BT line with phone and broadband.

Broadband is working OK and that has its own socket on the master
socket.

I can only get the phone working if I plug directly into the socket
behind the face plate on the master socket. If I plug into the socket
on the faceplate, I don't get anything at all. BT have suggested that
the micro filter on the faceplate has failed, but I've replaced that
with a new one, and that doesn't work either.

Any suggestions on where to start looking next ?

Thanks

Adrian
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Adrian wrote:

BT line with phone and broadband.
Broadband is working OK and that has its own socket on the master
socket.

I can only get the phone working if I plug directly into the socket
behind the face plate on the master socket. If I plug into the socket
on the faceplate, I don't get anything at all. BT have suggested that
the micro filter on the faceplate has failed

tempted to agree with them so far, be wary of calling them out as they'd
be likely to charge in this situation.

but I've replaced that
with a new one, and that doesn't work either.

Any other extension wiring?

Any suggestions on where to start looking next ?

Thanks

Adrian

On 10/05/2018 11:59, Adrian wrote:
BT line with phone and broadband.

Broadband is working OK and that has its own socket on the master socket.

I can only get the phone working if I plug directly into the socket
behind the face plate on the master socket.Â* If I plug into the socket
on the faceplate, I don't get anything at all.Â*Â* BT have suggested that
the micro filter on the faceplate has failed, but I've replaced that
with a new one, and that doesn't work either.

Any suggestions on where to start looking next ?

Can you confirm there are no external wires into the faceplate?

I might be tempted to get a new faceplate and try it myself, saving the
hassle and risk of an engineer attending.

It's possible a pin has been damaged/bent/out of place.

"Andy Burns" wrote in message
...
Adrian wrote:

BT line with phone and broadband.
Broadband is working OK and that has its own socket on the master
socket.

I can only get the phone working if I plug directly into the socket
behind the face plate on the master socket. If I plug into the socket
on the faceplate, I don't get anything at all. BT have suggested that
the micro filter on the faceplate has failed

Any other extension wiring?

That is the next thing to check: if there are wires attached to the
faceplate, going to a second cable to other parts of the house, they may be
suspect. Unplug everything from phone sockets (if any) elsewhere in the
house and see if the problem still exists.

However if even a standalone filter (ie not the one on the faceplate) causes
the same problem, then it looks as if it's extension wiring.

When you press the green telephone "off hook" button, do you get any sound
at all (eg a click)? What about if you take the phone off hook and then
plug/unplug the lead into the filter (standalone or faceplate)?

What tone does another phone (eg mobile) get if it tries to ring the
landline when it's not working?

Adrian explained :
BT line with phone and broadband.

Broadband is working OK and that has its own socket on the master socket.

I can only get the phone working if I plug directly into the socket behind
the face plate on the master socket. If I plug into the socket on the
faceplate, I don't get anything at all. BT have suggested that the micro
filter on the faceplate has failed, but I've replaced that with a new one,
and that doesn't work either.

Any suggestions on where to start looking next ?

Thanks

Adrian

Any extension wiring you have, will be connected when the faceplate is
plugged in, so that wiring comes under suspicion when it works
directly, but not via the faceplate. That was the whole idea of the
unpluggable faceplate, to be able to isolate the extension wiring
easily by the customer.

In message , Andy Burns
writes
Adrian wrote:

BT line with phone and broadband.
Broadband is working OK and that has its own socket on the master
socket.
I can only get the phone working if I plug directly into the socket
behind the face plate on the master socket. If I plug into the socket
on the faceplate, I don't get anything at all. BT have suggested that
the micro filter on the faceplate has failed

tempted to agree with them so far, be wary of calling them out as
they'd be likely to charge in this situation.


That was my thinking too..

but I've replaced that
with a new one, and that doesn't work either.

Any other extension wiring?


Yes, there are a number of other phone sockets around the house, none of
which currently have phones plugged into them.

