.

https://www.orchidtelecom.com/product/orchid-pbx308/

Also, I assume I have to terminate the cable from the BT master
socket in a BT socket rather than terminate it in the patch panel?

You can get "master" euro modules with BT socket on them, but those are
really designed for use with 2 wire PABX wiring, since they only provide
the ring cap, but not the surge suppressor or test resistor that you
have the main master.


--
Cheers,

John.

/================================================== ===============\
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Thanks very much all this was exactly what I was after but couldn't think of a way of achieving it. So, just so I can apply the various comments to my situation is this correct?

1. I have wired all my sockets up using 568B so sounds like at the face plate, when I need to have a phone line I just need the RJ45 to BT adapter Steph (sorry can't see full name) suggests above
2. I wire all faceplate sockets (including those that will be phones) to the patch panels
3. I wire the cat 6 cable that is wired into my master socket into the patch panel directly rather than to another BT socket
4. Set up 3 ports on the patch panel wired in parallel (i.e. punch a long wire connecting all same colours together - e.g. same brown wire punched into brown of all 3 ports). 1 for the master and one each for the 2 phones we have
5. Patch whichever face plate ports I want to activate as a phone to one of the ports set up in set (4).

Would this work?

thanks

Lee.

On 18/04/2019 10:43, wrote:

Thanks very much all this was exactly what I was after but couldn't
think of a way of achieving it. So, just so I can apply the various
comments to my situation is this correct?

1. I have wired all my sockets up using 568B so sounds like at the
face plate, when I need to have a phone line I just need the RJ45 to
BT adapter Steph (sorry can't see full name) suggests above

Typically (analogue) phone wiring on a structured cabling system just
uses the middle two contacts on the connector. The actual wiring
standard used does not really matter, so long as they are connected to a
pair, and they get to the far end! (and the centre pair are typically
carried by the blue wires on CAT5/6 - and those are the same in both
TIA-568 A and B anyway).

So you need to wire a patch lead with the outer two populated pins on
the BT plug (pins 2 and 5), to the centre two on the RJ11 / 45

See:

http://wiki.diyfaq.org.uk/index.php/...ing_the_System

2. I wire
all faceplate sockets (including those that will be phones) to the
patch panels 3.

Yup, wire all sockets the same way - all pins connected between socket
and patch panel. That way you can decide how the socket will be used
later, and change the use as well should the need arise.

I wire the cat 6 cable that is wired into my master
socket into the patch panel directly rather than to another BT
socket

Is this the incoming line we are discussing? If so that still needs to
be in place to provide the line protection and test facilities. You can
wire directly from its extension terminals to your patch lead though if
you want. I would be less keen on wiring a line to the patch permanently.

4. Set up 3 ports on the patch panel wired in parallel (i.e.
punch a long wire connecting all same colours together - e.g. same
brown wire punched into brown of all 3 ports).

Since you can only really use this kind of joining for phone circuits,
so you only need do the blue pair on pins 4 and 5.

See:

http://wiki.diyfaq.org.uk/index.php/...hone_signa ls

1 for the master and
one each for the 2 phones we have

Yup.

5. Patch whichever face plate ports
I want to activate as a phone to one of the ports set up in set (4).

Yup.

Would this work?

Yup.

You now need a way to connect the phone to the RJ45 socket at the far
end. There are two typical options he

One is to use a Line Adaptor Unit. This provides a BT style socket
connected to a RJ45 plug. It also includes a ring capacitor to provide
the bell wire to phones that need it. (its better to regenerate the bell
wire locally if you need it, rather than pipe it about the wiring, since
its not impedance balanced like the other pair, and is more likely to
pick up noise that can upset broadband speeds).

The second is to simply use a phone lead with a RJ45 plug on the end (or
change the plug for a RJ45) - for many modern phones that don't require
the bell wire this will be fine. A straight through 2 wire lead with
RJ11 on both ends (as used by ADSL modems) will work fine with many phones.


--
Cheers,

John.

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\================================================= ================/

Thanks very much John. Almost there. A couple of quick follow-up questions / clarifications inline (hopefully it is readable)

On Thursday, 18 April 2019 12:16:28 UTC+1, John Rumm wrote:


Thanks very much all this was exactly what I was after but couldn't
think of a way of achieving it. So, just so I can apply the various
comments to my situation is this correct?