I'm not ruling out a wiring fault, but it seems odd that it has died
when there hasn't been any obvious change to the system. The last time
it was disturbed was in late 2012 when I changed from ADSL to FTTC.

Adrian
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On 10/05/2018 11:59, Adrian wrote:
BT line with phone and broadband.

Broadband is working OK and that has its own socket on the master socket.

I can only get the phone working if I plug directly into the socket
behind the face plate on the master socket.Â* If I plug into the socket
on the faceplate, I don't get anything at all.Â*Â* BT have suggested that
the micro filter on the faceplate has failed, but I've replaced that
with a new one, and that doesn't work either.


Do you mean you have replaced the frontplate or that you have plugged a
"dongle" type microfilter in ?

In message , Harry Bloomfield
writes
Adrian explained :
BT line with phone and broadband.

Broadband is working OK and that has its own socket on the master socket.

I can only get the phone working if I plug directly into the socket
behind the face plate on the master socket. If I plug into the socket
on the faceplate, I don't get anything at all. BT have suggested
that the micro filter on the faceplate has failed, but I've replaced
that with a new one, and that doesn't work either.

Any suggestions on where to start looking next ?

Thanks

Adrian

Any extension wiring you have, will be connected when the faceplate is
plugged in, so that wiring comes under suspicion when it works
directly, but not via the faceplate. That was the whole idea of the
unpluggable faceplate, to be able to isolate the extension wiring
easily by the customer.


Thanks.

I've just removed the extension wiring from the faceplate, and I can now
get the faceplate working (unfortunately, its location doesn't lend
itself to leaving a phone plugged in). Tracing that through is not
going to be fun.

Adrian
--
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Every time someone says "I don't believe in trolls", another one dies.

In message , Robert
writes
On 10/05/2018 11:59, Adrian wrote:
BT line with phone and broadband.
Broadband is working OK and that has its own socket on the master
socket.
I can only get the phone working if I plug directly into the socket
behind the face plate on the master socket.* If I plug into the socket
the faceplate, I don't get anything at all.** BT have suggested that
the micro filter on the faceplate has failed, but I've replaced that
with a new one, and that doesn't work either.


Do you mean you have replaced the frontplate or that you have plugged a
"dongle" type microfilter in ?

Replaced the faceplate. No dongle type microfilters are in use here.

Adrian
--
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replace "bulleid" with "adrian" - all mail to bulleid is rejected
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Every time someone says "I don't believe in trolls", another one dies.

Robert wrote:
On 10/05/2018 11:59, Adrian wrote:
BT line with phone and broadband.

Broadband is working OK and that has its own socket on the master socket.

I can only get the phone working if I plug directly into the socket
behind the face plate on the master socket. If I plug into the socket
on the faceplate, I don't get anything at all. BT have suggested
that the micro filter on the faceplate has failed, but I've replaced
that with a new one, and that doesn't work either.


Do you mean you have replaced the frontplate or that you have plugged a
"dongle" type microfilter in ?


It might help us to know the exact type of master socket and filter.
For example is it the modern "Type 5C" as shown on:

https://www.telecomgreen.co.uk/engin...t-guided-tour/

see also:

http://bt.custhelp.com/app/answers/d...-have-i-got%3F

--
Graham J

On 5/10/2018 6:59 AM, Adrian wrote:
BT line with phone and broadband.

Broadband is working OK and that has its own socket on the master socket.

I can only get the phone working if I plug directly into the socket
behind the face plate on the master socket.Â* If I plug into the socket
on the faceplate, I don't get anything at all.Â*Â* BT have suggested that
the micro filter on the faceplate has failed, but I've replaced that
with a new one, and that doesn't work either.

Any suggestions on where to start looking next ?

I've had a similar problem, more than once. The solution was, oddly
enough, replacing the router/hub. See if you can borrow one, switch it
for yours, and see if that clears the problem. If not, perhaps the whole
master socket needs replacing?
According to a local OpenReach employee, lightning strikes in the area
may have caused some damage, but not enough to stop all functioning of
the hub.
It's happened to my phone service three times now, and each time,
replacing the hub has fixed it.

In message , Graham J
writes
It might help us to know the exact type of master socket and filter.
For example is it the modern "Type 5C" as shown on:

http://bt.custhelp.com/app/answers/d...t-type-of-mast
er-socket-have-i-got%3F


Looking at that page, scroll down to the "Master socket with two
sockets" section, and it looks like the middle one of the three,
broadband on top, phone on the bottom.

Adrian
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On 10/05/2018 12:54, Robert wrote:
On 10/05/2018 11:59, Adrian wrote:
BT line with phone and broadband.

Broadband is working OK and that has its own socket on the master socket.

I can only get the phone working if I plug directly into the socket
behind the face plate on the master socket.Â* If I plug into the socket
on the faceplate, I don't get anything at all.Â*Â* BT have suggested
that the micro filter on the faceplate has failed, but I've replaced
that with a new one, and that doesn't work either.


Do you mean you have replaced the frontplate or that you have plugged a
"dongle" type microfilter in ?

Or do you have the latest type of Openreach socket which has
a separate phone and data socket ?.

Any recent thunderstorms or lightening in the area ?.

In message , Andrew
writes

Or do you have the latest type of Openreach socket which has
a separate phone and data socket ?.


Yes, see elsewhere in this thread for a description.

Any recent thunderstorms or lightening in the area ?.

Not that I'm aware of.

Thanks

Adrian
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Adrian wrote:

[snip]


Any extension wiring you have, will be connected when the faceplate is
plugged in, so that wiring comes under suspicion when it works
directly, but not via the faceplate. That was the whole idea of the
unpluggable faceplate, to be able to isolate the extension wiring
easily by the customer.


Thanks.

I've just removed the extension wiring from the faceplate, and I can now
get the faceplate working (unfortunately, its location doesn't lend
itself to leaving a phone plugged in). Tracing that through is not
going to be fun.

OK so the fault is with the extension wiring.

How many extension sockets are there?

If more than one, the wiring may go from one to the next, in a daisy
chain, or there may be multiple wires joined at one or more extension
sockets. You will have to inspect them all, and make a sketch to show
how they are connected.

It then ought to be possible to isolate each cable, and reconnect them
one by one starting from the wiring that you disconnected from the
faceplate filter.

It would be worth making a simple tester with a battery and a lamp, so
that you can check each pair. If there's a convenient earth point
available you can check one wire at a time.

Be aware that the punchdown connectors very rarely accept more than one
wire reliably. Two wires will sometimes work, but where I have seen
three punched down together the last will usually fall out.

If you can prove a break along the length of a cable then you may have a
problem with mice or rats eating the PVC insulation and chewing through
the copper conductor.

--
Graham J

In article ,
Adrian wrote:
BT line with phone and broadband.

Broadband is working OK and that has its own socket on the master
socket.

I can only get the phone working if I plug directly into the socket
behind the face plate on the master socket. If I plug into the socket
on the faceplate, I don't get anything at all. BT have suggested that
the micro filter on the faceplate has failed, but I've replaced that
with a new one, and that doesn't work either.

Any suggestions on where to start looking next ?

Sounds like a problem in the phone wiring after the socket. Disconnect and
see if a phone now works on the faceplate one.

--
*Eschew obfuscation *

Dave Plowman London SW
To e-mail, change noise into sound.

In message , Graham J
writes
Adrian wrote:

[snip]


Any extension wiring you have, will be connected when the faceplate is
plugged in, so that wiring comes under suspicion when it works
directly, but not via the faceplate. That was the whole idea of the
unpluggable faceplate, to be able to isolate the extension wiring
easily by the customer.


Thanks.

I've just removed the extension wiring from the faceplate, and I can now
get the faceplate working (unfortunately, its location doesn't lend
itself to leaving a phone plugged in). Tracing that through is not
going to be fun.

OK so the fault is with the extension wiring.

How many extension sockets are there?