1. I have wired all my sockets up using 568B so sounds like at the
face plate, when I need to have a phone line I just need the RJ45 to
BT adapter Steph (sorry can't see full name) suggests above

Typically (analogue) phone wiring on a structured cabling system just
uses the middle two contacts on the connector. The actual wiring
standard used does not really matter, so long as they are connected to a
pair, and they get to the far end! (and the centre pair are typically
carried by the blue wires on CAT5/6 - and those are the same in both
TIA-568 A and B anyway).

So you need to wire a patch lead with the outer two populated pins on
the BT plug (pins 2 and 5), to the centre two on the RJ11 / 45

See:

http://wiki.diyfaq.org.uk/index.php/...ing_the_System


In my scenario, the cat 6 running from the master socket is connected to the extension terminals of the master socket and then wired into a secondary socket at the moment (I believe I have used brown wires and no bell wire to improve broadband). Sounds like I should switch these to the blue wires (does it matter which is which) and then wire the other end into the patch panel as normal. This was if I then use a RJ11 to RJ11 wire at the face plate to connect the phone it should work?

2. I wire
all faceplate sockets (including those that will be phones) to the
patch panels 3.

Yup, wire all sockets the same way - all pins connected between socket
and patch panel. That way you can decide how the socket will be used
later, and change the use as well should the need arise.

I wire the cat 6 cable that is wired into my master
socket into the patch panel directly rather than to another BT
socket

Is this the incoming line we are discussing? If so that still needs to
be in place to provide the line protection and test facilities. You can
wire directly from its extension terminals to your patch lead though if
you want. I would be less keen on wiring a line to the patch permanently.

4. Set up 3 ports on the patch panel wired in parallel (i.e.
punch a long wire connecting all same colours together - e.g. same
brown wire punched into brown of all 3 ports).

Since you can only really use this kind of joining for phone circuits,
so you only need do the blue pair on pins 4 and 5.

See:

http://wiki.diyfaq.org.uk/index.php/...hone_signa ls


Ah yes good point

1 for the master and
one each for the 2 phones we have

Yup.

5. Patch whichever face plate ports
I want to activate as a phone to one of the ports set up in set (4).

Yup.

Would this work?

Yup.

You now need a way to connect the phone to the RJ45 socket at the far
end. There are two typical options he

One is to use a Line Adaptor Unit. This provides a BT style socket
connected to a RJ45 plug. It also includes a ring capacitor to provide
the bell wire to phones that need it. (its better to regenerate the bell
wire locally if you need it, rather than pipe it about the wiring, since
its not impedance balanced like the other pair, and is more likely to
pick up noise that can upset broadband speeds).

The second is to simply use a phone lead with a RJ45 plug on the end (or
change the plug for a RJ45) - for many modern phones that don't require
the bell wire this will be fine. A straight through 2 wire lead with
RJ11 on both ends (as used by ADSL modems) will work fine with many phones.



Of the 2 "phones" one is actually the alarm panel so is wired directly anyway so for neatness would be better to connect the real phone via RJ11 to RJ11 cable.

--
Cheers,

John.

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| John Rumm - john(at)internode(dot)co(dot)uk |
\================================================= ================/

On 18/04/2019 12:55, Lee Nowell wrote:
Thanks very much John. Almost there. A couple of quick follow-up
questions / clarifications inline (hopefully it is readable)

On Thursday, 18 April 2019 12:16:28 UTC+1, John Rumm wrote:


See:

http://wiki.diyfaq.org.uk/index.php/...ing_the_System

In my scenario, the cat 6 running from the master socket is connected
to the extension terminals of the master socket and then wired into a
secondary socket at the moment (I believe I have used brown wires and
no bell wire to improve broadband). Sounds like I should switch
these to the blue wires (does it matter which is which) and then wire
the other end into the patch panel as normal.

The colours used for that application do not matter particularly, so
long as you use both wires of a twisted pair - say brown and brown
stripe or blue and blue stripe. Don't use say blue and green.

This was if I then use
a RJ11 to RJ11 wire at the face plate to connect the phone it should
work?