4 extension sockets in all, and they are daisy chained.

Be aware that the punchdown connectors very rarely accept more than one
wire reliably. Two wires will sometimes work, but where I have seen
three punched down together the last will usually fall out.


Thanks for the warning.

If you can prove a break along the length of a cable then you may have
a problem with mice or rats eating the PVC insulation and chewing
through the copper conductor.


The leg between extension 2 and 3 is under the floor, so if there is a
rodent issue, that's likely where it is, but it is ~10 years since there
was last any sign of a rodent visiting.

Thanks

Adrian
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In message , Adrian
writes
BT line with phone and broadband.

Broadband is working OK and that has its own socket on the master
socket.

I can only get the phone working if I plug directly into the socket
behind the face plate on the master socket. If I plug into the socket
on the faceplate, I don't get anything at all. BT have suggested that
the micro filter on the faceplate has failed, but I've replaced that
with a new one, and that doesn't work either.


I'm happy to report that the problem appears to have been resolved.

Going back to the days of ADSL, extension sockets numbers 2 & 4 in the
chain had in built filters. It looks as though the problem was with the
face plate on number 2. When I disconnected wire 2 (Line B ?), I could
get a dialling tone on the handset plugged in between it and the master
socket, when I reconnected line 2, it didn't work. Fortunately, I had a
spare, plain, face plate which I've swapped it for, and I'm now back in
business. It looks as though Mr B.T's diagnosis of a failed filter was
right, just the wrong one.

Many thanks for the suggestions.

Adrian
--
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"Dave Plowman (News)" wrote in message
...
In article ,
Adrian wrote:
BT line with phone and broadband.

Broadband is working OK and that has its own socket on the master
socket.

I can only get the phone working if I plug directly into the socket
behind the face plate on the master socket. If I plug into the socket
on the faceplate, I don't get anything at all. BT have suggested that
the micro filter on the faceplate has failed, but I've replaced that
with a new one, and that doesn't work either.

Any suggestions on where to start looking next ?

Sounds like a problem in the phone wiring after the socket. Disconnect and
see if a phone now works on the faceplate one.

Yes, I think some of us were fed astray when the OP said that he'd tried a
different filter. I assumed that he'd tried a separate "dangly" filter, as
opposed to a replacement faceplate, and therefore that he'd eliminated the
house wiring and yet still had the problem. When he said that it was a
replacement faceplate, with the extension wiring reconnected, that changed
things a bit - we hadn't after all eliminated the extension wiring from the
equation.

1 make sure the phone works on another line on its own with a filter. If
yees, then the only issue assuming nothing else connected is their ruddy
socket.
Brian

--
----- -
This newsgroup posting comes to you directly from...
The Sofa of Brian Gaff...

Blind user, so no pictures please!
"Adrian" wrote in message
...
BT line with phone and broadband.

Broadband is working OK and that has its own socket on the master socket.

I can only get the phone working if I plug directly into the socket behind
the face plate on the master socket. If I plug into the socket on the
faceplate, I don't get anything at all. BT have suggested that the micro
filter on the faceplate has failed, but I've replaced that with a new one,
and that doesn't work either.

Any suggestions on where to start looking next ?

Thanks

Adrian
--
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This does beg the question, however what would make a randomly placed filter
go down suddenly?

Brian

--
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"Adrian" wrote in message
...
In message , Adrian
writes
BT line with phone and broadband.

Broadband is working OK and that has its own socket on the master socket.

I can only get the phone working if I plug directly into the socket behind
the face plate on the master socket. If I plug into the socket on the
faceplate, I don't get anything at all. BT have suggested that the micro
filter on the faceplate has failed, but I've replaced that with a new one,
and that doesn't work either.


I'm happy to report that the problem appears to have been resolved.

Going back to the days of ADSL, extension sockets numbers 2 & 4 in the
chain had in built filters. It looks as though the problem was with the
face plate on number 2. When I disconnected wire 2 (Line B ?), I could
get a dialling tone on the handset plugged in between it and the master
socket, when I reconnected line 2, it didn't work. Fortunately, I had a
spare, plain, face plate which I've swapped it for, and I'm now back in
business. It looks as though Mr B.T's diagnosis of a failed filter was
right, just the wrong one.

Many thanks for the suggestions.

Adrian
--
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"Adrian" wrote in message
...
BT line with phone and broadband.

Broadband is working OK and that has its own socket on the master socket.

I can only get the phone working if I plug directly into the socket behind
the face plate on the master socket. If I plug into the socket on the
faceplate, I don't get anything at all. BT have suggested that the micro
filter on the faceplate has failed, but I've replaced that with a new one,
and that doesn't work either.

Any suggestions on where to start looking next ?

Redo the socket on the faceplate.

Brian Gaff wrote

This does beg the question, however what would make a randomly placed
filter go down suddenly?

Usual problem, wire breaks etc. Pretty fine wire too.

"Adrian" wrote in message
...
In message , Adrian
writes
BT line with phone and broadband.

Broadband is working OK and that has its own socket on the master socket.

I can only get the phone working if I plug directly into the socket
behind the face plate on the master socket. If I plug into the socket on
the faceplate, I don't get anything at all. BT have suggested that the
micro filter on the faceplate has failed, but I've replaced that with a
new one, and that doesn't work either.


I'm happy to report that the problem appears to have been resolved.

Going back to the days of ADSL, extension sockets numbers 2 & 4 in the
chain had in built filters. It looks as though the problem was with the
face plate on number 2. When I disconnected wire 2 (Line B ?), I could
get a dialling tone on the handset plugged in between it and the master
socket, when I reconnected line 2, it didn't work. Fortunately, I had a
spare, plain, face plate which I've swapped it for, and I'm now back in
business. It looks as though Mr B.T's diagnosis of a failed filter was
right, just the wrong one.

Many thanks for the suggestions.

Adrian
--
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you are merely using a web portal to a USENET group. Many people block
posters coming from web portals due to perceieved SPAM or inaneness.
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In article ,
Adrian wrote:
I've just removed the extension wiring from the faceplate, and I can now
get the faceplate working (unfortunately, its location doesn't lend
itself to leaving a phone plugged in). Tracing that through is not
going to be fun.

Further sockets in the house are daisy chained. Disconnect them one at a
time starting with the nearest one, and test again. Unless a cable has
been damaged (so likely exposed so easy to see) it's most likely a problem
inside one of the other outlets.

--
*Until I was thirteen, I thought my name was SHUT UP .

Dave Plowman London SW
To e-mail, change noise into sound.

On 10/05/2018 18:04, Brian Gaff wrote:
This does beg the question, however what would make a randomly placed filter
go down suddenly?

Brian


Those filters have a ring capacitor of around 1uF. A good filter would
have a non-polarised component whilst a cheaper version may have back to
back electrolytic capacitors similar to those which fail in many power
supplies.

Last week I had to replace 4 electrolytic capacitors in my 9 year old
Samsung 42" TV. Two in the power supply had visibly bulged so I replaced
all in the same area. The fault was a reluctance for the TV to switch on.

--
mailto : news {at} admac {dot} myzen {dot} co {dot} uk

alan_m wrote:
On 10/05/2018 18:04, Brian Gaff wrote:
This does beg the question, however what would make a randomly placed
filter
go down suddenly?

Brian


Those filters have a ring capacitor of around 1uF. A good filter would
have a non-polarised component whilst a cheaper version may have back to
back electrolytic capacitors similar to those which fail in many power
supplies.

Last week I had to replace 4 electrolytic capacitors in my 9 year old
Samsung 42" TV. Two in the power supply had visibly bulged so I replaced
all in the same area. The fault was a reluctance for the TV to switch on.



Capacitors on PC motherborads fail in the same way ...

--
Graham J

In article ,
says...