Yup. Depending on the phone at the end it may not ring if it wants the
bell wire and that has not been recreated somewhere.

4. Set up 3 ports on the patch panel wired in parallel (i.e.
punch a long wire connecting all same colours together - e.g.
same brown wire punched into brown of all 3 ports).

Since you can only really use this kind of joining for phone
circuits, so you only need do the blue pair on pins 4 and 5.

See:

http://wiki.diyfaq.org.uk/index.php/...hone_signa ls



Ah yes good point

1 for the master and one each for the 2 phones we have

Yup.

5. Patch whichever face plate ports I want to activate as a phone
to one of the ports set up in set (4).

Yup.

Would this work?

Yup.

You now need a way to connect the phone to the RJ45 socket at the
far end. There are two typical options he

Of the 2 "phones" one is actually the alarm panel so is wired
directly anyway so for neatness would be better to connect the real
phone via RJ11 to RJ11 cable.

The alarm panel is very unlikely to need a bell wire anyway, The phone
probably doesn't but you might want to check to be sure. If its happy
without, then a RJ11 to 11 or 45 lead will do fine. If it needs one,
then a LAU will be needed (or open the phone and install a 10uF bi-polar
cap somewhere suitable)




--
Cheers,

John.

/================================================== ===============\
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|-----------------------------------------------------------------|
| John Rumm - john(at)internode(dot)co(dot)uk |
\================================================= ================/

On 17/04/2019 20:38, wrote:
Hi All,

I have run cat 6 cables to all rooms in my house all terminated in a comms cupboard. The BT master socket is in another room and again a cat 6 cable is run from it to the comms cupboard terminated with a BT socket. In the comms cupboard I have terminated all cat 6 cables in a patch panel.

So, the question is how best to I connect the 3 patch panel ports which are connected to phone sockets in rooms to the BT socket. So far I have thought of the following
1. Create patch cables with RJ45 one end and BT socket the other. The connect these into the BT socket via a normal phone splitter
2. Create a 3 way cable by having 3 cables with RJ45 connectors one end and the other ends all soldered together. Then solder this onto a phone cable connected to BT socket
3. I tried looking for a RJ45 splitter (RJ45 version of a normal phone one) but couldn't find one

Neither of which seem ideal. Anyone have any better ideas?

Also, I assume I have to terminate the cable from the BT master socket in a BT socket rather than terminate it in the patch panel?

Thanks in advance for your help

Lee.

How about a BT socket to RJ45 adapter and then
https://www.amazon.co.uk/MagiDeal-Sp.../dp/B076VNM65Y

SteveW

Thanks Steve. Looks good but I have some spare ports on my patch panel so if the above would work might be a neater solution for my scenario

On 18/04/2019 10:44, Steve Walker wrote:
On 17/04/2019 20:38, wrote:
Hi All,

I have run cat 6 cables to all rooms in my house all terminated in a
comms cupboard.Â* The BT master socket is in another room and again a
cat 6 cable is run from it to the comms cupboard terminated with a BT
socket.Â* In the comms cupboard I have terminated all cat 6 cables in a
patch panel.

So, the question is how best to I connect the 3 patch panel ports
which are connected to phone sockets in rooms to the BT socket.Â* So
far I have thought of the following
1. Create patch cables with RJ45 one end and BT socket the other.Â* The
connect these into the BT socket via a normal phone splitter
2. Create a 3 way cable by having 3 cables with RJ45 connectors one
end and the other ends all soldered together.Â* Then solder this onto a
phone cable connected to BT socket
3. I tried looking for a RJ45 splitter (RJ45 version of a normal phone
one) but couldn't find one

Neither of which seem ideal. Anyone have any better ideas?

Also, I assume I have to terminate the cable from the BT master socket
in a BT socket rather than terminate it in the patch panel?

Thanks in advance for your help

Lee.

How about a BT socket to RJ45 adapter and then
https://www.amazon.co.uk/MagiDeal-Sp.../dp/B076VNM65Y

Shame about the lousy description - it gives the impression that you can
split ethernet with it, when in reality its only of any practical use in
a few limited voice application... something a good few of the reviewers
have obviously not grasped!


--
Cheers,

John.

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