Further sockets in the house are daisy chained. Disconnect them one at a
time starting with the nearest one, and test again.

Better still, if there are a lot of them, disconnect the last
half. If the fault disappears, Check again half way between
there and the end, if it doesn't, go back halfway to the
beginning. Repeat as required.

--

Terry

---
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In article ,
Terry Casey wrote:
In article ,
says...


Further sockets in the house are daisy chained. Disconnect them one at a
time starting with the nearest one, and test again.

Better still, if there are a lot of them, disconnect the last
half. If the fault disappears, Check again half way between
there and the end, if it doesn't, go back halfway to the
beginning. Repeat as required.

Yup. Lots of ways. But you can guarantee it will be the last one you go to
which has the fault.

--
*TEAMWORK...means never having to take all the blame yourself *

Dave Plowman London SW
To e-mail, change noise into sound.

On 5/11/2018 7:06 PM, Dave Plowman (News) wrote:
In article ,
Terry Casey wrote:
Better still, if there are a lot of them, disconnect the last
half. If the fault disappears, Check again half way between
there and the end, if it doesn't, go back halfway to the
beginning. Repeat as required.

Yup. Lots of ways. But you can guarantee it will be the last one you go to
which has the fault.

In article ,
says...

In article ,
Terry Casey wrote:

Better still, if there are a lot of them, disconnect the last
half. If the fault disappears, Check again half way between
there and the end, if it doesn't, go back halfway to the
beginning. Repeat as required.

Yup. Lots of ways. But you can guarantee it will be the last one you go to
which has the fault.

Why would you carry on fault finding after you'd fixed the
faulty one?

Lets say you have 12 sockets/units/whatever, say, in a line
and the last one is faulty. If you start at the beginning and
work your way along the line you will check all 12 before
finding the fault.

If, instead, you start at the 6th position and disconnect the
output, if the fault disappears, you've eliminated the first
6. Now go to the 9th and do the same. With only two checks
you've eliminated 9.

Now go to the 11th and disconect the output. The fault still
clears so the fault must be at the 12th one or the feed to it.

That's four checks instead of twelve.

--

Terry

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"Terry Casey" wrote in message
...

In article ,
says...

In article ,
Terry Casey wrote:

Better still, if there are a lot of them, disconnect the last
half. If the fault disappears, Check again half way between
there and the end, if it doesn't, go back halfway to the
beginning. Repeat as required.

Yup. Lots of ways. But you can guarantee it will be the last one you go to
which has the fault.

Why would you carry on fault finding after you'd fixed the
faulty one?


Remorons like Dave The Benefits scrounger , can't think
it's the low education and lack of brain capacity.

--

On Sat, 12 May 2018 20:23:14 +0100, pamela wrote:



"Terry Casey" wrote in message
...

In article ,
says...

In article ,
Terry Casey wrote:

Better still, if there are a lot of them, disconnect the last half.
If the fault disappears, Check again half way between there and the
end, if it doesn't, go back halfway to the beginning. Repeat as
required.

Yup. Lots of ways. But you can guarantee it will be the last one you go
to which has the fault.

Why would you carry on fault finding after you'd fixed the faulty one?

That's what he said. It will be the last one you go to.

The same as finding something in the last place you look.

You fell for it - admit it.

In article ,
pamela wrote:


"Terry Casey" wrote in message
...

In article ,
says...

In article ,
Terry Casey wrote:

Better still, if there are a lot of them, disconnect the last
half. If the fault disappears, Check again half way between
there and the end, if it doesn't, go back halfway to the
beginning. Repeat as required.

Yup. Lots of ways. But you can guarantee it will be the last one you
go to which has the fault.

Why would you carry on fault finding after you'd fixed the
faulty one?

Whoosh.

Remorons like Dave The Benefits scrounger , can't think
it's the low education and lack of brain capacity.

Are you referring to me? Surely not the Pamela we know and love. ;-)

--
*A backward poet writes inverse.*

Dave Plowman London SW
To e-mail, change noise into sound.